Chronic Car Buyers Anonymous (Archived)

au1994

xwesx said:

That's why I always operate on out the door pricing. I don't care what numbers they put where, but if we agree on $20,000 out the door, that better be the price at the bottom of the page!

100% agree. I learned and refined that method here.

I told a guy on an Accord SE one time, you can charge me $25k for floor mats for all I care but I’m writing a check for $30k. He was confused and had to go see the manager.

xwesx

Speaking of $25K on an Accord, my brother just bought one of those a couple days ago for his son, who is going to college in Oklahoma (they live in Oregon). I guess this is a 2024 model, but was demo car, so it has 1,800 miles on it. He got it for $26K out the door. I think it must be an Accord EX? He said it had an MSRP of $30K.

stickguy

Good deal on a good car to take to college.

au1994

Smokin deal on the Accord

oldfarmer50

Another one for stickguy. Right in his back yard.

https://albany.craigslist.org/cto/d/ballston-spa-2001-mazda-miata-ls/7764527148.html

xwesx

Well.... here's the flip side of that deal.

Originally, they had been looking for a used car. My brother has a Hyundai Elantra (2017?) out of which he uses the snot due to needing to drive regularly for his job. It averages upper 30s in the fuel economy, so he figured that would be a good place to look.

They found a Kia version ( I don't recall the model) up in Spokane, which I guess turned out to be a reconstructed unit due to a recent-but-relatively-minor crash. Seller did not disclose such in the ad or on the phone, and it wasn't until they showed up that the collision was quite apparent (only repaired to the extent necessary, which meant there was some superficial damage to the left side and rear quarter). Car had 122,000 miles on it, and seller was apparently very forthcoming on its history while face to face (which still does not excuse the lack of disclosure in the ad). Guy even says at one point, "This car will never leave your son stranded anywhere."

Well, they had just traveled about a hundred miles to see it, and the price was still on target compared to everything else they'd been considering, so they bit the bullet despite the red flags and took it home. Next morning, my nephew takes it out on the highway, gets about twenty miles into nowhere, and the engine blows. Done. Finalizado. So, total of 129 miles fo about $6K. I now have one infuriated brother....

Apparently the issues with the 2.4L engine are well known now, and that has him worried about his own car (which has been relatively flawless to this point).

Weighing his options, he just threw in the towel and got the Accord deal done.

Michaell

xwesx said:

Well.... here's the flip side of that deal.

Originally, they had been looking for a used car. My brother has a Hyundai Elantra (2017?) out of which he uses the snot due to needing to drive regularly for his job. It averages upper 30s in the fuel economy, so he figured that would be a good place to look.

They found a Kia version ( I don't recall the model) up in Spokane, which I guess turned out to be a reconstructed unit due to a recent-but-relatively-minor crash. Seller did not disclose such in the ad or on the phone, and it wasn't until they showed up that the collision was quite apparent (only repaired to the extent necessary, which meant there was some superficial damage to the left side and rear quarter). Car had 122,000 miles on it, and seller was apparently very forthcoming on its history while face to face (which still does not excuse the lack of disclosure in the ad). Guy even says at one point, "This car will never leave your son stranded anywhere."

Well, they had just traveled about a hundred miles to see it, and the price was still on target compared to everything else they'd been considering, so they bit the bullet despite the red flags and took it home. Next morning, my nephew takes it out on the highway, gets about twenty miles into nowhere, and the engine blows. Done. Finalizado. So, total of 129 miles fo about $6K. I now have one infuriated brother....

Apparently the issues with the 2.4L engine are well known now, and that has him worried about his own car (which has been relatively flawless to this point).

Weighing his options, he just threw in the towel and got the Accord deal done.

The Elantra (and Kia Forte) don't use the 2.4 engine - that's in the Sonata and Kia equivalent.

But, sucks for them about the blown engine.

xwesx

Okay, thanks for clarifying. I might have misunderstood some of what he said, as I was trying to work while he was talking to me on the phone.

