Edmunds Members - Cars and Conversations (Archived)

andres3

28firefighter said:

So...given that I live in a market that is an anomaly (and one that seems to actually be slowing down), we realized a 40% ROI in 3 years of ownership of our first home in Seattle. We had to use all of that gain as a downpayment in order to fit our current home within our budget. Our current home sold for exactly the same as we paid for our first home 3 years ago, just is bigger and located in the suburbs.

We were lucky and had the funds for our first down payment to be able to purchase when we did, or we would be like our friends and stuck putting every dime of our savings into a home. My issue is that while they are "in" the market and likely realizing excellent gains, same as we did, they are cash flow strapped and have no emergency fund. I can't live like that and probably wouldn't live like that.

Sounds like a recipe for disaster, and eerily similar to what happened in 2008 and 2009. Why would you want to be in a position where if you lose your job your forclosing as soon as the bank can do it.

andres3

dino001 said:

houdini1 said:

Home ownership is a secondary investment, not your main investment. The alternative to home ownership is renting. And even in the worst possible scenario you can piece together, such as the above, the homeowner still comes out ahead. Coming out ahead is good when you consider the poor guy who spent all those years renting, while still having to pay utilities, taxes, various home expenses and paying enough monthly rent for his landlord to pay all his expenses, taxes, home repairs and still make a profit. How far in the minus column is that poor guy after 10 or 20 years.

I actually disagree with the math. Nobody showed me a comprehensive calculation that includes all costs of home ownership and compares them with costs of renting. It's not there, because real estate industry would kill any suggestion the math may not be as great. Another reason is large number of variables, not conducive for general public to actually understand a multivariable calculation. It's usually couple of great sounding one-liners, like "you lock in your payment, think how many times your landlord will raise the rent", aimed at ending any in-depth discussion about the subject and going with the warm feelings.

BTW, really poor guy will never get approved for any kind of decent mortgage in a decent house in a safe neighborhood. Not so poor guy will have enough to get a decent rental, save the rest and invest it on a side.

For years we heard "houses never lose value". Well, they did big. Mine still didn't recover from its 2005 peak. 13 years later it's still worth below what people thought it was worth then. But even if its value rose by 50 or 75 percent in that time, I'd still maintain there were better "investments". I like my place, I'm not selling it and I'm not moving. I just refuse to give in into illusions, which makes me a bit strange guy. It feels sometimes like this guy who exposes alchemist's scam of turning lead into gold and gets burned on the stake (not the alchemist, the guy who exposed him).

that's how i feel when I expose the NHTSA and IIHS as the political propaganda machines they are.

andres3

driver100 said:

houdini1 said:

Home ownership is a secondary investment, not your main investment. The alternative to home ownership is renting. And even in the worst possible scenario you can piece together, such as the above, the homeowner still comes out ahead. Coming out ahead is good when you consider the poor guy who spent all those years renting, while still having to pay utilities, taxes, various home expenses and paying enough monthly rent for his landlord to pay all his expenses, taxes, home repairs and still make a profit. How far in the minus column is that poor guy after 10 or 20 years.

Home ownership should be no investment unless you have more than one. Your home is where you want to live....nothing more, nothing less. Whether prices go down or up, you need a place to live, that is what a home should be.


Some examples of why home investment can be bad....really bad;
1. Before we bought, we rented a townhouse in Florida. The people we rented it from bought it as an investment. Paid $650000 for it, used is $250000 pension money from Southwest as the down payment. They had to walk away when the value decreased to $250000 in 2008.
2. My brother rented his apartment 35 years ago......rent was $550 a month. Everyone told him to buy, and since then condo prices have probably tripled or quadrupled. But, because of rent controls he ended up paying $930 a month after 35 years. His rent didn't even double over that time....now who is the smart one?
3. Our place in Florida reached a peak of being worth about $220000 just before the crash of 2008. We bought it for $125000 in 2011. Original price 22 years ago was about $110000, Our home is worth maybe $160 to $170K, but I am not a financial genius, just bought at the right time....still, not a huge profit over 7 years, especially if you include costs to maintain, taxes, etc. It is buying a lifestyle....that is what it is....I don't consider it an investment at all. If it goes up great, it doesn't really matter.

1. Had to walk away? I don't think so. Chose to more likely.
2. LOL
3. Agreed. But CA does make property tax cheap for those that bought cheap.

andres3

graphicguy said:

tbirdmarco said:

 The person job placement man from the state is new and thinks it’s good for me to do cold calling I don’t like the idea what do you all think just go there and show up and talk with them maybe to potentially hire me for something I don’t like it one bit 

@tbirdmarco ....When I first got out of college, my first "real" job was with Xerox. I was a tech representative at the time, the guy who fixed their "Star" system. That was essentially a typewriter(s) that was wired directly into their print shop. It was all hooked together via ethernet and the first real "network" I was really aware of.

So, what's this have to do with your cold calling interview?

Well, after about a year of being the tech rep, the Star sales rep was let go as she had a hard time hitting her quota on a consistent basis. Since I was providing her a lot of leads, the viewed me as a potential and successful sales person. Most of the offices I visited had temp workers manning the typewriters and print shop. They would spend a month or so with one company and then would be moved to the next. They knew exactly which companies needed such a system as Xerox's Star System. They would let me know who they were....mainly large legal and financial firms.

I resisted going into sales. I did not want to be a sales person and didn't have any experience in sales.

My boss at the time said the Sales Manager would send me for sales training. If after 6 months in the field as a sales person I was not successful, or still did not like it, I could have my old job back as a Tech.

Not sure about today, but back in the late '80s when I first started working for them, Xerox sales training was considered the best in the world.

In 6 months, I was the 2nd revenue producer of Star Systems in all of Xerox. I made more money that I ever thought possible. I was hooked.

But, the least favorite part of my job was cold calling, which I did for 8-9 hours every Tuesday to set up demos and appointments for the rest of the week and into the next week. Lots and lots of phone work was involved. Sometimes once I finished one meeting, I'd look in the same office building for firms that may be able to use one of our Star Systems and would cold call in person. Again, hated doing that.

