Chronic Car Buyers Anonymous (Archived)

qbrozen

UGH. I'm so torn. Just can't decide which is the better move.

Lighter weight, lower depreciation (quite possibly appreciation), wagon capability. For lack of any hard data, let's say $1500/yr to maintain it and sell for same $15k after 2 years. So 24-mo $3k net cost.

vs

More comfy, warranty, no previous farts. Estimated depreciation and maintenance will probably run ~$2100/yr. So 24-mo $4200 net cost.

xwesx

qbrozen said:

UGH. I'm so torn. Just can't decide which is the better move.

Lighter weight, lower depreciation (quite possibly appreciation), wagon capability. For lack of any hard data, let's say $1500/yr to maintain it and sell for same $15k after 2 years. So 24-mo $3k net cost.

vs

More comfy, warranty, no previous farts. Estimated depreciation and maintenance will probably run ~$2100/yr. So 24-mo $4200 net cost.

If you're looking at shorter ownership (2-3 years), I think the new version is the better option all around. Shame on the lack of hatch, but that's just the way of it today. I think Subaru should have just done a generational change (e.g., one gen is sedan while the next is hatch). Unfortunately, I think we're at around ten years now with no hatch available.

corvette

andres3 said:

All bets are off after 6 years though.

That's the rub with many European marques--in many cases, they do really well during the warranty period or slightly longer, then require expensive repairs. Throw in the fact that they may be on their second or third owner by then, and you have a recipe for disaster.

stickguy

Q, do you really want a LT relationship with a steering wheel on the wrong side of the car?

mjfloyd1

@breld -please check your pm

mjfloyd1

Speaking of the X5 - how awful is this black vermilion edition with frozen black paint and red grilles and 22 inch wheels??

jmonroe1

@explorerx4 said:
The first thing Line-x does is sand the paint off the bed before spraying in the liner.
You can buy a bed mat for a bit over $100. Just strap down the load if you think it will shift.

Are you sure they sand if off or do they just scuff it up so the spray has something to bite into for better adhesion?

jmonroe

stickguy

the guy at the shop I talked to said they scuff it up for that reason. I assume it is something like hitting it with a scotchbrite pad. Same thing you would do if repainting a section.

tjc78

@stickguy said:
Q, do you really want a LT relationship with a steering wheel on the wrong side of the car?

Lol. Q and long term in the same sentence.

nyccarguy

@qbrozen - 2022 WRX pricing is out?

xwesx

tjc78 said:

Lol. Q and long term in the same sentence.

Laugh all you want, but he had the Caravan longer than @breld would have any four dozen cars, combined!

explorerx4

Ford had some F-150's with a similar design theme as that X5.

stickguy

tjc78 said:

@stickguy said:

Q, do you really want a LT relationship with a steering wheel on the wrong side of the car?

Lol. Q and long term in the same sentence.

he's the one that laid out a 3 year ownership plan!

qbrozen

Hey, hey, I said 2 years!
haha. I've had the Charger for more than 2 years now!
Coronet longer, but can't really count it when it never goes anywhere.

And, yes, I think I wouldn't mind RHD. Stir things up and keep them fresh, ya know?

Heck, I may not have a choice. Out of 4 subie dealers, I've got no response from 2, one wants $5k ADM, and one just keeps calling my phone and not leaving a message. I responded to his email asking if they would honor the advertised lease deal, but then he called again. Sigh.

Benz mechanic still hasn't given me any indication on my bill except to say "you should probably sell the Mach-e first to pay this." Ummm... ok. I know it is a joke, but, seriously, you can't drop things like that and then ghost me when I say "how much??"

qbrozen

nyccarguy said:

@qbrozen - 2022 WRX pricing is out?

they still selling '21s.

tjc78

@xwesx said:
Laugh all you want, but he had the Caravan longer than @breld would have any four dozen cars, combined!

I think the lifetime warranty had something to do with that!!

@qbrozen
All joking aside, I’d be nervous about the bill on the ML!

xwesx

True, that (on the lifetime warranty), but he did keep its predecessor for quite some time as well (without that sweet warranty).

