Project Cars--You Get to Vote on "Hold 'em or Fold 'em"

bumpy

the $500 principle at work

Shiftymobile of Doom

if you think a Hummer gets bad mileage...

fintail should buy this, drive it back home, and flip it for 5 grand

were there no Novas left on the continent?

I've always liked these

for the same money, I could go to Canada and buy one that's not a pile of parts

texases

Thanks, you've just given me all the details to go with my 'bottom of the barrel' interest in these :lemon: s! I just see them as some kind of pinnacle of GMs complete inability to design a reasonable small car. While Toyota and Honda were constantly improving, GM's answer was the Chevette.

Mr_Shiftright

Yeah I think you're right....the "floor price" principle would be higher for an older, clean full-size pickup. Why? Obviously, because of the utility. That pile of leaves, trash or lumber doesn't care how the truck looks.

However, it does care how much it can carry, so I think a larger pickup will always have more value than a small one, because trucks are supposed to be large....that's what trucks do.

If a truck can still do work, it can pay for itself, and it will command a decent price.

Grandpa's truck will sell in a red hot minute at that price.
They should have asked more.

CHEVETTES: Yeah, I know, people look at them today and say "Oh, this was America's Toyota or Honda of the times"

A comparative test drive will crush that notion. One has to be totally perverse (which some people enjoy) to claim any competence for these cars. Liking what most people hate can be kind of fun actually :P

andre1969

I think that "Grandpa's truck" might actually command a bit of a premium, for being a 3/4 ton truck. IIRC, the GVWR on something like that would be around 7,000 pounds. In contrast, the GVWR on my '85 Silverado half-ton is 5600. So there's a lot more utility available. A half-ton pickup is often little more than a car in pickup truck drag, whereas a 3/4 ton could be a real workhorse.

Lately at car shows and swap meets, I've been seeing more '73-87 style Chevy pickups showing up. I've toyed with the idea of buying one if I could find one in better shape than my '85, and just using it for parts. But it seems like they usually want around $2500-3000 for them (does't mean they're going to get it, of course) and they're almost always in worse looking shape than mine (more rust, rattier interior, etc)

I actually wouldn't mind something like that 3/4 ton truck Fintail posted. It would be strong enough to put a truck camper back there, whereas mine wouldn't.

Mr_Shiftright

Hey, I like SPITFIRES....but $2,500 for one that needs "welding" to the exhaust system ( you know what THAT means) and has a non-smoggable Weber carb on it?

I don't THINK so....this is already a $4,000 Spitfire, and that's pushin' it past retail for the dismal last year models.

I'd buy a clean 60s Spitfire in a minute for $2,500...like right now!

fintail

Oh, that diesel Golf would sell in 5 seconds here. I bet that thing performs like a diesel fintail with an automatic.

explorerx4

i would buy grandpa's truck in a heartbeat. it would be great to pull up next to one of those new tundra's and say 'nice truck for a little half ton'.

boomchek

You could get and R32 Skyline for about $11k now. There's so many of them here.

oregonboy

Here we have a victim of automotive abuse
300 'vert

texases

At least if (big if) the body's OK, then $5000 gives you some room to remove all that junk and end up with a decent convertible.

lemko

Geeze, I might keep the engine as it is, but I'd have to redo the interior, repaint the car an exponentially more tasteful color, change out the wheels and tires, and get rid of all that other self-destructive add-on junk.

210delray

Talk about a way to absolutely ruin a perfectly good car.

fintail

More expensive than most, but looks nicer than most

Pretty long "bad" list for a car in "excellent condition"

texases

240D - lets see, lotsa work, poss. interior rust from water leak, a slug, "great gas mileage" 24-29 mpg?!? Get me a '95 Accord!

Mr_Shiftright

Sounds like the wrecking yard is even better an idea...worn out old shoe with a list of important needs as long as your arm.

One would be generous to offer $750 for it.

