Are you a current Michigan-based car shopper? A reporter would like to speak with you about your experience; please reach out to PR@Edmunds.com by 7/2 for details.
I spotted an (insert obscure car name here) classic car today! (Archived)
This discussion has been closed.
Comments
I have to admit to liking the glassier roofline of the '61 Caddy coupes...plus, it seems like I see fewer '61's than '62's, unscientifically, which I like.
While I can't say I think they're pretty, I'd sure like to see a short-deck '61-63 Caddy at a show. Decades since I've seen one at all.
I don't know, I'm starting to find that my attitudes on finances and expenses are changing. I'm thinking about moving in the next 6 years or so, to a better house in a less crowded area with lower property taxes...but higher house prices. And, since most houses don't come with 4 car garages, I'll most likely have to get one built.
I'm also starting to get that attitude of how things start tying you down, and trapping you, as you get older, and I don't want to keep working forever. There's not just the cost of the car, but housing it, insuring it, maintaining it, etc. I'm finding that I'm pretty content these days to just go to the car shows, look at the cars, enjoy them, but, at the end of the day, be more like the grandparent who gets to visit for a bit, but then lets the "parents" deal with the major hassles of caring for them!
And I have slowed down a bit. The last time I bought a "classic" (and I use the term loosely) was back in May of 2007, when I bought my '79 New Yorker. Since then, I've only bought two cars...my 2000 Park Ave back in late 2009 when my Intrepid got totaled, and then my Ram in 2012.
I know the feeling andre, but on the other hand, I do miss owning an old car. I'm down to zero now.
A group of eleven of us went out to dinner at Tippecanoe Place in South Bend Friday night, which is the old Clement Studebaker mansion. Sheesh, were my Stude buddies trying hard to get me into an old car of any kind, mentioning low-price Ramblers and Novas. I don't want a car that I'm not really, really into just because it's an old car though. (I would enjoy a '75 Nova LN though but I don't think I've seen one since...maybe '80?!)
Here's one for you, Andre!
http://seattle.craigslist.org/sno/cto/4455865648.html
Now, don't you feel a little urge now?
I know I'm biased, but I think that makes a '60 Lark look absolutely sensuous.
I think somewhere between Andre and Uplander is the answer. I believe it is 1. Plus, you can get away with a 2 car garage (though of course, 3 spots is preferable)
2020 Acura RDX tech SH-AWD, 2023 Maverick hybrid Lariat luxury package.
Every time that I think about how close I am to retirement, I start to regret all of the money my wife spends on things that I don't care about. (patio furniture is the latest).
The things I spend money on? Necessities.. every one of them.
Edmunds Price Checker
Edmunds Lease Calculator
Did you get a good deal? Be sure to come back and share!
Edmunds Moderator
every time I go out to take care of the pool, or buy supplies for it, I realize I should have just told the family No, go to the swim club if you want to swim that bad.
the rest of the stuff? no where near as expensive! and I slowed way down on flipping cars
I did solve the retirement issue. I will never be able to afford it, so will just work until I kick the bucket. Sounds like fun.
2020 Acura RDX tech SH-AWD, 2023 Maverick hybrid Lariat luxury package.
I feel what Andre is feeling - things weigh you down. When I moved from condo to apartment, I ditched a lot of stuff. Sometimes I want to thin it out more. It doesn't help that I have a few "collections" (parents were antique dealers). But at least none take too much room
I am certain I won't get another old car - the fintail has more than enough needs to keep me going forever, and the costs of having a third car would be taxing, not to mention I don't drive the one I have enough as it is.
At least I don't think you guys have kids in college.
I have one in now and leaving in two weeks for five weeks study abroad in London, and another one who's a junior in high school now. There's no working to pay for school like it used to be; school has just gone up that much. We've gone two years of college with no loans so far; don't know how much longer that'll happen though.
I've got four undesirable cars to the enthusiast; however, no car payments (all paid with cash; two new and two used) so I'm liking that.
I want another Studebaker so bad I can taste it though.
Nope, no kids at all. (that I know of, at least.
