Edmunds Members - Cars and Conversations (Archived)

Mr_Shiftright

highway 395 in California at Junction of Rte 120 to Yosemite:

PUG = $4.99/gal.

Ouch.

imidazol97 said:

stickguy said:

filled up at Exxon today. Down to $2.099

odd thing, mid and PUG never change. PUG is $2.87, and Mid is $2.77. that is one heck of a gap.

other stations local are much smaller spreads.'

oh, the Exxon also has gone to a 12 cent upcharge for credit (2.21 vs. 2.09). Good thing I use my Exxon card. Get the cash price!

I suspect down in VA I might see a station that dropped below $2/gal finally.

Considering that MUG is bout. 1/3 to 40 percent PUG, some paying 2.77 for MUG is really getting taken. 

abacomike

Speaking of "gas", I'm running on empty!  Painter finally left and I was able to put my bedroom back in order.  I tried to rehang a very large picture and I threw my back out.  Luckily the cleaning ladies are coming again tomorrow at 11:30 AM for 3 hours.  They will put the stuff back into the large walk-in closet in the master bedroom and hang my clothes in the other large closet.  Then they will help me hang that picture.  They also have to scrub the shelves in the pantry before putting the foodstuffs back along with the cleaning supplies and laundry detergent.

Then they have to clean the terrace, re-vacuum the carpeting, wash the tiles floors and put this place back together.  They also change the sheets and pillowcases in both bedrooms.

I sure hope my back is OK.  I'd hate to end up back in the hospital while I'm still taking these anti-viral Hep C tablets.

I vow to never again put down carpeting or paint this apartment.  Too much for me and my back.

imidazol97

abacomike said:

Speaking of "gas", I'm running on empty!.

Sounds like you need a tankful of Exxon PUG to get your motor going!

nyccarguy

@jpp5862 - me, you, @qbrozen, @fintail & I think @tyguy are around the same age.  @28firefighter is a few years younger.

driver100

Wasn't it not too long ago that the "experts" were predicting oil would be $200 a barrel?

abacomike

driver100 said:

Wasn't it not too long ago that the "experts" were predicting oil would be $200 a barrel?

Driver, one of these days it will be that and perhaps even more than $200 a barrel.  Oil supplies are not unlimited, driver.  And when supply dries up let's pray our grandchildren will never have to rely on oil for energy to power their vehicles.

dino001

It's true, but were "running out" of oil at least five times last century, every twenty years, or so, first time in twenties.

Mr_Shiftright

Well, given that no new oil is being produced by the earth itself, we have to be 'running out of oil' all the time

right now, the supply and demand equation is favoring the consumer, but as soon as demand goes it, which it must, so will the price.

It's related to "techo-lock". New technologies are not developed rapidly because all the infrastructure favors the old.

Same with cars--we've been in ICE technolock for 100 years.

dino001

Actually last twenty years was increadible explosion of new technologies in exploration, production, from hydraulic fracturing, to charting, to horizontal drilling. Oil production is getting cheaper every day, more efficient, faster. Old "exhausted" basins get second life, drills have much higher success ratio. Oil itself may be old, but technology of exploration and extraction is evolving really rapidly.

fezo

stever said:

fezo said:

Steve - you have me beat by a year. My last new car was in 1999.

Well, I got the '99 Quest on the last day of the year in 1998, so I may only have you beat by a day.

You're still ahead of me in the Miata department.

You've still got the year. I bought that 00 Accord in December of 99.

oldfarmer50

explorerx4 said:

@oldfarmer, I didn't know the Mustang was octane aware, but it is.

If by that you mean that the computer will adjust the timing to run on regular, yes. I've heard you lose about 1% in power. Most cars have been like that for years. I know my 2008 which recommended premium would run fine on regular.

driver100

abacomike said:

driver100 said:

Wasn't it not too long ago that the "experts" were predicting oil would be $200 a barrel?

Driver, one of these days it will be that and perhaps even more than $200 a barrel.  Oil supplies are not unlimited, driver.  And when supply dries up let's pray our grandchildren will never have to rely on oil for energy to power their vehicles.</</p>

blockquote>

Mike, cars get 2 or 3X mileage they used to, 2,3 or 4X as long between oil changes, hybrids, electric, new ways to find oil, there will be oil for quite awhile and the grandchildren will find new ways to power cars. I try not to worry about stuff that probably will never happen.

