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Comments
Price still seems steep.
Larry
They are a dealer and accepted my Subaru bucks... so very little cash out of pocket. 8~)
Jim
thanks for replying to my clutch questions
Craig, thanks for the TSB. Was your problem with clutch shudder or premature failure? Who did you work with at SOA?
Juice, my concern is that the clutch failed at 40K (2nd clutch in the car), and it spent its first month smelling like it was burning up. Do you know if there is any way to tell if it was defective going in?
Thanks, Tom
We know that over-tightening the wheel nuts can contiribute to warped rotors.
However, does the over-tightening warp them right away, or make the more prone to warping when driving?
I haven't checked the torque of the nuts, but after having the rotors replaced again, they started feeling warped very soon after replacement.
Comments would be appreciated.
The reason I'm asking is that the wife's 03 OB wagon has recently picked up a bit of a howl that wasn't there for the last 8 months or so.
I've seen American cars that use weights and when they throw a weight it can cause everything from vibration to howling to premature rear end failure.
I looked under the wagon today when I rotated the tires and changed the oil. It looks like there's a spot at the rear of the shaft where a weight "used" to be - now its just a rectangular rusty spot outlined with some kind of gray material (epoxy, weld? ).
Any info appreciated.
Thanks
Larry
Second one - and it seems this was the case on my Sables is that when the rotors get nice and hot, and you quench the metal in a big puddle or two, the rotor will warp reasonably quick.
I have no idea if either of these theories is valid. I'm partial to the second one only because it seemed to line up with two of my Sables.
Larry
(one of the reasons I need my rain guards is so I can view the outdoors without the wet-window obstruction, and see what may be worthy of taking shots myself!)
"Subaru Adding Seven-Seater in 2005
The largest Subaru ever will join the crossover fray in the U.S. in mid-2005, according to Automotive News. The industry weekly reports that Subaru is planning and engineering a new model capable of carrying seven passengers atop a new car platform equipped with all-wheel drive. The power plant will be a 250-horsepower flat six. The new vehicle is said to be more European-looking, and could be priced above $30,000, the report says. The new Subaru will be built alongside other American-market models in Lafayette, Ind."
Steve, Host
Point your car at a wall from about a carlength and toss a towel over each headlight so you can see what the foglight pattern is. If you see a sharp horizontal line below which is light and above which there is no light, then they're reasonably designed. Likely not, but worth knowing before you embark on replacing them.
One factor against you is all factory lights are regulated by archaic US regulations and they probably are ineffective patterns. Another of these regs requires that you cannot use your fogs alone, which means they are useless in real fog/snow because the glare from the headlights would ruin operation of even the finest foglamps.
If they're a reasonable pattern, I'd find a way to run them without the headlamps and replace the bulb with a yellow bulb if you insist on having yellow lamps. Yellow lamps are indeed superior in the worst conditions though they often have lower output simply because making a white light yellow involves some type of filter. The most effective I've used are the PIAA Ion Crystal bulbs for amber/yellow output - excellent on snow. Also, check out rallylights.com and see the Hella Yellow Star bulbs for a bit smaller pocketbook whack.
If the beam pattern is indeed crap, then consider replacing them with a set of Hella 200FF lamps, which would fit nicely in there. I have a set and they're outstanding. Not cheap, but neither is hitting a deer or worse.
IdahoDoug
Seven passengers is great for families and such, but I'm more interested in the functionality of the ride as a multi-purpose trekking vehicle.
Are there any photos available to see?
IdahoDoug-thanks for those tips, I'm gonna check some things out that you suggested. I hadn't considered the replacement of just the bulbs of those fogs, so that may be an option.
Which reminds me...the manual suggested dealer-replacement of the fogs because they thought it a bit tricky...haven't looked at it myself, but I reckon it's nothing I can't do myself. (unless there's something technical involved that I can't foresee)
Anyway, thanks for the help again, everyone.
Like I said earlier, if they replaced your clutch with the same problematic parts, the problem was likely to re-occur no matter what -- it's a problem with the previous clutch material design and can be exacerbated by climate. If your new clutch used the revised material and design, you're probably going to be OK. My 2003 WRX had the new clutch design from the factory, and seems real strong. Then again, it only has 4000 miles and I do live in a warmer climate!
