I spotted an (insert obscure car name here) classic car today! (Archived)

ab348

A local used car dealer has a "77 (I think) GMC Palm Beach for sale. It looks original and mostly unrestored but in pretty good condition - good driver condition I'd say. I wish I could find a link... ah, here you are:

Palm Beach

fintail

Nice fabrics inside :shades:

stickguy

a 2-fer close to my neighborhood.

a 1960 something ford F100 (not the 50's look, one of the early modern style ones. looked pretty stock, other than some mags and a JC whitney steering wheel.

and in a driveway, a very nice (as in, newish) looking beige Camaro rally sport. Looked like a '77. screamed 1970s.

texases

Those fabrics are pretty mild for RVs. Even the $500k ones they show being made on TV often have pretty 'unique' looks to them. Not sure why that's a requirement??

It would seem a modern version of that GMC with a 3l turbo diesel, lightweight construction, and fwd would be a neat idea. Instead, 35' class Cs with V10 gassers...

fintail

A couple from the other day I just remembered: a "shoebox" 49 Ford Tudor in 50s hot rod style, turn signal stuck on, and a Corvette Stingray 63-67 - couldn't see it close enough to determine but it was that light yellow Chevy used then, unusual color for one.

toomanyfumes

Problem with those older motorhomes is most of the time they've just sat through most of their lives. My brother-in-law bought one out of state on Ebay a few years back. Probably 25 years old, on a Chevy van frame. Every time he's used it, it's ended up on the side of the road. Electrical, carburator, belt or hose, dry rotted tire, you name it.

andre1969

Back in late 2000, I found a 1973 or '74 (memory's getting fuzzy) Travco 220 motorhome that I wanted to buy. It was only $2900, and actually ran well (rebuilt industrial 440). But I just picked up a bad vibe from the thing. For one thing, its tires were dry-rotted, and they were an odd 17.5" style, and were on something called a "split rim". Now for $2900, what do you expect, but thankfully, I decided to pass on it.

Honestly at this point, if I ever get the urge to go camping, I think I'll just do it with a car and a tent. Or stay in motels!

texases

I got close to making the same kind of mistake when living in Anchorage - looked at new ones ($$$$), then thought 'How bad could a used one be?'

Answer: very bad! Looked at several, then just decided to rent. Near-new, no breakdowns, no payment, no storage $$. Best of all worlds.

lemko

explorerx4

remember this version?

lemko

The urban assault vehicle from "Stripes." I remember going to the movies with my brother and Dad to see "Stripes" when it first came out. Dad reminded us that the real army wasn't like that after the movie was over in case we we entertaining any thoughts of enlisting.

ab348

Another fuselage, this time the top of the line, a '71 Imperial. Note the rear seat heater concealed in the trunk. Not sure why you'd want that in Florida though.

Not Green At Least

explorerx4

maybe oil and transmission leaks?

uplanderguy

That's probably my favorite front-end styling of any '70's Imperial. Nice car. I wish they'd have used a different instrument panel than standard Chrysler though.

toomanyfumes

Yeah, I thought the same thing. Nice looking car, but the dash is pretty plain. I remember one of my parents cars having a blower to defrost the rear window like that Imperial, I don't think it worked very well

andre1969

I might be having false memories, but I think my '69 Bonneville had a blower in back to defrost/defog the rear window. I don't think it worked by the time I owned the car, though (1992-1996)

The dash is pretty plain, but at the same time, it's also fairly clean and non-tacky. I remember the Lincoln dashes of that era being kinda gaudy, while Cadillacs were getting plasticky.

Chrysler was fast running out of the resources to differentiate the Imperial, and I seem to remember some of the period advertisements actually admitting that the car couldn't keep up with a Caddy or Lincoln when it came to performance, and trying to focus on luxury. I think one of the ads said something along the lines of "if you want a drag racer, go buy a Cadillac or Lincoln, but if you want luxury, come to Imperial". Not too many people were won over though, and I don't know that it really made for better "luxury" than a Caddy or Lincoln. They were nice cars, though.

ab348

Lots of cars had blower-type rear window defoggers back then as the wire grids on the rear glass were just coming into popularity and the blower type was a cheaper though less effective option. This one, though, is allegedly a full rear seat compartment heater core, not just a rear defogger. That must have been getting pretty uncommon by then. I imagine if it developed a leak it must have been a pain to fix.

