OK, so the Vans are made to withstand 30 to 40 mile per hour crashes. But, if you don't pay attention in a parking lot, you could have a bag blow in your face. I don't know about you guys but, I would rather live through a head on at 30 MPH. If you check the following link, you will see that the test wasn't as bad as first reported. It is actually in fourth place behind the ugly Windstar. By the way I might be buying a Sedona next week fully loaded two tone for $22.963.00 US. Let me know what you think!!
"Note that all three current models that received good ratings (Sienna, Odyssey, Windstar) appear to have been tested with side airbags. Looks like the Sedona would have likely received a good rating if it had them."
Actually, neither the Odyssey (1999) nor the Sienna (1998) tested was equipped with side airbags as they were not available in those years.
It is interesting that the 2002 Chrysler vans get a better rating when equipped with side airbags ("Acceptable" with, "Marginal" without). I would suspect side airbags offer little protection in a frontal/frontal offset crash if they even deploy at all. Perhaps the Chrysler vans were so close to an "Acceptable" rating, the IIHS felt the added side airbags would be enough to appease Chrysler...
Also, the IIHS ratings for bumpers and head restraints DO NOT factor into the overall Offset crash test evaluation. Those tests will, however, affect the ranking in the list compared to other vehicles with the same overall rating. According to the IIHS:
"The three factors evaluated in the frontal offset crash test -- structural performance, injury measures, and restraints/dummy kinematics -- determine each vehicle's overall crashworthiness evaluation. The order in which vehicles are listed depends primarily on crash test performance, with head restraint and bumper evaluations influencing the rankings of vehicles with similar performance."
Even so, Sedona did make the list above MPV and the Chrysler vans, so apparently the bumper and head restraint tests didn't factor at all in this case.
Overall, Sedona is a safe package, with good crash tests. Plus, extra weight is always a bonus in crashes with other vehicles. Side airbags, traction control, a head restraint and shoulder belt in the center rear position and a low rollover risk would round it out nicely for next year. Kudos to Kia for doing a better job with a brand new product than some other companies have been able to do over many generations of minivans.
I asked for an e-mail quote on an EX with ABS, Spoiler and White/Silver two tone. This is the response I got:
"Thank you for your inquiry! We have several Sedonas in stock and available. However, the ABS option is still very hard to come by.... How important ids that option? Let me know, I will make you a deal you cannot turn down......"
So, how important are ABS? I did not have them in my '00 Cherokee and had no problems, but the Sedona will be for my wife and one year old.
I guess it matters what kind of deal is involved, but I was just wondering if I should even consider it.
I would say you can NOT special order a Kia. You can not special order a Hyundai, so since Hyundai owns Kia, I would say you could not special order your Sedona. He will have to check around the region and see if he can find one. That may be why your dealer answered your simple question with "Come on down and I'll make you a deal you can't turn down."
I'm a Safety Manager at a LARGE Telecommunications Company and we teach our employees to pull "through" a parking spot if possible when parking. If not, they are instructed to back in so they can go forward when leaving. Backing in to a parking spot is, once you get used to it, actually easier than driving straight in. When you are backing, the wheels doing the steering are now at the back of the vehicle and it becomes much more maneuverable.
As far as the bumper-basher in relation to the weight of the vehicle - it means nothing in the tests but is important only in the "real world." When these insurance tests are done, the vehicle is stationary while the "bumper-basher" moves into the vehicle. One reason for this is that the speed of the basher can be controlled much more exactly than the speed of the vehicle itself.
In the IIHS bumper tests the vehicle is propelled into a fixed barrier, not the other way around. There's a short video of the "rear into pole" test at their site, and extensive video of all four tests was featured on Dateline last week (see above posts for IIHS URL). Weight has to have at least a little to do with test results in the Sedona's case. The offset crash test will be featured tonight on Dateline. Unfortunately, all three of the small cars they tested with the Sedona (same trio as in the bumper tests) received better marks than the Sedona. I would hope Dateline wouldn't unfairly compare the Sedona to the cars, but I suspect they'll use the opportunity to put it's results in a less positive light than they should because they're always shooting for something controversial.
Guess I was wrong about side airbags. Like the negative comments on the Sedona's bumper tests added to the offset crash summary, comments on side airbags for the Odyssey etc. are apparently made for reference only and don't apply to the actual test. The fact that the Sedona received 5 stars in NHTSA side impact without them is actually a very good sign.
It appears that the main reason the Sedona did not receive a "good" in the offset is dummy head movement - it's head hit the steering wheel through the airbag (although not with great force) and the side pillar on the rebound. In many or most frontal impacts, the driver would presumably be aware it is about to happen, and have a split second to brace himself, which might limit head movement more than in the test. This probably should be less of a concern than having your feet and/or legs crushed by intrusion into the footwell - which seems to be a common problem for the vans rated lower than the Sedona.