After e-mailing Patti and asking her advice, I had my parents call in to Subaru 1-800 and start a case. I don't know who they worked with there (it was a guy), but they were very impressed with the whole experience -- my Mom said the guy was clearly trying to make things right and was on top of the situation. I've also talked to people at the Subary 1-800 number, and they were very responsive, called me back to follow up, etc...
By the way, it's my opinion that you should expect to get at least 80,000-120,000 miles out of a clutch that has not been abused. This is a very simple and time-proven part of automobiles, and other than the judder issue (which affected several manufacturers by the way) clutches are pretty damn reliable. The longest I've ever seen a clutch last was 240,000 miles in a friend's very old Toyota.
Sebastian: as far as I know, over-tightened lugs start to warp the rotors as soon as the brakes heat up, but it takes continued use to really become a problem (as in weeks of normal driving). It will definitely get worse as time goes on. If you were able to re-torque your lugs soon after you got the car back from the shop, you'd probably prevent the whole problem.
I have to take my WRX in for a state inspection next week, and they usually pull a wheel to look at the brakes. I plan on installing wheel locks, so I'll do it and re-torque all the lugs after the inspection.
Craig
I have a 2002 OB 5spd, 25k miles. It's always had the classic "ticking" sound when cold. But over the past 2 weeks or so, the ticking has sounded closer to rattling when first started in colder weather and after about 30 seconds it's down to the usual ticking. The ticking is now more pronounced, that is when the temp is 45 deg outside, it ticks like it did last year when it was 15 deg.
Now today, once the engine warmed up fully, I noticed that when I accelerated through the gears the engine got LOUD. Only when accelerating at 1/2 throttle or more. But it wasn't ticking, it was like it might sound if the engine had 100k miles on it or like there was a small hole in the exhaust or something like that. Very light acceleration was fine. I have an appointment to bring it in to the dealer on wed, but I don't know what to make of this. I've never had a subaru before, but I've always done maintenance on my cars myself. Any help in educating me on this would be appreciated!
Sebastian: with overtorqued lugs, I think you could warp the brakes rather quickly if you did any hard braking or the rotors warmed up during a long down hill stretch. It's hard to say.
-juice
Don't understand your statement "Only people who live in NYC drive with all the windows up all the time."
I have no idea what it means, either. I didn't say it -- it was just part of something said by someone else and to which I was responding. I was responding to the part about the lack of availability of window vents/guards.
K9Leader
Come to think of it, now that I live in the suburbs I still ride around w/ the windows up (or cracked). I guess I crack the window more in the suburbs - less chance of someone walking up and....
LOL!
I miss driving in the city! Driving in the suburbs is so boring. I always tell my wife I'd like to retire as a livery driver in the city... She says I'm nuts...
Ralph
Given that, I also believe it is conceivable that one could warp a set of rotors rather quickly, possibly even during just one outing in the vehicle with the lug nuts over-tightened, under the right conditions. This probably depends on how tolerant the rotors are to the effects of heating/cooling (as some certainly do seem worse than others).
There does also seem to be a common belief that one should avoid braking hard just prior to parking a vehicle then applying the hand brake, to avoid not only rapid cooling but uneven cooling.
Craig
When I changed the oil, I filled the oil to be between the 2 notches on the dipstick. Almost exactly 50/50 between them. Usually I have ended up right at the top because it takes less oil than I expect (my last car was a 6cyl Dodge Shadow). After 2 weeks of "rattling" I decided to add a little more to bring it to 25/75 (closer to the high mark, obviously). This morning, there was less chatter on start, but now I have the other sound. On further thought - could it be that some connector on the exhaust system is separating when hot? Are there any spring-loaded connections on the exhaust system? Such that when I increase the exhaust pressure, it forces the expansion open and I hear the new noise? Maybe it's not related at all, but just coincidental that it happened today.
I use and have always used 10w-40.
As for the fogs... on my 01 Legacy they are not too difficult to remove. You have to fiddle with the splash guard in the wheel well to get access to the bolts. But other than that they are easy to pull. I was going to replace mine with Hellla MicroDE fogs but have yet to get around to it.
bit
Steve
Very disappointing, given that the clutch which burnt out spent its first month smoking and smelling. Also, disappointing, because the DSOM offered to warranty the clutch against premature failure. Finally, disappointing because Subaru fails to acknowledge the large experience of clutch problems, reported on this board, on Vmag, and on archived discussions over the last 2 years.
I cannot recommend this car, or its support, any longer.
