Chronic Car Buyers Anonymous (Archived)

roadburner

venture said:

henryn said:

Found this buried in the fine print for a used car listing. And this is a Cadillac dealership, I would expect better.

"Pre-Owned Vehicle Pricing does not include taxes, state fees, or dealer fees, including a $1288.50 Recon Fee which may cover the following reconditioning issues cosmetic refurbishing, full detail, new tires, windshield, any major repairs or maintenance, and safety check."

What was the old saying? "Crooks, d___ crooks, and car dealers"

I wonder what the extra 50 cents is for?

Complimentary Vaseline?

pensfan83

Most institutions will finance it as long as it's within their allowable LTV ratio. When the credit app is transmitted to underwriting through indirect (dealer) channels the relevant information like sales price, doc fees, taxes, interest rate quoted, etc. are all listed but the sale price doesn't have a breakdown showing the aftermarket/ADM.

In this case though the down payment brought the LTV down to a roughly 108% so it was approved and only once F&I sent everything over would we know the reason for selling over MSRP was aftermarket, ADM, etc. At that point it doesn't matter what it's for because our credit exposure is within our guidelines. That being said I agree it is misleading.

henryn

I have never understood why financial institutions will loan more than the purchase price on a new car. We see this quite often, people who are upside down on one car trading it in, rolling the negative equity into the next car loan. They buy a new $30k car and wind up owing $35k or even $40k. It strikes me that should be a personal loan, at 8 or 10% or more, not a car loan at 4% (rough numbers there).

graphicguy

Michaell said:

graphicguy said:

Re the MR2 refurb......I think the biggest issue of that show was the fact the engine had to be pulled to get to some small hose. Engine bay (mid-engined) was miniscule, too.

While I think cosmetically the car was fine. But, they had to rebuild the turbo, too. I don’t remember what the mileage was, but given the body and interior were in good shape, I can’t imagine it was very high mileage. So, rebuilding a turbo means it was either not cared for and/or abused.

Looked like the top end of the engine needed to be rebuilt. That’s a lot of work.

I had that same motor (without turbo) in my Toyota GTS F/X16, which I auto crossed. That thing was bullet proof.

Loved the adjustable shocks on it, too.

But, a Toyota that needed that much work was unusual and tells me there were some maintenance issues and abuse issues with the car before Wheeler-Dealer tackled it.

I don't believe they mentioned the mileage (they rarely do). To me, it seemed like some maintenance was deferred, then it got out of hand. Which, I suspect, was why the previous owner wanted to sell it (plus, he already had one).

Original owner kept the "good one". Let's face facts....if those shows only bought cars that just needed a "lil this and a lil that", they wouldn't be all that interesting.

DOHC motor, but I had forgotten how small those cams were in the 2.0. They weren't much bigger than a magic marker.

pensfan83

henryn said:

I have never understood why financial institutions will loan more than the purchase price on a new car. We see this quite often, people who are upside down on one car trading it in, rolling the negative equity into the next car loan. They buy a new $30k car and wind up owing $35k or even $40k. It strikes me that should be a personal loan, at 8 or 10% or more, not a car loan at 4% (rough numbers there).

It's a calculated risk the FI takes and why there are tiers for credit worthiness. If the FI is approving a loan that is > 100% LTV it's because the applicant(s) have a history of repaying their debt. For those with a checkered past the bank adjusts the terms accordingly whether it's a cap on the term, higher interest rate, or requiring a lower LTV ratio. In many instances the applicant(s) may not be approved at all and need to go the subprime route.

tifighter

28firefighter said:

I was looking at that. For the cost of a well kept 996, you could get a 987 Cayman S. 

The problem with the Cayman is, you can't tell your friends you have a 911. Thus the 996 remains popular...

28firefighter

Part of the reason I love this community is that we don't buy cars for their bragging rights or status, but rather because we truly enjoy driving them. Sometimes I forget about that entirely.

