Hyundai Sonata 2006-2007

backy

However, lets not think for one minute that Hyundai will not make changes to the '07 Sonata to reflect improvement in this area.

I hope you are right. We waited three years for Hyundai to address the "Poor" result for frontal impact on the '01 Elantra, which they finally got to a "Good" after multiple tries with the '04 model. Maybe they learned from that experience and will react faster this time.

backy

Lets just say that Hyundai could have (should have) done better without bringing out the "commitment to safety" rhetoric implying that Honda,VW and others would never ever bring out a vehicle which tested less than "goods" across the board, something we know for a fact is not true.

I agree it was not good for Hyundai to bring out the "commitment to safety" rhetoric in their marketing without acting fully on that commitment. As for implying that Honda and VW would never bring out a vehicle which tested less than "goods" across the board, I don't see that anyone here implied that.

wdlp65

I don't agree totally as I feel there would be different results if tested more than once. I have found the NCAP rating for a side impact crash at 38.5mph rated the 06 Sonata as 5 stars. And comparing it with the 06 Accord which has been chosen as a top safest car only received 4 stars. Here look for yourself, save the Sonata on the left side and choose any other car in it's class as a comparison.

http://www.nhtsa.gov/cars/testing/ncap/

wdlp65

One more thing, try finding a car in the Sonata price range with side curtain aibags which in return protect your head from smashing into the window and support beam causing serious brain injuries. Try doing a comparison with other new cars without SCA and see how poorly they score in the side impact crash.

94hawkskin

Ctalk implied that Honda's have a committment to safety. He did not specify which vehicle. Honda's are safe but they do have their flaws as well as the Element has scored horribly in crash tests.

As a Sonata owner I feel that Hyundai did a great job in producing a high quality, safe vehicle for the price. This is the best value on the market bar none. No other vehicle offer SCA, ESC, Active Head Restraints, ABS across the board on all trim levels as standard equipment.

So yes I would say that the Sonata has a "Committment to Safety".

cjlars

As for implying that Honda and VW would never bring out a vehicle which tested less than "goods" across the board, I don't see that anyone here implied that.

"it looks like Honda and VW are more concerned with safety than Hyundai" was your quote from an earlier post. I'm not sure of the implication here but it seemed to me that you were implying that because the Sonata did not score "goods" across the board that Hyundai is less concerned about safety than Honda or VW . I was simply pointing out (admittedly with a touch of sarcasm) that both VW and Honda have vehicles in their line ups which have poor test results, which again begs the question "where was their "concern" with the safety of Element and Beetle drivers?" It seems to me that you are not holding everyone to the same standard here. And please don't excuse them by saying that the Element and Beetle are older models(the Element has only been out a couple years)and the Accord got a "poor" as recently as 2004.
Once again, did Honda's commitment to safety just start with this year's Civic?

era174

you are completely wrong
sonata lx v6 without nav costs about $24.5K in korea
that's when the exchange rate is about 1030won. the rate went down lately to 970won, so it's probably about 23.5k
that's hardly a rip off.

It's you who are completely wrong.

Let's break down the numbers:

Korea:
I don't know where you got the price, but anyway, I'll take your quoted price.

Korean Won: 25,000,000 (before taxes)

exchange rate (1030 in the past): U$ 24,272 (close to your number)

exchange rate (970 now): U$ 25,773 (before taxes / up, not down, contrary to your argument)

exchange rate (1000 median) U$ 25,000

USA:
LX V6 $18,492 (with freight & additional rebates available) / around $5,000 off MSRP $23,495

There's also

GLS V6 $16,762 (with freight & additional rebates available) / around $4,700 off MSRP $21,495

Check the latest prices at FitzMall

Korean prices before taxes: no discount or $500 (sometimes, but NOT NOW)

American MSRP: Yes, a very small number of people pay the Sonata's full MSRP, but how many?

With the same money you pay for GLS V6 in the States, Korean customers get a 2.0 liter (WOW) N20 Luxury Base (no side/curtain airbags, no MP3, no traction/stability control, etc.) before taxes (is it really "luxury"?).

