Chronic Car Buyers Anonymous (Archived)

venture

au1994 said:

I know it is pretty much unloved but I have always been a Maxima fan.

Me too. I've never owned one though.

[Deleted User]

qbrozen said:

Sooo… I’m conundrumming. Had someone reach out and ask if by any chance I’d be interested in swapping the Alto for a 350z. I am quite tempted. Even the wife said “do it!” It certainly doesn’t solve my needs but it might scratch and itch as it passes through my inventory.

https://www.facebook.com/share/iP3x3o93iL2hv7rP/?mibextid=79PoIi

Did you do it? The ad says SOLD...

nyccarguy

venture said:

nyccarguy said:

venture said:

oldfarmer50 said:

My BIL just bought a new 2023 Nissan Maxima down in central Florida. Even on a ‘23 leftover they had a “dealer addendum” of additional non-optional dealer add ons with a supplemental sticker. Evidently this included the standard mop & glo nonsense and overpriced interior protector. I can’t imagine what other useless garbage they they slapped on. He said most of the stuff he would have wanted anyway but I think he got taken.

When he went to sign the papers the dealer already had all the financing done with a payment calculated with zero down payment. He had intended to put a substantial amount down which they never even discussed with him. Once he let them know he was putting money down they made it difficult to pay. They refused personal or even cashier’s check and in the end required him to move money onto his debit card before they would accept his down payment.

I can’t believe they are still pulling this baloney down in Florida. Dealer ADMs on a Maxima? Aren’t they discontinuing those because of poor demand? I would have walked out a dozen times if I was treated like this. I’ve heard that Florida is a snake pit but this was ridiculous.

My BIL is not a dumb guy but I wanted to shake him and tell him he should have walked out. I guess there are plenty of people who just roll over so the dealers keep pulling it.

I hate reading things like that.

I have always wanted to walk after the F&I guy lies to me. Particularly when they say, "I can't sell you the car unless you sign the form". I may do that when we look for my wife's next car because she doesn't care if she gets a new one or not.

Whether they lie or are just stupid I don't know. In their position they should know so I assume it's a lie.

One is - the form to say you do not want to buy all the crap they are offering.
The other is - that they have to charge everyone the same amount for the doc fee.
It seems to me there is another form, but I don't remember. I just sign them Rat Face and they don't even look at it.

As shady as so many dealer F&I practices are, these are for their own protection. When the car's owner experiences a major mechanical failure when the warranty is up, the service writer asks if they have the extended warranty. The owner says it was never offered to them. If the dealership chooses to sell extended warranties then they must offer the extended warranty to EVERYONE who purchases a vehicle from them. I do agree it is ridiculous they make you sign 2 legal forms about it. 1 stating that it was offered to you and the second that you declined it.

Same with the Doc/Dealer/Conveyance fee. They aren't required by law to charge a fee, but if they do, then they must charge everyone. 6 in 1/ half dozen in the other. I just look at the doc fee as part of the whole cost. As long as I'm getting the best apples to apples net/net deal (no an Apples & Bowling Balls deal), I don't care about the doc fee. My best friend purchased a Genesis G70 a few months ago. He was also looking at the Lexus IS350 as well. Florida is notorious for high doc fees. There is a big Lexus dealer (J&M Lexus) that touts that they don't charge a dealer fee. They are also a 1 price dealer. They also offered him below market value for his trade in. Another Lexus dealer had a high doc fee, but he negotiated a better selling price than with J&M which offset the cost of the doc fee. Also the 2nd Lexus dealer offered him more for his trade.

In NY, doc fees are capped at $175 (I think?). In December 2021, I traded in mom's leased 2020 RX350 for a new 2022 RX 350. Now I negotiated a 5% off sticker base mf deal which was good at the time. They offered me $10K+ over the buyout for her 2020 RX with a hit on the CarFax (Those were the daaaaaaays). Now the sales manager whom I was dealing with said that due to the low inventory (during Covid) and them wanting to keep their full staff on the payroll they are offsetting the cost by charging the customer a 2% comission fee and that it would go away once inventory levels came back to normal. Guess what? They still charge it.

