No, I didn't necessarily think I would be getting a good deal for $99. Just curious as to how it could be done. My thought was that it would be a promotional gimmick for the opening of their 8 stores. That in 2 or 3 months the price would raise about $30.
I had my front rotors turned a year or so ago for around $30. I believe my Buick dealership charges $249 just for a front brake job. Anyhow, thanks all for the input.
Years ago in Memphis there was Bill King Brake-O, then it changed to Value Brakes...advertisments say "Best Warranty" in the business. So, 10 years or so ago when we had a first year Nissan Quest van, time to do the brakes. So, I stop in there. turns out to get the warranty you had to sign up for and get a brake fluid flush every six months. Plus they recommend replacing this and that which bumped it up to closer to $400 for the $99 job. I insisted on the $99 special but they did want me to sign the waiver that there was NO warranty without the brake flush. I was planning on trading with the year so I did not really need to have the warranty, but left with a real bad taste for some of those places that all but lie their ads.
jipster, I hope it didn't come off that I was being harsh to you. I tend to generalize my statements sometimes for everyone's benefit and sometimes it may seem like it is directed at one person.
It sometimes bothers me that some of these "chain" places run these specials and all these people go in thinking they are getting a great deal, until the $99 special turns into $600. Only to find out that they could have had a quality shop do a quality job for around the same money.
I'm not saying all chain places are bad, there are exceptions. The key is to find a quality place that gives you personal attention.
Oh, that's okay... no problem on your post. A good possibility the "Brakeway" stores are as wbrown described. I generally don't mind someone trying to sell me something extra, as long as it is something I need. The problem is unless one is fairly knowledgeable about car mechanicals and systems, they can get taken for a ride.
My Mazda dealership was running a $19 oil change special a month or so ago. They tried to sell me the 30k service while my van only had 28k. But, they didn't try to pressure, trick, or put a guilt trip on me into buying it... or anything else extra, so no problem.
Exactly. When you take advantage of a "special" you go in there "heads up" and pick and choose only what you need.
If I had an old work truck or some such, I might use a chain store to slap on some pads or shoes; but on my primary car, which I tend to drive with elan, I want every inch of stopping power, so I'm either going to tear it down completely and do it myself (yes, including braided brake hoses, etc) or take it to a friend's specialty shop.
Nothing worse that not having those few extra feet of stopping power when you need them.
Brakes are just about the one thing no owner should "skimp" on if he can afford to do otherwise.
Got a 20 year old beater that appeared in my driveway. Runs OK but the brakes feel "soft". The car will stop but you don't feel any "grab" to them and the pedal goes almost to the floor. If you pump the pedal it gets firmer. I'm thinking master cylinder. What else should I be looking at?
2019 Kia Soul+, 2015 Mustang GT, 2013 Ford F-150, 2000 Chrysler Sebring convertible
If I personally picked up a 20 year old beater, assuming it was running okay (and I wouldn't immediately be throwing money away), I would do a brake job on it.
New calipers and new brake pads, if the rears were drums...new brake cylinders and shoes.
If the rotors were gouged, had hot spots on them, or if I had detected a pulsating while stopping...I'd replace them as well.
I clean out the master cylinder reservoir, and then fill with new brake fluid and purge/bleed all the lines.
This might cost you 100-200 in parts (which is comparatively peanuts), but you would now know you had all new stopping power and have confidence in the vehicle. You also wouldn't have to be going back into the brakes for a number of years.
Air in the system would be the most likely cause of your soft brakes, and either purging the lines or this brake job would resolve it. If after these new maintenance parts you still had softness, then you could replace the master cylinder. You could replace that as well, but I've owned a number of very old high mileage cars, and have never had to replace a master brake cylinder. I know they 'do' go bad, I've just never have experienced it personally.
I second kiawah's suggestions but my logic dictates that if you have air in the system, you have to do more than bleed the brakes, as this only corrects the symptom, not the disease. How did the air get in there?
One way to test the master cylinder is to disconnect all the brake lines going to it and install brass plugs in the holes where the lines went in. Then pump up and bleed the master through these little plugs (by loosening them one at a time). If your master pumps up and stays firm after bleeding, you can assume it's okay.
Being the first part of the system, by determining that you have a good master cylinder, you can look elsewhere with confidence that you've eliminated one item entirely.