If it's not called a rip off, what would you call it?

era174

That VAT tax is not collected when the car is for export!
I am not talking about the SALES TAX !

Whatever you call them, ultimately they're all included in the MSRP of any cars (domestic or import) in Korea (quite different than the States).

Please read my lips, I've compared the Korean prices BEFORE TAXES with the American MSRP (which is also BEFORE TAXES).

Moreover, 2.4L Sonatas exported from Korea to the States carry a 2.5% (or something) American import tax (included in the American MSRP). That means, the REAL American price before taxes for the 2.4L Sonata is a litter lower than the
American MSRP.

FYI, there're three taxes included in Korean MSRPs: special consumption tax, education tax, and VAT.

bamacar

Already covered here. Call it "no competition". Protectionist policies by the government. How many $17-18k Camrys and Accords are available in Korea? If you have no competition, why drop prices. Don't blame Hyundai; blame the Korean people and the leaders they elect.

era174

My reply was regarding a post insisting that the Sonata in Korea is not that expensive compared to American prices. It's a joke.

"No competition" and "ripping off" go hand in hand.

ctalk

the Accord got a "poor" as recently as 2004.

Actually, the current Accord comes with standard side curtain/side airbags. The Accord equipped with side airbags had a "good" rating.

Once again, did Honda's commitment to safety just start with this year's Civic?
Honda has always been quite good with safety since the Accord came out. They've never been on top until the new Civic's scores came out. With the new Civic's scores, it shows what Honda is capable of doing. A compact with all "good" ratings is quite amazing. Honda really set the bar high in that segment. Hyundai had a chance to show their commitment to safety with the new Sonata, but didn't fully take the chance. It scored quite well, but quite well doesn't show their commitment to safety as well as a "Gold or silver rating from IIHS" does.

thegraduate

The Sonata is their flagship vehicle and they had expected it to score "good" across all areas in the saftey test.

If Sonata is the flagship, then what is the Azera?

cjlars

April 2005 A significant lifesaver

Consumer Reports’ auto experts believe that ESC may be one of the most significant automotive lifesaving technologies. Safety belts top the list; the National Highway Traffic Safety Administration credits them with saving nearly 15,000 lives in 2003, the latest year for which data are available. Air bags and child safety seats saved an estimated 2,900 lives that year, NHTSA says.

Preliminary results of a NHTSA study released in September show that cars with ESC were involved in 30 percent fewer fatal single-vehicle crashes than those without and that SUVs with ESC were involved in 63 percent fewer such crashes. An IIHS study released in October 2004 found that cars and SUVs with ESC were involved in 56 percent fewer fatal single-vehicle crashes than comparable models without ESC. The IIHS estimates that ESC could save some 7,000 lives annually if all vehicles on U.S. roads had the feature



Honda had a chance to fully show their commitment to safety by making ESC standard equipment on the Civic but chose not to even offer it as an option. As I mentioned before I will take the Sonata with ESC and its current crash test rating over a Civic (and its gold medal) without ESC every time. Avoiding an accident is always best, I don't see how anyone can reasonably argue otherwise.

pat

The uber flagship??

thegraduate

Only if Hyundai were german. Perhaps its the super-happy fun flagship.

pat

That word lost its German connotation long ago and is so ubiquitous* these days that it annoys me. That's why I used it.

*derived from a Latin word ! Guess we need a Korean term here now!!

bamacar

Yes they do go hand in hand. The Korean government rips off the Korean consumer and Hyundai charges the appropriate price the market will pay. Good job Hyundai. I am sure you agree.

jojoe

Am I missing something here? Did the 2006 Accord not receive a "poor" on rear impact ratings.So how is that being committed to safety,especially with all the years they have had to develope the Accord.Commitment..hmmmmmmmmmmmmm ...Are Honda fanatics possibly a little oblivious about any negativities regarding their precious Japanese machines? Does anyone else seem to notice in here how many folks just jump at the chance to condemn the 2006 Sonata? What is everyone afraid of? This is a great car,great looks,great price and has great safety features.Some people like them(as we do) and others don't,thats life.To think Hyundia failed here with a teenie,slight rating difference than the Accord on side impact(yet a better rating on rear)is going to make this car a failure,I got news for ya,it won't make any difference at all.Why not check on the cars that cost twice as much with by far worse safty commitment features in the past 10 years and check out the sales,yes they still sold. Sonata will do just fine,with Honda fanatics and all.

