Chronic Car Buyers Anonymous (Archived)

stickguy

I just can't get my hands around that Terrain. Just seems overwrought, but I guess styling is just subjective.

I explained my newest plan to my wife today while we were doing our evening walk. She seemed skeptical. But, we spent the afternoon at a graduation party and drank too much beer, so maybe not the best time.

roadburner

stickguy said:

this odd ball is cute. Miles a bit steep for a 14, but seems cheap. And I will average the miles out pretty quick.

not sure what the wife would think of this (though I can hazard a guess). But if it was a stick, I might bite! Though maybe that blue is just a tad much.

http://www.miniofmtlaurel.com/used/MINI/2014-MINI-Clubman-f4ccface0a0e0a176609e0035b6ebd7d.htm</blockquote

My wife and I still like our Clubman- although I honestly couldn't see driving it every day.

stickguy

my Sonata has been around for 31 months, and still has not broken 17K miles. I don't really drive anything every day, at least not enough miles to matter!

stickguy

just out of curiousity, I checked residuals on both my leases. The Jetta has a but out of $13,000.40, which may not be that bad actually, but it will be pushing the mid-30s miles by then. So likely a hard pass.

Sonata, if I want to buy it in 5 months, is about $17,700. No clue if that is good, bad or indifferent, but I know I have no plans to finance out that purchase! Even though it is a nice car, well maintained, and low miles.

Michaell

stickguy said:

I just can't get my hands around that Terrain. Just seems overwrought, but I guess styling is just subjective.

Exactly - you like the Civic, I don't.

Beauty is in the eye of the beholder, or some such.

benjaminh

stickguy said:

my Sonata has been around for 31 months, and still has not broken 17K miles. I don't really drive anything every day, at least not enough miles to matter!

That's certainly low miles. I've owned my 2016 Accord for 9 months, and now have about 10k miles on it.

Michaell

benjaminh said:

stickguy said:

my Sonata has been around for 31 months, and still has not broken 17K miles. I don't really drive anything every day, at least not enough miles to matter!

That's certainly low miles. I've owned my 2016 Accord for 9 months, and now have about 10k miles on it.

I've had my Jetta for almost 10 months now, just crossed 4500 miles.

stickguy

It is going to take another trip to N. Carolina in August for us to break 40K miles on the RDX before its 5th birthday. And those miles were largely put on in the first 2 years. In the last 24 months I think we put on 8-9K miles, total.

tbirdmarco

@stickguy nice Valvo would take it to be enspected and if all did go whell jump all over it for the year not bad miles! and love the color on the outside that and blew are my favorates.

tbirdmarco

@stickguy want to cell your sonata dad neads to get him selfe an new car maby can convince him to bye nice lo miles lol lol the r d x to would be all over nice lo miles!.

stickguy

plenty of nice, low mile CPO units out there. Not something that works in my favor!

I mentioned to the daughter that she could buy it out if she wanted. her response was along the lines of, "why would I want your slow old mans car?"

benjaminh

stickguy said:

plenty of nice, low mile CPO units out there. Not something that works in my favor!

I mentioned to the daughter that she could buy it out if she wanted. her response was along the lines of, "why would I want your slow old mans car?"

If I may ask, what are your monthly payments on the Sonata? Are you looking to lease or buy after you turn it in?

stickguy

$290/month on the lease. Next car, I go back and forth. Would rather not lease, but it will depend on my needs at the time, and financial considerations. IOW, I have no idea what I will do!

benjaminh

stickguy said:

$290/month on the lease. Next car, I go back and forth. Would rather not lease, but it will depend on my needs at the time, and financial considerations. IOW, I have no idea what I will do!

Does your Sonata Limited have AndroidAuto? If not, imho you should consider trying that on the next car you get. Google maps navi/voice recognition beats built-in navi by a mile imho.

My local Hyundai dealer has a brand new Sonata Eco (the one with the turbo) with Android Auto for just $16k. I think that might be about the same to buy as your current lease payment.

Or, Honda has lease specials on the Civic Sedan and Hatchback for just $179 a month for either one.

