Edmunds Members - Cars and Conversations (Archived)

suydam

Is the teenage driver a boy or a girl. If a boy, your insurance will be very high regardless.

stickguy

I did extensive research, and am comfortable that you can safely use RUG and not notice any difference, unless you plan to race it. The engine is basically the same as the 2.4l Accord engine, with any differences in tuning at the high end of the band. If you use RUG, only thing different is at the extreme margin, you might get a little less power. And unlikely you will ever notice it.

Insurance, I did not see a noticeable increase over the newer Elantra it replaced. But you would need to check your company. if there is a difference compared to any other new car, likely marginal, since it is not a high performance classification model.

Maintenance and repair, not an issue. It is basically a Honda. I used to take my 3.2TL to the Honda dealer for service since it was more convenient. Every 7,500 miles or so when it tells you, take it for an oil change. Usually $30-40 with a coupon. Very little other maintenance required. 4 banger has a timing chain too.

the 9 speed was a bit problematic originally I think. But that is only on the V6. When the DCT first came out (2015) there were some complaints about low speed harshness (I think that was the condition). But it was not mechanical, just software tuning. That got tweaked by 2016 and I have not seen of any issues since. Mine shifts great under every condition. And at least Acura comes with a 6 year, 70,000 mile powertrain warranty. Of course you can get an extended one if you want.

Maybe you will like the Camry too. That was a nice car in the latest iteration. Especially the SE or XSE version. Might be cheaper too.

benjaminh

jipster said:

After some research, a few concerns on the TLX.

1) Insurance
2) Premium fuel
3) Transmission
4) Maintenance and Repair

I was worried about insurance too, but it was only c. $100 more a year for me iirc compared to the Honda Accord I'd previously been driving. Maybe call your insurance agent for a quote.

Premium fuel will probably cost you about $300 more a year. The engine is designed to get its best power and mpg from premium fuel.

The 8-speed dual clutch transmission with unique torque converter has gotten mostly very good reviews. So far I've not heard about any problems with it (knock on wood). It's an in-house Acura transmission, designed and built for this car. I hope and think that they have "overbuilt" this transmission for long life. I did once see a TLX with over 100k miles for sale by a dealer and apparently everything was fine with the 8-speed DCT.

Acura, as you probably know, is the upscale brand of Honda, which is known as a good brand. Having owned 4 Honda Accords before the Acura, I can tell you that everything seems to be of higher quality, down to the battery, which is a bigger and higher grade than you get in an Accord. Should be reliable, but parts will be more expensive than for a Honda Accord, but less than for a BMW etc.

sda

While out for the first time this week. To pick up a few bushes to tighten up the front yard. I don't think I've seen it so crowded, and this new reality.

roadburner

graphicguy said:

90-day birthday for the Stinger this week. Nothing to report. Just a high quality, very fast, fun car to drive. Still holding around 20-21 MPG running around town on PUG. Built very well. Not that I’m want to do any Cafe racing with it, but it puts a big smile on my face when I do.

Paint is smooth and lustrous. Probably the first car I’ve owned where I haven’t seen ANY orange peel effect. Find myself just looking for back roads just to drive it. Been a long time since I’ve done that.

Not many of them on the road. Saw a GTS in town earlier in the week. The GTS driver “flashed” his hello lights at me. Love that orange color.

Car and Driver had a long term test of a Stinger and while they liked the car, they reported that by 40,000 miles,
"Its aging seat leather took on a shiny patina that looked a lot like vinyl. Creaks in its structure and suspension appeared that weren't present at 20,000 miles."

Now, CAR in England also had one for a year, but put less than 10,000 miles on it. They liked it as well.

Automobile had a long term GT for 19,000 miles and absolutely loved it- more than an M550i that had been in their fleet.

So I'm extremely conflicted, the 540i is a known quantity, and with the non-adjustable M Sport suspension it handles better than any other 5er save the M5. It also has a few more bells and whistles. Then I read an article like this: Automobile reviews a Stinger GTS. I just wonder if the inherent goodness of the car will be more than offset by having to deal with the Kia Store in Louisville.

sda

And saw this rare beast. It had GTI seats, yes the TL in the background. Had to stretch its legs a bit.

28firefighter

@roadburner My $.02 is you’re a diehard BMW fan and most other cars won’t measure up over the long haul, for you. The Stinger is probably as close as you’d get to another love, but it may wear off faster than the long term ownership you’re used to.

snakeweasel

houdini1 said:

imidazol97 said:

suydam said:

dino001 said:

Small fact: "Spanish flu" was really an American flu (first registered case in Kansas). Seems like even then "blame others" mindset was just as strong.

True! It was because Spain was the only country reporting accurate numbers. They were neutral in WWI and had no reason to fudge their numbers, as did all the other countries who were afraid it would demoralize the troops (who were getting sick too). So lying about the numbers has an old history as well.

X2 Thanks. I was just going to post that from reading articles about the naming of various epi- and pan-demics.

I've been reading some articles in the small town newspapers from 1918 where I grew up that are linked through the county historical museum's site. The articles are stunning in the fear they must have caused and the sense of helplessness once infected.

I don't remember my parents ever having said anything about that flu going through the population--they would have been 18 and 20 years of age then.

