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Comments
When did the US-built cars become inferior, exactly? Is this a problem that has crept up in the more recent Accords? Or has it always been there? And, I'm presuming that all Accords, be they Japanese or American in origin, are built using the same parts specifications, albeit different suppliers. How can the quality of the American cars be lower if the parts meet the same specifications? If they meet the same specifications, then they must go together the same way. If the American parts don't meet spec, then Honda has a bigger issue they're not acknowledging or rectifying, than poor assembly.
I'm not saying that there won't be the occasional defective part or poor fit. Maybe that is what it comes down to - numbers. The vast majority of Accords sold in this country are US-built cars. Therefore, it stands to reason that there will be more US-built cars with defects, simply because there are more of them. That doesn't necessarily mean that their inherent quality is lower.
2. You said he knew you were going to get an American-built Accord. Did you expect him to tell you the American ones were inferior? Next time when/if you buy a Japanese-built one, see what his tune is.
Why are US-built cars inferior? It all boils down to workers' attitude. The Japanese take pride in their work. Look at the crap put out by the Big Three. You don't think a company like GM has the manufacturing resources equal to the Japanese? But it's the workers on the front line that make all the difference. You can put in all the QC you want, but if the product is consistently lousy, what are going to do? Stop the production line? Result is QC standards are not enforced as strictly as they should be. And we all know, if the labour law (never mind unions), how difficult it is to fire a substandard worker.
It has a few minor squeaks and tiny rattles. No big deal really. Overall, i've only been to the dealer for 2 problems, both quality problems. Not bad I would say. As for my bumpers, they both are installed on the car perfectly correct.
Now, I would love to see how these three plants stack up to the Japanese manufacturing plants that produce the same name plates. My money would be on the Japanese plants since their workers seem to take pride in what they manufacture.
I read about a year ago about the "state of the art" Chrysler plant in Missouri that has the latest technology in auto manufacturing. Unfortunately, what is produced in that plant is a lot of cars with quality control problems. Look at the fit and finish on any Chrysler and you will see what I mean.
I have also seen the gaps mentioned which are a characteristic mainly on 4 DOOR ACCORDS.
The assumption of poor quality I sometimes see expressed about Mexican plants is puzzling to me. The mechanics who fix the cars under warranty are quite often hispanic. That doesn't seem to bother anyone.
Sometimes I read of people who prefer German Volkswagens over Mexican VWs but I understand the German plants are mostly populated with Turkish migrants. Nothing wrong with that, but certainly a third world work force.
I suspect the differences between a plant with 'acceptable' quality and 'excellent' quality are based on a number of fairly subtle and hard to measure things, rather than stereotypes about Japanese workers 'caring' about the cars and North American workers 'not caring' about the cars.
By accident I got a J built-fit and finish are superb-hope I get lucky for my next one.
Japanese built Accords are far superior to the Accords built in the USA. Just look at the paint for starters and that should convince you. An oil based paint is far superior to the water based EPA mandated paint as used in Ohio.
As I walk our used car lot, all of the paint seems to hold up the same, at least to me anyway.
I can't tell the difference but then, maybe I don't see as well as others do.
I think Honda paint overall is a little lower quality than Toyota, BMW, or Mercedes uses. But the quality difference is probabaly due to less coats being applied to the Honda's. As I said before I have a 2000 Accord Coupe(made in USA) in silver metallic with 26K miles and the paint is holding up well. I have very few stone chips and the paint still shines like new.
My current Honda was built in Japan. Given the choice I would by one from Japan. That choice is less and less every year.
The USA Honda worker thinks of his job as a job. Japanese workers incorporate their jobs into their life styles and make it the center point of their lives.
Regarding economies. The US economy has only been down for ~2 years, as I mentioned the Japanese economy is going on it's second decade of being down. People who thought they had jobs for life are losing them, how do you think that will effect their productivity? I can't imagine it is much different from the "hayseeds" you refer to in Ohio.
And yes you are right about the reasons Honda builds cars in the US, tariffs have been a part of the US practically since our independence, whether related to cars or whatever. I'm sure you are aware of how much the US economy depends on auto production and can understand why the government does what it does.
