Mystery car pix

mac24

Yes, they're Gogs. One could be forgiven for thinking the last one with the faired in headlights was a Berkley though, and until I gathered the pics I didn't know that Gogomobil made motor scooters.

Waiting to hear what the RR connection is. :surprise:

Mr_Shiftright

Wasn't there a sports car called a Buckle, built by the same Mr. Buckle who brought the Goggomobile to Australia?

andys120

grahampeters

G'day

Anyone who has looked at the remarkable little Goggomobil, made by Hans Glas gmbh would find it hard to make the connection to BMW, or to Rolls Royce. However, BMW had re-established themselves after the second world war by building and significantly developing the Isetta originally designed by Iso of Italy. There's an odd by-way here, as Iso were also the designers of the legendary Iso Rivolta and Grifo; from humble beginnings do great things come!

Glas had started as an agricultural machinery manufacturer in about 1895 and progressively developed a large plant at Dingolfing in German.

Like BMW, Glas's cars became rapidly more sophisticated after the Goggomobil, with a moderately successful 1300 Coupe in the early 60's. There was also a 2.6 litre V8 with a body designed by Pietro Frua, one of the leading Italian designer in the 1960's who also designed the Maserati Mistrala and Quattroporte.

By the mid 60's Glas were doing it tough. At the same time, BMW's Munich production plant was reaching maximum output and BMW decided to acquire Glas, rebadging the existing cars as BMW's. One, built in South Africa, remained in production until 1974.

The Glas plant at Dingolfing continued as a production facility for BMW, being redeveloped in the late 1960's It is now BMW's largest plant, building luxury 5, 6 and 7 series cars and the bodies for Rolls Royce. Thus the connection between funny little twin cylinder objects and the Spirit of Ecstasy.

The basic Goggomobil chassis and engine were clothed in much prettier clothes by Bill Buckle, a Sydney car dealer, especially the lovely little Dart sports car. Buckle also developed other vehicles off the Goggomobil, including the more bulbous yellow transporter in the photos above. Bill Buckle was a considerable motor entrepeneur, aslso building the Bucke GT, a fiberglass bodied Ford Zephyr powered lightweight in the late 1950's. The Bill Buckle chain now sells Subaru, VW and Toyota from their home base in Sydney's Northern suburbs.

I have always been intrigued as to how our neighbour, a professional fisherman, acquired the Dart, hidden in his garage under a mountain of rubbish. It seemed an ignominious end for such a pretty car. I do wonder if anyone rescued it.

Cheers

Graham

mac24

Wasn't there a sports car called a Buckle, built by the same Mr. Buckle who brought the Goggomobile to Australia?

There's an explanation to that question here: Goggo

bhill2

Well, the badge indicates that it's a Peugeot, but that' as far as I can go.

stickguy

I don't know, but I want one.

andys120

Well, the badge indicates that it's a Peugeot, but that' as far as I can go.

So far so good, it's the current top-of-the-line Pug Break. Who's got the number?

grahampeters

G'day

Isn't that pretty!

Peugeot 508 Touring.

Big Peugeots have a long tradition of extraordinary robustness and longevity, particularly in Africa. There, the 504 wagon seemed ubiquitous.

I fancy one of them

Cheers

Graham

Mr_Shiftright

Great car the 504. I had a 504 diesel. I beat the snot out of that car and it never, ever, skipped a beat. It was my "dock" car when I lived on a boat and it hauled marine gear, launched little boats, drove in snow and in desert heat on camping trips. It was a great car. And what a comfy ride! I could see why it would be suited to Australia. They were very tough vehicles. Too bad Peugeot never made a car as good. Well, maybe their little turbo hatchbacks.

ateixeira

I was gonna start guessing, they are all 3 digits with the middle digit zero, and you can guess from the size...

andys120

lemko

Humber Imperial circa 1965? I think I see a black vinyl roof. Else, it's a Super Snipe.

andys120

Right, Lemko, it's a Humber Imperial.

andys120

stickguy

Mid 70's alfa (yes, I go for the obvious). I always like these.

let's see, is it a GTV?

early 60s Buick next to it I think.

qbrozen

'74-'76 Alfetta GT

andys120

Actually, you're both right, it's a mid 70s Alfa-Romeo Alfetta GTV6.

