That's a gaudy looking thing, but at least the interior looks fairly unmolested. Those seats looks no nice, thick, and comfy, sort of a last holdout, before they got downsized, along with the cars.
I wonder how much of a performance cut the Eldorado took when it went from a 500 to a 425? I don't think it lost much hp, but I'm sure the drop in torque must have been noticeable.
Hudson is cool but a little worrisome - pics in the dark don't usually bode well, and the upholstery looks like generic 90s style stuff. Price is probably quite optimistic, but it might have potential for the right money.
It wasn't custom so much as special order. MB had green interiors on the palette throughout the 80s, but few people wanted them and dealers rarely chose them. But if you wanted to order your car and have it built to your spec, then wait months for delivery, you could have it built as you wanted - there was a wide color range. Earlier in the 80s, the green was more of an olive color, changing to this pine green around maybe 1986.
@ab348 said:
Heh.. I kind of like that green 420SEL.
Would MB actually do a custom interior color like the ad implies?
@andre1969 said:
You wouldn't think that green would go with that mocha exterior, but both colors are subdued enough that, for me at least, it works!
Being colorblind to those tones, I can't tell if the paint is gray, green, taupe, mocha, whatever. My first inclination was to call it a subdued green while some of the pics make me think it is brown, but I can't really tell. It is one of those non-colors for me.
The ad says the paint is original, but I just noticed in one pic, there appears to be a scrape in the door opening, showing some light green...
I also like this line in the ad...
"The owner's father purchased this car new. He wanted a green interior in his luxury car. The local Mercedes dealer told him that it was not available. He explained that if he could not have green in his Mercedes he would buy a Cadillac. A few months later he had this special ordered 420SEL."
@andre1969 said:
The ad says the paint is original, but I just noticed in one pic, there appears to be a scrape in the door opening, showing some light green...
While it might be a scrape, I'm thinking it might be a reflection. Looking under the hood seems to show the brown paint under the dirt, I can't imagine somebody stripping down the body for a full color change repaint.
Now that you mention it, I think that's exactly what it is! When I step back and squint my eyes a bit, it looks like it might be the reflection of the hood of a car. It did seem odd, that the car would look so nice otherwise, but have a scrape like that on it!
@andre1969 said:
Now that you mention it, I think that's exactly what it is! When I step back and squint my eyes a bit, it looks like it might be the reflection of the hood of a car. It did seem odd, that the car would look so nice otherwise, but have a scrape like that on it!
It is an amazing coincidence that the reflection is a color that goes with the interior!
That Citroen has had nine bids and they look legit. It's up to 3600.00 and there are two days and seven hours to go.
What am I missing? It looks like a cheap repaint, the engine is seized up and one can only assume the bizarre hydraulic systems and everything else is shot.
I must REALLY be out of touch with that market.
I wouldn't pay that for one in good running condition.
We once had a guy who lived nearby who had one like that only it was a wagon of all things. It was two tone blue and white and it appeared to be in outstanding condition. When he parked it, it would slowly settle to the ground overnight so it looked like a lowrider. In the morning he had to run it for awhile and it would slowly rise up. I assume there was a leak somewhere.
One day it had a for Sale sign on it and out of curiosity I called him. I think he only wanted 200.00 for it. One of the reasons he admitted he was selling it was because the only shop in the area that would work on it had folded.
I've come across odd ball interior colors on old Benzes. Recently we had a nice low mileage mid 80s SL R107 with blue carpeting and green dashboard, seating, and upholstery. It was minty green outside.
A restored (to Pebble Beach standards) DS21 could fetch $35K in the USA and probably more in Europe. Can you get from THERE (current car) to THERE (restored car) for $32,000? Nope.
Mercedes 6.9 Sedan---that thing will devour dollars faster than 5 overweight AARP members can scarf up meatballs at an all-you-can-eat banquet table on a cruise ship.
A couple of weeks ago, I started the Mustang and ran it for about half an hour. Idling at first, then putting some rev's in it.
Everything was fine.
The next day I set out for work and after a few miles, the engine started missing, so I limped it back home.
Has it towed to the repair shop, so we will see what happens and how long it will take.
