Chronic Car Buyers Anonymous

graphicguy

@breld said:
While we're talking Hondas (or, at least, I was )....

I responded to a craigslist ad yesterday for a 1990 CRX Si in yellow. Based on pictures, description and videos linked from the ad, it looked to be in very nice condition for such a car. It's exactly what I wanted way back in 1990, but instead went with a more practical Civic Si with backseats.

Never got a response and noticed the ad was deleted this morning - not surprising for such a car. He was asking $4,500 firm, which is a pretty good premium for the car, but if in the condition he represented, probably worth it.

That would make me crazy.....ask about a car....show interest....not a peep in return....not even a "get lost".

Those CRX Sis were hot little numbers in their time.

ab348

Almost impossible to find an unmolested CRX Si these days.

rayainsw

I probably should not have taken advantage of BMW’s offer to let me drive a new 435i Coupe. But I did.

A couple of reason I accepted:
Reason 1 is that driving a 4 series means a $1,000 credit toward purchase or lease of ANY series BMW – if delivered in the next 60 days. And that is ‘real money’ for me.

Reason 2 is that these events typically allow driving the selected car alone. With no sales dweeb in the right seat.

This was a mistake in that I was reminded of how much I enjoy the BMW driving experience – that I have now been away from for a while.

The particular 435i Coupe that they assigned to me had 2 upgrades that made it particularly interesting and rewarding for me to drive: The PERFORMANCE POWER KIT and the PERFORMANCE EXHAUST SYSTEM, both BMW accessory parts.

Though the 435i is definitely both larger and heavier than the 335iS I leased in 2011, and compared to the M235i that I really want, the power & torque boost and the ‘enhanced’ exhaust sound made this particular 4 Series Coupe very similar to that 335iS - in many dynamic respects.

The handling is excellent. The steering feel is OK. [ One area where the M235i does seem perceptibly better, to me & to many others. ] Everything works in concert.

But the sound and the push and the smoothness of that BMW straight 6 cylinder motor is just a wonderful feeling. This is the biggest thing I miss about the 335iS I had. Great Steaming Piles of Torque available at any engine speed and any road speed. Wow. This served as a reminder of how much I enjoyed my car – and rekindled my desire for another.

The 8-speed automatic continues to impress me. Shifts feel as quick as the DCT in the 335iS, and the low speed ‘stop and slow’ traffic behavior is better.

The only thing holding me back from pulling the trigger is – cost.

au1994

@ rayainsw...I was scheduled to go to that event as well but ended up in a 2 hr meeting that turned into a 6 hr meeting.

Too bad as I was really looking forward to driving a 4 and spending some time with the GC, I briefly looked at a 435i at the dealer a month or so ago. Black with gray interior and just stunning in person. So was the sticker unfortunately.

stickguy

That pesky cost issue is always what trips me up in the end.

jpp75

@‌kyfdx

Congrats! As others have said I love the color!> @tifighter said:

Add a punch.

It will probably make Q cringe, but I leased a 15 Leaf SL. 24 months. We recently moved to a townhouse in a denser urban area; one car garage and street parking is tough. The Accord was just too tight, and my wife wants nothing to do with squeezing the RDX in the garage.

My usage/commute is freeway, stop and go and predictable. I can charge at work and home. Western Washington has a good charging infrastructure with 90% of the electricity coming from hydro (and its cheap). Drove 26 miles this morning and still showing 75% chg, though that will obviously change in winter. Quiet, rides nicely, good torque keeps it from feeling too slow. I like it. I also drove the i3, which is a very interesting car and worthy of its own post, but I could lease 2 Leafs for the same cost.

Two year lease seems okay; big commitment for a CCBA guy, but the EV landscape will probably be pretty different in 2016 anyhow.

SO the city car is covered. The RDX will get replaced with the next 6 mos to year, and will be replaced with something for ski and outdoor trips, maybe a bit more space.

(Punch streak - 2008, 09, 11, 12, 13, 14. 2010 was a motorcycle year...)

We think alike, I wanted a Leaf or Focus Electric, but there are those 4 or 5 times a year when we need to take both cars out of town at the same time. So the Fusion Energi 24 month lease it is, hopefully by then the Tesla 3 or something comparable will be available.