Actually, I think I would rather survive an accident with a broken ankle or leg than have my head smack the steering wheel and bang around the door jamb and get a concussion (or skull fracture in an extreme cases). With a broken limb it is a pretty good bet that it can be mended with minimal long-term problems. But head injuries can lead to long term problems that are difficult to diagnose right after an accident. The addition of side air-bags to the Sedona would make me feel more secure in purchasing one . . . that and a satisfactory remedy for the low speed air-bag deployment.
Crash test data is important to me. I am pretty confidant in my own ability to drive safely but you never know what the person next to you will do. I currently drive a VW Passatt which has one of the best ratings for crash tests.
Yes leg injuries are preferrable to head injuries, that's common sense. I was just wondering how accurately the head and body movements of a limp dummy actually mirror the real world movements of a braced driver in a crash.
You can brace yourself all you want in a 40 mph crash and it isn't going to help you. It may in fact be worse. It is a well known fact that drunk drivers and babies fair far better in accidents on average due to being "limp" at the time of impact.
And, how many times are you going to have the time to brace yourself when the driver in the opposite lane weaves at the last minute and it results in an offset crash?
Anyway, I agree that being in 4th place, behind the Sienna, WindStar and Odyssey is pretty darn good!
I would hate to drive a ......... read the list of the vans on the bottom.
After all these crash tests, what is the immediate impact on your insurance premium? Whether it is 2k or 5k to fix up a car after an accident, as long as I pay my $500 deductible and the insurance pads the rest. I don't care, If Kia fixes the airbag deployment problem so it won't injure my face, it is good enough for me. All the immediate PR "anomaly" B.S. after the bumper test is a premature reaction from Kia side, it may take a while to recreate the bumper test environment in the lab, to assign the appropriate engineers to investigate and to fix this problem takes time. Let's wait for another month and see what happen.
After lingering around the IIHS site, I think an acceptable rating is quite sufficient. Some may find the Toyota Camry 1997-2001 test results very interesting to add some perspective regarding B pillar head injuries. It's quite clear that there is some amount of subjectivity involved. When I look at the after crash picture of the Sedona, the compartment is intact and the front tire is right where it should be. Works for me.
For me, red flags start to go up when I see "Marginal" IIHS ratings and 3-star NHTSA crash/rollover ratings.
These tests are long established and well known by manufacturers. If they can't design their vehicles to get at least "Acceptable" or 4-star ratings in these tests, then I don't trust that they have put any effort to safe design in the many other possible crash scenarios that are not well simulated by any tests...
With quadruple 5-star ratings, an "Acceptable" IIHS rating and weighing in over 4500 lbs., I think Sedona is a much safer choice than many other vehicles on the road.
I was just thinking. I was involved in an offset head on crash with my 92 Jeep Wrangler. I was going around 45mph and I have no clue what the oncoming guy that veered in front of me was going but probably 35 mph minimum. It was so instant that I barely had enough time to brake. He ran into me and all I can remember was that the nose of my Wrangler was on the road and the rear was catapoulted (sp) up almost vertical. I could see the pavement down in front of me and then the back end fell down. I was barely injured except for a minor knee scrape and then the next day a little lower back pain. I braced myself with my arms holding the steering wheel, which bent quite a bit but my head never hit anything. I was not even wearing my seatbelt. I consider myself very blessed because it could have been much worse. I put the hardtop on the previous day and if I wouldn't have, I would have been thrown out of the topless Jeep. This is a real world offset head on crash and I faired well. The 94 Wrangler, same as the 92 got a 2 star rating for driver at NHTSA and no IIHS test was ever done on it. To summarize, there are so many variables in a real world crash that IMO can't be generated or even resemble the IIHS tests. They use the same standard of testing for all vehicles which tells us that in that exact scenario, that is the outcome. Your real world outcome may differ?
I wear them more often now but not every time like I should. I am interested in results for my wife and 3 kids. She is the one that has an obssession with crash tests. I was merely pointing out that no one can know how safe a crash is until it's over in the real world. I gave my experience. I have another one too. It was new year's day 2000 and my mom who is a nurse was driving to work at 5:30 am. She was on the freeway on an overpass to another freeway. All of a sudden ascending the top she sees headlights and boom. A drunk driver with a stolen van and no license hits my mom head on. She got really banged up and taken to the hospital but nothing major. She was wearing a seatbelt but no airbag in her older Ford Escort. These are my 2 real world experiences and both have a good outcome as far as not being seriusly injured. People have been killed or seriously injured in "smaller" accidents and not head on ones but we have been fine and also not driving the "safest rated cars" on the road. Crash ratings are either good or bad PR but I still don't believe they reflect real world crashes. I think they are more fluff than substances but I won't tell my wife that. She is the exact opposite. She wanted the Sedona for the NHTSA quad 5 star rating among other things.
ody01 posts like biting fly. He not talk good. He not write good. He no want help people, just him talk how smart he buy Odyssey. Me hope he pay 1000 dollar over MSRP.