2024 Ford F-150 STX, 2023 Ford Explorer ST, 91 Mustang GT vert
@Mr_Shiftright said:
A restored (to Pebble Beach standards) DS21 could fetch $35K in the USA and probably more in Europe. Can you get from THERE (current car) to THERE (restored car) for $32,000? Nope.
Mercedes 6.9 Sedan---that thing will devour dollars faster than 5 overweight AARP members can scarf up meatballs at an all-you-can-eat banquet table on a cruise ship.
You're starting to sound a bit like Tom Mc Cahill which isn't a bad thing.
It sounds like those old DS's must have a following. I can't understand this but, hey, whatever floats your boat!
you guys just inspired me to a poor imitation of McCahill
The DS has a pretty avid following, probably because it is rated as one of the most significant cars of the 20th century. In 1955, it was the first mass produced car with power disc brakes, and also had self-leveling suspension. The car advanced automotive technology in suspension, handling and braking and is very well respected among engineers, museum curators, etc. It also won the 1959 Monte Carlo Rally.
More from WIKI:
"The DS placed fifth on Automobile Magazine's "100 Coolest Cars" listing in 2005. It was also named the most beautiful car of all time by Classic & Sports Car magazine after a poll of 20 world-renowned car designers, including Giorgetto Giugiaro, Ian Callum, Roy Axe, Paul Bracq, and Leonardo Fioravanti."
@andre1969 said:
Hey gang, does anybody know what the little red box on the top of the fender well of this Caddy would be called?
I recall that on my late '70s GM B and C-body cars there was an early sort of diagnostic connector in that location. It was clad in an orange, not red, plastic housing.
There's a difference between bravery and reckless stupidity. Bravery is rushing into a burning building to save a child. Reckless stupidity is sticking Roman candles in your pants and saying, "Hey, y'all! Watch this!" before lighting them or buying a 1969 Citroen Pallas as a restoration project.
@lemko said:
A cool yet super-ugly car. You're not likely to run into another one on the street or at your average car show.
Yeah, those final Hudsons are kinda ugly-cool. And among that generation of monstrosity, I actually find a fondness, for some reason, of the big '57 Nash.
"Stupid" is like when you were a kid riding your bicycles and one of your friends said: "Hey, let's build a ramp".
I dunno...there were a bunch of homely cars made in 1956, mostly from the independents. They were hurting for cash and cobbled things together as best they could.
His price seems very optimistic. I'd hit it at about $8000.
Got the Mustang back today. Loose plug wire. Not sure how, but Doh! The boss wasn't there, so they let take the car and will send me a bill in a couple of weeks.
2024 Ford F-150 STX, 2023 Ford Explorer ST, 91 Mustang GT vert
@qbrozen Got it towed using my kid's AAA. Last year, the repair shop had a hard time figuring out what was wrong, car needed a new computer, but I never gave them time pressure to fix it and they gave me a huge break on the potential diagnostic time. I'm guessing he'll charge an hour.
2024 Ford F-150 STX, 2023 Ford Explorer ST, 91 Mustang GT vert
And I still like those Nash cars used in the Superman TV show
Omar, you just had a crush on Lois Lane in her early 50's Rambler ragtop As for mid fifties, I think the Nash came out a little less clumsy than the last Hudson's. I always thought that Fomoco and Mopar had the sharpest looking 57's (even if they both had a love affair with Mr. Tinworm!)
some good finds Omar. I love the 924. $400? I think he left off 2 zeros. No way to get from there to anyplace you want to be. Maybe, if there are enough parts, if you wanted a retirement hobby to play with? And he gave it all to you? What a fright pig.
The Camaro is probably overpriced, but he is right. If you are interested in creating a hot rod and like that vintage, not that easy to find a solid base to work off of.
Those people are going to be owning those cars for a long, long time unless they splash some cold water on their faces, look in the mirror, and say "you know, I gotta get real here".
Dang it all to hell, looks like my '79 5th Ave is not destined to have whitewall tires. I ordered some last week from Amazon.com, but what showed up today were blackwalls. So, I refused delivery...hopefully they'll sort it out!
I received an email this morning from the company on Amazon.com that I ordered my whitewalls from. Looks like they're out of stock, so they're refunding my money. I found another set on eBay for about the same price, so hopefully this time it works out. It'll be nice to have proper tires on my 5th Ave, after all these years, instead of its current mismash of whitewalls and raised white letters, on copcar rims!
