Lexus IS 350 and IS 250

wale_bate1

And I, unlike a typical Lexus owner, have never prayed at the altar of Consumer Reports!

Come and listen to my story 'bout a little Lexus (mine), that on July 5th (last year) had a tow to the Lexus shop for a two-week stay while the baffled techies rubbed their pates and the total electrial system meltdown was left unabated.

Anecdotal? Of course! Statistical? Of course not.

Just like the C&D Bimmer.

D'oh!

Test drives are close at hand. Very close. Can you feel it in the air? I know I can.
:shades:

gee35coupe

more anecdotal "bad" than the Lexus. And don't get me started on the C-class. That's the only forum I've ever been in where the owners actually recommend you NOT buy that particular car in reliability is a concern. I was kinda taken aback.

kyfdx

You should check out the Land Rover Freelander discussion... truly scary...

regards,
kyfdx
Host-Prices Paid Forums

laurasdada

Hello: As a life-long New Englander (and skier), I've always been partial to FWD. For the DC area, you could buy a RWD and invest in a set of snow tires/dedicated rims. Snow tires with the array of traction electronics should allow you to get through the winter. The snow tire option would probably be less expensive up front than adding an AWD option to, say, the IS250. Plus you wouldn't have to carry the added weight and complexity of AWD 365 days/year. Drains performance and mpg, but adds a touch of safety.

Tires are probably the single most important factor here (FWD, AWD, RWD and traction control don't help when there is NO traction available!). I bought an Acura TL over an Infiniti G35x for (among several other reasons) the FWD advantage (not having to carry the AWD overhead mentioned earlier) in the white stuff I so much enjoy. Jokes on me, the Bridgestone EL42 tires on my TL are the worst tires I've experienced in the snow! Common sense/experience snow driving and the traction toys kept me going forward this past winter, but I am quite disapointed with the tires.

Good luck with your decision. You can check out tirerack.com to configure snow tires for your potential purchase as part of the shopping experience.

glenford

All true, and in addition, AWD doesn't do a thing (except negative stuff) to help you stop. The tires make a huge difference. Tim (who uses both winter tires and AWD)

wale_bate1

Abso-freakin-lutely.

Check the news when the first real snows hit. Nine out of ten cars displayed in ditches and medians are 4WD SUVs or trucks.

Snow tires, or chains and shutting off the cell phone will get you a whole lot further than AWD there. Some humility (remember, thou art mortal) helps too!

Or, you could join me, nippononly and BGDC out here on the best coast and never worry about it again, except by choice...
;-]

mvs1

Only you can answer the financial part of the purchase. I'm biased toward AWD systems, with that said take into account it's benefits driving in rain and in and around black ice. I'd agree 100% with the posters above regarding tires. It is the only part of the car that is in constant contact with the road, regardless of automobile choice, you should always have a good set on your vehicle.

newcars

As someone who was told the "unofficial" official pricing, I would say that hyperlite's pricing info is "very competitive."

newcars

I have to agree with blueguydotcom about European Delivery. I honestly don't know why more people don't take advantage of it. If you're really pressed for time, you can get it in a day or two: just fly to Europe, "pick up" your car and fly out. And the money you save on the car will probably pay for trip.

Plus, you can order it exactly the way you want it. Of course, you can order the car at a U.S. dealership exactly the way you want it, too. So that's not exactly an advantage of European Delivery.

The only real downside to European Delivery is the time needed to ship your car. Expect to plan (and pay) for your car a couple of months before you travel and another month or so (at least) for the car to arrive in the United States. But if you can afford the time, it's worth it for most.

newcars

At the Taste of Lexus in Washington, they had a BMW 3-series and a BMW 5-series along with the entire Lexus lineup. They might have had more but the only cars I was interested in were the BMW 330i and the Lexus IS350. Sorry I can't tell you more.

And everyone who is getting into the car must sign the waiver: that includes drivers and passengers.

Obviously, a few "60-second romps" on the "track" at the Taste of Lexus does not constitute a full test drive but I will recommend that you try every car your interested in at least twice. Provided you have time, of course. The first time will get you familiar with the car (whichever car) and the course: the second and subsequent times, you can get familiar with the car on the course.

