Chronic Car Buyers Anonymous (Archived)

breld

Kinda interesting news regarding a new base engine for the VW lineup.
blog.caranddriver.com/b-squad-volkswagen-tiguan-passat-and-beetle-welcome-new-base-engine/

breld

I am strangely attracted to this for nostalgic reasons (I ended up with the following generation of Prelude when I graduated college, but I looked hard for one of these).
1990 Prelude

Michaell

breld said:

Kinda interesting news regarding a new base engine for the VW lineup.
blog.caranddriver.com/b-squad-volkswagen-tiguan-passat-and-beetle-welcome-new-base-engine/

Wonder if that will find its way into the new Jetta? Looks like a solid entry.

nyccarguy

breld said:

I am strangely attracted to this for nostalgic reasons (I ended up with the following generation of Prelude when I graduated college, but I looked hard for one of these).
1990 Prelude

Great condition for a 27 year old car. Low mileage & a new clutch are also pluses. Something not driven all that much might need some deferred maintenance. Coolant/Brake Fluid. Timing Belt, Water Pump, Tensioner.

The styling of that era Prelude was the main influence of my Prelude's 5th generation styling. Look at the profile, the long hood, short deck, shape of the headlights.

breld

@nyccarguy - you're right about the styling. When your model came out, I still owned my 1993 Prelude, which I loved, but I did long for that new model, partially due to how it resembled the older styling.

If I ever came upon a nice example of the last gen Prelude, I'd strongly consider it. But not likely to find one that has been maintained properly.

stickguy

I love that prelude. With a recent clutch and timing belt done, if no rust, looks like a deal. Not many stock, rust free ones left.

nyccarguy

breld said:

Civic Type R sticker has been released at $34,775.

Seems good to me - undercuts the Focus RS and Golf R, which it should, and more or less in line with a loaded GTI or WRX. Of course, the Honda will be selling for no discounts for the foreseeable future, but once that dies down, or someone who just had to have one of the first ones finds it's too harsh for their daily driving and wants to unload it, I may have to try one out.

Honda is very proud of this Type R no doubt. I'm sure it drives incredible and won't dissapoint if you physically compare it (not internet fanboy race) to its top competitors (Golf R, STi, Focus RS). I'm really curious to see how the Si does. Maybe guys pick one up until the Type R fanfare subsides, maybe the Si doesn't sell as well as projected due to the Type R's dominance and gets some serious factory backed trunk money...

breld

Looking at the pictures again, I think it is the "ALB" model - so it has the all-new for the time feature of...Anti-Lock Brakes!

From a maintenance perspective, probably better than the 4WS model.

stickguy

Michaell said:

breld said:

Kinda interesting news regarding a new base engine for the VW lineup.
blog.caranddriver.com/b-squad-volkswagen-tiguan-passat-and-beetle-welcome-new-base-engine/

Wonder if that will find its way into the new Jetta? Looks like a solid entry.

Sounds like a nice motor. I am fine with a lower HP rating if made up for by torque, flexibility, and MPG on RUG.

My guess is the Jetta (and maybe golf) go with the 1.4 as base. Unless they up on get to 1.5l for those models. A comment to that article said they were doing so in Europe.

ab348

Those 3rd-gen Preludes were very nice cars. The low cowl and beltline are especially appealing to me. Around here the 2nd-gen was the hot car to have in the mid-80s and they were routinely sold by the dealer at well over sticker. A coworker bought one at sticker and thought she got a great deal. Nonrefundable $500 deposit, when her name got to the top of the list they called to tell her what color she was getting. The only choice was for the transmission.

breld

Alright - I'm on a "vintage" Honda kick right now.
Acura CL Manual

stickguy

Looks nice. Probably quick, but not particularly fun or sporty.

qbrozen

'03 is vintage? ha.

Looks pretty nice for having over 150k miles. Seats have held up admirably.

jpp75

breld said:

Kinda interesting news regarding a new base engine for the VW lineup.
blog.caranddriver.com/b-squad-volkswagen-tiguan-passat-and-beetle-welcome-new-base-engine/

I'm becoming more intrigued with the new Tiguan. Might be a good replacement for the Touareg.

nyccarguy

breld said:

I imagine the high demand for the Atlas will be short-lived. Not that it's a bad car - there's just too many solid choices out there in the segment for this one to be highlighted for too long. It's just the newest, shiniest entrant into a high demand market for such cars.

I'm interested to see how it drives - @michaell and I poked around the one at the Denver Auto Show and I was impressed with the interior look and feel. A used one could make a nice buy in a year or two.

Very short lived.  I'm sure a used one will be a nice buy in the future, but it won't have a 360 hp HEMI V8under the hood.

qbrozen

When the Atlas was first previewed as the CrossBlue, they said it would have a hybrid diesel powertrain. Guess we know why that didn't come to fruition.