Better yet, just go buy a nice one for less money than he's asking.

fintail

Missing the decimal point in front of the zeroes

Mr_Shiftright

Looks like about $1,250 to me if it runs really well.

british_rover

Too much money Yes/No

This has to be too much.

Seems more reasonable

Also reasoanble but has more issues.

fintail

That first car, the coupe, is shady. I am always leery of very fresh looking paint with faded chrome. Also, the wood is very aged, the car has been neglected.

The fintail would bring that in Europe, that's a nice car. But over here, overpriced. I like it though.

The two later cars are both iffy. The 250SE is unusual, but I suspect it's rusty. The other car gets a similar verdict. You can get a nice one for 5K or so, and it would take more than that to make those ones nice.

andre1969

Muy Hideoso! The only thing that would make it more tasteless would be if it was one of those styles that had the stationary headlights built into the covers!

qbrozen

oh come on now! do you have any idea how expensive that 2-tone paintjob is??

qbrozen

that's AWESOME!

hey, ya think you could get an insurance discount for the whole interior being one big airbag?

qbrozen

well, that sebring is gone. dammit.

i wanted to go see it last night, but the thunderstorms kept me away. i was DEFINITELY going tonight. but now i just looked and someone used the Buy It Now.

Mr_Shiftright

Aside from the fintail, which looks like a nice car with a deliriously overpriced asking price, the rest of them look like typical tired old Benz beaters. Any Euro car has guaranteed rust issues somewhere. The first coupe has old tires, is not restored, leather is dyed, upholstery details incorrect, snarky headliner, shabby wood. It's priced about 3X retail value.

I like the fintail, but get real. Fintail =$5,000 in America. If anything, the nicer it is the more the market will punish you for fixing it up. Try to sell in Europe.

250SE sedan--who cares?

fintail

I like this old money pit...top of the line model, Euro car, nice colors...

I see the headlight wipers are on backwards - the Euro cars worked opposite the US models. I wonder if this car has airbag/ABS, it easily could.

Mr_Shiftright

Price is fair enough but don't cry when the Mercedes repair shop throws you out because they are going nuts trying to match parts.

fintail

Oh, it would have to be a car for one with a sympathetic mechanic, or DIY skills. I just like it because it is odd, and nice looking.

hpmctorque

I think those words say it all. I always loved those large Benzes, but that's because I've been able to admire them without the burden of ownership. I must say they're tempting, but I'm afraid the aggravation and expense of ownership would get old mighty fast. Unfortunately, that's true of so many of the cars we discuss and admire in the Classic Cars forum. In many cases, their main value is in the memories, mental images and fantasies they evoke.

fortee9er

Since you guys are in a Mercedes mood how about this one http://houston.craigslist.org/car/322471785.html

Mr_Shiftright

Hard car to price--seller is quite correct "where would you find another"?, but didn't ask the question "how many people want one?"

This is hardly a "sporty" car in looks, so the mechanical concepts clash totally with rather dull conservative looks.

Were it a massive V8 under there, one could say "it's a Q-ship, a sleeper" car that will blow off your C6 Vette.

But it's not. It's a mildly hotted up inline 6 in a rather base model car.

So it's more like calling a 4-door Falcon 6 cylinder with a factory 4-speed a "muscle car".

It's just "weird".

$9K seems way too much. You can't comp it against an M6 or even an AMG V-8 car,

Hard sell. Gray market, rust. At least it doesn't have the usual tasteless AMG cladding, etc.

I just can't imagine who the buyer is here.

xwesx

Andre, it may have been cruel for the seller to even post something like that on the internet, but it was downright wrong of you to share it....

What is even worse, though, is that it actually has 12 bids!!! :surprise:

fintail

Wow, now that's an oddball. It's quite overpriced given that it needs rust repair, but what a neat little freakshow. However, you would have to be a MB enthusiast to really like it, and W123 people are diesel-heads for the most part.

