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To Fix Up or Trade Up, That is the Question

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Comments

  • fezofezo Manahawkin, NJPosts: 10,376
    Good decision. I did that for my daughter a few years back.
    2015 Mazda 6 Grand Touring, 2014 Mazda 3 Sport Hatchback, 1999 Mazda Miata 2004 Toyota Camry LE, 1999.
  • lmolinalmolina Posts: 1
    Should I get 06 Sonata (w/ 70K miles and paid off) A/C compressor replaced ($1400) or trade in for '11 Elantra?"06 Sonata is paid off for past 6 months - has almost 70K miles on it. In good condition except A/C compressor needs to be replaced - blowing hot air. Don't want to spend $1400 on repairs if it's going to keep costing money and losing trade-in value- is it time to trade in for an Elantra and get the benefit of a new car and warranty and better gas mileage at a good rate - I have been pre-approved for a %3.0 loan.
  • im_brentwoodim_brentwood Posts: 4,883
    $1,400 to replace the compressor?

    How much for one that's not made out of Silver?

    Shop this job around to some independents... unless the compressor died in a big way and you have to change the condensor and backflush everything this seems very high to me.
  • Mr_ShiftrightMr_Shiftright Sonoma, CaliforniaPosts: 64,490
    You need to shop around for a better price.
  • suydamsuydam Posts: 4,184
    I just replaced a compressor on my vibe at the dealer for less than $ 500. The price you were given seems outrageous. Also, 5 years for the compressor to last would make me think twice about buying another Hyundai.
    '14 Buick Encore Convenience
    '17 Chevy Volt Premiere
  • Mr_ShiftrightMr_Shiftright Sonoma, CaliforniaPosts: 64,490
    If the compressor seized and threw metal debris throughout the entire AC system, I could see the large bill of $1400, since every component would have to be replaced in the system.
  • srs_49srs_49 Posts: 1,394
    Gonna be hard to get a decent trade in allowance with the AC not working, on a 5 year old car and reasonable miles.

    I would shop around, look for an independent shop that would be more flexible in working with you.

    Also, you could just drive it with the windows down ;) .
  • kyfdxkyfdx Posts: 137,199
    This has happened to quite a few CR-Vs... they've all been quoted in the $3000 range for repairs..

    Did you get a good deal? Be sure to come back and share!

    Edmunds Moderator

  • Mr_ShiftrightMr_Shiftright Sonoma, CaliforniaPosts: 64,490
    Yeah, that's why I tell people that if their AC compressor is getting noisy, DISCONNECT it immediately and save yourself a bundle down the road.
  • oldfarmer50oldfarmer50 Posts: 13,728
    edited July 2011
    "...$3000 range for repairs..."

    Why, if a window AC can be had at Wal Mart for $90, does a car AC cost $3000? :confuse:

    http://www.newlaunches.com/archives/dude_attaches_home_windows_ac_to_his_car.php-

    2019 Kia Soul+, 2015 Mustang GT, 2004 Chevy Van, 2000 Chrysler Sebring convertible

  • suydamsuydam Posts: 4,184
    The price still seems exorbitant, but let's consider the problem. If you fix the '06 you probably won't have other repairs coming your way and the cost per year will be less than a car payment. I put $1500 into my 10 year old Maxima two years ago and have not had a significant repair bill since (and that was the first serious money I had put into it). For that $1500 dollars I have had two more years of driving a paid-off car. Of course, no one has a crystal ball, and the worry is that you will have more serious repairs coming up -- but I wouldn't think so with a 5 year old car. If you really don't trust your car that much, then why consider another Hyundai?
    '14 Buick Encore Convenience
    '17 Chevy Volt Premiere
  • capriracercapriracer Somewhere in the USPosts: 887
    I'm with suydam - if you consider what the payments are for a new car, and then compare that to what repairs would be for a used car, the used car wins every time. Even a complete engine or transimission change is less expensive in the long run.

    There are 3 downsides to this strategy:

    1) Rusting body work completely changes this picture (but that is pretty much a thing of the past!)

    2) Used cars require a bit of flexibility in order to cope with repairs. A second car or alternative transportation is a great help with this problem.