Besides, young people don't seem interested in buying cars. Young people don't have stable jobs that allow them to commit to car payments. They like to live in the city and take public transportation, or ride a bike. I was listening to a radio show and many young people who were in their late 20s didn't have a license....I got my license about a day after I turned 16 and so did most of my friends.

bwia

Speaking of alternative energy sources and stretching fuel reserves...

"Britain aims to tackle electric car range anxiety with wireless charging technology... The UK is committing £500 million (or roughly $780 million) over the next five years to study this technology. The trials, which are expected to begin later this year, are expected to last 18 months.

The trial follows an earlier Highways England feasibility study that looks at how wireless charging technology might be installed in Britain’s major roadways. It will also look at how motorists can pay for the electricity they receive to charge their vehicle.

Highways England calls the trials “the first of their kind.” But Fortune points out the idea for the technology dates back to the late 1800s when Nikola Tesla designed a similar system to charge streetcars remotely. Fortune also points out the technology has been employed in South Korea since 2013."
http://www.boston.com/cars/news-and-reviews/2015/08/18/britain-aims-tackle-electric-car-range-anxiety-with-wireless-charging-tech/q6qAutcNWsbH60HzBPxGFK/story.html

graphicguy

Mr_Shiftright said:

Well, given that no new oil is being produced by the earth itself, we have to be 'running out of oil' all the time

right now, the supply and demand equation is favoring the consumer, but as soon as demand goes it, which it must, so will the price.

It's related to "techo-lock". New technologies are not developed rapidly because all the infrastructure favors the old.

Same with cars--we've been in ICE technolock for 100 years.

All that is true. However, we keep discovering and producing new oil all the time.

Said it before, until the U.S. governing bodies quit being driven by big oil, getting traction in the alternative fuels arena is going to be a tough slog. Can the states make it any more difficult for Tesla to do business?

Offer inventives to states to drop their antiquated car dealer network...tie those incentives to Federal mony for road repair and building.

Offer any new companies a hand in building out electric infrastructure, since the big oil companies won't do it. Oil companies can't see the forest for the trees and refuse to put any meaningful effort into supporting the ever increasing electric car drivers. Put outlets in hotels/motels do chraging over night alleviates some of the range anxiety for electrics. Equip interstate rest stops with electric outlets. Put'em in malls so the electric driver can "top off" their electric vehicles.

Then there's this.....
http://www.gizmag.com/audi-e-benzin-synthetic-fuel/37672/

Give Audi a generous research grant to continue this research. In return, U.S. gets first dibs.

Big oil companies are not good corporate citizens....haven't been in quite some time. You can see it in the current price manipulation that's happening. They are, at best, slipshod in shipping their product (oil spills).

They can either get with the program outlined above? Or, find their business is being passed by at a breakneck speed by insisting in "business as usual".

driver100

bwia said:

Speaking of alternative energy sources and stretching fuel reserves...

"Britain aims to tackle electric car range anxiety with wireless charging technology... The UK is committing £500 million (or roughly $780 million) over the next five years to study this technology. The trials, which are expected to begin later this year, are expected to last 18 months.

The trial follows an earlier Highways England feasibility study that looks at how wireless charging technology might be installed in Britain’s major roadways. It will also look at how motorists can pay for the electricity they receive to charge their vehicle.

Highways England calls the trials “the first of their kind.” But Fortune points out the idea for the technology dates back to the late 1800s when Nikola Tesla designed a similar system to charge streetcars remotely. Fortune also points out the technology has been employed in South Korea since 2013."
http://www.boston.com/cars/news-and-reviews/2015/08/18/britain-aims-tackle-electric-car-range-anxiety-with-wireless-charging-tech/q6qAutcNWsbH60HzBPxGFK/story.html

Our good neighbors bought one of these:


The article says it gets 124 mpg! If that's not saving oil I don't know what will.
They love their i3, but it is a 2nd car and it is only used to go a short distance to work and back.
A big problem I have is it is hard to know when it is coming along...no engine noise, just sound of tires.

abacomike

@robr2:

You are correct, robr.  I have used less kwh's in the past two months since dad went to the hospital and then passed.  I spent as much time in the hospital and hospice as I did at home.  That's why my bill is low.  Also the new fridge uses 1/3 the energy as the old 25 yr. old fridge did which is why my bill is so much lower.  Additionally, I am alone in the house where several months ago there were two of us.