Thanks for the info. Someone had suggested air in the lines. The car has evidence of recent brake work so it's more likely that you're on target. The only master cylinder I've ever had go was on my old pick-up with over 200K on it.
2019 Kia Soul+, 2015 Mustang GT, 2013 Ford F-150, 2000 Chrysler Sebring convertible
You really don't know what was done in the past, and how well they did it. They could have replaced something and not bled the system correctly/completely. Some teenager replacing a part for the first time on the cheap, may have no idea what he was doing....and got it to the point that the brakes work, not necessarily working correctly.
check rear wheel brake adjustment. this controls most of the pedal travel if the rears are drum style brakes. also check rear wheel cylinders by pulling cup rubber to see if there is fluid present. does the car stop without any pull left or right.
I have a '00 Tundra with a front brake problem. The problem starts with a loud squealing noise (front left) when backing up (brakes applied) in the morning or after work. After I put the car in drive the truck the brakes don't make any noise while driving or braking, but I do notice a vibration at about 60 mph. I first inspected and replaced the rotor and brake pads thinking I had a warped rotor. No change. I also had the tires rotated and re-balanced. No change. Then I replaced the caliper assembly with pads. No change. Finally, I replaced the brake hose, thinking I had a collapsed hose. No change. After I changed the brake hose I put the truck on jack stands and tried to rotate both front tires. The left tire was difficult to turn and only rotated once (i.e, it felt like the brakes were applied). The right tire turned freely (6 - 10 times) before stopping. What is causing this? Could the brake master cylinder be bad?
my guess would be a sticking caliper if it's not spinning when at rest.
The vibration at 60mph is that under braking or when just coasting? If it's when you are coasting it may be unrelated.
The squeeling you hear when backing up may be due to rust that builds up on brakes when your vehicle sits for a few hrs. It's the pads clearing off the rust on the bare rotors.
This will be a long post, so if you are not interested, please go on.
In 2005 we purchased a brand new Dodge Grand Caravan. About 17500 miles, it started making a VERY LOUD moaning noise, whenever we were driving slow, like around a drive through at a restaurant, whenever we made a slow left turn, or when we were coasting to or from a stop. It is loud enough to get bystanders attention.
We took the van in, and the techs thought it was the rack and pinion, they replaced that,it wasn't. Then we were told it was the power steering, and even though it was under warranty, we were told to flush and refill the power steering, it did not stop the moaning.
It has been in for other repairs, like ABS going out, ABS sensor going out, and just last Friday, they replace the rear wheel bearings, and the half shaft broke, while I was leaving my driveway, which they had to tow. There have been other things, but, the moaning is still there. We have 20 minutes of recordings of the moaning. It can happen when we drive 10 miles, or it most definately happens when we drive for over an hour. The service guys have refused to ride with me 2 times when it happens, I have made a beeline to the dealership when it is really bad, but when they try to duplicate it, without letting me do it, they say it doesn't happen, and I don't believe them when they say they can't, because it happens every time. Yesterday, I took all the recordings to the dealership again, and mind you, my warranty expired Saturday.
The service manager said there is a problem with 1 in a 100 T&C's, Dodge GC'S and Chrysler Sebrings making this noise, which he now says could be the whole braking system, and Chrysler Dodge will not authorize what could be up to a $4000.00 repair. This noise happened again today, when I passed a garbage truck, that had stopped, and I swung into the other lane, and it MOANED!!!!! All my friends hear it when the are with me, the dealership manager is stumped, and they have run me until my warranty has expired. Has anyone ever heard of this.
Now, take a drive with me...... I drive for say 40 minutes, to the nearest large town, doing sometimes 70 MPH on the interstate. I get to town, stop at a store, spend 15 minutes, get back into my vehicle, get on the street, go to the first stop light, and as I am coasting to a stop, the car makes a loud moaning from the rear. I stop far behind the vehicle in front of me, then when I inch forward, with each wheel revolution the van makes a loud moaning noise.
I then go to a drive through, and while I am inching through the drive through, the van is moaing, loudly. :mad:
I get back on the road, and at every single light, the van moans, it is hot outside, the van is hot, and moaning. ( I am thinking i could sell the sound effects for adult movies)
I get back on the 4 lane highway home, exit, and on the exit, as I am slowing down, I have pressed the brakes, let them off, the the van is moaning. It happens all the time.
