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http://cgi6.ebay.com/ebaymotors/aw-cgi/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewBids&item=1852747075
Okay, okay, I'll tell you: $95,100. If you have time, check the "Bid History" on eBay. I happened to catch the last 10 minutes, and it was thrilling.
And still have money left for Lo-Jacks!
For each car!
whotheman
That is what I'M talking about!
We can have both, ok???
Obi
Sentras, Altimas, Maximas, oh my... why do we need so many sedans? BMW envy, perhaps? 350Z nice, but if you find one under $33K east of California (where a lot of Americans live, east of California... I know, difficult concept), I'd be surprised.
I've seen a few 240SX and 300ZX recently. Still drooling!
A 240sx couldn't even waste a Prelude, let alone a Camaro or Corvette.
2014 Mini Cooper (stick shift of course), 2016 Camry hybrid, 2009 Outback Sport 5-spd (keeping the stick alive)
Mario Andretti drives nice cars.
Shoes works at a winery.
Shoes drives nice cars.
Shoes = Mario Andretti? Hmm....
There were four salesmen, three customers, including me, and the couple who now own the Z.
Clearly the sales staff aren't interested in selling the car -- they don't know squat about it (one of them told me the only difference between the Touring and the Performance was the presence of an automatic. This is the same trog who once told me they're only making a "thousand or so."), and they've all turned into order-takers. I was greeted with "Put in an order. If it comes and you don't like it you don't have to take it. And there won't be one to test drive for a good six months."
Another guy says "You oughta put in an order. You'd look good in it!" Image selling, i.e., just like I got when I went to look at the BMW roadster when it first came out. Sorry, I'm more into performance, and like I said, these guys are still clueless.
I'm guessing the couple who bought the Desert (bronze) are up for image as the lady seemed uninterested in the car's details and just drove away. I can say that the exhaust makes a nice V6 rumble at idle, and sounds like it's winding even though she pulled away easy.
It does look as though the cars being shipped (from this experience and the web pages of other dealers in the area) are primarily Touring models. I would guess they want to grab the higher profit, first-on-the-block sales.
Enough about the salesmen and that part.
I went in prepared to place an order. But I'm going to wait, probably quite awhile. I'll stick with my old roadster for a few months. I don't like to buy on emotion (as you certainly can't trust the accuracy or the honesty of what the sales staff says), and I can only think of four times in my life that I've been as moved visually by a car as this. (I think a test drive right now would have me trying to drive like I could 30 years ago.)
The first time over-the-top was when my dad took me down to the dealer to look at the new '53 Corvette. (He didn't buy it because he didn't like the way it drove.) The next was when he came home with his XK140, and then the XK-E hit the streets and I nearly dropped out of school so I could buy a used 4.2 coupe. There were 30 years of drudge cars after that until my friend showed me his beautifully restored 308GTB (Ferrari roadster).
Visually, I think this car is in the same class: absolutely beautiful.
Someone said the front end looks like it doesn't belong. Nonsense. It is aggressive, a very real hood scoop that may be a foot deep and 3 feet wide and will look like you're about to fall in the Grand Canyon if the car comes up behind you on a track.
Seveeral have commented on the high beltline. It sure is. A few said it was too high or that it looks like the TT. No way. I measured: the beltline isn't higher than any other car, but the top is quite a bit lower ... so maybe it looks like a chopped 49 chevy fastback(lol). The beltline on the TT makes it look squat -- with a fastback the Z looks sleek, very sleek, and (having a long history with cars), much like the Porsche exotics of the '60s.
The rear view reminds me more of the XKE than anything else right now. Maybe I'll think of something else when I calm down.
The car is just plain gorgeous. Someone said it looked fat, not like the Zs of history. The 240 design was linear and angular with curves added to break it up, knifelike. THis is sleek and designed to move through the air without disturbing it much, let alone cutting it.
Some cars are derivative, and you can find examples in every Mitsubishi, Chevy, Ford, and so on shop. In fact, it's impossible to design a car that isn't derivative since they all need most of the same equipment and details. The trick is to get it all to hang together, I think. The new Z, I think, has more references to exotics than it does to street cars.