Over time, I didn't have any time for cold calling, however. I was just asking my customers for their introductions to other companies they thought might be a potential customer. Funny how lawyers and legal personnel all seem to know each other, regardless of the firms they worked for.

Parlayed that into a 10 year career with Xerox. Went onto become a Sales Manager, a Sales Training Manager (based in Leesburg, VA), a District Manager and finally the Director of Marketing for their (then new) color printers and copiers.

Since then I seem to have been in demand and have worked for companies small and large, with several startups during the (then) exploding tech arena in the '90s.

It all starts with cold calling, though.

If Craig @isellhondas is still around, he'll probably concur. So will @driver100.

The key is to have a clear upward path from the cold calling position. If successful, it can be very lucrative.

Good luck!

BTW....what will you be selling?

I'm the personality type where sales is a bit voodoo cult-like for me. It's hard to separate my own view point on sales when trying to sell something myself. My personality type is that "if I needed your product, I'd have found it myself already."

ab348

I wonder if part of what a successful sales person needs is something I picked up on years ago when I was trying to get better at presenting. I read/heard someone say that you had to convince yourself that you knew more about the subject than anyone in the audience so you could free yourself up and project confidence. I have to confess this worked wonders for me. 

suydam

andres3 said:

driver100 said:

houdini1 said:

Home ownership is a secondary investment, not your main investment. The alternative to home ownership is renting. And even in the worst possible scenario you can piece together, such as the above, the homeowner still comes out ahead. Coming out ahead is good when you consider the poor guy who spent all those years renting, while still having to pay utilities, taxes, various home expenses and paying enough monthly rent for his landlord to pay all his expenses, taxes, home repairs and still make a profit. How far in the minus column is that poor guy after 10 or 20 years.

Home ownership should be no investment unless you have more than one. Your home is where you want to live....nothing more, nothing less. Whether prices go down or up, you need a place to live, that is what a home should be.


Some examples of why home investment can be bad....really bad;
1. Before we bought, we rented a townhouse in Florida. The people we rented it from bought it as an investment. Paid $650000 for it, used is $250000 pension money from Southwest as the down payment. They had to walk away when the value decreased to $250000 in 2008.
2. My brother rented his apartment 35 years ago......rent was $550 a month. Everyone told him to buy, and since then condo prices have probably tripled or quadrupled. But, because of rent controls he ended up paying $930 a month after 35 years. His rent didn't even double over that time....now who is the smart one?
3. Our place in Florida reached a peak of being worth about $220000 just before the crash of 2008. We bought it for $125000 in 2011. Original price 22 years ago was about $110000, Our home is worth maybe $160 to $170K, but I am not a financial genius, just bought at the right time....still, not a huge profit over 7 years, especially if you include costs to maintain, taxes, etc. It is buying a lifestyle....that is what it is....I don't consider it an investment at all. If it goes up great, it doesn't really matter.

1. Had to walk away? I don't think so. Chose to more likely.
2. LOL
3. Agreed. But CA does make property tax cheap for those that bought cheap.

The Calif property tax break works if you’re ninety and have lived in your house forever, or were lucky to have parents who bought back in the 50s or 60s and you inherited from them AND stayed in that house. Otherwise you will have a very tough time getting into that market without a hefty income.

Michaell

suydam said:

andres3 said:

driver100 said:

houdini1 said:

Home ownership is a secondary investment, not your main investment. The alternative to home ownership is renting. And even in the worst possible scenario you can piece together, such as the above, the homeowner still comes out ahead. Coming out ahead is good when you consider the poor guy who spent all those years renting, while still having to pay utilities, taxes, various home expenses and paying enough monthly rent for his landlord to pay all his expenses, taxes, home repairs and still make a profit. How far in the minus column is that poor guy after 10 or 20 years.

Home ownership should be no investment unless you have more than one. Your home is where you want to live....nothing more, nothing less. Whether prices go down or up, you need a place to live, that is what a home should be.


Some examples of why home investment can be bad....really bad;
1. Before we bought, we rented a townhouse in Florida. The people we rented it from bought it as an investment. Paid $650000 for it, used is $250000 pension money from Southwest as the down payment. They had to walk away when the value decreased to $250000 in 2008.
2. My brother rented his apartment 35 years ago......rent was $550 a month. Everyone told him to buy, and since then condo prices have probably tripled or quadrupled. But, because of rent controls he ended up paying $930 a month after 35 years. His rent didn't even double over that time....now who is the smart one?
3. Our place in Florida reached a peak of being worth about $220000 just before the crash of 2008. We bought it for $125000 in 2011. Original price 22 years ago was about $110000, Our home is worth maybe $160 to $170K, but I am not a financial genius, just bought at the right time....still, not a huge profit over 7 years, especially if you include costs to maintain, taxes, etc. It is buying a lifestyle....that is what it is....I don't consider it an investment at all. If it goes up great, it doesn't really matter.

1. Had to walk away? I don't think so. Chose to more likely.
2. LOL
3. Agreed. But CA does make property tax cheap for those that bought cheap.

The Calif property tax break works if you’re ninety and have lived in your house forever, or were lucky to have parents who bought back in the 50s or 60s and you inherited from them AND stayed in that house. Otherwise you will have a very tough time getting into that market without a hefty income.

My folks bought their house in CA in 1968, and my mom still lives in it.

I remember the Proposition 13 debate clearly, as my dad was a firefighter and they were worried that their funding was going to dry up. Didn't happen, and now the property taxes are under $1000 annually.

suydam

I wonder how many Californians are now in that happy situation?

nyccarguy

I thought the stock market was too high at 18K.  I sure think it is way too high at 25K (or whatever it is today).  The low interest rates are still propping up the stock market and the economy.  News reports like to tell us how higher interest rates affect mortgages and car loans.  While this is true, big companies borrow tons of money to finance equipment, mergers, & acquisitions.  The companies constantly refinance debt to make it look like they have higher profit margins.  Higher profit margins equal higher stock prices.  Food for thought from a simple guy who sells toilets for a living.  

henryn

Michaell said:

My folks bought their house in CA in 1968, and my mom still lives in it.