As you say, a world of possibilities are out there for you.

stickguy

strong deal on the Eco. I would point my daughter at that one if she was buying now. Would feel like an equipment downgrade to me! My car does not have carplay or android auto (I have an iphone so only car play matters). I did get a notice that if I want to, I can DIY download the software update to activate that. I have not bothered. Somewhat annoying that Apple only allows apple maps to run on it. I prefer Google maps. But I heard a rumor (from a salesguy, so who knows, but he was young!) that they were working on adding Waze to the Carplay applications. That would be nice.

and yes, there are many options open. and IMO one of the best things about leasing is getting to switch to a different car in a few years. Could not imagine getting a replacement that was the same model.

tjc78

A very good friend of mine leases Highlander's.  He has had several, one time literally the only thing different was the color.   To make matters worse he does the same thing with his wife's RAV4. 

kyfdx

Leased three consecutive Accords for my wife. '97, '99 and '01

pensfan83

My parents do the same with Ford Escapes with the exception of them purchasing...2005, 2008, 2013, 2016.

pensfan83

Cars seem to go through so many mid-cycle refreshes anymore they are hardly the same if you lease a new one every 3 years.

tjc78

Only two back to back I've had are an 03 and 06 Avalon. Same name but really different cars. 

I've never had a consecutive same exact car.   

Elantra 08 and 17. Quite different 
Grand Marquis 89 and 04 again really different 

I guess my 89 Town Car was pretty much the same as the 89 MGM. 

stickguy

well, I got the first MY of the new design, so a 2018 would be basically the same. Might be different if it had gone through a redesign.

Still want to try something different. Spice of life! Especially if I lease 1 more time, because the one after that will probably be a buy and hold.

stickguy

I really like this paint color. Miles a tad steep, but not too expensive, and looks really clean. I bought my S40 used from this dealer. They only seem to have nice stuff. Be nicer with a lighter interior though. Wonder what they would actually take for it?

http://www.eliteacura.com/inventory/used-2007-infiniti-g35-sedan-g35x-all-wheel-drive-sedan-jnkbv61f17m818208

pensfan83

If I stay with the same car I would only be in the 2nd year of the new design and it's different enough for me! However I'm starting to lean more toward an SUV at this point, particularly the Grand Cherokee.

tbirdmarco

@stickguy yes menny good nice lo mile unets of the car you have that is for shore did sum looking on the net!

corvette

stickguy said:

But I heard a rumor (from a salesguy, so who knows, but he was young!) that they were working on adding Waze to the Carplay applications. That would be nice.

Waze would be nice! My Murano doesn't support Android Auto or Carplay. My usual setup on a long drive is either: 1. Listen to XM radio, phone Bluetooth off so it uses its own speaker, use Waze for navigation through phone's speaker, or 2. Bluetooth audio streaming, listen to podcasts on Pocket Casts app, Waze doing the navigation. Either way, I have a vent mount for the phone. Would be nicer if the nav display were on the car's larger nav screen.

tbirdmarco

@tjc78 would never get the same car mor than once if leesing. my aunt did that with to Honda pilets 09 and 2012. secand one was the higher trim leval first one the 09 was the lx trim. secand pilet they had an problem with the engian tords the end of the leese was eating oial good thing they caught it in time was sum recal that fixed the problem. and the batory to had to be changed on the 2012 it it is what it is happens! also my mom had an 2003 and 2006 Hyundai santafy. the 2003 was an leese and the 2006 we had for 7 or so years. than ws traded in and got an 2013 sanata limated we kept for 2 years witch was baught. then she saw the maxima and we did trade in the sonata and that is whair we are now. maxima gos back next year. as said before going to go in augest or sept to try to get out of leese early might be an bit to early. she saw sum gm suv that she likes. buick think it was. that she liked that was on an car haller brand new. maby the one that forget who it is in hear has. the oncor think it was. have an good night to all hope that everyone had an good weekand!

nyccarguy

@graphicguy - I say stick with the Q50 for now.  There will ALWAYS be deals on the TLX.

andres3

Co-Worker just bought a Hyundai Veloster, not as bad looking as I originally thought, and better from the front than the back. Stick-shift; I imagine that's a rare option.

She didn't know if it had the 1.6T?

qbrozen

@GG - something else to consider is what will happen in the next year. The Acura, being new and more expensive, will see steeper depreciation than your Q.

nyccarguy

@sda

Hey Steve! My mechanic diagnosed some front end issues I'm having back to a couple of bad rear bushings on the front lower control arms. I believe these are the hydraulic filled units you had replaced. Were yours replaced under warranty or through a recall? Thanks for your help!

