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Toyota FJ Cruiser


   I love Mighty 'Yota! Oh what a feeling! They have blessed us with legendary cars (Supra, Lexus LS, MR2 Turbo, Celica All-Trac, Lexus SC, 2000GT, etc.) and wonderful trucks and SUVs (4Runner, Land Crusher, Tacoma, RX), but this is stepping over the line!


   February 9th, at the Chicago Auto Show, a show where automakers habitually release future production trucks to Middle America, Toyota will release what by all signs will be a PRODUCTION version of the FJ 4X4 SUV concept from last years auto circuit.


   The issue is this. Jim Press, at about this time last year, stated that the desired successor to the legendary Toyota Supra would never come, instead another truck, based on the FJ 4X4 concept would be produced. So, ipso factso, Toyota thinks you want this truck more than a Supracar! A SIXTH SUV from 'Yota (not including Lexus)!! Let's see. Six SUVs. Zero sports cars. And Toyota wants to attract younger buyers. Uh......yeah.


   This truck in particular is being labeled as a off-roader for younger buyers. So I'd have to assume this falls somewhere near XTerra's turf in competition. Why not turn the RAV4, which sells aboyut the same as Xterra, into a off-roader, and give me my love back!!!


   Some of you think 'Yota will knock off this potential LF-A concept and make a Supra from it's platform. I wouldn't bet on it. How many $125k, 500HP supercars spawn $40k, 350HP kid brothers? How many sportscars does 'Yota have in them? I say one. Why water down your supercar? Who would buy a hairier Toyota sportscar at $125k? A Lexus dealer would have nightmares justifying that!


  I could go 'bout you?




  • alpha01alpha01 Posts: 4,747
    Way to jump to conclusions.


    The FJ does not mean that the new Supra successor will not materialize, nor do Jim Press's one year old comments. Things change, my friend.


    The RAV4 is a soft-roader that caters to a youthful market/small families that likely don't care about real off-roading. The FJ would appeal to those who do.


    Whats the issue?


    More choices = a good thing.


    If you want a sports car, why does it have to be a Toyota?


  • They've proven they would make the best! Period.


      We need another SUV like we need another McDonald's!


  • nippononlynippononly SF Bay AreaPosts: 12,726
    Dr Fill, we NEED Toyota to bring out this FJ! If it is everything it appeared to be in the concept a while back, it will be the first dirt-worthy covered truck from Toyota since they went and mommy-fied the 4Runner. HL, RAV? No way I would take either of those off a level graded road.


    OTOH, here is a truck-based two-door with an actual back seat, and a decent engine to go with it! The S/C 3.4 from the two-years-ago concept truck will not make it to the light of day, I don't think. Not since they stopped using it in favor of the new 4.0L in the Tacoma for '05. If they could just manage to keep some of the weight out of the FJ, I would even be satisfied with the 2.7L 4-cyl from the Tacoma. Just make sure it has available stick shift and a 2-speed transfer case.


    Supra, Schmupra. I loved the old Supra as much as anybody, but the market is flooded with affordable fast cars (including some VERY fast cars). OTOH, as you point out, the Xterra is just about the only thing out there right now in this category of one.

    2014 Mini Cooper (stick shift of course), 2016 Camry hybrid, 2009 Outback Sport 5-spd (keeping the stick alive)

  • Xterra sales have peaked at about 75k.


      Now you wanna split that pie with a TWO-DOOR SUV? Por que?


      I know America loves trucks, but when you have 5 SUV's, and 2 Crew Cab P/U's, give it a rest, ok?


      RAV4 sales have waned, throw money into that!


      That's my beef. I don't have a problem with the truck, but why invest in it? How many 2-door SUV's last here in America? Wasn't the 4Runner a 2-door? What happened?


      Bronco? Vehicross? Amigo? Cherokee? RamCharger?


      Haven't we fallen down this flight of stairs before? (Every year, Gus, your wife rips down the steps!)



      And, as I said before, they want to get younger, but they will sell NO sports cars, WHEN THERE IS A MARKET FOR THEM?


      If they won't sell one NOW.....