Michaell

xwesx said:

Okay, thanks for clarifying. I might have misunderstood some of what he said, as I was trying to work while he was talking to me on the phone.

I do that with my sister, too.

andres3

xwesx said:

That's why I always operate on out the door pricing. I don't care what numbers they put where, but if we agree on $20,000 out the door, that better be the price at the bottom of the page!

That's a better way to operate. CA has always cracked down on dealerships and kept tight tabs on things like "document processing" fees so it hasn't been an issue before. Now they can just give you a thumb drive so they don't even have to waste paper and ink much. Takes a rocket scientist to figure out DMV fees too.

CA makes you sign so much paperwork though, that you lose sight of the important things to look at.

ab348

Michaell said:

The Elantra (and Kia Forte) don't use the 2.4 engine - that's in the Sonata and Kia equivalent.

But, sucks for them about the blown engine.

H/K have earned the reputation that the early space-age rockets had: "They all blow up!!!"

jmonroe1

andres3 said:

xwesx said:

That's why I always operate on out the door pricing. I don't care what numbers they put where, but if we agree on $20,000 out the door, that better be the price at the bottom of the page!

That's a better way to operate. CA has always cracked down on dealerships and kept tight tabs on things like "document processing" fees so it hasn't been an issue before. Now they can just give you a thumb drive so they don't even have to waste paper and ink much. Takes a rocket scientist to figure out DMV fees too.

CA makes you sign so much paperwork though, that you lose sight of the important things to look at.

————————————————
Don’t tell us that you think dealerships are behind that,

FWIW, that dealership sounds like they got their training in south Florida.

jmonroe

nyccarguy

@xwesx said:
Well.... here's the flip side of that deal.

Originally, they had been looking for a used car. My brother has a Hyundai Elantra (2017?) out of which he uses the snot due to needing to drive regularly for his job. It averages upper 30s in the fuel economy, so he figured that would be a good place to look.

They found a Kia version ( I don't recall the model) up in Spokane, which I guess turned out to be a reconstructed unit due to a recent-but-relatively-minor crash. Seller did not disclose such in the ad or on the phone, and it wasn't until they showed up that the collision was quite apparent (only repaired to the extent necessary, which meant there was some superficial damage to the left side and rear quarter). Car had 122,000 miles on it, and seller was apparently very forthcoming on its history while face to face (which still does not excuse the lack of disclosure in the ad). Guy even says at one point, "This car will never leave your son stranded anywhere."

Well, they had just traveled about a hundred miles to see it, and the price was still on target compared to everything else they'd been considering, so they bit the bullet despite the red flags and took it home. Next morning, my nephew takes it out on the highway, gets about twenty miles into nowhere, and the engine blows. Done. Finalizado. So, total of 129 miles fo about $6K. I now have one infuriated brother....

Apparently the issues with the 2.4L engine are well known now, and that has him worried about his own car (which has been relatively flawless to this point).

Weighing his options, he just threw in the towel and got the Accord deal done.

OMG! How awful!

oldfarmer50

Michaell said:

xwesx said:

Well.... here's the flip side of that deal.

Originally, they had been looking for a used car. My brother has a Hyundai Elantra (2017?) out of which he uses the snot due to needing to drive regularly for his job. It averages upper 30s in the fuel economy, so he figured that would be a good place to look.

They found a Kia version ( I don't recall the model) up in Spokane, which I guess turned out to be a reconstructed unit due to a recent-but-relatively-minor crash. Seller did not disclose such in the ad or on the phone, and it wasn't until they showed up that the collision was quite apparent (only repaired to the extent necessary, which meant there was some superficial damage to the left side and rear quarter). Car had 122,000 miles on it, and seller was apparently very forthcoming on its history while face to face (which still does not excuse the lack of disclosure in the ad). Guy even says at one point, "This car will never leave your son stranded anywhere."

Well, they had just traveled about a hundred miles to see it, and the price was still on target compared to everything else they'd been considering, so they bit the bullet despite the red flags and took it home. Next morning, my nephew takes it out on the highway, gets about twenty miles into nowhere, and the engine blows. Done. Finalizado. So, total of 129 miles fo about $6K. I now have one infuriated brother....