The charging infrastructure here isn't nearly as robust as the Pacific NW, but most of my miles are EV.

jpp75

@gouldn said:
It's a 4 ... I don't think they made the wagon in a six, although I might be wrong. Here's the link http://www.cars.com/vehicledetail/detail/609987445/overview/, I got it for $23.8.

That's a great car for the money, you'll enjoy it for years to come.

nyccarguy

ray

They (BMW) really try so hard to "pull you back in." Between the Ultimate Drive Credit, Eco Credit, Cash Incentives, Generous Lease Residuals, & the ability to give MSDs, I just stay as far away from the dealership as I can:)

Michaell

@nyccarguy said:

>

They (BMW) really try so hard to "pull you back in." Between the Ultimate Drive Credit, Eco Credit, Cash Incentives, Generous Lease Residuals, & the ability to give MSDs, I just stay as far away from the dealership as I can:)

You're just lucky the car can't follow you home from the dealership.

Mr_Shiftright

ifyou don't mind sharing, what were the numbers on your Energi lease?

@jpp5862 said:
@‌kyfdx

Congrats! As others have said I love the color!> tifighter said:
The charging infrastructure here isn't nearly as robust as the Pacific NW, but most of my miles are EV.

nyccarguy

My car might have to go in for service before I turn it in. I'm hoping it doesn't. It also helps if I DON'T do the 4 series test drive:) That's one sharp looking car!

jpp75

@Mr_Shiftright said:
ifyou don't mind sharing, what were the numbers on your Energi lease?

I don't have all the numbers in front of me, but I know the MSRP was $42,xxx. They came down to $40,000, less a $5,007 Ford incentive for leasing a 2014. So Cap Cost was around $35k, the residual and money factor matched what ky posted in the Fusion Energi forum. So, 24 month lease, 10,500 miles/yr, first payment at signing and $521/mo for 23 more months.

It certainly won't pay for itself, but it's a fun toy and I'm still on the original tank of gas (just under half a tank left) 750 miles later, 200 of which were highway miles driving back from picking the car up.

There were probably a few dollars left on the table, but this was the only car in the region with the options I wanted so I was OK with paying a few extra to get what I wanted.

andre1969

@henryn said:
Or how about this 2004 Buick Park Avenue, with only 22k miles. $9,999, ouch again!

http://www.emmonsmotorcompany.com/Used-2004-Buick-Park-Avenue-Sedan-Pasadena-TX/vd/21194915

I kinda like that Park Ave, but it's a relative stripper model...no sunroof, non-supercharged, etc. Looks like about the same color as my 2000 Park Ave Ultra. And I like its rims better than the ones on my 2000.

i'd almost be tempted, as my Park Ave just hit 100,000 miles on Tuesday, and the check engine light is on, and it's looking a bit ratty. But, I don't know that I'd want to get into almost the same car, again. And it's still a 10, almost 11 year old car, so despite the good looks and low mileage, things WILL break on it! FWIW, I bought mine in December 2009, when it was about 10 years old, with 56,000 miles on it, for $7500. And things did break on it! It's had suspension problems, brake problems, including lines rusting out, emissions problems, and the last major repair was when the supercharger belt tensioner self destructed at about 75 mph. The mechanic replaced it, as well as the main belt tensioner, plus the two belts, and with other odds and ends that came to about $1,000. Oh, plus $133 for a new battery. A piece of shrapnel ripped into the battery pretty good, but it wasn't glaringly obvious. And the battery didn't start losing its charge until about a week later. I didn't even notice the tear until I pulled the battery out to swap in another!

Still, who knows? That 2004 might be a great car. But, old age issues could rear their ugly head.

Kirstie_H

Have you had any strange interactions or bloopers with the voice command system in your car? A reporter would like to talk with you. Please send your story to pr@edmunds.com by Wednesday, August 13, 2014.

rayainsw

Michaell -

'You're just lucky the car can't follow you home from the dealership.'

I did leave a trail of breadcrumbs, driving home...

= Ray

Always hopeful.

jayrider

@rayainsw said:
Michaell -

'You're just lucky the car can't follow you home from the dealership.'

I did leave a trail of breadcrumbs, driving home...

= Ray

Always hopeful.

Strudel bits might be more effective.

stickguy

Leave a trail of Benjamins, and the sales person will follow you home.