  • nippononlynippononly SF Bay AreaPosts: 12,726
    I hear you, but I suspect that if it makes it to the street, the FJ will have 2 and 4-door variants, and probably the 4-door will sell better. People liked those cute ragtop 2-door RAVs from the 90s - maybe they should do that treatment for the FJ as well, a la Jeep Wrangler.


    Point is, most of the SUVs Toyota sells are street-oriented, for the very good reason that the street is where most people use them. I want a small SUV where the 'U' part of the equation still exists.


    In fact, the big T should do itself a favor and try to differentiate its models more. When the HL gets bigger next year, it will step all over the 4Runner. And there are plenty of people who don't want a pick-up but want to go offroad, etc. Mostly now, they buy Jeeps. Come on Toyota, live up to your heritage!


    PS crew cab Tacoma (with actual back seats) with the 4WD and the V-6 runs 26, 28 grand...the FJ needs to be small and come in under that price.

    2014 Mini Cooper (stick shift of course), 2016 Camry hybrid, 2009 Outback Sport 5-spd (keeping the stick alive)

  • Kirstie_HKirstie_H Posts: 11,077
    OK, since we're not going to have a separate topic just for haters, the discussion title has been changed.


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  • nippononlynippononly SF Bay AreaPosts: 12,726
    I forgot to ask you - where did you hear the FJ would come to the March show in Chicago? If that is for real, I might have to head over that way and check it out - our show in San Francisco doesn't come until Thanksgiving. :-(

    2014 Mini Cooper (stick shift of course), 2016 Camry hybrid, 2009 Outback Sport 5-spd (keeping the stick alive)

  • Date, time, address, name of the ballroom, everything.


      I wouldn't start a forum without it being gospel.


      You think this thing is worthy of a 4 hour flight?


  • nippononlynippononly SF Bay AreaPosts: 12,726
    I've got other business in Chicago I can do any time, so why not in early March, eh?!


    Seems like there is not much interest in this type of vehicle from the Edmunds crowd, though. I hope they go ahead with it. It is unlikely they will drop it at this stage if the Chicago debut model is indeed production-ready.


    I want to get a gander at what the specs will more likely be versus the very-much-a-concept from two years ago.

    2014 Mini Cooper (stick shift of course), 2016 Camry hybrid, 2009 Outback Sport 5-spd (keeping the stick alive)

  • nippononlynippononly SF Bay AreaPosts: 12,726
    saw in the NAIAS coverage that Toyota has an almost-ready crossover called (at present) something like the "FTSX" that is supposed to be a Mercedes R-class fighter.


    Point is, once Toyota has a properly developed line of crossovers to replace their old SUVs, is it that inconceivable that Toyota could bring out the FJ as an '07 and just call it the next 4Runner? That would be cool to me and would make sense given that the Sequoia would still be available for the folks that actually want a truck-based SUV to tow or offroad.

    2014 Mini Cooper (stick shift of course), 2016 Camry hybrid, 2009 Outback Sport 5-spd (keeping the stick alive)

  • That and the Cruiser are the trucks that I like most, so don't replace it with a half-baked retro redo. The 'Runner is an excellent SUV.


  • nippononlynippononly SF Bay AreaPosts: 12,726
    such a truck would fulfill every duty the original 4Runner was designed to be capable of! And like I say, if you want to seat seven, you can still get a Sequoia.


    Actually, it would be kind of a neat historical twist: 40 years ago the FJ40 was the very first Land Cruiser. Over the years it became enormous and max-luxed. How weird if the 4Runner became the "new FJ" for the 21st century!


    So is the FJ concept really "half-baked"? I don't see why...

    2014 Mini Cooper (stick shift of course), 2016 Camry hybrid, 2009 Outback Sport 5-spd (keeping the stick alive)

  • elemintelemint Posts: 79
    I saw the FJ concept at the 2003 chicago auto show and i was the most ORIGINAL vehicle i have EVER seen! If it is anything like the one i saw at the show i am planing on buying on already. Now if the just make on with a diesel! THANKS TOYOTA!!!! This is the first vehicle i have EVER been excited about!
  • elemintelemint Posts: 79
    One more thing. PLEASE dont make the new fj with leather and wood trim! Many people do not want to pay for all that "luxury" garbage just so car makers can jack up the price!
  • The original 4Runner was a p/u with a cheap camper shell stapled on it. It had no original mission. It dreamed of being the polished off-roader it is today!