I don't like the fact that they have you sign a very complex legal document that their attorneys have prepared and you as the customer don't have legal representation.

Well. Not really. I know that's what they tell you. I've searched a lot to find where a dealer was sued for not offering something to a customer. Can't find a thing. If someone knows of an instance, I would really like to see it so I can change my mind. I agree that it is for their own, made up, protection. As someone here once said - it's like going to the grocery store to buy a loaf of bread and being required to sign a form saying you don't want a turkey.

I read the PA law about doc fees. The state sets a maximum you can charge, but it does not say everyone must pay the same amount. As a matter of fact, the law does say that it is negotiable so it may not be pre-printed on the sales form.

I guess my point is, it is not necessary to lie. Just tell the customer why it is like it is. The one in particular is the doc fee lie. If they would say it is as much as they are permitted to charge and they charge it to everyone that would be OK.

Also, it is a retail transaction. I don't make people sign forms who come into my store.

28firefighter

I dunno man. That 350 just screams ridden hard and put away wet.

ab348

qbrozen said:

Sooo… I’m conundrumming. Had someone reach out and ask if by any chance I’d be interested in swapping the Alto for a 350z. I am quite tempted. Even the wife said “do it!” It certainly doesn’t solve my needs but it might scratch and itch as it passes through my inventory.

https://www.facebook.com/share/iP3x3o93iL2hv7rP/?mibextid=79PoIi

I have to think that would be much more saleable and have appeal to a wider audience.

laurasdada

From Mass.gov, https://mass.gov/news/doc-fee-audit

• 
  

“Doc fees,” short for “documentation or documentary fees,” are fees that may be charged by a car dealership as part of a motor vehicle sale. They are neither required nor prohibited by Massachusetts state law.

• 
  

Doc fees can be any amount, but dealers will usually charge the same doc fee to each of their customers to avoid allegations of and liability for discriminatory or unfair and deceptive practices under M.G.L. c. 93A.

As far as I can remember, dealers have consistently told me, by law, that they must charge the same amount to each customer, it's the law. Well, unless I misinterpret the above ("may be charged..."), it's a lie (surprise). To avoid litigation, yes. The law, no.

venture

laurasdada said:

From Mass.gov, https://mass.gov/news/doc-fee-audit

• 
  

“Doc fees,” short for “documentation or documentary fees,” are fees that may be charged by a car dealership as part of a motor vehicle sale. They are neither required nor prohibited by Massachusetts state law.

• 
  

Doc fees can be any amount, but dealers will usually charge the same doc fee to each of their customers to avoid allegations of and liability for discriminatory or unfair and deceptive practices under M.G.L. c. 93A.

As far as I can remember, dealers have consistently told me, by law, that they must charge the same amount to each customer, it's the law. Well, unless I misinterpret the above ("may be charged..."), it's a lie (surprise). To avoid litigation, yes. The law, no.

Agreed. If that was really the case, they would charge everyone the same amount for the same vehicle.

venture

nyccarguy said:

venture said:

nyccarguy said:

venture said:

oldfarmer50 said:

My BIL just bought a new 2023 Nissan Maxima down in central Florida. Even on a ‘23 leftover they had a “dealer addendum” of additional non-optional dealer add ons with a supplemental sticker. Evidently this included the standard mop & glo nonsense and overpriced interior protector. I can’t imagine what other useless garbage they they slapped on. He said most of the stuff he would have wanted anyway but I think he got taken.

When he went to sign the papers the dealer already had all the financing done with a payment calculated with zero down payment. He had intended to put a substantial amount down which they never even discussed with him. Once he let them know he was putting money down they made it difficult to pay. They refused personal or even cashier’s check and in the end required him to move money onto his debit card before they would accept his down payment.

I can’t believe they are still pulling this baloney down in Florida. Dealer ADMs on a Maxima? Aren’t they discontinuing those because of poor demand? I would have walked out a dozen times if I was treated like this. I’ve heard that Florida is a snake pit but this was ridiculous.