Mr_Shiftright

They can just follow your scent....

corvette

Hmm... Price seems to be right (although Edmunds throws a check engine light when I try to appraise it). I'd prefer an automatic for a daily driver but this looks interesting. No satnav or color radio display. Minor body damage to the rocker panel, and the tires are cheap-o GT Radials.

breld

Wow - you certainly would be unique with one of those last 9-5s. I never would've guessed they made those with a true manual. Certainly a lot of car for the money, if you could get comfortable that you'd have someone who could work on it.

Personally, I like it.

Just chatted with a coworker who has a 2003 9-3 - loves the car and hasn't had any major issues with it. He found a local mechanic who specializes on Saabs.

stickguy

my neighbor had a very late 9-5 (AT). nice looking car. Pretty sure he got it just before SAAB went down for good. I never asked if it was a lease or a buy but he got it new.

I think he may have gotten rid of it. A couple of weeks back a new Dodge ram Bighorn with temp tags showed up in the driveway, and I have not seen the SAAB since.

nyccarguy

@jpp5862‌

Glad you like the fusion Energi. Cool you don't have to be a complete Eco-nut to enjoy it. Don't forget about the Q50 in your garage.

On the CCBA front. My Mom is looking to dump her 2013 X5 she got less than a year ago. Don't ask. Like @isellhondas says: "there's always something." She swears the X5 she test drove "had a better ride." She misses a lot of the tech stuff on the Cayenne (had a higher res backup camera, blind spot warning, ventilated seats...).

So first she looked at an ML 350. Liked it. They offered her $3K off the sticker plus $39K for her X5. No thanks.

Then my parents went on vacation. They spent a few days with a college friend who was a very high level Chryco employee. They have a Grand Cherokee Overland. My patents were both very impressed with its interior quality, tech, & overall ride. Mom took a ride to the jeep dealer. Liked the GC very much. Told the dealer she wants a Summitt (the top model). He tells her she wants a "Loaded Limited" because it is less expensive & the only difference is the Summitt has the height adjustable air suspension that you only need for off roading. She can get a "friends & family certificate" from her college friend. The jeep dealer calls me at work & tells us he can only offer $31K for the X5. Next!

I suggested that she look at the VW Toureg since it is the mechanical twin to the Cayenne for Thousands less. Plus VW offers cheapo n financing & 24K maintenance. She said she'll go look.

corvette

Yeah, it's interesting. My uncle bought a used 2006-ish 9-3 to replace his JCW Mini Cooper S when it got to be difficult for him to get in and out of the Mini, and the jarring ride got to be too much for him. He loved the 9-3 and kept it about two years, which I think is longer than he's ever kept a car! Never had any mechanical problems that I'm aware of.

On the other hand, if I were looking at buying one of these heavily depreciated, rare birds, it might be nice to have the fully loaded one with a V6 and AWD.

kyfdx

@corvette said:
Hmm... Price seems to be right (although Edmunds throws a check engine light when I try to appraise it). I'd prefer an automatic for a daily driver but this looks interesting. No satnav or color radio display. Minor body damage to the rocker panel, and the tires are cheap-o GT Radials.

That guy is the best used car dealer in town... Very honest and upfront. He has been in business since the '60s.. Almost bought a car from him, a couple of times. He has always had Saabs, and used to stock Volvos, Mazdas and Subarus when they weren't all that popular. Not so much anymore, but used to always have a good selection of stick-shifts.

graphicguy

@kyfdx said:
That guy is the best used car dealer in town... Very honest and upfront. He has been in business since the '60s.. Almost bought a car from him, a couple of times. He has always had Saabs, and used to stock Volvos, Mazdas and Subarus when they weren't all that popular. Not so much anymore, but used to always have a good selection of stick-shifts.

2nd what KYFDX said. Those guys have been around a long time. They always carry good cars. I went past his place not too long ago. He has all sorts of cars now, not just Mazdas, Volvos and Saabs.

KYFDX....separate topic....what happened to the guy who owned "JUST SAAB"? Is he doing anything else these days?

Mr_Shiftright

CARFAX shows it as a corporate vehicle, export from Sweden. I owner. Lived in Ohio.

