Project Cars--You Get to Vote on "Hold 'em or Fold 'em"

andre1969

of the car. But it's just that when I see one with such a reasonable asking price to begin with, I get suspicious! Heck, a few years back I had a chance to buy a '79 Bonneville for a few hundred bucks. Body and driveline were solid, and the interior didn't look bad except that he had cut up the headliner and glued it right to the metal of the roof in patches, and it was pretty dirty inside because he used it to haul topsoil (in the bag). Tires were to the point that they were showing steel belt. It had a Buick 350 under the hood, can't remember if it was a 2-bbl or 4-bbl. I remember that was one thing that bothered me about it, oddly. Strange though, I didn't mind my Grandma's '85 LeSabre having an Olds engine in it, or my '82 Cutlass having a Buick engine in it, but I wanted my Pontiac to have a PONTIAC engine in it! :confuse:

At the time though, I think I was erroneously lumping in the Buick 350 with the Buick 231, because both of them could be traced back to the same engine. However, while the 231 was pretty much junk back then, I think the 350 was actually pretty solid.

In the end I passed on it, because I didn't get the feeling that it would be any better than the '89 Gran Fury copcar I was driving at the time. And at the time this Bonneville was only 20 years old, so I would've had to get it inspected, which can be a crapshoot on a car that age.

The guy who owned it really didn't want to sell it to me, either. He was an older guy, who was moving, and he just wanted it gone. He was donating it for a tax writeoff, and I think he would've felt guilty selling me what could potentially be a piece of junk, even at a low price.

The more I think about it, I might just go and look at that Bonneville. I did say I wouldn't buy anymore cars until 2008, when my driving record clears up, but hey, if it checks out I could just get it and drive it around in the yard occasionally to keep it "alive", and then store it inside until I'm ready to put tags on it. And yeah, I know that sounds kinda rednecky. :P

qbrozen

ok... this is an odd one. I can't link to it specifically, but it is the '98 Dakota on this page. I had a '97 just like this one, black extended cab. I loved it. I had the V8, though. They don't specify, but I'd bet its the V6.

Anyway, the price seems to take the damage into consideration, don't you think? What do you think about fixing the light and bumper and driving it as is?

andre1969

That '98 Dakota might not be too bad if the rest of it checks out in person. Depending on how bent up underneath it is. The bumper mounts might be damaged as well, and I wonder if the fender got damaged in the hit as well? I can't get the other pics to come up large.

And that silver Intrepid on the same page looks awfully familiar. I lent mine to a friend...I better make sure he's not trying to sell it!! :P

qbrozen

Mine was actually hit much worse than that in the front and it was all cosmetic. Probably the only reason that doesn't look bad to me.

I think the fender survived, but the hood is pretty banged up in those pics.

All the pics work for me ... odd.

fintail

I think there are some cases where book values don't reflect reality, where demand is unusual...I remember a while back looking up a book value (I forget where) on an imaginary car - a 1985 MB 300TD with 30K miles in 'excellent' condition. They said something like $2750. I'll buy as many as you can find in that condition for that money!

andre1969

how the 3.9 would perform in the Dakota? I drove a 2000 Ram once with that engine and hated it, but I'm sure the Dakota, even the extended cab, is lighter.

As long as the damage is mainly cosmetic, and you can still open the hood, it might not be a bad hauler, as long as the engine/tranny check out and the suspension isn't muffed up.

qbrozen

i dunno how the V6 is. I never drove it. Back when I bought mine, gas was still like 99 cents, so the V8 (a $550 option) was an EASY choice. I can't believe people even wanted V6 models.

qbrozen

Is even the most pristine, prettiest, smells-new, ultraspecial '79 El Camino worth $10K?? I think not!

lemmer

I like the last generation about the same as the last generation 300ZX.

I know the market likes the Supra a little better, but this '93 has to be way overpriced.

andre1969

Is even the most pristine, prettiest, smells-new, ultraspecial '79 El Camino worth $10K?? I think not!

I'd say DEFINITELY not! I know that for the most part, the engine doesn't make much difference in 70's and 80's vehicles like this, but I'd be willing to pay a premium for one with a 305 or 350. I might be mixing things up, but I think the 305 that year had 145/160 hp depending on 2/4bbl carb, and the 350, only offered as a 4-bbl, had 170 hp, but a lot more torque than the 305. I think the 267 only had 115-120 hp.

