Chrysler 300M

glennbp

I am not by any means dissing Japanese cars, particularly the upscale models. They are wonderful automobiles with all the performance and bells and whistles one could ask for. All I am saying is that American cars are right with them and they are right with us at this point in time in every respect. We don't need to be bashing the reliability of either. Talk about other things; style, performance, features, comfort, whatever, but arguing about reliability just isn't an issue any longer for those in the know.

sirharper

If people want to pay more and get less, endure far higher service costs, and drive a soulless car who am I to agrue?

glennbp

makes a good point here. Look around at what Japan has to offer in the luxury area. What Japanese auto has the size (both interior and exterior), power, appointments, and style of the M for $30G's?

fastdriver

sirharper-

And how I love this "soulless", reliable car!! ;-))

fastdriver

phkck

Any opinions on 300M versus 300M Special. In the early stages of shopping, probably to buy in the fall. Thanks.

glennbp

I would look at 2 things.
1) Do you like the looks of the Special's trim, ie, ground effects?
2) Do you plan on doing modifications?
My feeling is if you are going to do the mods, go with the non-special. If you love the ground effects and other "Special" stuff and can't live without them, go with the Special. What stirs your soul?

toms99

How's the weather in your part of the country? See any significant snow? If so, plan on some extra bucks for snow tires. The stock tires look cool, but they are terrible (actually downright dangerous) in snow. Not a reason to reject the Special, just budget accordingly for the tires and doing the swap twice a year.

toms99

You know, I'm almost tempted to bid on this...The guy is located just 30 miles away from me (no shipping!), and it would be real easy to throw on a set of Prowler Pro gears with it sitting on the ground! Plus I could have the first ever LHS with AutoStick!! But the description sounds kinda suspicious, and this guy has zero feedback....

wencao

It is good, bold american style!

http://www.car-truck.com/image/chryed/buzz/charint4.jpg

guesswho1

i'll take one!!! like those suicide doors...

guesswho1

foreign cars, is that politically correct, just plain suck!!! that's my 10cents my 2cents are free

fastdriver

wencao -

Have you had your eyes checked lately? That's ugly. The original concept that they first had, the other link they reference there, was nice looking. This is plain fugly.

This is what they SHOULD build!

http://www.geocities.com/fastdriver2_99/charger.html

fastdriver

sirharper

I believe the proper terms are "overrated" and/or "ripoff".

sirharper

Wanna compare reliability between my M and your CL?

fastdriver

sirharper-

LOL.... LOL.... LOL.... LOL.... LOL.... LOL.... LOL.... LOL.... LOL.... LOL....LOL.... LOL.... LOL

fastdriver

sirharper

Why are you laughing? Can you beat not a single fault in 2 years?

Lemme answer for you....

NO...NO...NO...NO...NO...NO...NO...NO...NO...NO...NO...NO...NO...NO...NO...NO...NO...NO...NO

fastdriver

sirharper-

You got me! Damn! My CL-S is only 15 months old! I'll get back to you in 9 months. ;-))

fastdriver

pat

Um, folks let's just move on okay? Obviously, many folks here are very pleased with their Ms - and yes, others have had troubles. But there isn't any need to keep having the same disagreements over and over.

I'm sure I speak for many when I say that those who are very unhappy with Ms are welcome here, but it isn't really necessary for those folks to go on and on about how much they don't like them. Hang out and visit - that's great. Repeatedly criticize when no one was even asking a question and, well, that's really not very good neighborly, it seems to me.



Pat
Sedans Host

fastdriver

pat HOST-

Just trying to get this group to #1 again! ;-)) We're always neighborly and helpful here.

fastdriver

denverm

Here's a link to the article itself: http://car-truck.com/chryed/buzz/b061402.htm

Bearing in mind that the drawing is just an artist's interpretation of someone's description, I think it looks pretty good. I like it better than this concept drawing of the 300N: http://car-truck.com/image/chryed/buzz/300n4.jpg , and it's not as extreme a front end as the Super 8 Hemi: http://car-truck.com/image/chryed/concept/01/dodgec14.jpg

fastdriver, your link didn't work for me, but I'm guessing it was to an image of this Charger: http://car-truck.com/image/chryed/concept/99/charger.gif , which looks pretty cool.
[edit: just tried the link again and it worked. Definitely cool!]

