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Lexus is especially good at making the Toyotas and Lexus different enough to justify price and market adjustments. The larger the car, the more likely it shares a platform with a Toyota from that market or in another country.
To further confirm my statement, we can see from the recently released concept models from Lexus (LF-S, LF-X [sometimes calls the HPX] and LF-C) Lexus is trying to let the public know that Lexus is not going to introduce new models that are derived from Toyota models.
As for the engine's Lexus/Toyota is developing right now. It is quite a mystery. Because recently we have seen the new 3.0L V6 with 246hp come out in the 2006 GS concept and also the new Crown. However, if they already were able to successfully replace the old 200-210hp I6 with this new V6 (better performance) why are there still news about a 3.5LV6? The hp difference would most definitely not be significant (at most a 20-30hp difference) as they would not want the hp to reach as high as the V8's. So, why would they want to introduce another mid-size engine when a brand-new one (3.0L V6) had JUST been made?
*FYI: What is certain is that Toyota/Lexus is going to use different engines for different drivetrains (3.3L V6 is solely made for FWD Toyota/Lexus vehicles, and the coming 3.0L V6 and/or 3.5L V6 is going to be used for RWD vehicles)
The Crown "concept" (it was a car that has been in Japan for many yrs and is being introduced in North America for the first time as the Japan model is being redesigned for the 12th time).
No question the new GS and new Crown will share SOME parts, eg: transmission. But the main focus Lexus is trying to start on is that no more Lexus models will share the same platform as Toyota models and this is true in the case between the new Crown and the new GS. There are still some similarities between the 2 vehicles but to consumers the difference will be more significant. As, the image of Crown is a luxury sedan whereas, the GS is a sport sedan. The Crown will have much much more interior luxuries such as an 8-inch colour moniter, rear-seat comfort features, etc and it will also be much heavier than the new GS is its handling will not be as precise and accurate as the sporty GS. On the other hand, the new GS will be much more sportier, and have better handling and perfermance compared to the Crown. So, if you look carefully at each car, you can slowly see the many differences these cars have.
I even think the new RL is a lot nicer than the M45. But everyone likes different cars and that's why there are lots of them.
I'm not talking about the gloria knockoff tha infiniti has had here for the past year or so but the car they unvieled at the NY auto show.
I guess I can make that call based on features and specs right now I will sit in and drive both but on paper and pictures the lexus falls short. I would love owning a lexus but their autos are too tame and have no soul. Same is true of Acura drove the TL and while the interior blows the G35 away the driving sensation left me cold. Right now Nissan, Mazda and the dreaded BMW are the only ones making interesting cars. I guess you can add the fact that I am driving a vehicle based on the same platform and have been extremely happy with it.
BTW, the M will have wood. Go check out the infiniti site.
But it's good to see lots of choices. It simply makes all the players that much better.
I think the new M45 is gorgeous inside and out, although I prefer the interior of the GS slightly over the new M45.
oh, can't forget about the new STS. Could be another hot car.
So I don't know how one can say GS resale will be MUCH higher than M. That's in the past. Is the resale of ES/IS MUCH higher than G35. They might not be higher, period, and certainly not MUCH higher!
BTW, Carlos Ghosn is determined to bring Infiniti to Europe. The holdup is Nissan currently doesn't have a V6 diesel, which is needed in Europe and won't be ready until 3, 4 years from now.
The Lexus ES330 has expected retained value of 70% and 49% of MSRP after 2 and 4 years, respectively.
The Infiniti G35 has expected retained value of 65% and 48% of MSRP after 2 and 4 years respectively.
Saw the new GS today at NYIAS. 100x better in person than any picture I've seen. Very agressive, progressive styling that seems more akin, in my eyes, to the first generation. The light grey had a hint of baby blue to it from some angles in the show lighting- very appealing.
It really wasnt Renault that made Nissan what it is today, but rather Carlos Ghosn singularly, using Renaults cash.
The resale stats just prove my point. The new Nissans are neck and neck with Hondas and Toyotas in resale value.
Schweitzer (Renault chairman) and Ghosn decided to bid for Nissan because its strong engineering just needed capable management to turn it around. So Nissan revival is a product of Nissan product development, management from Ghosn and Renault seed money. Nissan actually is a much bigger company than Renault and much stronger in engineering.
mariner7 I actually prefer a Bimmer or a Benz but everytime I buy my cars I end up w/ a LExus bec. it's just a better buy & still have a real lux badge car . I have not accepted Acura's yet for the reasons I've stated above. Infiniti's gone a long way but I've had bad experience w/ Nissan's & so are my relatives who had once in their life tried Nissans. They like me ended up going back to Honda's or Toyota's. The current Nissans 350Z, Murano & even the Altima are great cars but they have an issue on built quality. Take the Murano for example. I looked into that to get my wife a cheap (vs. the RX 330 that she wants) replacement for her Sienna. That SUV has small rattles & squeaks. I tried the new 4Runner, solid as a rock on bumpy/rough roads, no squeaks or rattles. I don't know if it's due to the 4Runner being RWD. Even Edmunds, I noted had the same comments that I encountered on the Murano. In 96, I bought the Pathfinder, 1st year the current body style. My gosh that SUV's suspension had thumping sound when it hits bumps. That SUV thank God my job back then was walking distance from the NIssan dealership. I had the car for 3 years & it was in the shop at least 10 times for repairs. This is why I don't trust Nissan/Infinitis just yet. I admit that they're doing well, one of the good things they've done is by getting rid of that old G20. By doing that they're cars re now priced in the $30's & they now deserve to be a lux badge.