Has anyone EVER heard of this. :confuse: I have 20 minutes of recordings of this, I have had the van in 7 times, and they won't fix it. :sick:
the dealership manager is stumped, and they have run me until my warranty has expired.
Well, if you have work orders/repair orders showing that the vehicle has been into the dealer for this problem before the warranty expired, then it is considered an "ongoing" problem and should be covered under the warranty, as the problem occurred before the warranty was up and was never resolved. They are still on the hook for it, provided you kept the documentation.
That being said..................... You stated, as I am coasting to a stop, the car makes a loud moaning from the rear. Your vehicle model came with rear drums or rear disk brakes. Since you said the noise came from the rear, I am assuming that you have rear drum brakes.
Can you tell which rear brakes you have?
I know this may sound odd, but if they won't warranty it, the my suggestion would be to find a reputable independent shop and pay them to do the diagnostics on it (set a price of $100 or so) and have them go for a ride with you. If they won't go for a ride with you to see what the problem is, then find another shop. But to be honest, I don't know very many indy shops that won't. If they hear the problem and can tell you what their diagnostics are for $100 or so, then you are money ahead. Explain to them you are battling a warranty issue. They may help you out with it.
But be sure if you do, that you set a limit on diagnostics and for goodness sake, make sure it is noted on the work order that you sign. Make it noted that if the diagnostics proceeds past X amount of dollars, that they must get authorization to proceed.
Thanks for the response. I have 5 work orders right here in my hand, stating the problem, and that it was not resolved, starting at 17879 miles, until the very last one, at 35968 miles, unresolved, so, that is at least one good thing. Now, to find a shop that will help.... Thanks for your help.
Are you talking about bumper to bumper? This one has the 3/36, BUT it ALSO has the 7/70 powertrain, which if I sold it, would be transferable to the new owner. I talked to the dealership, and the only warranty they sell, is a 7/70, bumper to bumper, for $1400.00, but, if they can't fix something during the original warranty, another one won't do much good. In my state, I can't file under the lemon law, because the problem had to start in the first 12k miles, or be in the shop for 30 days, and this started at 17500k miles, so, I am up a tree no matter what. I think I have a :lemon: , but, I am stuck. Thanks for your reply.
Yeah, I was talking about bumper to bumper. But, I had forgotten about the 7/70 on the powertrain. If it seems fairly reliable besides the brake moaning, I would stick with the powertrain warranty. But, $1,400 for 4 more years of bumper to bumper protection sounds pretty decent as well. Good luck, and hope they can correctly diagnose the moaning.
If you have drum brakes on the back, then my first thought would be that one of the shoes is sticking when released after being applied and rattling against the backing plate or vibrating against the drum. I didn't go back and read your original post again, but has anyone done a visual inspection of the rear end to look for potential problems? It sounds like from your post that the problem is related to braking, so that's kind of the tack I'm taking here. I have a classic MGB that, just occasionally, on one of the drum brakes on the back, it will stick when the parking brake is released. I don't know if it's the cable not releasing or a weak return spring or someting else, but it makes a noticable "moan" when the car is moving slowly. My solution is to rock it back and forth a little until I can hear mechanical clunk when it releases. Someday I'll get industrious and fix it.
I copied this from Dodge, Grand Caravan SXT ($26,995) is powered by a 3.8-liter V6 and comes standard with four-wheel disc brakes with ABS, low-speed traction control, 16-inch tires and aluminum wheels, so I guess that means there aren't drums in the back???? :confuse:
I am at a loss, and literally do not want to drive this, considering the half axle broke while pulling out of my driveway, (I know, different areas, but leaves me with little trust)and now they can't diagnose this noise, that has lasted about 20k miles.....
Thanks for your response, but, they replaced both rear wheel bearings last Friday, which was attempt number 7, at trying to stop the noise, and it did not work. We have driven the van 3 times since then, and recorded the sounds, just like they were before the attempt was made. We are baffled, because they say describe the noise, we did better than that, we recorded it, and there is still no diagnosis...... Thanks for your suggestion, but already done.
As I said before, find a good shop. But since it is disk rear brakes, did they replace the rear rotors with the new updated rotors or did they just turn them? If they didn't replace the rotors, then there is a Service Bulletin #05-002-05 for pulsation (which would cause a growl) and the cure was to replace the rotors with part# 05019981AA This is something that they should have attempted a long time ago. I am suspecting that either this is the problem or you have a rear suspension problem.