phkck

Good point about snow and ice with the tire combo on Special. Here in KCK there is not much snow, but many icy days. How is everyone's experience with the 300M standard in the ice, snow?

sdmike2

The standard 300M handles great in snow. Good tires, traction control, FWD, heavy....does a great job.

sdmike2

I was a member of their "focus group" last fall and they never showed us the Hemi C. We did, however, have an opportunity to evaluate and provide feedback on a prototype Pacifica and the 300Ns. Better yet, I got paid for it! lol

mikeyjohn

Otto, do you know if the 01 M's in North America have the wiring harness in place where the 300M decals are located for adding the side markers? I know that the daytime running light harness is there in the event that US cars want to add it, but I would like to add the markers to my car as a safety issue, and I know that Roger has wiring diagram, but I don't want to cause myself any grief by starting something that I will regret. Thxs

splatt

OK - I'm not starting an argument, but the one thing I noticed that the question was asked - what have the Japanese car companies brought to the market. And they did bring reliability. Current cars, all makes, have a fair amount of reliability, and the current M is terrific - my 01 is very highly rated.

However, ask most people and they will say that American cars aren't and that Japanese are. It's not about the facts - it's about the belief. And it has kept the foreign car market boosted pretty darned high for a long time. I hope Chrysler/GM/Ford etc... can bring back enough, because I like US cars.

So this is not a post stating one is more reliable - ok?

sdmike2

...that the foreign car companies brought to the table (especially the japanese) were fuel efficient cars during the "oil shortage" times. It took the US a couple of years to ramp up for high MPG production, but at the time Toyota had things like the Tercel and Starlett, and Honda had the CRX (expecially the HF) and Civics.

splatt

except of course it couldn't get out of it's own way - especially with the air conditioner on Friend of mine had one.

sdmike2

The japanese were making reliable cars before it was fashionable to do so. If you look back at the cars of the 80s there was, without question, a reliability gap. That gap is no longer present, but the perception of that gap is.

Mike
Big Red loaded '01 Inferno Red - 12,000 miles, 0 problems

sdmike2

Well, they weren't THAT bad. What did they have in them.... a 1.2 liter engine or something like that? The darned things weighed about as much as a Harley.

splatt

ok, fine, they weren't that bad But.... Actually, I thought they had a pretty cool look for the time. It's a shame they had to make the hybrid car look exactly the same

sdmike2

Maybe they had extra parts left over from the late 80s. I agree....it was pretty cute. Although it looked the same as the high performance version except for those two little letters. My buddy had one too. Cheap, cute and high mpg. Couldn't beat it for a teenager.

achance

99 non-PHP gives me no problems in Juneau, AK. I do put studless winter tires on it now that the originals have a little wear on them. Got thru two winters on the Badyears with no problems, and we can do ice here.

no1trust

When the question was raised about the Japanese contribution, no one questioned that the reliability gap has recently narrowed between U.S. & Japanese cars; cars in general are more reliable as a direct result of more reliable cars being developed for the market by Japanese automakers in the 80s. Consumers found they didn't have to stick to the same old unreliable popular cars of years past. To compete, U.S. automakers had to make their products more reliable, and we as consumers have profited from this competition in the form of better products from U.S., Japanese, European, and even Korean car makers. If the 300M were unreliable (IMHO it is very reliable, dealer service issues notwithstanding) I doubt it would have the obvious loyal following it has now.

wire2

>...the 01 M's ...wiring harness in place where the 300M decals ...side markers?

Otto is at the plant at the moment so I'll offer that I don't believe there's a provision in the harness for side marker lights for a non-European M.
You'd have to run leads to a switched source.
Incidentally, the '99 side markers had a 12" lead and plug, the newer ones just have 2 pins and accept a harness plug directly.

splatt

Snow - the stock tires on the current non-special M are perfectly fine in the snow. I won't say great, they aren't 'snow tires,' but they are just as good as any other all-season, if not better. They are pricey though (NOTE - Hit costco for the best tire prices on the MXV4+ I just got one for $160 installed - including tax and free rotations, etc..., and Michellin is having a $60 off 4 sale next week - will get the other 4 on mine next sale)

Reliability - ") I doubt it would have the obvious loyal following it has now. " Not nec. - Ford had a pretty big following when the folliwing was the belief (fix or repair daily) However, the reliability is far better than it ever was, and the coverages they are offering make up for the rest. That's one of the reasons all my cars have been American. Though the 98 concorde I had had tons of problems - something I've heard is not uncommon, and that almost kicked me from the chrysler camp. The great deal on the M is the only thing that got me back. Thankfully

Side marker lights - I don't think there is any pre=hung wired back there. It's not just 'plug and play" so to speak. But check Scotian's site - he has pics on what to do and where to run the wires. Looks like a 30-60 min job.

ruski

winter is over and we are talking about snow

Hey, netcruzr, what brought you to Moscow? How did you like it there?