Or instead of saying I'd pay a premium for the better engine, I guess a better way to say it is that I simply would refuse a model with certain engines, unless it was a price too good to pass up. Still, even with a 350 I doubt that El Camino would be worth $10K. It is a nice looking truck, though.

lemmer

Wouldn't an identical colored/optioned Malibu be worth about $800? How much more do you pay for the bed in back? Two times as much? Three times? I don't see it being worth more than a couple of grand. It is ugly and has a wuss engine.

xwesx

Well, it is an awefully light duty truck, but for the money it could be worth it. If it runs and drives as it should, I would say fix the amber light covers on the front and let the rest lie. All the other damage really is just cosmetic and Despot runners have no need for such aesthetic nonsense. :P

Personally, I have a real aversion to Dodge, but it probably has a lot of life left in it. I just worry about those transmissions. A co-worker has a '97 Durango and she just had the second rebuild done on it (with about 70,000 miles on the ticker).

andre1969

I'd think a low-mileage Malibu coupe in similar condition would be worth at least a few thousand. I just tried checking on eBay, and they have 7 1979 Malibus. One has a bid up to $3500, but it's been modded with a high-performance 350. Another has an opening bid of $4500, but no bids yet. It has a 454 crammed under the hood. One is an awful looking 6-cyl lowrider wagon with a bid up to $1025. One is a Classic sedan in good shape, but in a no-sale green (I kinda like it though) bid up to $710 Canadian. The sedan is kind of a clunky looking body style on these, too. The other three are ratted out coupes. One has a 1981 front-end. Another has a 1980 front-end. None of these has bid over $1000, although one of them has an opening bid of $1000.

So I can't get a good feel for them on eBay. The coupes actually are popular these days among the rodders because the 1978-81 Malibu coupe was one of the lightest, smallest body-on-frame cars out there and can take a big-block without too much fuss. Anything Ford or Chrysler made that was this small was unitized.

Still, I dunno how much the ability to turn it into a rat rod affects its value.

qbrozen

hey, i remember i posted this broken bimmer when it was on craigslist.

Looks like the owner is in for an awakening.

qbrozen

its interesting you say that. I saw a listing for a Ram 1500 where the seller said "will probably need a tranny in the future since all dodges of this era do."

I never knew that of the trucks. I know chrysler minivans go through them like tissues, but I thought the trucks were reliable.

In any case, I know my pop put alot of miles on his 1500 ram. I think that's the same engine/tranny as the durango. hmmmm... guess i'll have to research this a bit more.

andre1969

I remember hearing about truck transmissions being problematic as well. Dodge was kind of late in going to a 4-speed truck transmission, just as they were late in the 4-speed car tranny, but I have heard they were unreliable for awhile. If it's any consolation, GM fullsized trucks with the 4L60E transmission (I think that's its name) can be troublesome too. And that transmission goes in just about every half-ton GM pickup, Yukon/Tahoe, and Suburban. The bigger 5.3 and 6.0 V-8's might have the better 4L80E tranny, but I think all the V-6 and 4.8's get the sucky one.

How are Ford pickup trannies these days? A neighbor of mine had a 2000 Expedition that ate trannies on a regular basis, but other than that I haven't heard anything about them, bad or good. I doubt any of them are as durable as the old THM350/400's, Torqueflites, or C6 tranny.

I think the biggest problem with transmissions these days is that they have to walk a fine line between not sapping too much power and economy, which means they make them with lighter components, but at the same time they have to handle ever-increasing horsepower and torque and GVWR ratings.

Now Chrysler did come out with a 5-speed automatic a few years back that's used in trucks, and it's supposed to be fairly reliable. But oddly, the 5-speed Benz unit that goes into the Hemi cars was a trouble spot!

I'm sure that the optimistic increased service intervals that owner's manuals have in them nowadays have sent many transmissions to an early death.

lemmer

Hard to find comparable sales because even most of the Malibus have dumped the little engine, the little wheels, and have been repainted in something other than poo-poo brown.

I like those old Malibus. I have fond memories of a friend's retired '79 Texas highway patrol car.

andre1969

I liked my first car, which was a 1980 Malibu coupe. It just had the 229 V-6, but compared to the crap most of my friends were driving at the time, it was almost a musclecar! I have a feeling though, that if I got behind the wheel and drove one today, it would tarnish my memories!

