Chronic Car Buyers Anonymous (Archived)

ab348

FWIW, this article from Hagerty caught my eye:

https://www.hagerty.com/media/hagerty-community/our-two-cents-the-most-boring-new-cars-on-sale-today

venture

corvette said:

Got the plates for the Volt. Of course, they expire in March since my birthday is in March. I guess I should expect a renewal notice in the mail shortly.

They could have mailed them in the same envelope. Save the taxpayers some money.

jmonroe1

venture said:

corvette said:

Got the plates for the Volt. Of course, they expire in March since my birthday is in March. I guess I should expect a renewal notice in the mail shortly.

They could have mailed them in the same envelope. Save the taxpayers some money.

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When did a government entity ever think about logical ways of saving tax dollars? They’d be the last group looking for ways to put themselves out of a job. C’mon man.

jmonroe

stickguy

@ab348 said:
FWIW, this article from Hagerty caught my eye:

https://www.hagerty.com/media/hagerty-community/our-two-cents-the-most-boring-new-cars-on-sale-today

Weird mix on that list.

xwesx

ab348 said:

FWIW, this article from Hagerty caught my eye:

https://www.hagerty.com/media/hagerty-community/our-two-cents-the-most-boring-new-cars-on-sale-today

The article was as boring as its topic, apparently. The least they could have done was to be non-lazy enough to actually select a set of makes/models with specificity. They decided to just select 70% of available models on sale today and corral them up into a homogenous mass.

kyfdx

A lot of hating on other people's choices on that list.

sda

corvette said:

Got the plates for the Volt. Of course, they expire in March since my birthday is in March. I guess I should expect a renewal notice in the mail shortly.

Plate renewal is tagged (pun,sorry) to your birthday month? That’s the first I’ve learned of that. The states I’ve lived in the renewal date is based on the month the car is registered.

au1994

ab348 said:

FWIW, this article from Hagerty caught my eye:

https://www.hagerty.com/media/hagerty-community/our-two-cents-the-most-boring-new-cars-on-sale-today

I guess the author was late for a deadline and pounded out that piece of c__p in about 5 minutes tops.

Wrangler boring? I know I am biased but boring is not a word I would use to describe one.

Ram Tradesman? You mean the truck that is largely bought for fleets or, well Tradesmen, that would actually use a truck for its original, intended purpose? Sure it’s boring.

All SUV’s? The Trackhawk begs to differ.

I could go on but I won’t.

corvette

sda said:

Plate renewal is tagged (pun,sorry) to your birthday month? That’s the first I’ve learned of that. The states I’ve lived in the renewal date is based on the month the car is registered.

Kentucky is special, lol. It wasn't until this year until we went from a system of "plate stays with the car" to "if you bought a plate, you keep the plate." Thankfully, we aren't a front plate state.

xwesx

I've always found the practice of a plate *not* staying with a car to be odd. I mean, it is the car's plate after all. Best case scenario, it results in far more plates being manufactured and issued than necessary.

oldfarmer50

kyfdx said:

I was just coming on here to say that..

Out of business!

That’s ominous. What do you think this means for the bigger players like CarMax and Carvana. If you believe the YT experts, those companies are on thin ice too.

corvette

Called the body shop today, they are still waiting on the trim piece for the Maverick. I wonder what happens if one doesn’t materialize within a reasonable timeframe.

oldfarmer50

stickguy said:

that should dump a lot of inventory into the auctions. Or maybe Carvana will just pick it all up at a discount!

I bet the rental companies will grab some of the newer stuff. During the pandemic we were sent to dealers all over the northeast to get low mile 1 or 2 year old used cars.

ab348

au1994 said:

I guess the author was late for a deadline and pounded out that piece of c__p in about 5 minutes tops.

Hey, I never said it was a good article.

kyfdx

oldfarmer50 said:

kyfdx said:

I was just coming on here to say that..

Out of business!