28firefighter

Also a side note, I get more compliments from the most random places on the Viggen. Some are just excited to see a Viggen that isn't completely trashed. Last night was from a guy driving a Mustang Cobra who was also decked out in Giants gear. He gets a pass because of the car.

laurasdada

The very red Giulia in my condo garage, which became a very white Giulia for a time, then turned back to red, then became a very black Giulia for a very long time is now red again.

Any updates on the Stelvios here? Apologies if I missed updates...

qbrozen

laurasdada said:

The very red Giulia in my condo garage, which became a very white Giulia for a time, then turned back to red, then became a very black Giulia for a very long time is now red again.

Any updates on the Stelvios here? Apologies if I missed updates...

well, mine has yet to change color

28firefighter

@qbrozen is already looking for ways to flip his. Kidding. Kind of.

Mine has been largely perfect, though I do have to take it in for a recall here sometime soon. I like it quite a bit, but have also been enjoying driving the Saab the past couple weeks.

pensfan83

I'm looking forward to getting the Prelude inspected so I can use it for the next 6 weeks before it's stashed for the winter. I'll probably drive it a fair bit over the next week since I've been out of town this week and it's mostly sat due to lack of stickers.

breld

@pensfan83 - that's a very interesting story. I'm always interested in what goes on behind the scenes of a dealership (financing being part of it).

Wife and I have an appointment this afternoon with the general sales manager of the dealership where we purchased the Golf R. We still have yet to receive any title work on it, this after about two and a half months after the purchase. This is annoying enough if you want to plate the car, but further complicating the issue is that we, as you all know, sold the car already.

We've been following up with the dealership for about a month now - the first pass resulted in them blaming the slow DMV, but a physical visit to the dealership prompted them to look more into it, which revealed that they had a mix-up with the previous lienholder. Yesterday, they e-mailed my wife some documents they claimed would allow us to register the vehicle. I knew it wouldn't cut it, but we visited the DMV anyway just to say we did. What the dealership provided us was the previous owner's bank information and the power of attorney that the previous owner had signed...all of course with his personal information.

We're contemplating filing a complaint with the Department of Revenue Auto Division, but wanted to give the GSM a chance.

stickguy

And maybe buy a car while you are there?

stickguy

How did you sell it though? Or do you still have it, pending working this mess out?

corvette

Two of my friends have new Jeep Renegades and they both report the same Uconnect issues I experienced in the Cherokee I rented, except they have Android phones. Sounds like Chrysler has a problem with the new Uconnect head units. 

breld

stickguy said:

How did you sell it though? Or do you still have it, pending working this mess out?

Well, we sold it to a co-worker, so it's a friendly deal.

What we have is a bill of sale, payment from him, and he has a loan with his bank.

Problem is, the DMV's system still shows the original owner (who traded it into the dealership) as the one and only owner. So until we are in the system as an owner, our friend is unable to register it. I actually called the DMV prior to completing the sale - they claimed it would be fine, but I think they misunderstood what I was saying.

The title itself can follow, but we need the system to get on track. And that's up to the dealership.

corvette

Got the G37 back. Wallet $1,100 lighter until Dad reimburses me. The sky was overcast, but the color match looks to be excellent. The area around the fog lights is unfinished black plastic. On most cars, this is a removable surround, but on Nissans and Infinitis, it’s just part of the bumper that has to be masked off. The mask job in that area was not perfect, and I’ve seen similar on other Nissans. I think it’s okay but I’m going to wait until I can see it in better light to decide. 

kyfdx

Just noticed the new 2019 Altima is available with AWD.