Bradd

Edit: Thanks to GOOGLE and my record keeping when it comes to automobiles, I found a letter in my file from HONDA saying that the warranty is extended from 7 years of original purchase date or 100K miles on the Front Suspension Rear Lower Arm Bushing.

The truck is currently getting new rear pads & rotors on it for $515 including installation.

breld

andres3 said:

Co-Worker just bought a Hyundai Veloster, not as bad looking as I originally thought, and better from the front than the back. Stick-shift; I imagine that's a rare option.

She didn't know if it had the 1.6T?

I actually have a soft spot for the Veloster based on our brief ownership period.  The worst thing, and the reason (or excuse) for getting rid of it, was a horrendous blind spot.  

We had a base model with the auto (DCT).  The turbo would have been very welcome.  It's differentiated with unique wheels, center tailpipe, a subtle spoiler, and the obligatory "turbo" badge.  

ab348

Got back from my appointment with the dealer. Turned out the salesman who called and made the appointment was handed my file by mistake and immediately handed me off to Chris. the guy I dealt with previously.

According to him, there is an upcoming change in the dealer structure that will only see one Cadillac franchise for the entire area, and they want it, so they are trying to move as many Cadillacs as they can right now to prove their worth. Could be blowing smoke or possibly true, no way to know.

We talked about what I might like and I told him there was really only the possibility to a Cruze Premier or a new Equinox 2.0T that would interest me. The latter are only available around year-end so that wasn't going to be possible. He let me drive a Cruze Premier. Nice car, comfortable seats, rode well, decent room, but just adequate power. Not surprising coming out of an ATS. I could live with it but would depend on the deal.

As we're standing there talking about it he concludes that I really should get into a new ATS given the incentives being offered. I tell him I would only want something that did not have a black interior. I figured this would be a challenge since they order almost their entire inventory with black inside. They have one car that qualifies. It is out front on the raised podium: a 2017 ATS Premium Performance, loaded to the gills. 3.6, RWD, 18" wheels, same Red Obsession paint as mine outside but Kona Brown leather inside. I had looked at it earlier and saw that the sticker was $57K Cdn.

I drive it, it is wonderful. The only things I do not like about it are that it is the same color outside as my current car, and that being a Performance trim it comes with summer-only tires. Everything else about it is just a bit nicer than my car, or in some cases a lot nicer. But it stickers for $57K. No way.

We go back inside and he goes to the sales managers tower. After a long, long time he comes back and throws out some numbers that baffle me. He is talking a sales price of $42K - insane. But I can only get that price if I lease it through them. He quotes a 5.5% APR, a monthly payment of $729 on a 48 month term, and a $17500 residual. I can tell right away those numbers don't make much sense. But then he says that I just have to be in the lease for 6 months and I can buy the car for that price less the capital cost reductions my 6 months worth of payments reduced the $42K by, plus sales tax on the remaining lump sum. The lease is not a GM Financial lease, because he said the incentives when going through them are not as good. This is some other kind of lease that dealers have access to. He said they ordered this car a while ago and realized after a while that they were going to have a very hard time selling it at anything close to sticker, so they are nervous about it and want it gone. Also my remaining 5 months worth of payments on my current lease are waived and I walk out of the 2014 and into the 2017 without termination fees.

I don't know what to make of any of this but the option to lease it for 6 months and then buy it at what is a very good price is tempting. It is probably the only thing that makes sense given those numbers. I just wish I didn't have such a light-headed feeling.

28firefighter

ab348 said:

Got back from my appointment with the dealer. Turned out the salesman who called and made the appointment was handed my file by mistake and immediately handed me off to Chris. the guy I dealt with previously.

According to him, there is an upcoming change in the dealer structure that will only see one Cadillac franchise for the entire area, and they want it, so they are trying to move as many Cadillacs as they can right now to prove their worth. Could be blowing smoke or possibly true, no way to know.

We talked about what I might like and I told him there was really only the possibility to a Cruze Premier or a new Equinox 2.0T that would interest me. The latter are only available around year-end so that wasn't going to be possible. He let me drive a Cruze Premier. Nice car, comfortable seats, rode well, decent room, but just adequate power. Not surprising coming out of an ATS. I could live with it but would depend on the deal.