backy

My comment which you snipped out of a longer post, "...it looks like Honda and VW are more concerned with safety than Hyundai...", was regarding the cars in this discussion, that is, mid-sized sedans. If you wish, go take a look at the IIHS web site and see where the VW mid-sized cars (Passat and Jetta) and the Honda mid-sized car (Accord) rank compared to the Sonata. I think you will see that the VW and Honda mid-sized cars rank above the Sonata in the eyes of the IIHS.

As for knocking Honda for their older models... go take a look at the IIHS crash test results for other Hyundai models, e.g. the previous-generation Sonata, the Elantra, the Accent, the Santa Fe... They are not so great either.

backy

One more thing, try finding a car in the Sonata price range with side curtain aibags which in return protect your head from smashing into the window and support beam causing serious brain injuries.

Other cars in the Sonata's price range or below with standard side curtain airbags include the Civic, the Accord, the '07 Camry, the Fit (out next month), and from Hyundai/Kia the Accent, Rio, Spectra, Tucson, and Sportage.

backy

Since you are chiding Honda for not making ESC standard or even an option on the '06 Civic, should you not be chiding Hyundai for not making ESC standard or even an option on the '06 Accent? Honda is making ABS and side bags and curtains standard on every car it sells in the U.S., going back to the '05 Accord and from now on. Hyundai cannot say the same.

ESC is a valuable feature, I agree. But even Hyundai doesn't think it is important enough to include on every car it sells. It also doesn't think it's important enough to put on all the Sonatas it sells in Canada. I guess Hyundai's commitment to safety is more a U.S. statement then?

backy

Does anyone else seem to notice in here how many folks just jump at the chance to condemn the 2006 Sonata?

I'm sorry, I missed the directions for this discussion that state that only positive remarks about the Sonata are allowed.

jojoe

Where do you read that? I don't see where is says thats so either.Some folks read what they want into any statement.Thought you were smarter than that,but there I go doing the same thing.

747pilot

I bought an 06 Hyundai Sonata LX V6 in silver today. Its fully loaded with all features. I got a pretty spanking good deal on it after rebates and discounts. Could not go as low as my older car because of demand but still got some off.

I am not new to the Hyundai or the Sonata. My previous Sonata was an 04 LX V6 loaded and it was a great car. However it definently is not in the same league as the new car. Even better I got an outstanding deal on trade. The older Sonata's are still in demand so I got $12K trade in on it. Not bad for a car I had owned for 3 years and paid $18.5K originally for. I know people who did not do that good on Honda's and Toyota's.

Below is a picture...hope it works!!!

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kingsalmon

Congrats on your purchase. I just saw a totaled Sonata on the way to work today and felt sorry for the owner. Remember to drive safe.
Peace,

cjlars

If you wanted to write that the Passat and Accord are safer cars than the Sonata you could have. You very clearly wrote that VW and Honda are more concerned about safety than Hyundai. Again I think that is an unfair generalization. Also the models I am knocking are not so old(2003 and 2004). Again I don't think you are holding everyone to the same standard here. No where did I imply that Hyundai's track record for its older models is good or even the equal of VW and Honda however I will knock Honda or anyone else when they deserve it (e.g. the Element).

thegraduate

That picture is making the page too wide, half of the post i want to reply to is hidden under the sidebar of videos!

cjlars

I am an equal opportunity "chider", however I never made a statement that Hyundai was more concerned with safety than Honda. You, however, did write that you thought Honda was more concerned with safety than Hyundai (though you have since attempted to backpedal a bit and clarify that Honda is only more concerned about the safety of its mid sized cars). If you believe that is true then I think it is fair to say we should expect more from the company which cares more. In the case of the new Civic ,which some here (not necessarily you) are trumpeting as such a gold-medal-winning- impenetrable-bastion of safety "statement" from Honda the absence of ESC is an unforgiveable omission. For Hyundai ,which we know doesn't care as much about safety as Honda anyway, it is excusable.(That was a little sarcasm again)
Seriously, all these manufacturers should (and can) do better with safety-Honda (see the continued "poor" rear test results) and Hyundai alike. We should continue to hold them to ever higher standards, not let them ride with some good crash results and some bad ,some safety equipment in one country but not in another etc.

cjlars

"It looks like manufacturers like Honda and VW are more concerned with safety than Hyundai."