That might bring that model back from the dead (or, at least, from the rental car lots). A point of differentiation from Camry/Accord. Not that it's helped the Legacy, much.

tbirdmarco

 Agree with you 28 fire fighter, I’m why I like this community in here so much enjoyed reading all the postings, I can’t drive and enjoy the car ha ha I could still read about it in a lease sit in them and enjoy almost as much it is what it is. Glad you got your car back Corvette nice to hear from you Laura Starla Apple’s been going well. Broiled sorry to hear about the mess the DM V is giving you with your sold Volkswagen golf   Hopefully clear up the mess real soon that’s insane, maybe yes like stick guy said, you can buy another car he win the wife while you’re there. We’ll see what happens with the new Ultima yes as will be able to drive now. Want to see one in person soon, but there’s none here on dealer lot as of yet search on cars.com. So we shall see. 

nyccarguy

@pensfan83 - great story! Thanks for sharing! I'm always astonished at the lengths people will go through to be deceitful.

fintail

New Altima actually isn't bad looking, for what it is. Faux floating C-pillar is painfully lame, but it is an improvement over the fleet fodder current model, and AWD won't hurt in this area anyway.

carnaught

The new Altima exterior, I agree, isn't bad looking. The interior, not so much, especially with a choice of either black or gray colors...nah.

ab348

fintail said:

New Altima actually isn't bad looking, for what it is. Faux floating C-pillar is painfully lame, but it is an improvement over the fleet fodder current model, and AWD won't hurt in this area anyway.

Having had an AWD car I tend to question its use for most people. Great if you are traveling a lot and have to deal with foul weather, as long as it is equipped with proper tires for the purpose. But most of the time it just adds cost and weight, and reduces performance and fuel economy, for not a whole lot of benefit.

kyfdx

ab348 said:

fintail said:

New Altima actually isn't bad looking, for what it is. Faux floating C-pillar is painfully lame, but it is an improvement over the fleet fodder current model, and AWD won't hurt in this area anyway.

Having had an AWD car I tend to question its use for most people. Great if you are traveling a lot and have to deal with foul weather, as long as it is equipped with proper tires for the purpose. But most of the time it just adds cost and weight, and reduces performance and fuel economy, for not a whole lot of benefit.

Doesn't matter if you are right or wrong, but the market disagrees with you.

qbrozen

ab348 said:

New Altima actually isn't bad looking, for what it is. Faux floating C-pillar is painfully lame, but it is an improvement over the fleet fodder current model, and AWD won't hurt in this area anyway.

Having had an AWD car I tend to question its use for most people. Great if you are traveling a lot and have to deal with foul weather, as long as it is equipped with proper tires for the purpose. But most of the time it just adds cost and weight, and reduces performance and fuel economy, for not a whole lot of benefit.

the reduce performance argument is not one that covers all examples. A high-powered, understeering, FWD car will almost always beneft with AWD. 

nyccarguy

qbrozen said:

ab348 said:

fintail said:

New Altima actually isn't bad looking, for what it is. Faux floating C-pillar is painfully lame, but it is an improvement over the fleet fodder current model, and AWD won't hurt in this area anyway.

Having had an AWD car I tend to question its use for most people. Great if you are traveling a lot and have to deal with foul weather, as long as it is equipped with proper tires for the purpose. But most of the time it just adds cost and weight, and reduces performance and fuel economy, for not a whole lot of benefit.

the reduce performance argument is not one that covers all examples. A high-powered, understeering, FWD car will almost always beneft with AWD. 

It also gives those of us with high-powered RWD (based) cars 2 extra wheels to spin

tbirdmarco

 Agree with the commenters above, don’t know why they keep ordering such lean interior colors. 

henryn

qbrozen said:

ab348 said:

fintail said:

New Altima actually isn't bad looking, for what it is. Faux floating C-pillar is painfully lame, but it is an improvement over the fleet fodder current model, and AWD won't hurt in this area anyway.

Having had an AWD car I tend to question its use for most people. Great if you are traveling a lot and have to deal with foul weather, as long as it is equipped with proper tires for the purpose. But most of the time it just adds cost and weight, and reduces performance and fuel economy, for not a whole lot of benefit.

the reduce performance argument is not one that covers all examples. A high-powered, understeering, FWD car will almost always beneft with AWD. 

-=-=-=-=-=-=- end quoted text -=-=-=-=-=-=-=-

Well.... kinda sorta. The performance in the realm of handling / cornering may improve, but not acceleration.