That’s ominous. What do you think this means for the bigger players like CarMax and Carvana. If you believe the YT experts, those companies are on thin ice too.

Carmax has a completely different business plan. Also, they own Edmunds!

Carvana? They were at death's door, less than a year ago, and their stock has rebounded, so who knows.

explorerx4

Carvana bought some auction company last year?

Sandman6472

Going to test drive a Bolt tomorrow if things work out. Just want to get a feel for it and see if it's doable for our family right now. I'm thinking a hybrid would work better to be honest. Plan to stop by the Hyundai store where we got the Accent to give the new Kona a whirl. Of course, I'd buy closer to home so best to start down there as no way am I ready to do anything quite yet. But, one must start somewhere and that somewhere is in Miami Lakes tomorrow if I'm feeling o k. Who knows, I might love the Bolt & hate the Kona...or hate the Bolt & absolutely love the Kona. Just don't know actually. And then, onto Mini Cooper to see if one could work. I'm finally ready to step inside a dealer which has been a long time coming! Baby steps before one can walk, as this is a lot of money here and have to get it right, no more Tucson debacle for me!

xwesx

Sounds like a plan, Sandy. And, I think an EV would fit in well with your family's use case(s). Being a two-vehicle family means you don't really have to worry about long trips or charging away from home, and your daily use is such that you'd never have to worry about public charging infrastructure at all.

tifighter

@28firefighter

This is a pretty large dealership in Puget Sound with 11 locations. It’s shaping up to be a spicy year.

jmonroe1

xwesx said:

I've always found the practice of a plate *not* staying with a car to be odd. I mean, it is the car's plate after all. Best case scenario, it results in far more plates being manufactured and issued than necessary.

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If prisoners didn’t make plates they’d just be sitting around smoking pot. Do you really want that to happen?

jmonroe

venture

xwesx said:

I've always found the practice of a plate *not* staying with a car to be odd. I mean, it is the car's plate after all. Best case scenario, it results in far more plates being manufactured and issued than necessary.

The plate goes on the new car.

Michaell

Sandman6472 said:

Going to test drive a Bolt tomorrow if things work out. Just want to get a feel for it and see if it's doable for our family right now. I'm thinking a hybrid would work better to be honest. Plan to stop by the Hyundai store where we got the Accent to give the new Kona a whirl. Of course, I'd buy closer to home so best to start down there as no way am I ready to do anything quite yet. But, one must start somewhere and that somewhere is in Miami Lakes tomorrow if I'm feeling o k. Who knows, I might love the Bolt & hate the Kona...or hate the Bolt & absolutely love the Kona. Just don't know actually. And then, onto Mini Cooper to see if one could work. I'm finally ready to step inside a dealer which has been a long time coming! Baby steps before one can walk, as this is a lot of money here and have to get it right, no more Tucson debacle for me!

Sandy, another car you should look into is the Kia Niro - it's available as a Hybrid, PHEV or full electric. I think it's small enough to fit in the garage.

explorerx4

@28firefighter,
Considering all the legal actions against them, not a total surprise.
My guess is the hundreds of illegal diesel modifications they are charged with is the tipping point.

corvette

Michaell said:

Sandy, another car you should look into is the Kia Niro - it's available as a Hybrid, PHEV or full electric. I think it's small enough to fit in the garage.

A used Volt would also likely fit--seems to have similar dimensions to a current Prius.

fintail

That Equinox has almost every modern styling trope. Makes me prefer the current/old one.

0-60 in 20 seconds is 1977 300D territory.

28firefighter

@tifighter said:
@28firefighter

This is a pretty large dealership in Puget Sound with 11 locations. It’s shaping up to be a spicy year.

WOW. That’s a big one - they’ve been around forever. I know they consolidated their Lynnwood lots, but this is surprising.

Seems like they over extended themselves on high priced inventory and were unprepared for a major price drop combined with an interest rate increase.