560SEL--it has already based the "any sane man would pay about $9500" Rule.
Pretty nice condition though I gotta say. Refreshing to see one that isn't the usual 560SEL beater.
I guess no harm done up to $12,500 or so; after that you're buried for a while. Perhaps if others sell in this rarified range we'll have to revise our books a bit.
I could see the 15K range if either car is genuinely nice. More than that is a real roll of the dice, even for export. I'd gladly pay $9500 for a 30K mile car with no needs and in the right colors (the latter is the problem). Original window sticker is cool too, 75K in 1990.
I am more interested the final bid for that Universal. Just hit 20K now.
@Mr_Shiftright said:
560SEL--it has already based the "any sane man would pay about $9500" Rule.
The Universal is a rather unique, specialty-built piece. The 560SEL is commonly available. I don't see $15K as a rational market price, nor as a very wise buy. But you know, you don't HAVE to adhere to rational spending if it's something you like.
A mint 560 SEL at 10K isn't rational - it's a decades old thirsty barge. Old cars aren't about being rational. Rational people buy mainstream cars.
The Universal auction will be interesting. The local I knew with a W110 230 Universal got about 20K for it 6-7 years ago. His was in similar condition to that auction car, maybe even a little better. I think it went to the Netherlands. This 200D has all the fun of a normal ~55hp sedan, with more ground-hugging weight and unobtanium parts.
Many collector cars are dropping in value from 6-7 years ago---that was definitely the peak of the graph for most old cars. As long as the Universals stay relatively scarce, and the people shopping for them don't die of old age, the prices should remain pretty solid. That is, the supply/demand equation doesn't get out of whack.
What you don't see with these auctions is the amount of money the new buyer puts into the car, and then sells it, if lucky, for what he paid or a small "profit". We never see the in-between parts of the story.
Just finished up an appraisal with a guy who built a Model A hot rod. He bought it in pretty nice shape for $15K, and sold it after 3 years for $18K. The bad news is that his receipts were over $8000.
I don't see a collapse in the value of old closed MBs - as they simply aren't worth much to start with. They didn't peak, but they haven't fallen - if anything, they might pace inflation. That Universal seller doesn't appear to have much of anything in it. Flippers are the ones who assume the risk. "Wheeler Dealers" is a fun way to show that - if they had to bill for labo(u)r, they'd always be in the red.
Model As are surely in the "die of old age" segment now - I think many were worth more in nominal dollars 30-35 years ago, not to mention inflation adjusted dollars. The hot rod might have been the best way to be in an A, rodders don't seem to be close to dying off - although I think there will be less of them in time, at least traditional rodders. My generation might make it lean towards the tuned car movement, eventually the souped up Supras and AE86s will be nostalgia cars.
Comments
What do you guys think?
Should I go for this one?
http://seattle.craigslist.org/sno/cto/4505209583.html
That's a gaudy looking thing, but at least the interior looks fairly unmolested. Those seats looks no nice, thick, and comfy, sort of a last holdout, before they got downsized, along with the cars.
I wonder how much of a performance cut the Eldorado took when it went from a 500 to a 425? I don't think it lost much hp, but I'm sure the drop in torque must have been noticeable.
"you will never find another like this".......truth in advertising!
Thank God!
That Hudson seems like it would be a nice car for the money if the description is accurate.
'11 GMC Sierra 1500; '98 Alfa 156 2.0TS; '08 Maser QP; '67 Coronet R/T; '13 Fiat 500c; '20 S90 T6; '22 MB Sprinter 2500 4x4 diesel; '97 Suzuki R Wagon; '96 Opel Astra; '11 Mini Cooper S
Hudson is cool but a little worrisome - pics in the dark don't usually bode well, and the upholstery looks like generic 90s style stuff. Price is probably quite optimistic, but it might have potential for the right money.
Go broke in style (this is actually probably one of the nicer survivors out there, and Euro car is a plus)
Never seen this interior color in a W126 before
Heh.. I kind of like that green 420SEL.
Would MB actually do a custom interior color like the ad implies?