Usually on rear disk, the cause of a growl/chatter/groan is most often either a loose caliper, cracked or warped rotor or loose rear suspension.
Thanks for the TSB tip. I had searched those from a pay website, but the service tech did not pay attention to me when I showed them what I found, but, I have printed your response, and will take my van back to them again Monday, and this time, talk to the dealership manager, again. I am pretty much treated like a dumb woman when I am in there, even though I helped restore my first car from the ground up, (engine, paint, upholstery) and I used to drive a semi......just a dumb southern blonde......they think!!! I guess I will have to rent space in there pretty soon..... Thanks so much, and I will let you know what happens this time!!!
They will try and tell you that the TSB is for steering chatter and what not, but it affects the rear brakes and is something that should have at least been checked out.
My Explorer has a brake pedal that when pushed will sink toward the floor a bit then give me great braking. The braking during the sinking part is minor and only slows me a bit. The problem is if I need to panic stop.... My mech replaced the master cylinder and this did not change anything. He tried all he could think of with no result. Does anyone have a suggestion as to what to do?
Mechanic blew it. It's the power brake booster, not the master cylinder most likely. A bad master cylinder would not recover part way down. Probably you have to press a bit harder than usual as well?
yes I have to push harder, then when it recovers I have to let up or lock up. Any sure way to Know it is the power booster? and could it be an easy thing like the vaccuum hose to the booster?
Well you might disconnect the vacuum booster for a moment and see if the pedal acts normally....i mean, it WILL be much harder to push but you could determine if it continues to "sink" or not with the booster disconnected.
Sure, a loose vacuum hose could cause you grief.
You might also check to see if you have abnormally low brake pad wear. This might cause the brake pistons to push out much further than they usually do, and that might affect pedal feel.
I agree with Mr Shiftright. The symptoms sound like a vacuum loss, which could be the vacuum hose from the intake to the booster or a likely suspect is the vacuum booster check valve (the plastic piece that pushes into the booster and the hose connects to it).
The check valve is about $8 or so. Check the condition of the vacuum hose and see if there are any cracks. If the check valve and the hose are not the problem, then get a hand vacuum pump, hook it up into the port the check valve goes into and see if the booster holds vaccum. If it does not, then the booster is faulty.
I had the mech replace the power booster & I replaced the check valve. The vac hoses seem to be in good shape. The brakes still do the same thing. small response under emergency slam then as the pedal goes down, I get braking. At low brakes it will lock up if asked. Frankly we are both stumped. anyone have any insights? Thanks all
it maybe if you have a high mileage engine that you have low vacuum available. have noticed perhaps when climbing a grade or under load that you air conditioning changes from vents to defrost or floor air.
Okay presuming the engine is producing proper vacuum and presuming the vacuum lines have all been individually tested and sealed----then I'd look for a crimped brake line.
Seems like air in the lines I had a car recently that I flushed and by accident I allowed the master cylinder to run dry during the flushing proceedure, I sucked in air. I took it for a test drive and had the same exact problem you are describing. I had to reflush the whole system and then the braking was proper.
bench bleeding is a good idea. with the replacement of the master cylinder one would think the tech did that. but if he didn't or did it improperly that would explain a lot.
What I would do is get some ATE Superblue brake fluid, which will be a different color than your current (probably clear or yellowish) and flush that through, when you get a full blue showing at each bleeder then you will know you've replaced it all.
For a bleeding proceedure which is time consuming but one of the most failsafe methods is to use a bleeder hose into a container with a 1-way valve or a container with some brake fluid in it already with the hose submerged. Then have someone pump up the brake pedal and hold it while you crack the bleeder, let them push the pedal to the floor w/o pumping it, when they hit the floor have them keep it there and let you know, then close the valve and let them pump it up hard again. Repeat this and make sure to keep checking the resivoir to make sure you don't run the master cylinder dry.
I'm new to this forum and I'm not sure if this the correct place to share my Problem.!?
I just couldn't find my truck Model under the menus...! Anyways; I have a toyota Pickup truck 4WD SR5 1991 with Extra Cab.
I have this Problem starting out of the blues driving I get this light on my dashboard "Rear Anti-lock"
When I got to work turned it off and after I came back to go home turn it on and no light was on.
After Couple days later on I got the same thing.so I did the same thing when the first time.
Started happing more often until now that this light doesn't go away any more no matter what, it's there all the time.!