Yeah, tell me about it. I went to the University of Maryland, and I remember tuition for the first semester, fall of 1988, was about $900, plus books. I commuted, so there was no dorm/meals/etc. My final semester, spring of 1993, it had gone up to $1500. And back then, we even complained about how much of an increase that was, as it was still a lot more than the rate of inflation. I think tuition now at the U of MD is around $5,000 per semester.
My family made too much money for me to qualify for any sort of tuition assistance, and my grades were only average, nothing spectacular, so I didn't qualify for any scholarships. My Dad ended up paying for about half of my tuition, and I covered the rest. I made anywhere from $5.50-12 per hour on average, while working. Gas usually cost around $1/gal (with the exception of Desert Storm). And my daily driver was an $1100 '69 Dart, which was replaced by a $1700 '68 Dart when the '69 got totaled.
I'd imagine that the jobs most college kids get today would only run around $8-12 per hour, which is not proportional to the rate tuition has gone up. Gasoline is more like $3.50-4/gal. And most $1100-1700 cars are probably going to be more trouble than they're worth!
Yeah, our older kid got a $500 scholarship from her elementary school of all places, and we got no financial aid whatsoever. My boss suggested I write an email and say we're considering these other colleges if they didn't cough up some kind of deal. They promptly responded that I should be flattered that they accepted my kid into their honors college. So much for that.
No kids, no complaints
I'm thankful I was able to go to school when I did - even in the late 90s, the relationship between lower wage jobs and school expenses was in a different world compared to today. In school, I never made more than $10/hr - and some of the higher pay was because the job wasn't pleasant. Even then, gas was in the $1.xx range, tuition was probably half of today or less, most other expenses likely less. I was also able to get a scholarship, a few grants, and took out loans. Today, those jobs might pay 20% more, but everything else is much more expensive. I had my old car then though, buying it at 18 as a primary car that was kind of cool, rather than a hobby car.
Oddly enough, gasoline prices seemed to go through the roof right at the time I finally upgraded to a more fuel-efficient car. In 1999, my primary car was an '89 Gran Fury ex copcar that required premium, and was lucky to get 13 mpg, in mostly local driving. I think gas bounced around from $1-1.25/gal for 87 octane, with premium usually running 20 cents more. Then I bought my 2000 Intrepid that November. I was still delivering pizzas as a second job, and estimated that the Intrepid would save about $125-150 per month just in gasoline, compared to the Gran Fury. Well, almost as if on cue, when it came time to fill up the Intrepid for the first time, gas went to about $1.39 per gallon for 87 octane. And nowhere but up from there. During that first wave, I don't think 87 ever broke 2/gal around here, but premium did.
I never did do the math, but considering how prices shot up, that Intrepid may have saved me even more than $125-150 per month. I did cut back on my driving though, going from 4 nights per week delivering, to 3. And then by the end of 2000, I quit the second job. Tried to go back a couple times, but my heart just wasn't in it. I liked the freedom more than the money.
But then, by the time late 2001 came around, and I bought my '79 5th Ave, gas had fallen down to around $1/gal for 87 octane. Of course, that wouldn't last...
The late '90s were the record low price period for gas (inflation adjusted, of course). No other time were prices lower - not the '50s, not the '60s, never. That's one reason why the huge SUVs became so popular, with gas that cheap, who cared about 13 mpg?
I remember PUG costing something like $1.10-1.20 around Christmas of 98, and cringing during the summer of 96 road trip when it was something like $1.75. Different world. That chart makes it easy to see why 70s barges depreciated to almost nothing in the early 80s. Gas prices compared to lower wage salaries would be interesting too.
Kid in college.... got that.
Edmunds Price Checker
Edmunds Lease Calculator
Did you get a good deal? Be sure to come back and share!
Edmunds Moderator
I feel your pain.
The Ohio State University changed the handling of their payment online system a few years back. In the new system they had a training site and it used the name for the person signing into the system as the parent paying the bill, "Daddy Rich."
'Bout says it all.