When Dad23girls had a head on with no seatbelt, he broke the steering wheel and both arms, came up under the steering wheel with his pelvis and had to wear an external fixation device drilled into his pelvic bones for three months, broke both legs in several places trying to brace, and was darn near close to being Dad2nogirls if you get my drift. DON'T EVER FORGET TO PUT YOUR SEATBELT ON! You are very, very fortunate! P.S. The woman who hit him was drunk also at 9:00 in the morning and slide into the floorboard with no injuries.
I agree that I should wear my seatbelt at all times. Since I am on the road most of the time, my odds go up just because I do spend alot of time driving. Wearing a seatbelt is something that I have gotten better at but still need to improve, which I will. Life is too precious, especially with a family to look after and be there for them.
It's a matter of tilting the odds as much as possible in your favor, man. Everyone's got a fanciful tale about how they or someone they know escaped injury despite not buckling up. Ask a state trooper, though, and they'll give you the perspective of someone who sees fatal crashes EVERY DAY. The more protection you utilize, the better your odds in most situations. My dad used to refuse to wear his seat belt because "if there's a fire in the car, I might not be able to get out". Got tired of arguing with him, asked him to increase his life insurance, and agreed that, in the event of a fire after an accident, if unbelted he could always escape through the huge hole his head had made in the windshield.
Even so, when it comes to safety, I'd rather base my choices on the odds than on the exception. I'll choose controlled, scientific tests over an anecdotal account from a friend's cousin any day.
I know for a fact that some vehicles perform better than others in some of the most common types of crashes simulated by the NHTSA and IIHS. I'd much rather have my family in one of those vehicles. Otherwise, I'd be assuming a manufactuer that couldn't even make a vehicle do well in these established tests has instead spent time and money making the car safer in other types of crashes (which don't even give them a marketing edge). Call me cynical, but I won't be making that assumption.
Ody01-
The IIHS assigns an overall rating for a reason. I suggest you read up on how they derive their overall rating and what the results mean. Then notice that they also link to the complementary NHTSA tests. Giving credit where credit is due, Sedona does quite well overall for crashworthiness. Maybe not quite as well as Sienna, Odyssey or Windstar, but it's probably among more crashworthy vehicles on the road today.
As a side note, I don't know how many times I've heard or read the following type of anecdote:
"We were in a crash with our monster SUV and it rolled. We were so lucky I only had a broken arm and my kids only had some bruises. It protected us so well we're going to buy another one today!"
It's very easy to let emotion and personal experience make this decision, even though the reality is that a safer vehicle might have avoided the crash to start, probably wouldn't have rolled and most likely wouldn't have caused any injuries at all in the same situation.
Just my 2 cents. Obviously, everyone has to interpret all the available information in their own way.
I got mine last Oct. It's the base model with ABS. After 5,000 miles I'm very disappointed & ready to trade it in on a used Sienna or Odyssey. The brakes are erratic-sometimes grabbing, sometimes thumping (no, it's not the ABS.) Weird down-shifting at times. The wind noise is so loud around all the windows that I think the windows are open. The doors have to be slammed really hard & in very cold weather, none of the doors would latch until the heater was going for at least 10 minutes. The heater is also anemic: I'm usually at my destination before there's heat. I can never tell if the gas tank is full because the pump shuts off but the gauge never reads full. The driver's position is very uncomfortable with the armrest so low that I've secured a small pillow to it so my shoulder doesn't ache. I like the power of the engine & the interior conveniences but that's about all I like. I'm a single mom who doesn't know much about cars but I know my 99 Caravan was a much superior vehicle. Did I get a lemon? Does anyone else have these problems?
Check the life insurance policy because some are void if you die in a car crash without wearing a seatbelt. I agree the odds are better with seatbelts and just going to lunch down the street today I put my seatbelt on. I have not done that in awhile. I think once I get in the habit of putting it on every time it will be second nature. I never really gave seatbelts much thought even though I should know better. All cars should come with the annoying beep like my mom's new Focus has that doesn't shut up until you put the seatbelt on. Every time I drive her car, the seatbelt goes right on because that chime is annoying. Great idea from Ford!
