Lexus GS 300/GS 430

lexusguy

JDM means Japanese domestic market. The outgoing A6 3.0 might have the same 220hp as the GS300, but its quite a bit slower. Slower even than a 525i, even with only 184hp. The outgoing A6 had a gorgeous interior (what happened Audi??), better than the outgoing GS300. The problem is though its been absolutely riddled with horrible quality problems. CR lists used A6's as a "risk" on their list of repeat offenders of worst used cars. It also made the PA\NJ list of highest lemon law cases. Not qualities I generally look for in a car.

boomsama

Anyone know how long ago the Toyota Crown Royal/Athlete was released?

The next GS' seat looks a bit short too. It only looks about as long as the ES330's seat, which isnt very supportive
Is there someway to extend the seat as well?

boomsama

I looked around a bit at the next IS. It said that it would come in 2.5 and 3.5L variants. Might the GS be using the same 3.5L V6 but tweaked a bit more to make it more powerful?

lexusguy

Boomsama, your guess is as good as mine

boomsama

bit off topic...again...do any of Lexus' cars offer sports seats, ones that actually support your body and wrap around it? Not as in just big and soft.

lexusguy

Aside fom the IS, no. This whole "sport thing" is very new to Lexus, so seats with sticky faux suede and agressive side bolstering arent options yet.

maxhonda99

The 2006 GS(from pictures) looks to have big side bolsters for a luxury car.

lexusguy

like a 5 or A6 with SP though?

boomsama

The seats on the S6/RS6 have MASSIVE side bolsters.

Another thing...Are there actually two different types of sat navs that toyota and lexus use? I've got a toyota camry with sat nav, and the interface looks pretty normal, quite casual.
I took a ES300 for a test drive one day, and the sat nav was a LOT different. Well the layout was anyway. It was green and the menus seemed more sophisticated. It even had a compass and a screen that showed your longtitude and latitued.

Is the one that Lexus uses just an older version? Or is it suppose to be a higher spec, more classy version?

lexusguy

I'm sure there are some software changes for Lexus NAV screens. Though I dont really have much experience with a Toyota nav system.

lenscap

I have a 2002 ES 300 with a nav and am very familiar with it. This is the exact same system that is in the Toyotas.

However, Lexus recently significantly upgraded the nav system with much cooler graphics. For example, on my "radio" screen it is all shades of gray. On the new one you can select from 4-5 bright colors. The new system also has around five million points of interest vs. mine that has around one million. Plus, there are sounds you can program in for certain destinations (like a doorbell when you arrive home) and you can locate businesses by phone number. Note the new system is not any faster than mine (although it does not need to be).

Now, I can update my nav DVD and get the five million points of interest. But I will not get the new colors and other features because they are part of the "new" system only.

Currently only a few Lexus models have the "new" system. That includes the ES 330, LS 430 and LX 470. I believe all other models still have the "old" system. I think the new Toyota Solara also has the "new" system, while the Sienna uses the old one. Go figure.

The best way to distinguish the new vs. old system in the ES (and the Toyotas) is by the screen. My old version has three "buttons" vertically along the right side of the screen...they are part of the display and you touch the screen to push one of these buttons. The new system on the ES uses the full screen for the map as the "buttons" were moved next to the screen and are now real buttons. Note cars like the LS 430 have a different screen (it never had the "buttons" on the screen).

lexusguy

Have you seen the pictures of the '06 M45's NAV system? It looks like Infiniti has totally revamped their NAV software, it looked very advanced, probably at least 256 colors.

boomsama

Yeah, everythings the same, except the layout isbetter on the Lexus' nav

lexusguy1973

Now that everyone has looked at the dissapointing 2006 GS, look at the Infiniti M45- which could possibly become the jewel of Infiniti's up-and-coming lineup. 2 years in the US, and Infiniti is going for the home run. Can or will the M45 overtake the GS? Maybe even the German competitors?

Btw, I remember everyone complaining when Ford dropped the more powerful standard engine from the new F150. That hasn't really affected buyers, last I checked it was a smash hit.

alpha01

Can you elaborate a little on why the new GS is disappointing? Perhaps you've already driven one? (I think not.)

~alpha

jmnyc

Could it possibly be that the GS we've seen to date is a wolf in sheep's clothing?

Lexus has been very tight lipped about many specifics, but has been heavy handed with promotional jargon and predictions of future grandeur, and has presented us with this model as a litmus test of public reaction.