I'll see '78-81 Malibu coupes regularly at Carlisle, and they usually have the 200 V-6 (78-79) or the 229 (80-81) or the 267 V-8. Usually they're asking $3-5K for them, depending on condition, but at the end of the day they probably take them home with them.

xwesx

Well, I would give you more info on the Durango except the owner says, "Why would I know which engine and transmission it has?! I know it has V8 and goes through gas like crazy." Some people..... Sheesh. This is the same person who has a '99 Corvette and babies it like it was a 4000# gold nugget. :sick:

Mr_Shiftright

If it's the "base" model, the price is kinda iffy...if you shop diligently, I don't see why you can't find a clean base model with about 100K miles for around $4,500...and this vehicle you posted has thousands of dollars in damage. So why bother?

Of course, if this were a high end model, then it might be worth it because those go for $6K--$7K.

qbrozen

So why bother?

well, because i don't mind the damage and won't fix it.

so why not get the mechanical "soundness" of a $4k truck for half price?

Mr_Shiftright

No argument there except that if the truck gives you any mechanical trouble you're going to have a hell of a time unloading it...."what gets you in cheap, comes back to haunt you on the way out".

Anyway, I said it was "iffy", not that it was a bad deal. :P

Basically that truck is "totaled", so I'd run a VIN check on it and see what's what. Sometimes cars with a salvage title are hard to insure.

fintail

Looks nice, good color, not cheap

Unusual configuration for a 63, but drop the "4 door cope" nonsense

stevedebi

"How are Ford pickup trannies these days? A neighbor of mine had a 2000 Expedition that ate trannies on a regular basis, but other than that I haven't heard anything about them, bad or good. I doubt any of them are as durable as the old THM350/400's, Torqueflites, or C6 tranny."

I haven't heard of any major problems with the Ford Freestyle (which I own). But then it has a CVT and a wimpy 3.0 engine. They did have early issues with the AWD system. Who knows, in 20 years this car may make the list on this forum. It appears that the CVT is only going to be produced for 3 years - assuming that the new Ford/GM 6 speed actually works, and Ford finally puts out that 3.5L Duratec.

I had a Ford Fairmont with the 302 engine that I kept for 15 years, until the body went. Good engine and transmission.

lilengineerboy

People don't sell niche collector cars on craigslist. If you want collector car money, you have to go the colletor car route...Hemmings, the big auctions, etc. To the rest of the world its a $3000 30 year old Toyota, and they don't understand why someone would restore it.
I guess there is no such thing as bad press though so the more people see it the more likely it is to find a home. Even eBay would be risky.

fintail

I wonder if those miles are real

In Seattle people put pricey old cars on CL all the time. I agree it's not really appropriate.

kapbot

I used to own a very similar club cab Dakota. The V6 is fine unless you like having a lot of power. I moved to Denver for a while, and the acceleration was scary sometimes trying to make a left turn. In K.C., where I bought & owned it for about 2 years prior, the power was just adequate. FWIW, the V8, 4.7 or 5.2, have more than enough power, and get about the same mpg as the V6.
Also I hit a deer with my truck that did a whole lot less damage than that truck has, and the repair came to over $4,000.
Of course, they did alot more work than that truck appears to need to be functional.
Also, I've owned three Dakotas, two with autos, 1 each 3.9 V6, and 4.7 V8, no tranny problems whatsoever. No major problems of any kind, actually. Except the abysmal gas mileage of course.

lilengineerboy

$2800 1978 300CD
Looks good for what it is, has Euro headlights, which is a big pimpin upgrade on Audis, presumably for MBZs as well.
Edit
And one more for shifty
you already know its a Jag of some sort
...Just a little down on power???

fintail

W123 doesn't look bad..rare color that could be saved...if it is sound and isn't rusty, one could do worse.

The Jag is hilarious...I can't remember what those ate...head gaskets or valve jobs? Or both? Might make it down on power. I bet it's a ruster too.

fintail

Good beater if you don't care about mileage

I don't know about "muscle" but I suppose it isn't seen everyday

Mr_Shiftright

two WINNERS fintail!! The Olds seems worth the money and the Cadillac for $350 is ready for demo derby (which I am DYING to do one of these days...)