28firefighter

Oh I didn’t realize apparently they were owned by Sonic.

Michaell

28firefighter said:

Oh I didn’t realize apparently they were owned by Sonic.

Sonic owns a bunch of dealers here in Denver, too. Wonder if any of them are on thin ice.

sda

Sonic Automotive was founded by Bruton Smith in the late 90s with head quarters in Charlotte, NC.

jmonroe1

sda said:

Sonic Automotive was founded by Bruton Smith in the late 90s with head quarters in Charlotte, NC.

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Any relation to the guy that makes burgers?

jmonroe

fintail

Surprising, I wonder what happened. NW Motorsport did often seem to have a surprising highline used assortment in addition to the frilly brotrucks.

Whatever will Jay Buhner do now

explorerx4

Bruton Smith is big in Nascar.

tifighter

Yeah, apparently they’re pretty known in the industry for overpaying at auctions for inventory. Mostly trucks. They would then lift and chrome to complete the brodozer conversion for crazy markups. And it worked for many years, until interest rates likely killed them for floor costs while simultaneously driving away their prime clientele, who are just getting completely priced out of the monthly payments.

Or so I’m speculating.

explorerx4

@tifigter,
That could tie into the link I posted, as the EPA fines diesel alterations on a per unit basis.

qbrozen

@jmonroe1 said:
————————————————
Any relation to the guy that makes burgers?

jmonroe

You beat me to it.

We like Sonic but only get food from the one in N Myrtle Beach. We consider it our cheap vacation food. Have never bought from any other location.

ab348

explorerx4 said:

Bruton Smith is big in Nascar.

He was until he died in 2022. Family now owns Sonic Automotive, along with the NASCAR speedways like Charlotte, Atlanta, Bristol, Las Vegas, New Hampshire, Sonoma, Texas, Dover, Nashville, Kentucky, and North Wilkesboro.

kyfdx

ab348 said:

explorerx4 said:

Bruton Smith is big in Nascar.

He was until he died in 2022. Family now owns Sonic Automotive, along with the NASCAR speedways like Charlotte, Atlanta, Bristol, Las Vegas, New Hampshire, Sonoma, Texas, Dover, Nashville, Kentucky, and North Wilkesboro.

The guys that started/deveoped KY Speedway were virtually forced into selling to Smith, otherwise, no dates for Cup events. Seems like a scam.

kyfdx

explorerx4 said:

Carvana bought some auction company last year?

Yes, they own Adesa, which might be 2nd, only to Manheim.

stickguy

Saw this, and of course thought of our friend sandy.

Would never be an issue up here in the arctic north!

https://youtu.be/uLgN0-AdWSc?si=hJ7z6BqK51Rh2o_I

breld

Sandy - good luck in your test drive of the Bolt. I think it could be a good fit (in many ways)!

I agree with @michaell on the Niro suggestion.

sda

kyfdx said:

ab348 said:

explorerx4 said:

Bruton Smith is big in Nascar.

He was until he died in 2022. Family now owns Sonic Automotive, along with the NASCAR speedways like Charlotte, Atlanta, Bristol, Las Vegas, New Hampshire, Sonoma, Texas, Dover, Nashville, Kentucky, and North Wilkesboro.

The guys that started/deveoped KY Speedway were virtually forced into selling to Smith, otherwise, no dates for Cup events. Seems like a scam.

Smith was a force to be dealt with. A lot of folks didn't care for him.

Somewhat of a funny story. In 2000 when I bought a 98 Catera from Arnold Palmer Cadillac, which then was owned by Sonic, I was picking up the Catera which had been detailed in the Service Area and meeting with my salesman. I would find out later I'd be no stranger to the Service Area. In came a black S class Mercedes and 4 men in suits got out. My salesman excitedly taps me on the shoulder and asks "do you know who that is?" Before I could answer, he said it was the 'Big Man', Bruton Smith. I was underwhelmed.

roadburner

kyfdx said:

ab348 said:

explorerx4 said:

Bruton Smith is big in Nascar.