My impressions of the cars were posted a few days ago, so I won't bother to repeat them. At least, not in depth.

I will say that the Lexus IS350 and the Toyota Avalon are completely different automobiles. The Toyota is large, "soft" and floats on the road. It also gets great gas mileage for a car its size.

The Lexus, on the other hard, has a firmer. much more dynamic ride and is appreciably smaller both front and rear. Especially in the rear. Both automobiles are fairly luxurious but the node definitely goes to the Lexus IS350.

Indeed, the Lexus automobile that the Toyota Avalon most competes against or compares with is the Lexus 330. And to be honest, I personally much prefer the Toyota.

I think the Lexus is a very good car. From personally experience comparing it to the BMW 330, the Lexus is more luxurious and better performing while the BMW is better handling and (because of it's larger rear seats and available fold down rear seats) more utilitarian. I don't think Lexus will have any problem whatsoever selling 40,000 annually. If the prices I heard hold true, they could probably sell twice that number easily.

The only real competition for the Lexus IS350 are the BMW 330i and Infiniti G35 and I personally don't like the Infiniti G35. While the Audi A4 and the Mercedes Benz C-class have their proponents, they really don't compare. And of them all, all in all, I personally like the Lexus best.

Strangely enough, I think BMW will win its share of "wins" not because of its superior handling but because of its superior utilitarianism. Me personally, I have an SUV when I want to carry people and/or cargo but I realize that for many people, the Lexus IS350 or BMW 330i will be their primary "people mover." In such cases, the larger rear seat area (and available fold down seats) of the BMW will probably win the day.

In fact, because of the really abysmal rear seating in the Lexus, I'm thinking of getting a Porsche Cayman S instead. It's more expensive but if it's anything like the reviews say, it out-handles and out-performs both the Lexus and the BMW.

As far as people giving their opinions about the relative merits of the Lexus and BMW, I can't emphasize it enough that you must drive the cars for yourselves. (Indeed, I still can't get over the fact that people in this forum who have never driven the Lexus IS350 think they're qualified to tell us how it drives.) But having said that, I think one of the car magazine reviewers said it best: he thought the BMW handled better than the Lexus and personally preferred it but the Lexus out-performed the BMW and if that's what you want, then that's what you should get.

wrjoyce

Test drove IS 350 and 250 today in Miami at the Taste of Lexus. Both automatics and the the 250 was AWD. Simple no comparison between the two cars, what the real reason for the difference, (horsepower or AWD) not sure. Did not like the 250 AWD at all. Did not think it had good handling or control. The 350 on the other hand was hot. Handles well and powerful. That said, I think BMW still wins out for that unquantifiable factor, response to road, it is just sublime, it is as if your brain is wired to the car which is in complete union with the road. So if you get to ride twisty roads and drive the
BMW is it, but if you are mostly highway driving and stop and go city, luxury is sweet and the lexus has that.

glenford

Newcars' advice about driving a car at least twice at the Taste of L is excellent. The first time, I didn't know the car or the course, so held back. 2nd drive with same (model) car on same course was very different. Tim

kdshapiro

"AWD doesn't do a thing (except negative stuff) to help you stop."

D'oh but if you can't go, you don't have to worry about stopping. Why do poople worry about stopping? In two feet or more of snow I'm worried about going.

lbaily

Thanks for the suggestions/opinions/info. I'll wait for the pricing to be announced (Oct 11 apparently) and make my decision. I will also talk to my friends who do the winter/summer tire switch twice a year. That sounds like a pain in the tush.

vrsc

Even though I just purchased a 2005 Infiniti G35 (1 week ago), I still can't wait until I can test drive the Lexus IS350. I test drove the 330i, Acura TL and G35 and unfortunatly I couldn't wait long enough for the IS350 to come out so I purchased the best car IMHO. It has been great reading all these reviews and opinions since the beginning from members here about this car. Once they start reaching dealerships and we can actually test drive them on roads and highways we will get a better feel for this car. I look forward to writing my own impression post whenever that time comes.

chanmak

I am based in chicago and looking to buy either IS250 or IS350. My decisions is hinged on safety vs performance. I have been suggested against buying RWD by one of my friend who drive BMW 5 Series RWD. His comment was that it takes lot of control to drive RWD in Winter or Rain. So would Snow tires make RWD safer to drive in winter. Do you know anyone who drive RWD with snow tires in snow belt and has no issues? Any thoughts.

mazda6s

Maybe Bob is right but according to the Lexus web site, cloth will be standard on the 250.

brightness04

I find it nigh impossible to believe someone who can afford an entry level lux car doesn't take vacations.