And of course, yolo, we don't want to be hounding naggers giving you grief. We just want you to live long and prosper.
Marian115: Sorry you're having such tough problems. While the initial flush of excitement has faded, and I've found a few things I don't like about my Sedona, I haven't had any of the problems you describe. I'm at three months and 3K miles. As a matter of fact, the low wind noise, tranny, and braking are outstanding. Doors are smooth and obedient to me and 7 year old alike. I do notice it takes a while to heat up, but after 10 minutes running, I put the front and rear heaters on full, and it's 80 degrees in a minute. Are you turning on the rear heater, and not just the rear fan? Oh, and come to think of it, I did notice that the tank never gets up to "full". I think you need to bring yours back to the dealer and have a chat, and accompanied test drive, with the service manager.
I, too, have noticed that the gas gauge never gets to full. I have also notice that when it gets to empty and the low fuel light comes on that when I get gas I only get about 15 gallons. The tank holds 19 gallons and the low fuel light shouldn't come on until there is less than 2 gallons. The dealer offered to look at it, but its not that big a deal, so I declined.
Also, I had a tranny leak fixed last week. My Sedona is only a month old. My van was also downshifting weird before this. The dealer was very helpful and fixed it quickly.
"hounding naggers" never crossed my mind but I did open up to making sure to put my belt on every time. Thanks all! It definitely can't hurt.
About tranny downshifting. It is normal on uphill grades. It's the nature of a 5 spd auto. It should not occur on flat roads unless you apply more throttle, which is normal. I don't know if the Sedona has a kick down adjuster, but my Ram 1500 does and once fine tuned it helped tremendously on not downshifting as much as when I bought it new. It was out of adjustment from the factory. Might be something to ask the KIA service dept. about? Are you getting it on a flat road without applying too much throttle or steady throttle?
I can't move two feet in my car without my seatbelts on. My Dad taught us kids well when seat belts first came out. I feel totally naked if my seatbelt is not snugly done up. And my car WILL NOT MOVE until EVERY passenger in my car is belted up. It is the law here to wear seatbelts, and the driver can be fined if the passenger (s) don't belt up, but I don't do it for that reason. I do it because the odds are greatly in favour of me and my passengers walking away from an accident alive or with less injuries when wearing a seat belt.
I've gotten so used to using seat belts over the years, that I can close the door, put my seat belt on, put the key in the ignition, and start the car......... all in one motion.
Saving your life doesn't take ANY TIME AT ALL!! :-)
------
You'll notice that the IIHS report mentioned the Sedona having up-to-date seat belts in the front with the "pre-tensioners", which helps a lot when it comes to injuries.
I notice it doesn't respond right away, after fill up, iit sometimes takes a whole 2 minutes to come to the F mark. No problems with heat at all 3 mins, 5 minutes tops on heat output on coldest days, faster than my olds silhouette. I hate the interior lights, i can't turn them on in the rest of the van, once i'm prceeding done the road. Don't tell me i can turn them on indiviually, as a parent with little ones, you need to be able control these things with ease from the cockpit.
Our van has only 1600 miles, but in the 5 weeks we've owned it, I have not experienced any of the problems you described. You seem to have gotten an unfortunate unit. Try hard to get your dealer to address your concerns.
I found more ducts under the front seats pointing rearward. These are activated with the floor settings on the front controls. I don't think we covered these in earlier posts on the subject.
To be honest, they are kind of crude and actually invalidate the area for storage - not a good place for anything which warps or dries out when heated.
You don't happen to have the text of your previous posts about the HVAC system, do you? I wouldn't mind saving this in a separate doc, just so I can have it for keeps.
No, but if you punch 925 into the message goto box near the top of this page (your browser may vary ), it and the discussion that follows is all there.
[It's probably time to repost this for newcomers: an ample discussion on pricing and perspectives therein can be found in the 660 +/- 30 messages range.]
P.S. Am I missing something, or is there no intra-board search function? Would be really useful.
Well said on the results. I do also think the Sedona is solid in all respects, but my viewpoint is admittedly biased. The Sedona results were not as good as I expected, but that does not mean they were disappointing.
I also reviewed the TransPort results...I think they lost the dummy in that one since it looked unlikely that the dummy could be extracted from the vehicle. For comparison, that's a result that impacts a buying decision.