Make no mistake, in this day and age, one year is a LOT of time to fine tune an automobile, and my guess is that Lexus knows exactly what it's doing. Look for Lexus to show the final car at Tokyo, (or detroit) and don't be surprised if they've re-shaped it, and the details of it's architecture, handling, and technology emerge to be much more substantial than what we've been hearing in the past.

At first I thought Infiniti G35 when I looked at the profile, but have changed my mind. I bet it will be a stunner in real life.

Tsk tsk, REALLY, when was the last time you saw Lexus do anything half assed. The future is bright.

boomsama

right with you jmnyc. Anything could happen in a year. And personally, I like the '06 GS just fine.

boomsama

I was watching the Edmunds' GS '06 video again, and I noticed the front seat headrests. They look suprisingly similar to the Volvo headrests. It looks like you cant adjust their height either. Maybe this is another safety feature Lexus has decided to use?

lexusguy

Possibly. Articularting anti-whiplash headrests is something Lexus has been slow to adopt.

boomsama

How do these types of headrests actually stop whiplash? I understand the BMW's active headrests, but these ones just seem like normal headrests. Are they just so that the roof wont crush into the cabin?

lexusguy

Well, when a car is rear ended, the force pushes your body and head forward, and then the seatbelt tries to yank it back to the seat, which can cause whiplash. Volvo's headrests flip foward when this happens so that your head doesnt snap back to the seat.

boomsama

ahhh....I never knew they flip forward lol.

merc1

I really wouldn't hold my breath for a change to the new GS, especially in the area of styling. The final car has been shown. The only changes before next spring will likely be the V8 engine in the GS430 model. The styling is done. Doesn't make sense for them to show a claiming it is the next GS only to change it again before launch. Unless they read these boards and got a ton of feedback from current Lexus owners saying they didn't like the car.

Lexus doesn't half-[non-permissible content removed] things true, but the GS has never been that strong of a competitor, no company is perfect and hits the target with every vehicle.

M

boomsama

Personally, I'm only expecting very minor engine tweaks, nothing different with the styling. For all we know, it might just make matters worse if the design is changed.

lexusguy

I wouldnt count them out just yet. Wait until someone has actually DRIVEN the new GS.

boomsama

True, the 0-100k time could actually be in the 6's. If they can perform that well, they wont be needing extra power.

maxhonda99

The current GS430 does 0-60 in 5.8 to 6.1 seconds. And the next GS V8 will have a 6-speed automatic. I would bet it's 0-60 will be under 6.

lexusguy

The outgoing GS430 can outrun a 540iA. Speed was never its problem.

boomsama

Dont they have the 545i now? Maybe the 6 speed will lower GS430 times to mid 5, and GS300 to high sixes (6.8?)

lexusguy

Yeah the V8 in the new 5 is the 545i. The outgoing GS430 is capable of 5.7 second 0-60 sprints, so I would expect their new six speed to lower than into the low 5s. The V6 I really dont know, this supposed 3.0L engine is supposedly brand new, so theres really no point of reference for its performance.

boomsama

Any idea if the new GS is lighter?

lexusguy

I seriously doubt it. The new GS looks quite a bit bigger, plus is gaining a bunch of features, so my guess is its probably going to put on some pounds.

boomsama

True, but then the new 5 series grew larger in ALL dimensions yet it was lighter dur to aluminium. Why dont lexus use aluminium?

saugatak

Aluminium makes the car lighter, but it's also easier to damage. A small bump can easily total an aluminium car.

merc1

"A small bump can easily total an aluminium car."

Huh???

M

saugatak

Check out the BMW 5 series board. Some poor guy with a new e60 5 series said he rear ended someone going at very low speed (I think it was like 10 mph) and caved in his left quarter front panel and destroyed the front axel.

His insurance company determined that it wasn't worth fixing the brand new e60.

What happened to the car he rear ended? A small dent on its steel bumper.

merc1

Do you know what the post # was for that? I haven't read the 5-Series board since I don't know when. I see 300 new posts since. I have a hard time believing all that damage at just 10 mph. I can't see a car being sold in this country that has to pass 5 mph bumper regulations having that much damage at 10 mph. He (the 5-Series) almost had to be steadily pushed into the other car for a few seconds after the two cars locked up.