@corvette said:
Hmm... Price seems to be right (although Edmunds throws a check engine light when I try to appraise it). I'd prefer an automatic for a daily driver but this looks interesting. No satnav or color radio display. Minor body damage to the rocker panel, and the tires are cheap-o GT Radials.

jayrider

@nyccarguy said:

Trade in values on anything 1-2 years old is brutal.

>

kyfdx

@graphicguy said:
KYFDX....separate topic....what happened to the guy who owned "JUST SAAB"? Is he doing anything else these days?

No idea.... three dealerships, nothing but Saab... It must have killed them. They might still own the place in Madisonville, though. Someone has to work on Saabs.

nyccarguy

@jayrider‌

I know. There is a big difference between what is acceptable depreciation and a complete lowball offer. In June, my best friend just returned his wife's 2012 X5 (that they leased in late 2011). The buyout was $35K. They liked their X5 a lot and considered getting it certified and buying it out. The dealer wanted $6K to certify it plus a $499 processing fee. $35K plus $6K plus $499 = $41.5 plus tax. That's for a 2012 with 45K miles. I understand the $6K for the certified warranty is a complete rip off.

A 2013 X5 with 17K miles should be worth more than a 2012 with 45K miles. I've also got to shop it around for them. Plenty of jeep dealers & plenty of Grand Cherokees 'round these parts;)

stickguy

was gonna say, there is no shortage of Jeep dealers. If you know the model, and have a fixed F&F price, basically all you are doing is shopping the BMW around for a buy offer. The rest of the deal seems to be fixed.

nyccarguy

Yup

jayrider

@nyccarguy said:
jayrider‌

There is a big difference between what is acceptable depreciation and a complete lowball offer.

Very true. I remember the best trade I ever made. In 1980, I traded a 76 Country Squire wagon for a new VW Rabbit. I don't remember the details but having shopped it as a trade to several dealers, I was shocked at the allowance. Seems the sales manager who did the deal was drunk and let it slide -- [Friday night at closing]. I took the car home that night and when I came in to sign the papers on Monday, the salesman said I was lucky to get that deal, especially since the rear differential on the Ford went out that morning. Of course, that Rabbit was no cream puff either and it was brand new. Haven't owned a Ford or a VW since.

graphicguy

@kyfdx said:
No idea.... three dealerships, nothing but Saab... It must have killed them. They might still own the place in Madisonville, though. Someone has to work on Saabs.

Sorry that things went sideways. I heard nothing but good things about his dealerships.

Workng on Saabs doesn't sound like a large and increasing customer base.

laurasdada

Greetings. Figured I'd update my now getting long in the tooth '13 Jag XF status: Turned 7000 miles this past weekend, so I'm averaging just a bit less than 1k/month. But that's picking up. Per OBC for the last 5k miles I've averaged 27.9 mph and 23.8 mpg. Not bad (my daily commute is ~20 miles, either back road/stop lights and signs or stop and go highway).

No issues to report other than a sunshade rattle, but only when the sunroof shade is fully pulled back and I'm on rocky road. Still enjoying the overall goodness of this car. I know it's a bit of a porker weight-wise, but it is just so well damped and tuned I don't feel it (unlike a bit in the 535). Meridian sound rocks, and when required, rolls. Leather still looks new, a few wrinkles on the outboard seat cushion of my (driver's) seat. No Prince of Darkness issues to report.

Still working for me style-wise both in and out. Two shortcomings, especially at this price point, though:

• Should have more than just the basic 6 way adjustable seats
• Should have front fog lights (it has a rear)

Also, visibility takes a bit of a backseat to the slick style. Hence, using the blind spot warning, backup camera/radar and my owl-like swivelling neck!

Nothing has slowed or phased this car, weatherwise. Like my XK, it will cruise effortlessly at speed. And, a little more speed. And again, more than that! First service isn't due until the end of the year and I'll probably take it with son and skis for a week to the mountains of Vermont, Maine or New Hampster this winter. Should't be an issue, the awd and Conti all seasons made short order ot this past winter.

So, for those that may be considering the new, curry-flavored Jag, here's one big thumbs up! Of course, it's only been 7.5 months, plenty of warranty left!

xwesx

Wow.... long in tooth already? Time to break out the Sensodyne.

jpp75

@laurasdada said:
Greetings. Figured I'd update my now getting long in the tooth '13 Jag XF status: Turned 7000 miles this past weekend, so I'm averaging just a bit less than 1k/month. But that's picking up. Per OBC for the last 5k miles I've averaged 27.9 mph and 23.8 mpg. Not bad (my daily commute is ~20 miles, either back road/stop lights and signs or stop and go highway).

