Chronic Car Buyers Anonymous (Archived)

mjfloyd1

@breld - check your PM

benjaminh

sda said:

I noticed that they no longer offer the EXL trim level of the Civic, you jump from the EX to the Touring. The EX is the sweet spot. I agree, a power seat is a must.

Overall, I feel like the new Civic seems like a bit of a disappointment. If the styling of the previous generation was a bit extreme, the new generation seems bland. And all the reviews that I've seen say that it's slower than the previous generation, which is strange. It seems like Honda should have put into the new Civic the 192-hp version of the 1.5T found in the Accord.

As mentioned, the equipment choices are a bit of a letdown for the EX. The Previous EX Civic had a power seat and XM. So although the prices are pretty much the same, losing those two things makes the EX less appealing. The Sport model has flashy wheels, but the standard 2.0 engine is slow for anything that's supposedly a "sport" model.

nyccarguy

henryn said:

I’ve been reading over in one of the Forums dedicated to the Ford F150, and there is a Ford dealer up in Iowa who will order a new Ford for you at invoice minus the 3% dealer holdback. Of course, at this exact moment in time, the delivery date is “up to the gods”. But still that gave me thought.

I have never custom ordered a new vehicle. I have bought any number of new cars and trucks, but never once custom ordered. This is something I just might do, once things return to normal.

I have been playing with the ordering / pricing options on the NADA web site. I can get a new 2021 F150 XLT Supercab with a lot of nice things included for around $45k. The 3.5L ecoboost engine for one. I have owned 3 of the 2.7L ecoboost engines, but never had a 3.5L and would like to try one. And I think I would like the supercab this next time, I always used to buy Supercabs until the dealers only started keeping SuperCrews in stock.

And this is with the 302A package (highest available on the XLT), and sliding rear window, power adjustable pedals, 360 degree camera, navigation, trailer towing package and other goodies.

MSRP $48,525, invoice $45,270, minus 3% dealer hold back leaves $43,865. I just sold my 2018 for $37.5, and that lacked several of the nice features on this one. It was a supercrew rather than the supercab, but I think I would rather have the supercab. Hmmm….

What’s the story on ordering? How much do you put up? And is that money “at risk”? And what if 6 months from now the truck still hasn’t been delivered?

This would require an airplane ticket and a road trip, but I think I have one more road trip in me before I die. And several of my female acquaintances claim they are addicted to travel, so a companion for the trip is always possible.

My Dad custom ordered his 2018 GMC Yukon. I want to say he had to leave a $2,500 deposit. He wanted a Yukon without a sunroof (he never uses it & likes the extra headroom) & without the built in DVD player (he never used that either). These 2 items are usually ordered by dealers together as the Sun & Entertainment Package. He wanted an SLT with specific 20" wheels and a molding that the Denalis have which really breaks up the "slab side" of the truck. He's a little over 3 years into owning it and has over 77,000 miles.

mjfloyd1

Regarding EV federal tax credits, my accountant says

The maximum tax credit is 7500 per vehicle. The IRS tax form to get the credit is Form 8936. It is set up for two vehicles so I assume you can get the credit on two separate vehicle purchases. I can't find any resource saying that you would not be eligible for this credit on multiple vehicles.

stickguy

Ii think the 1.5 civic is plenty quick for what it is. And great MPG. no issues for me. I also appreciate more “mature” styling, especially since it comes with more comfort and better visibility!

Maybe the hatch will have better option mix. The EX skipping the power seat was poor planning IMO!

fintail

When I was maybe 6 years old, I had a thing for the Fuego - I had some varied and changing tastes in cars then (others I liked were MGs, VW pickups, 911s, old cars especially open top, etc). I remember my dad liked to go car-looking on Sundays, and we visited a Renault dealer, where I was awarded with some promo posters - 18i sedan and wagon, and Fuego. Last saw a Fuego on the road around 10 years ago.

roadburner said:

sda said:

greg128 said:

Ok here is my tortured list going back to the 1960's

1948 Plymouth (suicide doors and center mounted rear brake light with aftermarket signal lights)
1956 Chevy 4 dr
1957 Plymouth SW
1958 Dodge 4dr
1961 Mercury 4dr
1961 Chevy Impala 2dr bubbletop 3 spd manual (my favorite)
1955 Pontiac drag car
NAVY STINT
1967 VW Beetle
1971 Toyota Corolla (new..but tiny 1200 cc motor blew at 60K miles)
1974 VW Beetle (new)
1976 VW Rabbit (new)
1977 VW Scirocco (new)..kept 7 years
MARRIED
1974 Buick Regal (wife)
1976 Buick Skyhawk (wife)
1981 Pontiac Grand Prix (wife)
1986 Pontiac 6000SE (wife - new)
1981 Renault Fuego Turbo (me)
1984 Ford EXP Turbo (me)
1988 Ford Thunderbird Turbo Coupe (me)
1989 Chevy Astrovan (wife)
1995 Eagle Vison TSI (new - me)
1998 Chevy Astrovan EXT LT ( new - wife)
2000 Nissan Maxima (new - wife) kept 8 years
2005 Chrysler Crossfire SRT-6 AMG supercharged (me - bought at 50% of MSRP in 2007 with only 3000 miles & kept 7 years - sold in 2014 and since only drive company trucks and have not replaced)
2008 Saturn XR ( wife-new) kept 8 years
2016 Chevy Malibu Premier ( wife - new leased)
2018 Buick Lacrosse Premium ( wife)

Great list. I liked the Fuego Turbo, thought it was a good successor to the R17 Giordini.

My wife had a R18i when we met. Fun car, but reliability was an issue. I loved the Fuego but wasn't comfortable buying one after the issues the R18i experienced.

sda

I like the toned down more conservative styling of the new Civic. In addition to the lack of a power seat in the EX or lumbar support, I do wish Honda would include a/c vents for the back seat passengers. I wonder if the slightly slower acceleration is due to the changes made to the CVT to make it less CVT like.

qbrozen

C&D has a review of the "new" GTI. More power. Great. They group it with competitors such as the Type R and Veloster N, although it is seriously outgunned by those. But ... $38k as tested?? What?! I really hope that is a typo. Their tester didn't even have leather.

On a completely unrelated note, as I ponder having 54 cars in 30 years, I wonder how long it will take me to average out to 2 cars per year. Or even if I could get to that point. Could be quite challenging.

Sandman6472

Like the new Civic look, it bit more conservative for sure, but nothing wrong with that. The interior is definitely a winner though there seems to be an array of things that can be done, probably take a while to learn it all. My choice wold be the Touring model if I were to get one as have decided at this stage, no more settling for anything especially when purchasing/leasing a new vehicle. Figure it'll just be a little bit less the kids will inherit and think they'd be fine with that. The Civic has grown since my 2006 LX model and doubt it'll fit on my side of the garage anymore. Wonder if they'll still have a hatch in the new line up?

ab348

sda said:

I like the toned down more conservative styling of the new Civic. In addition to the lack of a power seat in the EX or lumbar support, I do wish Honda would include a/c vents for the back seat passengers. I wonder if the slightly slower acceleration is due to the changes made to the CVT to make it less CVT like.

As with most new car introductions, but especially with those of the favorite brands of the auto journo class - Honda, Hyundai, Kia, Subaru, and to a lesser extent, Toyota - you have to discount the introductory reviews and those of the first few months thereafter because they are always the Best Thing Ever. Usually it takes 6 months or so to go by before you will start to hear about the shortcomings.

Sandman6472

My dealer has yet to get a Taos in stock for me to check out. Very curious to be honest. Hoping it's raised just a bit like the Rav4 as I'm more comfortable a little higher up and the ability to just slide in and out is high on my want list, just easier with my spinal issues. I think it'll be a bit pricey for the model I'd want to get but still, want to try it.

stickguy

Sandy, a hatch is coming. Should be introduced next week. Not sure how much shorter than the sedan it will be, so probably still too long for you.

The Taos I think is in the middle. Lower than. RAV or CRV, but higher than a sedan.

rayainsw

A quote that surprised me from that new GTI test in C+D:
"engine booms at legal highway speeds".
- Ray
Seems odd, given my experience with a recent GTI...