I imagine that @qbrozen 's mechanic is trying to get things wrapped up on it before letting him know the cost so that it isn't the mechanic getting ghosted before there's an operational vehicle in the balance!

oldfarmer50

explorerx4 said:

Ford had some F-150's with a similar design theme as that X5.

I saw a truck like that at the Ford dealer last week. Except it also had wheels like this:

Sandman6472

NY, I take it that you never made it into work today. If so, probably the best move as am sure there were many accidents if there was so much black ice on the streets. Haven't driven in snow or ice conditions in way too long but don't miss it one bit. Watching video of vehicles just sliding all over the road with no grip whatsoever is hard to view especially when they hit another vehicle. That sound of metal hitting metal really is unnerving to say the least. Remember when living in Westchester, both folks had front wheel drive vehicles and still, they'd be sliding all over the place in icy conditions. usually best to just stay put until conditions improve.

tifighter

@breld said:
Now that the holidays and new home stuff is mostly settled, I'm returning to my car-obsessed mindset. * I like the wife's m340i so much that it makes me long for an X5 over the XC90. Now that the PHEV version uses an I-6 paired with the electric motor, it seems very appealing. Plus it qualifies for the full $7,500 federal rebate and CO's $2,500. Essentially knocking $10k off a well-equipped version sounds like a pretty good deal to me, as long as the XC90 is part of the crazy trade value market.

• I also am craving a manual sporty/sports car. Inquired on an incoming Civic Si and their pricing is $2,500 over MSRP. Nope. Subaru dealership in Colorado Springs will locate/order a BRZ at MSRP. And Vroom has a beautiful 2021 Miata RF Club with the Recaro/Brembo/BBS package. It just recently dropped $2k, so is now actually below new MSRP!

We think alike. I’m glad we’re separated by a few states, so we don’t look at the same cars at the same dealers. The new BRZ/86 gives me ideas. And thankfully, a reasonably priced local M2 sold before I got back from vacation…

Sandman6472

Going to have around 38 or so hours this week and was told yesterday that working this coming Sunday is a real possibility. Don't mind at all as might as well work these extra days when offered as once season ends in late Spring, they won't need as many vehicles. And no way do I want to go back to Toyota or any kind of shuttle driving gig to be honest. Working behind the scenes is much easier to be honest and not dealing with customers is wonderful. After being in the service industry my whole postal career, had enough of dealing with the public. Since I love to drive, best to put me behind the wheel of a car or suv and I'm good to go. Luckily, there is a small group of us that want as many hours each week as we can just because. Sure, the extra income is sure nice to get but it's not the main reason I'm working part time. I know in time, this chip situation will end and then there will be a good selection of new vehicles on dealer lots. Having some extra cash put aside will just mean I have to finance that much less. And I will get something new once conditions improve. I know I talk about it a lot here but I just need to find the perfect vehicle at a price that's fair to both sides.
Passed a Toyota store this afternoon and they had not one vehicle on their new car side of the dealership. I was so surprised to only see "pre-owned" inventory for sale. Guessing that most of the sales force is working less hours if at all with the service department being super busy. Folks just have to keep their current rides a bit longer and like us, fix the little issues before they become larger ones. Assuming the mechanics are all working lots of hours just to keep up with all the work. Do remember at Toyota, there'd be a long line of vehicles waiting inline just to get into the service area to be worked on. Give these folks a lot of credit for keeping many of us on the road as we wait for better times to happen.
Just wondering if we'll ever see below invoice pricing on anything anymore once inventories get back to their normal levels or will MSRP become the new starting point of negotiations? Once inventories do ramp up, there's going to be so much pent up demand that things will still be crazy for awhile. Am sure those pesky "ADM Fees" will go away as quickly as they came as the need for them will no longer be there. I know for us, I won't pay those fees & will just keep what we have longer if need be. With our driving mileage down these last couple of years, it'll still be awhile till we both approach 100K miles & think both of our vehicles will be able to go many miles over that amount. But think the most I'd want to keep them is maybe 10 years if need be. Only time will tell I imagine...only time will tell!

breld

tifighter said:

@breld said:

Now that the holidays and new home stuff is mostly settled, I'm returning to my car-obsessed mindset. * I like the wife's m340i so much that it makes me long for an X5 over the XC90. Now that the PHEV version uses an I-6 paired with the electric motor, it seems very appealing. Plus it qualifies for the full $7,500 federal rebate and CO's $2,500. Essentially knocking $10k off a well-equipped version sounds like a pretty good deal to me, as long as the XC90 is part of the crazy trade value market.