Comments on the Imperial vs Chrysler were valid and echoed even at the time. I remember C&D did a review at the time and said something like "despite everything it still smells like a Chrysler inside". The Imperials were generally better handlers than the other two luxury brands thanks to the torsion bars up front but had the smallest engine and was not quite as luxurious. Looked good though.

andre1969

The Imperials were generally better handlers than the other two luxury brands thanks to the torsion bars up front but had the smallest engine and was not quite as luxurious. Looked good though.

I'd love to see a comparison of a '76 New Yorker Brougham (essentially an Imperial), a Lincoln Continental sedan, and a Cadillac Sedan DeVille. By that time, the 440 was choked to 205 hp, while the Lincoln's 460 was 202. The Caddy 500 was down to 190, but if you got optional fuel injection, made 215.

I'd imagine even though the 440 was competitive in hp, it still might have lost out because of having a bit less torque than the others? And I'm sure fuel injection and the extra 25 hp really helped the 500's performance.

Motortrend did a flagship comparison test in 1980, pitting a Seville with a 368, a 5th Ave with a 318, and a Mark VI coupe (can't remember if it had the 129 hp 302 or the 140 hp 351), and the Seville actually did fairly well, with 0-60 in around 10.6 seconds. I think the Lincoln came in around 11.1, which makes me think it had the bigger 351. I remember MT said the new 4-speed overdrive helped a lot, because Lincoln shortened the axle from 2.50:1 to 3.00:1, versus the older 3-speed. The poor Chrysler, with only 120 hp, came in a distant 3rd with a 0-60 of 14.1 seconds.

I imagine the Seville and Mark VI would have been faster than those mid-70's mastodons, even with the torquey big blocks. I always thought it was a shame that the Chrysler in that test was stuck with the 318. But MT did say that was all they could get. A 360-2bbl with 130 hp was optional, and I've seen some sources say you could even get the 185 hp copcar engine in them, but I imagine they were pretty rare.

fintail

Had the old beast out today, saw a few old cars. Saw a ~65 Riviera, white; a pretty silver blue 65 Mustang - the driver gave me a friendly wave, a 50 Ford coupe, an early 90s Alfa with the hardtop that belongs only to that era, and a MB W113 SL, probably a 230 by the way it sounded. Stopped by a high end car dealer and saw a 70 911T, a 79 911SC (somehow it worked very well in dark brown), a decent looking W140 S500, SL and CL 65, and a 99 Bentley Arnage. Took the modern car to get some gas, and a teenager beside me in a first gen Lexus ES was all over it, thought it was a wonderful car...it's 9 years old but still getting a few looks.

bhill2

I've got a question. You said you saw a W140 S500. Isn't the W140 the one from the late '80s (e.g. my trusty 380SE)? In that case the car you saw must have been a 500SE or 500SEL.

fintail

W140 is model years 1992-99 in this market - the slab sided Russian mafia car. The car I saw was a 1997 model.

Your 380SE is a W126, a more durable car.

bhill2

Thanks. I've stored that. You're right about it's being durable; 260K and purrs like a kitten. Partially due to maintenance by a truly superb mechanic that we found (Tom Leko at V.I.P. Auto Center in Thousand Oaks CA if it's of use to anyone).

fintail

I think those cars will last forever if taken care of. The 126 cars were the pinnacle of MB quality - incredibly overengineered, state of the art when new, timeless. I wouldn't mind having another one someday.

bhill2

The 126 cars were the pinnacle of MB quality - incredibly overengineered, state of the art when new, timeless.

You have hit a button with that. Even at its advanced age, the sound of one of that car's doors closing is something that you won't experience in almost any new car, as is the feel of the switches, knobs, and other controls.

fintail

Here's my pretty old 126. Looking like it was brand new in 1989, but pic was taken in 2003 when it had maybe 170K on it. It aged amazingly well inside and out.



On the obscure front, I saw something odd today - first generation Camry. Diesel. Sounded like a MB 240D - nice and clattery.

bhill2

When I lived in Richland (WA) I almost bought a 2 year old 300D from the dealer in Spokane. I decided not to because I didn't want to drive to Spokane to get it serviced. I found out later that there was a mechanic right in Richland that Mercedes owners from all over Eastern Washington came to for service. DAMN!!

kyfdx

You name it, I saw it...