It's the exact opposite for me. I don't have the time for ED (isn't there a number medicine for that? ;-) Taking a week off would cost me more money than the couple thousand dollars that it saves; waiting months for car delivery? No Thanks. The last three cars that I purchased, I just walked in after calling around, and wrote the checks and drove away with the cars. I got a number of calls from dealers a week afterwards to offer me better deals . . . too bad, if you don't give me the best deal on the day I decide to buy a car, no soup for you!

pearl

That's because too many 4WD or AWD owners don't have a clue and drive like idiots in snow. They may be able to go, but they can't stop any faster than anyone else. I used to live in Denver and was forever amazed at how many "goat ropers" ended up in the ditch in their 4WDs because they drove in snow like it was dry pavement. I have owned Audi AWDs but quickly learned that while they provided a margin of improvement to get going, they were no better at speed when it came to stopping. There is a certain amount of macho bravdo that sometimes accompanies buying a big 4WD rig, which is usually stuffed the first time they have to be towed out of the offroad for aggressive driving in snow. Easy on the gas, easy on the brakes and everyone will likely get there safely.

ivan_99

Agreed...

After driving the majority of my life in snow…my motto is:
Drive like you have a hot cup of coffee between your legs and you’ll be fine…

mikegiller

I live in Winterpeg (Winnipeg)... We get at least 2 bad snow storms. By bad storms I mean about 1 meter of snow. Temps usually dip to about -30*C, sometimes below 40*C. With windchill that is in the close to 60*C range. Winter tires are very important, and so is not driving like superman.

bigb82

I drove from Orlando down to Miami this morning...I found out that there are two tours in the country going on...one which is going out west and NY and all...and this one just started in DC and came to FL and so fourth...they had 2 IS250 AWD ONLY, NO RWD and had two IS350 and ONE BMW330i....
i drove the 250 it was nice...the 330i had good pick up but the interior sux a*s...BUT OMFG i took a turn goin 40 on that thing n it took it like it was nothing....so finally i was ready to drive the 350 and wouldnt you know it...frikkin it started pouring...well i still drove it but one thing i HATED was the VDIM kept turnin on as i was drive it fast in the rain so to ME it felt like the IS250 on dry was faster then the 350 on wet cuz the stupid VDIM...i can already tell this will be a HUGE issue....the car wudnt even gun...n then you all will be surprised....they shut the entire event down at like 1pm, it was suppose to be till six.
They have tents and stuff up and the water started flooding the place and I asked the Lex dude how it said rain or shine it will go on and he said oh its for safety and all this...so needless to say i could not drive anythin else as i was looking forward to drive that hybrid...

This was the worse part...but with every bad thing comes a good side....Since the event shut down all the cars were just parked so i told the guy how i came all the way from orlando and i atleast wanted to play around with the car inside with it on and see it so he let me....I sat in the 350 for like 45 mins and played with the nav and other amazing options....I had a 2002 IS till two weeks back when i sold it and am currently driving a 2004 TL with and one thing the rep even agreed on is the lexus Nav being too complicated and not user friendly...I tried to pull up a local miami address and it was quick but took 20 mins to find and figure out for me and the rep to just get the list of directions instead of just the map view...whereas this is very easy on the Acura Nav....also lexus nav has NO toggle botton??? i never knew that...another words if i want to look ahead on my directions i have to literally hold my finger n move it up n so fourth versus just a toggle botton to move n navigate around...so that was a bit disappointing for me...any comments from 06 GS owners with the same version Nav??

