Edmunds Members - Cars and Conversations (Archived)

Mr_Shiftright

It's hard to avoid. I mean cars are about world competition, about unions, about emissions scandals, about bankruptcy----automobiles are a huge economic engine and firmly intertwined with national and global politics.

Just look at a list of "who owns what" in the automotive world. It's a virtual map of the globe, and a mishmash of economic systems.

imidazol97

dino001 said:

The forecast industry works only on very unbalanced set of incentives: any time a major disaster is foretold, when it happens, the predictor is a genius, media are full of interviews, new clients flock in. When the disaster doesn't happen, there is no commensurate punishment - all the forecaster has to do is double down on the next year. Peter Schiff, Marc Faber and others live well on selling end of the world books, newsletters, while their clients count dollars lost. "One day" their predictions are accurate and the markets fall said 20 or even 50 percent. Guess what do they say then? Do they say "now you you buy it back"? Of course not - they say, it's going to fall another 20 or 50 percent. They are never satisfied with the fall. The markets bottom out, start climbing - those guys will say, it's a phoney rally, it's a bear market rally, it will fall again. They markets pass the previous high mark, they keep saying stay away, don't buy now, it's a bubble for sure. Then it doubles - they only double down the predictions. Peter Schiff predicted the 2008 crash - but he also "predicted" a crash in 2002, 2003, 2004, 2005, 2006, 2007, 2010, 2011, 2012, 2013, 2014, 2015 and surely will predict a crash in 2016, 2017, 2018 and 2019.

RBS guys are a bit different, as they are not known for being permanently bearish. However, that industry still operates on no accountability. If markets go down, indeed, you'll see those guys on all networks. If it doesn't, nobody will be unkind to them to remind their predictions.

Sounds like conspiracy theory.

dino001

imidazol97 said:

dino001 said:

The forecast industry works only on very unbalanced set of incentives: any time a major disaster is foretold, when it happens, the predictor is a genius, media are full of interviews, new clients flock in. When the disaster doesn't happen, there is no commensurate punishment - all the forecaster has to do is double down on the next year. Peter Schiff, Marc Faber and others live well on selling end of the world books, newsletters, while their clients count dollars lost. "One day" their predictions are accurate and the markets fall said 20 or even 50 percent. Guess what do they say then? Do they say "now you you buy it back"? Of course not - they say, it's going to fall another 20 or 50 percent. They are never satisfied with the fall. The markets bottom out, start climbing - those guys will say, it's a phoney rally, it's a bear market rally, it will fall again. They markets pass the previous high mark, they keep saying stay away, don't buy now, it's a bubble for sure. Then it doubles - they only double down the predictions. Peter Schiff predicted the 2008 crash - but he also "predicted" a crash in 2002, 2003, 2004, 2005, 2006, 2007, 2010, 2011, 2012, 2013, 2014, 2015 and surely will predict a crash in 2016, 2017, 2018 and 2019.

RBS guys are a bit different, as they are not known for being permanently bearish. However, that industry still operates on no accountability. If markets go down, indeed, you'll see those guys on all networks. If it doesn't, nobody will be unkind to them to remind their predictions.

Sounds like conspiracy theory.

On whose part? Mine? I don't see any conspiracies here, just human nature. Confirmation bias (people looking for pieces of evidence confirming their views), selling fear by some people and media (very lucrative), lack of accountability based on "here and now" mentality, not fair analysis of one's record. Permabears are always right at some point, just like a broken clock. When they are right, the media flock in with "how did you know". When they are wrong, nobody wants to remember.

BTW, my test for the market is number or "doom and gloom" newsletter ads on Yahoo Financial website. When they disappear (i.e. those newsletters run out of advertising money), I'll know the top is in. As long as those ads stay on in large number, I know there will be another leg up.

berri

Markets go up, markets go down. I don't see a depression on the horizon, so I'd suggest looking at your personal financial goals. If you are in the market for another decade it may become a buying on sale opportunity. Timing the market is a game of luck with not so great odds of being correct. More than a few market timers end up missing the beginning of a recovery where the big gains take place. A market correction can be a good time to rebalance your portfolio and minimize the tax effects.

abacomike

stickguy said:

Mike, even dial gauges are pretend now. They are all electronic.

PRETEND?  Alas, yet another disappointment in my life. LOL! 

cdnpinhead

Many people (and companies) make money on the churn -- not so many when you sit on what you've got.