I could be very happy with $45-$50 electric bills each month.  Let's see what next month's bill is.  We are in the hottest two months of the year right now.

houdini1

dino001 said:

It's true, but were "running out" of oil at least five times last century, every twenty years, or so, first time in twenties.

I think all the oil will be gone in a few thousand years. By then we'll have the Star Trek beam me up thing.

nyccarguy

You guys all seem to be much more efficient than me. I used 1,812 kWh last month. My bill was $310.50.

abacomike

nyccarguy said:

You guys all seem to be much more efficient than me. I used 1,812 kWh last month. My bill was $310.50.

Bradd, you have a house, wife, kids, etc., all using electricity.  Additionally, I an serviced by Florida Power and Light (FPL) which is one of the lowest cost providers in the country.  I set my thermostat at 78 degrees.  I am on the second floor of a 4-story building with condo units on both sides of me.  So I am well-insulated from the heat.  I close my shades to keep sun and heat out of my apartment.

Mr_Shiftright

Ah, I don't think I explained myself well.

By "techno-locked" I don't mean that progress in the old technology isn't being made--I mean that no new technology to *replace* the old is developed because all the resources and capital go toward the old.

Techno-Lock can be an artful trap in this way.

graphicguy said:

Mr_Shiftright said:

Well, given that no new oil is being produced by the earth itself, we have to be 'running out of oil' all the time

right now, the supply and demand equation is favoring the consumer, but as soon as demand goes it, which it must, so will the price.

It's related to "techo-lock". New technologies are not developed rapidly because all the infrastructure favors the old.

Same with cars--we've been in ICE technolock for 100 years.

All that is true. However, we keep discovering and producing new oil all the time.

Said it before, until the U.S. governing bodies quit being driven by big oil, getting traction in the alternative fuels arena is going to be a tough slog. Can the states make it any more difficult for Tesla to do business?

Offer inventives to states to drop their antiquated car dealer network...tie those incentives to Federal mony for road repair and building.

Offer any new companies a hand in building out electric infrastructure, since the big oil companies won't do it. Oil companies can't see the forest for the trees and refuse to put any meaningful effort into supporting the ever increasing electric car drivers. Put outlets in hotels/motels do chraging over night alleviates some of the range anxiety for electrics. Equip interstate rest stops with electric outlets. Put'em in malls so the electric driver can "top off" their electric vehicles.

Then there's this.....
http://www.gizmag.com/audi-e-benzin-synthetic-fuel/37672/

Give Audi a generous research grant to continue this research. In return, U.S. gets first dibs.

Big oil companies are not good corporate citizens....haven't been in quite some time. You can see it in the current price manipulation that's happening. They are, at best, slipshod in shipping their product (oil spills).

They can either get with the program outlined above? Or, find their business is being passed by at a breakneck speed by insisting in "business as usual".

roadburner

nyccarguy said:

You guys all seem to be much more efficient than me. I used 1,812 kWh last month. My bill was $310.50.

We used 1,489 kWh for July; the bill was $135.20

stever

We have higher "summer" rates so the 1407 kWh used last month cost $206. Average off-season usage runs around 600 kWh. Still playing with solar numbers and the payback is still ~11 years. Lots of uncertainty here with proposed gird charges for those trying to save by going solar.

CX-3s have arrived - may try to test one early next week.

driver100

stever said:

We have higher "summer" rates so the 1407 kWh used last month cost $206. Average off-season usage runs around 600 kWh. Still playing with solar numbers and the payback is still ~11 years. Lots of uncertainty here with proposed gird charges for those trying to save by going solar.

CX-3s have arrived - may try to test one early next week.