But, the worse thing, it's that now if I drive my truck with that light on after few minutes driving starts to hear this anoying noise like some cracking metal and if I stop and don't use my truck for a day then it will be fine, but after few minutes of driving the noise comes back
????????????
Any ideas how can I fix this ABS Brake system light and make it go away and shut off the horrible noise....!
What's going? What's the problem??
Any help will be really appreciate it. Thanks in advance
So, I hope this forum is close enough. In brief: The plastic cover for my rear brake lights has simply fallen off. I'd normally have to buy an entire brake light assembly to replace it, but instead have tried the local junkyards with no luck.
Ideas? FYI, this is a '02 Chrysler Town and Country EX.
Help!!!! I have a 99 Mercury Villager with 90K miles. No problems at all until about a month ago. Front driver side brake stuck in the braking position, and almost caught fire. We replaced the caliper, pads, rotor, wheel bearing, and even did the CV axle while we were working on it. The brakes worked fine for about a month, and then the problems started back yesterday. It has been recommended that we replace the brake line, and plan to do so. But, I have been reading online in forums and other publications about problems with the ABS Brake Pressure Modulator Valve. This is not an aftermarket part, and the dealership wants $725. If this is the ultimate root of my problem, I can't afford the repair. Has anyone else had similar experiences or can offer some advise? I am praying that replacing the brake line will solve the problem, but based on my readings, I am doubtful. Any advise would be greatly appreciated.
While ABS (Antilock Braking System) may seem like a good thing to some people and was forced upun us by some safety addicts.... there is a "dark side" to ABS.
Sure ABS tends to shield poor drivers from stupid mistakes.... but ABS also makes people drive faster than they should in many dangerous situations.
Also, if brakefluid is not changed at least every 2 years, the hydroscopic nature of brakefluid will corrode the expensive ABS components from the inside out. This makes ABS systems significantly more expensive to maintain and repair than the simpler systems they replace.
You asked for advice... You have already replaced all the components which should have been affected by overheated brake on that corner of the vehicle. There is an outside chance that the new (rebuilt) caliper is defective. But you may be faced with replacing ABS components. AND THEN CHANGE BRAKEFLUID EVERY 2 YEARS REGUARDLESS OF MILES... forevermore on all vehicles you own
My 2006 ML 350 was in for "Service B" at the dealership at 21,000 miles this morning. They called me and told me I should put $1,100 into new brakes. I know NOTHING about cars, but it didn't seem square to me. The brakes on the car are behaving fine and don't make noise. The car is not subjected to particularly harsh driving as my wife simply uses it for her commute.
I'm taking the car elsewhere to have the brakes looked at before doing anything but can anyone tell me if $ 1,100 for brakes at 21,000 miles sounds reasonable.
The OEM brake pads themselves for the front and rear of your vehicle are in the $400-$500 range. And the labor is around 3 hours, adding for incidentals and brake bleeding, you can figure between 3.5-4 hours. So, if it is a dealer doing the work, the estimate sounds about right.
Now, whether you actually need new brake pads or not, that is a tough call. If you do a lot of stop and go driving or a lot of driving in hilly areas, you possibly could need new pads.
But your thoughts of getting a second opinion are good ones.
My listing is showing the front pads List Price for OEM pads for the ML350 06 as $146 for the fronts and $144 for the rears. If a dealer takes 4hrs to change 4 pads and bleed your system, I'd be very concerned. It should take no more than 2hrs to change pads and bleed the system by trained professionals, so even at $150/hr you would be looking at $300 in labor, you should be paying around $500-600 max for a 4-pad replacement. If you are at all mechanically inclined you can do it yourself and save a lot of $. Pads are probably the easiest thing to change on a car, hardest part is taking the wheels off!
Not sure about the dollars quoted, but on my car just about every brake job rotor replacement is recommended, since the new rotors are not able to be turned, and the tolerances are so rigid. Maybe this job also includes rotors?
Comments
Yup, I use Dot 4 in all of my cars, even our domestic minivans, and I flush the full braking system every other year. ;-)
Best Regards,
Shipo
I had my front rotors turned a year or so ago for around $30. I believe my Buick dealership charges $249 just for a front brake job. Anyhow, thanks all for the input.
I hope it didn't come off that I was being harsh to you.
I tend to generalize my statements sometimes for everyone's benefit and sometimes it may seem like it is directed at one person.