TA
Once again, I'm sorry we could not help with this situation. As I've posted before, I do not think it's appropriate to post the details from our records. If you are not clear on the reasons for the denial of assistance, you can call the Rep. at 1-800-SUBARU3 for more information.
Thanks.
Patti
While the noise might not be indicative of a future failure, it can't hurt to have the check it out. If you run into a problem with doing that, please call 1-800-SUBARU3. A Rep. can work with your dealer to make sure everything is checked appropriately.
Thanks!
Patti
-juice
Patti
-juice
Greg
nygreg - I'm from upstate and agree that NYC has a relatively low crime rate. I've had the misfortune of being to a number of cities, but NYC and Chicago seem the best to me. Mexico City was absolutely frightening.
Driving around NYC is probably scarier, knowing that Paisan is pulling a trailer at 80 plus out there, LOL.
Steve, Host
-juice
But times do change. Tokyo and Osaka have felt the ill effects of the Asian economic downturn. I was saddened by some of what I saw last year. And in the mean time, Rudy G. and a strong economy lifted NYC to unprecedented heights. No, they are not at the same level, but in the past few years I have taken pride in showing off the city 80 miles south of my home.
Sorry for the way off-topic ramblings.... My OBW is doing just fine, thank you....
Steve
I re-adjusted the fogs on my WRX and the wifes Legacy GT, and they have much better patterns than most of the junk sold out there today as "fog lights". Of course if you go with a good Hella, it might be better, but try aiming the OEM lights first. The factory fogs have plastic lenses that might be a little more forgiving of rocks.
steve - Driving in NYC is nothing compared to MXC (IMHO). I've been to both recently and MXC is scary. You have to stop at the lights even if they're green. Even the taxis stop there (not the green VWs). A relative of mine had a co-worker's car robbed and then stolen while he just barely got away himself. No thanks.
OBW status: got it back from the dealer.
1. The valve tensioner belt was loose, causing the excessive noise when cold. Sounded normal again this morning.
2. The "exhaust noise" was caused by the air filter housing being seated incorrectly at it's bottom connection (my fault). Service manager diagnosed this on the spot when I told him about it.
3. Recall went fine.
4. They checked my brakes and replaced the front pads because they were worn. This was not at my request, but was quite cool of them to do.
No charge for anything. Well done by them. Very friendly service staff (and a cute cashier).
What dealer do you use? Sounds like they are on the ball.
Craig
-juice
2001 LLBean just turned 50K today!!!! Flawlessness (new word)continues (knock on plastic wood).
Ralph
Steve, Host
The oil filter and drain plug on the other hand could not be placed in a more friendly location.
Greg
So, not power steering? Wheel bearing - but sounds like metal scraping on a rotor? Happens when not braking.
Anyone with similar experience???
Thanks in advance,
Ralph
HTH, Owen
Ralph
Are the rear pads still in good shape?
Craig
In this case the sound usually seems to be more noticeable in places like parking lots, while going slowly and turning sharply which can bring the rotors just a wee bit closer to the backing plates and produce more noise.
A visual inspection of the rotors will clue you in rather quickly if this is the problem, and if so you can easily chisel away the loose scale. Of course if the rust appears to be affecting enough of the rotor(s) that it's expanding underneath the edges of the pads, you'll want to consider obtaining replacements.
The foreign object lodged beween backing plate and rotor idea is a good one too, I've also experienced that myself. Best thing to do is pull those wheels off and take a look. If you're lucky something may be easy to spot, and perhaps you can even hear the scraping while turning the rotor manually so you can pinpoint it's origin.
Going to get my wheels rotated & balanced (free) tonight or tomorrow night and hopefully something will fall out so I can avoid a Sat. appt with Subaru. Or, maybe the rear pads are worn enough to scrape when cornering - I hear it when cornering in the parking lot as slickdog commented.
As I called Subaru today it dawned on me that the 2001 Beaners honeymoon is finally over at 50K miles. Not a bad run so far (on it's way to 200K)...
:-)
Ralph
Ralph,
The metal to metal sound you are experiencing in your brakes may be the metal wear tabs on the pads contacting the rotors, particularly since the mileage is at 50,000+. Most brake pads are designed that way as an early warning so the rotors won't be scored by excessive pad wear. Pull each wheel and check to see if you can find the offending pad...it should be very noticable. Hope this helps!
Sirfile