• I also am craving a manual sporty/sports car. Inquired on an incoming Civic Si and their pricing is $2,500 over MSRP. Nope. Subaru dealership in Colorado Springs will locate/order a BRZ at MSRP. And Vroom has a beautiful 2021 Miata RF Club with the Recaro/Brembo/BBS package. It just recently dropped $2k, so is now actually below new MSRP!

We think alike. I’m glad we’re separated by a few states, so we don’t look at the same cars at the same dealers. The new BRZ/86 gives me ideas. And thankfully, a reasonably priced local M2 sold before I got back from vacation…

So what was “reasonably” priced for the M2? I noticed a 2020 Comp on Carvana with 13k miles for something like $63k - that actually seems like a decent deal compared to $55k OG examples.

And I’d say it’s too bad we don’t live closer - we could just have our own little car swap club!

I think the BRZ/86 is at the top of my sporty list at the moment - I assume it’s a bit roomier than the Miata. And compared to a marked up Civic Si, I’ll take a BRZ at MSRP all day.

stickguy

I seriously thought about spending the money on a BRZ instead. But that would be a nice weather toy, and I have long since given up on finding a reasonably priced truckish unit for carrying duty. Probably easier having a practical DD and finding a toy at some point.

breld

Regarding that special edition X5, I agree it looks pretty hideous with the overdone red trim.

But a co-worker of mine just took delivery of a loaded X5 in that same frozen black but not the special edition, so no red highlights, and it’s a striking car.

nyccarguy

@Sandman6472 said:
NY, I take it that you never made it into work today. If so, probably the best move as am sure there were many accidents if there was so much black ice on the streets. Haven't driven in snow or ice conditions in way too long but don't miss it one bit. Watching video of vehicles just sliding all over the road with no grip whatsoever is hard to view especially when they hit another vehicle. That sound of metal hitting metal really is unnerving to say the least. Remember when living in Westchester, both folks had front wheel drive vehicles and still, they'd be sliding all over the place in icy conditions. usually best to just stay put until conditions improve.

I did make it in. I waited until about 11:00 ish when everything was wet and melted. The Merit parkway and Hutchinson River Parkway are bad on regular rainy mornings.

nyccarguy

@qbrozen said:
they still selling '21s.

Interesting. What does your 36/10K “theoretical “payment look like? You looking at Base, Premium, or Limited? Not that I’d be willing to pay above sticker on anything, but especially not a 6 MY old design that’s on its way out.

benjaminh

stickguy said:

I seriously thought about spending the money on a BRZ instead. But that would be a nice weather toy, and I have long since given up on finding a reasonably priced truckish unit for carrying duty. Probably easier having a practical DD and finding a toy at some point.

Did you ever calculate your total savings from your year or whatever of not owning a car?

How's the interior of your Maverick Lariat so far? In terms of the exterior, I like the slightly larger and different wheels on the Lariat, as well as the Michelin tires. Plus the front grill for the Lariat has a slightly nicer design from my pov.

Oh, and have you put it into one of those sites that estimates your value? If so, how much is it worth in this crazy market?

sb55

@nyccarguy
Your freezing rain event reminded me of one of my worst commutes. In about 1986, I left for work from Katonah, NY to Long Island City. It started to rain, then freeze, when I was on I-684 around Mt. Kisco. Traffic stopped.......for over 6 hours! It was so slick that there was no traffic on the North bound side. A few hours later salt trucks were BACKING up 684 because it was too icy for them to drive forward. I think that we had to wait until it melted to move again.
This was before cell phones. My boss called my wife around 11:00 and asked where I was. She had no idea that I was stuck.

tjc78

Back around 2000 or so I was working in King of Prussia PA. It was one of the worst drives you could have from South Jersey up the Schuykill Expressway through Philly.