Sandman6472

Still think the new Corolla Cross will be the one that will hit the sweet spot for me to be honest. It'll sit up a couple of inches and will fit in the garage nicely so it could just be what I'm waiting for. Liking that light blue color also but if they come out with a light pearlized paint color, I could very well go for one of those. As much as I like a blue metallic, a light pearl paint will win out every time. Match that with a light interior, think I'd go for it in a nano second! Just have to wait & see what they bring out and hoping for an end of the year purchase/lease. Definitely would like a 2022 model if at all possible and would be nice to have it all paid off before I retire again. Figure I could give up one of my two gigs at that point, most likely the shuttle one as I do like the Enterprise gig so much better. Honestly, the four of us have too much fun together, we just get each other I guess. And the two guys who are older than me have much in common which makes it that much more fun really, us baby boomers. Have similar points of reference and definitely enjoy the same music, late '50's to mid '60's.

tifighter

On a road trip these past few days. If you haven't heard of CA highway 36, google it. Or click this I guess. Then add it to your bucket list. It did not disappoint.

xwesx

stickguy said:

Ii think the 1.5 civic is plenty quick for what it is. And great MPG. no issues for me. I also appreciate more “mature” styling, especially since it comes with more comfort and better visibility!

Maybe the hatch will have better option mix. The EX skipping the power seat was poor planning IMO!

Or maybe not. If they can get folks to step up to the Touring just for the power seat(s), then they win.

xwesx

tifighter said:

On a road trip these past few days. If you haven't heard of CA highway 36, google it. Or click this I guess. Then add it to your bucket list. It did not disappoint.

There's nothing like a good twisty! Sounds like a great road for my Econoline!

breld

Sandy - personally I think that Corolla Cross really hits all the right buttons for you and would be a great choice.

sda

The inflated used car prices are incredible. I just found a VW SE Tech identical to mine, same color, current miles within 1k, VW CPO, priced $4k more than what I paid 8 months ago!

au1994

As much as I would really, really like to take advantage of these crazy prices, there’s just no inventory that I can roll into.

- Outside of nearly $60k Gladiator Rubicon’s, there are maybe 5 in a 150 mile radius in my preferred configuration. And I’m being flexible on color…anything but black.
- Zero TRD Sport 4wd. One dealer has about 20 ‘in transit’ but no ETA. Other large dealer has none/
- One Ridgeline and its the Black Edition at the closest dealer. Haven’t really pursued these as its the 3rd choice at this point.

Haven’t gotten serious enough to talk numbers but from what I’m reading on other forums, good luck, especially on the Jeep.

I’m now getting quotes for tires, shocks and brakes on the Land Cruiser. I hate to throw what will amount to at least $1k at it but these are the days we live in!

Sandman6472

Breld, thinking the same thing to be honest. I look at my short list and come right back to the Toyota every time. Think it gives me everything I'm looking for but mostly, that piece of mind and hopefully, no drama. I know my wife will be on board whatever I do as she gets it that I'm a car guy and I want one with no issues. She also likes Toyota's so that helps my cause. And definitely thin it'll fit on my side of the garage which she also likes. Just hoping that all the stars align if I want to finance and that 0% rate will still be in effect as just once, just once in my life I'd love to be able to get that rate. Don't want to touch my investments nor do I want to use up all my immediate cash so financing will be used this time, first time since I bought the Datsun B-210 back in February of 1981!

henryn

au1994 said:

As much as I would really, really like to take advantage of these crazy prices, there’s just no inventory that I can roll into.

- Outside of nearly $60k Gladiator Rubicon’s, there are maybe 5 in a 150 mile radius in my preferred configuration. And I’m being flexible on color…anything but black.
- Zero TRD Sport 4wd. One dealer has about 20 ‘in transit’ but no ETA. Other large dealer has none/
- One Ridgeline and its the Black Edition at the closest dealer. Haven’t really pursued these as its the 3rd choice at this point.

Haven’t gotten serious enough to talk numbers but from what I’m reading on other forums, good luck, especially on the Jeep.

I’m now getting quotes for tires, shocks and brakes on the Land Cruiser. I hate to throw what will amount to at least $1k at it but these are the days we live in!

It is indeed a very poor time to be trying to buy a new car or truck. But that Land Cruiser has pretty much depreciated all it's going to depreciate, and spending $1k to keep it running for another year until the present madness is over sounds like a good idea to me. I found a good deal on an older used pickup, and I have been busily fixing it up to last me at least a year (or longer, who knows?) And I expect owning it will cost me next to nothing in depreciation.

The chip shortage will end. No one can reliably predict just when, but it WILL end. And the market will return to some kind of new normal. I fully expect new car prices are going to be higher than before all of this began, but just how much higher?

"New normal" is a term none of us were using or hearing a year and a half ago, but now we hear it every day. And about so many different things, including the new and used car market.