2014 Malibu 2LT, 2015 Cruze 2LT,
On the subject of Nova LN's, I used to see one here at work. Either an LN or a Concours...it's been awhile now and my mind is getting fuzzy. Did the Concours have a more pretentious grille, whereas the LN just used the normal grille? Anyway, I moved to another building in late 2009, and then to a different location about a mile and a half away in late 2010, so I don't know if it's still there or not. But I first saw it around 1993 I guess. Last I saw would've been 2009. It was black with a red interior, and getting a bit rough towards the end. But not so rough that I'd turn it away...
Edit: just googled, and it looks like the Concours was the one with the more upright grille, similar to a 1980 Malibu. And six taillights. So this one was the Concours then, and not the LN.
Holy crap, I just saw a late 80s Pulsar with the station wagon "attachment", like this
Can't remember when I last saw one.
Speaking of Novas, I remember when I was in school, someone who lived in the same building had a 70s Nova that I think was a hatchback.
Going to see Graduation next week. Good thing because TR&B would have been about 60K next year.
Why, yes. Yes it is. Next year and for the 6 after that...
'21 Dark Blue/Black Audi A7 PHEV (mine); '22 White/Beige BMW X3 (hers); '20 Estoril Blue/Oyster BMW M240xi 'Vert (Ours, read: hers in 'vert weather; mine during Nor'easters...)
Something kinda curious I've noticed, about Novas, and Venturas and their pecking order in GM's lineup. It seems like the Nova Concours/LN, and the top lines of the Ventura/Phoenix (LJ or SJ?) actually had nicer interiors than a Malibu Classic or Grand LeMans! The Malibu Classic didn't even have carpeting on the lower door panels. As for the Grand LeMans, I'm not sure, but I think mine might actually have the top trim level. It's all vinyl...a pretty nice, thickly padded vinyl, but still vinyl. I've seen them with cloth, and while it's not a bad cloth, it's nothing really luxurious. In those days, often vinyl was the step up from cloth, so that might have been the case with the Grand LeMans. I tend to think of cloth as the better material, so I might just be looking at this through modern eyes, where people of the time didn't always see it the same.
Now with Olds, if you got the Cutlass Supreme Brougham, that was really nice inside, so I wouldn't say the Omega Brougham was nicer. I'm trying to think how Buick stacked up. I don't remember ever seeing a really luxurious '73-77 Century, but then they had the Regal for that so maybe the Century was usually more basic because of that. I don't remember any really ritzy Apollos or Skylarks, either. There used to be a brown Skylark at work though, that was pretty nice. It was a 4-door with a beige vinyl interior. Nice vinyl though, in those days where leather was still reserved for the ultra-elite, or at least a Cordoba!
A similar thing started happening at Chrysler, so maybe all of this was a bit of the Granada effect, as people started going for more luxurious small cars. The Valiant Brougham and Dart S/E were decked out really nice, but didn't really catch on. Then there was the Volare Premier and Aspen S/E (or Medallion?) that were really nice, but may have overlapped some once the LeBaron/Diplomat came out. But, with the midsized Coronet/Monaco and Satellite/Fury, it seems nicer models were few and far between. I seem to recall seeing a Coronet Brougham, or something like that, that wasn't too bad, but it seems like they were putting more effort into their smaller cars at the time. Might not have been a bad idea though, as Chrysler usually depended more on compacts than GM did.
I think the Malibu Classic had nice standard seat trim, with a 'tuck and roll' thing going on, and fold-down center armrest, and cloth trim on the doors when you got a cloth interior. That said, the Nova Concours was 'pimpier' in my opinion--more luxurious seat trim but sadly, things like wide wheel opening trim, wide side moldings, etc., too. I really like the LN--simple trim outside, and wide bucket seats in cloth in all models, with upgraded trim around the instruments, etc., and a console; cloth trim on the doors, and a map pocket. I think the four-door still looks good today. I don't like the four-door GM midsizes at all during that era.
http://www.curbsideclassic.com/wp-content/uploads/2012/03/75-Nova-LN.jpg
Looked at a 1984 Buick Grand National, 41,000 original miles, nice #2 car, no mods, pretty original clean car but not "show".