To clear up the space issue on this car....I felt when i got inside the car that the front of the car was amazing but I kinda hated how on the side it literally had plastic where the gas door and trunk door bottons are,,,that looks soo cheesy....i hope thats just on these cars since I was told all these are hand built prototypes which will be crushed once they are done with press pics, taste of lexus and the actual production cars come out....Anyhow...I have a friend who is 6 foot and he could not drive my old IS cuz the seat never went back that far...on this car however the seat goes back far as hell...BIG PLUS lexus....however im average height 5"9 and with my settings, I still felt that the backseat SUCKS the same if not worse compared to our current IS's and yet they say it has more room? Cuz the only way it has more room is if u put ur seat up all the way,,,otherwise with the average height n person....when you sit in the back its tight as hell, your feet are tight under the seat and it is hard as hell to get out of the back cuz even the door has such a small opening...and im average!!... lol
The other nite with Bob Carter...he kept saying it will be competitively priced with BMW...if they want the capture those people..they need to do dam well considering the space in the car hasnt improved much in MY OWN OPINION....even the front compared to the 330 is so cramped together...this could be more so noticable cause the car has so much more then our old IS's did and further more i love how the center consoul is kind of uplifted now...
I have pics and video....PM me if interested...
I confirmed from six different people that 2007 IS lineup WILL offer a convertible option....which will be unvailed next year some time...
I just want a honest comments from everyone about everything i have mentioned here...and their opinions
__________________

accorddrvr98

Has anyone heard whether Lexus is coming out with a coupe in additional to the hardtop convertible next year?

mario787

bigb82:

"I have pics and video....PM me if interested..." Could you please send me a couple of pics of the IS 250 and IS 350? My email is arroyomario787@yahoo.com

I would also like to know what are the differenes between the two models other than the price and the horsepower, particularly whehter the IS 250 looks the same on the inside as the IS 350. Thanks in advance, Mario

wale_bate1

Amen.

fatal_ice

bigb82,

Can you also send me info and pics @ Fedler@gtemail.net

Thanks

laurasdada

Yes, snows will make a big difference on a RWD car (as well as FWD, AWD). My neighbor has a Lexus GS300 with all-seasons. Could not get up her short, steep driveway in snow until they put snows on. Big difference. My FWD TL has some difficulty in snow 'cuz the Bridgestone all-season's are really 3 seasons! They just don't like snow...

If I had RWD, especially if the RWD comes with "summer" or "performance" tires, in any snow area, I'd definately get snows.

mikegiller

same here.. send to mikehobbes@hotmail.com

moresol

The chat transcript is available now.
http://www.edmunds.com/townhall/chat/transcripts/lexusischat092905.html

mikegiller

Thanks a lot Bobby. I appreciate you taking your time to get all the pics together. Do you have the video? :P

newcars

bigb82, sorry you didn't get a chance to test-drive the IS350 in the dry. YMMV, of course, but I think you would have found it appealing.

I'm also very disappointed that the navigation system on the Lexus was so difficult. I am thinking more and more about the BMW (and the Porsche Cayman S) but then again, in order to get the Navi on the 330i you must get the accursed i-Dirve.
:sick:

Also, the one thing I forgot to check when I was at the Taste of Lexus is if the BMW had the adaptive steering. If it did, it was much better than the adaptive steering in the 5-series. Does anyone know if it had it?

(I doubt it but I thought I'd ask.)

Kirstie_H

It'd be great if you can post some of the photos here so we can all see them!

stickguy

read the transcript. Nice that leather and moonroof are standard. If it also has a power driver's seat, I wouldn't need any options!