MG club came through town.. "Rally to Reno".. Quite a few of them were going to make it coast-to-coast, so they started in Ocean City, MD on Saturday morning... After Reno, where they have their national meeting/rally, they are going on to San Francisco.. They were in Cincinnati to stay on Sunday night...

Now..that's dedication.... .and, a lot of repair work going on in the hotel parking lot.. :surprise:

Some anomalies... one guy couldn't get his car ready, so was doing the trip in a Porsche Boxster.. another in a Z3M roadster.. Quite a few had little trailers made from the rear end of another donor MG.. One trailer had a tap next to the right tail-light.. Turns out it wasn't for show.. had a keg set-up in the trailer.

Interesting... but, no way I would drive an MG that far... Most were shipping the cars home, but some will just drive back... A couple of them drove over 1500 miles, just to start from Maryland..

fintail

Did that area not have a MB dealer then? I actually grew up in that region - I remember Spokane and Yakima had dealers, but I don't recall seeing one in the Tri-Cities until the early 90s - however I never lived there. I spent most of my pre-high school youth in Yakima and Moses Lake - the latter had a surprising amount of MB on the streets given the distance from any dealer. My first exposure to a W126 was there, an off white 300SD that smoked a lot for its relative newness.

bhill2

I was there in the late '70s and there was nothing resembling a Mercedes
dealer in the area. I later bought a VW from the dealer in Kennewick in order to have something that could be serviced locally. That dealership also sold Audi, so there was one of those.

fintail

Moses Lake actually had a VW dealer back in the day too - I remember seeing the new 1985 Jetta there. I am pretty sure it is long gone now - way too small to support a dealer like that. I spent a night there last year to check out my old memories - the place has changed a lot. I also remember the AMC dealer there - as my dad wanted an Eagle once, vetoed by mom, of course. Not a good era to buy an Audi! :shades:

I remember when I was a kid, I always looked forward to going to Yakima or Spokane to see more diverse cars (and going to good toy stores), or a trip to Seattle where I might see a late model Porsche or Ferrari.

bhill2

Yes, when I bought the VW I initially was looking at an Audi 4000 but decided against it, for all reasons because it only took unleaded and I was afraid of shortages. I briefly considered An Audi 5000, but decided it was more car than I needed. I hope my guardian angel got the stiff drinks that he needed after that one. The VW, a Scirocco, was actually a good car.

fintail

When I was a kid in ML, a friend of the family had an early 80s 4000...I bet those had a short life expectancy. I wonder where they got it serviced out there...maybe at the VW dealer.

I also remember a few years later someone had a 4000 2-door sedan, an animal almost unknown today.

halsworthy

flickr image by afiler

I love these cars, they are everywhere in Eastern Europe. Useless as cars but are so plucky you can't help but like them!

fintail

I like how they sound and smoke like a chainsaw. Ring ding ding ding, as the Germans say. A Trabi would be fun as an around town beater, and yes, loads of them are still on the road.

imidazol97

I saw a '61 Chevrolet bubble top on I-70 flying along.

That's the two-door hardtop with the narrow pillars, BelAir Sport Coupe, in this color.

berri

I always liked the 61 Chevy and Pontiac. I liked that bubble top Bel Air, unusual car since you usually see that roofline on an Impala. it kind of looks like the rag top may also be a Bel Air.

imidazol97

The convertible is a Bel Air. I picked that picture for the color because it is a Bel Air instead of an Impala.

ab348

That is a rare thing, but this one is just... bizarre:

3 on the tree, Armstrong steering & brakes

The person who ordered this must have been nuts. I can imagine the chagrin on the production line when this came through. I cannot imagine that Chrysler built more than a handful of these - to the point where one wonders why they did the engineering for the standard trans and non-power steering and brakes ion the first place. I wouldn't buy this car at any price even if it was near-perfect.

Mr_Shiftright

Too bad the body isn't good--if it were, you could take a donor car's power steering and brakes and transmission and make one good car out of it.