My BIL is not a dumb guy but I wanted to shake him and tell him he should have walked out. I guess there are plenty of people who just roll over so the dealers keep pulling it.

I hate reading things like that.

I have always wanted to walk after the F&I guy lies to me. Particularly when they say, "I can't sell you the car unless you sign the form". I may do that when we look for my wife's next car because she doesn't care if she gets a new one or not.

Whether they lie or are just stupid I don't know. In their position they should know so I assume it's a lie.

One is - the form to say you do not want to buy all the crap they are offering.
The other is - that they have to charge everyone the same amount for the doc fee.
It seems to me there is another form, but I don't remember. I just sign them Rat Face and they don't even look at it.

As shady as so many dealer F&I practices are, these are for their own protection. When the car's owner experiences a major mechanical failure when the warranty is up, the service writer asks if they have the extended warranty. The owner says it was never offered to them. If the dealership chooses to sell extended warranties then they must offer the extended warranty to EVERYONE who purchases a vehicle from them. I do agree it is ridiculous they make you sign 2 legal forms about it. 1 stating that it was offered to you and the second that you declined it.

Same with the Doc/Dealer/Conveyance fee. They aren't required by law to charge a fee, but if they do, then they must charge everyone. 6 in 1/ half dozen in the other. I just look at the doc fee as part of the whole cost. As long as I'm getting the best apples to apples net/net deal (no an Apples & Bowling Balls deal), I don't care about the doc fee. My best friend purchased a Genesis G70 a few months ago. He was also looking at the Lexus IS350 as well. Florida is notorious for high doc fees. There is a big Lexus dealer (J&M Lexus) that touts that they don't charge a dealer fee. They are also a 1 price dealer. They also offered him below market value for his trade in. Another Lexus dealer had a high doc fee, but he negotiated a better selling price than with J&M which offset the cost of the doc fee. Also the 2nd Lexus dealer offered him more for his trade.

In NY, doc fees are capped at $175 (I think?). In December 2021, I traded in mom's leased 2020 RX350 for a new 2022 RX 350. Now I negotiated a 5% off sticker base mf deal which was good at the time. They offered me $10K+ over the buyout for her 2020 RX with a hit on the CarFax (Those were the daaaaaaays). Now the sales manager whom I was dealing with said that due to the low inventory (during Covid) and them wanting to keep their full staff on the payroll they are offsetting the cost by charging the customer a 2% comission fee and that it would go away once inventory levels came back to normal. Guess what? They still charge it.

I don't like the fact that they have you sign a very complex legal document that their attorneys have prepared and you as the customer don't have legal representation.

Well. Not really. I know that's what they tell you. I've searched a lot to find where a dealer was sued for not offering something to a customer. Can't find a thing. If someone knows of an instance, I would really like to see it so I can change my mind. I agree that it is for their own, made up, protection. As someone here once said - it's like going to the grocery store to buy a loaf of bread and being required to sign a form saying you don't want a turkey.

I read the PA law about doc fees. The state sets a maximum you can charge, but it does not say everyone must pay the same amount. As a matter of fact, the law does say that it is negotiable so it may not be pre-printed on the sales form.

I guess my point is, it is not necessary to lie. Just tell the customer why it is like it is. The one in particular is the doc fee lie. If they would say it is as much as they are permitted to charge and they charge it to everyone that would be OK.

Also, it is a retail transaction. I don't make people sign forms who come into my store.

Good point. If a pipe broke or a valve failed, etc. and a customer's basement got flooded, would they come back to you because you didn't offer to sell them an alarm that sounds when flooding starts?

roadburner

oldfarmer50 said:

My BIL just bought a new 2023 Nissan Maxima down in central Florida. Even on a ‘23 leftover they had a “dealer addendum” of additional non-optional dealer add ons with a supplemental sticker. Evidently this included the standard mop & glo nonsense and overpriced interior protector. I can’t imagine what other useless garbage they they slapped on. He said most of the stuff he would have wanted anyway but I think he got taken.

