I spotted an (insert obscure car name here) classic car today! (Archived)

fintail

So if retail is 20K it'll bring 25K on BaT?

Fried eggs.

kyfdx

texases said:

That's a lot of fake wood, isn't it?

That's the Texas Cadillac option....

benjaminh

Some pages from the 1938 Pontiac brochure....

texases

I'd like to see one of those station wagons today, up close - all that wood!

fintail

Convertible sedan and wagon both would be insanely rare today, maybe double digits in survivors, at best.

benjaminh

Some pages from the 1939 Pontiac brochure....

benjaminh

1940: "The massive grill is gleaming chromium..."

benjaminh

For me these brochures have the weird affect of almost making me want a new 1940 Pontiac. I guess I'm a sucker for the work of Madison Avenue. But GM was producing a nice car for this era with the Pontiac. For just a little more than a basic Ford or Chevy it does seem like a nice car for that time....

fintail

I believe my grandpa's first car after the war was a 39-40 Pontiac. I only recall seeing distant rear quarter images of it (a sedan) some time ago, and my grandma, usually sharp as a tack, has no memory of such details of a used car from 70+ years ago. I think her primary old car memory is nixing the idea of a bullet nose Stude.

Mr_Shiftright

Seat belts? Nope. Air bags? Nah. Power steering perhaps? Noooo. Cruise control? Automatic transmission? Back-up camera? Bluetooth? Power brakes? AC? No, no, no, no and no.

Good grief! How did these people ever survive?

omarman

I'll have another "famous Scotch Mist manifold" please.

explorerx4

@omarman,
HA HA, I was wondering if anyone else noticed that.

texases

I'm confused - the pistons "are made of the same material as the engine block"? Cast iron?

ab348

Yes, I believe the Pontiac pistons were indeed cast-iron slugs. Their flathead six was not the greatest performer.

Today while on the highway some distance out of town I spotted a VW Rabbit pickup, restored nicely. It was sporting a gleaming orange metallic paint job, aftermarket wheels that suited it nicely, and appeared to be lowered. Tooling along the highway at 70 mph with the windows down, youngish guy behind the wheel. I always liked these and they are very uncommon in these parts today.

texases

I can't tell you the last time I saw a mk I Rabbit, much less a pickup.

benjaminh

For 1941 a power convertible was available. And "Scotch Mist" returned....

texases

Hats, hats, hats...how times have changed. Wonder how many were making hats back then.

Mr_Shiftright

This was before grown men dressed like toddlers.

Wow--three people across in one seat! Now you need a Maybach to do that.

omarman

benjaminh said:

For 1941 a power convertible was available. And "Scotch Mist" returned....

I like the name, "Pontiac De Luxe Torpedo Convertible Sedan Coupe."

ab348

I think I might have a bottle of Scotch Mist in the back of my liquor cabinet.

bhill2

Mr_Shiftright said:

Seat belts? Nope. Air bags? Nah. Power steering perhaps? Noooo. Cruise control? Automatic transmission? Back-up camera? Bluetooth? Power brakes? AC? No, no, no, no and no.

Good grief! How did these people ever survive?

I find myself curious. I know that the automatic transmission became available to the car-buying public in 1940, and I think AC debuted shortly after WWII. However, when did power steering and power brakes come on line?

benjaminh

1947....

benjaminh

1949....

benjaminh

1950....

benjaminh

1952....."Built to last 100,000 miles.":

xwesx

Wow! 100,000 miles! How generous!

As far as PS/PB, my 1969 Econoline has neither. My 1969 C20 has power steering... and it is heavily boosted, at that!

ab348

bhill2 said:

I find myself curious. I know that the automatic transmission became available to the car-buying public in 1940, and I think AC debuted shortly after WWII. However, when did power steering and power brakes come on line?

According to Wiki power brakes came along in the late 1920s/early 30s on high-end models. Power steering made its debut in 1951 on Chrysler products..

benjaminh

1954....Power steering and power brakes available optional at extra cost....(You can double click on these images to read the text, which explains the Pontiac "philosophy.")

fintail

That material makes me think of how some buyers must have been a little irked by the heavily updated 1955 models.

kyfdx

I didn't even have power brakes on my '70 Galaxie 500. (or, A/C, for that matter)

fintail

Thinking of my dad's old Fords:

68 Fairlane - no PS, no PB, 3 on the tree. Fun to drive if you like a workout.

66 Galaxie - PS, PB, automatic

60 Country Sedan - I think it had PS, but no PB. Automatic.

No AC on any of them, because 1960s cars in the PNW.

The fintail, which has dual circuit power brakes, power steering not as overboosted as a period domestic car, along with 4 speed auto, fuel injection, etc must have seemed like the future even with its quickly dated styling.

Mr_Shiftright

This was before grown men dressed like toddlers.

Wow--three people across in one seat! Now you need a Maybach to do that.

fintail said:

That material makes me think of how some buyers must have been a little irked by the heavily updated 1955 models.

1955 was a break-through year for the American auto industry. It was a virtual leap into the "modern automobile"---vivid colors, short-stroke V8 engines in the most "common" of cars, slab-side styling, power options for Everyman and some serious performance. Sure, there were individual pioneers here and there in the early 50s, but in 1955 everybody got on the train--the jet age--a bright new future. Everyone forgot about the dumpy styling of the immediate postwar era.

You could still buy a flathead engine here and there, but they were mighty scarce by 1955.