Honda's reputation was built through the '80s and '90s, roughly the timeframe that Honda has been manufacturing at least a portion of its products in the United States. I've no idea of the relative proportions from year to year of domestically manufactured versus imported Hondas, sold in the United States. But, it would seem to me that if there was an actual, perceivable gap between the quality of domestically-produced Hondas and those imported from Japan, that Honda would not have been able to build its reputation into what it has today.
I won't debate that their is a difference (cultural or otherwise) in the mindset of American workers and Japanese workers. I'm sure the Honda workers in Ohio wouldn't appreciate being referred to as "hayseeds". People take pride in the product they help create. And with Honda plants, the UAW isn't there to create an atmosphere of entitlement.
And to make two things clear, I did not refer to the Ohio workers in a negative manner, I was quoting someone else. And I do realize that there were no automobiles in 1776.
When Japan bought out the Sterling plant in England back in the late 1980's, it was for the same reason. Guess what guys, the Honda plant in England is going to be building the new Civic SI and exporting them to Europe and the United States. Nothing like those British built cars with a history of electrical and paint problems. Hope Honda limits each British factory working to only one pint of ale at lunch time.
Last week I noticed rust above the rear driver's side wheel well where the plastic bumper and the metal meet at the seam. Took it to an award winning body shop in the area and the collision shop writer informed me that this was a common problem on 1994, 1995, 1996 and 1997 Honda Accords. He informed me that it was an obvious design flaw on Honda's part due to an inner lip that collects water. He also told me it was a problem on earlier Accords as well. My estimate to get one side fixed and painted was $365.00 with the car being in the shop three days.
This is the first new Honda I owned and it looks as if it will be my last. VW has a 10 year 100K rust through warranty so it looks as if the Passat will be my next car. My question is, "do you think I should invest $365.00 to have my Accord fixed? My car has only 52K on it.
Have a 97 and always clean it myself making certain to really clean that area. The price quoted is very good if they actually grind off the loose rust, kill off the remaining, seal it and then paint it to match. Sounds like a winner if they do a quality job.
Make your next car a ford or dc product-you will learn a lot about cars driving one of those.
Here on the west coast, I don't see any rust.
bd21...I think I heard something about a service bulletin on the side airbag light.
I also live in the "rust belt" of the northeast. Hondas are known to rust above the back wheels on Accords and Civics. Usually right after the rust through warranty is over.
I've tried lubricating the foam stripping with silicone spray but that does not seem to help. Is there any way I can have the door adjusted to shut tighter? I'm going to bring it back to the dealer, but I'm afriad I'll get the "there's nothing we can do" so I figured I'd ask here first.
Any insight would be great. Anybody else experience the noise?
Apparently the salt gets in between the metal and plastic bit and does a tune on the paint. Yeah Honda's rust-got rid of my last one when I could see through the floor board-it is still going with over 300K on it-the guy has a couple of layers of card board over the hole.
I guess my question is if you have a 6th generation Accord, will it start rusting in the same place after the warranty is up?
Usually in areas of the country where rock salt is used on roads in the winter months. isellhondas---you won't see this problem in the area that you live in. Northeast, Midwest and Rocky Mountain states where there is a lot of snow.
Definitely a Honda engineer design flaw that I hope is corrected on the 6th generation Accords.
ah well even honda can improve-why so many years to do it though. At least it ain't their engines or trannies.
Does Honda galvanize its steel before it is painted?
Honda needs to address this at their manufacturing facility in Ohio.
It's almost like you look for a fresh audiance to tell your story to. Over and over and over....
As far as the rust issue is concerned, I haven't said anything because I have no experience with this.
I've spent my entire life in California and Western Washington. They don't salt the roads here so cars don't rust. It does rain all of the time however. I've never seen the rear wheel rust you're talking about but don't doubt it happens. I see lots of cars from back east with terrible rust.
We don't buy lease return cars from the salt belt area of any make or model.
Hopefully the 1998 model change fixed this.