When he went to sign the papers the dealer already had all the financing done with a payment calculated with zero down payment. He had intended to put a substantial amount down which they never even discussed with him. Once he let them know he was putting money down they made it difficult to pay. They refused personal or even cashier’s check and in the end required him to move money onto his debit card before they would accept his down payment.

I can’t believe they are still pulling this baloney down in Florida. Dealer ADMs on a Maxima? Aren’t they discontinuing those because of poor demand? I would have walked out a dozen times if I was treated like this. I’ve heard that Florida is a snake pit but this was ridiculous.

My BIL is not a dumb guy but I wanted to shake him and tell him he should have walked out. I guess there are plenty of people who just roll over so the dealers keep pulling it.

Agreed; I would never pay an ADM- leftover or not, and if the store wouldn't take a down payment I would be gone.
On another board a guy related a story about a dealer who wouldn't negotiate an OTD price. And sadly the guy went along with it.

roadburner

au1994 said:

I know it is pretty much unloved but I have always been a Maxima fan.

I actually like the looks of the current Maxima but FWD+CVT is a deal killer for me.

jmonroe1

qbrozen said:

Sooo… I’m conundrumming. Had someone reach out and ask if by any chance I’d be interested in swapping the Alto for a 350z. I am quite tempted. Even the wife said “do it!” It certainly doesn’t solve my needs but it might scratch and itch as it passes through my inventory.

https://www.facebook.com/share/iP3x3o93iL2hv7rP/?mibextid=79PoIi

————————————————
I can see that it’s sold, so tell us how you like it.

jmonroe

kyfdx

It isn't the law. Dealers say it is, so they don't have to argue with old men that hang out on Edmunds Forums.

jmonroe1

oldfarmer50 said:

My BIL just bought a new 2023 Nissan Maxima down in central Florida. Even on a ‘23 leftover they had a “dealer addendum” of additional non-optional dealer add ons with a supplemental sticker. Evidently this included the standard mop & glo nonsense and overpriced interior protector. I can’t imagine what other useless garbage they they slapped on. He said most of the stuff he would have wanted anyway but I think he got taken.

When he went to sign the papers the dealer already had all the financing done with a payment calculated with zero down payment. He had intended to put a substantial amount down which they never even discussed with him. Once he let them know he was putting money down they made it difficult to pay. They refused personal or even cashier’s check and in the end required him to move money onto his debit card before they would accept his down payment.

I can’t believe they are still pulling this baloney down in Florida. Dealer ADMs on a Maxima? Aren’t they discontinuing those because of poor demand? I would have walked out a dozen times if I was treated like this. I’ve heard that Florida is a snake pit but this was ridiculous.

My BIL is not a dumb guy but I wanted to shake him and tell him he should have walked out. I guess there are plenty of people who just roll over so the dealers keep pulling it.

————————————————
I disagree about your BIL’s intelligence. The smart folks I know don’t allow a dealer to lie to them and put up with their shenanigans then buy the car anyway.

I told this story before:

My late Delray Beach brother bought a convertible in the dead of Winter in the Burgh then had his nephew (from his younger brother) and a cousin drive it to Florida then flew them back to the Burgh and he still saved a few thousand bucks. He could not stomach dealing with the snake pit of dealers in southeast Florida. I know for a fact he could afford buying a car where he lived but just the thought of dealing with snakes was more than he was willing to put up with.

Where there’s a will there’s a way.

jmonroe

qbrozen

@dad23 said:
Did you do it? The ad says SOLD...

No. He wasn’t making headway so he pulled it hoping Spring would see a better market for it. So I have time to decide.

I have someone who claims they want to come tomorrow. If that doesn’t happen, maybe I’ll discuss logistics with this guy.

oldfarmer50

roadburner said:

au1994 said:

I know it is pretty much unloved but I have always been a Maxima fan.

I actually like the looks of the current Maxima but FWD+CVT is a deal killer for me.

Evidently my BIL had good luck with his Altima. He had over 100k miles on it with no problem on the CVT.

oldfarmer50

kyfdx said:

It isn't the law. Dealers say it is, so they don't have to argue with old men that hang out on Edmunds Forums.