I remember the Proposition 13 debate clearly, as my dad was a firefighter and they were worried that their funding was going to dry up. Didn't happen, and now the property taxes are under $1000 annually.

Well, I’m not in California (thank goodness), and my house isn’t that valuable, but my property taxes are frozen now that I’m post 65. A little under $500 a year. The last year I paid full taxes on this house, it was nearly $2,500. That is by far the best “senior discount” I have discovered.

tjc78

dino001 said:

Home ownership is a secondary investment, not your main investment. The alternative to home ownership is renting. And even in the worst possible scenario you can piece together, such as the above, the homeowner still comes out ahead. Coming out ahead is good when you consider the poor guy who spent all those years renting, while still having to pay utilities, taxes, various home expenses and paying enough monthly rent for his landlord to pay all his expenses, taxes, home repairs and still make a profit. How far in the minus column is that poor guy after 10 or 20 years.

I actually disagree with the math. Nobody showed me a comprehensive calculation that includes all costs of home ownership and compares them with costs of renting. It's not there, because real estate industry would kill any suggestion the math may not be as great. Another reason is large number of variables, not conducive for general public to actually understand a multivariable calculation. It's usually couple of great sounding one-liners, like "you lock in your payment, think how many times your landlord will raise the rent", aimed at ending any in-depth discussion about the subject and going with the warm feelings. BTW, really poor guy will never get approved for any kind of decent mortgage in a decent house in a safe neighborhood. Not so poor guy will have enough to get a decent rental, save the rest and invest it on a side. For years we heard "houses never lose value". Well, they did big. Mine still didn't recover from its 2005 peak. 13 years later it's still worth below what people thought it was worth then. But even if its value rose by 50 or 75 percent in that time, I'd still maintain there were better "investments". I like my place, I'm not selling it and I'm not moving. I just refuse to give in into illusions, which makes me a bit strange guy. It feels sometimes like this guy who exposes alchemist's scam of turning lead into gold and gets burned on the stake (not the alchemist, the guy who exposed him).

I hear you!  My house is a money pit IMO.  I bought in 05.  I’ve done tons of work, added on etc etc.   I wonder if I will ever turn a profit.  

When we added on last year my wife and I had a long conversation about this ... we aren’t going anywhere. 

Still have things to do too, i still don’t have my yard the way I want it after the addition last year. 

driver100

GG Since then I seem to have been in demand and have worked for companies small and large, with several startups during the (then) exploding tech arena in the '90s.

It all starts with cold calling, though.

If Craig @isellhondas is still around, he'll probably concur. So will @driver100.

Quite a story GG. My father told me if you want to earn good money, after being a professional like a doctor, lawyer or dentist, the best road is sales. You don't even need a good education.

I think, a good salesman should believe in his product. And, you have to listen to the potential buyer and show him how your product will make his life better.

When I wanted to put our books into a large chain store my goal was to make the buyer look like a hero, here was a product that would boost his sales....and make him into a hero.

You never know who your next big customer is.....the only way to find him is to go out and start knocking on doors. The Terminex guy that came to my house made a huge mistake...he tried to scare me and didn't ask me my needs....he droned on trying to make a sale for himself.....very poor selling technique.

driver100

Did anyone see the video of the girl on Dr Phil who demands that her mother has to buy her a $231000 Mercedes G Class? She would take a C Class but she "NEEDS" a G Class.

LINK TO VIDEO.....GO TO 2 min 10 sec to see the part about the G Class....unbelievable!

tbirdmarco

 Thank you chief Stewart and driver 100 and others for the advice not to sell anything that was just an auto mechanic shop in the area we called and they wanted me to come in and talk about a job 

oldfarmer50

imidazol97 said:

How do I find my FICO score? My Chase cards don't tell me. My bank doesn't tell me.

Only way I know would be to buy a house, like a winter home in Florida. I'm waiting for all those canadians to start selling to I can get a good price. But even then I wouldn't apply for a loan. So how do I learn my score?

My wife's Discover card tells her even though she hasn't used it in months. Funny, now that I think of it, she has an 850 score too, even though she's been out of the work force since 1981.

oldfarmer50

andres3 said:

graphicguy said:

tbirdmarco said:

 The person job placement man from the state is new and thinks it’s good for me to do cold calling I don’t like the idea what do you all think just go there and show up and talk with them maybe to potentially hire me for something I don’t like it one bit 

@tbirdmarco ....When I first got out of college, my first "real" job was with Xerox. I was a tech representative at the time, the guy who fixed their "Star" system. That was essentially a typewriter(s) that was wired directly into their print shop. It was all hooked together via ethernet and the first real "network" I was really aware of.

So, what's this have to do with your cold calling interview?

Well, after about a year of being the tech rep, the Star sales rep was let go as she had a hard time hitting her quota on a consistent basis. Since I was providing her a lot of leads, the viewed me as a potential and successful sales person. Most of the offices I visited had temp workers manning the typewriters and print shop. They would spend a month or so with one company and then would be moved to the next. They knew exactly which companies needed such a system as Xerox's Star System. They would let me know who they were....mainly large legal and financial firms.

I resisted going into sales. I did not want to be a sales person and didn't have any experience in sales.

My boss at the time said the Sales Manager would send me for sales training. If after 6 months in the field as a sales person I was not successful, or still did not like it, I could have my old job back as a Tech.

Not sure about today, but back in the late '80s when I first started working for them, Xerox sales training was considered the best in the world.

In 6 months, I was the 2nd revenue producer of Star Systems in all of Xerox. I made more money that I ever thought possible. I was hooked.