Go figure.

abacomike

cdnpinhead said:

Many people (and companies) make money on the churn -- not so many when you sit on what you've got. Go figure.

Pinhead, at my age, I don't have a choice. I have a decent pension, a Social Security Check each month, and whatever I have in the bank has to last me the rest of my life.  And with my health deteriorating, money for my heirs.  

If I was 40 years old, I would definitely look for ways to increase my income at retirement.  That time has long passed! 

graphicguy

I've seen some of the reports on Cadillac in general. As everyone knows, I've had my own share of grief from the brand. I don't consider any of what I read as GM bashing.

However, I can say unequivocally, the materials and build quality used in today's Cadillac is 2nd to none. All of it is first rate....and I've owned and/or test driven some of the most revered brands in the industry over the past few years. Cadillac's build and material quality gives up nothing to them. Even performance is as good or better, depending on the price point.

It's some of the not quite ready for prime time engineering that needs work. And, as far as I can tell, their entire franchise structure needs a significant overhaul. For example, CUE is a good idea that lost out in its implementation. It took Cadillac two model years to get all the bugs out. That's unacceptable in a $20K car, let a lone a $65K car.

Current version of CUE? State-of-the-Art, tops in class. You can't tell me in 2012 or 2013, whenever Cadillac was doing development for the 2014 version of CUE that they tested it and said "yep, that works just grand". If they did say that, they should be fired.

Can't continue to do that and expect sales volumes to climb. That fact can't be that hard to comprehend. Yet, for Cadillac, seems like it is.

bwia

The rapid pace of development and implementation of technology has hurt GM. After spending millions (if not billions) on OnStar GM was caught in a conundrum. Onstar was state of the art and a cash cow for GM but as newer and cheaper telematics came along suddenly OnStar was not the novelty it once was. Read, obsolete.

GM was slow to integrate OnStar with infotainment. And when they did they still continued the old-fashioned turn-by-turn directions without the color maps offered by Garmin and Magellan; and Bluetooth did not work well either. So caught between two worlds CUE and Intellilink suffered as GM tried to add features to its OnStar platform.

ab348

I am amazed OnStar still exists in its current form. I wonder what the take rate for it after the free trial period is over time?

Mr_Shiftright

graphicguy said:

I've seen some of the reports on Cadillac in general. As everyone knows, I've had my own share of grief from the brand. I don't consider any of what I read as GM bashing.

However, I can say unequivocally, the materials and build quality used in today's Cadillac is 2nd to none. All of it is first rate....and I've owned and/or test driven some of the most revered brands in the industry over the past few years. Cadillac's build and material quality gives up nothing to them. Even performance is as good or better, depending on the price point.

It's some of the not quite ready for prime time engineering that needs work. And, as far as I can tell, their entire franchise structure needs a significant overhaul. For example, CUE is a good idea that lost out in its implementation. It took Cadillac two model years to get all the bugs out. That's unacceptable in a $20K car, let a lone a $65K car.

Current version of CUE? State-of-the-Art, tops in class. You can't tell me in 2012 or 2013, whenever Cadillac was doing development for the 2014 version of CUE that they tested it and said "yep, that works just grand". If they did say that, they should be fired.

Can't continue to do that and expect sales volumes to climb. That fact can't be that hard to comprehend. Yet, for Cadillac, seems like it is.

Well if you're right (and no reason not to think so, coming from the horse's mouth), then that review was aiming to be mean about the interior fit and finish.

driver100

Speaking about OnStar...when I started driving the Malibu rental car I went to adjust the review mirror and unfortunately I pressed one of 3 buttons that were lit up....at the bottom of the mirror.

Then a pleasant ladies voice could be heard and she asked what kind of help I needed.

I had to explain that I was sorry but I pressed the button accidentally.

I think she was disappointed I didn't have something for her to work on. "Just call if you need help".

suydam

I liked a lot of the features of Onstar but costs way too much. I dropped it after the 6 months were up. If they offered the app aspects (remote diagnostics, for example) as a perk it would really give people a reason to shop the brand.

oldfarmer50

abacomike said:

It is 62 degrees out with intermittent rain.  I have had a chill all day that I just cannot get rid of.  I am wearing jeans, a sweatshirt and I have a comforter over me as I sit in my recliner.  And still I have a chill.

This is what living in South Florida year-round can do to a 70 year old human being.  Let us pray:

"Dear Lord, let there be warmth!" 

I took a two mile walk today to break my usual winter time slug behavior. It was 22 and windy. I know just how you feel.

