Chronic Car Buyers Anonymous (Archived)

tifighter

It turned over 80K last week, and it's starting to feel a little bit like an old car.

Question for Michael: when you replace this one, would you get another Saturn? You've been a Saturn guy to the core, but I'm curious if the uncertainty around the brand will make you choose differently next time...

fezo

Yeah, we just losta Saturn dealer locally. Got to be more of that coming.

michaellno

Question for Michael: when you replace this one, would you get another Saturn? You've been a Saturn guy to the core, but I'm curious if the uncertainty around the brand will make you choose differently next time...

If I absolutely had to buy a new car in the next 72 hours, I would probably not get another Saturn. They just don't make anything that really excites me:

Astra: like the looks, but it seems underpowered and doesn't have all the features that I really want (no aux jack for the stereo - are you kidding me?)

Aura: not really convinced that I want a 4-door sedan again

Sky: love it - especially the Redline - but don't really fit - my eyes are the exact same height as the top of the windshield

VUE: already have one (2008 XR V6 AWD)

Outlook: too big

It does make me a bit sad, though .. my experiences with my local dealer, from both a sales and service perspective, have been nothing but superb. The dealer group they are affiliated with owns, I believe, 5 Saturn dealerships - 2 in Denver, 2 in Co. Springs and 1 in Pueblo.

I am watching very carefully how GM deals with Saturn. I know that a "task force" that includes Saturn executives and dealers is looking into options. The nationwide dealer network is about 400 strong and, when you think about it, Saturn doesn't really sell anything that is unique to the brand - everything is either a rebadged GM or Opel offering.

The idea of a "Saturn Distribution Company" makes sense, where they would partner with a manufacturer and simply use the dealer network to sell someone else's goods. Fiat comes to mind, if they were to wise up and ditch the pathetic relationship they have with Chrysler.

No, if I had to buy something within 72 hours, my top choices would be (in no particular order):

1) Honda Fit Sport
2) Pontiac Vibe GT
3) Used Chevrolet Impala SS (I know, a sedan, but 303HP does have a certain allure)
4) Used Mustang GT
5) CPO 3-series coupe (if I could find one with the right equipment at the right price)
6) Used Sebring convertible

Hopefully, I can get another couple of years out of the L300 .. it's not that she's become downtrodden, just a bit rough around the edges. I'm afraid that it's going to need some serious $$$ invested into it, but as long as it's less than a car payment for 4-5 years, it makes sense to do so.

What needs to be done:

1) left rear power door lock doesn't work on the first try
2) power seats only move fore and aft (and maybe recline)
3) intermittent warning light from the dash - something transmission related
4) shocks are starting to make noise over speed bumps
5) burned out left fog light

woodyww

the L300 .. it's not that she's become downtrodden, just a bit rough around the edges. I'm afraid that it's going to need some serious $$$ invested into it

Personally, I wouldn't put serious $$$ into repairs on it, for lots of reasons, like the age, all the stuff already wrong with it, etc. OTOH, if you can nurse it along by spending I dunno, $100/month, I could see that.

Problem comes maybe when it needs a $500-$1000-$2000 repair(s), & the car's only worth a couple thou. Plus the aggrevation. I'd be out test driving new cars, just in case......

tifighter

I'd be out test driving new cars, just in case......

I like woody :shades:

andre1969

Oh yeah, and the AC crapped out last summer. That car, although it looked decent enough, had many little defects as time went on, things that were never talked about, but were there. At least it was cheap when new. I suspect she'll tire of the Corolla and replace it long before it dies. She gets 5-10 years out of a car usually before she wants to move on.

Well, as a reference point, my uncle's '03 Corolla has about 169,000 miles on it, and is still running well. And he hasn't been particularly kind to it. The only real trouble points were the catalytic converter, which started crapping out around 100,000 miles, and the water pump, which I think went out around 145-150,000. I had to take him to the hospital yesterday for some procedure, and I drove it. Miserable little torture chamber for me and my long legs, but I guess if you're of more average height, it's not too bad.