No issues to report other than a sunshade rattle, but only when the sunroof shade is fully pulled back and I'm on rocky road. Still enjoying the overall goodness of this car. I know it's a bit of a porker weight-wise, but it is just so well damped and tuned I don't feel it (unlike a bit in the 535). Meridian sound rocks, and when required, rolls. Leather still looks new, a few wrinkles on the outboard seat cushion of my (driver's) seat. No Prince of Darkness issues to report.

Still working for me style-wise both in and out. Two shortcomings, especially at this price point, though:

• Should have more than just the basic 6 way adjustable seats
• Should have front fog lights (it has a rear)

Also, visibility takes a bit of a backseat to the slick style. Hence, using the blind spot warning, backup camera/radar and my owl-like swivelling neck!

Nothing has slowed or phased this car, weatherwise. Like my XK, it will cruise effortlessly at speed. And, a little more speed. And again, more than that! First service isn't due until the end of the year and I'll probably take it with son and skis for a week to the mountains of Vermont, Maine or New Hampster this winter. Should't be an issue, the awd and Conti all seasons made short order ot this past winter.

So, for those that may be considering the new, curry-flavored Jag, here's one big thumbs up! Of course, it's only been 7.5 months, plenty of warranty left!

Great review of your experience, I've always loved the looks of the XF. Price and quality concerns kept my away, but great to hear you haven't had any issues. The MPG is impressive for the car as well.

Odd that they would have rear foglights but none in the front...probably a carryover from Europe, I remember my uncle had a 1989 Volvo 740 with the rear foglights, but none on the front. Great car.

jpp75

@nyccarguy said:
jpp5862‌

Glad you like the fusion Energi. Cool you don't have to be a complete Eco-nut to enjoy it. Don't forget about the Q50 in your garage.

Thanks Bradd...the Q50 gets plenty of attention, mostly from my better half but I still love driving it when I get the chance. We're going on 8 months with the Q50 and it is pushing 15,000 miles so it definitely isn't sitting still.

I find myself using the Fusion for all the "short trips" but trying not to drive it on gas if it can be helped. I'm not an eco nut, but it is a bit of a fun exercise to try and stretch the miles as far as you can. I've read on the Energi forums of people driving without climate to save range....I won't do that but for most of the driving I do (gym, airport, grocery store) it's nice driving on electric, especially since it's so cheap here in NC.

I can relate to your Mom's experience, and I can see where you got the CCBA gene.

Regardless I've always liked the X5, but I like your Touareg suggestion. I've always been a fan of those, a bit pricey for a VW but handsome and underrated IMO.

nyccarguy

@jpp5862‌

She's never really been a CCBAer until recently. In my lifetime her cars have been:

1977 Oldsmobile Delta 88 (Brown with Tan Vinyl Interior)
1985 Volvo 740 Turbo (Black with Red Cloth interior/white stripes)
1990 Mercedes-Benz 300E (Silver/Grey Leather)
1995 Dodge Stealth R/T (Red/Black) - lease
1998 Mercedes-Benz CLK 320 (Black/Black) - lease
2002 Audi A6 3.0 Quattro (Blue/Black) - lease
2005 BMW 530i (Black/Black) - lease
2008 BMW 328xi (dark grey/black) - lease
2011 Porsche Cayenne (White/black)
2013 BMW X5 35i (sapphire black/black)

Michaell

Corvette, I know you've been keeping track of the punches for us ... can you provide a list of who has bought what this year?

roadburner

One of my favorite British two-wheelers -a 1973 Raleigh Grand Prix- just returned from the restoration shop:

corvette

@Michaell said:
Corvette, I know you've been keeping track of the punches for us ... can you provide a list of who has bought what this year?