I am in the peak of my towing season in my camper business, I tow about 4-5 times per week bringing in POPUP CAMPING units for resale. Sedona is everything I could ask for. Average weight is about 1500lbs and at times 2500lbs. Engine is very quiet, transmission is smooth. I am especially impressed with the 5-speed transmission and the power! There is excellent power in every gear which I attribute to superb engineering regarding the torque range. When I need to get around somebody on the I-system while towing it is very responsive. I have had to learn how to "stay light" on the gas pedal with this van because it really gets up and goes.... )!! This is one rock solid road holding van, especially in in cross winds. We had glare ice, snow, drifting this morning as I was headed towards Milwaukee. Majority of vehicles in the ditch were 4 X 4's, go figure. My Previa would get bounced around pretty good in these types of cross winds, I would never have ventured out with it on a day like today. I have nearly 6,000 miles now (purchased mid Jan) ABS works to perfection. Seats are now broken in ( I should say my butt is broken in) and the Lexoil treatment I gave them weeks back has really softened the leather nicely. I have nt vibrations to speak of and wind noise? What wind noise? I have handed out nearly ten business cards from my dealer to people asking about my fully loaded my 2-tone Sapphire Blue, and at the same time I have only seen ONE other on the road. The only complaint I have is that my defroster heat output is marginal, and that I will have checked out on my first service. It's really a joy to drive, I am very pleased because in fact I practically live in this thing...ONE SATISFIED OWNER
Ex, you're back! Busy season???? What the heck are you Wisconsonites doing in campers in winter?!?!? Your brass monkey might freeze his.....well, you know.
And what's an old SF guy have to say to ody01?
Hey, you were right; the trailer hitch was a breeze, really. My seven year old daughter even crawled under the car with me, and turned a couple wrenches. A real bonding moment, let me tell you. My little gearhead.
Oh, and mobilmac: Have you tried turning the dome light master on (left of the radio), then punching all the individual rear dome lights to turn them on, then using the master to turn them on or off? You have to turn them on at the light itself, then you can be Der Meisterswitcher from the cockpit.
Exactly, marcolius. In fact, I have found that with the middle row light(s) on, I can still see the road at night - at least on the highway - while little people are distracted by doing things that require light. I'm not recommending it, especially in around town driving, but it can be done and as you noted you can shut them off when it's a problem.
It would be nice if Kia could put the circuits in that would activate them on door opening, even regardless of the front switch. Anyway, an enhancement for another year.
I just purchased an LX two weeks ago and have been mostly happy with it. I had a couple of issues with a rattle and pin missing for the headrest adjuster. I took it into the dealership and they found that it rattle was coming from the inner panel in the sliding door. Anyway they are going to fix it but the service manager said that some people have been complaining about the amount of heat that their Sedona's have been putting out. He said they found that when shipped from the factory that they had a 60% antifreeze to 40% water ratio. They ended up draining out a couple of liters and then added some water. I now find that it heats up much faster and is much hotter. I should know, it has been cold here in Alberta the last three weeks.
Marian115, last night my wife was coming home from work at midnight and she could not close the drivers side door. She had to drive for fifteen minutes in freezing cold weather holding the door closed. Maybe there is an issue with the latches in cold weather, but that was the first time it happened.
On Nov 20th we bought the only XE model on the lot at Hart Motor Co. Salem Virginia. Its a Dark Emeral Green/ Silky Beige with leather & sunroof. Also came with a cargo net, but no rear mat..Do all EX's have the cargo net as standard equipement? We now have 8200 miles and two trips to Florida from Va. It rides and drives very well crusing at 70 to 75 mph. Last trip I checked milage and got 24 to 25 mpg. Have found no real probblems so far, althrough at times I notice a very slight shudder thru the steering wheel when the transmission shifts from 3th to 4 th gear. Thanks to this townhall I've learned how to operate the rear heater and the location of the rear heat vents. The heater puts out very hot air. I plan on buying the service manuals for the Sedona so I can learn even more about my van. I usally buy them anytime I get a new vehicle
WELCOME to this board! Now I can direct all my service and mechanical questions to you! Man, with Excelent3 as Der Towmeister, a couple statistical experts to interpret the crash data, and you with the manual, we're all set.
Hi.. enjoying all of the posts. I filled up last night and the gauge actually went a little past the full mark. I didnt top off the tank, just filled until it stopped. I only have 700 miles on the van so far, the MPG has been about 14 , mostly city driving using 87 octane. Hopefully this will improve. Did have it on a highway trip last weekend and noticed how easy is was to pass other vehicles, was doing 80 mph before I realized I'd better slow down. Very smooth on the highway.. Heaters ( front & rear ) work well. We are gonna test out the new TV/DVD player this weekend.. bought a Toshiba 9' TV/DVD combo with the TV TOTE harness.. I used one of those "cassette" hook ups that come with the portable CD players, hooked it up to the headphone jack and plugged the "cassette" into the player and nice sound coming thru the van's stereo system.. also bought a headphone jack that splits so you can plug 2 headphone sets into it.. for the "quiet times".... the Sedona honeymoon continues.