It sometimes bothers me that some of these "chain" places run these specials and all these people go in thinking they are getting a great deal, until the $99 special turns into $600. Only to find out that they could have had a quality shop do a quality job for around the same money.
I'm not saying all chain places are bad, there are exceptions. The key is to find a quality place that gives you personal attention.
My main issue with chain stores is their tendency to over-sell, or sell on fear, and of course the "bait" advertising (the latter being illegal).
My Mazda dealership was running a $19 oil change special a month or so ago. They tried to sell me the 30k service while my van only had 28k. But, they didn't try to pressure, trick, or put a guilt trip on me into buying it... or anything else extra, so no problem.
If I had an old work truck or some such, I might use a chain store to slap on some pads or shoes; but on my primary car, which I tend to drive with elan, I want every inch of stopping power, so I'm either going to tear it down completely and do it myself (yes, including braided brake hoses, etc) or take it to a friend's specialty shop.
Nothing worse that not having those few extra feet of stopping power when you need them.
Brakes are just about the one thing no owner should "skimp" on if he can afford to do otherwise.
2019 Kia Soul+, 2015 Mustang GT, 2013 Ford F-150, 2000 Chrysler Sebring convertible
If I personally picked up a 20 year old beater, assuming it was running okay (and I wouldn't immediately be throwing money away), I would do a brake job on it.
New calipers and new brake pads, if the rears were drums...new brake cylinders and shoes.
If the rotors were gouged, had hot spots on them, or if I had detected a pulsating while stopping...I'd replace them as well.
I clean out the master cylinder reservoir, and then fill with new brake fluid and purge/bleed all the lines.
This might cost you 100-200 in parts (which is comparatively peanuts), but you would now know you had all new stopping power and have confidence in the vehicle. You also wouldn't have to be going back into the brakes for a number of years.
Air in the system would be the most likely cause of your soft brakes, and either purging the lines or this brake job would resolve it. If after these new maintenance parts you still had softness, then you could replace the master cylinder. You could replace that as well, but I've owned a number of very old high mileage cars, and have never had to replace a master brake cylinder. I know they 'do' go bad, I've just never have experienced it personally.
One way to test the master cylinder is to disconnect all the brake lines going to it and install brass plugs in the holes where the lines went in. Then pump up and bleed the master through these little plugs (by loosening them one at a time). If your master pumps up and stays firm after bleeding, you can assume it's okay.
Being the first part of the system, by determining that you have a good master cylinder, you can look elsewhere with confidence that you've eliminated one item entirely.
2019 Kia Soul+, 2015 Mustang GT, 2013 Ford F-150, 2000 Chrysler Sebring convertible
I first inspected and replaced the rotor and brake pads thinking I had a warped rotor. No change. I also had the tires rotated and re-balanced. No change. Then I replaced the caliper assembly with pads. No change. Finally, I replaced the brake hose, thinking I had a collapsed hose. No change. After I changed the brake hose I put the truck on jack stands and tried to rotate both front tires. The left tire was difficult to turn and only rotated once (i.e, it felt like the brakes were applied). The right tire turned freely (6 - 10 times) before stopping. What is causing this? Could the brake master cylinder be bad?
The vibration at 60mph is that under braking or when just coasting? If it's when you are coasting it may be unrelated.
The squeeling you hear when backing up may be due to rust that builds up on brakes when your vehicle sits for a few hrs. It's the pads clearing off the rust on the bare rotors.
-mike
This will be a long post, so if you are not interested, please go on.
In 2005 we purchased a brand new Dodge Grand Caravan. About 17500 miles, it started making a VERY LOUD moaning noise, whenever we were driving slow, like around a drive through at a restaurant, whenever we made a slow left turn, or when we were coasting to or from a stop. It is loud enough to get bystanders attention.
We took the van in, and the techs thought it was the rack and pinion, they replaced that,it wasn't. Then we were told it was the power steering, and even though it was under warranty, we were told to flush and refill the power steering, it did not stop the moaning.
It has been in for other repairs, like ABS going out, ABS sensor going out, and just last Friday, they replace the rear wheel bearings, and the half shaft broke, while I was leaving my driveway, which they had to tow. There have been other things, but, the moaning is still there. We have 20 minutes of recordings of the moaning. It can happen when we drive 10 miles, or it most definately happens when we drive for over an hour. The service guys have refused to ride with me 2 times when it happens, I have made a beeline to the dealership when it is really bad, but when they try to duplicate it, without letting me do it, they say it doesn't happen, and I don't believe them when they say they can't, because it happens every time. Yesterday, I took all the recordings to the dealership again, and mind you, my warranty expired Saturday.
