Mystery car pix

hudsonthedog

"Duh. I knew that .. don't know what made me type Lambo.

Must be the keyboard ... yeah, that's it!"

That's entirely understandable. The "Lamborghini" key is right next to the "Maserati" key on the standard QWERTY keyboard!

andys120

...they're Iso Rivolta Fidias.

Si!

andys120

boyce

Is it a Kaiser? 1950s?

karsick

1954 Kaiser

andys120

Those are good guesses but that is in fact a 1961 Kaiser
Carabela manufactured by IKA (Industrias Kaiser Argentina SA) which manufactured Kaisers in South America long after they ceased to be made in the USA.

IKA was bought by Renault in 1967 and produced AMC/Jeep models as well as various Renaults starting w Dauphines.

andys120

magnette

Sorry - been away for a few days, so I need to catch up - don't seem to see a reply to your b & w picture of the 60's two-door, from Aug 19th.

This looks like the Reliant prototype for the Anatol, which was made in Turkey - late 60's. Reliant developed this for them, based on a similar design to the original Scimitar - in fact, I think they had plans to make a sort of Scimitar saloon for the UK market at the time but it didn't materialise. They also had similar deals with Sabra in Israel re their sports and early saloon cars, in the early 60's, and later also did things in Cyprus, and I think Greece...
These were quite successful, in their day, and one of my colleagues thinks he saw one in Turkey a couple of years ago, as they are pretty indestructible, being fibre-glass.

Someone at Reliant obviously liked holidays in the Eastern Med...

magnette

Edit:
I think this was actually an Olicit Anatol

andys120

My source calls it a Reliant Anadol.

hudsonthedog

"I think this was actually an Olicit Anatol"

If I'm not mistaken, it's OLTCIT.

I can see how different sources might refer to it as either an Oltcit (local Turk producer) or Reliant (original designer and source of many parts).

andys120

Can anyone guess the exotic in #12205?

Clue: It has a well-known Italian brand name but isn't built or sold in Italy.

Going, going...

stever

Bugatti Veyron?

hmm, finally found a rear quarter panel shot and the tail lights are all wrong (and probably lots of other obvious stuff, lol).

Some other Bugatti? :shades:

hudsonthedog

Isn't Andys' car a Brazilian Lamborghini?

done37

I would have to say its a Diablo based Lambo, but its funky in the back like a body kit or something.

andys120

Sorry Steve. Ettore Bugatti built his cars in Molsheim, Alsace and that's where the Veyrons are made too. Bugatti though of Italian descent was a French national so, as applied to cars Bugatti is not an Italian name and in any case Veyrons are sold in Italy AFAIK.

andys120

I think it is Diablo based but it's sold in South America as the Lambo Coatl by Lamborghini de Argentina.

andys120

british_rover

2008 Accord Coupe

stever

Isn't there a big dispute among you exotics fans whether Bugatti qualifies as "Italian" or not?

michaellno

Isn't there a big dispute among you exotics fans whether Bugatti qualifies as "Italian" or not?

Why, because the name ends in an "i"?

I thought they were a French company.

hudsonthedog

Isn't there a big dispute among you exotics fans whether Bugatti qualifies as "Italian" or not?
"Why, because the name ends in an "i"?

I thought they were a French company."

I agree. There's no doubt that Ettore's original and Volkswagen's current Bugatti are French companies. Artioli's short-lived Bugatti was Italian, though.

andys120

stever

Well, the founder was born in Italy. The company started in a part of Germany that was restored to France after being annexed for 40 some years at the turn of the century. (Not that century, the late 19th century).

Then there's that Italian guy who bought the name in '87 (the more recent '87). Then there's that whole Bugatti Autos SAS founded by VW.

It's mysterious. But then I didn't know that VW owned Lamborghini either.

Mr_Shiftright

Yes, collectors and historians definitely regard the original Bugatti as a French car. I don't know what they think of the remake....

magnette

Bugatti actually started life as a German make, because Molsheim, where all the real Bugattis were built, was in Alsace, and from 1871 to 1918 that was part of Germany ( ex-Franco Prussian war) In 1919 the area was returned to France.

magnette

Skoda 1200 wagon - late 50's (and this one appears to be registered in Sweden)

neil733

It was an Otosan Anadol, not an Oltcit, or an Anatol.
See http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Anadol
There was a link with Reliant.