But, the least favorite part of my job was cold calling, which I did for 8-9 hours every Tuesday to set up demos and appointments for the rest of the week and into the next week. Lots and lots of phone work was involved. Sometimes once I finished one meeting, I'd look in the same office building for firms that may be able to use one of our Star Systems and would cold call in person. Again, hated doing that.

Over time, I didn't have any time for cold calling, however. I was just asking my customers for their introductions to other companies they thought might be a potential customer. Funny how lawyers and legal personnel all seem to know each other, regardless of the firms they worked for.

Parlayed that into a 10 year career with Xerox. Went onto become a Sales Manager, a Sales Training Manager (based in Leesburg, VA), a District Manager and finally the Director of Marketing for their (then new) color printers and copiers.

Since then I seem to have been in demand and have worked for companies small and large, with several startups during the (then) exploding tech arena in the '90s.

It all starts with cold calling, though.

If Craig @isellhondas is still around, he'll probably concur. So will @driver100.

The key is to have a clear upward path from the cold calling position. If successful, it can be very lucrative.

Good luck!

BTW....what will you be selling?

I'm the personality type where sales is a bit voodoo cult-like for me. It's hard to separate my own view point on sales when trying to sell something myself. My personality type is that "if I needed your product, I'd have found it myself already."

I think a lot of sales is reinforcing a person's already made decision to buy. Cold calling is much tougher because the decision hasn't been made yet. The difference between someone walking into the showroom vs. a salesman walking up to people on the street and asking "who wants to buy a car TODAY?"

graphicguy

Michaell said:

graphicguy said:

stickguy said:

Aldis, we like it for some stuff. Just keep a spare quarter in cup holder. And the washer lady is stealing. Because at checkout, you don’t get the same cart back. The next person in line will get her washer.

Went to ALDIs once. Not impressed....with the selection nor the quality. Store was somewhat dingy, too. Even the cashier wasn’t really welcoming.

Maybe I expected too much.

Won’t go back.

Found some good deals on some high quality produce and butcher shop food at Whole Foods, though. Plus, I got some “deals” because I’m an Amazon Prime member.

Still, my go to is.....

http://junglejims.com

My last trip to the Queen City, we stopped by the Jungle Jim's off 275 on the east side of town. I'll admit it was an amazing place, especially with the bar in the middle of the store.

Michaell.....And, that’s the smaller of the two here in Cincinnati. I live about 15-20 minutes from the larger one. It’s definitely a “destination”.

oldfarmer50

henryn said:

Michaell said:

My folks bought their house in CA in 1968, and my mom still lives in it.

I remember the Proposition 13 debate clearly, as my dad was a firefighter and they were worried that their funding was going to dry up. Didn't happen, and now the property taxes are under $1000 annually.

Well, I’m not in California (thank goodness), and my house isn’t that valuable, but my property taxes are frozen now that I’m post 65. A little under $500 a year. The last year I paid full taxes on this house, it was nearly $2,500. That is by far the best “senior discount” I have discovered.

I get a farmer's tax exemption that saves me about 1/3 of my taxes but I'd kill to pay even $2500. Many people in my area pay $10k-20k in property/school taxes. It's insane.

houdini1

houdini1 said:

driver100 said:

houdini1 said:

Home ownership is a secondary investment, not your main investment. The alternative to home ownership is renting. And even in the worst possible scenario you can piece together, such as the above, the homeowner still comes out ahead. Coming out ahead is good when you consider the poor guy who spent all those years renting, while still having to pay utilities, taxes, various home expenses and paying enough monthly rent for his landlord to pay all his expenses, taxes, home repairs and still make a profit. How far in the minus column is that poor guy after 10 or 20 years.

Home ownership should be no investment unless you have more than one. Your home is where you want to live....nothing more, nothing less. Whether prices go down or up, you need a place to live, that is what a home should be.


Some examples of why home investment can be bad....really bad;

It is buying a lifestyle....that is what it is....I don't consider it an investment at all. If it goes up great, it doesn't really matter.

If it doesn't matter to you, if you do make a profit when you sell, please send it to me. Thx.

oldfarmer50 said:

andres3 said:

graphicguy said:

tbirdmarco said:

 The person job placement man from the state is new and thinks it’s good for me to do cold calling I don’t like the idea what do you all think just go there and show up and talk with them maybe to potentially hire me for something I don’t like it one bit 

@tbirdmarco ....When I first got out of college, my first "real" job was with Xerox. I was a tech representative at the time, the guy who fixed their "Star" system. That was essentially a typewriter(s) that was wired directly into their print shop. It was all hooked together via ethernet and the first real "network" I was really aware of.

So, what's this have to do with your cold calling interview?

Well, after about a year of being the tech rep, the Star sales rep was let go as she had a hard time hitting her quota on a consistent basis. Since I was providing her a lot of leads, the viewed me as a potential and successful sales person. Most of the offices I visited had temp workers manning the typewriters and print shop. They would spend a month or so with one company and then would be moved to the next. They knew exactly which companies needed such a system as Xerox's Star System. They would let me know who they were....mainly large legal and financial firms.

I resisted going into sales. I did not want to be a sales person and didn't have any experience in sales.

My boss at the time said the Sales Manager would send me for sales training. If after 6 months in the field as a sales person I was not successful, or still did not like it, I could have my old job back as a Tech.

Not sure about today, but back in the late '80s when I first started working for them, Xerox sales training was considered the best in the world.

In 6 months, I was the 2nd revenue producer of Star Systems in all of Xerox. I made more money that I ever thought possible. I was hooked.

But, the least favorite part of my job was cold calling, which I did for 8-9 hours every Tuesday to set up demos and appointments for the rest of the week and into the next week. Lots and lots of phone work was involved. Sometimes once I finished one meeting, I'd look in the same office building for firms that may be able to use one of our Star Systems and would cold call in person. Again, hated doing that.

Over time, I didn't have any time for cold calling, however. I was just asking my customers for their introductions to other companies they thought might be a potential customer. Funny how lawyers and legal personnel all seem to know each other, regardless of the firms they worked for.