Jag V-12 -- well I suppose you could do a cylinder leakdown test and if it's just a head gasket you could offer him $500. You could part it out to other miserable Jaguar V-12 owners for $500 easily if you lift the head and find something awful. This engine isn't all that bad if you can keep it from catching fire...it did used to win races after all....

qbrozen

Basically that truck is "totaled", so I'd run a VIN check on it and see what's what. Sometimes cars with a salvage title are hard to insure.

Good point.
I hadn't thought of that.

qbrozen

I used to get 14 mpg in my V8 ex-cab. OUCH!

Damage can be a funny thing. Sometimes what doesn't look bad is and what does look bad ain't. The damage to mine looked worse than this example and it involved the bumper, fender, and hood. Came to $2800. Go figure.

lemmer

Don't a couple of you guys like these big BMW coupes? They started this one at $11,900. It is a couple of miles from my house. The paint on the front fenders doesn't even come close to matching the rest of the car. To be a nice car, it really needs a whole new paint job. I'd rather have an old 3-series coupe with a manual tranny anyway.

Mr_Shiftright

They're kinda big tanks to plow around in traffic but they are nice road cars. For that price it had better be pretty spectacular. More like $6,500--$7,500 for these cars. Owners think they are worth more but the rest of the known universe doesn't agree.

qbrozen

Some people just can't stand to throw anything away.

Just a tad optimistic, don't ya think??

Uh-oh. The optimism must be transmitable.

Here's a nice How-To Guide on wasting lots of time and money.

link on craigs led to this: It might have been worth the Buy It Now price if all the time and money were used to restore it to original. I can't believe the bidding is even as high as it is.

how many digits are we missing from this odometer reading? It does look nice for the money, though ... if you like this kinda car.

Good god! I think I may have found a REASONABLE PROJECT!!

andre1969

I like that '79 Eldorado...really interesting, rare color. It would probably gross a lot of people out but I actually love that color! As long as the thing has the Olds gas 350 and not that awful Diesel 350, I wouldn't mind having it. For some reason they never put Caddy 425's in these things, but then for 1980 they put Caddy 368's in them instead of the Olds gas 350. I don't think it was a clearance issue, as the 368 and 425 were the same sized block. Even the old monstrous 472/500 was the same block, although I guess it could have had a raised deck or something.

That '64 T-bird looks reasonably priced, at least compared to the overpriced projects I usually see at swap meets! I always liked the '64-66 style

Mr_Shiftright

What's yer problem with the '65 Mustang fastback? It's easily worth the $8,000 being bid---but not the buy it now price, that's true.

I predict the bids will stop at about $11,000.

'79 Eldo---seems about a fair price. Just turn up the AC, smoke a lot and don't go around corners too fast.

qbrozen

my problem with the '65 fastback is that he made it look like a '67 Shelby!

I'm just not a fan of clones.

At least he could have made it look like this, though:
http://www.nvsaac.com/photogallery/images/1965/SFM5R100_a.jpg

jlflemmons

Per Edmunds this one is about 2k overpriced
PT Cruiser

jlflemmons

12yo Toyota

jlflemmons

Oh, Yeah...

au1994

wish 'em good luck with this one. With the rebates DC was offering you could get an 06 for about 12-13k. Don't know if they are still in effect though.

xwesx

Huh? I think the owner of this car should be buried with it. :sick:

qbrozen

low miles AND a stick!
'93 Prelude

qbrozen

So an ad popped up on the local rag, which is tied to cars.com, that was put there by this Habitat for Humanity charity place that sells donated stuff and uses the money for charity. The ad merely stated "1996 GMC Sierra. Broken windshield. $475 or b/o." and then the phone number.

So I called to inquire about the GMC Pickup, and the woman said something about me being the 2nd person to call and she knows nothing about this. So I explained its in the paper, etc. She gets someone else to get on the phone who again asks me what the ad says. I tell her and she says "well, where does it say its a pickup?" ummmm... i explain that a GMC Sierra IS a pickup, period. Then she realizes ... OH, we have an Olds Ciera! *d'oh!*

toomanyfumes

yeah.. good luck

toomanyfumes

aww.. no pic?

toomanyfumes

a real project...

jlflemmons

That's just wrong