I'd be curious to hear your impressions of the CX-3. I have only heard great things about Mazdas since talking to a few people who have bought them recently - and any reviews I have read seem to be pretty positive.

robr2

I used 1138 last month and it was $222. The generation portion of my bill dropped by about 35% last month as the summer rates went into affect. Most of the electricity in MA is generated by natural gas.

driver100

driver100 said:

stever said:

We have higher "summer" rates so the 1407 kWh used last month cost $206. Average off-season usage runs around 600 kWh. Still playing with solar numbers and the payback is still ~11 years. Lots of uncertainty here with proposed gird charges for those trying to save by going solar.

Our electricity bill for Florida during the summer when we aren't there is about $30 a month. That's for a/c set at 84, a fridge going, and a trickle charger, and a few lights.

explorerx4

The most electricity I've used in a month was over 1500. Last summer I sued 1200 a couple of times. Since then, we have replaced the HVAC and the appliances, except for the garage fridge. Since then, I haven't gone over 850.

stever

I'm really curious about the CX-3 too @driver100 - it sounds "small" but my knees will be the real test.

All that's showing up here on the online inventory are a couple of AWD ones. And who knows if the online inventory is up to date, but there's some in ABQ too, so that's a good sign.

[Deleted User]

Our good neighbors bought one of these: The article says it gets 124 mpg! If that's not saving oil I don't know what will. They love their i3, but it is a 2nd car and it is only used to go a short distance to work and back. A big problem I have is it is hard to know when it is coming along...no engine noise

The 2016 Chevy Volt adds an artificial noise at slower speeds to help with the stealth car issue.  I'm all for electric cars and have a hard time picturing myself using any gasoline in 15 years.  I do wish the manufacturers would realize it's okay for an electric car to look normal.  The i3 is a case in point.  Is BMW trying to scare customers away?

I think vehicles like the 2016 Volt will be a good bridge to full electric.  50 miles of electric range with a gas motor that averages 42 mpg after the battery is exhausted.  That much electric range would meet my needs most days of the month and there is no range anxiety.

BTW, Edmunds is awful on a mobile device.  It's literally the worst of any website I've come across.

dino001

Ah, I don't think I explained myself well.

By "techno-locked" I don't mean that progress in the old technology isn't being made--I mean that no new technology to *replace* the old is developed because all the resources and capital go toward the old.

Techno-Lock can be an artful trap in this way.

I think plenty of resources are going to the now tech. Lack of or insufficient progress is not an automatic proof of some kind of conspiracy, or even lack of interest. It may just be that the new technology is not ready. It is easy to declare some tech superior based on one or two metrics, the winning technology has to be aceeptable in all aspects. Internal combustion engines run on gasoline or diesel may not be most efficient, or cleanest, but so far it beats others due to combination of all aspects. Other alternatives may be coming closer every day, but it's not that it stands still.

abacomike

Just a brief update on using Windows 10 on my 6 year old PC. I was using Windows 7 Home Premium 64 bit which came with the computer when I purchased it. It has the original I7 Processor with 12 Gigs of RAM and a speed of 3.44 mhz. We discussed that the increased speed with Windows 10 was due to all the updates from years past for Windows 7. But now, when I turn the computer on, it takes less than 25 seconds to open the desktop and immediately start selecting Apps or the internet. This computer even when I first bought it took closer to 60 seconds to be ready to use.

So, my assumption is that Windows 10 is super fast compared to Windows 7. It runs programs more quickly than with the previous operating system. I will admit that I still don't know all the ins and outs of this new operating system so I hunt and peck as I need to change settings, etc. But, this update to Windows 10 was free and it made my computer a "teenager" once again.

abacomike

Well, the cleaning ladies came at 11:30 AM. They put the entire apartment back in order including scrubbing the shelves in the pantry, putting everything back in the closets, etc. As I stood at the front door looking at the apartment and thinking back 2 weeks ago and envisioning what this place looked like than, it was like an "EXTREME MAKEOVER"! The place looks so good I don't think I want to sell it right away. I want to enjoy it for awhile. As soon as I save up some money, I want to replace the bathrooms and the kitchen cabinets and appliances (except for the fridge which is brand new). But for the time being, it's like going from Tobacco Road to the Taj Mahal. (forgive my embellishments).

fezo

I don't completely get the Volt. I love the technology and where they are trying to go with it but it has half the space of a Prius and once you've done your 50 electric miles lower gas mileage.