I don't think that 300M was stolen. There are plenty of people in Moscow who can buy nice cars and pay double for it (import tariff make all import cars cost double there). When I was in Moscow last time, I saw lots of MBs, BMWs, Audis, Jags, etc. A friend of mine has a Cadillac limo with a driver and a Lincoln Mark VIII for those times when he wants to drive.

ruski

Hey, they stole the wheels from 300M!

achance

I drove a '72 Corolla then a '74 Land Cruiser. The Corolla is the ONLY car that I've ever had a metalurgal failure of a major part on. The keyway on the crankshaft just tore out, probably from A/C load in the Atlanta climate. It was out of the 12k warranty, and I had to eat it. The L/C was driven accross the US and up the Alcan. The early FJ40s were more like tractors than cars so the routine maintenance was heavy, but it was tough! The emission controls were awful and I had constant burned valve and warped head problems til I got to Alaska where they didn't care about such things and took it all off. I had a Porsche 911 for a while, it was a toy but I'd hate to have to maintain it as a daily drive. My '87 Jetta was ok, but ate fan belts and the plastic trim was cheap and brittle. My '88 LeBaron Coupe was driven to 100K with no significant repairs that weren't covered by the warranty (up to 70K). It ate brake disks, but Chrysler replaced them all. Step-daughter finally blew the 2.2 Turbo at about 110K, but I'm reliably told that it occurred at over 100mph - Chrysler can be excused, I guess. The '99 M has been totally without incident so far, 27K. I think most of the American "reliability" problems stem from emissions issues. The Japanese and Europeans used consortiums to develop standard responses to US controls. The US companies had to develop theirs separately to avoid anti-trust charges. Drivabilty was terrible in the '70s and since all the money went into emissions, quality and development suffered greatly - but I could be wrong.

mikeyjohn

Thanks guys, I'll have to try the wiring guide that Scotian and Roger talk about.

blonda

I work with hundreds of people transplanted from all over the world. It appears that a lot of the Asians prefer to drive German cars. A lot of the europeans like American (especially Jeep Cherokees) but German cars are a close second. Most Japanese cars are driving by non-ethnic Americans. This of course is just a sampling of the majority. Your results may vary :-)

scotian

I was spring cleaning, and thought I'd spend some time and take another set of instruction pics:

http://public.fotki.com/Scotian/300m/interior/rear_speakers/

rogor2k

Wire2 - thanks for the answer on the wiring harness connector for the side marker lights. Even if it was there, you'd probably have to remove the outer fender to get to it.

Mikeyjohn and others interested - the side markers are just connected in parallel with the turn signal flashers (at the turn signal bulb connector). Two simple crimp splices on each side and you're in business. You don't even have to cut the wires. It's almost foolproof!

The most challenging part of the installation is fishing the wires, but that's not even all that difficult. On a scale of 1 to 5 "hammers", I'd give it a 2. Total time involved is 1 to 2 hours.

If a leased vehicle is a concern, you can always cut and cap the wires at the marker light end, and put the badges back in the holes. No one will ever know the marker lights were there.

intrepidspirit

We replaced the inside driver's door handle on my wife's 2001 several months ago (under warranty). It developed a sharp edge that actually cut her finger. It appeared to be peeling at the bottom edge and I remember thinking it seemed like plastic.