You guys are confusing me. First it is wrong to call the corona virus by the name of the country where it originated, but it is perfectly acceptable, ever preferable, to call the "Spanish Flu", the "American Flu", because it originated in America? Just pointing out that this "Name Game" is sort of superfluous.

Same here, many times things like this are named for the area its associated with, why not this. Wasn't it originally called the Wuhan virus?

roadburner

jipster said:

Oldfarmer- Lowball? How much lower you think they'd go? Looking at almost $10,000 off. The Sonata is out though. They only discount $1,200 off a $27,000 Sonata. Then got most of that $1,000 back with dealer fees and.something called "Pulse" ( flashes that. center brake light). But, yeah, I'll try to get a.little.more meat off the bone.
.

COVID-19 or not, the Oxmoor Dealer group never changes; they pulled the "no test drive without a signed buyers order" scam when I was shopping for an MS3 in 2007. Did I mention that they had a used MS3 and wanted more for it than I paid for a new one at Kings Mazda in Cincy?
They also wouldn't allow test drives of the Supra when I looked at one last year. And at Oxmoor Hyundai where I was considering a Veloster N(until the excruciatingly low-rent interior put me off), they were hawking the "Pulse" ripoff. Just what I want, paying a tech who probably can't spell "Veloster"-or count to 20 without taking off his shoes-to hack into the factory wiring harness.

snakeweasel

dino001 said:

graphicguy said:

abacomike said:

28firefighter said:

Can we please stop calling this China virus?

I agree, FF! If this covid-19 virus had been labeled "China Virus" by the W.H.O. or by the CDC, that would be different. But it has not and has rather been labeled covid-19, thus coronavirus or covid-19 is its appropriate and biochemical name. Thanks for correcting that poster.

I don’t understand that. What purpose does that serve by mislabeling COVID-19. Now, what possible good does that do with China being one of the major powers on earth? I feel I’m watching press briefings are being done by pre-schoolers sometimes.

Purpose is simple - deflect, distract, shift blame.

How is it shifting blame? It originated in China and the Chinese government lied through their teeth about it and are likely still lying about it.

jipster

benjaminh said:

jipster said:

...Benjamin- We test drove the TLX with tech package, 4 cylinder. Yes, we were interested in the base. But, with $1,600 more in incentive money for the TLX with tech.package, may be worth spending a little bit more ($1,400) and get the car with tech pack.....

If you can stretch your budget to get the Tech level I think it might be worth it. Below is what it includes, and what I think (very subjectively) each the Tech level features are worth to me.

TLX Technology Package:
($600)Perforated Milano Premium Leather-Trimmed Interior
($600) Acura/ELS Studio®32 Premium Audio System with 10 Speakers including Subwoofer
($400) Acura Navigation System with 3D view10
($200) Color Multi-Information Display (MID) with Turn-by-Turn Guidance
($200) AcuraLink® Connected Services62
($100) HD Radio®4
($200) 8-in LED Backlit Center Information Display
($100) GPS-linked10 Climate Control
($400) Blind Spot Information System20
($400) Rear Cross Traffic Monitor76
($200) Rain-Sensing Windshield Wipers

So to me, again just imho, the Tech package is "worth" c. $3400. And so if you can actually get it for $1400 I'd say it's a bargain.

Built-in Navigation used to be a c.$1200 option for Honda and Acura, but the reason I only valued it at $400 is that it's really been surpassed by the maps on CarPlay/AndroidAuto. But a few times I've forgotten my phone, or for some reason AndroidAuto doesn't work, and then I'm glad I have the built-in navi.

When I got the car I thought the idea of rain sensing wipers was almost silly. I mean, can't we turn on our own windshield wipers? But I've gotten to like that feature. Sometimes you're driving on a corner with both hands on the wheel and it starts to rain or sprinkle. Rather than worry about it, the car just turns on your wipers for you at the appropriate slow, medium, or fast speed.

The blind spot monitor and cross traffic alert are important safety features. I like them and appreciate them a lot.

The ELS stereo is probably actually worth at least a thousand if not more to me, because I love it every time I drive, but realistically it maybe costs $600 more than the already good entry level Acura system, and so that's the price I tried to put on it.

On the other hand, the TLX will still be a lot better than the Sonata even at the base level.

Thanks. I really liked the premium leather with the tech package. If the base TLX seats are noticeably less in quality, would definitely go with the tech. The premium stereo would be nice. Everything else would be icing on the cake.

I suspect all the safety features will take time getting us to. The car was beeping and alerting me quite bit(Cross traffic monitor a couple of times, drifting out.of my lane) ....duties that use to belong to my wife (jk) ;-)

snakeweasel

jipster said:

After some research, a few concerns on the TLX.

1) Insurance - Insurance.going up with any new car, but is a cosideration. Will having a teenage driver in the household increase it even more?

2) Premium fuel- Honda recommends premium, so that's what I'd be using. How much more a year in fuel costs would I be looking at needs to be looked at.

3) Transmission - Looks like this cars transmission has had some problems. I read it was mostly with the 9 speed transmissions that come with the 6 cylinder. Someone had posted it cost them 8 grand for a new transmission.Yikes!

4) Maintenance and Repair- Parts and service expensive? To members in the "TLX Club", hows
reliability? As most of you know, reliability is at the top of the list for me.