I kind of wish it had period AMG cladding, I have never seen it on a 123 sedan.

fintail

This guy is enthusiastic

Mr_Shiftright

Is this a satire? "only 170,000 miles" and the "hard to find" brown metallic paint?

He's putting us on, don't you think, or at least tongue-in-cheek?

texases

I guess this is what you get when you cross an OCD Volvo owner with a performance-oriented car.

oregonboy

I'm leery of the tranny swap, but for the money you could drive it until something expensive breaks then discard. I have to wonder how the REAR door panels got messed up.

link Cheap 5-series

Mr_Shiftright

I mean 171K--the car has some serious wear if it hasn't been rebuilt...the camshaft, the turbo, etc.

But having said all that, he might get something close to his price if the car is as nice as he says. Whether it'll go ten more miles before it blows up, nobody can say at 171K. I suppose you could do a long test drive, a cylinder leakdown test and a safety check...and of course put a close ear to that turbo.

One way to tell turbo wear, aside from noise, is to start the car dead cold. If the turbo bearings are worn, the engine vacuum will suck oil through the turbo and the car will smoke for a minute or so, then clear up.

More like $2,200 sounds right on this car.

oregonboy

I could'a had a V8. $3,200 for a 5-spd (high mile) 530i:

530i

Mr_Shiftright

Scary miles but at least approaching a fair price....

texases

You're right, in any normal used car universe a 23 year old station wagon with 171k and all of 135 hp wouldn't get a second glance, but I'm afraid this guy's in the Volvo Zone, has been for 23 years, and he may well find another like minded Volvo-nut. It's like the old Saabs and even the Subaru Brats (I never imagined them as appealing to anyone, but there are a few enthusiasts out there).

Mr_Shiftright

I run across this a lot...someone extolling the virtues of their high mileage baby---and when I drive it, and I hear first gear howling like a banshee, they turn to me and say "oh, they all do that". And the clutch chatters ("you have to be gentle with it...don't POP the clutch like that") and the speedometer is broken and the front main seal is dripping ("just add a little oil now and then") and the front end goes CLUNK when you turn too far to the left ("I never turn the wheel that far") and the handbrake doesn't hold ("just put it in park and curb the wheels").

And it goes on and on....

qbrozen

they either hacked IN or hacked OUT a pair of speakers, is my guess.

andre1969

I think one problem is that if you stick it out with one car for a long enough time, you simply "evolve" with the car. If it starts doing something annoying, or has something defective, you just learn how to deal with it, and it becomes second nature.

But then, when somebody else gets confronted with all those problems (or eccentricity, if it'a a Jag or some other premium foreign car) all at once, then they see just how much of a piece of junk your prized baby really is!

Mr_Shiftright

That's a great way to describe it--like getting used to your mate's annoying habits--LOL!

andre1969

That's a great way to describe it--like getting used to your mate's annoying habits--LOL!

Yeah, but it's funny how you can adjust to a car's annoying habits, whereas I've seen enough old Alfred Hitchcock Presents episodes to know that your mate's annoying habits, even if they're cute at first, end up getting you buried in the rose garden, in the cellar, or taking forty wacks from from Lizzie Borden's sister's axe, etc. :P

Mr_Shiftright

texases

Looks like somebody forgot to take out the garbage...

british_rover

Audi's new design direction takes some getting used to.

210delray

I think one problem is that if you stick it out with one car for a long enough time, you simply "evolve" with the car. If it starts doing something annoying, or has something defective, you just learn how to deal with it, and it becomes second nature.

I know what you mean. I had my '80 Volvo 240 for 21 years, and it developed a number of "foibles" over the years. Just for fun I wrote down a "Would you buy this car?" list with all of its many issues (NOT as bad as Shifty's description).

I don't think too many outsiders would have wanted to touch the car! (But I did eventually sell it after fixing some of the problems.)

210delray

And that's without the stupid "bigmouth bass" grille design!