2017 Cadillac ATS Performance Premium 3.6
It wasn't custom so much as special order. MB had green interiors on the palette throughout the 80s, but few people wanted them and dealers rarely chose them. But if you wanted to order your car and have it built to your spec, then wait months for delivery, you could have it built as you wanted - there was a wide color range. Earlier in the 80s, the green was more of an olive color, changing to this pine green around maybe 1986.
You wouldn't think that green would go with that mocha exterior, but both colors are subdued enough that, for me at least, it works!
Being colorblind to those tones, I can't tell if the paint is gray, green, taupe, mocha, whatever. My first inclination was to call it a subdued green while some of the pics make me think it is brown, but I can't really tell. It is one of those non-colors for me.
2017 Cadillac ATS Performance Premium 3.6
The ad says the paint is original, but I just noticed in one pic, there appears to be a scrape in the door opening, showing some light green...
I also like this line in the ad...
"The owner's father purchased this car new. He wanted a green interior in his luxury car. The local Mercedes dealer told him that it was not available. He explained that if he could not have green in his Mercedes he would buy a Cadillac. A few months later he had this special ordered 420SEL."
At first, I was thinking you'd have a snowball's chance in hell of getting a green interior in a Cadillac by 1987, but apparently you could: http://www.tcpglobal.com/aclchip.aspx?image=1987-Gm-pg07.jpg
Looks like there was "medium emerald" and "dark emerald" for Cadillac, and "medium" sage for the rest.
While it might be a scrape, I'm thinking it might be a reflection. Looking under the hood seems to show the brown paint under the dirt, I can't imagine somebody stripping down the body for a full color change repaint.
Now that you mention it, I think that's exactly what it is! When I step back and squint my eyes a bit, it looks like it might be the reflection of the hood of a car. It did seem odd, that the car would look so nice otherwise, but have a scrape like that on it!
It is an amazing coincidence that the reflection is a color that goes with the interior!
That Citroen has had nine bids and they look legit. It's up to 3600.00 and there are two days and seven hours to go.
What am I missing? It looks like a cheap repaint, the engine is seized up and one can only assume the bizarre hydraulic systems and everything else is shot.
I must REALLY be out of touch with that market.
I wouldn't pay that for one in good running condition.
We once had a guy who lived nearby who had one like that only it was a wagon of all things. It was two tone blue and white and it appeared to be in outstanding condition. When he parked it, it would slowly settle to the ground overnight so it looked like a lowrider. In the morning he had to run it for awhile and it would slowly rise up. I assume there was a leak somewhere.
One day it had a for Sale sign on it and out of curiosity I called him. I think he only wanted 200.00 for it. One of the reasons he admitted he was selling it was because the only shop in the area that would work on it had folded.
It's hard to find a shop that'll work on a Saab!
I've come across odd ball interior colors on old Benzes. Recently we had a nice low mileage mid 80s SL R107 with blue carpeting and green dashboard, seating, and upholstery. It was minty green outside.
It looked a bit odd too.
2016 Audi A7 3.0T S Line, 2021 Subaru WRX
A restored (to Pebble Beach standards) DS21 could fetch $35K in the USA and probably more in Europe. Can you get from THERE (current car) to THERE (restored car) for $32,000? Nope.
Better yet, buy this nice wagon on a $15K offer and get one all together for 1/4 or what you'll end up spending. http://www.hemmings.com/classifieds/carsforsale/citroen/ds21/1649321.html
Mercedes 6.9 Sedan---that thing will devour dollars faster than 5 overweight AARP members can scarf up meatballs at an all-you-can-eat banquet table on a cruise ship.
A couple of weeks ago, I started the Mustang and ran it for about half an hour. Idling at first, then putting some rev's in it.
Everything was fine.
The next day I set out for work and after a few miles, the engine started missing, so I limped it back home.
Has it towed to the repair shop, so we will see what happens and how long it will take.
Hey gang, does anybody know what the little red box on the top of the fender well of this Caddy would be called?
Lemko needs one for his '89 Brougham. Only problem is, we don't even know what the thing is called, so don't know what key words to use for a search!
**Edit: D'oh, as soon as I posted this, my brain had a revelation. Fusible link box, maybe?
You're starting to sound a bit like Tom Mc Cahill which isn't a bad thing.