We had a morning snow so I left early to beat the traffic. Got to the office and then they decided to close. On the way home I got stuck behind two stuck tractor trailers. We sat there all day. Good times.

qbrozen

@nyccarguy said:

@qbrozen said:
they still selling '21s.

>

Interesting. What does your 36/10K “theoretical “payment look like? You looking at Base, Premium, or Limited? Not that I’d be willing to pay above sticker on anything, but especially not a 6 MY old design that’s on its way out.

It is definitely not for a payment shopper. The advertised deal is $325/mo with $1965 at signing, plus tax/tags/doc. Best I can calculate, it seems that would require a $1k dealer discount. So I’m having my doubts anybody will honor that advertised deal.

stickguy

I did that commute, further out to Malvern, for a year or so. 2 winters. Great fun.

stickguy

I have so far resisted temptation to troll my car through the sites. I haven’t even gotten my account set up with ford finance yet.

I would also save a lot in tax credit by trading it in.

kyfdx

stickguy said:

I have so far resisted temptation to troll my car through the sites. I haven’t even gotten my account set up with ford finance yet.

I would also save a lot in tax credit by trading it in.

I'm really curious, can you check just for me?

stickguy

kyfdx said:

stickguy said:

I have so far resisted temptation to troll my car through the sites. I haven’t even gotten my account set up with ford finance yet.

I would also save a lot in tax credit by trading it in.

I'm really curious, can you check just for me?

Does it accept “temp tag” in the license plate field?

I guess Breld would know!

kyfdx

stickguy said:

kyfdx said:

stickguy said:

I have so far resisted temptation to troll my car through the sites. I haven’t even gotten my account set up with ford finance yet.

I would also save a lot in tax credit by trading it in.

I'm really curious, can you check just for me?

Does it accept “temp tag” in the license plate field?

I guess Breld would know!

I think you can do it with a VIN?

stickguy

You can. Or just describe it.

I was just being cute.

au1994

I hope employers have learned over the course of the pandemic that (some) jobs can be performed successfully remotely and hopefully for those in the snowy climes, you can just WFH on those days and not risk life, limb and machine just to get to an office and perform the same task you were going to do from home.

Not everyone’s position can be done that way and I respect that but on the rare snow days here in the south, its quite unnerving driving on the slick stuff. Like everyone else I am worried about ‘the other guy’. I’ve successfully navigated it in a 4wd Tacoma, 4wd Explorer and a Jeep. Got caught out in the Snowmageden here in Atlanta in ‘13 (?) in my F30 335i with performance tires. I was ‘the other guy’ in that case. Took me an hour and a half to get 12 miles home and when I did, couldn’t get up the driveway. Luckily my neighbor is from Iowa and still had a snow shovel.

Looks like more is headed across the country so be safe everyone.

stickguy

benjaminh said:

stickguy said:

I seriously thought about spending the money on a BRZ instead. But that would be a nice weather toy, and I have long since given up on finding a reasonably priced truckish unit for carrying duty. Probably easier having a practical DD and finding a toy at some point.

Did you ever calculate your total savings from your year or whatever of not owning a car?

How's the interior of your Maverick Lariat so far? In terms of the exterior, I like the slightly larger and different wheels on the Lariat, as well as the Michelin tires. Plus the front grill for the Lariat has a slightly nicer design from my pov.

Oh, and have you put it into one of those sites that estimates your value? If so, how much is it worth in this crazy market?

Best guess, maybe saved 8,800? Though likely I would have bought it out so could have recouped a bit of that, but moot point if I didn’t sell it right away.