I don’t worry about doc fees, I just make an OTD offer that factors it in. As was mentioned NY doc is capped at $175 so I don’t know how I’d react to a $1000 Florida fee.

cdnpinhead

It's pretty apparent that acquiring a vehicle in FL is a fool's mission. I "feel" for the poor (fill in the blank) who have do deal in such a miserable environment.

Take a vacation or break to somewhere away from FL (GA, AL, etc.), buy what you want, and tell the people where you live to *iss up a rope. Otherwise you're just more grist for their mill.

corvette

Just checked in for my long weekend trip to the Chicago Auto Show. Easy four hour drive to East Chicago, then about a 40 minute train ride in. I got there way early and had to wait a bit for the train, but that’s preferable to driving in Chicago traffic.

roadburner

oldfarmer50 said:

roadburner said:

au1994 said:

I know it is pretty much unloved but I have always been a Maxima fan.

I actually like the looks of the current Maxima but FWD+CVT is a deal killer for me.

Evidently my BIL had good luck with his Altima. He had over 100k miles on it with no problem on the CVT.

I don't care how long it lasts, I hate how a CVT operates.

qbrozen

@corvette said:
Just checked in for my long weekend trip to the Chicago Auto Show. Easy four hour drive to East Chicago, then about a 40 minute train ride in. I got there way early and had to wait a bit for the train, but that’s preferable to driving in Chicago traffic.

That’s dedication.

Michaell

Isn’t East Chicago essentially Lake Michigan?

oldfarmer50

cdnpinhead said:

It's pretty apparent that acquiring a vehicle in FL is a fool's mission. I "feel" for the poor (fill in the blank) who have do deal in such a miserable environment.

Take a vacation or break to somewhere away from FL (GA, AL, etc.), buy what you want, and tell the people where you live to *iss up a rope. Otherwise you're just more grist for their mill.

That’s what I told my BIL since he returns to NY a few times a year but it fell on deaf ears.

oldfarmer50

roadburner said:

oldfarmer50 said:

roadburner said:

au1994 said:

I know it is pretty much unloved but I have always been a Maxima fan.

I actually like the looks of the current Maxima but FWD+CVT is a deal killer for me.

Evidently my BIL had good luck with his Altima. He had over 100k miles on it with no problem on the CVT.

I don't care how long it lasts, I hate how a CVT operates.

Yeah, we’ll, there is that.😓

Michaell

As I've noted before, the CVT in our Outback is programmed to feel like a traditional automatic transmission, faking shifts where you can feel the engine change speeds (and, reflected on the tach, as well).

Plus it has the handy flappy paddle shifters if I want to get more involved, or if the weather dictates.

corvette

Michaell said:

Isn’t East Chicago essentially Lake Michigan?

That, and chemical plants, from what I could tell.

roadburner

Michaell said:

As I've noted before, the CVT in our Outback is programmed to feel like a traditional automatic transmission, faking shifts where you can feel the engine change speeds (and, reflected on the tach, as well).

Plus it has the handy flappy paddle shifters if I want to get more involved, or if the weather dictates.

The thing is, the "advantage" of a CVT is that it allows the engine to stay in the peak of its power curve- which is really annoying. So, the "solution" is to make the CVT act like a conventional automatic. Me, if I'm getting an automatic I want a good one like the ZF HP8 or the 9G-Tronic in the C43.

jmonroe1

Michaell said:

As I've noted before, the CVT in our Outback is programmed to feel like a traditional automatic transmission, faking shifts where you can feel the engine change speeds (and, reflected on the tach, as well).

Plus it has the handy flappy paddle shifters if I want to get more involved, or if the weather dictates.

————————————————
Mrs. j’s 2018 Legacy Limited with the 3.6R engine has a CVT. I agree they really did do a good job faking shift points and only a real car buff could tell it isn’t a typical 6 speed slush box.