Michaell

A former (20+ years ago) moderator on these forums is trading in her 2010 Wrangler Unlimited for a new Gladiator. Don't know much about it, other than it's red.

au1994

Michaell said:

A former (20+ years ago) moderator on these forums is trading in her 2010 Wrangler Unlimited for a new Gladiator. Don't know much about it, other than it's red.

Color me jealous

Sandman6472

Just saw a video about the new 2022 Honda Civic Touring sedan. Nice vehicle for sure but at $29,995, a lot for a compact vehicle! A bit shocked at the price but wow, can't one get an Accord for that kinda change??? I agree that we're in a "new normal" here but this price is just so out of whack, gonna take me some time to wrap my head around it. Luckily, I can wait a bit until the chip situation comes to an end but feel sorry for folks like my co-worker who just sold his vehicle to Carvana and cant find the right vehicle to meet his $270/month payment. I can wait a bit because what I want ain't even out in the market yet.
Still, strange times for the world and the American auto industry!

au1994

henryn said:

au1994 said:

As much as I would really, really like to take advantage of these crazy prices, there’s just no inventory that I can roll into.

- Outside of nearly $60k Gladiator Rubicon’s, there are maybe 5 in a 150 mile radius in my preferred configuration. And I’m being flexible on color…anything but black.
- Zero TRD Sport 4wd. One dealer has about 20 ‘in transit’ but no ETA. Other large dealer has none/
- One Ridgeline and its the Black Edition at the closest dealer. Haven’t really pursued these as its the 3rd choice at this point.

Haven’t gotten serious enough to talk numbers but from what I’m reading on other forums, good luck, especially on the Jeep.

I’m now getting quotes for tires, shocks and brakes on the Land Cruiser. I hate to throw what will amount to at least $1k at it but these are the days we live in!

It is indeed a very poor time to be trying to buy a new car or truck. But that Land Cruiser has pretty much depreciated all it's going to depreciate, and spending $1k to keep it running for another year until the present madness is over sounds like a good idea to me. I found a good deal on an older used pickup, and I have been busily fixing it up to last me at least a year (or longer, who knows?) And I expect owning it will cost me next to nothing in depreciation.

The chip shortage will end. No one can reliably predict just when, but it WILL end. And the market will return to some kind of new normal. I fully expect new car prices are going to be higher than before all of this began, but just how much higher?

"New normal" is a term none of us were using or hearing a year and a half ago, but now we hear it every day. And about so many different things, including the new and used car market.

You are, of course, 100% correct. I may make a crazy offer on an 80th anniversary edition and see what happens but otherwise, I’m going to plan on putting some money in the LC and driving it to the end of the year and checking the market. If its no better, plan on extending to spring 22. Pains me greatly to type that .

It will be interesting to see how far prices fall once this is over. Is it going to be back to normal with incentives, good lease and finance rates and the expectation to negotiate? Or is it going to be like gas. Goes up by $.40 for the crisis of the day but only drops by $.10 when said crisis passes.

Michaell

Sandman6472 said:

Just saw a video about the new 2022 Honda Civic Touring sedan. Nice vehicle for sure but at $29,995, a lot for a compact vehicle! A bit shocked at the price but wow, can't one get an Accord for that kinda change??? I agree that we're in a "new normal" here but this price is just so out of whack, gonna take me some time to wrap my head around it. Luckily, I can wait a bit until the chip situation comes to an end but feel sorry for folks like my co-worker who just sold his vehicle to Carvana and cant find the right vehicle to meet his $270/month payment. I can wait a bit because what I want ain't even out in the market yet.
Still, strange times for the world and the American auto industry!

Sandy, you can option up a Mazda 3 to $35K. Not too outrageous, if you ask me.

au1994

Michaell said:

Sandman6472 said:

Just saw a video about the new 2022 Honda Civic Touring sedan. Nice vehicle for sure but at $29,995, a lot for a compact vehicle! A bit shocked at the price but wow, can't one get an Accord for that kinda change??? I agree that we're in a "new normal" here but this price is just so out of whack, gonna take me some time to wrap my head around it. Luckily, I can wait a bit until the chip situation comes to an end but feel sorry for folks like my co-worker who just sold his vehicle to Carvana and cant find the right vehicle to meet his $270/month payment. I can wait a bit because what I want ain't even out in the market yet.
Still, strange times for the world and the American auto industry!

Sandy, you can option up a Mazda 3 to $35K. Not too outrageous, if you ask me.