I love this van. It feels so much like a car, I am amazed. I really like the safety rating it has received, and am very proud to have bought a great vehicle for my family. I missed the message about installing a hitch, and need to do this. Can someone tell me what message that info was in?
As for the air bag deployment - if we address Kia with the issue and ask them to do something about it I believe we will have a better likelihood of getting the issue addressed and corrected (if there is an issue) than if we just speculate about it. My wife is concerned about it, so I asked her to write the company. I think that Kia is concerned with establishing itself with a solid base of customers in the US market, and feel that because of this they may be more responsive than other companies. Write them!
Just wanted to put in my 2 cents now that IIHS has released its Sedona test results. Compared to other minivans, the Sedona's performance in the IIHS tests is good. An "Acceptable" rating is better than most of the other vans have achieved. Plus, the problem with dummy movement, which was the Sedona's biggest problem area, seems less important than some of the other categories. Yes, the dummy's head hit the B pillar after bouncing off the airbag in one particular IIHS test. But this does not mean it will happen in every real-world crash involving the Sedona.
The quadruple 5-star NHTSA results, Acceptable rating from IIHS, and the vehicle's significant weight (much heavier than most minivans) combine to make this one of the safest minivans you can buy, at least from a crash-test performance viewpoint. The poor bumper-test performance is disappointing, but it's far less important than the other test results.
You could make the argument that Sedona is less maneuverable than other minivans such as Villager/Quest and MPV, so perhaps those vans are better able to avoid accidents.
In the Toyota Camry test, the dummy's head hits the B pillar too with a high rate of acceleration. That vehicle still earned a nod as an IIHS best pick. Thoughts?
Comments
http://www.iihs.org/vehicle_ratings/ce/html/summary_passvans.htm
Actually, neither the Odyssey (1999) nor the Sienna (1998) tested was equipped with side airbags as they were not available in those years.
It is interesting that the 2002 Chrysler vans get a better rating when equipped with side airbags ("Acceptable" with, "Marginal" without). I would suspect side airbags offer little protection in a frontal/frontal offset crash if they even deploy at all. Perhaps the Chrysler vans were so close to an "Acceptable" rating, the IIHS felt the added side airbags would be enough to appease Chrysler...
Also, the IIHS ratings for bumpers and head restraints DO NOT factor into the overall Offset crash test evaluation. Those tests will, however, affect the ranking in the list compared to other vehicles with the same overall rating. According to the IIHS:
"The three factors evaluated in the frontal offset crash test -- structural performance, injury measures, and restraints/dummy kinematics -- determine each vehicle's overall crashworthiness evaluation. The order in which vehicles are listed depends primarily on crash test performance, with head restraint and bumper evaluations influencing the rankings of vehicles with similar performance."
Even so, Sedona did make the list above MPV and the Chrysler vans, so apparently the bumper and head restraint tests didn't factor at all in this case.
Overall, Sedona is a safe package, with good crash tests. Plus, extra weight is always a bonus in crashes with other vehicles. Side airbags, traction control, a head restraint and shoulder belt in the center rear position and a low rollover risk would round it out nicely for next year. Kudos to Kia for doing a better job with a brand new product than some other companies have been able to do over many generations of minivans.
"Thank you for your inquiry! We have several Sedonas in stock and available. However, the ABS option is still very hard to come by.... How important ids that option? Let me know, I will make you a deal you cannot turn down......"
So, how important are ABS? I did not have them in my '00 Cherokee and had no problems, but the Sedona will be for my wife and one year old.
I guess it matters what kind of deal is involved, but I was just wondering if I should even consider it.
As far as the bumper-basher in relation to the weight of the vehicle - it means nothing in the tests but is important only in the "real world." When these insurance tests are done, the vehicle is stationary while the "bumper-basher" moves into the vehicle. One reason for this is that the speed of the basher can be controlled much more exactly than the speed of the vehicle itself.
Guess I was wrong about side airbags. Like the negative comments on the Sedona's bumper tests added to the offset crash summary, comments on side airbags for the Odyssey etc. are apparently made for reference only and don't apply to the actual test. The fact that the Sedona received 5 stars in NHTSA side impact without them is actually a very good sign.
It appears that the main reason the Sedona did not receive a "good" in the offset is dummy head movement - it's head hit the steering wheel through the airbag (although not with great force) and the side pillar on the rebound. In many or most frontal impacts, the driver would presumably be aware it is about to happen, and have a split second to brace himself, which might limit head movement more than in the test. This probably should be less of a concern than having your feet and/or legs crushed by intrusion into the footwell - which seems to be a common problem for the vans rated lower than the Sedona.