This will cheer you up. It was part of a car ad on Tampa CL:

oldfarmer50

graphicguy said:

I've seen some of the reports on Cadillac in general. As everyone knows, I've had my own share of grief from the brand. I don't consider any of what I read as GM bashing.

However, I can say unequivocally, the materials and build quality used in today's Cadillac is 2nd to none. All of it is first rate....and I've owned and/or test driven some of the most revered brands in the industry over the past few years. Cadillac's build and material quality gives up nothing to them. Even performance is as good or better, depending on the price point.

It's some of the not quite ready for prime time engineering that needs work. And, as far as I can tell, their entire franchise structure needs a significant overhaul. For example, CUE is a good idea that lost out in its implementation. It took Cadillac two model years to get all the bugs out. That's unacceptable in a $20K car, let a lone a $65K car.

Current version of CUE? State-of-the-Art, tops in class. You can't tell me in 2012 or 2013, whenever Cadillac was doing development for the 2014 version of CUE that they tested it and said "yep, that works just grand". If they did say that, they should be fired.

Can't continue to do that and expect sales volumes to climb. That fact can't be that hard to comprehend. Yet, for Cadillac, seems like it is.

I find myself lusting for an older Deville, you know just before they started that alphabet soup of DTS, STS, CTS etc. and I needed a translator to figure the models. I think a 2005 because that's when they finally fixed the Northstar.

This one would do me right:


http://tampa.craigslist.org/pnl/cto/5382285800.html

driver100

oldfarmer50 said:

graphicguy said:

I've seen some of the reports on Cadillac in general. As everyone knows, I've had my own share of grief from the brand. I don't consider any of what I read as GM bashing.

However, I can say unequivocally, the materials and build quality used in today's Cadillac is 2nd to none. All of it is first rate....and I've owned and/or test driven some of the most revered brands in the industry over the past few years. Cadillac's build and material quality gives up nothing to them. Even performance is as good or better, depending on the price point.

It's some of the not quite ready for prime time engineering that needs work. And, as far as I can tell, their entire franchise structure needs a significant overhaul. For example, CUE is a good idea that lost out in its implementation. It took Cadillac two model years to get all the bugs out. That's unacceptable in a $20K car, let a lone a $65K car.

Current version of CUE? State-of-the-Art, tops in class. You can't tell me in 2012 or 2013, whenever Cadillac was doing development for the 2014 version of CUE that they tested it and said "yep, that works just grand". If they did say that, they should be fired.

Can't continue to do that and expect sales volumes to climb. That fact can't be that hard to comprehend. Yet, for Cadillac, seems like it is.

I find myself lusting for an older Deville, you know just before they started that alphabet soup of DTS, STS, CTS etc. and I needed a translator to figure the models. I think a 2005 because that's when they finally fixed the Northstar.

This one would do me right:


http://tampa.craigslist.org/pnl/cto/5382285800.html

Nice looking car for $4000. Did those big boats really have FWD?

oldfarmer50

driver100 said:

oldfarmer50 said:

graphicguy said:

I've seen some of the reports on Cadillac in general. As everyone knows, I've had my own share of grief from the brand. I don't consider any of what I read as GM bashing.

However, I can say unequivocally, the materials and build quality used in today's Cadillac is 2nd to none. All of it is first rate....and I've owned and/or test driven some of the most revered brands in the industry over the past few years. Cadillac's build and material quality gives up nothing to them. Even performance is as good or better, depending on the price point.

It's some of the not quite ready for prime time engineering that needs work. And, as far as I can tell, their entire franchise structure needs a significant overhaul. For example, CUE is a good idea that lost out in its implementation. It took Cadillac two model years to get all the bugs out. That's unacceptable in a $20K car, let a lone a $65K car.

Current version of CUE? State-of-the-Art, tops in class. You can't tell me in 2012 or 2013, whenever Cadillac was doing development for the 2014 version of CUE that they tested it and said "yep, that works just grand". If they did say that, they should be fired.

Can't continue to do that and expect sales volumes to climb. That fact can't be that hard to comprehend. Yet, for Cadillac, seems like it is.

I find myself lusting for an older Deville, you know just before they started that alphabet soup of DTS, STS, CTS etc. and I needed a translator to figure the models. I think a 2005 because that's when they finally fixed the Northstar.

This one would do me right:


http://tampa.craigslist.org/pnl/cto/5382285800.html

Nice looking car for $4000. Did those big boats really have FWD?