I haven't had any problem with my 2000 -- the handle feels smooth like you would expect. I wonder if this was a cost saving for 2001 or if a supplier developed his own cost saving...

mikeyjohn

Thanks Rogor, I have sent you a e-mail, on joining the club and the side markers.

mdmark

Very nice tutorial by scotian re speaker removal. My 99 has the premium Infinity system. I believe this means high powered amp and several speakers. What is compatibility with aftermarket equipment? Are Infinity speakers boosted or powered seperately? I have the AM/FM/cassete/CD head unit w/ 3-band equalizer but would like muti-CD capability. I have seen a DC 4-CD changer that mounts in the cubby below the radio, but listed only for 2000 and up applications. Will this changer mate with the '99 head unit? If so, how hard to install? I have noticed that CD-R (wma format) experience difficulty in the current player (skipping, sticking, etc.). These CDs play fine in all other units (car changers, CD-ROM, boom box, home players). Has anyone noticed a problem playing burned CDs? Any and all audio advice is welcome. Sorry if this is covering old ground but things were a lot simpler with my Lafayette under-dash 8-track and rear shelf speakers (plastic grills replaced with metal ones after first sunny day).

bigmike5

Saw an interesting article in Automobile magazine on the Corvette Z06. It reported on the performance of the car over a one year period that the mag. staff had one. Here are a few of their comments: Biggest bummer--road noise. What tire? Guess? Badyears. Next problem--burning 2 qts of oil in 2,500 miles and 3 qts in the next 1,100. Problem: poorly designed piston rings and it got new improved piston rings at 5,810 miles. Result 1 qt of oil every 4,000 miles. Problem: Failed alternator and the dealer had to order the part. Problems: loose coolant hose clamp, a broken exhaust bolt and a corroded electrical connection that screwed up the temp gauge. My point here is that this is a car that costs almost double what the M does, and is the flagship of GM, and still, it is really hard to get a good first year build where every piece of the puzzle performs flawlessly. So enjoy the M's and try to take the greater good with the lesser bad, and if all else fails, blame it on the parts.

fastdriver

intrepidspirit -

Hey! Long time no see- here. How is the paint job holding up? If I remember correctly, it's my favorite color- red! Your last report was all was well with the paint.

fastdriver

intrepidspirit

I've sure seen a lot of you lately. ..you've been in rare form the last couple of days!!! LOL!

My paint is holding up well -- I get lots of comments on my Zaino shine! Whenever I suggest to the commentator that they take a look at the Zaino web site, they back off, saying how it looks like it would be too much work. They can't believe that you can get a shine like this so easily! I've had my inferno red two years in July, and it looks better than new.

One exception -- the part of the composite bumper that has the 90 degree bend to fit the front wheelwell is color-distorted. Not that noticeable because of where it is but I see it.

By the way, the car runs beautifully -- had to get rid of the badyears, though. No problems other than an armrest, weatherstrippings and an ATC unit that runs too cold!

Interesting that you still hang around this forum, although I'm glad you do. I know you love your Acura, but let's face it, the 300M has a charisma that you just can't resist!

fastdriver

intrepidspirit-

"I've sure seen a lot of you lately. ..you've been in rare form the last couple of days!!! LOL!"

Mmmm.... I THINK I've been taking my medication! LOL.....

Glad that the paint has held up for you. I still think the Inferno Red is the best color on the 300, especially with Zaino. So many people think the Z is difficult to use and that you must spend 24/7 to keep the car looking that way! ;-)) It's ok with me because my car usually looks great clean OR dirty!

"Interesting that you still hang around this forum, although I'm glad you do. I know you love your Acura, but let's face it, the 300M has a charisma that you just can't resist!"

I've been in this group since June of 1998. It was such a help to me when I had Christine that it's hard to just hit cancel subscription although I'm sure that there are many who wish that I would do just that! LOL... Won't be happening anytime soon. Besides, every so often someone has a concern that I can address and help them with since most of them won't get any real help from their "5-STAR" dealer.

You are 100% correct- the 300M is charismatic to look at. I've said that many times before.

fastdriver

toms99

No, I don't believe you can put the 4 disc changer in the 99....the head unit doesn't have the proper controls for it.

You may want to consider a trunk-mounted changer. See my new "TUNES" page at:

http://mywebpages.comcast.net/tsokol5/99.htm

The new FM-modulated units are terrific! I just mounted the remote display in the cubby space. Works great!

With regard to burned CD's in the head unit, it has been "hit or miss" for me. I have a disk in the head unit right now that doesn't play occasionally...I just eject and push it back in a few times unti it plays. Interestingly, if I put that CD (or any others that are having trouble) in the Pioneer 12 disc changer, they play perfectly!

PS: I'm 47 and yeah, I remember 8 track too!!