Crash test data is important to me. I am pretty confidant in my own ability to drive safely but you never know what the person next to you will do. I currently drive a VW Passatt which has one of the best ratings for crash tests.
And, how many times are you going to have the time to brace yourself when the driver in the opposite lane weaves at the last minute and it results in an offset crash?
Anyway, I agree that being in 4th place, behind the Sienna, WindStar and Odyssey is pretty darn good!
I would hate to drive a ......... read the list of the vans on the bottom.
... Greg :-)
Whether it is 2k or 5k to fix up a car after an accident, as long as I pay my $500 deductible and the insurance pads the rest. I don't care, If Kia fixes the airbag deployment problem so it won't injure my face, it is good enough for me.
All the immediate PR "anomaly" B.S. after the bumper test is a premature reaction from Kia side, it may take a while to recreate the bumper test environment in the lab, to assign the appropriate engineers to investigate and to fix this problem takes time. Let's wait for another month and see what happen.
These tests are long established and well known by manufacturers. If they can't design their vehicles to get at least "Acceptable" or 4-star ratings in these tests, then I don't trust that they have put any effort to safe design in the many other possible crash scenarios that are not well simulated by any tests...
With quadruple 5-star ratings, an "Acceptable" IIHS rating and weighing in over 4500 lbs., I think Sedona is a much safer choice than many other vehicles on the road.
This is a real world offset head on crash and I faired well. The 94 Wrangler, same as the 92 got a 2 star rating for driver at NHTSA and no IIHS test was ever done on it. To summarize, there are so many variables in a real world crash that IMO can't be generated or even resemble the IIHS tests. They use the same standard of testing for all vehicles which tells us that in that exact scenario, that is the outcome. Your real world outcome may differ?
It was new year's day 2000 and my mom who is a nurse was driving to work at 5:30 am. She was on the freeway on an overpass to another freeway. All of a sudden ascending the top she sees headlights and boom. A drunk driver with a stolen van and no license hits my mom head on. She got really banged up and taken to the hospital but nothing major. She was wearing a seatbelt but no airbag in her older Ford Escort.
These are my 2 real world experiences and both have a good outcome as far as not being seriusly injured. People have been killed or seriously injured in "smaller" accidents and not head on ones but we have been fine and also not driving the "safest rated cars" on the road. Crash ratings are either good or bad PR but I still don't believe they reflect real world crashes. I think they are more fluff than substances but I won't tell my wife that. She is the exact opposite. She wanted the Sedona for the NHTSA quad 5 star rating among other things.
My dad used to refuse to wear his seat belt because "if there's a fire in the car, I might not be able to get out". Got tired of arguing with him, asked him to increase his life insurance, and agreed that, in the event of a fire after an accident, if unbelted he could always escape through the huge hole his head had made in the windshield.
I know for a fact that some vehicles perform better than others in some of the most common types of crashes simulated by the NHTSA and IIHS. I'd much rather have my family in one of those vehicles. Otherwise, I'd be assuming a manufactuer that couldn't even make a vehicle do well in these established tests has instead spent time and money making the car safer in other types of crashes (which don't even give them a marketing edge). Call me cynical, but I won't be making that assumption.
Ody01-
The IIHS assigns an overall rating for a reason. I suggest you read up on how they derive their overall rating and what the results mean. Then notice that they also link to the complementary NHTSA tests. Giving credit where credit is due, Sedona does quite well overall for crashworthiness. Maybe not quite as well as Sienna, Odyssey or Windstar, but it's probably among more crashworthy vehicles on the road today.
As a side note, I don't know how many times I've heard or read the following type of anecdote:
"We were in a crash with our monster SUV and it rolled. We were so lucky I only had a broken arm and my kids only had some bruises. It protected us so well we're going to buy another one today!"
It's very easy to let emotion and personal experience make this decision, even though the reality is that a safer vehicle might have avoided the crash to start, probably wouldn't have rolled and most likely wouldn't have caused any injuries at all in the same situation.
Just my 2 cents. Obviously, everyone has to interpret all the available information in their own way.
I'm a single mom who doesn't know much about cars but I know my 99 Caravan was a much superior vehicle. Did I get a lemon? Does anyone else have these problems?
I always enjoy the "smart people only do this/that..." mentality of some people. It's quite telling.
/j
Marian115:
Sorry you're having such tough problems. While the initial flush of excitement has faded, and I've found a few things I don't like about my Sedona, I haven't had any of the problems you describe. I'm at three months and 3K miles. As a matter of fact, the low wind noise, tranny, and braking are outstanding. Doors are smooth and obedient to me and 7 year old alike. I do notice it takes a while to heat up, but after 10 minutes running, I put the front and rear heaters on full, and it's 80 degrees in a minute. Are you turning on the rear heater, and not just the rear fan? Oh, and come to think of it, I did notice that the tank never gets up to "full".