2014 Punch List (total 21):

01/02/14 breld 2014 VW Passat Wolfsburg 1.8T (lease)

01/06/14 sda 2010 Honda Pilot EX-L RES 50k

01/18/14 au1994 2005 BMW 330cic ZHP 77k

02/14/14 js06gv 2014 Kia Optima SX turbo (lease)

02/17/14 stickguy 2014 VW Jetta SE (lease)

03/05/14 robbieg 2014 Toyota Highlander AWD XLE

04/04/14 akangl 2001 Chevrolet Silverado LT 2500HD 113k

04/11/14 nextcar3 2014 Infiniti Q50

04/12/14 michaell 2014 MINI Countryman S ALL4

04/16/14 breld 2008 Audi TT 3.2 Quattro coupe 10k

04/22/14 steine13 2014 Subaru Outback Premium

05/15/14 stevedebi 2014 VW Passat SE TDI

06/04/14 stever 2009 Dodge Grand Caravan xxk

06/08/14 breld 2011 BMW 535xi M-sport 22k

06/14/14 qbrozen 2014 Chrysler Town & Country Limited (lease)

07/03/14 kyfdx 1995 BMW M3 coupe 205k

07/11/14 jpp5862 2014 Ford Fusion Titanium Energi (lease)

07/17/14 glayfan40 2014 VW GTI Autobahn (lease)

07/20/14 breld 2015 VW GTI Autobahn

07/30/14 tifighter 2015 Nissan Leaf SL (lease)

07/31/14 gouldn 2011 Acura TSX wagon xxk

Any inaccuracies, please email Edmunds' Unofficial Compendium Customer Service.

stever

@roadburner, nice. I sort of wish I had kept my '71ish Libertas but the bottom bracket had brindled and I gave it to my BIL in the late 90s. One less thing I'd be having to haul around. The bike we should have kept was my wife's Lotus Elan.

The Libertas had 531 butted tubes which was the be-all back in the day. Turns out that the "internal butted" Schwinns were a better design but at the time everyone thought the Europeans had frames figured out better.

What I'd really like to have is a pair of some old Lyotard platform pedals.

stickguy

When I was a kid I got a new white Raleigh record. About that same vintage. Long since gone.

nyccarguy

21 punches in 2014 so far! Impressive.

stickguy

@nyccarguy said:
21 punches in 2014 so far! Impressive.

Thank breld and his wife.

roadburner

@stever said:
roadburner, nice. I sort of wish I had kept my '71ish Libertas but the bottom bracket had brindled and I gave it to my BIL in the late 90s. One less thing I'd be having to haul around. The bike we should have kept was my wife's Lotus Elan.

The Libertas had 531 butted tubes which was the be-all back in the day. Turns out that the "internal butted" Schwinns were a better design but at the time everyone thought the Europeans had frames figured out better.

What I'd really like to have is a pair of some old Lyotard platform pedals.

The Raleigh has a lugged frame with hand-painted gold highlights around each lug. You definitely don't see anything similar today. And all for $125 in 1973...

laurasdada

@jpp5862 said:

Thanks, great car!

I noted early on while shopping that the XF was sans front fogs. I even pointed it out to the salesfolk I worked with, none were aware! Regarding the price, as I've noted I bought it (after much shopping) New Year's Eve, with incentives so, while not inexpensive, I paid even less than I thought would be my best deal. Money was made by the dealer on the trade though. But, that's business!

I hope the forthcoming XE is a knockout!

stever

@roadburner, mine was closer to $250, a lot of dough back in the day. Campy hubs and sew-ups, but mediocre Huret derailleurs. Had to go to New Orleans to find anything. And after paying that much, it didn't have the gold highlights around the lugs but the rear stays were chromed as well as half the fork.

So I went to the drugstore and got some gold Testor's and added that myself. Fun memories.

slorenzen

@stever said:
roadburner, mine was closer to $250, a lot of dough back in the day. Campy hubs and sew-ups, but mediocre Huret derailleurs. Had to go to New Orleans to find anything. And after paying that much, it didn't have the gold highlights around the lugs but the rear stays were chromed as well as half the fork.

So I went to the drugstore and got some gold Testor's and added that myself. Fun memories.

Ah, sew-ups...

I had to buy the cotton ones, couldn't afford silk.

They definitely were nice for speed, but too fragile for normal road use.

Remember checking the tire pressure by flicking the tire, and going by sound?

stever

Never developed that skill but I was always "flicking" the tires, trying to keep the road trash from embedding and getting a flat. Real pain patching them. Even on my current Raleigh mtn bike, I drilled out the valve stem holes so I could use Schrader tubes on it. Gonna be real fun moving back to goathead country.