I also hate the way the thing rides and handles, but I think that's more a problem with me being used to big cars, than any failing of the Corolla itself.

michaellno

Personally, I wouldn't put serious $$$ into repairs on it, for lots of reasons, like the age, all the stuff already wrong with it, etc. OTOH, if you can nurse it along by spending I dunno, $100/month, I could see that.

Funny you should mention that ... since I paid off the car in November 2007, I've averaged about $77/month on maintenance and repair costs. So, I'm ahead of the game a bit, based on your estimates.

Like you, I'm worried about the $1-2K repair. I've had a few of them already in the time I've owned it, but $2K is better than the $15-20K a new or used car would cost.

When I bought it, the wife wanted it to last 8 years. I'm almost at 6.5, so another couple of years should put me right around 100K miles.

As much as I'd love to go car shopping, it will only make me want what I can't have. In the past couple of months, I've looked at both the Vibe GT and the Suzuki SX4 (drove the Vibe). I'm trying to stay away from the dealers, but it can be hard at times.

boomchek

I never liked the Corolla's seat/steering/pedal postion layout. I could never get comfortable in one, and I'm only 5'10". If I push the seat far enough that my legs are comfortable with the pedals, then I'm too far away from the steering wheel. If i move up closer to the steering wheel, then my legs aren't comfortable with the pedals. :mad:

michaellno

I hear ya on the Corolla.

A friend of ours has one and I had the chance to drive it once. Same thing - I'm only 5'11", and I felt cramped behind the wheel. Not enough headroom, and the seats didn't go back far enough.

One last thought regarding a replacement for the L - the Denver Auto Show is next week (April 1-5). I think I'll go down and wander around .. gives me the chance to sit in and examine the new cars without the pressure of a salesman.

andre1969

Like you, I'm worried about the $1-2K repair. I've had a few of them already in the time I've owned it, but $2K is better than the $15-20K a new or used car would cost.

My Intrepid pulled one of those on me just a couple weeks ago. I was on the way home after picking up a friend from the airport, had the defogger on, and about a half mile from home the car started squealing like a pig and acting like it wanted to stall out. By the time I pulled into the yard, smoke was coming from under the hood. Turns out the a/c compressor seized up and pretty much destroyed the whole system. To the tune of $1,301.79. :sick:

That repair bill put my monthly average, since the car was paid off in November 2004, up to around $104. If it hadn't been for that repair, I'd be hovering around $79/mo.

I guess I could've just been a cheap b@stard and let it stay broken. But then with my luck the power windows would start failing, and there ain't much worse than busted a/c and a bad power window in the middle of summer!

That's the most expensive single repair the Intrepid has ever had, but it also came around 144,600 miles, so I guess I can't complain! If that car makes it to November 6 of this year, that'll be its 10 year anniversary. It's amazing how the time flies!

anonymousposts

Gee picked up the IS250 and is headed back home. I have decided not to buy the 330 but yes, we were going to buy both of them and get of our Accord.

fintail

My mother is a somewhat frumpy 5'6"...she says she likes the car very much so far. She's mentioned the outside temperature gauge and the CD changer to me twice - funny the little things that captivate some people. Her main complaint is that she claims it gets dusty inside too fast, and the floor mats get dirty too easily. I am sure I won't be too wowed by its comfort or performance when I visit her next, but for someone older and shorter who doesn't drive on the highway often, it might be a good fit.

anonymousposts

found a private owner 06 330 6-speed manual with premium, cold weather, and sport package. It has 47,000 miles. He is asking $21800. May go look at it tomorrow.

stickguy

depending on what time zone these posts are at, Gee should be passing about 3 miles from my house right about now (assuming eastern time!)

stickguy

looks like pacific time, so he should be passing by around 3 hours from now.

tell him to swing by if he needs to use the guest room!

anonymousposts

He drove to PA last night and stopped about 3 AM. Left the hotel at 10 AM and is almost home. Said he had a great ride back in the IS. 30 MPG average and no aches and pains.

qbrozen

Hmmm.. that's about dealer asking price on that. He's gotta come down at least $1500 to even be reasonable. Its worth round about $18,5 on a trade.

oregonboy

High miles... what color?
(It seems like 80% of recent BMWs are black... not my 1st choice)

anonymousposts

silver exterior with black interior. He bought it from an Infiniti dealer last year and has had a drastic reduction in income. This is their third car so they are selling it.