My son's '93 did.

berri

Hey, maybe the new Lincoln Continental will fit the bill?

oldfarmer50

berri said:

Hey, maybe the new Lincoln Continental will fit the bill?

Sure, as soon as my Power Ball winnings arrive.

graphicguy

Mr Shiftright....the only thing I can gather from the recent Cadillac reviews is build quality is spotty. Maybe it's the QC after the cars are rolling off the assembly line that are proving to be the issue.

Pretty big difference in the issues with the '14 CTS I had and the current '16. It's almost like two different models....maybe even two different generations of car.

The '14 with all of its problems was akin to a Lada. The '16, it compares well to Mercedes, Audi, BMW, of competing models.

OF....I know of guys who are still bemoaning the demise of the DeVilles and Town Cars of yesteryear. These are not "car guys", per se. But, they are sales people, who put in a lot of time on the road, and appreciate the room and soft ride of those body on frame lux cars.

As my current Caddy dealer says...."wish I could convert one customer in 5 who come in from a DTS to the new models." More often, they leave disappointed.

graphicguy

oldfarmer50 said:

graphicguy said:

I've seen some of the reports on Cadillac in general. As everyone knows, I've had my own share of grief from the brand. I don't consider any of what I read as GM bashing.

However, I can say unequivocally, the materials and build quality used in today's Cadillac is 2nd to none. All of it is first rate....and I've owned and/or test driven some of the most revered brands in the industry over the past few years. Cadillac's build and material quality gives up nothing to them. Even performance is as good or better, depending on the price point.

It's some of the not quite ready for prime time engineering that needs work. And, as far as I can tell, their entire franchise structure needs a significant overhaul. For example, CUE is a good idea that lost out in its implementation. It took Cadillac two model years to get all the bugs out. That's unacceptable in a $20K car, let a lone a $65K car.

Current version of CUE? State-of-the-Art, tops in class. You can't tell me in 2012 or 2013, whenever Cadillac was doing development for the 2014 version of CUE that they tested it and said "yep, that works just grand". If they did say that, they should be fired.

Can't continue to do that and expect sales volumes to climb. That fact can't be that hard to comprehend. Yet, for Cadillac, seems like it is.

I find myself lusting for an older Deville, you know just before they started that alphabet soup of DTS, STS, CTS etc. and I needed a translator to figure the models. I think a 2005 because that's when they finally fixed the Northstar.

This one would do me right:


http://tampa.craigslist.org/pnl/cto/5382285800.html

For $4K (probably be able to buy it for low-mid 3s), there's a comfortable car that would give you next to no trouble for the next 10 years. Talk about a screaming bargain.

nyccarguy

@graphicguy - "they leave disappointed" & head straight to the Lexus dealer.

graphicguy

Bradd....you're right!

driver100

If you don't hear from me tomorrow you will know I am on my way to pick up my Powerball Winnings!

It would be better if I could win it in Canada....there would be no tax to pay on proceeds from gambling (one of the few financial advantages). The government says since we can't claim it as a loss if we lose, we don't have to declare it as income if we win. I'd hate to win $1.5 Billion and have to give the government $5 million

Michaell

driver100 said:

If you don't hear from me tomorrow you will know I am on my way to pick up my Powerball Winnings!

It would be better if I could win it in Canada....there would be no tax to pay on proceeds from gambling (one of the few financial advantages). The government says since we can't claim it as a loss if we lose, we don't have to declare it as income if we win. I'd hate to win $1.5 Billion and have to give the government $5 million

I've been reading articles today about that.

Here in Colorado, if you take the cash option, you'll end up initially with about $660 million after the initial federal and state taxes, but you'll owe another $96 million to the US Gov't at the end of the year.

Turns out the federal tax bite on the winnings is initially 25%, but the top tax rate is 39.6%, so you'll owe the difference at the end of the year.

abacomike

Just picked up my Powerball ticket - 5 sets of numbers, $10.00.  I waste that much on any given week on junk - this way I can feel a part of all the hysteria!  Good luck all! 

Michaell

abacomike said:

Just picked up my Powerball ticket - 5 sets of numbers, $10.00.  I waste that much on any given week on junk - this way I can feel a part of all the hysteria!  Good luck all! 

No state tax for you if you win!

abacomike

Michaell said:

Just picked up my Powerball ticket - 5 sets of numbers, $10.00.  I waste that much on any given week on junk - this way I can feel a part of all the hysteria!  Good luck all! 

No state tax for you if you win!