The technology will grow into something more marketable but it isn't there.

Mike, that's great. I'll leave my cat at home....

abacomike

fezo said:

I don't completely get the Volt. I love the technology and where they are trying to go with it but it has half the space of a Prius and once you've done your 50 electric miles lower gas mileage. The technology will grow into something more marketable but it isn't there. Mike, that's great. I'll leave my cat at home....

Darn right you will!  

oldfarmer50

nyccarguy said:

You guys all seem to be much more efficient than me. I used 1,812 kWh last month. My bill was $310.50.

I used about 1900 and my bill was $246. Total electric home plus a bunch of greenhouse fans.

ab348

roadburner said:

nyccarguy said:

You guys all seem to be much more efficient than me. I used 1,812 kWh last month. My bill was $310.50.

We used 1,489 kWh for July; the bill was $135.20

I think you win the prize for lowest electricity rates so far among those reporting in.

Funny thing: up here in Nova Scotia, the entire province is obsessed with power rates if from what you see in the newspapers and on TV news is any indication. Everyone thinks the power monopoly is evil and rips off the citizenry. Yet most of the rates people are quoting here aren't far off ours. I just looked at my most recent bill: 1100 kwh cost me $190 Cdn. That would be somewhere around $145-150 US.

I have long suspected most people living in Nova Scotia have the art of complaining down to a science. Someone once said we have "a culture of defeat" and I find it hard to disagree.

abacomike

oldfarmer50 said:

You guys all seem to be much more efficient than me. I used 1,812 kWh last month. My bill was $310.50.

I used about 1900 and my bill was $246. Total electric home plus a bunch of greenhouse fans.

Greenhouse fans?  You wouldn't be cultivating a weed that grows naturally in many States across this wonderful country of ours, now would you?

abacomike

@ab348:

My $49.00 electricity bill which included taxes, fees and fuel costs was for 435 kwh's.  I consider that cheap compared to most.  Like I said, FPL is one of the lowest cost utilities in the country for electricity.  Most of its source for power is nuclear with the rest being natural gas and solar.

bwia

abacomike said:

Well, the cleaning ladies came at 11:30 AM. They put the entire apartment back in order including scrubbing the shelves in the pantry, putting everything back in the closets, etc. As I stood at the front door looking at the apartment and thinking back 2 weeks ago and envisioning what this place looked like than, it was like an "EXTREME MAKEOVER"! The place looks so good I don't think I want to sell it right away. I want to enjoy it for awhile. As soon as I save up some money, I want to replace the bathrooms and the kitchen cabinets and appliances (except for the fridge which is brand new). But for the time being, it's like going from Tobacco Road to the Taj Mahal. (forgive my embellishments).

Hold that thought on the kitchen and bathroom upgrade until you consult with a mature but youngish permanent female house mate. Any vibes from a certain 6' 2" California blonde?

fezo

1066 june 17 - July 17. I went nuts on cutting electric usage about a year ago. I should have waited because the solar installation was based on past year's usage. I'd have a lot more panels if I hadn't saved. It cut the bill in half. Had been on a budget of a bit over $200 a month. Now it's budgeted at $109 a month but they still owe me $670 so I haven't had to pay in some time. Of course with the solar on now that will cut it a bunch more.

Easy tricks on saving electricity - put any electronics that instant on isn't an issue on power strips and turn the completely off when not in use. They said I might save $50 a month and I did. I leave the desktop on all day but shut it completely off at night. I leave the wifi on.

I am going to replace the garage refrigerator at one point. Easy fix.

Mike, I wasn't really bringing the cat. Heck, I don't even have him yet....

stever

Garage frig's are a big energy suck nationwide, and many of them are the older, inefficient ones that people hung on to when they remodeled their kitchen. My UP house came with a "spare" out in the garage and I quickly put in on craigslist for $10. When a buyer showed up for it, I told him thanks for actually showing up and didn't take his $10. Never plugged in the 1952 vintage freezer that came with that house either.

jwilliams2

abacomike said:

@ab348:

My $49.00 electricity bill which included taxes, fees and fuel costs was for 435 kwh's.  I consider that cheap compared to most.  Like I said, FPL is one of the lowest cost utilities in the country for electricity.  Most of its source for power is nuclear with the rest being natural gas and solar.