Now, how long it lasts that is a different question. The car doesn’t even have 30K miles yet and I doubt we’ll have it for another 10K miles.

jmonroe

qbrozen

Gotta wonder why bother putting in a CVT only to make it act like an automatic. Just use the real thing rather than pretend.

cdnpinhead

Same answer as always -- it's cheaper.

qbrozen

@cdnpinhead said:
Same answer as always -- it's cheaper.

But is it? I guess if you already put your money into the R&D and tooling…

cdnpinhead

Probably the fuel mileage thing is the real driver. I remember seeing an article in Popular Science back in the early '60s describing how a CVT works, but it took until a decade or so ago for material science to catch up with the concept, and the jury is still out regarding whether the longevity is anywhere near an automatic transmission, let alone a manual.

oldfarmer50

jmonroe1 said:

Michaell said:

As I've noted before, the CVT in our Outback is programmed to feel like a traditional automatic transmission, faking shifts where you can feel the engine change speeds (and, reflected on the tach, as well).

Plus it has the handy flappy paddle shifters if I want to get more involved, or if the weather dictates.

————————————————
Mrs. j’s 2018 Legacy Limited with the 3.6R engine has a CVT. I agree they really did do a good job faking shift points and only a real car buff could tell it isn’t a typical 6 speed slush box.

Now, how long it lasts that is a different question. The car doesn’t even have 30K miles yet and I doubt we’ll have it for another 10K miles.

jmonroe

On a non performance car I’m not really concerned with how a CVT “shifts” but in how long it lasts. If I could trust them to last as long as a conventional auto the numb sensation wouldn’t bother me too much. It’s not like modern transmissions have strong positive shifts like the old Torqueflite anyway.

venture

I remember back when Subaru was introducing the CVT. I drove, I think, an Outback with the CVT. It didn't shift. It just kept winding up. I hated it. We bought something else that still had a traditional automatic.

The newest ones are simulated to be 8 speeds and they did a really good job with them.

It sort of makes you wonder - if the CVT were the traditional transmission and someone introduced a regular automatic, would we be complaining about the jerky shifts?

stickguy

probably, since many people complain about change, no matter what it is.

the CVT sound/experience is different, but you normally just get used to stuff fairly quickly. A reason why deciding based on a short test drive is not always the best idea!

qbrozen

@cdnpinhead said:
Probably the fuel mileage thing is the real driver. I remember seeing an article in Popular Science back in the early '60s describing how a CVT works, but it took until a decade or so ago for material science to catch up with the concept, and the jury is still out regarding whether the longevity is anywhere near an automatic transmission, let alone a manual.

It was, but once you make it act like a regular auto trans, you negate the fuel benefit.

qbrozen

First CVT I tried was a Nissan… I believe the Note? It was awful, but probably more because of the vehicle it was in. Having a rattly engine incessantly buzzing away at full chat in a tin can is supremely irritating.

qbrozen

First person to drive the Alto bought it. Well, essentially. I will wait till they succeed in registering it in PA and come back with the plates before counting it gone.

Buyer was a young lady with father in tow. She currently has a manual Miata and needs something more daily friendly. She was nervous to drive RHD so they asked me to drive. I gave it the beans to show her what it could do. She was very pleased. I then had her take it around my block so she could see it was nothing to be afraid of. Again, she was pleased. When we got back, they discussed all of 15 secs before offering $500 off my asking price. Done.

roadburner

oldfarmer50 said:

jmonroe1 said:

Michaell said:

As I've noted before, the CVT in our Outback is programmed to feel like a traditional automatic transmission, faking shifts where you can feel the engine change speeds (and, reflected on the tach, as well).

Plus it has the handy flappy paddle shifters if I want to get more involved, or if the weather dictates.

————————————————
Mrs. j’s 2018 Legacy Limited with the 3.6R engine has a CVT. I agree they really did do a good job faking shift points and only a real car buff could tell it isn’t a typical 6 speed slush box.