Still want to check out and test drive the Mazda 6 and Camry. Manager friend at Kia says they have up to $4,000 in rebates on the Optima. If the Optima has that same course engine that's in that 2019 dsmo Sonata we.looked at, I'll pass.

I told the salesperson at Acura we' were going to test drive a couple of more cars and depending on how that goes we may want to come back and look at the base TLX in red.

To answer #4 look at #3, that would worry me.

imidazol97

jipster said:

Imidazol7- Yes, the salesperson followed me in their company car. A bit odd as I thought she might lose me in traffic...think I stole it, and call the cops. I did put the pedal to the metal a couple of times. She kept up. th
.

Wow.

imidazol97

jmonroe said:

I don’t understand that. What purpose does that serve by mislabeling COVID-19. Now, what possible good does that do with China being one of the major powers on earth? I feel I’m watching press briefings are being done by pre-schoolers sometimes.
I think the easiest way to answer this is that they know their audience.

jmonroe

I think it's better to avoid politics talk here.

oldfarmer50

jipster said:

Oldfarmer- Lowball? How much lower you think they'd go? Looking at almost $10,000 off. The Sonata is out though. They only discount $1,200 off a $27,000 Sonata. Then got most of that $1,000 back with dealer fees and.something called "Pulse" ( flashes that. center brake light). But, yeah, I'll try to get a.little.more meat off the bone.

Explorer- I'll post more when I can, but residual on the non tech package with $1,000 down and 12,000 miles is $17,197. The residential WITH the tech package, same down and mileage....is $18,108

Benjamin- We test drove the TLX with tech package, 4 cylinder. Yes, we were interested in the base. But, with $1,600 more in incentive money for the TLX with tech.package, may be worth spending a little bit more ($1,400) and get the car with tech pack.

Suydum - On me pulling the trigger. Yes....the suspense is.killing me. I hope it lasts. ;-)

Imidazol7- Yes, the salesperson followed me in their company car. A bit odd as I thought she might lose me in traffic...think I stole it, and call the cops. I did put the pedal to the metal a couple of times. She kept up. th

To me the 4 cylinder had very good torque and power. I imagine the 6 cylinder must be a blast.

Sorry, I must have misread what you said. I thought you said the Acura was $10k more than the Sonata so I was suggesting you offer them the Sonata price (-$10k). Seems like that’s just what happened.

Of course you’ll have to go a ways to beat GG’s $17k discount.

imidazol97

sda said:

And saw this rare beast. It had GTI seats, yes the TL in the background. Had to stretch its legs a bit.

Surprisingly good shape. Unless those straps in the bed are holding the sides up. LOL

I have seen few of those in this area that didn't have rust, but were still running.

benjaminh

jipster said:

....Thanks. I really liked the premium leather with the tech package. If the base TLX seats are noticeably less in quality, would definitely go with the tech. The premium stereo would be nice. Everything else would be icing on the cake.

I suspect all the safety features will take time getting us to. The car was beeping and alerting me quite bit(Cross traffic monitor a couple of times, drifting out.of my lane) ....duties that use to belong to my wife (jk) ;-)

Yeah, the Milano leather seats are good, and have a luxurious quality to them. It's better quality leather than is found in an Accord.

The standard seats on the base TLX are vinyl. They aren't called that, but that's what they are. But it's a deluxe vinyl, similar to what Mercedes and BMW use on their cars before you get the optional leather.

The advantage of vinyl is that it will last a very long time, much longer than leather. If you've ever seen pix of the seats of a 15-year old luxury car with leather, often it's a sad picture, while the vinyl in the same model of car will still look almost new at 15 years. With cleaning and moisturizing every couple of years, however, I do think leather can last for at least a dozen years, which is as long as I'm likely to own my TLX.

Since you're into the details, here's more detail that you can possibly imagine on the TLX—from Acura's tech heavy press release for the car....

https://acuranews.com/en-US/releases/release-4ab1e0fb10674d7791526ba08c42d93f-2018-acura-tlx-overview

Move your cursor to the left to see the separate entries for chassis, powertrain, interior, etc.

Here are several paragraphs on the engine, which by the way is almost certainly the last of the naturally aspirated engines from Acura. Acura is probably going all-turbo soon.

"The TLX's direct injected (DI) 2.4-liter DOHC i-VTEC® 4-cylinder engine features a host of intelligent technology. The engine's i-VTEC system combines VTC (Variable Timing Control), which continuously adjusts the intake camshaft phase, with Variable Valve Timing and Lift Electronic Control (VTEC), which changes valve lift, timing and duration of the intake valves. The direct injection (DI) system, dual-stage intake manifold and other technologies combine to produce 206 horsepower and 182 lb.-ft. of torque.

The TLX's 2.4-liter engine has a lightweight die-cast aluminum block with a single main-bearing cradle design that creates a rigid assembly to help minimize noise and vibration. Cast-in iron cylinder liners provide long-lasting durability. Each journal on the forged-steel crankshaft is micropolished to reduce internal friction. To improve smoothness throughout the rpm range and help lower noise levels, the engine is fitted with an internal balancer unit. Consisting of a pair of chain-driven counter-rotating shafts located in the lower block and integrated into the oil pan, the balancing system helps quell the inherent second-order harmonic vibrations that normally impact inline 4-cylinder engines.