Mr_Shiftright

I just don't see that the Atlas has what it takes to beat the competition in that class.

breld

qbrozen said:

'03 is vintage? ha.

Looks pretty nice for having over 150k miles. Seats have held up admirably.

Yeah, "vintage" may be a stretch. How about this?

https://denver.craigslist.org/cto/6092102914.html

nyccarguy

Mr_Shiftright said:

I just don't see that the Atlas has what it takes to beat the competition in that class.

Especially when "the class" includes Highlander & Pilot

Michaell

nyccarguy said:

Mr_Shiftright said:

I just don't see that the Atlas has what it takes to beat the competition in that class.

Especially when "the class" includes Highlander & Pilot

Not everybody wants a Camry or Accord, which is why some folks who populate these boards get a Jetta or a Passat.

Same is true with the 3-row SUV market. The Atlas is different. I actually like the looks of it.

stickguy

Looks nice in pictures. Have not seen interior or driven yet. Pilot is nice. Highlander does nothing for me. To bulky and truck like.

The Tiguan probably is nice. But likely won't lease well.

Sat in a new style escape today. A striper S model, but still nice. An SE with pano and the big touch screen would be nice. If it came cheap! Not that I really need another compact CUV, and I would never get the wife to swap for one. Or a Tiguan for that matter. She really does not like VWs much.

Maybe I will get a 2018 Passat? Wonder what else is new besides engine?

breld

I agree - the Atlas offers something different for the class, much like the CX-9 does.

The Highlander and Pilot are more than competent - very reliable, efficient and functional vehicles with handsome styling. No new entrant will likely compete sales-wise with the Honda and Toyota, much like no one can really compete with the Odyssey and Sienna. But it's nice to have choices with the Atlas, CX-9 and Durango (I just threw the Dodge in there for my own sake )

Michaell

breld said:

I agree - the Atlas offers something different for the class, much like the CX-9 does.

The Highlander and Pilot are more than competent - very reliable, efficient and functional vehicles with handsome styling. No new entrant will likely compete sales-wise with the Honda and Toyota, much like no one can really compete with the Odyssey and Sienna. But it's nice to have choices with the Atlas, CX-9 and Durango (I just threw the Dodge in there for my own sake )

Exactly. Though the minivan market shrunk to the point where it wasn't competitive to have an entry in it, the SUV market is all growth. And, the market is large enough for a lot of variety.

qbrozen

breld said:

'03 is vintage? ha.

Looks pretty nice for having over 150k miles. Seats have held up admirably.

Yeah, "vintage" may be a stretch. How about this?

https://denver.craigslist.org/cto/6092102914.html

Love the rattle can paintjob, including what appears to be overspray on the seats.

pensfan83

stickguy said:

Looks nice in pictures. Have not seen interior or driven yet. Pilot is nice. Highlander does nothing for me. To bulky and truck like.

The Tiguan probably is nice. But likely won't lease well.

Sat in a new style escape today. A striper S model, but still nice. An SE with pano and the big touch screen would be nice. If it came cheap! Not that I really need another compact CUV, and I would never get the wife to swap for one. Or a Tiguan for that matter. She really does not like VWs much.

Maybe I will get a 2018 Passat? Wonder what else is new besides engine?

My mom has a 2016 Escape Titanium with the 2.0 Ecoboost. It's a solid CUV for what she needs. My parents briefly considered an Explorer (they are Ford people) but they felt that was entirely too big and my dad hated the way it drove.

nyccarguy

I agree that not everyone wants a highlander or a pilot.  But as you all mentioned, this is a crowded and very competent class.  Where does it fit in?  

You want a smooth ride, reliable as the sun, and insane reliability?  All which translate into excellent lease payments.  Highlander

You want more room than the highlander?  The anti-minivan of the segment?  Pilot.

Badass looks?  Available V8?  Durango or bust.

Something different?  With a gorgeous interior that drives smaller than it is?  CX9.

Never count out GM either.

so now you have the VW die hards who will buy the Atlas?  Who else?  It's not the cheapest.  Not the biggest.  Not the fastest.  Doesn't get the best fuel economy.  The 6 year warranty doesn't mean squat to those who lease.  

What are they going to do when Subaru comes out with their Ascent?

tommister2

@nyccarguy our 2012 Pilot has about 55k miles on the original brakes. It passed VA state inspection this month. Any idea why you are burning through rear brakes? Just seems odd. Does your mechanic see this often?

Michaell

nyccarguy said:

I agree that not everyone wants a highlander or a pilot.  But as you all mentioned, this is a crowded and very competent class.  Where does it fit in?  

You want a smooth ride, reliable as the sun, and insane reliability?  All which translate into excellent lease payments.  Highlander

You want more room than the highlander?  The anti-minivan of the segment?  Pilot.