Interior is nice. Seats look good and are comfy. Controls work fine. Pretty simple but very easy to use. The lariat wheels look good on it, and the gray works well with the brown interior. Looks fairly upscale IMO.

corvette

@au1994 said:
I hope employers have learned over the course of the pandemic that (some) jobs can be performed successfully remotely…

They did learn that, I just happen to work for one that has embraced “work from home = bad” as part of its corporate ethos. We can work from home if ill or during inclement weather, but you have to lug your laptop home in order to do so. The old setup let us VPN in from our personal devices using Remote Desktop, which was preferable. Add to that, the new laptops are so locked down that you can’t even change the browser homepage. And chronic understaffing. (Yes, I’m dusting off my resume…)

Michaell

We had a few inches fall last night. Nobody needs to be anywhere today, so I'll shovel the drive later this afternoon.

My travel event was in the fall of 1997. I was in Toronto on business, and called the wife. She said snow was expected, but didn't know how much. I called again from Chicago (plane change) and snow had started, but not much had accumulated.

2.5-3 hours later, when I landed in Denver, it was a different story. All the cars in the parking lot were covered with snow, and it took me 20 minutes to find my car specifically.

At the time, DIA had a toll-plaza like setup to pay for parking, and another 45 minutes passed before I was able to exit the airport. Not long after, my wipers froze to the windshield, so I was forced to follow traffic in front of me to stay on the road.

I got within a mile or two of my house before I got stuck in a snowbank. Kids in 4x4 pickups were pulling folks out, and they eventually got to me.

Total travel time from the airport to home - 4+ hours. This was in the era before cellphones, so the wife didn't know where I was once I left the airport.

Ended up with 25-30" total from that storm, and we didn't leave the house for 2 days.

nyccarguy

au1994 said:

I hope employers have learned over the course of the pandemic that (some) jobs can be performed successfully remotely and hopefully for those in the snowy climes, you can just WFH on those days and not risk life, limb and machine just to get to an office and perform the same task you were going to do from home.

Not everyone’s position can be done that way and I respect that but on the rare snow days here in the south, its quite unnerving driving on the slick stuff. Like everyone else I am worried about ‘the other guy’. I’ve successfully navigated it in a 4wd Tacoma, 4wd Explorer and a Jeep. Got caught out in the Snowmageden here in Atlanta in ‘13 (?) in my F30 335i with performance tires. I was ‘the other guy’ in that case. Took me an hour and a half to get 12 miles home and when I did, couldn’t get up the driveway. Luckily my neighbor is from Iowa and still had a snow shovel.

Looks like more is headed across the country so be safe everyone.

I use my judgement. If it is bad out, I'll call my Dad in the AM. We might decide to go in late or not at all. Even if my Dad or I gets into a minor fender bender, its just not worth the $1000 deductible and the "hit" on either of our insurance policies. It will most likely be slow and I'll just be fielding calls all day to see if we have any "rock salt."

kyfdx

Some people (even salaried management) need supervision to insure their productivity. This is true, even if you feel it doesn't apply to you.

au1994

corvette said:

@au1994 said:

I hope employers have learned over the course of the pandemic that (some) jobs can be performed successfully remotely…

They did learn that, I just happen to work for one that has embraced “work from home = bad” as part of its corporate ethos. We can work from home if ill or during inclement weather, but you have to lug your laptop home in order to do so. The old setup let us VPN in from our personal devices using Remote Desktop, which was preferable. Add to that, the new laptops are so locked down that you can’t even change the browser homepage. And chronic understaffing. (Yes, I’m dusting off my resume…)

I used to work for one of those type of companies.

Snow starts early afternoon and begins to stick. Of course all work stops as we are watching the traffic begin to pile up, watch the snow accumulate, check in with spouses and kids and watching the weather on the internet. Productivity, less than zero. Hey, it’s Atlanta, we freak out when we see this stuff.

Multiple folks ask if/when we can leave and a few brave ones just do it. But this was 2009 and the recession is still a thing so nobody wanted to rock the boat too much. Finally about 4;45 the VP (who was a Chicago native and lived about 5 miles from the office) relented and said we could leave. Ultimate clock watcher. I got a talking to for leaving at 5 til 5 on a Friday at one point.