    3) Used cars are not very impressive - if that is important to you.
  • You must watch the red-green show.

    An automotive AC system is nothing like a home window unit. The only thing the same is the principle of operation.
  • I'll pass on the eurortrash and take a rear drive NorthStar STS over any of these. ;)
  • cadillacmikecadillacmike Posts: 543
    edited October 2011
    Laughing at this one.

    My 1995 Fleetwood at 198,000 miles had no issues, no leaks, no falling off trim (I did have the belt line trim repainted a few yeard back). The only thing was that occasionally the memory seat would think i'm 4'8" and move the seat too close up.

    My 1996 Fleetwood (83,000 mi) is the opposite. It think's I'm 7'2" and does not move it far enough up. These are two problem free cars, expeciually compared to the 7-series mentioned.
  • Mr_ShiftrightMr_Shiftright Sonoma, CaliforniaPosts: 64,490
    But no Northstar engines prior to 2000. Many problems with those.
  • cadillacmikecadillacmike Posts: 543
    edited October 2011
    My nephew - let's clarify that, my wife's niece's husband, managed to blow the engine in his 2004 Jeep Liberty. Don't know how he did it, and of course he doesn't know - no car sense.

    Anyway initial repair estimate is approx $3,500. Car is worth maybe $6,000-8,000 i don't know enough details about it and Edmunds TMV on used cars is usually in fantasy land. Problem is they owe some $8,600 on it still????? I owe less on my wife's 2008 CTS but that's besides the point.

    Of course they have no money and want / need us to pay for most of it. I could maybe agree, but this is a never ending saga. Her younger brother is a similar train wreck on cars & financial sense and their parents (my wife's older sister) are a financial nightmare. These guys think I'm their personal banker and my wife has a 100 megaton short fuse when it comes to these subjects. I told her if we agree, then I'm getting a rear drive northStar STS. She said i could have the STS and but not her. That's looking like a better & better deal, but i digress.

    Would it make better bottom line $ sense to take advangage of one of those "$5,000 minimum trade in on any new XXX model" from the kia & mitsubshiiti hawks or just sink the $3,500 into this one.

    Lets see keep old one means sink $3,500 into an 8 year old car, they they STLLL owe $8,600 on. Trade with one of those "minimum trade" crazies = 8,600 owe - 5,000 trade = 3,600 net negative equity, so initial look is NO - would cost more to buy a new car, even though the new car will have a warranty. But it may mean no money out of pocket for me, since they might be able to roll the $3,600 into the new car.....

    If they owed much less on the Liberty, then that would make sense. Am i right on this?
  • Mr_ShiftrightMr_Shiftright Sonoma, CaliforniaPosts: 64,490
    Er, that's a very iffy solution in my opinion. The $5000 trade-in is, of course, meaningless unless we know what they will charge you for the new car, and then basically, once the smoke clears, your relative will have two car payments instead of one.

    Then of course, what do we mean by "blow the engine"? Is it a complete loss, is it a head gasket...what?

    I think before I pulled the trigger on anything here I'd get two opinions, AND a very clear description, in detail, of what is wrong with this engine. I mean, you're footing the bill and you have a right to accurate information on which to base your decision.

    I don't think the "minimum trade" gimmick is anything more than a manipulative sales tool. They'll just pack it in on the other end of the deal and you'll end up, in reality, getting no more for the Jeep than if you sold it as a parts car.

    If I were King ('it's GOOD to be King!" :P ) I'd ask them to sell the damaged vehicle and with whatever they get for it, use that to buy some beater until they can come up with a decent down on a car you may be willing to co-sign on.
  • kyfdxkyfdx Posts: 137,199
    "If I were King ('it's GOOD to be King!" ) I'd ask them to sell the damaged vehicle and with whatever they get for it, use that to buy some beater until they can come up with a decent down on a car you may be willing to co-sign on. "

    Can't sell it, unless they pay off the $8600 loan...

    Did you get a good deal? Be sure to come back and share!

    Edmunds Moderator

  • Actually NorthStars didn't appear until the 1993 model year, and no rear drive ones until 2004. I had a 2000 Eldorado FWD) and it ran great up until i got sideswiped. It did have that annoying split case oil seepage (small leak but annoying nonetheless), but it (quietly) screamed down the road and was very fuel efficient.