No, just Federal income tax - 40+% of winnings.

Michaell

abacomike said:

Michaell said:

abacomike said:

Just picked up my Powerball ticket - 5 sets of numbers, $10.00.  I waste that much on any given week on junk - this way I can feel a part of all the hysteria!  Good luck all! 

No state tax for you if you win!

No, just Federal income tax - 40+% of winnings.

Would you take the cash option or the annuity?

laurasdada

Apropos of nothing: Watched an old Let's Make a Deal again last night. Part of one of the Big Deal was 1000 gallons of gas. A $350 value! As well as a vinyl-roofed Buick Electra 225.

tjc78

We played in a group of about twenty of us at work.  $10 each.  Last week we had two power balls and took home a cool $8.00. 

Mr_Shiftright

Congratulations! Are you still planning to work?

abacomike

Michaell said:

Michaell said:

Just picked up my Powerball ticket - 5 sets of numbers, $10.00.  I waste that much on any given week on junk - this way I can feel a part of all the hysteria!  Good luck all! 

No state tax for you if you win!

No, just Federal income tax - 40+% of winnings.

Would you take the cash option or the annuity?

CASH!!! 

abacomike

oldfarmer50 said:

I've seen some of the reports on Cadillac in general. As everyone knows, I've had my own share of grief from the brand. I don't consider any of what I read as GM bashing. However, I can say unequivocally, the materials and build quality used in today's Cadillac is 2nd to none. All of it is first rate....and I've owned and/or test driven some of the most revered brands in the industry over the past few years. Cadillac's build and material quality gives up nothing to them. Even performance is as good or better, depending on the price point. It's some of the not quite ready for prime time engineering that needs work. And, as far as I can tell, their entire franchise structure needs a significant overhaul. For example, CUE is a good idea that lost out in its implementation. It took Cadillac two model years to get all the bugs out. That's unacceptable in a $20K car, let a lone a $65K car. Current version of CUE? State-of-the-Art, tops in class. You can't tell me in 2012 or 2013, whenever Cadillac was doing development for the 2014 version of CUE that they tested it and said "yep, that works just grand". If they did say that, they should be fired. Can't continue to do that and expect sales volumes to climb. That fact can't be that hard to comprehend. Yet, for Cadillac, seems like it is.

I find myself lusting for an older Deville, you know just before they started that alphabet soup of DTS, STS, CTS etc. and I needed a translator to figure the models. I think a 2005 because that's when they finally fixed the Northstar. This one would do me right: http://tampa.craigslist.org/pnl/cto/5382285800.html

You lust for cars - I lust for more animate things, if you know what I mean! 

Mr_Shiftright

Careful Mike....love dies, but cars are forever.

stickguy

My wife knows not to ask me to choose. She's afraid what the answer might be.

Though I do tell my kids that the dog is my favorite.

cdnpinhead

A lottery is proof that the vast majority of people either: 1) can't figure out math, or 2) buy into the concept that "you can't win if you don't play." You most assuredly can, by never playing.

Yeah, I know, party pooper.

abacomike

Went to my cardiologist this morning.  Cardio-gram was good, per the doc.  Have to go in for a 2+ hour stress test and echo-cardio-gram in 2 weeks.  He told me there are two more arteries 50% closed - but because of my diabetes (which he says caused the plac in the first place) he said he may have to put 2 more stents in.  I'm really looking forward to that! 

Saw the hematologist on Monday - I have to have some extensive blood tests next month and a Doppler ultrasound done on my left leg to study the deep vein thrombosis (blood clot).

Tomorrow morning I have to see my primary care physician.  I am tired of doctors and tests and hospitals.

If I have to have two more stents put in, I am going to insist on several days in a rehab to gain my strength.  Then I'll have a health care worker 8 hours a day for the first week home.

stickguy

Keep plugging mike.

Michaell

cdnpinhead said:

A lottery is proof that the vast majority of people either: 1) can't figure out math, or 2) buy into the concept that "you can't win if you don't play." You most assuredly can, by never playing.

Yeah, I know, party pooper.

For those of you who play golf, I saw an interesting comparison today. Turns out the odds of you getting a hole-in-one on two holes in the same round are better than winning the Powerball.

I've been playing golf since I was a kid and I've got one hole-in-one in all that time.

driver100

CASH!!! 

Almost 100% of the winners take cash, and it probably makes sense to do it that way.

70% of the winners have lost all they won within 5 years.

Easy come easy go.