But of course the reviewers always have to find something to say in their 'thumbs-down'
part of the review, like "not a BMW." A few years ago, Audi brought the A6 out, a ground-breaking design that many others are now using as a base for their own near-fastback designs. Edmunds' reviewers criticized the taillights,for godsake, because they look like those on an S-10 pickup. They didn't like the look of the car -- but saying it with that kind of idiotic comparison is akin to saying that the Corvette, which has four tail lights in pairs, got the idea from a semi trailer. The technique damns by association, implying that the vehicle looks like a truck ..... Who cares?
I don't often post here, but I went on so long this time because the car is very exciting, beautiful, and not something I should drive or buy until I can get more objective. One thing I know for sure: the design WORKS.
Take care.
Joe W.
I once had a toolbox tell me to spend an extra 1000 on an automatic. Why? "Your resale will be higher." How much? "At least 700-800 higher!" Well, I'm sold give me a more expensive option that will surely lose money and that I do not desire. Brilliant!
How do you feel about the new Infiniti G35 coupe due in November???
Cheers,
Thanks for the support.
I finally thought of something I didn't care for: too many Z's all over the body.
Go Bluejays.
Joe W.
P.S. I think it was Motor Trend that tested the S2000 by launching it at 6,000 rpm. But they got 0-60 in 5.2 and a 13.9 quarter mile out of a brand new car (i.e. and the S2000 is known to gain power after 3,000 miles). If I'm not mistaken R&T took it a bit easier. All of this happens to be somewhat irrelevant to me, since I don't drag race from a standing start at stoplights. Engine flexibility, handling and steering are my priorities.
Of course, I honked, she waved, we hammered it and did a 70-to-100 sprint and the Z didn't seem to strain in doing it. Couldn't tell if it was a manual or auto that she was driving, but I'm pretty sure the rims were 18". I wanted to stick around longer but I had to take an exit.
Very nice car. If it weren't for what they're doing to nissan.com, I'd even consider one.
It looked fantastic. It looks much better in person than in pictures. The show was at a Knoxville dealership.
An 18 wheeler pulled into the dealership lot around 9 this morning. It had 2 new Z's on it (one silver and one red.) They unloaded the silver one and drove it into the garage, but they left the red one on the truck (later I found out it was headed for a different dealership.) Both of them looked great.
About an hour later they finally pulled the silver one out of the garage (I guess it took time to prep & clean it.) They pulled it right out onto the lot for everyone to see, but they left the doors locked (so you could only peer into the windows if you wanted to look at the interior.) There was a note in the front window stating that the car belonged to some female (I forgot the name) and the note asked not to touch the car since it had already been sold.
It was an automatic "Touring" model with spoilers. Overall this is one sweet car. The bar in the back window is much more pronounced than shown in the magazines. This car is going to be a winner.
Here is a pic of a G35c Convertible that was photoshopped on the web somewhere. Both cars have soul IMO, thanks for your opinion.
And I do NOT think the G35 Convertible will ever be made, but we can dream.
Some of the criticisms I might have of the 350Z as a sports car - overweight, design/engineering compromises (i.e.shared engine & chassis components), etc, do NOT apply as much to the G35 coupe, since it isn't intended to be a sports car.
I could even see the convertible G35 coupe as a nice affordable alternative to the CLK and 330cic, even though I cringe when I think of a 3,500+/- lb convertible 350Z. I'll take my S2000 over the 350Z as a pure sports car, but from what I see and hear, the G35 coupe may be one of the best <$40k coupes on the market.
That said, I still love my Maxima! I WOULD however kill for traction control and an IRS, but I can wait. This car has just been too good to me and I can get over these small inconveniences.
Obi
When Nissan decided to build the new sports car "The 350Z", they had to find a way to cut costs.
The solution is the car is manufactured with RECYCLED METAL. I'm not an expert on metals, but I do know what happened when other manufactures were building there cars from recycled metal. Most dealers are asking full over sticker for the 350Z. I believe a prospective buyer should
be very careful before paying full sticker for any vehicle that is built with recycled metal
the 350Z is cheaper than the 90-96 300ZX twin turbo because it's lower tech, for the time.
the 300zx tt had every ounce of technology Nissan could muster, and little expense was spared and little thought given to practicality.
the 350Z came to be under Ghosn's accountant eye and HAD to be cheaper, more focused and more profitable. in my opinion it's still too expensive, considering the base model shamefully has no limited-slip differential. not sure how you can meaningfully use 280HP without one...
-Colin
....the steel issue merits additional input from the author.................ez
There are two niche markets, I think, for this car. One is the lady who gets one from her S.O. This is the best possible copy to buy used. The other market is the performance nut who can buy one for "sport." The boy racer, the young family guy, and so on will find this too much of a toy.