Wonder what the luxury package he mentions includes? probably the power seat, and 3K of other options I don't want!

nellie4051

Hello Bigb82: Thanks for your information. Could you please send me some photos and videos from that event, when you have a moment? (email is: neldawg311@hotmail.com). Thanks once again.

digital_b

you should probably let us know how to 'pm' you. I would like to see the pics and video.

rockylee

Hello to all, I see that some of you were at the Bob Carter, chat the other nite. I was there if you remember. "rockylee"
Hello Bigb82 my e-mail is rockylee@xit.net

I knew the VDIM is going to make or break this sweet car.....I am so damn upset at Lexus for not offering a defeat switch.....perhaps the 350h hybrid when it's released will get a defeat ?....any rumors of when it's coming out ???.......The 450h will be a cool car too, but looks to be very expensive.....We have until the Oct. 17th before final prices will be announced, which will determine if I'm purchasing a 350 or 350h or not at all.....you can figure a IS 350 MSRP + $5-6K for the Synergy pack for the 350h.....if the 350 get's too expensive, then I might as well wait for the Caddy CTS-V to be totally redesigned in 2007 since I won't have to pay sticker since I get a GM employee discount from my relatives....I like the handling of the BMW 330i but I think it's ugly and expensive....Where I live, there is only one Lexus dealership within a 200 mile radius, and you know they are going to demand sticker for the IS 350 at first
Well if you guys here any more rumors, drop them on the
forum->Thanks Rocky

cdnpinhead

I'm from Edmonton & know what "Portage & Main" means. It's something of a tossup (& point of pride) as to whether Winnipeg or Edmonton has the worst Canadian weather (outside of the territories), but either one makes what we deal with down here (in my case) pretty trivial.

I drove a '65 MGB and a 240-Z in Edmonton through weather that I imagine most who post here have only read about, including sales calls all over Western Canada to the tune of 25K miles/year plus. They were both RWD, and tire technology was nothing like as good as it is now. I had no accidents & no close calls, down to 56 below (no, that's not wind chill -- still air).

Front-wheel or all-wheel drive may get (& keep) you going, but it's still necessary to steer & stop, preferably on the road, without hitting anyone or anything. Idiot-proofing (excuse me, poka-yoke) the situation often only results in more idiots, sadly.

Buy good winter tires.

Pay attention.

randyl712

I haven't seen any specs on the quickness nor the fuel efficiency of the IS250 AWD. Can someone shed some light on that for me?

petl

Lexus.ca lists the fuel mileage at 27/37. These specs are calculated in imperial (Canadian) gallons. American specs will be lower by approx. 20%. Not sure about the quickness.

jmcphillips1

here is a post of the gas milage from lexus

http://www.lexus.com/about/press_releases/index.html

just follow the link

ben833

Why would they put the gear shifters on the steering wheel? What if you wanted to shift while turning?

Also, I don't like how they made the moonroof standard. That's a piece of equipment that I don't want to be paying for. I would probably only use it 4-5 times a year, since it's too hot in the summer and too cold in the winter (rochester, ny). Does anyone actually use their moonroof often?

jmcphillips1

Yes,
I use my moonroof all of the time
I live in the south and I can promise you it is hotter here in the summer than it is up there

wayde

I use my moonroof ALOT and I live in Minnesota!
I love having the extra light - even when it's below zero & above 80
Also, I tilt it open on long drives in the winter for fresh air to circulate. After having a sun/moonroof in my 2nd car I swore I'd never own a car without one again. (I did however and I missed it very much. My current car does have one

stickguy

I use it all the time, unless it is below 40 or above 90 (actually, I use it then too if I'm not dressed in work closthes!). That's keeping it open, the rest of the time I keep the cover back for light.

But, I know some people don't want it, or maybe need the extra headroom, but in this class it is almost considered a requirement. It is also standard on the 3 series, both Acura, and probably some others.

So, if you want a strippo metal roof car, looks like you have to shop elsewhere! Maybe a G35 if you can find one.

hybrid3

I have been looking everywhere for this info. Does anyone know the 0-60 on the awd???

justconvinced

I would like to see your pics and video... your email is private (apologies to the rest of the folks for the public message)

jC

randyl712

Have prices been posted? (Isn't this going on sale within 30 days?)

blueguydotcom

Does anyone actually use their moonroof often?

Nearly every day. Unless it's raining my moonroof gets opened almost every time i come out to my car (usually hit the fob and make the windows drop and roof open before I get to my car).

at night i love it open while driving. in the morning it's sensational. day time it's great to cool the car down.

spfotey

mikegiller

Oct. 11= Pricing
Oct. 17= Release to Showrooms