Apparently the issues with the 2.4L engine are well known now, and that has him worried about his own car (which has been relatively flawless to this point).

Weighing his options, he just threw in the towel and got the Accord deal done.

The Elantra (and Kia Forte) don't use the 2.4 engine - that's in the Sonata and Kia equivalent.

But, sucks for them about the blown engine.

Kia has had problems with their engines for decades. When I bought my 2019 it was because I thought they had solved some of their problems only to find out that the engine defects included mine. I would have a problem buying a new Kia and I would be really wary of buying a used one, particularly where the seller was not being honest.

nyccarguy

Took my daughter out for Boba this evening. Saw an awesome ‘91 NSX at a light. I told him I loved his car! It was in spectacular condition. He asked what year my Prelude was and then the light turned green and off he went.

28firefighter

Someone scraped the corner of the back bumper of the BMW at the park and ride yesterday. Clearly tried to wipe off their paint before leaving to hide it, but took off my paint too.

Of course no note. Grrrrr.

nyccarguy

28firefighter said:

Someone scraped the corner of the back bumper of the BMW at the park and ride yesterday. Clearly tried to wipe off their paint before leaving to hide it, but took off my paint too.

Of course no note. Grrrrr.

UGH! THAT STNKS!

sda

I had that happen to the Passat back in March. No note. Truly stinks.

[Deleted User]

Do you think the lot has cameras or would that be more work than it's worth?

au1994

@28firefighter said:
Someone scraped the corner of the back bumper of the BMW at the park and ride yesterday. Clearly tried to wipe off their paint before leaving to hide it, but took off my paint too.

Of course no note. Grrrrr.

That’s terrible. Sorry to hear.

roadburner

28firefighter said:

Someone scraped the corner of the back bumper of the BMW at the park and ride yesterday. Clearly tried to wipe off their paint before leaving to hide it, but took off my paint too.

Of course no note. Grrrrr.

Being boiled in oil is too lenient a punishment.

28firefighter

@dad23 said:
Do you think the lot has cameras or would that be more work than it's worth?

They don’t. I already called. And what’s worse is my dashcam caught the movement and I could see them drive away in the rear window, but it’s not enough detail to do anything with.

I’ll get an estimate next week.

pensfan83

Infuriating to say the least.

oldfarmer50

dad23 said:

Do you think the lot has cameras or would that be more work than it's worth?

Probably a deadbeat. You’d be chasing them for years.

andres3

Speaking of cars in need of body repair, the Tiguan was finished up the other day but we didn't have time to pick it up before 5 PM. Today is that day.

Anyone want an S4 that's never been tracked to my knowledge? $23K-$24K is my magic number but I might find out that was May's number and I'm off.

jmonroe1

roadburner said:

28firefighter said:

Someone scraped the corner of the back bumper of the BMW at the park and ride yesterday. Clearly tried to wipe off their paint before leaving to hide it, but took off my paint too.

Of course no note. Grrrrr.

Being boiled in oil is too lenient a punishment.

————————————————
I agree and this would be the wrong group of guys to ask what the appropriate punishment should be. But I’d like to hear from them anyway.

jmonroe

Michaell

A scrape? I had this happen to the Subaru last year at target. Given my budget situation, I’m just now arranging for a repair.

[Deleted User]

jmonroe1 said:

roadburner said:

28firefighter said:

Someone scraped the corner of the back bumper of the BMW at the park and ride yesterday. Clearly tried to wipe off their paint before leaving to hide it, but took off my paint too.

Of course no note. Grrrrr.

Being boiled in oil is too lenient a punishment.

————————————————
I agree and this would be the wrong group of guys to ask what the appropriate punishment should be. But I’d like to hear from them anyway.

jmonroe

I was thinking a mid-day visit to the DMV, A/C happens to be out, they pull ticket number 182 and the sign says now serving number 12?

jmonroe1

dad23 said:

jmonroe1 said:

roadburner said:

28firefighter said:

Someone scraped the corner of the back bumper of the BMW at the park and ride yesterday. Clearly tried to wipe off their paint before leaving to hide it, but took off my paint too.