Mike, that is cheap. My average over the last year in my apartment is 541 kwh, with an average bill of $114.25. Don't think it's ever under $100. So our rates here in Connecticut must be much higher than yours in Florida.

fezo

I don't have it in me to not have the refrigerator in the garage - at least until the kids are out of the house. Can pick up an Energy Star one for under $600.

Michaell

We are leaving the garage fridge behind when we move. 

isellhondas

Hey, those old 1952 chest freezers are great! I'm talking about the kind you have to defrost. They don't freezer burn stuff and you can store food much longer.

Not sure about electricity usage. Probably not good.

[Deleted User]

fezo said:

I don't completely get the Volt. I love the technology and where they are trying to go with it but it has half the space of a Prius and once you've done your 50 electric miles lower gas mileage..

Kinda hard to compare the two with the Prius being a hybrid and the Volt being an extended range electric. Prius gets 1 mile electric range compared to the Volt's 50. Different markets. With the Volt around 95% of my driving would be electric, my primary goal with such a vehicle, and with the Prius it would be nearly 0%.

oldfarmer50

abacomike said:

oldfarmer50 said:

nyccarguy said:

You guys all seem to be much more efficient than me. I used 1,812 kWh last month. My bill was $310.50.

I used about 1900 and my bill was $246. Total electric home plus a bunch of greenhouse fans.

Greenhouse fans?  You wouldn't be cultivating a weed that grows naturally in many States across this wonderful country of ours, now would you?

No, not that kind of weed. Even though they have proposed a medical Mary Jane dispensary a few miles away the only herb I grow in there is Basil and Rosemary. Besides, I'm on the incoming flight path for the airport and the state police helicopters are always overhead. I'd be typing from the state pen in no time.

stickguy

Get an ingriund pool if you want high electric bills. Combined with too many electronics, work from home, and a brutal hit summer, it is painful.

Next house will be efficient. And have solar

fezo

I know about those old chest freezers. We were thinking of a small, new chest freezer but in the current situation a refrigerator with a decent freezer compartment works best.

Kind of like the 5. For right now it works. Four years from now I'll likely want something smaller, still roomy and fast and fun to drive. Ideally my Tesla III. I expect lots or ironed out issues by then. Of course by then I'll be close to 70 and say why spend oney on a car though that doesn't seem to work here.

stever

isellhondas said:

Hey, those old 1952 chest freezers are great! I'm talking about the kind you have to defrost. They don't freezer burn stuff and you can store food much longer.

Not sure about electricity usage. Probably not good.

It was a classic - that was the 1906 house we had in the UP where we were the second owners. The kids (in their 70s) who sold it to us said the freezer worked great but if we turned it off it might never run again. We unplugged it. I was born in '52 and I'm barely running and I'm sure not very efficient any more! It was a hoot though and they still had the original owner's manual. Weighed a ton and I think they may have built the basement around it.

@stickguy, how many gallons and how long is the pump cycle set for this summer?

Back to cars, I'm getting a little concerned about the tablet sticking up in the middle of the CX-3 dash. I managed to stick my Garmin halfway down the van console so the dash is clear.

driver100

stever said:

isellhondas said:

Hey, those old 1952 chest freezers are great! I'm talking about the kind you have to defrost. They don't freezer burn stuff and you can store food much longer.

Not sure about electricity usage. Probably not good.

Back to cars, I'm getting a little concerned about the tablet sticking up in the middle of the CX-3 dash. I managed to stick my Garmin halfway down the van console so the dash is clear.

Not sure you will have much choice...every car company is going in that direction. Those GPS screens that pop up are a big pet peeve of mine, but maybe we are the only ones it bothers.

When I test drove a 2015 A6 the screen is rather large and really blocks your view. The salesman said I could leave it down unless actually using it. But, then all the radio and media info is really small and hard to use, near the speedometer. The E400 has a small one, situated high, but built in and it is the best way to go. I'd prefer if it was slightly larger or much larger....the larger the better, but, like it built in.

Any car companies out there....please get the message.