      I don't know what either one of you is talking about!


  • nippononlynippononly SF Bay AreaPosts: 12,726
    the 4Runner today is a 7-seat mondo-mommymobile with compromised offroad specs for the sake of kicking Explorer and Traiblazer butt for the family set. The original was kinda special - a real truck that happened to have a back seat. All thru the 90s it maintained this mission, even as it became more lux-ified. For '03 they spent all their money putting in third row seats, rear seat DVDs, and quieting the ride with all kinds of sophisticry (not to mention making it HUGE). IOW, the original truck is gone, replaced by family transport.


    That is what the FJ now proposes to be. A covered truck with a back seat. Small enough for a tight turning radius and offroad work. And for elemint, I will add that Toyota wants this to be an entry-level truck similar to XTerra in pricing. Don't expect wood, there might be optional leather (I won't be wanting any of that), but do expect it to be a rough-and-tumble truck right out of the box. No third rows and DVDs here! :-)

    2014 Mini Cooper (stick shift of course), 2016 Camry hybrid, 2009 Outback Sport 5-spd (keeping the stick alive)

  • This 'Runner is better-looking, better off-road, rides better, has more features, and is a better value than any 4Runner before it. It's better than Grand Cherokee. Better than Exploder.


       It has a V8, a 3rd row seat they spent two cents on (the same add-on the Cruiser has had for a decade!), and has not been watered-down AT ALL! It's just better. They made it wider to seat 3 in the back better, and for rollover tests, that's it!


       It is their most balanced and capable SUV, a tremendous value. If only Ford or Gm could make one!


       They've put a ton of money into features and new engines, they ain't replacing the 'Runner anytime soon, anyway.


  • elemintelemint Posts: 79
    The 4runner is not bad, a little 'worty' for my tastes though. I think the new pathfinder is where is it at though. I am looking forward to the fj cruiser because before i got wind of it i wanted to import a land cruiser II. The bear bones land cruiser truck that are all over the developing world. NOW THAT IS A 4x4! Too bad all the car manufacturers think we are all lazy fat asses that need a car that is like a living room. The nissan patrol rocks too!
  • nippononlynippononly SF Bay AreaPosts: 12,726
    you are right on!




    The engines in the 4Runner are a variant of the (pre-existing) LC/Sequoia V-8 and the V-6 the new Tacoma is using. No need to worry about them throwing away the money on development of that pair - they will get plenty of use. Besides, we will probably see the V-6 as an option (possibly standard) in the FJ.


    "It's better than Grand Cherokee. Better than Exploder."


    EVERYTHING is better than Explorer. But I won't hold my breath waiting for offroad folks to start lifting 4Runners and taking them out on the trails. I would die first if I did. People DO lift GC's and take them out there, however. Just as they do with the pre-2003 4Runners.


    "This 'Runner is better-looking, better off-road, rides better, has more features, and is a better value than any 4Runner before"


    The 4Runner is only a better value in the sense that you get more junk for the same money. All junk for family car buyers. What's the bet the next gen won't even have a low range any more? If it follows its current path, I would say it is decent odds. Looks are subjective of course, but it is NOT better offroad - it has much lower approach and especially departure angles, and a totally compromised breakover. And if it has a better ride on the road, what about wheel articulation off the road?


    Nope, with the advent of the '03 4Runner, Toyota relegated the "dirty work" role to its pick-ups. But not everyone wants a pick-up. Bring on the FJ.


    Oh yeah, and I even like the model name 'FJ'. I hope they keep it and don't try to give it some silly word name instead.

    2014 Mini Cooper (stick shift of course), 2016 Camry hybrid, 2009 Outback Sport 5-spd (keeping the stick alive)

  • I just don't know. The Pathfinder has the Frontier's cost-cut interior, and looks stupid on the outside, with a minivan rear end, and no V8. I don't sweat the Pathfinder.