To reduce piston-sliding friction, the cylinder bores are offset by 8.0 mm from the crankshaft. This gives the connecting rods a more favorable angle during each power stroke, which reduces side loading on the pistons and in turn, improves efficiency. The engine features a forged crankshaft for high rigidity and low friction. Lightweight pistons have a carefully optimized skirt design to minimize reciprocating weight, and reduced weight minimizes vibration and increases operating efficiency. The piston crowns are dished, to help maintain stable combustion and to optimize distribution of the stratified fuel charge from the direct injector in each cylinder. This close control over the combustion process boosts overall operating efficiency.

To maximize power output, the 2.4-liter engine has a dual-stage intake manifold has two different intake runner lengths that are selected based on the operating conditions. An actuator and a set of four butterfly valves control the intake runner switching process. At low engine speeds, the long runners are used to improve low-end torque. At higher engine speeds the system switches to the short intake runners for greater high rpm power. The result is intake tuning that is optimized for the engine's entire operating range....

To help boost fuel efficiency and power, the combustion chamber shape and valve angles have been optimized. The included valve angle is a narrow 35 degrees, which decreases the surface-to-volume ratio and helps create a flatter, more compact combustion chamber that reduces unburned hydrocarbon emissions. With this combustion chamber shape and the precise control of direct injection, the compression ratio set at 11.6:1...."

And it goes on and on even from there!

snakeweasel

benjaminh said:

jipster said:

After some research, a few concerns on the TLX.

1) Insurance
2) Premium fuel
3) Transmission
4) Maintenance and Repair

I was worried about insurance too, but it was only c. $100 more a year for me iirc compared to the Honda Accord I'd previously been driving. Maybe call your insurance agent for a quote.

Premium fuel will probably cost you about $300 more a year. The engine is designed to get its best power and mpg from premium fuel.

The 8-speed dual clutch transmission with unique torque converter has gotten mostly very good reviews. So far I've not heard about any problems with it (knock on wood). It's an in-house Acura transmission, designed and built for this car. I hope and think that they have "overbuilt" this transmission for long life. I did once see a TLX with over 100k miles for sale by a dealer and apparently everything was fine with the 8-speed DCT.

Acura, as you probably know, is the upscale brand of Honda, which is known as a good brand. Having owned 4 Honda Accords before the Acura, I can tell you that everything seems to be of higher quality, down to the battery, which is a bigger and higher grade than you get in an Accord. Should be reliable, but parts will be more expensive than for a Honda Accord, but less than for a BMW etc.

Why would a dual clutch transmission have a torque converter? Its basically a manual transmission with a computer controlled clutch (or clutches).

jipster

Thanks for the info and comments benjamin, stick and others.
Roadburner, not sure what was going on with Oxmoor. At first, Oxmoor Hyundai said I needed a signed buyers.order before test.drive. I balked, then they came back and said I could test.drive, which I did. Oxmoor Mazda.said no test drive, but Oxmoor Toyota said they were too busy, call back.and.schedule a test drive. The Hyundai salesman did say their.offer wasn't that "aggressive" , suggested they could do better if I was still in after.completing my other test drives.

imidazol97

abacomike said:

Just ordered 2 pkgs of face masks from Amazon - disposable - for when I go out shopping or getting gasoline (once a month lately) or going to the ATM for cash. I think it was $23.00 for 16 x 2 boxes. I already have disposable gloves.

It was suggested by my nephew who is slowly recovering from covid-19. His fever is low grade now instead of 102.5+. He said that with my health issues and my compromised immune system, it is essential.

Glad to see you're getting some masks.

I don't understand why videos from the other countries had everyone wearing masks and here we were told they don't do any good. Now they've decided maybe they do help. I've been wearing one after the first few weeks; earlier I went to grocery when the people count was low.

People can use disposable plastic bags from the grocery to handle the gas pumps when they fuel up.

benjaminh

snakeweasel said:

....Why would a dual clutch transmission have a torque converter? Its basically a manual transmission with a computer controlled clutch (or clutches).

DCT transmissions can be a little jerky in low speed stop-and-go situations. The torque converter smooths that out. It also aids acceleration. Here's what Car and Driver said back when the car was introduced for 2015:

https://www.caranddriver.com/reviews/a15108541/2015-acura-tlx-24l-test-review/

"The trans incorporates a torque converter to smooth out operation and to permit torque multiplication from a standstill, and it otherwise does all the things that make dual-clutches good dance partners. It holds gears to redline, matches revs on downshifts, and rewards tugs on the appropriate wheel-mounted paddle with near-instantaneous downshifts; in short, it does a damn good job of almost making you forget about the lack of a third pedal. Almost."

And here's what Acura says about it:

"The ultra-thin torque converter complements the efficient operation of the DCT by providing exceptionally smooth operation in stop-and-go situations, plus it offers off-the-line torque multiplication for improved initial acceleration that a DCT alone can't equal. In an aggressive standing-start launch, the torque converter substantially improves acceleration in the first 1.4 seconds, or about the first 60 feet (compared to a DCT alone)."

driver100

jipster said:

. The Hyundai salesman did say their.offer wasn't that "aggressive" , suggested they could do better if I was still in after.completing my other test drives.