As we're standing there talking about it he concludes that I really should get into a new ATS given the incentives being offered. I tell him I would only want something that did not have a black interior. I figured this would be a challenge since they order almost their entire inventory with black inside. They have one car that qualifies. It is out front on the raised podium: a 2017 ATS Premium Performance, loaded to the gills. 3.6, RWD, 18" wheels, same Red Obsession paint as mine outside but Kona Brown leather inside. I had looked at it earlier and saw that the sticker was $57K Cdn.

I drive it, it is wonderful. The only things I do not like about it are that it is the same color outside as my current car, and that being a Performance trim it comes with summer-only tires. Everything else about it is just a bit nicer than my car, or in some cases a lot nicer. But it stickers for $57K. No way.

We go back inside and he goes to the sales managers tower. After a long, long time he comes back and throws out some numbers that baffle me. He is talking a sales price of $42K - insane. But I can only get that price if I lease it through them. He quotes a 5.5% APR, a monthly payment of $729 on a 48 month term, and a $17500 residual. I can tell right away those numbers don't make much sense. But then he says that I just have to be in the lease for 6 months and I can buy the car for that price less the capital cost reductions my 6 months worth of payments reduced the $42K by, plus sales tax on the remaining lump sum. The lease is not a GM Financial lease, because he said the incentives when going through them are not as good. This is some other kind of lease that dealers have access to. He said they ordered this car a while ago and realized after a while that they were going to have a very hard time selling it at anything close to sticker, so they are nervous about it and want it gone. Also my remaining 5 months worth of payments on my current lease are waived and I walk out of the 2014 and into the 2017 without termination fees.

I don't know what to make of any of this but the option to lease it for 6 months and then buy it at what is a very good price is tempting. It is probably the only thing that makes sense given those numbers. I just wish I didn't have such a light-headed feeling.

So typically in the US, when you perform a lease buyout, you owe the sum of all your remaining payments + the residual + sales tax on the residual. That means also paying all the interest over the life of the lease, which in this case is a MF of .0023 (or thereabouts). At least, I'm 99% sure that is how it works...

So by that math your buyout would be $17,500 (residual) + $30,618 (42 payments @ $729) = $48,118 + tax.

Could be different with this leasing company or by Canada rules, but that's just my experience.

Michaell

@ab348 - while I suspect the lease market in Canada is different than in the US, I can probably provide some general thoughts on your dealer encounter.

Third party banks are making inroads into leasing, given the high volume of lease transactions that are taking place - especially with luxury brands.

Third party bank leases generally have much higher money factors than GM Financial, but they make up for it with some pretty large incentives. That may explain why the $57K car suddenly became $42K.

I'd be wary about the "5 remaining lease payments are waived" comment. Most of the time, those payments are rolled into the new lease, unless there is a defined "pull ahead" program in place.

Let's use the numbers you've supplied and see where we are:

MSRP - $57K
Cap Cost - $42K
MF - .00229 (5.5% / 2400)
Residual - 31% (!) - that seems horrendously low, but it is a 48 month lease

My handy dandy home grown lease calculator gives me a payment of $644/mo, before tax. If the total tax rate is around 13%, then that gets you to the $729/mo number (well, pretty close).

Of that number, only $500 or so is going to depreciation, so subtract $3000 after 6 months.

Rarely does it make sense to buy out a lease early, but @breld did it with his Passat, so perhaps he can chime in on how that worked.

Again, things may be different in Canada, but I don't see anything really shocking here.

corvette

Too many moving parts for me--long, non-factory lease, incentives, entering into a lease with the intention of terminating it in a few months, etc. Too many opportunities to get shafted.

sda

nyccarguy said:

@sda

Hey Steve! My mechanic diagnosed some front end issues I'm having back to a couple of bad rear bushings on the front lower control arms. I believe these are the hydraulic filled units you had replaced. Were yours replaced under warranty or through a recall? Thanks for your help!

Bradd

Edit: Thanks to GOOGLE and my record keeping when it comes to automobiles, I found a letter in my file from HONDA saying that the warranty is extended from 7 years of original purchase date or 100K miles on the Front Suspension Rear Lower Arm Bushing.