The service manager said there is a problem with 1 in a 100 T&C's, Dodge GC'S and Chrysler Sebrings making this noise, which he now says could be the whole braking system, and Chrysler Dodge will not authorize what could be up to a $4000.00 repair. This noise happened again today, when I passed a garbage truck, that had stopped, and I swung into the other lane, and it MOANED!!!!! All my friends hear it when the are with me, the dealership manager is stumped, and they have run me until my warranty has expired.
Has anyone ever heard of this.
Now, take a drive with me...... I drive for say 40 minutes, to the nearest large town, doing sometimes 70 MPH on the interstate. I get to town, stop at a store, spend 15 minutes, get back into my vehicle, get on the street, go to the first stop light, and as I am coasting to a stop, the car makes a loud moaning from the rear. I stop far behind the vehicle in front of me, then when I inch forward, with each wheel revolution the van makes a loud moaning noise.
I then go to a drive through, and while I am inching through the drive through, the van is moaing, loudly. :mad:
I get back on the road, and at every single light, the van moans, it is hot outside, the van is hot, and moaning. ( I am thinking i could sell the sound effects for adult movies)
I get back on the 4 lane highway home, exit, and on the exit, as I am slowing down, I have pressed the brakes, let them off, the the van is moaning. It happens all the time.
Has anyone EVER heard of this. :confuse: I have 20 minutes of recordings of this, I have had the van in 7 times, and they won't fix it. :sick:
Please let me know if you have any ideas.
Well, if you have work orders/repair orders showing that the vehicle has been into the dealer for this problem before the warranty expired, then it is considered an "ongoing" problem and should be covered under the warranty, as the problem occurred before the warranty was up and was never resolved. They are still on the hook for it, provided you kept the documentation.
That being said.....................
You stated,
as I am coasting to a stop, the car makes a loud moaning from the rear.
Your vehicle model came with rear drums or rear disk brakes.
Since you said the noise came from the rear, I am assuming that you have rear drum brakes.
Can you tell which rear brakes you have?
I know this may sound odd, but if they won't warranty it, the my suggestion would be to find a reputable independent shop and pay them to do the diagnostics on it (set a price of $100 or so) and have them go for a ride with you.
If they won't go for a ride with you to see what the problem is, then find another shop. But to be honest, I don't know very many indy shops that won't.
If they hear the problem and can tell you what their diagnostics are for $100 or so, then you are money ahead.
Explain to them you are battling a warranty issue.
They may help you out with it.
But be sure if you do, that you set a limit on diagnostics and for goodness sake, make sure it is noted on the work order that you sign. Make it noted that if the diagnostics proceeds past X amount of dollars, that they must get authorization to proceed.
Thanks for your help.
Thanks for your reply.
I didn't go back and read your original post again, but has anyone done a visual inspection of the rear end to look for potential problems? It sounds like from your post that the problem is related to braking, so that's kind of the tack I'm taking here.
I have a classic MGB that, just occasionally, on one of the drum brakes on the back, it will stick when the parking brake is released. I don't know if it's the cable not releasing or a weak return spring or someting else, but it makes a noticable "moan" when the car is moving slowly. My solution is to rock it back and forth a little until I can hear mechanical clunk when it releases. Someday I'll get industrious and fix it.
I copied this from Dodge, Grand Caravan SXT ($26,995) is powered by a 3.8-liter V6 and comes standard with four-wheel disc brakes with ABS, low-speed traction control, 16-inch tires and aluminum wheels, so I guess that means there aren't drums in the back???? :confuse:
I am at a loss, and literally do not want to drive this, considering the half axle broke while pulling out of my driveway, (I know, different areas, but leaves me with little trust)and now they can't diagnose this noise, that has lasted about 20k miles.....
-mike
Thanks for your response, but, they replaced both rear wheel bearings last Friday, which was attempt number 7, at trying to stop the noise, and it did not work. We have driven the van 3 times since then, and recorded the sounds, just like they were before the attempt was made. We are baffled, because they say describe the noise, we did better than that, we recorded it, and there is still no diagnosis......
Thanks for your suggestion, but already done.
