Edmunds dealer partner, Bayway Leasing, is now offering transparent lease deals via these forums. Click here to see the latest vehicles!
Options
Popular New Cars
Popular Used Sedans
Popular Used SUVs
Popular Used Pickup Trucks
Popular Used Hatchbacks
Popular Used Minivans
Popular Used Coupes
Popular Used Wagons
Comments
Absolutely - no-one is saying you shouldn't, and I certainly agree your dealer should handle this well. If my dealer were to show this lack of empathy, I'd be posting too.
My 4x4 history includes several different Toyota products, Isuzu, Chevy, Ford, Mazda, Land Rovers (2 Disco II's) and one Mercedes G500 - and the LR3 beats them all to pieces. My '99 DII was the worst vehicle I've ever owned, and my '00 DII was the absolute best - I'm hoping that the LR3 fits into that category. Bad thing is I have to wait several months to get it (projected for April).
Until then, I'm satisfied to read all your posts and I appreciate everyone's input. Thank you all !
(I had an ML500 until two weeks ago and it beats that easily - to save space here, just look at my drive review on http://www.mvw.net/lr3/roadtest.php)
I agree and that was a big factor in our decision to acquire our white SE7. It snowed again yesterday and this truck is simply amazing in bad weather. It's an unstoppable tank!
I'm a huge fan of this vehicle but even with that said, here are my only complaints so far:
1. No compass (that I can find) if you didn't order navigation. Come on LR! Most Suzukis have one.
2. No auto head lamps without getting the light package. Again, for 50 large that should be standard, not optional.
3. If you and the wife share a key, you are unable to move the power seat without the key being in. Suppose you're a 6'2" lug married to a smaller women (we should hope!). To move the power seat back the key must be in, which requires leaning into a cramped space to insert it and then back to move the seat. Dumb.
4. Most people won't be bothered but the elements in the heated windshield are somewhat distracting at night. Again, the majority of people like this and since it doesn't bother my wife (her car) it's no biggie.
Don't get me wrong, the powertrain and suspesion of this beast still give it an overall A+ rating and like the post above, very few vehicles actually get you excited as you're walking up to drive it. The LR3 does just that.
I also find the seats to be some of the most comfortable I've ever experienced.
Enjoy, you'll love it.
I called them, becuase I have received no ownership package - this includes service details, service booklet, "owner benefits listing", warranty details and so on. I have no idea what the warranty and service condition are, even though I have the car already. That's a first in my 30-year car-buying history.
LR Customer support just got back to me: "The brand manager for Land Rover tells us that a package with all that will be sent to all LR3 owners at the end of January."
So they had 8 months to prepare but that preparation did not include service booklets, warranty details, or indeed the web site. Incredible.
Thanks for the advice. I will certainly pass on your suggestions to the dealer.
Since I too reviewed many different 7 passenger SUVs and loved what the LR3 has to offer, I really want the LR3 to work out.
As I said earlier, the LR3 has about 250 miles on it and I filled once before when it got below 1/2 tank. Even assuming 10 mpg estimated city, there was always plenty of gas in the tank. The fuel guage has not gotten to 1/4 yet.
Just curious.
The dealer (Land Rover of Mission Viejo) has been great. On my first (and only so far) trail run I picked up a nail in the sidewall. The dealer spotted it when I took it in for a wash after running up Trabuco Canyon. I took it across the street to a tire shop; they had to order a new tire and this was Christmas eve. The dealer took a tire & wheel off one of the trucks on the lot, ran it over to the tire shop, and let me use it for a week while I waited for Goodyear to deliver.
So far, I'm a happy camper. Oh, and did I say, I love this truck!
Tom
"3. If you and the wife share a key, you are unable to move the power seat without the key being in. Suppose you're a 6'2" lug married to a smaller women (we should hope!). To move the power seat back the key must be in, which requires leaning into a cramped space to insert it and then back to move the seat. Dumb. "
Does anyone with an HSE know if those 8-way memory seats also have the same issue, or do the memory seats move into position when you unlock the vehicle with the remote (before you get in and turn the ignition key)?
Also, I'd hope that a technical service bulliten would be issued, so the dealer can modify the seat's power to a source that is energized when the vehicle is not running, and therefor allow you to move the seat before you get inside. We noticed this during our initial test drive, and agree completely that this is an ergonomic oversight in the design.
I called my salesperson to complain. He also was upset at the response we received about the service. He said bring the truck in right away and he would personally insure we got a loaner, even if it was his own vehicle. The manager of the dealership was just as concerned and also agreed that we would get a loaner.
Maybe we should have called the saleperson to schedule a service appointment.
Will let you know how this nets out.
jackman said: "I'd hope that a technical service bulliten would be issued, so the dealer can modify the seat's power to a source that is energized when the vehicle is not running, and therefor allow you to move the seat before you get inside"
The better behavior would be for the seat adjustments to work for a few minutes right after unlocking the door even if there is no key in the ignition. This way they would still be "off" the rest of the time.
Send feedback to Land Rover (web form on US site), call Customer Service or work through your dealer if you find the SE behavior irritating. There is always a chance if enough customers complain...