No, its not bad. Inflation and the fact that just about everything made now is really nice and well screwed together now makes 30-35k palatable. Once upon a time that was 3 Series territory.

xwesx

Michaell said:

A former (20+ years ago) moderator on these forums is trading in her 2010 Wrangler Unlimited for a new Gladiator. Don't know much about it, other than it's red.

And, straight swap, right?!

xwesx

If I recall correctly, the average price of a new car for 2021 is over $35,000. That seems insane to me; inflation is real!

I paid just over $23,000 for my last new car (our 2010 Forester) in September of 2009.

Michaell

xwesx said:

Michaell said:

A former (20+ years ago) moderator on these forums is trading in her 2010 Wrangler Unlimited for a new Gladiator. Don't know much about it, other than it's red.

And, straight swap, right?!

I didn’t ask, but I wouldn’t be surprised if the transaction favored her.

stickguy

Michaell said:

Sandman6472 said:

Just saw a video about the new 2022 Honda Civic Touring sedan. Nice vehicle for sure but at $29,995, a lot for a compact vehicle! A bit shocked at the price but wow, can't one get an Accord for that kinda change??? I agree that we're in a "new normal" here but this price is just so out of whack, gonna take me some time to wrap my head around it. Luckily, I can wait a bit until the chip situation comes to an end but feel sorry for folks like my co-worker who just sold his vehicle to Carvana and cant find the right vehicle to meet his $270/month payment. I can wait a bit because what I want ain't even out in the market yet.
Still, strange times for the world and the American auto industry!

Sandy, you can option up a Mazda 3 to $35K. Not too outrageous, if you ask me.

nope. The touring is a lot of car. not small, and loaded with features (fun/luxury stuff, safety, etc.) a lot of overkill most likely. If you want to spend less, a base Civic still has the safety stuff, and goes for about $22K.

and if you think those are expensive, don't shop CUVs!

Michaell

stickguy said:

Michaell said:

Sandman6472 said:

Just saw a video about the new 2022 Honda Civic Touring sedan. Nice vehicle for sure but at $29,995, a lot for a compact vehicle! A bit shocked at the price but wow, can't one get an Accord for that kinda change??? I agree that we're in a "new normal" here but this price is just so out of whack, gonna take me some time to wrap my head around it. Luckily, I can wait a bit until the chip situation comes to an end but feel sorry for folks like my co-worker who just sold his vehicle to Carvana and cant find the right vehicle to meet his $270/month payment. I can wait a bit because what I want ain't even out in the market yet.
Still, strange times for the world and the American auto industry!

Sandy, you can option up a Mazda 3 to $35K. Not too outrageous, if you ask me.

nope. The touring is a lot of car. not small, and loaded with features (fun/luxury stuff, safety, etc.) a lot of overkill most likely. If you want to spend less, a base Civic still has the safety stuff, and goes for about $22K.

and if you think those are expensive, don't shop CUVs!

Actually, you’d be surprised by that.

As an academic exercise, I’ve been building and pricing compact SUVs the last few days. Everything I’ve built has come back at $30-33k for the MSRP:

Forester Premium
RAV4 XLE
Tucson SEL
CX-5 Touring
CR-V EX-L
TIguan SE

(Just getting a jump on research for the inevitable replacement of the MINI, which may happen as early as next year)

henryn

I just looked, TrueCar says you can get a base Civic LX for about $400 under MSRP. Not much off, but better than $2k over. I just checked the online inventory for the nearest Honda dealer, and he shows several base model Civic LX's at $22k. In my experience, the local dealers never show the dealer add-ons with their online pricing, so I would not be surprised to find $1k to $2k in Mop-n-Glow, nitrogen filled tires, etc.

In ordinary times, it's not too difficult to get past the Mop-n-Glow, but these are not ordinary times.

stickguy

Hondas traditionally have had a fairly small delta between sticker and invoice though. Especially the sedans. so $400 off is reasonably good, especially for a new model.

these days though, all bets are off!

stickguy

Michaell said:

stickguy said:

Michaell said:

Sandman6472 said:

Just saw a video about the new 2022 Honda Civic Touring sedan. Nice vehicle for sure but at $29,995, a lot for a compact vehicle! A bit shocked at the price but wow, can't one get an Accord for that kinda change??? I agree that we're in a "new normal" here but this price is just so out of whack, gonna take me some time to wrap my head around it. Luckily, I can wait a bit until the chip situation comes to an end but feel sorry for folks like my co-worker who just sold his vehicle to Carvana and cant find the right vehicle to meet his $270/month payment. I can wait a bit because what I want ain't even out in the market yet.
Still, strange times for the world and the American auto industry!