The truck is currently getting new rear pads & rotors on it for $515 including installation.

nyccarguy said:

@sda

Hey Steve! My mechanic diagnosed some front end issues I'm having back to a couple of bad rear bushings on the front lower control arms. I believe these are the hydraulic filled units you had replaced. Were yours replaced under warranty or through a recall? Thanks for your help!

Bradd

Edit: Thanks to GOOGLE and my record keeping when it comes to automobiles, I found a letter in my file from HONDA saying that the warranty is extended from 7 years of original purchase date or 100K miles on the Front Suspension Rear Lower Arm Bushing.

The truck is currently getting new rear pads & rotors on it for $515 including installation.

Yes that sounds right. They are compliance bushings that are liquid filled and are covered and will include an alignment, at least that is what our dealer provided. Get it done before your mileage/time runs out. I understand the repair would cost $500+.

Sandman6472

Drove an X60 today and did like it! Hit the gas and damn, I was down the pike. Liked the comfy buckets and the covering felt nice to the touch, not sure if it's real leather but still, something I could live with. Being a coupe, the doors were a bit on the heavy side but, that's the thing about only having 2 doors, they weigh a bit more. Being a Infiniti/Nissan product, expect mileage to be pretty dismal but only drove it about 15 miles or so , so hard to tell on this. GG and NY would definitely know more about this but I get why they both like their vehicles.
In a perfect world, I could be happy with an X60 but since that ain't my world, nice to dream about having one though. But to be honest, in my mind, keep coming back to either a Mini Cooper or 328i for my next ride. Like the size of the Mini and everything about the 3 Series. What's the main difference between the 320i and the 328i? I know that the 320 can be had with a sunroof/moonroof, something I'm not willing to give up anymore. True, can only use it comfortably from November through mid April, but something that I no longer will compromise on. Would love a drop top but not sure I could live with the cowl shake and all the creaks and rattles that alwys seem to come with age.

The Sandman

qbrozen

We have had this lease buyout discussion before. Apparently, having to pay all remaining lease payments is not a universal given. I'm pretty sure breld is who said he did not have to in his case. 

roadburner

sandman_6472 said:

Drove an X60 today and did like it! Hit the gas and damn, I was down the pike. Liked the comfy buckets and the covering felt nice to the touch, not sure if it's real leather but still, something I could live with. Being a coupe, the doors were a bit on the heavy side but, that's the thing about only having 2 doors, they weigh a bit more. Being a Infiniti/Nissan product, expect mileage to be pretty dismal but only drove it about 15 miles or so , so hard to tell on this. GG and NY would definitely know more about this but I get why they both like their vehicles.
In a perfect world, I could be happy with an X60 but since that ain't my world, nice to dream about having one though. But to be honest, in my mind, keep coming back to either a Mini Cooper or 328i for my next ride. Like the size of the Mini and everything about the 3 Series. What's the main difference between the 320i and the 328i? I know that the 320 can be had with a sunroof/moonroof, something I'm not willing to give up anymore. True, can only use it comfortably from November through mid April, but something that I no longer will compromise on. Would love a drop top but not sure I could live with the cowl shake and all the creaks and rattles that alwys seem to come with age.

The Sandman

The 320i and 328i differ in standard equipment and engine tune. I sometimes see a heavily optioned 320i and sometimes I run across a 328i with almost no options. And everything in between. Me, I could live with a 320i manual, but if I wanted just two pedals it would have to be a 328i.

stickguy

Sandy, the 320 is basically just a lower optioned 328, with a detuned version of the same engine. Still more HP than your car, and i doubt you would notice the difference between the 320 and 328. Yes you can get a moonroof on the 320. Just not as many of the real fancy stuff options.

corvette

roadburner, darn, your dealership got that CPO BMW storefront open in a jiffy! Seems like only a few days ago that the building looked half-gutted.

nyccarguy

@sda thank-you for the quick response.  My independent mechanic quoted me $480 for the parts and $300 for the labor.  I'm at just over 6 years and 93,000 miles.  I'll call a Honda dealership to see what they say.  I'll have to make an appointment to have the work done.  