Pontiac was regarded as an old lady's car in the 40s and early 50s. Those brochures depicting women in evening gowns is....pretty silly.

benjaminh

1955 Pontiac engine brochure....

ab348

Much to my surprise, saw a Lancia Scorpion in the lot of a local indy car repair shop today, red as many of them are, and looking in very good, possibly restored, condition. While these are likely rare pretty much everywhere, this was quite surprising since they were not sold new here and I don't think I have ever seen one here before.

stickguy

street parked outside wildwood, a nice red and white AH 3000. Looked real clean.

texases

I got a laugh out of the '55 Pontiac's "Pressure-Suction Crankcase Ventilation" - they were very proud that all noxious crankcase fumes were quickly vented to the atmosphere, to protect those "delicately machined parts!" cough..cough...

Mr_Shiftright

ab348 said:

Much to my surprise, saw a Lancia Scorpion in the lot of a local indy car repair shop today, red as many of them are, and looking in very good, possibly restored, condition. While these are likely rare pretty much everywhere, this was quite surprising since they were not sold new here and I don't think I have ever seen one here before.

A seriously flawed car, but kind of interesting. Sort of a bigger Fiat X1/9. I think they were sold new here, 1976-77.

Michaell

Not spotted, but goodness, where would one get this fixed?

ab348

Michaell said:

Not spotted, but goodness, where would one get this fixed?

My first reaction is to say it is unrepairable in North America. Possibly in Japan too but who knows. But maybe I am wrong.

All that said, it is a seriously cool car, great looking, especially inside.

benjaminh

sda

benjaminh, Thanks for the car brochure postings. I really enjoy reading them. Dad had a black '59 Catalina coupe with red interior when my parent's met. Later he had a '71 Catalina 2dr hardtop with Rallye II (?) wheels, vinyl top, a/c, auto, ps, pb , 350 2bbl as a company car later to be replaced with a '73 Catalina sedan with vinyl roof, a/c, auto, ps, pb, am/fm stereo!, 400 2bbl. While I was in college dad bought a used '73 Grand Am 4dr sedan, auto, ps, pb, a/c, cruise, am/fm with rear speaker, Rallye wheels, for my sisters to drive. Meanwhile I drove a '76 Pontiac Sunbird with V6, 5sp, ps, pb, a/c, luxury interior, Rallye wheels. I was sad to see Pontiac and Olds get the ax.

fintail

What I think when I see a 55 Pontiac:



(One can see the paint and chrome have been muted, along with the windshield removed, to prevent camera glare. This was a new car at the time).

Apparently these have a lot of room inside:



I'd take that Eunos to my local dealer and nonchalantly ask about work just to see the reaction.

Mr_Shiftright

Michaell said:

Not spotted, but goodness, where would one get this fixed?

Possibly a Mazda rotary specialist could handle some of it, but the electronics would be a bear.

Only for the few....the brave....the chosen....

ab348

I have always thought that the styling of the '55/'56 Pontiac was decided unattractive.

Mr_Shiftright

ab348 said:

I have always thought that the styling of the '55/'56 Pontiac was decided unattractive.

I agree. it reminds me of an older person trying to dress young. Doesn't work.

andre1969

I don't think power brakes really became "mandatory" until front disc brakes became more popular. I once owned a 1967 Newport, that had been owned by a little old lady before me. It had power steering, but manual drum brakes. It wasn't that hard to stop. And think out it...if a petite little old lady could drive that ~2 ton car for close to 30 years without having issues with the brakes, then most people wouldn't.

But, I've driven power disc brake cars with no assist...it wouldn't be the assist that went out, but rather, the car itself would stall. Once the vacuum reserve was gone, they could take a bit of muscle to slow down.

As for power steering, it's a necessity these days with nose-heavy FWD cars and wide-profile tires, not to mention the relatively tiny steering wheels. But, I don't think a lot of those old cars, with their narrow bias-ply tires, larger steering wheels, etc, were too bad. Plus, the manual steering had a different ratio than power, so while it took more turns of the steering wheel, each turn was less effort. Of course, the larger the car, the more necessary it was...but then larger cars tended to more expensive, and more likely to be equipped with it.

The last time I had to drive a car without power steering was my '79 5th Ave, which probably weighs about two tons. It started failing while I was up at a car show in Carlisle, PA back in 2011 I think. I added fluid, but it kept leaking out, and on the trip back home, it totally leaked out. Out on the highway, it wasn't even noticeable. About the only time it was a pain was if I had to make a really sharp turn from a dead stop. But that's when you give it a little gas first and then whip the steering wheel. Fortunately, I didn't have to parallel park it with the power assist being gone!

bhill2

Mr_Shiftright said:

Michaell said:

Not spotted, but goodness, where would one get this fixed?

Possibly a Mazda rotary specialist could handle some of it, but the electronics would be a bear.

Only for the few....the brave....the chosen....

One interesting thing about that one is that you could (presumably) get it with a three-rotor engine. Were any other production rotaries offered in a three-pack?

fintail

The weird little gills or intakes above the headlights on those Pontiacs bug me. Also a rust nest, I bet.

I remember the manual steering on my dad's 68 Fairlane was fine once the car was moving, but could be a chore when parking.

explorerx4

I'm still waiting for a Pontiac I think looks decent, but we are getting close.

omarman

The weird little gills or intakes above the headlights on those Pontiacs bug me.

lol I never noticed before. My friend would say, "She's got no edges!"