And yes, your chance of winning is almost impossible...much better chance of getting bitten by a shark, but, it is good to dream once in awhile and it is something to talk about. I told the guys at tennis if I am not there on Friday I am on my way to pick up my check.

One other stastic......with those odds, 290 million to one, it would be like flipping a coin and getting heads 58 times in a row.

nyccarguy

cdnpinhead said:

A lottery is proof that the vast majority of people either: 1) can't figure out math, or 2) buy into the concept that "you can't win if you don't play." You most assuredly can, by never playing. Yeah, I know, party pooper.

Very funny you say that.  A few of the guys who work (work is a strong word for some of them) for me play lotto every day - lotto, mega millions, power ball, pick 3 daily, pick 4 daily, & of course (my favorite) the illegal street numbers.  I make more money than they do & I don't have the money they literally throw away on a weekly basis on lotto & numbers.  

I bought $10 worth of powerball tickets last week.  Some people are spending $10 - $20 - $50 - $100 on Powerball tickets.  It's crazy.

abacomike

Michaell said:

A lottery is proof that the vast majority of people either: 1) can't figure out math, or 2) buy into the concept that "you can't win if you don't play." You most assuredly can, by never playing. Yeah, I know, party pooper.

For those of you who play golf, I saw an interesting comparison today. Turns out the odds of you getting a hole-in-one on two holes in the same round are better than winning the Powerball. I've been playing golf since I was a kid and I've got one hole-in-one in all that time.

I have many, many more holes-in-one - at least 100+.  Haven't had one in a long time now because I gave up miniature golf!   

driver100

"

nyccarguy">

I bought $10 worth of powerball tickets last week.  Some people are spending $10 - $20 - $50 - $100 on Powerball tickets.  It's crazy

.

If you have to play, the smartest thing is to buy one ticket for $2........if you win it will just be by some incredible fluke any way. Buying 5 or 10 tickets only increases your chance of winning by a tiny fraction of a percent.

dino001

abacomike said:

CASH!!! 

Absolutely annuity, no doubt about it.

dino001

Anything bigger than say $500K cash, I'd take in an annuity. Why give up all that money, considering such low interest rates. Here are my scenarios:

$1M: $50K annuity, don't quit my job, nice addition to the income.
$5M: $250K annuity: can quit my job, can live non-rich, but very comfortable life,
$20M: $1.5M annuity: rich life, but no helicopters
$200M: $10M annuity: very wealthy life, can pursue some costly hobbies
$1B: $50M annuity: basically absurd.

Why should I burden myself into how to invest, what to do, who to hire. Money comes in every year, no effort. Only reason to take cash now is if you believe in end of the world, so you buy hoard of gold and bury it somewhere in the backyard. But when such EOW comes that gold won't help you anyway.

oldfarmer50

Michaell said:

driver100 said:

If you don't hear from me tomorrow you will know I am on my way to pick up my Powerball Winnings!

It would be better if I could win it in Canada....there would be no tax to pay on proceeds from gambling (one of the few financial advantages). The government says since we can't claim it as a loss if we lose, we don't have to declare it as income if we win. I'd hate to win $1.5 Billion and have to give the government $5 million

I've been reading articles today about that.

Here in Colorado, if you take the cash option, you'll end up initially with about $660 million after the initial federal and state taxes, but you'll owe another $96 million to the US Gov't at the end of the year.

Turns out the federal tax bite on the winnings is initially 25%, but the top tax rate is 39.6%, so you'll owe the difference at the end of the year.

The worst state as far as taxes to win the PB is NY. Wow, what a surprise.

oldfarmer50

cdnpinhead said:

A lottery is proof that the vast majority of people either: 1) can't figure out math, or 2) buy into the concept that "you can't win if you don't play." You most assuredly can, by never playing.

Yeah, I know, party pooper.

I rarely throw my money away on lotteries but when the payout in cash exceeds the odds (in this case 1.5 billion vs. 292 million) I throw caution to the winds.

qbrozen

My problem with the annuity is that it is putting alot of trust in them actually continuing to pay you. Anybody who won't be getting social security or their pension (hello, NJ) certainly understands that concern.

dino001

qbrozen said:

My problem with the annuity is that it is putting alot of trust in them actually continuing to pay you. Anybody who won't be getting social security or their pension (hello, NJ) certainly understands that concern.

I think there is a difference in legal framework of those two. I can understand the concern, though. I bet if everybody chose annuity, that would actually put much more stress on the system, but majority wants cash.