Parlayed that into a 10 year career with Xerox. Went onto become a Sales Manager, a Sales Training Manager (based in Leesburg, VA), a District Manager and finally the Director of Marketing for their (then new) color printers and copiers.

Since then I seem to have been in demand and have worked for companies small and large, with several startups during the (then) exploding tech arena in the '90s.

It all starts with cold calling, though.

If Craig @isellhondas is still around, he'll probably concur. So will @driver100.

The key is to have a clear upward path from the cold calling position. If successful, it can be very lucrative.

Good luck!

BTW....what will you be selling?

I'm the personality type where sales is a bit voodoo cult-like for me. It's hard to separate my own view point on sales when trying to sell something myself. My personality type is that "if I needed your product, I'd have found it myself already."

I think a lot of sales is reinforcing a person's already made decision to buy. Cold calling is much tougher because the decision hasn't been made yet. The difference between someone walking into the showroom vs. a salesman walking up to people on the street and asking "who wants to buy a car TODAY?"

I attended a convention in Tulsa, OK. about 40 years ago, and an older waitress gave me this sales advice. She said it was pretty simple: Sit close, talk low, and don't take no for an answer ! I went on to become director of sales training for a national company, and never forgot that advice.

graphicguy

ab348 said:

I wonder if part of what a successful sales person needs is something I picked up on years ago when I was trying to get better at presenting. I read/heard someone say that you had to convince yourself that you knew more about the subject than anyone in the audience so you could free yourself up and project confidence. I have to confess this worked wonders for me. 

driver100 said:

GG Since then I seem to have been in demand and have worked for companies small and large, with several startups during the (then) exploding tech arena in the '90s.

It all starts with cold calling, though.

If Craig @isellhondas is still around, he'll probably concur. So will @driver100.

Quite a story GG. My father told me if you want to earn good money, after being a professional like a doctor, lawyer or dentist, the best road is sales. You don't even need a good education.

I think, a good salesman should believe in his product. And, you have to listen to the potential buyer and show him how your product will make his life better.

When I wanted to put our books into a large chain store my goal was to make the buyer look like a hero, here was a product that would boost his sales....and make him into a hero.

You never know who your next big customer is.....the only way to find him is to go out and start knocking on doors. The Terminex guy that came to my house made a huge mistake...he tried to scare me and didn't ask me my needs....he droned on trying to make a sale for himself.....very poor selling technique.

Xerox was excellent at training sales people. If you couldn’t succeed with their (constant) training, you should look for a different kind of work.

In the 3 years I was in sales with Xerox, I think I went back to classes at least once every 6 months. There was basic, advanced, strategic, enterprise and some other sales courses they taught me that I used to make me successful.

Any sales person who says you don’t have to know your product to be successful, isn’t a very good sales person. This is particularly true in high tech sales where potential customers need to get knuckle deep into the product to find a fit.

That’s what always shocked me about some car sales people. If you know more than your car sales person, it’s probably a fair guess that the sales person learns his/her products quickly, or that person will fail.

Establishing rapport and finding out needs is certainly important, too. But, even if you find out what your potential customer wants/needs, but don’t know your own product enough to find a fit, you’re not going to make the sale in all likelihood.

As much as I hated cold calling, I do miss the sales end of my previous jobs. Nothing feels better than to know you did a good job for your customer and they’re happy with you.....and knowing your company is going to reward you (well) for the good job you did.

Met a lot of different people, too.....some remain friends with me to this day. Some even call me to consult on other tech projects they find themselves involved in.

I feel the same towards my Acura and BMW sales people, too. They know me. I know them. They know their products, WELL!. They make buying their products simple for me.

fintail

My grandma pays under 1K for her property taxes on the house that is worth dozens of times what they paid for it in the 60s, but she's in her 90s. Numerous houses here have 10K++ tax bills too, but the houses are worth 7 figures, so I won't be feeling any sympathy.

oldfarmer50 said:

I get a farmer's tax exemption that saves me about 1/3 of my taxes but I'd kill to pay even $2500. Many people in my area pay $10k-20k in property/school taxes. It's insane.

fintail

Watching Dr Phil is about as appealing as watching a 24 hour loop of Fox and Friends.

Regarding the teen, now we know where "class warfare" is born. Sometimes, the French have a good idea

driver100 said:

Did anyone see the video of the girl on Dr Phil who demands that her mother has to buy her a $231000 Mercedes G Class? She would take a C Class but she "NEEDS" a G Class.

LINK TO VIDEO.....GO TO 2 min 10 sec to see the part about the G Class....unbelievable!

stickguy

$12,000 annual property taxes are a huge reason I want to move to Delaware.

And houses are not just financial decision. When raising our family, wanted our own place and to stay in it a long time. And renting a big house, ain’t cheap.

Now that we are Empty nesting, renting is realistic. Just not sure wife will do it! Purely emotional reasons. I would like to sell, them move to a new area and rent for a bit while we settle in.

bwia

RIP Sergio. According to the NY Times.....

"Sergio Marchionne, the executive who pulled two ailing carmakers from the brink of collapse and led the improbable transformation of Fiat Chrysler into an automotive giant, died on Wednesday in Zurich. He was 66."

imidazol97

It's always sad when young people like him pass away.

driver100

fintail said:

Watching Dr Phil is about as appealing as watching a 24 hour loop of Fox and Friends.

Regarding the teen, now we know where "class warfare" is born. Sometimes, the French have a good idea

driver100 said:

Did anyone see the video of the girl on Dr Phil who demands that her mother has to buy her a $231000 Mercedes G Class? She would take a C Class but she "NEEDS" a G Class.

LINK TO VIDEO.....GO TO 2 min 10 sec to see the part about the G Class....unbelievable!

Talk about "afluenza". I find it scary that kid is walking among us.

Mr_Shiftright

henryn said:

Michaell said:

My folks bought their house in CA in 1968, and my mom still lives in it.