Probably this baby is ready for the parts bin.

andre1969

I wonder how hard it would be to handle a car that size with non-power steering? The only rough reference point I have is my '68 Dart, which had broken power steering, which should require even more effort than manual, as it still had the quicker power steering ratio, and I think when the fluid drains out, the pump might actually work against you and make it even harder to turn.

I briefly owned a 1967 Newport that had non-power brakes. It actually didn't require much effort to stop. And even more telling, before me it belonged to a petite little old lady, who had owned it since 1971!

And yeah, it does seem odd that by 1970, Chrysler would even bother to build a Newport equipped like that. But, a stripper Fury or Polara would have been a bit more common, so maybe it made sense to offer it with the Chryslers as well? Still, that late in the game I'd think a 3-on-the-tree would have been limited to 6-cyl cars and smallblock V-8's. Chrysler's big-block used a different bolt pattern than the small-block. Maybe the manual shift tranny used some kind of universal bolt pattern?

BTW, I have some of those hubcaps like what that '70 is sporting. My grandparents had a Town and Country wagon for a short time, and I think that might be where they came from. I had one of 'em on my '79 New Yorker for awhile, after it threw one of its hubcaps on its way to a car show.

andre1969

I didn't think Chevy offered a Bel Air convertible after 1957? Well, if you want to get technical, the '58 was a "Bel Air Impala", but according to my old car book (which has been known to be wrong), the convertibles were either Impala or Impala SS after that, at least until the SS went away, and then for '73-75, the convertible moved to the Caprice trim level.

Mr_Shiftright

I think the phrase "driving Hell" would be the operative. Bolt a steering wheel to a tree and try to turn it.

imidazol97

The convertible in the picture has Bel Air side trim. I don't find a Bel Air convertible in the brochure for 1961.

andre1969

I think the phrase "driving Hell" would be the operative. Bolt a steering wheel to a tree and try to turn it.

So, do you think it would've been worse than my '68 Dart with broken p/s? FWIW, a couple years ago the power steering started to fail in my '79 New Yorker. I'd guess that a well-equipped '79 New Yorker (base weight 3800 lb) weighs about the same as a stripper '70 Newport convertible (base weight 4085 lb). When the power steering failed, it actually wasn't bad out on the road, at higher speeds. But at slow speeds, such as parking, making a right turn after a stop sign, turning into the driveway, etc, it was enough of a pain that I topped the fluid off pretty quickly and got it off to the repair shop ASAP!

I put up with my Dart's power steering not working for about 40,000 miles. I wasn't about to repeat that in a car that probably weighed about 800 lb more, and had a steering wheel that was even smaller-diameter! I guess if I had, I'd have some pretty nicely defined arms by now...

Mr_Shiftright

Oh yeah, that heavy engine with no power steering PLUS wrestling with a balky 3-on-the-tree setup. Just think about working your way out of a tight parking space with the car pointed uphill or downhill.

andre1969

I'm starting to like those fat fuselage '69-73 Mopars more and more, but if I were to go for one, it would have to be much better-optioned. My favorite of that fuselage era is the '69 Dodge Polara/Monaco. Somehow, the styling that year managed to make them look a lot more trim, and less fat than the others. Second choice would probably be an Imperial. I love the hidden headlights.

ab348

I like most of the '69-'71 Chryslers, but my favorites are the '70 and '71 Polara and, especially, the Monaco. You almost never see those now. The big Plymouths were always my least favorite of the 3, though again '70 and '71 are preferred over the '69. Oddly, you tend to see those more often than any of the fuselage cars. Survival rates seem low in general, as build quality wasn't great and rust can kill these in a hurry if it gets into the suspension mounting sections of the unit body.

Speaking of such things, outside my house today I witnessed a late 90s Civic suffer catastrophic front suspension failure. It was making a 3-point turn using the neighbors driveway when I heard this awful sound and turned to see its front wheel collapsed into the fenderwell. I recognized it immediately as the exact same thing that happened to a coworkers Honda in the office parking lot last year. She got a quote of $2K or so to fix it due to all the structural work required and it was replaced with another car. Rust and unibodies are a bad mix.

lemko

Don't forget the SuperLight!

lemko

...light green 1972 Oldsmobile Cutlass convertible on a side street in my neighborhood.

stickguy

Big body, small bumper Mustang notchback. 71 or 72. Fair condition, nothing special as to model. Looked like a low level model survivor.