'84 was I believe the first year for the GN. This year car, and the '85, are not as valuable as the '86, because the later has improvements such as an intercooler---hence, more power.
The intercooled models are pretty quick for an 80s car. Listed horsepower was 235 but most people seem to think they were closer to 300.
I valued the '84 at about $15K.
So is the Mercedes R-Class a dead duck now? I saw a black one, R350, and I swear it looked like a hearse.
R has been gone in the US since 2012. It is still sold in some markets, like China.
The best or maybe only one to have is the R63 AMG, maybe 30 were sold in the US (there's 2 in my area - a real obscure sighting).
@MrShifty Edmunds had a later GN for a year until about 6 months ago.
yes an '87 model. They got pretty good money for it, too.
I'm holding with my current fleet; the Mazda is now close to being truly fast, the ti is being freshened up at the BMW body shop. and the 2002 is continuing to appreciate. I also like having zero consumer debt(not counting a couple small 0% APR loans).
Just have to find a newer Euro car for Number One Son...
Mine: 1995 318ti Club Sport-2020 C43-1996 Speed Triple Challenge Cup Replica
Wife's: 2021 Sahara 4xe
Son's: 2018 330i xDrive
I was exploring google earth now that it includes every place I lived when I was a kid, and spotted this sad old thing:
This is located across the street from where my dad bought his 60 Ford. I remember this Chrysler being there back then, around 1990 - probably in the same spot. Looks like it is sinking.
shame that people let things go so far. Still, there might be some tasty bits on there to restore other similar vehicles.
Those '55-56 Mopar products were pretty stout cars, although not as rust-resistant as the '49-54 models. So even though it's looking pretty rusty, a lot of that might just be surface scale. However, being a 4-door car, I doubt there are too many people who want to bring it back from the dead. If it was a '57-58 Mopar, it would probably be collapsing on itself by now.
Agreed, andre. Generally, people just don't want to restore four-door-with-post cars. I always thought those cars looked chubby.
Went to our daughter's orchestra concert last night and saw a guy with a "Mopar or No Car" shirt. I laughed as I hadn't seen that before. I'm probably out of the loop, though.
I think "Mopar or No Car" might be so old that it's gone out of circulation! I knew a guy who had that attitude, back in the 1990's. He happened to be driving by, in a pale blue '63 Fury sedan one day as I was putting the DeSoto in the garage, when I lived at my Grandmother's. I think I only had it about a month, maybe even less at this point. He pulled up into the driveway, struck up a conversation, and before I knew it he was spewing rhetoric that would make Archie Bunker blush. Among that, I remember him saying that if he saw someone with a Japanese car that had broken down, he'd stop, tell them they should have bought a Mopar, and then drive off laughing.
The dude was such a Mopar die-hard that he got an attitude with me when I mentioned I bought a '67 Catalina! Eventually though, I think his tastes changed, because one day in early 1998, in a parking lot, I saw him get out of a '69 Impala wagon. I remember the timeframe, because I almost hit him with my Mom's '86 Monte Carlo when he walked off a curb right in front of me without looking. I blew the horn at him and he looked at me kind of douchily, but then we both recognized each other.
Ran into him a few years later, maybe 2004, at a local classic car show in Rockville, Maryland. I asked him if he still had any old Mopars, or any old cars. He said no, that his family drove nothing but Toyotas these days, because the old cars kept breaking down! D'oh!
But then, I did run into him a few years later at a classic car show in Macungie, Pa, and he said something about a 40's Pontiac woody wagon he was having restored.
Ahh, it's just 'surface rust'...
Probably mostly surface rust - a testament to the gentle climate here, but after sitting outside for maybe 30 years or more, it'd be a chore to remove. Floors and trunk are likely gone, too. Another car where you could invest 40K to get 15K in return.
I seem to remember the guy who had the Chrysler also having a white 66 Toronado at the same time. And around the same time, I remember a 52 or so Chrysler that was always parked on the street in my neighborhood - in decent condition for something that lived outside, but like Andre says, those cars were durable. It was black, and I think might have had gold emblems.