Of course no note. Grrrrr.

Being boiled in oil is too lenient a punishment.

————————————————
I agree and this would be the wrong group of guys to ask what the appropriate punishment should be. But I’d like to hear from them anyway.

jmonroe

I was thinking a mid-day visit to the DMV, A/C happens to be out, they pull ticket number 182 and the sign says now serving number 12?

————————————————
You’re wicked. You could have added they didn’t have any chairs left either.

jmonroe

corvette

Drove about 50 miles on gravel roads in the Maverick today. The setup with the tonneau is definitely not dust-proof. I think a lot came in from under the tailgate. My luggage is going to need a vacuum when I get back home. Spending the night at Price Tower, Frank Lloyd Wright's only realized skyscraper.

stickguy

I got for my first maverick a stick on gasket to seal around the tailgate. Seemed to do a good job. Though I was more doing it to water seal. I don’t drive on dusty roads.

breld

@28firefighter - oh man, that is horrible about your BMW. My mind always go to Pulp Fiction when something like that happens. Don’t mess with another man’s car!

I get to have a little shopping experience later this morning. My daughter’s boyfriend has been shopping for a lightly used Q5 and seems to have landed on the right one. 2024 Q5 Premium Plus, black over black with the black optic package…so very sinister! It’s sharp. Probably a previous service loaner, as it’s a 2024 w/2,500 miles (CPO).

I helped him shop a little bit already and didn’t want to overstep, but did offer to accompany him for the actual buying process…and most importantly for the finance office ordeal. He gladly accepted.

breld

Not car-related, but figured this group would get a laugh out of this…

We have a Samsung Frame TV in our main living area and decided to get another one for our newly remodeled basement. I spent way more hours yesterday than anticipated hanging it, considering I’ve hung dozens of TVs over the years and this same exact Samsung on our upper level.

Most of the ordeal was me simply not being patient enough…one of the studs was stubborn and I stripped one of the screws trying to drive it it…then when my wife and I finally hung the TV I hadn’t measured well and it was hanging too low, leaving the outlets behind the TV exposed at the top. So I had to reposition the TV mounts a bit higher. My wife took off to run some errands while I completed that…and here’s where it all went really bad.

Repositioning the mounts didn’t take much time at all. So I thought…I can get this 65” TV up on the mounts on my own.

I did indeed lift the TV up and onto the mounts. Or at least I thought I did. I went to adjust the TV and it came crashing down to the floor.

After a bit of screaming, I calmed down, took the broken TV up to the garage (until I can properly recycle it) and promptly ordered a replacement from Costco for delivery Tuesday. At least the mount is already installed.

tjc78

Oh no!! I almost lost a 65” too. I was trying to get something plugged in and knocked it off the mount. Somehow I pressed against the screen just hard enough to stabilize it but not damage it while getting a grip on it.

sda

Michaell said:

A scrape? I had this happen to the Subaru last year at target. Given my budget situation, I’m just now arranging for a repair.

Ugh! Nice Michelins.

oldfarmer50

I might have a solution for my worries that Kia has crap engines. My dealer just sent me an ad inviting me to trade in my Kia Soul+ for a Niro EV Wind lease. MSRP $42,500, zero due at signing, all fees and taxes rolled into the deal. 36 months/30k miles for $298.

I’d have to drive the devil out of it to do 10,000 miles a year (I do an average of 2500 across four cars now) but forgetting that I have no place to charge it, what do you guys think?

Based on what my current Kia is worth I might walk away with a few bucks too.

kyfdx

oldfarmer50 said:

I might have a solution for my worries that Kia has crap engines. My dealer just sent me an ad inviting me to trade in my Kia Soul+ for a Niro EV Wind lease. MSRP $42,500, zero due at signing, all fees and taxes rolled into the deal. 36 months/30k miles for $298.