If this truly is the case, then BMW has made a grave mistake because the A8, NSX and XJ aren't exactly that fragile.

M

lexusguy

No, but the A8 can be a pain in the [non-permissible content removed] to get body work done, as there are like 8 places in the US that can work on aluminum bodied cars.

saugatak

Check out post #8939 of BMW 5-series sedan boards.

Actually, I just looked at it again and I got stories confused. The guy who had a less than 10 mph hit on the front bumper caved in the front quarter panel of his car and suffered $7k in damages.

There were other people who had similar accidents involving different cars that either had more damages or had their cars totaled.

My apologies for putting out wrong info.

merc1

That is very interesting to me. He estimated that he was traveling between 5-7 mph and sustained over 4K in damages! I still think he was moving faster than that, but hey he was there so......

M

saugatak

In a later post, he said the damages were actually $7k. Yikes!

His proof that he was going less than 10 mph is the front airbags didn't deploy. Sounds convincing to me.

Anyway, back on topic, why is there NO BUZZ about the new GS?

Aside from Boomsama, no one seems to be excited about this car.

merc1

Well that could be, but airbags are not speed dependent. They're triggered by the deceleration forces and if the front end is design to crush (as all modern car are) it takes a pretty good impact to activate them nowadays. I guess I'm surprised by the amount of damage, not the costs, because the new 5-Series is an all-aluminum car from the a-pillar foward. Disposable cars!?!

The A6 has been driven by the press and the STS is a homegrown product hence their popularity on these boards. The new GS hasn't been driven yet so give it some time, I'm sure things will pick up around here shortly.

M

boomsama

true, the A6 discussion thread was pretty much left for dead until it was actually released and someone died.

lexusguy

Whats embarrasing is SUVs dont qualify for those 5mph federal mandates. Have you seen some of the damage some SUVs sustain for hitting poles and such at 5mph and under?

boomsama

There was a report on that a few months ago on TV. Those SUVs get damaged pretty easily and cost a LOT to repair.

merc1

The whole SUV thing is just an enigma to me. They were originally meant for off-road use, but nobody bought them and nobody buys them for that now. They're called "Sport" Utility Vehicles, yet there is nothing remotely "sporty" about the vast majority of them, most have what I find to be downright offensive on-road manners. Now people like them for their perceived safety advantages, yet most of them fold up in crash tests worse than a lot of cars do....some of them will kill you when that A-pillar bends and hits your square in the head! People buy them for safety, yet drive them like sports cars and then sue the maker when they flip over. Forget that it isn't meant to be driven like a "car". People like them because of the high seating position yet most of them still block the left lane on the interstate. Hell if you can see so well you shouldn't be blocking the road! They suck gas like no tomorrow yet the government wants us to all drive little (crash vunerable when they meet an Excursion at the intersection) cars while SUVs don't carry a "gas guzzler" tax, but some (much more exciting) cars do! End SuV rant.

M

boomsama

Sedans are actually proven the be safer than SUV's.

maxhonda99

True, currently the majority of sedans are safer than SUVs, but SUVs are getting safer all the time as manufacturer's pay more attention to it. The move from body on frame to unitized structure's also helps. Generally crossover SUVs are very safe because of their car platforms such as the RX330, Highlander, Acura MDX, BMW X5.

lexusguy

Hhehe I'm with you buddy. The government really needs to cange CAFE standards, so that SUVs are not in the same catergory with Ryder moving trucks. Dodge is trying to classify the Magnum as an SUV because of a "flat load floor" and thus the Hemi can suck as much fuel as it wants. Its disgusting. The government (at least the current administration) wants us driving SUVs though, not little cars. There's a rather significant tax break for businesses buying large SUVs at the moment. Why...I have no idea.

Its true that unibody x-overs are safer than their body on frame behemoth counterparts, but they are still inherently less safe than a passenger car. They will not be able to swerve as well to avoid an accident, they are more likely to roll, and braking performance suffers because of the extra weight and high center of gravity.

saugatak

"I don't like SUVs, why do you?" thread.

My 2 cents. I originally did not like SUVs at first for all the reasons you guys mentioned.

But after doing a few moves, extended family vacations, etc., I find it incredibly convenient to have at least 1 large car around.

I do agree, however, that too many idiots drive SUVs around like sports cars. You can't brake fast in these things and they don't turn too well. If you're going to drive 'em, you have to drive 'em carefully.