A very, very beautiful toy. And because of its limited (purchasing) audience, if it isn't slick as snot to drive, it won't be around long unless it transforms itself into another cruiser.
The Z had to be kept less expensive. The higher prices are already occupied by the boxster and its followers (literally). In this price range its only real mass competition will be the S2k, obviously, and some well-tuned Miatae, MR2s ... all of them 4 cyl., none of them fixed roof. The car advances the debate at all the local events; except it still has to compete against more expensive cars on any given Sunday. That's why so many of us are waiting to see what it has, not in a magazine but on the autoX, rally, and time trial events.
In terms of sales, it seems obvious that the new Z raises the stakes considerably. In terms of performance, the decision hasn't even begun but the hopes are high.
I told you that the local dealer had 4 delivered, and I saw the first in its new, blonde owner's hands. The dealer called me over the weekend. it seems that someone didn't pick up their new Touring toy and he said: "The car is available for sale, and perhaps for a test drive." PERHAPS
Of course I called him back (want to keep the door of discussion open) and let him know I wasn't interested in a Touring but wanted Performance or Track (depending on which drove the way I want, if either), and whether I bought or not would depend on a Loooong test drive and whether the car's performance was interesting enough.
I'm sure he'll tell me about 0-60 when he talks about performance. He's an order taker, that's about it.
Go Bluejays.
Joe W.
Where's the advantage again? I know , I know, the whole universe seems to agree the WRX is ugly, and I will not be one to contradict the universe! But there are plenty of stylish sports cars and sport coupes out there, so in that respect the Z is just one of the crowd.
OK, I am done splashing cold water around, if someone wants to flame, there will be nothing to put it out!! :-)
2014 Mini Cooper (stick shift of course), 2016 Camry hybrid, 2009 Outback Sport 5-spd (keeping the stick alive)
a) the WRX is hardly svelte at 3085lb for the sedan. the 350Z is 3200-3275lb depending on configuration. I stopped at CalculusII, but I'm still reasonably sure that's around 200lb and a far cry from 500.
b) the WRX will do 0-60 in less than six seconds (about 5.7 typically) and the quarter mile in 14.6-14.8 seconds ONLY with a wickedly brutal AWD launch. it is much slower if you drive it with any mechanical sympathy, which most owners would. and if they don't, they'll be in the shop for non-warrantied repairs.
c) the Z isn't meant to compete head-to-head with the WRX. in fact, neither car really has much direct competition if you care deeply about everything each has to offer and the price ranges they occupy.
-Colin
BTW, I completely agree w/your last statement!
Stephen
BUT if your top priority is sportiness, and you are looking at price as a factor in your decision, there is still nothing out there that can beat the WRX for bang for the buck, and that includes the Z.
BTW, one of the car mag reviews I read of the WRX described the launch they did to get the best 0-60 times, and they were launching from 3500 rpm - heck, that is almost what I would normally launch from anyway!
2014 Mini Cooper (stick shift of course), 2016 Camry hybrid, 2009 Outback Sport 5-spd (keeping the stick alive)
RWD
V6
Leather
Yeah, yeah, I've heard all the babble about cloth is good for this or that...when Porsche, Lambo and Ferrari start selling cars with cloth come talk to me. Until then, real sports cars come with supportive leather seats.
As far as the Z competing with WRX ect. I don't think it's much of a stretch for people looking for performance as their top priority. I plan to take a Z out for a test once all the hype dies down. The Nissan dealer I went to is charging a 10% premium and had a big chart on the wall of all their incomming Z's, about half were spoken for. I doubt the hype will last all that long, a couple months at the most.
if you have documented proof otherwise I'll consider it. a g-tech pro is not considered a worthy instrument, by the way.
when you accelerate at maximum effort in a RWD car, the clutch and transmission see a whole lot less stress because they are being resisted by only two tires, instead of four. abuse is abuse, no argument there, but 2WD vehicles by nature can take much more of it.
-Colin
As far as the Z competing with WRX ect. I don't think it's much of a stretch for people looking for performance as their top priority. I plan to take a Z out for a test once all the hype dies down. The Nissan dealer I went to is charging a 10% premium and had a big chart on the wall of all their incomming Z's, about half were spoken for. I doubt the hype will last all that long, a couple months at the most.