I’d have to drive the devil out of it to do 10,000 miles a year (I do an average of 2500 across four cars now) but forgetting that I have no place to charge it, what do you guys think?

Based on what my current Kia is worth I might walk away with a few bucks too.

Loan it out to your employer to rent, when they run out of cars?

tjc78

@oldfarmer50 said:
I might have a solution for my worries that Kia has crap engines. My dealer just sent me an ad inviting me to trade in my Kia Soul+ for a Niro EV Wind lease. MSRP $42,500, zero due at signing, all fees and taxes rolled into the deal. 36 months/30k miles for $298.

I’d have to drive the devil out of it to do 10,000 miles a year (I do an average of 2500 across four cars now) but forgetting that I have no place to charge it, what do you guys think?

Based on what my current Kia is worth I might walk away with a few bucks too.

We don’t have a home charger for our EV at either home and never have an issue.

At home we charge at the shopping mall 5 mins from the house (free for two years). At the shore there is a Starbucks with charging 3 blocks away.

At the rate you drive you would charge once a month maybe. Easily could incorporate that into your errands or shopping trips.

At the shore we have to pay for charging since there is no Electrify America here. I was at 20% took it to 85% for $30

oldfarmer50

kyfdx said:

oldfarmer50 said:

I might have a solution for my worries that Kia has crap engines. My dealer just sent me an ad inviting me to trade in my Kia Soul+ for a Niro EV Wind lease. MSRP $42,500, zero due at signing, all fees and taxes rolled into the deal. 36 months/30k miles for $298.

I’d have to drive the devil out of it to do 10,000 miles a year (I do an average of 2500 across four cars now) but forgetting that I have no place to charge it, what do you guys think?

Based on what my current Kia is worth I might walk away with a few bucks too.

Loan it out to your employer to rent, when they run out of cars?

No thanks, I see what you renters do to cars. I wouldn’t want it back afterwards.😢😢

Besides, it’s a 2019, too old.

mjfloyd1

@Michaell said:
A scrape? I had this happen to the Subaru last year at target. Given my budget situation, I’m just now arranging for a repair.

Is that paint transfer from a white car or is the paint scratched and missing? If the former, I’d do paint less dent repair and polish the paint transfer off

explorerx4

@mjfloyd1,
I agree that it's worth trying to buff out.
Here's are before and after pics of one of my doors when I rubbed a metal pole in a parking lot.
All I did was rub it down with some waterless carwash or maybe detail spray.

ab348

oldfarmer50 said:

I might have a solution for my worries that Kia has crap engines. My dealer just sent me an ad inviting me to trade in my Kia Soul+ for a Niro EV Wind lease. MSRP $42,500, zero due at signing, all fees and taxes rolled into the deal. 36 months/30k miles for $298.

Did they give you a trade-in offer already or is that monthly payment with no trade at all?

It hasn’t drifted north to Canada yet of course, but I was seeing multiple sites this week talking about super-cheap leases suddenly being offered in the US on Chevy Blazer EVs with payments in that same range. Apparently GM is sitting on about 18,000 of them and want them gone. I checkout locally and they’re still quoting absurd monthly lease quotes of around $1000/mo.

oldfarmer50

ab348 said:

oldfarmer50 said:

I might have a solution for my worries that Kia has crap engines. My dealer just sent me an ad inviting me to trade in my Kia Soul+ for a Niro EV Wind lease. MSRP $42,500, zero due at signing, all fees and taxes rolled into the deal. 36 months/30k miles for $298.

Did they give you a trade-in offer already or is that monthly payment with no trade at all?

It hasn’t drifted north to Canada yet of course, but I was seeing multiple sites this week talking about super-cheap leases suddenly being offered in the US on Chevy Blazer EVs with payments in that same range. Apparently GM is sitting on about 18,000 of them and want them gone. I checkout locally and they’re still quoting absurd monthly lease quotes of around $1000/mo.

So far it’s just a postcard ad.