    My point was no thanks to the maintenance nightmare euros.
  • Mr_ShiftrightMr_Shiftright Sonoma, CaliforniaPosts: 64,490
    Oh, I was thinking they find a buyer, close a deal and then pay off the loan by adding their own money---but i guess after re-reading, that they are stone broke here?

    In THAT case, fixing the car seems the only reasonable option. You don't buy a new car for penniless people--that's just crazy and ASKING for more grief---such as, what happens if they smash up the new car and don't have gap insurance? Guess who gets stuck for the difference.
  • I'd like to do that, but you have to remember the 100 megaton blast that will ensue. I'd really like to hammer some sense into their heads.

    I'm very leery of the "$5,000 minimum trade gimmicks, i usually change the station when i hear one, but they are everywhere here in FL. Can't find a forum topic on thet subject here - maybe i'm looking at in the wrong sections. In orlando it's mostly the Kia dealers. If they do execute a new car trade in with this libeerty, there wioll only be 1 loan, albiet an inflated one. but that leads me to question what thell did they get into when they bought this current vehicle?????

    I haven't seen the liberty. They are all in the Tampa area and I'm working in Orlando. I'll be there this weekend. Word from my wife, from her neice (with total car knowledge is what your 8 yr old sister might know) is that a radiator failure (crack??) caused an overheat an engine fail on the interstate.
  • Mr_ShiftrightMr_Shiftright Sonoma, CaliforniaPosts: 64,490
    edited October 2011
    Okay an overheat might only mean a head gasket unless they just ignored the heat gauge, the oil gauge, and lots of noise and smoke and just put the pedal to the metal anyway. It takes a lot to destroy a modern engine--almost an intention to do so.
  • kyfdxkyfdx Posts: 137,199
    Or, buy them a beater for $2500, and let them keep making payments on the Jeep....

    Now, chances are.... they won't keep up with the payments... (and, no offense to your relatives), because most people can't separate "money owed" from the car payment...

    So, they'll probably get it repossessed...

    But, at least you are only out $2500....

    You seem to know that you can't fix their problems.... so, just do the minimum to allow them to keep working (and, minimize your cash outlay until the next time).

    That's what I would do.. but, it's harder when it's someone you care about....

    Did you get a good deal? Be sure to come back and share!

    Edmunds Moderator

  • They both work, and a new car loan would be in their names. I'm trying to not have to foot a down payment - but that may not be possible. I'm also concernewd about an already 8 year old car that they STILL owe over $8,000 on...

    They are paying their bills on time, etc, but have no savings, and i don't know the details on this liberty they bought. They know i have the knowledge they need for these things but they are too stubborn to seek out competent advice before they execute a large financial transaction. Same with mey brother (wife's nephew) who has even less financial sense and no car knowledge either.
  • Buying a "beater" might make sense, but that's onlay a $1,000 difference and we don't know the potential beater's history.

    Is there any consensus on geatting a new car and putting $3,600 (possibly more depending on what one of those minimum trade scams are really hiding) of negative equity into the new car loan (or a down payment - there goes my my cash again..)???

    That would at least get them a car with a warranty.

    No offense taken. Their younger brother (wife's nephew) already had a near repo - guess who paid for that??? You know what - that car, currently owned by their parents, is available. Maybe they can use that car. Sure, that would make sense. don't get me started.
  • im_brentwoodim_brentwood Posts: 4,883
    Mike,

    $5000 minimum trade? Sure. $3995 or more over sticker.

    Reality is that this Jeep with a blown engine is worth $500 as a trade in. So... you probably have $8000 to bury in the new car deal.. that's gonna be tough unless they have stellar credit and buy something that you can bury that kind of money in, and that ain't gonna be a $18k car.
  • Mr_ShiftrightMr_Shiftright Sonoma, CaliforniaPosts: 64,490
    The dealer is not going to lose money on this deal so one way or the other he's not going to give you $5000 real dollars for a $500 crippled car.
  • kyfdxkyfdx Posts: 137,199
    You know what - that car, currently owned by their parents, is available. Maybe they can use that car. Sure, that would make sense. don't get me started.