By the way, I know Nissan's a bigger company that Renault but who's got the $$$.. I was also shocked when I learned this years back, that Renault bought Nissan, I thought it was the opposite....
1. It has never been confirmed by Lexus that the LF-X will become reality. That is pure speculation at this point.
2. The LF-S was the concept for the production 2006 GS, not the IS. Of course, since Lexus will have new styling cues some of what you see on the LF-S will most likely make it onto the new IS sedan.
3. Not all Lexus models will offer all-wheel-drive, although most will. Certain models, like the SC 430, will not.
1. The LF-S was NOT the concept for the 2006 Lexus GS. As they do not share any similar design cues or shapes. The LF-S is most likely be a concept for the next IS. The reason the LF-S was not a concpet for the 2006 GS is because when the LF-S was designed, the final blueprints of the 2006 GS were already sealed and confirmed at Lexus, which is why the 2006 GS seen in the recent auto show do not show the significant noew design direction Lexus is taking.
2. Yes, all models of Lexus WILL offer all-wheel drive as an option. There is absolutely no reason that this cannot be made possible by Lexus.
All Lexus models will not offer AWD. Why in the world would they offer AWD on a SC430 convertible?
The LF-C shows the design direction for the next IS300, not the LF-S.
1. "The LF-S was NOT the concept for the 2006 Lexus GS"
You are incorrect. The LF-S is most definitely the concept car for the 2006 GS. When they were designed has no bearing. The fact is the LF-S was introduced to the public about three months in advance of the GS as a teaser. Denny Clements, the Lexus GM, has stated this. If you still don't believe me, check out any magazine and they will say the same thing. For one example, here's a link to Automobile magazine. Note the last sentence: "The LF-S portends the next-generation GS sedan."
2. "As they do not share any similar design cues or shapes."
You are incorrect. The LF-S and GS share many design cues. Go check out a topic at clublexus.com from mid-January in the GS forum called something like "LF-S and GS together." The cars are shown together and the similarites are very clear.
3. "the 2006 GS seen in the recent auto show do not show the significant noew design direction Lexus is taking."
You are incorrect. The 2006 GS does show the new styling direction. From Denny Clements recent speech at a Morgan Stanley Automotive Conference:
"In addition to greater product diversity and technology, a second step in our evolution of the brand is a new, more passionate design direction...Arriving early next year, the GS will be the first production vehicle from Lexus to benefit from this passionate new styling approach."
4. "Yes, all models of Lexus WILL offer all-wheel drive as an option. There is absolutely no reason that this cannot be made possible by Lexus."
You are incorrect. Denny Clements has again stated that most Lexus vehicles will offer AWD but some will not. The SC 430 was one example he gave. No competing luxury two-seat convertibles offer AWD (like the Mercedes SL and BMW 6 Series) and Lexus will not either. It is possible but it will not happen.
Am I the only one that noticed that the new GS and the new Audi A6 look almost EXACTLY the same from the back? Whats up with that?
vs this picture:
you dont see it?
It will look good from some angles on the road. But there are some odd parts that just don't make a cohesive form. And, as of right now, no innovations ahave been introduced to set it apart fro the competition. So I have to stay with my Thumbs Down.
Lexus GS wasn't the only one getting a luke-warm reception! The STS and M45 (2006) also proved mediocre at best.
I thought the STS would be bigger, but is similar in size to the Acura RL! From what I've seen, it'll be a good value, as far as pricing goes, but shouldn't get many headturns.
Could easily be mistaken for a CTS! And that ain't good.
The M45 was nice, with an Ivory interior, but the exterior was very round, and lacked any surface tension to catch you eye. I'd expect 10-15k sales at best a year.
The RL is probably a better car than all of them, but I reserve judgement until I see it on 17's. And it looks like a modified TL, no a $50k car. You can tell just by looking at it it's a V6. Very nice, safe styling, but doesn't say "Gotta Have It!".
I think the Germans have taken a firmer hold on this segment. But the new A6 has disappointing rear end styling! Very cold and flat. But from the front I did mistake it for the A8 with the new Corporate grill. That's a good ting!
Sat in the 545i. The cupholders are particularly strange! But I have always liked the design AND styling. Looks aggressive and even slightly Japanese in the headlights!
I think the next Lexus IS will be BIG! Lexus will sweat this car and make it a winner. I think they really are committed to getting it right.
I think the new Audi grille is wretched. Otherwise, the A6 seems like it will be a better entry at the price than the BMW. Both the Bimmer and the Benz E suffer from heavy overpricing. There was a Benz E320 4Matic at NYIAS that was $60,000 +. Sorry, but if I had the money, Id give up some cachet and wait to see the AWD entries from Lexus, Acura, and Infiniti.
I took a look at the E500 4matic as an alternative to an SUV for my wife, but it approaches $70,000! Not only that but it gets like 15mpg. No thanks, she gets an RX400h.
drfill, there's a reason STS is not that big, it's built on the same platform of CTS. I read M35 is built on platform of the next, not current, Z. I don't know if that's true or not. It wouldn't surprise me if RL is built on same platform as TL, hence its relative small size.
Don't next GS and IS share same platform?
I wonder what will happen to the Deville. If Cadillac really plans to establish themselves as a BMW or M-B alternative, they need a car that can compete with the S and 7 cars. The current car doesnt exactly do that.
lexusguy, I suspect a big reason Deville sells well is because of its inexpensive FWD platform that's been amortized a long time ago. If they decide to build it on a brand new RWD platform, it will be much more expensive. Big gamble for GM, I'd say!
So Nissan might have only one RWD platform in the future; Honda none, discounting S2K. How many will Toyota have, two?