Hmmm.... If you're really overpowered, and having problems with the launch, AWD can indeed improve your 1/8 or 1/4 mile times. The last time I went out to watch the illegal Saturday night street races there was a guy in a Subaru WRX kicking some serious tail due to his ability to get off the line very quickly.

tifighter

That’s the Tesla’s party trick; immediate torque at all wheels. Instant warp speed. Thankfully, it costs less than $6 to ‘fill up’ as it is hard not to launch it all the time.

fintail

AWD might be of limited real world use, but it is a selling point. I live in an area that might have half a dozen really icy mornings a year, but AWD is seen as a necessity, and is also kind of a "lifestyle" feature, for people who have dogs and beards and go hiking or skiing once every 18 months.

ab348

fintail said:

AWD might be of limited real world use, but it is a selling point. I live in an area that might have half a dozen really icy mornings a year, but AWD is seen as a necessity, and is also kind of a "lifestyle" feature, for people who have dogs and beards and go hiking or skiing once every 18 months.

That last line describes just about every SUV/CUV commercial I have ever seen.

ab348

qbrozen said:

ab348 said:

fintail said:

New Altima actually isn't bad looking, for what it is. Faux floating C-pillar is painfully lame, but it is an improvement over the fleet fodder current model, and AWD won't hurt in this area anyway.

Having had an AWD car I tend to question its use for most people. Great if you are traveling a lot and have to deal with foul weather, as long as it is equipped with proper tires for the purpose. But most of the time it just adds cost and weight, and reduces performance and fuel economy, for not a whole lot of benefit.

the reduce performance argument is not one that covers all examples. A high-powered, understeering, FWD car will almost always beneft with AWD. 

Uhhh, we're talking Altimas here...

breld

tifighter said:

That’s the Tesla’s party trick; immediate torque at all wheels. Instant warp speed. Thankfully, it costs less than $6 to ‘fill up’ as it is hard not to launch it all the time.

How is the Tesla experience going?  

tifighter

breld said:

tifighter said:

That’s the Tesla’s party trick; immediate torque at all wheels. Instant warp speed. Thankfully, it costs less than $6 to ‘fill up’ as it is hard not to launch it all the time.

How is the Tesla experience going?  

I really like it. I got an over the air update last night that added some features to the car, like using the existing autopilot camera as a dashcam, new navi features, connectivity to your calendar, interface updates, and a bunch of other stuff (like Atari games, seriously). Pretty cool to get upgrades after you’ve already purchased it, while at home. Otherwise, it’s fun to drive, quiet, and has a ton of storage space. My wife likes putting groceries in the frunk just because there’s a frunk. I like flooring it and getting tunnel vision. I cannot imagine someone being disappointed by the test drive.

TL;DR- it won’t be my last Tesla.

@breld Orders before Oct 15th are guaranteed to be delivered before the end of the year for the full federal tax credit. So if you need my referral code...

qbrozen

ab348 said:

ab348 said:

New Altima actually isn't bad looking, for what it is. Faux floating C-pillar is painfully lame, but it is an improvement over the fleet fodder current model, and AWD won't hurt in this area anyway.

Having had an AWD car I tend to question its use for most people. Great if you are traveling a lot and have to deal with foul weather, as long as it is equipped with proper tires for the purpose. But most of the time it just adds cost and weight, and reduces performance and fuel economy, for not a whole lot of benefit.

the reduce performance argument is not one that covers all examples. A high-powered, understeering, FWD car will almost always beneft with AWD. 

Uhhh, we're talking Altimas here...

Weellll...actually, you said "having an AWD car I tend to question its use for most people." So it was a blanket statement beyond Altimas. Although I don't disagree that most people don't need it. I was only disagreeing with its impact on car physics.

ab348

Whatever. Most people don’t drive hi-po cars. 

suydam

tifighter said:

breld said:

tifighter said:

That’s the Tesla’s party trick; immediate torque at all wheels. Instant warp speed. Thankfully, it costs less than $6 to ‘fill up’ as it is hard not to launch it all the time.