It sounds like those old DS's must have a following. I can't understand this but, hey, whatever floats your boat!
you guys just inspired me to a poor imitation of McCahill
The DS has a pretty avid following, probably because it is rated as one of the most significant cars of the 20th century. In 1955, it was the first mass produced car with power disc brakes, and also had self-leveling suspension. The car advanced automotive technology in suspension, handling and braking and is very well respected among engineers, museum curators, etc. It also won the 1959 Monte Carlo Rally.
More from WIKI:
"The DS placed fifth on Automobile Magazine's "100 Coolest Cars" listing in 2005. It was also named the most beautiful car of all time by Classic & Sports Car magazine after a poll of 20 world-renowned car designers, including Giorgetto Giugiaro, Ian Callum, Roy Axe, Paul Bracq, and Leonardo Fioravanti."
that is my guess on the red box. fuselink or some kind of fuse relay. not sure of the right terms.
should of course be able to ask the parts department guy.
2020 Acura RDX tech SH-AWD, 2023 Maverick hybrid Lariat luxury package.
and man, without fenders, much easier to get to stuff.
2020 Acura RDX tech SH-AWD, 2023 Maverick hybrid Lariat luxury package.
I recall that on my late '70s GM B and C-body cars there was an early sort of diagnostic connector in that location. It was clad in an orange, not red, plastic housing.
2017 Cadillac ATS Performance Premium 3.6
There's a difference between bravery and reckless stupidity. Bravery is rushing into a burning building to save a child. Reckless stupidity is sticking Roman candles in your pants and saying, "Hey, y'all! Watch this!" before lighting them or buying a 1969 Citroen Pallas as a restoration project.
A cool yet super-ugly car. You're not likely to run into another one on the street or at your average car show.
Yeah, those final Hudsons are kinda ugly-cool. And among that generation of monstrosity, I actually find a fondness, for some reason, of the big '57 Nash.
"Stupid" is like when you were a kid riding your bicycles and one of your friends said: "Hey, let's build a ramp".
I dunno...there were a bunch of homely cars made in 1956, mostly from the independents. They were hurting for cash and cobbled things together as best they could.
His price seems very optimistic. I'd hit it at about $8000.
I recall those mid fifties Hash's as being rather smooth riding sedans though. The 57 look was over the top to me.
Hormel is the first and favorite of American 50s Hash. I bake a cornbread and hash combo that goes well with pinto bean soup. Yum.
And I still like those Nash cars used in the Superman TV show.
Got the Mustang back today. Loose plug wire. Not sure how, but Doh! The boss wasn't there, so they let take the car and will send me a bill in a couple of weeks.
hope the bill is really really small. As in minimum shop charge (probably 1/2 hour labor, I'd imagine). The tow is probably more expensive.
'11 GMC Sierra 1500; '98 Alfa 156 2.0TS; '08 Maser QP; '67 Coronet R/T; '13 Fiat 500c; '20 S90 T6; '22 MB Sprinter 2500 4x4 diesel; '97 Suzuki R Wagon; '96 Opel Astra; '11 Mini Cooper S
Project cars from the Metropolis Craigslist (columbus, ohio):
People still like this generation Cutlass which could make a decent cruiser.
Seller:"all it needs is about $400 worth of work."
For the DRAG-U-LAH fans
Someone posted a remark earlier about "truth in advertising."
So this car will need an interior and motor trans etc., and that is why it is labeled as a project car.
Seller's price = $2000
Check the rear frame rails. Those were notorious for rusty rear frames.
2017 Cadillac ATS Performance Premium 3.6
@qbrozen Got it towed using my kid's AAA. Last year, the repair shop had a hard time figuring out what was wrong, car needed a new computer, but I never gave them time pressure to fix it and they gave me a huge break on the potential diagnostic time. I'm guessing he'll charge an hour.
And I still like those Nash cars used in the Superman TV show
Omar, you just had a crush on Lois Lane in her early 50's Rambler ragtop
As for mid fifties, I think the Nash came out a little less clumsy than the last Hudson's. I always thought that Fomoco and Mopar had the sharpest looking 57's (even if they both had a love affair with Mr. Tinworm!)
some good finds Omar. I love the 924. $400? I think he left off 2 zeros. No way to get from there to anyplace you want to be. Maybe, if there are enough parts, if you wanted a retirement hobby to play with? And he gave it all to you? What a fright pig.