Tell them you can do better checking online.

driver100

imidazol97 said:

abacomike said:

Just ordered 2 pkgs of face masks from Amazon - disposable - for when I go out shopping or getting gasoline (once a month lately) or going to the ATM for cash. I think it was $23.00 for 16 x 2 boxes. I already have disposable gloves.

It was suggested by my nephew who is slowly recovering from covid-19. His fever is low grade now instead of 102.5+. He said that with my health issues and my compromised immune system, it is essential.

Glad to see you're getting some masks.

I don't understand why videos from the other countries had everyone wearing masks and here we were told they don't do any good. Now they've decided maybe they do help. I've been wearing one after the first few weeks; earlier I went to grocery when the people count was low.

People can use disposable plastic bags from the grocery to handle the gas pumps when they fuel up.

A few possible reasons;
At first they thought there wouldn't be enough masks for medical staff...so didn't want the public trying to buy them up and horde them.
Some medical people think masks could be misused and cause more of a problem. If you get COVID on your hand (which can happen easily), you could get it on your face when you go to remove your mask. That is less likely to happen, if you get it on your hand, and wash your hands...before accidentally touching your face.
New thinking is it is probably best to use a mask....if, you use it properly, and medical people have them.

qbrozen

sda said:

And saw this rare beast. It had GTI seats, yes the TL in the background. Had to stretch its legs a bit.

stretched tires are asinine.

fintail

Our response has been shamefully inconsistent from the beginning, at both the state and federal level. Heck, the first couple can't even agree on wearing masks, and states are doing things 12 different ways because "muh rites!" or something, which guarantees people will be just as inconsistent.

Guess I'll need to find masks now, of course there's no plan for people to acquire these. Maybe I'll wear my hockey helmet with shield as well to keep my eyes and hair protected, and to give kids a laugh.

If anything, maybe this will spur some decomposable disposable bag tech, looks like plastic bags aren't all evil after all.

imidazol97 said:

Glad to see you're getting some masks.

I don't understand why videos from the other countries had everyone wearing masks and here we were told they don't do any good. Now they've decided maybe they do help. I've been wearing one after the first few weeks; earlier I went to grocery when the people count was low.

People can use disposable plastic bags from the grocery to handle the gas pumps when they fuel up.

fintail

The real story behind this panic:

benjaminh

The 2-minute trailer for the 2011 movie Contagion. I like what Lawrence Fishburne says at c. 1:10 when a paranoid national security guy asks if there's a way to weaponize the bird flu. LF says, "Someone doesn't have to weaponize the bird flu. The birds are doing that."

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zAhz0AORXPc

dino001

snakeweasel said:

How is it shifting blame? It originated in China and the Chinese government lied through their teeth about it and are likely still lying about it.

They probably did and are, but the data was coming from other sources and plenty of experts were warning the steamroll was coming, yet many elected officials chose to act like it would not be a problem and it will miraculously disappear in two weeks. Kind of like this guy.

https://youtu.be/l4UFQWKjy_I

jmonroe

imidazol97 said:

jmonroe said:

I don’t understand that. What purpose does that serve by mislabeling COVID-19. Now, what possible good does that do with China being one of the major powers on earth? I feel I’m watching press briefings are being done by pre-schoolers sometimes.
I think the easiest way to answer this is that they know their audience.

jmonroe

I think it's better to avoid politics talk here.

I have no idea how you construed my answer as being political.

jmonroe

ab348

The problem is that you are damned if you do and damned if you don't. Canada left most measures to the provinces and all of them did variations on the same theme within a short period of time - closing schools, closing non-essential businesses, closing public areas and parks, enacting lockdowns. The police now have powers to ticket/arrest those who do not practice social distancing or stay away from parks and beaches which have been deemed off limits. Our Premier has told everyone to stay home for the last few weeks and yesterday delivered a diatribe about those who are outside. This after not too long ago telling people to go for walks. They have indicated this will be a number of weeks more under those same circumstances and people here are already starting to get a bit squirrelly. We still have cases. A lot from people returning from abroad, some from people working in care facilities where distancing is difficult. We don't have overwhelming numbers of cases here and nobody has died from it here so far (Quebec and Ontario are less lucky) but the economy is wrecked or soon will be and govt deficits this year are going to be off the charts.

There is no vaccine, there is no cure other than time and the human immune system, although some drugs devised for other conditions may help some. The current testing is unpleasant and time-consuming so it is being used only where there is some reason to think a person has been exposed. Universal testing may be coming with newer, easier methods but how would that work? Get tested today, get exposed next week, then what? It is surely not a panacea and you cannot test constantly. The models the Public Health types have come up with are very scary but they are based on a set of assumptions that may or may not be true. Knowing Public Health as I do they are probably variations on worst-case scenarios. One interesting one I read about said that doing what we are doing will lead to a lot fewer deaths but will do more social and economic harm because we could need to do this for the next 18 months. It was contrasted with a less intrusive model that had far more deaths in a short period of time but which according to them meant that the whole crisis played out in just a few months, after which things quickly went back to normal. I don't understand how that works but that is what was reported. I don't think anyone has the answer. I found this Korean doctor useful to listen to (note his comments on masks). The intro is in English but the rest is subtitled.

https://youtu.be/gAk7aX5hksU

andres3

qbrozen said:

So here is an interesting story. A friend of ours and his wife were sick for a week. They tried to get tested and were denied three times. They finally managed to get tested at a drive through and the husband was so bad at that point they took him then and there by ambulance to the hospital where they kept him for 12 days.