We may have discussed this before, andre, but my very favorite Mopars are:
1) '68 Plymouth Satellite Hardtop. Not GTX, not Road Runner, not Belvedere, but Satellite. I think it's the ''65 Impala' of Mopars...proportions, lines, just right, has stood the test of time; wheelcovers and emblem placement just right, and so on. I used to see many around my hometown in that pale light green metallic that was almost silver.
2) '69 Dodge Coronet 500 Hardtop--for a lot of the same reasons as above, but I love the three horizontal lights in back.
3) '64 Dodge Custom 880 2-door Hardtop. Nice full-size.
4) '64 Plymouth Sport Fury hardtop--nice lines, nice four-pod instrument panel.
5) '65 Chrysler 300--maybe my favorite full-size Chrysler
6) '65 Barracuda....really showed what a Valiant could be! Love the huge rear window. There used to be a red "Formula S" around Kent, where I live now, with those wheels that looked like 'chrome reverse' but I think they were factory...really sharp IMHO.
I realize that all of the above are surely indicative of the years I was a car-crazy kid.
And who could forget the 'Hemi Under Glass'??
shame that people let things go so far. Still, there might be some tasty bits on there to restore other similar vehicles.
Surface rust can be difficult to remedy. The best method I think is chemical dip.
sinking.
You aren't going to believe this but, yesterday I spotted that EXACT SAME 1955 Chrysler turning into Costco in Issaquah! Same color combo!
Only this one looked perfectly restored or MINT original!
I'm thinking it was the same car only perfectly restored?
A good Studebaker friend sent me this Chevy for sale. So much for my liking offbeat stuff--this is the best-selling full-size Chevrolet model year ever, but this exact car makes me weak in the knees:
http://www.mecum.com/auctions/lot_detail.cfm?LOT_ID=SC0514-183267&entryRow=255
I used to have an office in Doraville, GA, where the car was built, and three of my Chevy vans were built there. It's closed now.
Up, I am not at all a big American sled guy, but even I like that one.
2020 Acura RDX tech SH-AWD, 2023 Maverick hybrid Lariat luxury package.
I've always felt there just isn't a bad line anywhere on a '65 Impala.
Well, it is Evening Orchid, or whatever that color was called, so that makes it offbeat in a way. Apparently, that color wasn't very popular, and I think it may have been a one-year only thing? I think the '65 Chevy is one of those few cars that looks just about perfect from every angle. And they have a look about them that, IMO at least, looks youthful, hip, and sporty, yet upscale at the same time. In contrast, I don't think the Ford quite pulled that off in '65. I think it got the upscale part nailed down, but was a bit more conservative. And the '65 Plymouth, had sort of a tough, rugged, don't mess-with-me look about it. But it didn't pull off "sporty" as well as the Chevy, nor "upscale" as much as the Ford.
And, even though they were popular cars when new, I don't see an over-abundance of '65 Chevies at car shows, so they still catch my attention.
I doubt it. Come to think of it, a year or two ago, the car lot at the SW corner of NE8th and 116th had a Chrysler in that same bodystyle. I bet you saw that one - like you said, how many of those can be around.
Right now I am just a couple miles from the car I posted - maybe tomorrow I'll drive by.
That Impala is gorgeous. I like that style in a silvery blue, and I think I once saw one in kind of a burgundy metallic that looked nice.
Supposedly wags used to say, "The '65 Ford is the box the '65 Chevy came in"! LOL
I do like '65 Fords, but the '65 Chevy, to me, is nearly a work of art.
I think you're right, which was too bad. The pictures in the listing don't do the color credit. In reality the car is pretty spectacular in that color.
2009 BMW 335i, 2003 Corvette cnv. (RIP 2001 Jaguar XK8 cnv and 1985 MB 380SE [the best of the lot])
That is a one-year color. Pontiac called it 'Iris Mist'.
I can still remember the Assistant Principal at my elementary school had a '65 Impala Sport Coupe, 327, in Evening Orchid with black interior. He parked it on the street and even then I'd just stare at it. His son was in my class, somewhat of a motorhead, and we talked about ten years ago at our reunion and he was amazed I could remember that car.