I apologize that I quoted you incorrectly before. The above is the actual quote from your post. The corrected quote does however more strongly suggest that you were referring to the manufacturers in general and not specifically to mid-sized sedans. I could be wrong.

backy

In the case of the new Civic ,which some here (not necessarily you) are trumpeting as such a gold-medal-winning- impenetrable-bastion of safety "statement" from Honda the absence of ESC is an unforgiveable omission.

Well, I never said the Civic is a "gold-medal-winning impenetrable bastion of safety", but interesting you should mention that... the Civic is a "gold medal winner" in the eyes of the IIHS. And the Sonata could have been a "gold medal winner" also with a little better score on the side impact test. Now wouldn't that have been a triumph (and great marketing fodder) for Hyundai?

bobad

Below is a picture...hope it works!!!

Wait! I think I know that car!

Is this the same car?

Click Here to see a Pretty Car

pat

Yes, it would be best if people would only post pictures that fit the actual column width since it is fixed. If a picture someone would like to post is wider than the column (around 500 pixels), the thing to do is post a link to it instead.

In order to see the post data under the right sidebar, you can try reducing the fonts on the page temporarily (works best with Firefox). Another workaround is to manipulate the message display by using the message number links to control what posts are on the page.

cjlars

I think I made it clear that you did not say that (in fact no one actually said it,it was a bit of hyberbole). It absolutely would have been great for Hyundai to be a gold medal winner, agreed. It also would have been great for the gold medal winning Civic to offer ECS,do you agree?

backy

I think it would be great for every car to have ABS, traction control, ESC, and be able to protect occupants from an 80 mph collision, head-on or otherwise. Maybe some day we will see that happen.

cjlars

Until that day it would be nice if well-established leaders of the automotive industry, like Honda, would set an example for others by making a safety device as important(and readily available) as ESC standard equipment (or at the very least an option) on a brand new model like the Civic.

94hawkskin

I know you are in the market for a new car in the next year or so. Will these crash test results be enough for you to not buy a Sonata? Just wondering because it seems like we are spltting hairs here between a Good, Acceptable, Good rating and a Good, Good, Poor rating. How do we really know how these vehicles will hold up in the real world anyways.

backy

Maybe Honda is waiting for up-and-coming Hyundai to lead the way there by putting ESC, and ABS even, on all of its new models. Honda for its part has put ABS and side bags/curtains on all its models from here on out. Honda is not the problem in this regard--Ford, GM, et. al. are way behind both Honda and Hyundai in standard safety features.

backy

I will look for a car that meets my needs (including price) and has the highest level of safety available within my price range. If the Sonata happens to be it, then I would buy it. But right now I am focusing on some other options.

jimmy81

I think most consumers don't even know the safety ratings of the cars they go to buy. Hyundai's doing a good job advertising the Sonata as a safe car, and I don't think many consumers are doubting that claim. I think most people are just wondering (still) about the long term reliability of the Sonata. Time will answer that question.

cjlars

I certainly hope that Honda isn't waiting for anyone to lead them in producing safer vehicles. While I applaud them for putting ABS and side bags on all their models they then dropped the ball by not offering ESC on the new Civic. I also agree with you that we may be preaching to the choir on this forum- as you note other manufacturers are far behind both Hyundai and Honda on these important safety issues.

747pilot

Sorry folks....

I am running in a high res so its not a problem on my display. I did not even think about it when I posted the picture. I think we all know what the car looks like so one of the administrators can remove the picture if they want.