How many people are in this situation? I know we talked about those who have it and aren’t severe enough to get tested, but there are those who are quite ill and being turned away. That blows my mind. He got lucky, but my wife knows a few others who have also been denied testing and they are attempting to recover at home. Her sister, a single mom with a 5-yr-old daughter, is sick right now and no clue if it is covid or something else. On one hand, I’m completely freaked out that she could die with nobody there to help but a helpless child. On the other hand, no way we can risk going there ourselves. Its crazy.

For people with health insurance, I think it's time for pitch forks and torches to the people in charge at those insurance companies that fail to provide adequate health care. Corona virus would be too kind to them.

Full Disclosure: I'm sure the reason I haven't seen a dollar or a decision from USAA on my claim from mid-December is that COVID-19 is slowing them down ..................NOT!

P.S. Anyone craving Corona Beer?

andres3

jipster said:

Oldfarmer- Lowball? How much lower you think they'd go? Looking at almost $10,000 off. The Sonata is out though. They only discount $1,200 off a $27,000 Sonata. Then got most of that $1,000 back with dealer fees and.something called "Pulse" ( flashes that. center brake light). But, yeah, I'll try to get a.little.more meat off the bone.

Explorer- I'll post more when I can, but residual on the non tech package with $1,000 down and 12,000 miles is $17,197. The residential WITH the tech package, same down and mileage....is $18,108

Benjamin- We test drove the TLX with tech package, 4 cylinder. Yes, we were interested in the base. But, with $1,600 more in incentive money for the TLX with tech.package, may be worth spending a little bit more ($1,400) and get the car with tech pack.

Suydum - On me pulling the trigger. Yes....the suspense is.killing me. I hope it lasts. ;-)

Imidazol7- Yes, the salesperson followed me in their company car. A bit odd as I thought she might lose me in traffic...think I stole it, and call the cops. I did put the pedal to the metal a couple of times. She kept up. th

To me the 4 cylinder had very good torque and power. I imagine the 6 cylinder must be a blast.

You never know if the lowball offer is truly lowball until you either get:

A. Shunned
B. Ignored
C. Rejected
D. Kicked out of the dealership with your tail tucked between your legs.

benjaminh

More on the Acura 8-speed DCT in the TLX from Gears Magazine....

https://gearsmagazine.com/magazine/acura-dct-8-speed-transaxle/

"....Common complaints regarding the traditional DCT involve the quality of low-speed engagements, harshness, and shudder. Honda addresses these issues with a design modification that provides the smoothness of a traditional automatic with the efficiency of a DCT.

The Acura DCT8 uses a conventional torque converter with a torque converter clutch. The dual clutches sit at the end of the mainshaft and the secondary shaft (figure 3). Both the mainshaft and secondary shaft consist of an inner and outer shaft assembly. When applied, the clutches lock the inner and outer shaft assemblies together.

The DCT8 attempts to improve upon the traditional DCT design by using a torque converter to provide smoother operation during vehicle launch and low speeds, but then apply the torque converter clutch once the vehicle reaches the proper speed....

The DCT8 internals look like a smashup of a manual and an automatic transmission (figure 7). There are four shift rails with permanent magnets attached. The magnets act on Hall Effect sensors to inform the control module of shift rail position...."

There's much more, but honestly I don't understand most of it. But there are some nice pix.

andres3

benjaminh said:

jipster said:

After some research, a few concerns on the TLX.

1) Insurance
2) Premium fuel
3) Transmission
4) Maintenance and Repair

I was worried about insurance too, but it was only c. $100 more a year for me iirc compared to the Honda Accord I'd previously been driving. Maybe call your insurance agent for a quote.

Premium fuel will probably cost you about $300 more a year. The engine is designed to get its best power and mpg from premium fuel.

The 8-speed dual clutch transmission with unique torque converter has gotten mostly very good reviews. So far I've not heard about any problems with it (knock on wood). It's an in-house Acura transmission, designed and built for this car. I hope and think that they have "overbuilt" this transmission for long life. I did once see a TLX with over 100k miles for sale by a dealer and apparently everything was fine with the 8-speed DCT.

Acura, as you probably know, is the upscale brand of Honda, which is known as a good brand. Having owned 4 Honda Accords before the Acura, I can tell you that everything seems to be of higher quality, down to the battery, which is a bigger and higher grade than you get in an Accord. Should be reliable, but parts will be more expensive than for a Honda Accord, but less than for a BMW etc.

I think Acura has a super long powertrain warranty, so you wouldn't have to worry for a very long time.
Insurance and premium fuel are negligible when your talking about a car over $30K?

andres3

benjaminh said:

More on the Acura 8-speed DCT in the TLX from Gears Magazine....

https://gearsmagazine.com/magazine/acura-dct-8-speed-transaxle/

"....Common complaints regarding the traditional DCT involve the quality of low-speed engagements, harshness, and shudder. Honda addresses these issues with a design modification that provides the smoothness of a traditional automatic with the efficiency of a DCT.