He was until he died in 2022. Family now owns Sonic Automotive, along with the NASCAR speedways like Charlotte, Atlanta, Bristol, Las Vegas, New Hampshire, Sonoma, Texas, Dover, Nashville, Kentucky, and North Wilkesboro.

The guys that started/developed KY Speedway were virtually forced into selling to Smith, otherwise, no dates for Cup events. Seems like a scam.

I don't feel too bad about those guys being forced to sell; they had screwed over Louisville Motor Speedway back in the '90s. LMS was a very nice 3/8 mile track that hosted ARCA and NASCAR events and was usually packed every weekend for sportsman, mini-trucks, street stocks and late model races.

explorerx4

@stickguy,
When we were looking to build here, our realtor refused to show us any properties built by that company.
They are a huge developer.

ab348

Just to bring a dose of reality to the discussion, Sonic Automotive is controlled by the Smith family. They own (according to Wiki) about 30% of the shares but thanks to some kind of arcane voting structure have 80% of the votes. Sonic is a Fortune 500 company listed on the NYSE. Wiki says they operate in 24 states and have over 100 dealerships. They also own Echo Park Automotive. The NW Motorsports stores that went bust were one piece of an acquisition when they bought RFJ Auto Partners in 2020.

AFAIK they do not sell burgers.

sda

98 Catera. I forget how many unscheduled trips to the service department I made in the year or so I owned it. It had around 24k on it when I bought it, sold it to CarMax with 41k on it. It was still under the 4/50k warranty but I was done.

Michaell

ab348 said:

Just to bring a dose of reality to the discussion, Sonic Automotive is controlled by the Smith family. They own (according to Wiki) about 30% of the shares but thanks to some kind of arcane voting structure have 80% of the votes. Sonic is a Fortune 500 company listed on the NYSE. Wiki says they operate in 24 states and have over 100 dealerships. They also own Echo Park Automotive. The NW Motorsports stores that went bust were one piece of an acquisition when they bought RFJ Auto Partners in 2020.

AFAIK they do not sell burgers.

We have Echo Park dealerships here in the Denver area - kind of an alt CarMax.

laurasdada

sda said:

98 Catera. I forget how many unscheduled trips to the service department I made in the year or so I owned it. It had around 24k on it when I bought it, sold it to CarMax with 41k on it. It was still under the 4/50k warranty but I was done.

Perhaps you bought my father's Catera! I think he dumped it after 6 months, mostly spent at the dealership service dept.

oldfarmer50

tifighter said:

@28firefighter


This is a pretty large dealership in Puget Sound with 11 locations. It’s shaping up to be a spicy year.

Certainly the seesaw of values the last three years has disrupted the market worst than even 2008 and the cash for clunkers debacle. Both supply and prices whipped up and down where I think many used dealers were sitting on inventory bought too dear just as the economy and interest rates slammed the brakes on demand.

Some of it was their own fault. Slapping thousands of dollars of junk fees and refusal to negotiate price soured many buyers away from these dealers. Once the supply of baby seals was gone these guys could no longer pull the same old tricks.

oldfarmer50

venture said:

xwesx said:

I've always found the practice of a plate *not* staying with a car to be odd. I mean, it is the car's plate after all. Best case scenario, it results in far more plates being manufactured and issued than necessary.

The plate goes on the new car.

In NY the buyer pays for a new plate and it’s his to put on the next car he buys. If not transferred to another car you’re required to turn the plate into DMV or you can’t drop insurance coverage.

It gets interesting as NY regularly changes the design of their plates so I now have them in three different colors.

jmonroe1

stickguy said:

Saw this, and of course thought of our friend sandy.

Would never be an issue up here in the arctic north!

https://youtu.be/uLgN0-AdWSc?si=hJ7z6BqK51Rh2o_I

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So much for building codes.

jmonroe