I had my first Jeep at the time and it was a good fluffy snow so I did ok. A few white knuckle moments though.

stickguy

You can supervise fine remote workers. It’s just a different process. Especially for salaried/professional jobs it should not be an issue.

If a manager thinks they need to hover over people. All day, there is either a problem with the org, or more likely, the manager.

These days, even if in an office, teams are usually spread out. My current company, I did go into the office at first, but did not meet my boss in person for well over a year since she was in an office 500 miles away. My current team has people all over the world, and my new as of this week boss I think is in India someplace.

mjfloyd1

If it snows, just get a 4 exxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx4 pickup truck. Sorry, couldn’t resist

fintail

Almost live view of my birdbath, suffice it to say, today is a WFH day:



Fortunately, this storm was predicted, and my employer even encouraged WFH.

The new working world has been difficult for the organization - there's a younger set who would be fine if they never saw the office again, and a more established contingent who has devoted their life to "office culture" and feel like something is missing in their lives if they aren't physically in the office. Leadership has tried to make a hybrid model, which I think has mostly worked, as there's a lot of discretion, especially if one has a more progressive/non micromanagerial director (I do). There have been growing pains, as a questionably worded "return to the office" announcement resulted in a wave of resignations, which then resulted in what are likely disguised retention bonuses (I am not complaining), and the hybrid model. Personally, I don't mind going in, but the past nearly 2 years has offered proof that one not need be there 5 days a week to get work done.

explorerx4

One of my kids works for a company that is reluctant to let people work remotely, but they did invest many, many, many millions in building their campus over the years.
I can kind of see their point.

fintail

And knowing Denver, it was 60F 3 days later.

I have but one good travel event. Monday before Thanksgiving 2010, I was flying from Berlin to Seattle, with layovers in Frankfurt and Vancouver. Flight out of FRA was delayed due to a windstorm, and mother nature was working hard that day. Landed in YVR to the sight of snow, and the delay caused me to miss my connection. No big deal as there were a good 10 YVR-SEA flights each day. Nope, Seattle ends up getting buried in snow, SEA shuts down, stuck in Vancouver. Fortunately was put up in a hotel, back to YVR in the morning to try to get out. Got a flight to SEA that landed around noon, to the most snow I have seen at that airport. My ride home chickened out, so I had to take a taxi home, shared it with another guy as they were in short supply. The taxi slid off the road on 405 in Renton, causing real damage to the bumpers - but the driver just got out, looked it over, and got back on the road, now with extra bad noises. Departed from Berlin at 0800 local time Monday, arrived home around 1300 local time Tuesday.

Michaell said:

We had a few inches fall last night. Nobody needs to be anywhere today, so I'll shovel the drive later this afternoon.

My travel event was in the fall of 1997. I was in Toronto on business, and called the wife. She said snow was expected, but didn't know how much. I called again from Chicago (plane change) and snow had started, but not much had accumulated.

2.5-3 hours later, when I landed in Denver, it was a different story. All the cars in the parking lot were covered with snow, and it took me 20 minutes to find my car specifically.

At the time, DIA had a toll-plaza like setup to pay for parking, and another 45 minutes passed before I was able to exit the airport. Not long after, my wipers froze to the windshield, so I was forced to follow traffic in front of me to stay on the road.

I got within a mile or two of my house before I got stuck in a snowbank. Kids in 4x4 pickups were pulling folks out, and they eventually got to me.

Total travel time from the airport to home - 4+ hours. This was in the era before cellphones, so the wife didn't know where I was once I left the airport.

Ended up with 25-30" total from that storm, and we didn't leave the house for 2 days.

Michaell

About 10-15 years ago, we had a winter where we had a sizable snow storm every Thursday for 6 straight weeks. Each storm dumped between 8-16". The snow piles on either size of my driveway were 6' high, and the snow didn't completely melt until April.

fintail

Might end up being a sunk cost fallacy if it impedes them from being able to attract talent. I suspect some orgs have already been dealing with that, due to stubbornness of a few.

explorerx4 said:

One of my kids works for a company that is reluctant to let people work remotely, but they did invest many, many, many millions in building their campus over the years.
I can kind of see their point.