The Acura DCT8 uses a conventional torque converter with a torque converter clutch. The dual clutches sit at the end of the mainshaft and the secondary shaft (figure 3). Both the mainshaft and secondary shaft consist of an inner and outer shaft assembly. When applied, the clutches lock the inner and outer shaft assemblies together.

The DCT8 attempts to improve upon the traditional DCT design by using a torque converter to provide smoother operation during vehicle launch and low speeds, but then apply the torque converter clutch once the vehicle reaches the proper speed....

The DCT8 internals look like a smashup of a manual and an automatic transmission (figure 7). There are four shift rails with permanent magnets attached. The magnets act on Hall Effect sensors to inform the control module of shift rail position...."

There's much more, but honestly I don't understand most of it. But there are some nice pix.

I find it hard to believe this tranmission is built "bulletproof" since they are afraid to use it with their stronger motor/engine.

I also think a torque converter would be harmful to acceleration and economy, but improve smoothness. There's almost always a trade-off. The manufacturers tend to talk about the pros, without mentioning the cons.

benjaminh

Yeah, to me the costs seems small for the added driving enjoyment over a Sonata. Acura's standard warranty is 4 years and 50,000 miles bumper to bumper, and 6 years and 70,000 on the engine and transmission. That's pretty good, but it seems like sometimes @jipster keeps his cars till they break. My guess is that a new TLX with good care has c. 15 years/200k of good life in it before it dies, but that's obviously just a guess.

andres3

Carvana seems to be terrible at listing the proper trim level on Alltracks. They can't figure out the difference between S, SE, and SEL. I see a lot of mislabeling and inaccuracy.

stickguy

Carvana to me was really hard in general to figure out what options are on a car. Not an issue on an Acura or Honda, but on a BMW or Volvo where there were many options, the listing often left something to the imagination. they started including some sort of faux window sticker replica. which certainly helped if accurate.

roadburner

stickguy said:

Carvana to me was really hard in general to figure out what options are on a car. Not an issue on an Acura or Honda, but on a BMW or Volvo where there were many options, the listing often left something to the imagination. they started including some sort of faux window sticker replica. which certainly helped if accurate.

https://www.mdecoder.com/

stickguy

more painting today. got the master bath all prepped up and the ceiling painted. Tomorrow morning will paint the walls 1st coat, and finish it up in the afternoon. Man I hate painting bathrooms and kitchens. Too much fixed stuff to work around. But it is going to look a whole lot better without some peeling areas and general tiredness after 9 years. once I clear out the girls will go redecorate (they already bought stuff weeks ago, so will be pulling out the tools again to start drilling holes!)

oldfarmer50

roadburner said:

stickguy said:

Carvana to me was really hard in general to figure out what options are on a car. Not an issue on an Acura or Honda, but on a BMW or Volvo where there were many options, the listing often left something to the imagination. they started including some sort of faux window sticker replica. which certainly helped if accurate.

https://www.mdecoder.com/

That’s handy. Do other brands have something similar?

It’s interesting that the ad that comes with that site shows two wallets. One looks fat and full while the other looks skinny and empty. Are those before and after pics when buying a BMW?

jipster

andres3 said:

jipster said:

Oldfarmer- Lowball? How much lower you think they'd go? Looking at almost $10,000 off. The Sonata is out though. They only discount $1,200 off a $27,000 Sonata. Then got most of that $1,000 back with dealer fees and.something called "Pulse" ( flashes that. center brake light). But, yeah, I'll try to get a.little.more meat off the bone.

Explorer- I'll post more when I can, but residual on the non tech package with $1,000 down and 12,000 miles is $17,197. The residential WITH the tech package, same down and mileage....is $18,108

Benjamin- We test drove the TLX with tech package, 4 cylinder. Yes, we were interested in the base. But, with $1,600 more in incentive money for the TLX with tech.package, may be worth spending a little bit more ($1,400) and get the car with tech pack.

Suydum - On me pulling the trigger. Yes....the suspense is.killing me. I hope it lasts. ;-)

Imidazol7- Yes, the salesperson followed me in their company car. A bit odd as I thought she might lose me in traffic...think I stole it, and call the cops. I did put the pedal to the metal a couple of times. She kept up. th

To me the 4 cylinder had very good torque and power. I imagine the 6 cylinder must be a blast.

You never know if the lowball offer is truly lowball until you either get:

A. Shunned
B. Ignored
C. Rejected
D. Kicked out of the dealership with your tail tucked between your legs.

A- thru D wouldn't bother me a bit....well, maybe shunned.

My suspect Mercury Mariner has running well the past 4 days. So, I'm in no hurry to buy. But, I've walked plenty of times before. Sometimes the salesman will come after me, sometimes he dont.

Chronic car lease buyers feel free to offer any advice. I leased a Honda Civic in 2012. $3,000 down (Got $2,000 for my trade in) and $79 a month for 3 years/12k miles a year. Had planned to buy it out when lease wss up, but just didn't like the car that much.

jipster

benjaminh said:

Yeah, to me the costs seems small for the added driving enjoyment over a Sonata. Acura's standard warranty is 4 years and 50,000 miles bumper to bumper, and 6 years and 70,000 on the engine and transmission. That's pretty good, but it seems like sometimes @jipster keeps his cars till they break. My guess is that a new TLX with good care has c. 15 years/200k of good life in it before it dies, but that's obviously just a guess.