I remember the Proposition 13 debate clearly, as my dad was a firefighter and they were worried that their funding was going to dry up. Didn't happen, and now the property taxes are under $1000 annually.

Well, I’m not in California (thank goodness), and my house isn’t that valuable, but my property taxes are frozen now that I’m post 65. A little under $500 a year. The last year I paid full taxes on this house, it was nearly $2,500. That is by far the best “senior discountI have discovered.

California property taxes are considerably lower than in Texas, however. CA ranks 17 (1 being the lowest) and Texas ranks 46th:

https://wallethub.com/edu/states-with-the-highest-and-lowest-property-taxes/11585/

Look at poor New Jersey!

Mr_Shiftright

fintail said:

Watching Dr Phil is about as appealing as watching a 24 hour loop of Fox and Friends.

Regarding the teen, now we know where "class warfare" is born. Sometimes, the French have a good idea

driver100 said:

Did anyone see the video of the girl on Dr Phil who demands that her mother has to buy her a $231000 Mercedes G Class? She would take a C Class but she "NEEDS" a G Class.

LINK TO VIDEO.....GO TO 2 min 10 sec to see the part about the G Class....unbelievable!

I think it was quite amusing when Dr. Phil came out with a diet book. I mean, "physician, heal thyself".

Mr_Shiftright

Now THIS is disturbing:

Apparently, the USA has the highest road death fatality rate in the industrialized world. On any given summer's day, about 100 Americans die in a car. You name it---texting, drunk drivers, or being a pedestrian hit by any of the above. Saturday is the most lethal day.

Interestingly, the death rate has been going down in some categories, but motorcyclists have not benefited at all from any safety regulations.

With some exceptions within the following age group, road crashes are the leading cause of death for Americans between the ages of 3 and 34 (as of 2014).

abacomike

Good news on the newspaper front: I heard the newspaper hit the front door at 4:30 AM this morning. I guess my phone call directly to the Sun Sentinel newsroom paid off. I wonder how long this will last - I am certainly not calling their subscription and delivery office again - no need to talk to someone 10,000+ miles away who can only email "upper management".

On another front, I took a nasty fall yesterday. My glasses fell off and I hit my left upper cheek just to the left of my left eye on a railing and the blood was everywhere. Bruised on both arms, my left side and my whole body aches.

I was reading somewhere that senior citizens fall frequently with broken hips the most common fall injury. In my case, I am swollen all over my arms and face. No broken bones, at least to the best of my knowledge.

jmonroe

driver100 said:

Did anyone see the video of the girl on Dr Phil who demands that her mother has to buy her a $231000 Mercedes G Class? She would take a C Class but she "NEEDS" a G Class.

LINK TO VIDEO.....GO TO 2 min 10 sec to see the part about the G Class....unbelievable!

Call me naive but I refuse to believe any of that or anything like that. The more shows profess to be reality the more I stay away from them. Just don't want to be insulted like that.

I would more believe that clip was an audition for an actress profession, like keeping a straight face during the whole segment.

Nope, just not going to believe any of it.

jmonroe

ab348

fintail said:

Watching Dr Phil is about as appealing as watching a 24 hour loop of Fox and Friends.

A few years ago I was in a checkout line at the supermarket when I noticed the lady behind me in the line staring at me. This is always a concern because my first thought is that something is wrong - is my fly open, is there soup on my shirt, has a large stinging insect landed on me? She noticed that I noticed and finally said with a look of hope on her face, "Are you... uh, are you Dr. Phil?"

I should have thought more quickly and responded in the affirmative with his accented voice but was startled so I said no. She was very disappointed.

snakeweasel

driver100 said:

Watching Dr Phil is about as appealing as watching a 24 hour loop of Fox and Friends. Regarding the teen, now we know where "class warfare" is born. Sometimes, the French have a good idea

Did anyone see the video of the girl on Dr Phil who demands that her mother has to buy her a $231000 Mercedes G Class? She would take a C Class but she "NEEDS" a G Class. LINK TO VIDEO.....GO TO 2 min 10 sec to see the part about the G Class....unbelievable!

Talk about "afluenza". I find it scary that kid is walking among us.

If she were my kid she would get a 5 year old used Hyundai Accent and she will like it or she can walk, I didnt see any casts on her legs.

abacomike

ab348 said:

fintail said:

Watching Dr Phil is about as appealing as watching a 24 hour loop of Fox and Friends.

A few years ago I was in a checkout line at the supermarket when I noticed the lady behind me in the line staring at me. This is always a concern because my first thought is that something is wrong - is my fly open, is there soup on my shirt, has a large stinging insect landed on me? She noticed that I noticed and finally said with a look of hope on her face, "Are you... uh, are you Dr. Phil?"

I should have thought more quickly and responded in the affirmative with his accented voice but was startled so I said no. She was very disappointed.

Now that's funny! No, not funny, HILARIOUS!!!

I would not have guessed that my fly was open unless she was looking down. I would not have guessed it was a large stinging insect because I would have felt the bite. As for soup - now that's what people always stare at me for - soup stains on my shirt.

Mr_Shiftright

Some people just look good in anything they eat, Mike.

jmonroe

abacomike said:

Good news on the newspaper front: I heard the newspaper hit the front door at 4:30 AM this morning. I guess my phone call directly to the Sun Sentinel newsroom paid off. I wonder how long this will last - I am certainly not calling their subscription and delivery office again - no need to talk to someone 10,000+ miles away who can only email "upper management".

On another front, I took a nasty fall yesterday. My glasses fell off and I hit my left upper cheek just to the left of my left eye on a railing and the blood was everywhere. Bruised on both arms, my left side and my whole body aches.

I was reading somewhere that senior citizens fall frequently with broken hips the most common fall injury. In my case, I am swollen all over my arms and face. No broken bones, at least to the best of my knowledge.

Hope you'll be over the pain soon. Also hope you know how it happened so that it doesn't happen again.