How is the Tesla experience going?  

I really like it. I got an over the air update last night that added some features to the car, like using the existing autopilot camera as a dashcam, new navi features, connectivity to your calendar, interface updates, and a bunch of other stuff (like Atari games, seriously). Pretty cool to get upgrades after you’ve already purchased it, while at home. Otherwise, it’s fun to drive, quiet, and has a ton of storage space. My wife likes putting groceries in the frunk just because there’s a frunk. I like flooring it and getting tunnel vision. I cannot imagine someone being disappointed by the test drive.

TL;DR- it won’t be my last Tesla.

@breld Orders before Oct 15th are guaranteed to be delivered before the end of the year for the full federal tax credit. So if you need my referral code...

Is it bigger than the Volt? I haven’t seen that model very often.

nyccarguy

tifighter said:

tifighter said:

That’s the Tesla’s party trick; immediate torque at all wheels. Instant warp speed. Thankfully, it costs less than $6 to ‘fill up’ as it is hard not to launch it all the time.

How is the Tesla experience going?  

I really like it. I got an over the air update last night that added some features to the car, like using the existing autopilot camera as a dashcam, new navi features, connectivity to your calendar, interface updates, and a bunch of other stuff (like Atari games, seriously). Pretty cool to get upgrades after you’ve already purchased it, while at home. Otherwise, it’s fun to drive, quiet, and has a ton of storage space. My wife likes putting groceries in the frunk just because there’s a frunk. I like flooring it and getting tunnel vision. I cannot imagine someone being disappointed by the test drive. TL;DR- it won’t be my last Tesla. @breld Orders before Oct 15th are guaranteed to be delivered before the end of the year for the full federal tax credit. So if you need my referral code...

I’m glad you are enjoying the car and the ownership experience.  Model S & Model X Tesla’s are all over the place here.  I’m starting to see Model 3s in the wild now too.  It is intriguing for sure.  I MIGHT bite if the price point ever gets low enough.

tifighter

suydam said:

tifighter said:

breld said:

tifighter said:

That’s the Tesla’s party trick; immediate torque at all wheels. Instant warp speed. Thankfully, it costs less than $6 to ‘fill up’ as it is hard not to launch it all the time.

How is the Tesla experience going?  

I really like it. I got an over the air update last night that added some features to the car, like using the existing autopilot camera as a dashcam, new navi features, connectivity to your calendar, interface updates, and a bunch of other stuff (like Atari games, seriously). Pretty cool to get upgrades after you’ve already purchased it, while at home. Otherwise, it’s fun to drive, quiet, and has a ton of storage space. My wife likes putting groceries in the frunk just because there’s a frunk. I like flooring it and getting tunnel vision. I cannot imagine someone being disappointed by the test drive.

TL;DR- it won’t be my last Tesla.

@breld Orders before Oct 15th are guaranteed to be delivered before the end of the year for the full federal tax credit. So if you need my referral code...

Is it bigger than the Volt? I haven’t seen that model very often.

A quick google search shows the Model 3 is 4 inches longer then the Volt.

nyccarguy

tifighter said:

tifighter said:

That’s the Tesla’s party trick; immediate torque at all wheels. Instant warp speed. Thankfully, it costs less than $6 to ‘fill up’ as it is hard not to launch it all the time.

How is the Tesla experience going?  

I really like it. I got an over the air update last night that added some features to the car, like using the existing autopilot camera as a dashcam, new navi features, connectivity to your calendar, interface updates, and a bunch of other stuff (like Atari games, seriously). Pretty cool to get upgrades after you’ve already purchased it, while at home. Otherwise, it’s fun to drive, quiet, and has a ton of storage space. My wife likes putting groceries in the frunk just because there’s a frunk. I like flooring it and getting tunnel vision. I cannot imagine someone being disappointed by the test drive. TL;DR- it won’t be my last Tesla. @breld Orders before Oct 15th are guaranteed to be delivered before the end of the year for the full federal tax credit. So if you need my referral code...