    That's sure the way I would push it.... Let them keep making payments on that Jeep... while driving someone else's (free) car..

    I'd rather dole out a few hundred at a time, if they really needed it.... or, just be extra generous at Christmas... rather than have them come to you for multiple thousands at a time... That's a hard habit to break...

    Did you get a good deal? Be sure to come back and share!

    Edmunds Moderator

  • fezofezo Manahawkin, NJPosts: 10,376
    Wow. That's a lot of issues at once. Sure sounds to me like the letting them sue the free car in the family while continuing to pay for the quasi-dead Jeep is the best of a lot of lousy options.

    I can remember thinking that my parents (an uncle? wow. just wow.) should bail me out when I was younger so I get a little of the mindset but short of them having to face economic reality and deal with it this will never end.

    We have a few of those $5,000 over on any trade here in NJ. Most of them are (sorry, Bill) Hyundai dealers.
    2015 Mazda 6 Grand Touring, 2014 Mazda 3 Sport Hatchback, 1999 Mazda Miata 2004 Toyota Camry LE, 1999.
  • kmurpkmurp Posts: 21
    edited November 2011
    Took it in for the 120,000 mile service and they found problems with the water pump and rack and pinion steering. Cost would be 1800 or so. We are out of our "minivan years", though on occasion the cargo capacity of the van is handy. Would you trade or fix up?
  • Mr_ShiftrightMr_Shiftright Sonoma, CaliforniaPosts: 64,490
    Well $1800 is maybe what...40% of the trucks' value? So yeah, that's pushing the limits of when not to repair something....however, in that value range, you can't buy anything short of a steaming pile of junk for $1800-- so if you must have a second vehicle---I'd roll with this one---better the devil you know than...etc etc.

    Is the pump leaking or just noisy? What's with the steering?
  • fezofezo Manahawkin, NJPosts: 10,376
    I'd agree with fixing it unless you are eager to leave that minivan phase.

    I just traded an 04 Odyssey that no doubt has loads of life if not value in it because I was nuts having to always drive it. Got a Solara convertible. MAde out well on the deal so I'm happy.
    2015 Mazda 6 Grand Touring, 2014 Mazda 3 Sport Hatchback, 1999 Mazda Miata 2004 Toyota Camry LE, 1999.
  • qbrozenqbrozen Posts: 26,421
    edited November 2011
    Ehhh... On the surface, it would seem a good idea to put $1800 into a vehicle with only 120k miles; however, those older 4-speed transmissions from Chrysler are pretty notoriously weak. Have you ever replaced the trans?

    '10 Equinox LS; '08 Charger R/T Daytona; '67 Coronet R/T; '14 Town&Country Limited; '18 BMW X2. 49-car history and counting!

  • kmurpkmurp Posts: 21
    Thanks for the replies:
    I have not replaced the tranny but for years it has lurched and jerked from first to second. Not always but sometimes.
    I was afraid someone would ask about the repair details... I don't remember the specifics of the steering problem.
    I am kinda done with minivans. That said, wife likes having one around and she hates car payments. (experience has taught me she's usually right).
  • suydamsuydam Posts: 4,184
    That is a tough problem. It may be getting to the age when it will be one repair after another. You don't say what you can afford to buy if you replace it. And if you want to sell it you'll have to fix it anyway. You might pay the $1800 but be thinking about replacing it within a year or so and put some money aside for a down payment.
    '14 Buick Encore Convenience
    '17 Chevy Volt Premiere
  • Mr_ShiftrightMr_Shiftright Sonoma, CaliforniaPosts: 64,490
    Well without the repair details, we don't have the critical information to make a good call. For instance, if the water pump is a little noisy, well, for occasional local trips that could last a long time; if it is leaking badly, then of course you have to do it sooner than later. Ditto on the steering. If it's just dripping a little, I'd just keep adding fluid every few weeks.
  • euphoniumeuphonium Great Northwest, West of the Cascades.Posts: 3,425
    The best move for the relatives is to NOT be an enabler. Let the school of "Hardknox" take its course. When you become a banker for one relative, you become a banker for all. :(
  • euphoniumeuphonium Great Northwest, West of the Cascades.Posts: 3,425
    Over a few years, the depreciation on a newer replacement can amount to more than the cost of repairing the original vehicle.