My thoughts:
- The only items really bugging me about the GX are the now-inferior third row seats (which I think I can live with) and the swinging rear door (which I'm not sure whether I can live with).
- I love the styling, technology and apparent capability of the LR3.
- I was concerned about the LR3's fuel economy but this is not turning out to be so bad...thanks to those who have divulged mileage.
- I was worried about LR reliability and those of you stalling virtually around the corner from the dealership are scaring the poop out of me.
- Prior Land Rovers have depreciated notoriously in my market but this is moot since I will be leasing.
- I come from a Lexus family but the LR3 really has my attention. I have test driven both trucks and really love both, each for their own reasons.
For reasons mentioned above, I'm firmly on the fence. Somebody close me!
P.S. if the GX didn't have a rear-swinger, I'm afraid this would be an easy decision. Ex-GX owners, please pipe up too...
Many thanks
Tom
Vancouver, BC
I'm a biased LR3 fan and we used to have a Land Cruiser but here goes:
My honest hunch is the GX may hold it's value slightly better and also be more reliable over the long haul. But I'd still go with the LR3 because 2 years from now, the GX will be a fairly dated looking rig and the LR3 turns heads like you've never seen. It's impossible to fill up without 1-2 people coming to talk about the car. Plus the seating and tailgates are WAY better.
I also think Ford and LR have so much at stake with this SUV that they'll do whatever is needed to make things right, if something does go wrong.
And to answer myself with the power seat/key in ignition debate above, I do think each key they supplied may go to a preset seat position but we share one key in my family so it's a pain but I'm getting pretty smooth at leaning in, putting the key in and moving the seat back.
You will love the LR3. Don't delay. JUST DO IT!
You can thank the Federal Govt. for the lack of adjustability in today's vehicles. It would be next to impossible to meet EPA air quality regulations without the current engine management systems.
Dealers are well aware of it and have tried many fixes. I heard that Lexus in Australia have a fix. It's not all GX470's but a fair amount!
I have heard all sorts of potential reasons but it hasn't cured many of the problems!
Tires have been changed, driveline lubed etc
I even heard that the tires were out of round after being the car/truck was overly strapped down on the ship. Lexus changed a friends complete tires using this as a reason.
Well Lexus could not fix my vibration and purchased back the vehicle. I cant fault them for standing by their product.
Check the Lexus forums and search under "vibration" There is a problem out there! I am not sure if it's carried over to the 2005 model which they may have fixed. The 3rd seat is the same & there are very little that has been changed for 2005.
I can't believe how a good amount of drivers would put up with it or don't notice it! It is subtle, but after a 1300 mile run to Florida its a PITA!
The 3rd row seat is a total joke compared to the LR3.
In my view the two vehicles do not compare. Both have niggles. Lexus service is good but LR service has been equally good for me. It's relative & down to individual dealers. No it should not be!
You just have make it known how you want things!
For $55k it should be perfect. I request & get a loaner if I need it.
I have owned a ML55 (hopeless in snow, cramped, CD Nav, design), GX470 (vibration, 3rd row, not 179 compliant), Tahoe (Solid but low tech, no Nav).
I drive upwards of 30k plus miles a year & the LR3 is the best so far. I dont work for LR or anyone else.
The one thing I did notice about GX470 owners were how so many of them were wiring their Nav screens to watch DVD's upfront!
Defies belief & they all say they only watch it while parked! Right!
Sorry if I have ranted on!
If you can wait, I'd recommend that first.
We have a friend who has the GX and the rear door is really a pain. The GX seats also fold like our old ML320, which means they cut visibility when up and spill stuff to the back when folded down. The fold-flat seats on the LR3 are really unbeatable.
If there's any good news about the stalling we've had, it's that the LR3 starts right back up. Just hard to steer while trying to stop.
I have a Lexus LS430 and can certainly vouch for their superior service.
I'm still an LR3 fan. That may change if the stalling continues.
Best of luck.
Sometimes the service experience is not just the willingness of the dealership but also the logistical system behind the service centers. LR is amongst the worst with regard to getting parts. Lexus on the other hand has it down cold.
If you have to put adults in the 3rd row or have a significant problem with the swinging door, then go for the LR3.
I don't see a huge volume difference between the GX and LR3. The uniqueness factor will wear off in a couple of years unless Ford fails it's sales plan. If that happens, the depreciation will be bad since Ford will discount heavily to move the new cars.
From the off road capability stand point, I am not sure a KDSS equipped GX would be much less than an LR3. I've seen trail pictures of KDSS and they are impressive. The tire choice you make could make more of a difference in the off road or slippery situations than the vehicle design itself.
One thing you should check out is if KDSS equipped GX can tow the full weight if you have a towing requirement. My dealer told me it can't, that puts GX out of my list for me.
Now our current SUV is acting up and we may be back in the market. However, I have just about completely ruled out the GX470 for various issues mentioned - lousy 3rd row being chief among them. The 2005 MDX, with a few added features over the 2004, seems a better "safe" choice among the Japanese brands. And, after 12,000 miles behind me with my 2004 TL, I have no complaints on Acura quality.