Yeah, I usually drive my cars until they fall into that gray area between a junker and a clunker. Worth around 1 or 2 grand....oldfarmer territory? LoL.

stickguy

don't put any money down is my advise. just pay inception fees. Unless the money factor is so low that there is basically no interest (or if it means they will be taxed, not sure how your state works that). But in any case, don't pay more than DMV fees and first month payment at drive-off.

also, do the math (I believe it is impossible to buy a car without doing a spreadsheet!) if you really intend to buy at the end. It does not always work out cheaper once you factor in all the lease fees, extra DMV and dealer fees to buy it out, etc. It can just be cheaper depending on interest rate, MF, residual, etc. If they have a bunch of lease cash good chance there is enough trunk money to make the purchase price tasty too.

the real benefit to leasing first when you really mean to buy, is in case it turns out after 3 years you would really rather just give it back!

28firefighter

The nice thing with Acura is that if you decide to lease to take advantage of the lease cash, then you can immediately buy the lease out and they won’t charge you the interest on the lease payments (I believe) which is crazy high.

So let’s say that MSRP is $37,725. You get a $2500 discount (very fair) and are eligible for the $8700 in lease cash and $750 conquest. That puts you at a sale price of $25,775. Figure $1500 in fees (bank fee, doc fee, plates) for a net cap cost of $27,275. Not knowing your tax rate, on a lease that would come out to $353 plus tax with 0 due at signing (literally sign and drive) for 35 more payments, 10k miles per year - 36 month lease.

The money factor on this lease is .00215 which is an equivalent of 5.16% interest. The residual at lease end is 49% (18,485.25). You could choose to sign the lease and after it funds, immediately buy it out and not have to pay the 5.16% interest - you’d pay $18,485 + ($251 pretax x 35 remaining payments) = $27,270 + sales tax. $251 is your lease payment without the interest component and without tax, which would be how they calculate your buyout.

You could then finance the buyout at 2.39% for 60 months through PenFed and voila you bought the car for 28% off.

benjaminh

jipster said:

....Chronic car lease buyers feel free to offer any advice. I leased a Honda Civic in 2012. $3,000 down (Got $2,000 for my trade in) and $79 a month for 3 years/12k miles a year. Had planned to buy it out when lease wss up, but just didn't like the car that much.

Iirc Acura maybe needs some kind of minimum down payment to get their lease incentive deal. 1000? I'm not sure.

Michaell

Ohio taxes the sum of the lease payments up front. You can pay them as part of the inception costs or add them into the monthly payment. If you buy it out early, you'll pay tax on the buyout value.

jipster

The 3 options the saleslady provided was a down payment of $1000, $2,000 or $3,000. She sent me some numbers via email, but I can't get them to post here. I'll see if she can send via text. She's also suppose to send me numbers on buying outright.

I feel I'm a bit out of my element with the lease terminology. With that Civic I leased, I had a good discount off the price, dealership gave me as much as I could have gotten private party on my trade in. Only $79 a month. Total payout was around $6,400.

Here's a video of the non tech package TLX I'm looking at. Don't know if I like that red. Looks to be the same red as what was on the Sonata,, Mazda, and the Toyota.

https://click.drivecentric.com/?c=1435B0D1-10F3-4E15-BDA4-BADF84F5A1D4&stre=457401ce-ed7a-4b4b-af9e-8fce4e088617&r=3868050&i=Video&u=InternalLink&l=1882&v=e731538f-baf4-403f-9564-40535d32846f#videoimage

Michaell

jipster said:

The 3 options the saleslady provided was a down payment of $1000, $2,000 or $3,000. She sent me some numbers via email, but I can't get them to post here. I'll see if she can send via text. She's also suppose to send me numbers on buying outright.

I feel I'm a bit out of my element with the lease terminology. With that Civic I leased, I had a good discount off the price, dealership gave me as much as I could have gotten private party on my trade in. Only $79 a month. Total payout was around $6,400.

Here's a video of the non tech package TLX I'm looking at. Don't know if I like that red. Looks to be the same red as what was on the Sonata,, Mazda, and the Toyota.

https://click.drivecentric.com/?c=1435B0D1-10F3-4E15-BDA4-BADF84F5A1D4&stre=457401ce-ed7a-4b4b-af9e-8fce4e088617&r=3868050&i=Video&u=InternalLink&l=1882&v=e731538f-baf4-403f-9564-40535d32846f#videoimage

Leasing is just an alternative to financing. If you can get the numbers, I'll plug them into my lease calculator so we can confirm our payment calculations match the dealer.

jipster

Let's look at the TLX with tech package I received from Acura:

$1,000 down
36 month/12,000 miles
Comes out to $420 a month
Residual is $18,108
Rebate for Healthcare professional: $750

Market Value $37,725
Discount $9,995
Selling Price $27,730
Total monthly payment $420

First Payment $420
Fees $0
Down Payment $1,253.80
Tax on down payment $0
Lease fees $0
Upfront sales tax $0
Balance due $1,000

All under "Essential Terms of 3rd Party Lease Agreement" .

Not sure why down payment starts out as $1,000, then turns into $1,253.80...then back down again to $1,000