Oltcit was a Romanian company that built the Citroën-derived Axel in Craiova in the 1980s. The Oltcit factory was later bought by a Daewoo joint-venture, and still builds Daewoo's now-obsolete Nexia/Cielo and first-generation Matiz models. The Romanian government bought Daewoo's share back from Daewoo's creditors a couple of years ago, and is currently negotiating to sell the plant to Ford.

andys120

Skoda 1200 wagon - late 50's

Actually, Skoda 1201, 1959.

andys120

kyfdx

Shelby GT350 .. '69?

Funny.. I had a '77 Cobra II, and the wheels were virtual copies of the style in that picture.

texases

It's a '66, right? I don't think they made them in '65.

andys120

It's a '66, right? I don't think they made them in '65.

Yep it's a '66, you can tell by the rear quarter window visible on the drives side. There were 1965 GT-350s but they did not have the quarter window.

1965 GT-350>


1966 Shelby GT-350H

andys120

texases

I learn something every day. Turns out about there were about 562 '65s and about 2500 '66s.

Mr_Shiftright

Perhaps geographically but you are talkin' pure heresy in the eyes of automotive historians. If you do ever come across a book that categorizes any Bugatti as German, I'd be interested to see that. What would be interesting is to track down the 1911 Lemans car and see how they recorded the country of origin.

Bugatti abandoned is modest works in 1914 and buried his race cars and fled Alsace. I don't think he wanted anything to do with the Germans or Germany. He built aircraft engines for the French.

PS: The Delorean is catalogued as an Irish car--which is pretty strange.

texases

re Delorean, that's about to change: "This company based in Humble, Texas, which has been refurbishing old DeLoreans for years, says that it will build new DeLoreans for $57,500 beginning approximately one year from now." I can't wait :sick:

Mr_Shiftright

Well that should be a colossal failure (as usual). Why not re-make the Edsel and the Corvair while you're at it? Some people really know how to tweak the nose of the gods, don't they?

hudsonthedog

PS: The Delorean is catalogued as an Irish car--which is pretty strange.

I don't see why that's strange. Deloreans were built in Northern Ireland. Just like Bricklins were Canadian (New Brunswick).

texases

Turns out these guys got the factory inventory, so it sounds more like a simple assembly operation. Look at their warehouse on DeLorean.com, pretty impressive.

lemko

Well, I hope these "new DeLoreans" have a better engine than the crappy Renault unit used in the original car. Can I get a Flux Capacitor in mine?

texases

Uh-oh - they have lots of old Renault engines, 'factory fresh', so they're stuck with them, I bet. :sick: :sick:

Mr_Shiftright

I don't even want to look. I just want Deloreans to go away forever. I'm sick of hearing about them.

stevedebi

"Why not re-make the Edsel and the Corvair while you're at it?"

I have known several people who owned a Corvair, and they say that the car was safe with the final designs. One of my friends said that he simply put weight over the front wheels and his was safe.

Haven't heard from any of them lately though ... :sick:

Mr_Shiftright

What I meant was the once the car is a loser, it's always a loser...even if the problems get corrected or whatever....

magnette

Geogarnos Encyclopedia which is pretty much my main motor reference book categorises Bugatti as German, until end WW1, and French thereafter, but it is really a geographical/political thing - I would imagine that Monsieur Bugatti, like about 80% of all Alsatians, would have categorised the area as part of France, occupied by Germany...

magnette

Delorean; Another boundary, another problem. Whilst I wouldn't want to get drawn into any discussion over the situation in Northern Ireland, speaking as a British taxpayer, to whom the late unlamented Mr Delorean and his bunch of crooks owes a share in several hundred million pounds to, I would point out that Delorean cars weren't built in the Irish Republic, and where they were built was ( and still is ) part of the United Kingdom... If it was in Ireland, presumably the Irish government would have spent millions propping it up instead...

magnette

I should have known that - I even saw a Citroen Axel at the weekend !

Mr_Shiftright

Yep that's why I found the "IRE" designation in some auto books so strange.

Thanks for the Bugatti reference. I'm sure M. Bugatti would roll over in his grave to see his early cars designated German but after all, the map of Europe is always changing, so you takes your chances. France thinks it owns Corsica but don't tell the Corsicans that. They don't even LOOK French.

I think Mr. Delorean left a very bad taste in a lot of people's mouths....his backers, his workers, and his customers. A most grievous breach of faith. I could never get into the revisionist glorification of the car itself, given the karma associated with it. It's like saying "Hey wasn't the 1929 Capone a GREAT car?"

texases

Don't underestimate the 'Back to the Future' factor. This is one of the cars that looks way cooler than it is.