Is it bigger than the Volt? I haven’t seen that model very often.

A quick google search shows the Model 3 is 4 inches longer then the Volt.

A friend of mine just picked up a Model S 75D.  He’s happy!

tbirdmarco

 Glad you’re liking your Tesla model three experience love hearing about that car, they definitely interest me. Enjoyed reading everything else above everyone. 

corvette

The thing I found disappointing on the new Altima is that I think AWD is only available with the base, non-turbo engine. 

fintail

How does the dashcam feature work for recording, does it have a micro SD slot for recording, or does it integrate into a standard SD slot that many cars have had for a few years now? Front and rear camera?

Now if we could just get about 500 real world miles of range

tifighter said:

I really like it. I got an over the air update last night that added some features to the car, like using the existing autopilot camera as a dashcam,

@breld Orders before Oct 15th are guaranteed to be delivered before the end of the year for the full federal tax credit. So if you need my referral code...

Michaell

Took the Jetta in today for it's second (and likely, it's last) service at the dealer.

26 months and less than 13,000 miles. Oil change, cabin air filter and tire rotation.

@jpp5862 and @breld met me and we walked the VW, Volvo, Audi and Mazda lots (same owner).

Took a closer look at the Mazda 6. They had both a GT ($30K MSRP) and a Signature ($34K MSRP) on the lot. Both with the turbo engine. These are very nice cars. Didn't have time for a test drive - I'll get back to it in the near future.

On the VW lot, there were a couple of Passat GTs, and in between them was a Passat SE w/ Tech. All were priced at around $30K MSRP. The SE w/ Tech has adaptive cruise, while the GT does not. Is 100HP extra an acceptable trade off?

Also saw 4 identical white 2019 Jetta R-Lines in a row.

The Volvo dealer had a very pretty V90 XC in the showroom. Metallic brown with a khaki interior. $10K off sticker. No 2019 S60's there, yet.

tbirdmarco

 Very nice Michael on your guys car browsing yesterday but you were car was in the shop getting service done. 

tbirdmarco

 Corvette yes for now just the beast engines getting it, any trim level from what I hear. If demand high enough or wanted to edit to the turbo one in the near future. 

Drivingfool

I've been doing around 13K/year since I got the Golf. This year should be a bit less as I didn't drive it in May, only my son did a few days when he flew in for my surgery. But that was basically from the house to the hospital and back a few times. Should hit 45K in a day or two.
Wife took the train to Indianapolis yesterday and went to D.C. first. Got there at 5 am today and now is on another train to Indiana and will arrive at 7 am. I'd rather fly but she won't so she does the train. This train is smaller so she says she feels a lot of bumps, but she's in business class. She had a sleeper on yesterdays train and it was pretty long to be honest. Once I retire, might try a train trip. It's about 4 hours from here to St. Cloud/Kissimmee where the oldest is moving and the station is near her new house so could always do that.

Mr_Shiftright

nyccarguy said:

qbrozen said:

ab348 said:

fintail said:

New Altima actually isn't bad looking, for what it is. Faux floating C-pillar is painfully lame, but it is an improvement over the fleet fodder current model, and AWD won't hurt in this area anyway.

Having had an AWD car I tend to question its use for most people. Great if you are traveling a lot and have to deal with foul weather, as long as it is equipped with proper tires for the purpose. But most of the time it just adds cost and weight, and reduces performance and fuel economy, for not a whole lot of benefit.

the reduce performance argument is not one that covers all examples. A high-powered, understeering, FWD car will almost always beneft with AWD. 

It also gives those of us with high-powered RWD (based) cars 2 extra wheels to spin

I think the original Mitsubishi EVO proved that AWD in the hands of a good driver can be a very effective weapon on the track.

corvette

Got the G37 back. It was raining this morning. Went to fill up with gas and the traction control kicked in when I tried to take off from a stop. It's deceptively fast!