FWIW, last Thursday while leaving her water aerobics class, Mrs. j tripped over a mat out in front of the place and landed on the right side of her jaw and bit into the top inside of her upper lip. The girls called for an ambulance and she had to have 3 stiches. Her lip swelled up pretty good and she looked like I got in a good left hook. She had to break her fall with her hands or it would have been much worse. Looks pretty much like her old self now.

Keep us up do date on your progress.

jmonroe

abacomike

Mr_Shiftright said:

Some people just look good in anything they eat, Mike.

Thanks Shifty - I appreciate your sensitivity to my eating habits. My specialty is Italian Food - I can't leave an Italian Restaurant with a clean and unstained shirt. I just wear what I eat - sort of like a styling accessory.

abacomike

jmonroe said:

abacomike said:

Good news on the newspaper front: I heard the newspaper hit the front door at 4:30 AM this morning. I guess my phone call directly to the Sun Sentinel newsroom paid off. I wonder how long this will last - I am certainly not calling their subscription and delivery office again - no need to talk to someone 10,000+ miles away who can only email "upper management".

On another front, I took a nasty fall yesterday. My glasses fell off and I hit my left upper cheek just to the left of my left eye on a railing and the blood was everywhere. Bruised on both arms, my left side and my whole body aches.

I was reading somewhere that senior citizens fall frequently with broken hips the most common fall injury. In my case, I am swollen all over my arms and face. No broken bones, at least to the best of my knowledge.

Hope you'll be over the pain soon. Also hope you know how it happened so that it doesn't happen again.

FWIW, last Thursday while leaving her water aerobics class, Mrs. j tripped over a mat out in front of the place and landed on the right side of her jaw and bit into the top inside of her upper lip. The girls called for an ambulance and she had to have 3 stiches. Her lip swelled up pretty good and she looked like I got in a good left hook. She had to break her fall with her hands or it would have been much worse. Looks pretty much like her old self now.

Keep us up do date on your progress.

jmonroe

Ouch! Poor Mrs. jmonroe - good thing she only bit into the top inside of her upper lip - could have been so much worse.

As for the "how it happened" learning lesson, I know exactly what caused it. Back when I was in graduate school, a bunch of the guys decided to play softball. I hit a grounder to the third baseman and as I was crossing over first base, I landed in such a way that my left knee dislocated. They took me to the hospital and they did an emergency procedure in the operating room to put my knee back into its natural state. Unfortunately for me, my left common peroneal nerve was severed at the knee joint causing me to lose motion and feeling on parts of my lower left leg and several toes as well as ankle movement. There was a ton of damage done to my ligaments, tendons and my patella. After 6 hours of surgery the following week and two more surgeries to repair the nerve, I went into rehab for a month.

I wore a lower leg brace conneted to my shoe with a spring-loaded mechanism so I would have a more natural walking gate. After many months of physical therapy, they decided that due to the severed nerve, I would develop a "drop foot" on my left leg. So, sometimes I trip on things like sidewalk cracks that are uneven or carpeting - come to think about it - just about everything. I just have to be careful with this limitation I have. So that's the long and the short of it (mostly long). I am paralyzed on my left foot - cannot raise the foot at all.

henryn

abacomike said:

On another front, I took a nasty fall yesterday. My glasses fell off and I hit my left upper cheek just to the left of my left eye on a railing and the blood was everywhere. Bruised on both arms, my left side and my whole body aches.

I was reading somewhere that senior citizens fall frequently with broken hips the most common fall injury. In my case, I am swollen all over my arms and face. No broken bones, at least to the best of my knowledge.

Sorry to hear that, Mike. I hope you make a speedy recovery.

You are correct (as usual) about senior citizens falling frequently. My sense of balance is not what it used to be. Sometimes just walking down the street I will weave a little bit. Normally it's not a problem, but I do have to be very careful when leaning over as it is very easy to lose my balance and need to grab something.

Getting old is definitely not for wussies, but yes, it is still better than the alternative!

abacomike

henryn said:

abacomike said:

On another front, I took a nasty fall yesterday. My glasses fell off and I hit my left upper cheek just to the left of my left eye on a railing and the blood was everywhere. Bruised on both arms, my left side and my whole body aches.

I was reading somewhere that senior citizens fall frequently with broken hips the most common fall injury. In my case, I am swollen all over my arms and face. No broken bones, at least to the best of my knowledge.

Sorry to hear that, Mike. I hope you make a speedy recovery.

You are correct (as usual) about senior citizens falling frequently. My sense of balance is not what it used to be. Sometimes just walking down the street I will weave a little bit. Normally it's not a problem, but I do have to be very careful when leaning over as it is very easy to lose my balance and need to grab something.

Getting old is definitely not for wussies, but yes, it is still better than the alternative!

You are right henryn. So if I got this right, if I see a man weaving his way down the sidewalk in your neighborhood, chances are good it will be you. Be careful out there, henryn.

ab348

The screen cap below is from the brother of a friend of mine. Story is that dad was away on vacation, son invites 2 friends over then leaves them behind alone in the house when he goes out for a while. Hilarity ensures. Really sad.

Michaell

Even license plates are going digital now!

houdini1

Speaking of newspapers, how much do people pay for daily delivery around the country? Here, the paper has gotten smaller and smaller each year and we pay about $250. a year. They ask for $350. and settle for $250. We just keep taking it for the daily puzzles, comics, etc, and out of habit, certainly not for news.

suydam

Newspapers: I have digital subscriptions. They are cheaper and I enjoy reading on my iPad.
Falls: Is something causing you to feel lightheaded and fall, @abacomike ? That’s rrally scary. When my Dad fell and broke his hip at the age of 86, that was it for independent living. And @jmonroe, “using your hands to break your fall” is the primary reason for broken wrists. I’ve done that twice now.

roadburner

ab348 said:

I wonder if part of what a successful sales person needs is something I picked up on years ago when I was trying to get better at presenting. I read/heard someone say that you had to convince yourself that you knew more about the subject than anyone in the audience so you could free yourself up and project confidence. I have to confess this worked wonders for me. 