      If you want a less technical, more elemental 4X4, get the Xterra. With only 75k sales a year, with no competition for that niche, in a market with, I don't know, 60 SUVs to chose from, I don't see any evidence that Toyota is missing something.


      And a 4Runner, or land Cruiser, can do anything the Xterra can do, only faster!


  • sortersorter Posts: 146
    Finally, someone can challenge Jeep.



    It's a goer for Toyota



    by Alastair Sloane



    Toyota says it created its go-anywhere FJ Cruiser to "raise the emotional pulse of the emerging youth market".


    The new off-roader, styled from the original FJ concept of the late 1960s, will be pitched as an affordable sports utility vehicle for the active lifestyle set.


    The carmaker is expected to confirm at the Chicago motor show next week that the new model will go into production next year, initially for the North American market.


    It has been designed to compete with the H3 Hummer, the scaled-down 2006 model-year version of the vehicle originally developed for the US military.


    The FJ Cruiser is marginally smaller than the H3 and was developed jointly by Toyota Motor Sales (USA) and Calty Design Research, the company's North American design centre in Newport Beach, California.
  • This thing is a lot uglier than I remember!


      HOW MANY viscious blind spots does thing have?


      And why can't they make the RSC concept form '02?


      That was 1000 times hotter than this load!


  • I'd love an FJ. Look's great in my opinon.
  • nippononlynippononly SF Bay AreaPosts: 12,726
    I don't get it - you are out in left field on this one.


    I don't think they will make the production model with that glass roof/hatch - don't know how that would do in crash tests but I bet whether it does well or not it is expensive, and this is supposed to be "the affordable offroader".


    All the lights and stuff I can see, and I wonder if it will really come with a stock winch on the front like the concept.


    Oh yeah, and those enormous rims on the concept truck will be gone, I am sure, and I still say they will sub in the new 4L V-6 from the Tacoma rather than use the outdated 3.4L with the S/C.

    2014 Mini Cooper (stick shift of course), 2016 Camry hybrid, 2009 Outback Sport 5-spd (keeping the stick alive)

  • This thing is tore up from the floor up!


       Wanna debate this or a 4Runner? On looks or anything else? This is a ultra-niche vehicle like the Element.


       But they are mentioning $30k vehicles in comparison, not Elements and alike. They mention building it for young people.


       I guess they are talking about people my age or a little younger (I'm 29). Young people aren't just dropping $30k for that! Hell no!!


  • elemintelemint Posts: 79
    What mention of $30k? I bet it will be around $25k It is a REAL 4x4 so what else are they supposed to compare to? I find this thing to be the best looking vehicle i have seen in a 4wd. All the rest are mostly copies of copies. I have been wait for such a vehicle for 20 years. I thought i found what i wanted in the element which i still love, but the FJ seems even more what i need. The fact that some people hate the look is a GOOD thing. All cutting edge designs offend the cookie cutter minds out there. Always has been like that and always will be. That is the sign of a good design. Most people alway hated Frank L Wright, but now people imaginations have cought up with his after 60 years
  • nippononlynippononly SF Bay AreaPosts: 12,726
    they were going for a $20K starting price when they first put forth the concept a couple years back. I imagine if it is like every 4x4 they have ever had, there will be a RWD version, so a 4WD FJ should start at about $22K. High-roof cars like the Element do not compare. The only vehicle that anyone should be comparing to the FJ is the XTerra.

    2014 Mini Cooper (stick shift of course), 2016 Camry hybrid, 2009 Outback Sport 5-spd (keeping the stick alive)

  • elemintelemint Posts: 79
    That is the 2006 Toyota FJ Cruiser. NOT 2007!
  • It look so out of dated. but It would be perfect for someone looking into mini-hummer.
  • elemintelemint Posts: 79
    PLEASE dont us 'hummer' and the fj in the same sentence. The hummer has no purpose but to use up as much gas as possible while saying, 'look at me, i have a small package'.
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