woodyww

my uncle's '03 Corolla has about 169,000 miles on it, and is still running well

I co-owned a '79 Corolla with my ex for 7 years, & all it ever needed was a waterpump & 1 set of tires. Funny how a person can bond with a little tinnny car with bad handling when it never seems to break, & gets great mileage.....I still miss that little sucker (the Corolla, not the ex!)......

nippononly

Funny how a person can bond with a little tinnny car with bad handling when it never seems to break, & gets great mileage

You have just described my relationship with my Echo to a tee. I am also very fond of how light it is (curb weight = 2100 pounds).

But now there's the internet/fleet guy at my local Honda dealer e-mailing me that he will let me have his very last new '08 Civic SI, red, for $18,234 (MSRP = $21,990), and boy oh boy, the Echo love just isn't sufficient to fully quell my interest in that deal....I should go for a LONG drive far from the Honda dealer after work, yet I fear that I will instead be drawn towards it like a moth to a flame. :-/

tifighter

coupe or sedan?

nippononly

coupe

woodyww

That's $3756 off the list price (!). How does that price compare with that of an '09 SI? It's hard to imagine regretting buying a new SI, esp. if you get a semi-decent trade on the echo.

If you want it, & it's a great deal.....well.....oh, & it'll probably last forever, gets great mileage, nice interior, & performance......I'm almost ready to buy one myself......

andre1969

She's mentioned the outside temperature gauge and the CD changer to me twice - funny the little things that captivate some people.

LOL, the outside temp gauge was something that actually caught my eye, when I drove my uncle's Corolla up to Carlisle a couple years ago. I did a little test to see what kind of economy I could get out of it, and if I could really deal with something that small on a longer trip. I remember noticing the outside temp gauge, and the inside fuel release lever, two things my Intrepid don't have. There was a third thing it had that my Intrepid didn't, but I can't remember now.

oregonboy

If fuel prices stay low, you will love the SI.
If fuel goes up, you will kick yourself repeatedly for as long as your payments on the SI last.
What do you think will happen to the price of gas? :sick:

nippononly

What do you think will happen to the price of gas?

Up, up, up. :-(

Of course, the Matrix makes 36 mpg and the Echo makes 42, which at 18,000 miles a year is a $25/month difference with $4 gas.

So I could keep the Matrix, trade the Echo, and probably not regret it. ;-)

But I would prefer a 4-door SI - the new '09 4-doors on the lot are stickered at $22,850, and the fleet manager will sell them for $21K. Not as good a deal. I dunno, maybe I will wait one more year. 2010 should be the last year of the current Civic, I wonder if Honda will continue the SI to the next gen. If I wait one more year, the Echo will be essentially worthless and I will just keep it and make a new SI my third car.

The economy has me feeling real indecisive about moving on a new car, maybe recession is the only real cure for CCBS.....

oregonboy

All new Civic due soon? If I had my wish, they would give us a more functional version, a hatch or wagonback. But I suppose that the Fit is supposed to fill that role.

corvette

I wish Honda would quit dumbing down the US-spec versions of their products. The European Civic has a different and better looking grille... And it's offered in hatchback form.

boomchek

I agree. That Civic is actually sold everywhere all over the world excpet North America.

tifighter

coupe

sedan, and I would have been booking a flight south...

nippononly

sedan, and you would already be too late! :-)

nippononly

what's the deal again with the tax credit for buying a car? Is it a $3500 deduction above the line, or a decrease of $3500 in the amount of income tax you pay?

corvette

Above the line deduction, from what I can tell.

I wonder where the deduction and warranty assurance is for those who bought something after the economic collapse, but before everyone and their mother was getting bailed out?

nippononly

Well warranty assurance will be for all models of a specific brand, not just one bought after a certain date.

The deduction is for all purchases after some day in February, from what I remember reading. So all the January-and-before buyers are just out in the cold on that one, I suppose.

An above the line deduction isn't that good, $3500 becomes maybe $1200 in my pocket. Not worth it, doesn't even cover the sales tax. :sick:

corvette

Not from what I've read:

"But people who already own a G.M. or Chrysler vehicle are not covered by this program..."