The Camaro is probably overpriced, but he is right. If you are interested in creating a hot rod and like that vintage, not that easy to find a solid base to work off of.
2020 Acura RDX tech SH-AWD, 2023 Maverick hybrid Lariat luxury package.
Those people are going to be owning those cars for a long, long time unless they splash some cold water on their faces, look in the mirror, and say "you know, I gotta get real here".
Dang it all to hell, looks like my '79 5th Ave is not destined to have whitewall tires. I ordered some last week from Amazon.com, but what showed up today were blackwalls.
So, I refused delivery...hopefully they'll sort it out!
I received an email this morning from the company on Amazon.com that I ordered my whitewalls from. Looks like they're out of stock, so they're refunding my money. I found another set on eBay for about the same price, so hopefully this time it works out. It'll be nice to have proper tires on my 5th Ave, after all these years, instead of its current mismash of whitewalls and raised white letters, on copcar rims!
Let the bidding begin!
Cultists in Netherlands, Belgium, and Germany are probably losing their minds over this. I bet it goes back.
Paging Uplander...
I spotted this one at a recent car show.https://us-mg6.mail.yahoo.com/ya/download?mid=2_0_0_1_4339245_AHXsw0MAAA8iU5jjVQAAAIUZ55Q&pid=2&fid=Inbox&inline=1
How high will it go?
The pinstripes on this are even worse, ugh
Pic doesn't work, isell
560SEL--it has already based the "any sane man would pay about $9500" Rule.
Pretty nice condition though I gotta say. Refreshing to see one that isn't the usual 560SEL beater.
I guess no harm done up to $12,500 or so; after that you're buried for a while. Perhaps if others sell in this rarified range we'll have to revise our books a bit.
I could see the 15K range if either car is genuinely nice. More than that is a real roll of the dice, even for export. I'd gladly pay $9500 for a 30K mile car with no needs and in the right colors (the latter is the problem). Original window sticker is cool too, 75K in 1990.
I am more interested the final bid for that Universal. Just hit 20K now.
The Universal is a rather unique, specialty-built piece. The 560SEL is commonly available. I don't see $15K as a rational market price, nor as a very wise buy. But you know, you don't HAVE to adhere to rational spending if it's something you like.
A mint 560 SEL at 10K isn't rational - it's a decades old thirsty barge. Old cars aren't about being rational. Rational people buy mainstream cars.
The Universal auction will be interesting. The local I knew with a W110 230 Universal got about 20K for it 6-7 years ago. His was in similar condition to that auction car, maybe even a little better. I think it went to the Netherlands. This 200D has all the fun of a normal ~55hp sedan, with more ground-hugging weight and unobtanium parts.
Many collector cars are dropping in value from 6-7 years ago---that was definitely the peak of the graph for most old cars. As long as the Universals stay relatively scarce, and the people shopping for them don't die of old age, the prices should remain pretty solid. That is, the supply/demand equation doesn't get out of whack.
What you don't see with these auctions is the amount of money the new buyer puts into the car, and then sells it, if lucky, for what he paid or a small "profit". We never see the in-between parts of the story.
Just finished up an appraisal with a guy who built a Model A hot rod. He bought it in pretty nice shape for $15K, and sold it after 3 years for $18K. The bad news is that his receipts were over $8000.
I don't see a collapse in the value of old closed MBs - as they simply aren't worth much to start with. They didn't peak, but they haven't fallen - if anything, they might pace inflation. That Universal seller doesn't appear to have much of anything in it. Flippers are the ones who assume the risk. "Wheeler Dealers" is a fun way to show that - if they had to bill for labo(u)r, they'd always be in the red.
Model As are surely in the "die of old age" segment now - I think many were worth more in nominal dollars 30-35 years ago, not to mention inflation adjusted dollars. The hot rod might have been the best way to be in an A, rodders don't seem to be close to dying off - although I think there will be less of them in time, at least traditional rodders. My generation might make it lean towards the tuned car movement, eventually the souped up Supras and AE86s will be nostalgia cars.