But since it is disk rear brakes, did they replace the rear rotors with the new updated rotors or did they just turn them?
If they didn't replace the rotors, then there is a Service Bulletin #05-002-05 for pulsation (which would cause a growl) and the cure was to replace the rotors with part# 05019981AA
This is something that they should have attempted a long time ago. I am suspecting that either this is the problem or you have a rear suspension problem.
Usually on rear disk, the cause of a growl/chatter/groan is most often either a loose caliper, cracked or warped rotor or loose rear suspension.
Thanks so much, and I will let you know what happens this time!!!
My mech replaced the master cylinder and this did not change anything. He tried all he could think of with no result. Does anyone have a suggestion as to what to do?
Sure, a loose vacuum hose could cause you grief.
You might also check to see if you have abnormally low brake pad wear. This might cause the brake pistons to push out much further than they usually do, and that might affect pedal feel.
The symptoms sound like a vacuum loss, which could be the vacuum hose from the intake to the booster or a likely suspect is the vacuum booster check valve (the plastic piece that pushes into the booster and the hose connects to it).
The check valve is about $8 or so.
Check the condition of the vacuum hose and see if there are any cracks.
If the check valve and the hose are not the problem, then get a hand vacuum pump, hook it up into the port the check valve goes into and see if the booster holds vaccum.
If it does not, then the booster is faulty.
Thanks all
-mike
For a bleeding proceedure which is time consuming but one of the most failsafe methods is to use a bleeder hose into a container with a 1-way valve or a container with some brake fluid in it already with the hose submerged. Then have someone pump up the brake pedal and hold it while you crack the bleeder, let them push the pedal to the floor w/o pumping it, when they hit the floor have them keep it there and let you know, then close the valve and let them pump it up hard again. Repeat this and make sure to keep checking the resivoir to make sure you don't run the master cylinder dry.
-mike
I'm new to this forum and I'm not sure if this the correct
place to share my Problem.!?
I just couldn't find my truck Model under the menus...!
Anyways;
I have a toyota Pickup truck 4WD SR5 1991 with Extra Cab.
I have this Problem starting out of the blues driving
I get this light on my dashboard "Rear Anti-lock"
When I got to work turned it off and after I came back to
go home turn it on and no light was on.
After Couple days later on I got the same thing.so
I did the same thing when the first time.
Started happing more often until now that this light doesn't
go away any more no matter what, it's there all the time.!
But, the worse thing, it's that now if I drive my truck
with that light on after few minutes driving starts to hear
this anoying noise like some cracking metal and
if I stop and don't use my truck for a day then it will be
fine, but after few minutes of driving the noise comes back
????????????
Any ideas how can I fix this ABS Brake system light and
make it go away and shut off the horrible noise....!
What's going?
What's the problem??
Any help will be really appreciate it.
Thanks in advance
Freddy
So, I hope this forum is close enough. In brief: The plastic cover for my rear brake lights has simply fallen off. I'd normally have to buy an entire brake light assembly to replace it, but instead have tried the local junkyards with no luck.
Ideas? FYI, this is a '02 Chrysler Town and Country EX.
Thank you for your time.
Sure ABS tends to shield poor drivers from stupid mistakes.... but ABS also makes people drive faster than they should in many dangerous situations.
Also, if brakefluid is not changed at least every 2 years, the hydroscopic nature of brakefluid will corrode the expensive ABS components from the inside out. This makes ABS systems significantly more expensive to maintain and repair than the simpler systems they replace.
You asked for advice... You have already replaced all the components which should have been affected by overheated brake on that corner of the vehicle. There is an outside chance that the new (rebuilt) caliper is defective. But you may be faced with replacing ABS components. AND THEN CHANGE BRAKEFLUID EVERY 2 YEARS REGUARDLESS OF MILES... forevermore on all vehicles you own
I'm taking the car elsewhere to have the brakes looked at before doing anything but can anyone tell me if $ 1,100 for brakes at 21,000 miles sounds reasonable.
So, if it is a dealer doing the work, the estimate sounds about right.
Now, whether you actually need new brake pads or not, that is a tough call. If you do a lot of stop and go driving or a lot of driving in hilly areas, you possibly could need new pads.
But your thoughts of getting a second opinion are good ones.
-mike
I think all Benzes require rotor replacement if the rotor is in any way distressed, regardless of thickness. They don't want you to turn them.