NYTimes

woodyww

Isn't it a tax deduction (not a credit) for the sales tax on a new car? (Whoopie).
Article on the proposed tax deduction & warranty stuff:

http://www.latimes.com/business/la-fi-gm-qanda31-2009mar31,0,6289060.story

But almost no one can get financing to buy a GM or chrysler anyway, so who's gonna buy one because they get a tiny tax deduction & a government warranty?

corvette

You're right... I was wondering where nippononly lived (and what kind of car he was thinking of buying) that would generate a sales tax bill of $3500. GT-R, perhaps?

I'd rather have the $$$ in my pocket than have to spend the money to get a tax deduction/credit, anyway. If all goes according to plan, I probably won't have enough deductions to be able to itemize deductions in 2009.

fezo

Good point on the itemized deductions. I do itemize but if I didn't what would be the point? Even with itemizing that isn't enough to get me moving at all. I'd need some very serious incentive. Of course even then - I've got cars that work. I'm fine with that.

mark156

So you guys were wondering what happened to Jolie (akangl).... Well, I drove the new Bentley up to Alaska and swept her off her feet and brought her back to sunny Palm Springs to live with me! HA!

She is now in the lap of luxury not having to scoop one more shovel of snow!

.... Honey.... fix me a martini....

Mark156

nippononly

the tax deduction is basically worthless, forget it then. In that case I think it will be 2010 before I buy anything new. Now something well used is a whole other proposition.....

corvette

I think the new car sales tax credit is an "above the line" deduction, so you can deduct it even if you don't itemize. Things like mortgage interest and charitable donations are "below the line" deductions.

kyfdx

For most people, the deduction will be worth one payment..

Not enough to move people to buy, who can actually do the math... but, I don't think that includes most people.... :surprise:

fezo

You make a good point. There will always be some people who just hear "government deal on a car" and will rush off to take "advantage."

Sorry, in this case I couldn't type advantage without the quotes....

boomchek

lol Mark,

That'd be a loooong drive. I didn't know your Bentley came with a Snow-N-Fun package.

Is this you?

woodyww

Nobody's buyin' nothin' now, reportedly--not cars (except for anon, good for her!), TV's, whatever. Even Toyota & Honda sales figures are horrible.

Not to mention which, people who've lost their jobs, or their houses, or have huge cap. gains losses in the stock mkt, may barely owe any income tax anyway......& I'm guessing are in a really bad mood, in general.....

roadburner

Nobody's buyin' nothin' now, reportedly--not cars (except for anon, good for her!), TV's, whatever. Even Toyota & Honda sales figures are horrible.

I was in Best Buy yesterday and there were quite a few folks walking out with big-ticket items. There were some screaming deals, and I took advantage of one of them- a new Pioneer Elite Kuro plasma for 50% off. The cheapest price I found on the web was only ten dollars less. That will teach my wife to leave town for a few days... :P

mark156

Well, we certainly so miss Jolie where ever she is!

Not much need for the Snow-n-Fun package in southern California, but it sure looks fun!

I took the Bentley for it's first 'commercial' car wash a few weeks ago... I have been hand-washing it myself but then took it to a commercial hand-wash place. NO BRUSHES!

After having the Bentley for 5 months, it just turned 1,000 miles. It's one SWEET ride let me tell you! Since it's all-wheel-drive... the car is SO sure-footed you don't miss a beat. I've not punched it really hard yet but I did give it a little push and this car will move... it will force you in the back of your seat like no other car! (552 hp).

Now that I have a few miles on it, I'll take it out soon and punch the gas to see what she was made to do!

Funny that the coupes don't have sunroofs. As you know, mine is a convertible.

Mark156

boomchek

but I did give it a little push and this car will move... it will force you in the back of your seat like no other car

I wrote on another thread that I recenlty had a chance to try out a coworkers 09 MB C63 AMG. That thing moved like crazy. It's a monster. My preganant wife almost gave birth in the front seat, it had so much torque.

roadburner

The Alpina B7 that I drove to Texas was also a beast. It was even fun to hammer around the track...