If I’m reading this right, they want the trade but that’s independent of the lease terms. I’m sure any tax credits, federal and state, and any incentives go to the dealer. They say KBB price for the trade. KBB says my car is worth about $11k trade-in and $298 X 36 equals about $10,700 so I might net a little bit over the total cost of the lease.

https://www.destinationkia.com/newspecials.html

Under my current projections I would be needing a car for more than 3 years so a lease at this time wouldn’t fit my plans. But it’s interesting to think about.

imidazol97

mjfloyd1 said:

@Michaell said:

A scrape? I had this happen to the Subaru last year at target. Given my budget situation, I’m just now arranging for a repair.

Is that paint transfer from a white car or is the paint scratched and missing? If the former, I’d do paint less dent repair and polish the paint transfer off

A test for damaged clear coat/abraided clear coat is to completely wet it with rubbing alcohol. It and the clear coat have about the same index of refraction, so the roughened clear coat clears up. Anything that doesn't is a deeper scrape or scratch that goes into the undercoat. So if the white is damaged clear coat, it should clear up.

I learned this from videos on how to repair by sanding scratches on my Cruze.

corvette

120V will also get it charged (eventually), but it's painfully slow. Level 2 charging should get you a full charge overnight.

qbrozen

@oldfarmer50 said:
So far it’s just a postcard ad.

If I’m reading this right, they want the trade but that’s independent of the lease terms. I’m sure any tax credits, federal and state, and any incentives go to the dealer. They say KBB price for the trade. KBB says my car is worth about $11k trade-in and $298 X 36 equals about $10,700 so I might net a little bit over the total cost of the lease.

https://www.destinationkia.com/newspecials.html

Under my current projections I would be needing a car for more than 3 years so a lease at this time wouldn’t fit my plans. But it’s interesting to think about.

Things like that are always tempting, but then I remember I’d have nothing after 3 years vs owning my current vehicle that will still have some value.

laurasdada

corvette said:

120V will also get it charged (eventually), but it's painfully slow. Level 2 charging should get you a full charge overnight.

I was going to note the same (as I use 120v for the PHEV; 12-16 hours to fill the 14.1 kWh battery. Less, of course, to ~80%).
Left for dinner last night with a full battery, noted 29 miles of range. Round trip 25 miles, 80% highway, averaged 40mph (70-80mph on the highway) and got an actual 21.5 miles of electric avenue cruising before the 4 banger reared its ugly head.

stickguy

I am doing TV stuff now too. Got the TV connected to the internet finally (ethernet to the FIOS mothership in the basement worked perfectly) and the new soundbar/Sub was plug and play, and sounds really good. Only problem is, it is currently sitting on the floor in front of the fireplace since I have not ordered a mount yet. And I really don't want to have to deal with installing that on the wall around the outlets and plug box up there. Eventually!

also need to put one in the bedroom. Will likely do that first to practice, since it will be less of an issue if I screw that one up!

oldfarmer50

corvette said:

120V will also get it charged (eventually), but it's painfully slow. Level 2 charging should get you a full charge overnight.

The Hyundai Konas that Enterprise received said 60 hours to full charge on 110volts.

oldfarmer50

qbrozen said:

@oldfarmer50 said:

So far it’s just a postcard ad.

If I’m reading this right, they want the trade but that’s independent of the lease terms. I’m sure any tax credits, federal and state, and any incentives go to the dealer. They say KBB price for the trade. KBB says my car is worth about $11k trade-in and $298 X 36 equals about $10,700 so I might net a little bit over the total cost of the lease.

https://www.destinationkia.com/newspecials.html

Under my current projections I would be needing a car for more than 3 years so a lease at this time wouldn’t fit my plans. But it’s interesting to think about.

Things like that are always tempting, but then I remember I’d have nothing after 3 years vs owning my current vehicle that will still have some value.

That’s my issue and since I bought the Soul because my wife could get in and out of it (not so with any of my other vehicles) I’d have to buy something similar after 3 years or lease another.