Badass looks?  Available V8?  Durango or bust.

Something different?  With a gorgeous interior that drives smaller than it is?  CX9.

Never count out GM either.

so now you have the VW die hards who will buy the Atlas?  Who else?  It's not the cheapest.  Not the biggest.  Not the fastest.  Doesn't get the best fuel economy.  The 6 year warranty doesn't mean squat to those who lease.  

What are they going to do when Subaru comes out with their Ascent?

Guess we'll see what the VW marketing minds come up with, I suppose.

Same with the Ascent - I think there is pent up demand for a Subaru 3-row SUV once the Tribeca was retired.

Middle America will always gravitate towards the GM trio, and Ford has some competent offerings as well.

Kia and Hyundai, too.

Really, is there a mainstream manufacturer (non-luxury) who doesn't have a 3 row SUV in their inventory - or, has one coming soon?

xwesx

tommister2 said:

@nyccarguy our 2012 Pilot has about 55k miles on the original brakes. It passed VA state inspection this month. Any idea why you are burning through rear brakes? Just seems odd. Does your mechanic see this often?

I would guess it is just part of city life - a lot more stop and go. I had to replace the rear pads on my 2010 Forester at less than 100K, IIRC, and I thought something must be very wrong there. Turns out, that generation of Forester tends to go through rear pads faster than front. At nearly 108K when we lost it, it was still on the original fronts. However, we have MUCH less braking in our miles.

sda

breld said:

I agree - the Atlas offers something different for the class, much like the CX-9 does.

The Highlander and Pilot are more than competent - very reliable, efficient and functional vehicles with handsome styling. No new entrant will likely compete sales-wise with the Honda and Toyota, much like no one can really compete with the Odyssey and Sienna. But it's nice to have choices with the Atlas, CX-9 and Durango (I just threw the Dodge in there for my own sake )

I agree, and if VW has been able to provide that distinctive Germanic solid feel and driving dynamics that may make the difference in setting it apart from the others.

ab348

How does the Atlas compare to the Touraeg? They seem almost the same size.

ab348

This just appeared on BaT and I figured it would be of interest to some here:

1998 BMW M3 convertible

stickguy

I think the Atlas gives more interior room and a bit (maybe a lot) less pork to carry around.

And I think Subaru will sell a ton of 3 row larger CUVs (assuming they do it right) to their base core.

Michaell

stickguy said:

I think the Atlas gives more interior room and a bit (maybe a lot) less pork to carry around.

And I think Subaru will sell a ton of 3 row larger CUVs (assuming they do it right) to their base core.

Plus the 3rd row.

corvette

I'm not a fan of the styling of the current Pilot. Much prefer the styling of the Explorer and Highlander.

sda

nyccarguy said:

sda said:

I sat in a VW Atlas on Monday. The launch edition,though lacking some features has the panoramic sunroof and lists for $33.5 about $35k with shipping. I could live with that as it gets very expensive as more features and you progress thru the higher trim levels. The conservative but strong styling is a plus. The Pilot has a larger third row seat and can seat 8 total in the interior where most, including the Atlas seat 7. The sales person said, and I witnessed all were sold, and there was a waiting list for those being trucked in. Will be interesting to see longer term how they sell. The enhanced 6/72k warranty is a real plus.

It is always good to hear your thoughts on 3 row SUVs since we've both got the Pilot. With 92,500+ miles, the Pilot continues to suit our needs as a family of 5 perfectly (aside from the fact that it isn't blue and doesn't have a power lift gate). Just this past weekend, I was able to load up the 5 of us (Mom & Dad up front, Son #1 & #2 in the 3rd row, Princess in the 2nd row) plus enough toys and gear for a full day at the beach, & still had plenty of space to pick up my wife's cousin.

I noticed the steering wheel shakes above 65 mph. My mechanic said to have the tires balanced 1st, then he'll check the front end to see if any of the tie rods are in need of replacement. This lead me to an "Only in New York" moment.

My mechanic tells me to have the tires balanced at this tire shop not too far from him. They also happen to be a certified Tire Rack installer and get excellent Google reviews. I call the tire shop yesterday and Tony tells me they don't open until 8:30 am. I tell him I have to be at work at 7:30 am and ask if there is a night drop. Tony tells me "no, but leave the keys with Juan at the bodega next door." So I found a parking spot on the street 3 cars in front of this tire shop, dropped my keys off with Juan, jumped on the train 3 stops, then walked 10 minutes to work. From 7:30 to 8:30, there was a thought in the back of my mind that Juan was going to put my Pilot on a boat to Santo Domingo instead of giving it to Tony.