My new car manager said that I was the "anti-salesman"- meaning I talked about the product with enthusiasm and no attempt to overtly "sell" the car. Of course that only works if you truly believe in the product.

imidazol97

suydam said:

Newspapers: I have digital subscriptions. They are cheaper and I enjoy reading on my iPad.
Falls: Is something causing you to feel lightheaded and fall, @abacomike ? That’s rrally scary. When my Dad fell and broke his hip at the age of 86, that was it for independent living. And @jmonroe, “using your hands to break your fall” is the primary reason for broken wrists. I’ve done that twice now.

Do many elderly have a hip "break" and then they fall. The break is due to osteoporosis or other bone deterioration, but the victim doesn't realize which happened first. I was told that was what happened with my brother a few years ago. He had been in a nursing home without much activity and the bone deteriorated from not being used to carry normal weight, in my opinion.

driver100

Mike....you had a pretty long spell without any mishaps. You shouldn't have gone out....you were overdue for something like this to happen.
At least, no broken bones, rest up and then get out there and take on the world again.

driver100

jmonroe said:

driver100 said:

Did anyone see the video of the girl on Dr Phil who demands that her mother has to buy her a $231000 Mercedes G Class? She would take a C Class but she "NEEDS" a G Class.

LINK TO VIDEO.....GO TO 2 min 10 sec to see the part about the G Class....unbelievable!

Call me naive but I refuse to believe any of that or anything like that. The more shows profess to be reality the more I stay away from them. Just don't want to be insulted like that.

I would more believe that clip was an audition for an actress profession, like keeping a straight face during the whole segment.

What! You don't believe Dr Phil?
You would think it is too outrageous to be possible, but, I think there are kids like that.
btw.....that lowlife kid according to this got her G Wagon;
Girl on Dr Phil gets her G Wagon
I have no idea what she will do for the rest of her life....and I feel really sorry for the guy who marries her.

I agree with snake........she could have had my brothers 2008 Hyundai Accent for $4000, that would be way more than the little brat deserves.

jmonroe

abacomike said:

jmonroe said:

abacomike said:

Good news on the newspaper front: I heard the newspaper hit the front door at 4:30 AM this morning. I guess my phone call directly to the Sun Sentinel newsroom paid off. I wonder how long this will last - I am certainly not calling their subscription and delivery office again - no need to talk to someone 10,000+ miles away who can only email "upper management".

On another front, I took a nasty fall yesterday. My glasses fell off and I hit my left upper cheek just to the left of my left eye on a railing and the blood was everywhere. Bruised on both arms, my left side and my whole body aches.

I was reading somewhere that senior citizens fall frequently with broken hips the most common fall injury. In my case, I am swollen all over my arms and face. No broken bones, at least to the best of my knowledge.

Hope you'll be over the pain soon. Also hope you know how it happened so that it doesn't happen again.

FWIW, last Thursday while leaving her water aerobics class, Mrs. j tripped over a mat out in front of the place and landed on the right side of her jaw and bit into the top inside of her upper lip. The girls called for an ambulance and she had to have 3 stiches. Her lip swelled up pretty good and she looked like I got in a good left hook. She had to break her fall with her hands or it would have been much worse. Looks pretty much like her old self now.

Keep us up do date on your progress.

jmonroe

Ouch! Poor Mrs. jmonroe - good thing she only bit into the top inside of her upper lip - could have been so much worse.

As for the "how it happened" learning lesson, I know exactly what caused it. Back when I was in graduate school, a bunch of the guys decided to play softball. I hit a grounder to the third baseman and as I was crossing over first base, I landed in such a way that my left knee dislocated. They took me to the hospital and they did an emergency procedure in the operating room to put my knee back into its natural state. Unfortunately for me, my left common peroneal nerve was severed at the knee joint causing me to lose motion and feeling on parts of my lower left leg and several toes as well as ankle movement. There was a ton of damage done to my ligaments, tendons and my patella. After 6 hours of surgery the following week and two more surgeries to repair the nerve, I went into rehab for a month.

I wore a lower leg brace conneted to my shoe with a spring-loaded mechanism so I would have a more natural walking gate. After many months of physical therapy, they decided that due to the severed nerve, I would develop a "drop foot" on my left leg. So, sometimes I trip on things like sidewalk cracks that are uneven or carpeting - come to think about it - just about everything. I just have to be careful with this limitation I have. So that's the long and the short of it (mostly long). I am paralyzed on my left foot - cannot raise the foot at all.

Gee @Mike, do you have any other ailments you want to tell us about now or are you going to put us through the agony of hearing about them one by one.

Keep in mind that there is only so much poster length that @driver100 can take in one day from one person.

jmonroe

jmonroe

suydam said:

Newspapers: I have digital subscriptions. They are cheaper and I enjoy reading on my iPad.
Falls: Is something causing you to feel lightheaded and fall, @abacomike ? That’s rrally scary. When my Dad fell and broke his hip at the age of 86, that was it for independent living. And @jmonroe, “using your hands to break your fall” is the primary reason for broken wrists. I’ve done that twice now.

I am the one that said Mrs. j "had to break her fall" but she says she doesn't remember doing that. Everyone tells her it could have been so much worse and that she is very lucky that all she suffered was a top lip that needed a few stitches..

As for you braking your wrist twice, you are one ahead of me. If anyone remembers last August, one day before we were going on vacation, I fell off a four foot wall along the driveway that I have navigated umteen times over the years but that day I missed a step and over I went. Skinned up both palms, both elbows and both knees along with having a very sore right wrist. When Mrs. j saw all the blood she got worried but while I was laying there on my back, I remember saying, "it looks worse than it is but this wrist is going to hurt like a bit** tomorrow morning". Because I could move it in all directions I didn't think it was broken. Then when we got back from vacation I decided to go to the emergency room because even though the swelling was almost gone, it was still sore. Sure enough an X-ray showed a break. Even the doctor didn't think it was broken because I could move it so well.

jmonroe