    $35,000 for a new one today causes it to be worth $20,000 in 3 years while repairing the original car may be less than $3,500. In addition, you have to consider the investment loss of taking $35,000 out of the market to buy the depreciating motor car. ;)
  • I was recently in a minor fender bender with my 2010 Scion TC in which the damage is all cosmetic. I got a check from the insurance company for the repairs (about $1500) but I'm thinking about trading in the car and getting an Infiniti. Is it worth my while to get the Scion fixed before I trade it it or would it be better to keep the insurance money and use that as part of the down payment? Thanks for the help!!
  • Mr_ShiftrightMr_Shiftright Sonoma, CaliforniaPosts: 64,490
    Well you corner them by bringing it in as is, and getting a quote on the trade-in, and when they give that to you, ask them what they'd pay if the car were all fixed up.

    Now keep in mind that the trade-in price can be made to look better than it is, because they can pack the selling price.

    What I'd do is first work out a selling price for the car you want and don't even mention that you have a trade-in. Then come back the next day with the car and say you've decided to trade it.

    I know they'll hammer you for the damage but hard to say if it's going to be $1500 or not. They can fix the car a lot cheaper than you can.
  • Great advice, I'll give it a try and see what they say. Thank you!
  • bolivarbolivar Posts: 2,316
    Well, this is one of those things where we might need to see the damage. But I had about $1400 in damage, which was one small nick in a plastic panel and some paint damage that I waxed out. You say this is a 2010 auto, which I consider rather new. If there is much visible damage, I would lean toward getting it fixed. But the approach discussed by others might be a good way to go. If there is much of a panel damage somewhere, I would think a dealer will really mark in down, even if their body shop could get it repaired for far less than the $1500 estimate you have gotten.
  • srs_49srs_49 Posts: 1,394
    We had a 2002 Subaru Outback (Pearl White?) that had received some minor paint damage on the front corner of the bumper and the rear quarter panel (2 separate incidents). I did not want to make an insurance claim for them, so just drove around with damage for several years.

    In 2008, we sold the car to my son, but he wanted the damaged areas fixed up. So we took it to an independent shop and for something like $350 plus a case of Bud Lights :P they repaired both damaged areas. I was really surprised at how cheap it was.
  • Mr_ShiftrightMr_Shiftright Sonoma, CaliforniaPosts: 64,490
    Well your good fortune but in general $350 bucks where I live would get you someone filling their mouth with paint and spitting in on the car.
  • kyfdxkyfdx Posts: 137,199
    Didn't Farrah Fawcett do something like that?

    Covered herself in paint, then rolled around on a canvas and left butt-prints? :surprise:

    Did you get a good deal? Be sure to come back and share!

    Edmunds Moderator

  • Mr_ShiftrightMr_Shiftright Sonoma, CaliforniaPosts: 64,490
    back away from the YouTube website.....

    I had my back bumper redone on the cheap and it was okay but I recently saw the car (I sold it, a Scion xA, 2 years ago) and the paintwork has definitely deteriorated.
  • rmsarmarmsarma Posts: 8
    I have cylinder head that needs replacement on my 2000 infiniti i30t, i have 127K on the engine, is it worth fixing the engine or should i junk the car... suggestions welcome, i have an estimate of 4k to includes cylinder head, gasket and labor...

    The dealer estimate was 7k for parts and labor with no guarantee, ...
  • rmsarmarmsarma Posts: 8
    I have cylinder head that needs replacement on my 2000 infiniti i30t, i have 127K on the engine, is it worth fixing the engine or should i junk the car... suggestions welcome, i have an estimate of 4k to includes cylinder head, gasket and labor...

    The dealer estimate was 7k for parts and labor with no guarantee, ...
  • Mr_ShiftrightMr_Shiftright Sonoma, CaliforniaPosts: 64,490
    Very marginal...I'm leaning towards saying "no, don't fix it". My reasoning is based on the mileage, and also the fact that reconditioning new cylinder heads atop an old high mileage engine is risky...

    Has the vehicle been properly diagnosed or are people guessing? Has a compression test or cylinder leakdown test been taken and have you been shown the results?
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