Sandy, you can option up a Mazda 3 to $35K. Not too outrageous, if you ask me.

nope. The touring is a lot of car. not small, and loaded with features (fun/luxury stuff, safety, etc.) a lot of overkill most likely. If you want to spend less, a base Civic still has the safety stuff, and goes for about $22K.

and if you think those are expensive, don't shop CUVs!

Actually, you’d be surprised by that.

As an academic exercise, I’ve been building and pricing compact SUVs the last few days. Everything I’ve built has come back at $30-33k for the MSRP:

Forester Premium
RAV4 XLE
Tucson SEL
CX-5 Touring
CR-V EX-L
TIguan SE

(Just getting a jump on research for the inevitable replacement of the MINI, which may happen as early as next year)

hard to tell what is comparable, but usually I think it was 10-15% more for the CUV vs. sedan (so in this case, $3-4K ish). Just saw that a touring CRV or limited Tucson blows right on up to $35K too. Good thing they are at least nice now.

Michaell

Even the mid-level trims come really well equipped, compared to the MINI

corvette

It's odd to me that the "sport" trim of the Civic lacks the turbo engine (I think it was the same for the previous generation). I think the EX is the sweet spot in terms of price to equipment, as for $1,600 over the Sport model, you get the turbo, BLIS, moonroof, and heated seats. Nice to see LED headlights standard even on the base model.

benjaminh

Sandman6472 said:

Just saw a video about the new 2022 Honda Civic Touring sedan. Nice vehicle for sure but at $29,995, a lot for a compact vehicle! A bit shocked at the price but wow, can't one get an Accord for that kinda change??? I agree that we're in a "new normal" here but this price is just so out of whack, gonna take me some time to wrap my head around it. Luckily, I can wait a bit until the chip situation comes to an end but feel sorry for folks like my co-worker who just sold his vehicle to Carvana and cant find the right vehicle to meet his $270/month payment. I can wait a bit because what I want ain't even out in the market yet.
Still, strange times for the world and the American auto industry!

Alex on Autos mentioned in his review of the 2022 Civic that it was almost exactly the same size as a 1994-1997 Accord. I looked up the msrp of a 1994 Accord LX Auto with ABS and it was $19,000. Put that into an inflation calculator and that's about 34k in today's money. Even if you paid the full msrp for a 2022 Civic LX, which is about 22.7k, maybe from that pov it's still a good value?

PS Here's a retro review from Motor Week of a 1994 Accord EX with the 5-speed manual with an msrp of almost 20k. Motor Week got a 0-60 time of 8.9, compared to the 7.5 Car and Driver got with the 2022 Civic 1.5T. When the new Civic Si comes out it should be pretty entertaining to drive.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FeZvVzZu2HI

henryn

benjaminh said:

Sandman6472 said:

Just saw a video about the new 2022 Honda Civic Touring sedan. Nice vehicle for sure but at $29,995, a lot for a compact vehicle! A bit shocked at the price but wow, can't one get an Accord for that kinda change??? I agree that we're in a "new normal" here but this price is just so out of whack, gonna take me some time to wrap my head around it. Luckily, I can wait a bit until the chip situation comes to an end but feel sorry for folks like my co-worker who just sold his vehicle to Carvana and cant find the right vehicle to meet his $270/month payment. I can wait a bit because what I want ain't even out in the market yet.
Still, strange times for the world and the American auto industry!

Alex on Autos mentioned in his review of the 2022 Civic that it was almost exactly the same size as a 1994-1997 Accord. I looked up the msrp of a 1994 Accord LX Auto and it was $19,000. Put that into an inflation calculator and that's about 34k in today's money. Even if you paid the full msrp for a 2022 Civc LX, which is about 22.7k, maybe from that pov it's still a good value?

An excellent point. And if your wages have kept up with the cost of living index, then you are in a good situation. If they haven't, then no, things aren't so good. It's like people have been telling me all of my life -- everything is relative.

explorerx4

Sedans are not the volume sellers anymore, so don't expect big discounts.

stickguy

I really tried to buy a prior generation Civic when I was shopping for one car (maybe when I got the Sonata?_ But the manual seats were a deal breaker. And I think there may have been a model at some point with power seat which was a bit better, but there was some reason it got cut from the list.