As for the car I am really impressed with it. Its ultra quiet and pretty bloody fast. You gotta be careful because its really easy to speed in. As for refinement it seems like they are doing a little better job now then at the beginning of summer when I first looked but its hard to tell. For example the 4 cylinder model I drove back in July was made in Korea but the GLS-SPORT V6 was made in Alabama. The Korean one felt just a little tighter and more refined as far as little details. Of coarse my new LX is made in Alabama and it feels more refined then that 4 cylinder model I drove back in July.

Yesterday I spent my time showing off the car. No one was not impressed. In fact everyone was very impressed with how it handled and drove. Including my boss who makes some serious $$$. He has a Ferarri 575M, a BMW 7 Series with a V12 and a Mercedes AMG version of the S Class. He found some flaws and issues but overall even he was impressed.

snakeweasel

I think most consumers don't even know the safety ratings of the cars they go to buy.

To be honest I barely look at crash test results when buying a car. While I most likely would not buy one that is poor across the board I will not rely to heavily on crash test results. One of the reasons for that is that its only a slight chance of me getting into such an accident in any particular car. Its a case of probability of the risk.

Secondly I am more concerned with the cars ability to help me avoid the accident.

94hawkskin

All I'm trying to say is that yes, it would have been great to get goods across the board, but I think people are somehow interpreting Sonata's results with being poor or marginal. The one area they did not get good in they got Acceptable, which if it is acceptable by the toughest crash test around, then it is acceptable by me as well.

I'm very happy with the results for the Sonata, not to say there is always room for improvement.

747pilot

I believe crash testing aside pretty much all cars made today are a heck of a lot safer then anything 5 or 10 and certainly 20 years ago.

I bet the next major advancements will be crash avoidance and not so much crash protection.

For example last January I got into a little fender bender. A lady had stopped at the bottom of a freeway on ramp. She should have not stopped but she did. I stopped about 15' feet behind her like I had done several times in the past. When a break in traffic and looked forward and she started to pull away. I looked over my left shoulder and I started to pull out as well. As I looked forward she slammed on her brakes and I did mine but could not stop in time so BANG!!! I am thinking if the car had some kind sensor that alerted me of her stopping I could have avoided it. Such a sensor would not be expensive to engineer.

pat

No problem. I haven't found that resolution makes a difference, but font size does. That right column is just anchored where it's anchored, period.

Anyway, there IS a solution and I can't believe I didn't think of it when I posted that earlier. Drive on over to CarSpace - if you haven't been there yet, set yourself up a page and then post all the pictures you want of any size!!

:shades:

cjlars

There are those who seem intent on pointing out the one area where Hyundai did not achieve the best rating while trying to rationalize or excuse the flaws of other vehicles. As I have said before I will take the Hyundai with its good/acceptable/good and ESC over another vehicle with a good/good/good and no ESC (Civic or Malibu included) any day and without hesitation. IMO anyone who would take the latter vehicle would be making a potentially fatal mistake.

backy

I think you are missimg the point. This is not about how terrible the Sonata or Hyundai is in safety. It is about how some people (like me) would really like to have the choice of a reasonably-priced car that has good crash test scores across the board PLUS ABS/traction PLUS ESC. The Sonata was that close to fulfilling that wish. That is what is disappointing. So now we need to make the hard choices--some will choose optimal crash safety, some will choose a balance of good-but-not-best crash safety and active safety. And some won't care about any of this.

snakeweasel

I am thinking if the car had some kind sensor that alerted me of her stopping I could have avoided it. Such a sensor would not be expensive to engineer.

Your car already has such a sensor, its called your eyes. Plain and simple, you didn't watch out enough for her to see what she was doing. As I said before, the greatest safety device on a car is the driver.

pocono35

If the Sonata won 'Car of the Year' in every nation, attained perfect crash test ratings and was driven by Jesus Christ upon His return to earth, there would be those who would say 'Yeah, but Hyundai built the Excel' or some other justification not to accept it as a viable competitor. Don't waste your breath on the facts!

pocono35

Who will just buy the car and never have an accident anyway!