I think you need to bring yours back to the dealer and have a chat, and accompanied test drive, with the service manager.
Also, I had a tranny leak fixed last week. My Sedona is only a month old. My van was also downshifting weird before this. The dealer was very helpful and fixed it quickly.
About tranny downshifting. It is normal on uphill grades. It's the nature of a 5 spd auto. It should not occur on flat roads unless you apply more throttle, which is normal. I don't know if the Sedona has a kick down adjuster, but my Ram 1500 does and once fine tuned it helped tremendously on not downshifting as much as when I bought it new. It was out of adjustment from the factory. Might be something to ask the KIA service dept. about? Are you getting it on a flat road without applying too much throttle or steady throttle?
How come I don't have your problems and your problems sound very generic?
Problems of no problems or just user feelings.
Ody01, You sounded more like a Japanese camouflaged in a western name.
bb8
I've gotten so used to using seat belts over the years, that I can close the door, put my seat belt on, put the key in the ignition, and start the car......... all in one motion.
Saving your life doesn't take ANY TIME AT ALL!! :-)
------
You'll notice that the IIHS report mentioned the Sedona having up-to-date seat belts in the front with the "pre-tensioners", which helps a lot when it comes to injuries.
... Greg :-)
To be honest, they are kind of crude and actually invalidate the area for storage - not a good place for anything which warps or dries out when heated.
[It's probably time to repost this for newcomers: an ample discussion on pricing and perspectives therein can be found in the 660 +/- 30 messages range.]
P.S. Am I missing something, or is there no intra-board search function? Would be really useful.
I also reviewed the TransPort results...I think they lost the dummy in that one since it looked unlikely that the dummy could be extracted from the vehicle. For comparison, that's a result that impacts a buying decision.
I have nt vibrations to speak of and wind noise? What wind noise? I have handed out nearly ten business cards from my dealer to people asking about my fully loaded my 2-tone Sapphire Blue, and at the same time I have only seen ONE other on the road. The only complaint I have is that my defroster heat output is marginal, and that I will have checked out on my first service. It's really a joy to drive, I am very pleased because in fact I practically live in this thing...ONE SATISFIED OWNER
And what's an old SF guy have to say to ody01?
Hey, you were right; the trailer hitch was a breeze, really. My seven year old daughter even crawled under the car with me, and turned a couple wrenches. A real bonding moment, let me tell you. My little gearhead.
Have you tried turning the dome light master on (left of the radio), then punching all the individual rear dome lights to turn them on, then using the master to turn them on or off? You have to turn them on at the light itself, then you can be Der Meisterswitcher from the cockpit.
It would be nice if Kia could put the circuits in that would activate them on door opening, even regardless of the front switch. Anyway, an enhancement for another year.
Marian115, last night my wife was coming home from work at midnight and she could not close the drivers side door. She had to drive for fifteen minutes in freezing cold weather holding the door closed. Maybe there is an issue with the latches in cold weather, but that was the first time it happened.
Its a Dark Emeral Green/ Silky Beige with leather & sunroof. Also came with a cargo net, but no rear mat..Do all EX's have the cargo net as standard equipement?
We now have 8200 miles and two trips to Florida from Va. It rides and drives very well crusing at 70 to 75 mph. Last trip I checked milage and got 24 to 25 mpg. Have found no real probblems so far, althrough at times I notice a very slight shudder thru the steering wheel when the transmission shifts from 3th to 4 th gear. Thanks to this townhall I've learned how to operate the rear heater and the location of the rear heat vents. The heater puts out very hot air. I plan on buying the service manuals for the Sedona so I can learn even more about my van. I usally buy them anytime I get a new vehicle
As for the air bag deployment - if we address Kia with the issue and ask them to do something about it I believe we will have a better likelihood of getting the issue addressed and corrected (if there is an issue) than if we just speculate about it. My wife is concerned about it, so I asked her to write the company. I think that Kia is concerned with establishing itself with a solid base of customers in the US market, and feel that because of this they may be more responsive than other companies. Write them!
The quadruple 5-star NHTSA results, Acceptable rating from IIHS, and the vehicle's significant weight (much heavier than most minivans) combine to make this one of the safest minivans you can buy, at least from a crash-test performance viewpoint. The poor bumper-test performance is disappointing, but it's far less important than the other test results.
You could make the argument that Sedona is less maneuverable than other minivans such as Villager/Quest and MPV, so perhaps those vans are better able to avoid accidents.
..."the Sedona is a winner.'
Dont know if this was posted already.. more press.