The wheels are currently off now and getting balanced. Tony calls me and tells me that my rear brakes are shot and need to be replaced as do the rotors. I tell him to hold off and will have my mechanic look at it this coming Monday. According to my records, I last had the rear brake pads replaced and rotors resurfaced on 7/2/2013 at 37,289 miles so it does seem appropriate that they are due for replacement. As always, my mechanic will ONLY put genuine HONDA parts on my car.

Our Pilot is a tick under 100k, 99433. We bought it as a CPO Honda with 50k. As part of the CPO process it had new brake pads and rotors resurfaced, new battery, filters, wiper blades, oil change. At 92k we were getting some pulsing from the brakes when they got warm. The front rotors were resurfaced but the brake pads were still thick and retained. At 92k I also replaced the tires with another set of Michelins, this time the Defender LTX. They are smooth and quiet. Timing belt is due next service.

Remember to keep an eye on the compliance bushings up front. They are liquid filled and are prone to fail. Honda has a TSB and will cover them to 10yr/120k IIRC. They are expensive to replace. Ours failed around 6 mo ago. They were replaced at no charge and that included a free alignment and loaner car.

tommister2

@sda what happens when the compliance bushing fail? Vibration, bounce, noise, ????

stickguy

I strangely like this one. Not the wheels though. and the dashboard is just nasty. But something about it conceptually...

http://bringatrailer.com/listing/1970-ford-ranchero/

jeffb0101

Weird question here. Anyone know if it is possible to purchase an extended warranty without going through a dealer? It would have to be a third-party as I am out of b2b, and Honda requires the purchase prior to expiration of 3/36.
Any insight would be appreciated. Just trying to weigh the costs.

stickguy

yeah, you can get them aftermarket. Not the factory backed one of course. Different question is if you trust them. Google around for references, since many of them are not necessarily trustworthy.

ab348

stickguy said:

I strangely like this one. Not the wheels though. and the dashboard is just nasty. But something about it conceptually...

http://bringatrailer.com/listing/1970-ford-ranchero/

I saw that one yesterday and started ticking off in my head all of the things that were done to it that I would have to undo or re-do if it was mine. Hacked on a bit too much for my liking.

sda

tommister2 said:

@sda what happens when the compliance bushing fail? Vibration, bounce, noise, ????

Honestly I don't know as ours seemed to be driving fine. However, and it may be the alignment done after the repair, but the Pilot tracks truer than it ever has and seems to be a bit tighter in steering response. On a previous service I complained I was seeing oil droplets on our garage floor and they couldn't find anything. Next service they came to me without me mentioning any issues, was there for an oil change only, that they discovered the compliance bushings leaking. This is what it looked like on the garage floor and what the bushings look like,

jeffb0101

Thanks! I still kind of kick myself for not getting it when the car was new. However, never thought I would keep it this long.

stickguy

so, a quick update on the short list du jour. Subject to change at any point.

sticking with sedans, for various reasons, all new or slightly used (so 2017s basically), I'm interested in:

- 3 series
- Maxima
- Civic EX-L
- TLX
- Mazda 6
- Passat
- Jetta (2018)
- Elantra
- Ioniq
- S60

ab348

That's not a short list.

Sandman6472

Co-worker bought a 2016 Sorrento EX 6 cylinder, black over black, and loves it! Says it drives great and is very quiet. They took it to Georgia and Alabama this past weekend and with 3 adults, 2 little kids and a 17 year old, all were comfortable and that included luggage for all. Said he was driving, looked down and saw 90 on the speedo...had no idea he was moving so fast!
Saw a dark grey unit that was stunning in the showroom. Personally, black over black in anything in South Florida is insane but hey, to each his own. Starting to really love my beige leatherette interior. Cut my finger yesterday morning getting lunch pale out of Golf all the while talking with my boss. He tells me there's blood dripping down your hand and yep, blood all over! Cut the top of my ring finger on a piece of metal and that sucker really dripped. Last night noticed blood stains had dried on the seats. Went out and got the leather cleaner we have, sprayed it on and boom, off all the blood came. If the seats were black, no way I'd have seen it. Used to hate a beige interior but no more!

The Sandman

stickguy

you should see the long list.

and this doesn't include the other vehicle types. Anywhere from an Escape to an X1 to a Ram PU.

Hey, there was a reason I had to start looking 6 months early.

thebean

jeffb0101 said:

Thanks! I still kind of kick myself for not getting it when the car was new. However, never thought I would keep it this long.

You might be able to still buy a HondaCare warranty after the B2B warranty has expired.  Of course, they will not be anywhere as reasonable as if you bought it when the car was new.  There are several Honda dealers that sell them online for quite a savings over most dealers.  There is a topic on this, here on Edmunds and probably on some of the Honda forums on the interwebs.  

pensfan83

Only 3 more cars than my list. I'd like to start paring it down soon.

sda

A pic from about a year ago, still looks the same. Wife says she will drive the wheels off this one and I may lose a digit if I try to trade it.