If I were you - and leasing - I think the LR# would be tops on my list. The horrendous deprectiation would not be a factor, nor would long term relaiblity after the warranty period. The LR3 may having you go to the dealership more during the warranty period than an Acura or Lexus, but that's more of a nuisance than an actual financial risk.
However, since we would be buying, I have to take issue with the claim made by someone above that the Land Rover would (only) depreciate slightly more than a Lexus (or Acura). I could buy a $70k+ 3-4 year old Range Rover for about the same I would have to pay for a similar vintage $40k MDX. That's not "slight" in my book. Based upon Range Rover's history, they have never had a model that wasn't at the very bottom of its category list ranked in terms of resale value.
Poor resale isn't a deal killer by itself. But combined with the risk of long term reliability, it does make for a bit of anxiety on how an owner might feel in 5 years when the warranty has expired and the resale value is diminimous.
I don't know for sure, but I think that the Defender may be the exception to that rule.
Good to hear that Ford helped the LR Parts system. Would you elaborate a bit on what the 97% fill rate means?
1. How do you count an order filled? i.e. Next day availability, two days, or within a week?
2. Does the 97% include all parts or just some of the parts? i.e. would the LR3 fuel tank and A pillar (to repair a collision) count?
3. What would be a typical wait if a part has to come from UK? e.g. How log to get an LR3 door?
Thanks.
On another note my dealer drove to my office on his way home last night to hand deliver the part of my door handle that I had lost in the car wash last weekend. Thought that was pretty good service.
Sorry - you headed down a street that has a 45 degree incline? No street on earth is that steep I think., so I am misunderstanding I am sure. Can you explain?
tidester, host
Baldwin Street in Dunedin, New Zealand is reputedly the steepest road in the world that is meant for auto traffic with a 36% grade. Lombard Street has a 14.3% grade and Filbert in San Fran comes in at 31.5%
I'll leave it to Tidester to explain the difference in slope, angle, grade, degree, etc.
Btw, the Dodge Power Wagon can almost manage a 90% angle. :-) (link)
Steve, Host
By the way, I can't seem to find any pricing on the Power Wagon here in Edmunds (the link from the review page just goes to the basic 2wd 1500 Ram).
teldoc, the HSE has the memory seat positions and can be programmed to follow the fob. The SE doesn't have memory at all, so it needs a better solution.
Todd
The dealer now states it is the diesel fuel pump and tank (seems that LR is beginning to recognize the problem). Was mentioned earlier that some pre-production models got the wrong tank/fuel pump combination. Seems like the "pre-production" problem made it into production models as well.
Have to wait 2 to 3 weeks for the tank. Will let you know how it turns out.
A simple input to output cord will work. Real cheap at Radio Shack. I actually checked my cord collection at home and I had a couple, so I saved a dollar or two.
"And lastly make a key that will accept a key ring!!! "
they're now attaching a small ring to it so that you can then attach a bigger key ring to that...
My fuel pump was replaced almost 1.5 months ago and my dealer knew then that there were cars destined for the US with diesel pumps instead of gas ones. I understand that not all stalls have the same cause but it would make sense that one of the first things that would be checked in a car that stalls repeatedly would be the pumps knowing that fact.
Since my pumps were replaced, I have even parked in my inclined driveway with the low fuel light on, the same place the car stalled with 1/4 of gas.
;--)
Typically you slow down if you see the brake lights come on in front of you. When a vehicle stalls, the brake lights wouldn't come on.
For safety, it's advisable to turn on the hazard signal immediately following a stall.
I looked at the lexus as well and there was no comparison in my opinion. I lived in Australia for the last year and the lexus GX is the Toyota Prado down there. Here it is the same as the 4runner except different body and dressed up some. They are rather boring and to me are fine for driving around town. There is just nothing distinguishing about it other than they are very reliable. My buddy has one and we constantly harrass him about driving his girlfriends car....
As for the LR3. I have had mine for just over a month and I have not had a single issue. I took it skiing last weekend and it was unstoppable in the snow. The stereo is great. Some say the inside looks cheap, I think it looks great. I love the engine, the way it rides is much nicer than the lexus, I get comments all the time on how nice people think it looks. I think the engine is faster than 8 seconds for 0-60. Overall, I couldn't be happier.
I grew up outside Philly too. So the roads there are a little chewed up. Take them for a test drive. You will see there is not comparison. The air suspension is simply plush... But if you only care about history of reliability and fuel consumption. Get the lexus.... but you regret it everytime you see an LR3 on the road.
The 97% is against the total number of parts ordered by line, not against individual parts. All of the parts count equally.
Many parts from the UK ship overnight, but there is time spent with customs clearing and transportation in the US to the warehouses that can make it take up to ten days from placing the order to getting the part to the retailer. We strive to have the parts in the US to avoid these delays.
There are some parts that are held up by supplier issues, these are generally the parts that take an inordinate time to fill. We are working to minimize these issues.
For an earlier post that asked if the car started up again, the answer is "yes, once you stopped completely and put in in park (neutral may have worked but did not try it)".
Think about driving on the highway where cars can reduce speed without brake lights. There is the risk of being rear ended.