If you had never ever posted about your experiences with this particular bushing, I would have never known to research it and look through my folder.  Thanks for the knowledge.  You saved me close to $800.

qbrozen

sandman_6472 said:

Drove an X60 today and did like it! Hit the gas and damn, I was down the pike. Liked the comfy buckets and the covering felt nice to the touch, not sure if it's real leather but still, something I could live with. Being a coupe, the doors were a bit on the heavy side but, that's the thing about only having 2 doors, they weigh a bit more. Being a Infiniti/Nissan product, expect mileage to be pretty dismal but only drove it about 15 miles or so , so hard to tell on this. GG and NY would definitely know more about this but I get why they both like their vehicles.
In a perfect world, I could be happy with an X60 but since that ain't my world, nice to dream about having one though. But to be honest, in my mind, keep coming back to either a Mini Cooper or 328i for my next ride. Like the size of the Mini and everything about the 3 Series. What's the main difference between the 320i and the 328i? I know that the 320 can be had with a sunroof/moonroof, something I'm not willing to give up anymore. True, can only use it comfortably from November through mid April, but something that I no longer will compromise on. Would love a drop top but not sure I could live with the cowl shake and all the creaks and rattles that alwys seem to come with age.

The Sandman

What is an X60??

stickguy

I think he meant Infiniti Q60

stickguy

speaking of Infinitis, while I am not a fan of graphite guts, I really like this one. At least the outside is white. Miles not bad, seems on the lower end of what is advertised right now price was.

plus, it is barely over 2 years in service, so has 22 months of BtoB warranty left. Plus, it was already sold as a CPO, so if that carries over, many miles of extra coverage.

yet, I am not buying now!

https://www.cars.com/vehicledetail/detail/700427761/overview/

roadburner

corvette said:

roadburner, darn, your dealership got that CPO BMW storefront open in a jiffy! Seems like only a few days ago that the building looked half-gutted.

Yes, it was faster than I expected. I helped drive the CPO cars over to the new store on Saturday.

breld

qbrozen said:

We have had this lease buyout discussion before. Apparently, having to pay all remaining lease payments is not a universal given. I'm pretty sure breld is who said he did not have to in his case. 

I'm sure there are variances among lessors, but generally your payoff is calculated as the initial cap cost, plus an applied interest charge each month, less monthly payments made.

In other words, it works much like a traditional auto loan, except the interest is generally not called "interest," and at the end of the term, you have the option of turning in the car to satisfy the remaining payoff (the predetermined residual).

Since you're paying much less along the way than a traditional auto loan, you'll almost always be upside down compared to the value of the car until lease end.

stickguy

actually, this one really interests me. Love the colors. Got the hot rod motor (well, by my standards). Lots of goodies. Probably super comfy. Low miles, and cheap. This actually could be a really good deal. Lots of car, not much money, and should be able to drive a few years for barely anything if you don't put a lot of miles on. Would work perfectly for my needs right now! And yes, I know what make it is!

http://www.jsautohaus.net/used/Buick/2011-Buick-Regal-8d2f62090a0e08bd10261a7a9bfc5c7e.htm

this is probably a pretty good deal too. Would be a good car for a teen. Get right through college without costing a fortune!

http://www.jsautohaus.net/used/Ford/2014-Ford-Fusion-18c10dcf0a0e08bd03a3a15347b0be37.htm

an even better one for that purpose.

http://www.jsautohaus.net/used/Hyundai/2016-Hyundai-Sonata-dab69a250a0e08be37faf84c8128367f.htm

stickguy

OK, now this one, I love this one. Nicely equipped super low mile Volvo wagon, in perfect colors? At $23,995, this one is definitely cheap. Has to be under warranty too. Dang. This could be a winner!

http://www.jsautohaus.net/used/Volvo/2016-Volvo-V60-d4f7340d0a0e08bc15ee6af679ed85f6.htm

28firefighter

stickguy said:

OK, now this one, I love this one. Nicely equipped super low mile Volvo wagon, in perfect colors? At $23,995, this one is definitely cheap. Has to be under warranty too. Dang. This could be a winner!

http://www.jsautohaus.net/used/Volvo/2016-Volvo-V60-d4f7340d0a0e08bc15ee6af679ed85f6.htm

Dude, your are all over the board. Not that I am any different...

The current object of my affection is the 2017 Explorer Sport. I had one last week while traveling on business in Indiana and it was really nice.