Now, how long it lasts that is a different question. The car doesn’t even have 30K miles yet and I doubt we’ll have it for another 10K miles.

jmonroe

On a non performance car I’m not really concerned with how a CVT “shifts” but in how long it lasts. If I could trust them to last as long as a conventional auto the numb sensation wouldn’t bother me too much. It’s not like modern transmissions have strong positive shifts like the old Torqueflite anyway.

Try an HP8 or 9G-Tronic in Sport+ mode.

Sandman6472

The CVT in my kids 2008 Nissan Versa SL was just awful...lugged all the time! Felt like it was stuck in a gear and couldn't get out. She didn't mind being her first new vehicle and all. But, would've driven me crazy to have it as my d d.

Sandman6472

Just got off the phone with AT&T and so glad I asked to speak with a supervisor from the get go. Got some resistance but kept to my guns & eventually got a pretty low key guy. Explained the issues which he could plainly see in the notes & corrected the issue and even gave me an extra credit towards next months bill which I didn't ask for or even expect...just wanted to pay the correct price each month. He could see where the initial guy at the local store totally screwed things up and didn't get the correct info from me for our new Florida 55 Plus plan. I had to go to another company owned store near one of our offices to get things straightened up but still, last months bill was over double what it should be which pissed me off!

Saw this months bill online, we have to do paperless billing & auto-pay with a debit card to get this plan but I'm fine with that. For the two of us, cheaper than what we had while getting unlimited data, something I really wanted. Hate making changes with certain company's like AT&T as there's always an issue I have to deal with at a later time. And seeing the last bill for just over $200 really pissed me off. But, I knew my figures were right and obviously, the paperwork & this supervisor got that. I knew I'd need a supervisor to get things done correctly so didn't want to even bother with the person answering my call. Would've been frustrating & he would've needed his supervisor anyways to do what needed to be done to correct things.

I remained calm as I knew there was a simple solution here & ended up getting more then I even asked for! A win/win for me and a happy customer for them!

corvette

One of the issues I had with the earlier CVTs is that, if you were at (lower) cruising RPMs and gave it the beans, it seemed to take longer for the CVT to spool up than it would have taken many conventional automatics to kick down to the appropriate gear. I owned two of them in spite of that, but it was definitely a shortcoming.

jmonroe1

Is everyone at a Super Bowl party that I wasn’t invited to?

jmonroe

corvette

jmonroe1 said:

Is everyone at a Super Bowl party that I wasn’t invited to?

Yes, I heard there is some sort of sportsball game going on, and that Taylor Swift might make an appearance. I went to a Spanish tapas place for dinner right about tee-off time, and I was the only one there. I only glanced at the TV trying to get a glimpse of TS, but I must've missed her.

qbrozen

I saw the Taylor Swift show. I don’t know what sports thing y’all talkin bout.

venture

Ya mean these guys?

tjc78

Other than Romo… I felt the entire event was great to watch.

Game was awesome. No ticky tack calls.
Commercials had their moments
Usher entertained
They kept the Taylor saga to a minimum.
I’m happy for Andy. Lots of Eagle’s fans hate on him, but I’ve always been a fan.

qbrozen

I think they showed Taylor and friends far more than necessary.

I will admit the refs were largely fair. Several noncalls on Chiefs offensive holds but I can’t say it made a difference.

venture

qbrozen said:

I think they showed Taylor and friends far more than necessary.

I will admit the refs were largely fair. Several noncalls on Chiefs offensive holds but I can’t say it made a difference.

Agree that the refs were pretty good. Also agree with the holding no calls. Not too bad. One time a SF lineman almost got his jersey ripped off. It really didn't make a difference in the play, but still...

ab348

I agree on the excess coverage of Swift and the obnoxious Kelce. Romo seemed to be restrained for much of the game but went ga-ga by the latter stages. I feel sorry for Nantz. I wanted the 49ers to win but cannot deny the tremendous talent of Mahomes. I actually like him even though I always want the Chiefs to lose.

I found the restraint of the officials keeping their flags in their pockets quite refreshing.

stickguy

The finish worked out for my kids. Final score gave my son a win in a box pool and my daughter’s BF had bet on the chiefs.