I really don't like cars with small seats, especially short cushions or ones that don't tilt up enough in the front.

roadburner

I saw a new Civic Sport tonight. Nice enough, but if I was shopping for a sporty FWD sled it would have to be a Veloster N.

kyfdx

xwesx said:

If I recall correctly, the average price of a new car for 2021 is over $35,000. That seems insane to me; inflation is real!

I paid just over $23,000 for my last new car (our 2010 Forester) in September of 2009.

Only 12 short years ago...

corvette

@benjaminh - I really wanted a 1994-95 Accord EX as my first car. This was in the infancy of the web, when dealers didn't have much of an online presence, and dialup internet was still the norm. I couldn't find one, and ended up with a 1997 Grand Am GT coupe instead. I would have been better off with the Accord, and likely wouldn't have felt a need to replace it within a year (as I did the Pontiac), but hindsight is 20/20.

nyccarguy

@stickguy said:
I really tried to buy a prior generation Civic when I was shopping for one car (maybe when I got the Sonata?_ But the manual seats were a deal breaker. And I think there may have been a model at some point with power seat which was a bit better, but there was some reason it got cut from the list.

I really don't like cars with small seats, especially short cushions or ones that don't tilt up enough in the front.

My Tacoma has manual seats as does my Prelude. It doesn’t bother me a tremendous amount as usually I’m the only one who drives my cars.

fintail

I remember those days. I also recall when one could buy a really decent house around here for ~100K. At least cars haven't tracked housing!

au1994 said:

Michaell said:

Sandman6472 said:

Just saw a video about the new 2022 Honda Civic Touring sedan. Nice vehicle for sure but at $29,995, a lot for a compact vehicle! A bit shocked at the price but wow, can't one get an Accord for that kinda change??? I agree that we're in a "new normal" here but this price is just so out of whack, gonna take me some time to wrap my head around it. Luckily, I can wait a bit until the chip situation comes to an end but feel sorry for folks like my co-worker who just sold his vehicle to Carvana and cant find the right vehicle to meet his $270/month payment. I can wait a bit because what I want ain't even out in the market yet.
Still, strange times for the world and the American auto industry!

Sandy, you can option up a Mazda 3 to $35K. Not too outrageous, if you ask me.

No, its not bad. Inflation and the fact that just about everything made now is really nice and well screwed together now makes 30-35k palatable. Once upon a time that was 3 Series territory.

stickguy

nyccarguy said:

@stickguy said:

I really tried to buy a prior generation Civic when I was shopping for one car (maybe when I got the Sonata?_ But the manual seats were a deal breaker. And I think there may have been a model at some point with power seat which was a bit better, but there was some reason it got cut from the list.

I really don't like cars with small seats, especially short cushions or ones that don't tilt up enough in the front.

My Tacoma has manual seats as does my Prelude. It doesn’t bother me a tremendous amount as usually I’m the only one who drives my cars.

I don't care about adjusting on my car since I am the only one that drives it (would be a hassle on the family car that we both drive). My Elantra was manual seats, no issue. The problem I have is that since they went to the ratchet height adjustment I can't usually adjust them to a position that is comfortable. I don't like to have the seat slammed on the floor, and if you raise it, it dumps you forward. I like to have the front cushion tilted up and you can't do that.

oldfarmer50

Michaell said:

Sandman6472 said:

Just saw a video about the new 2022 Honda Civic Touring sedan. Nice vehicle for sure but at $29,995, a lot for a compact vehicle! A bit shocked at the price but wow, can't one get an Accord for that kinda change??? I agree that we're in a "new normal" here but this price is just so out of whack, gonna take me some time to wrap my head around it. Luckily, I can wait a bit until the chip situation comes to an end but feel sorry for folks like my co-worker who just sold his vehicle to Carvana and cant find the right vehicle to meet his $270/month payment. I can wait a bit because what I want ain't even out in the market yet.
Still, strange times for the world and the American auto industry!

Sandy, you can option up a Mazda 3 to $35K. Not too outrageous, if you ask me.

On Mazda’s you can have endless fun trying to figure out how to use the radio as well. Only BMW is less intuitive.

stickguy

not a big concern on a car I buy, as opposed to hopping into a rental and trying to figure it out on the road already!