Four cylinder versions were sold outside the US.

grahampeters

G'day

One small variation on the Humber Imperial. The B suffix on the registration plate shows that it was first registered in 1964. The English system from 1963 has permitted you to judge the age of the car from the numberplate. They ran through the letters (added after a three digit letter and three number string) and then reversed it in about 1982/3 with year identified, three digits then three letters.

Some letters were not used where they could cause confusion (I, O and Z) and the letter Q was reserved for oddities; imports and hand built specials incorporating parts from different years (hence one claimed derivation for the description "Q car" for something which was not quite what one would expect; more likely, this derived from the Q-Ships of the two wars - ostensibly merchantman but actually having hidden ability as fighting vessels)

Initially, the plate changed on January 1 each year but dealers and manufacturers quickly realized that customers dried up late in the year, only to rush their showrooms on 1 January. Accordingly the date for plate changes shifted to 1 August from 1967.

This threw up the oddity that the "E" plate only ran for seven months, increasing the scarcity of "E" plates when children played number plate spotting games (haven't we all entertained kids - or been entertained this way - on long trips, to keep them quiet?).

In turn, the motor trade took to describing the age of a car as the model year and plate letter ('79 on a "T") and the pricing for used cars reflected both factors

The problem of concentrated demand for a new year plate was merely transferred to August 1 from January 1, resulting in up to 50% of a year's sales occurring with August delivery. The race to have a new letter plate on the driveway had reached ludicrous proportions by the time that I moved to Britain in 1990. Buyers would pre-order their new car in June and July for delivery on August 1. Car factories geared up for the expected rush, working massive overtime in the months leading up to August and building inventories for the expected rush.

On August 1, many car dealerships would open at midnight, delivering huge numbers of vehicles to eager "punters". In turn, the punters would pay too much for the privilege and the delivered cars would have been rushed through production and pre-delivery. It was no surprise that warranty claims for these vehicles were noticeably higher than for a car sold in say February. The comparative scarcity of sales at other times of the year, also meant that a canny buyer could obtain significantly higher discounts by choosing their moment

The UK system has now moved to the plate letter changing twice a year. I believe that this has slightly reduced the peaks. There is also a system by which you can tell the town where the car was first registered.

Cheers

Graham

andys120

grahampeters

G'day

I know this is not quite right but 55/56 Belair?

Cheers

Graham

berri

Right years, but its a Pontiac, don't know which year though.

grahampeters

G'day

Okay, how a '56 Pontiac Star Chief. Never seen one down under, that I can recall. A friend is rebuilding a 57 Belair, which I still think is a lovely looking car.

Until the early 1960s a lot of big American muscle was imported or manufactured from CKD (Completely Knocked Down) kits in Australia. You would often get slight variations for the Australian market and there was even one point where the model progression in Australia went backward, delivering the equivalent of 57 after the 58 (something Ford derived, I think).

Cheers

Graham

andys120

That's right, it's a '56 Pontiac Star Chief, the last Pontiac to wear the traditional chrome stripes. In 1956 the stripes were only on the hood but not the trunk as in prior years.

By 1957 Pontiac's new boss Bunkey Knudsen had succeeded in banishing this dated detail entirely. Ironically in '58 they slapped chrome every but the hood and trunk!

berri

Ironically in '58 they slapped chrome every but the hood and trunk

I gotta tell you though, I think the 58 Bonneville is a great looking car, maybe even nicer than the Impala (especially the interior).

imidazol97

Here's a nice example.

Mr_Shiftright

'55 Pontiac? I don't think it's a Star Chief, so it must be a Chieftain.

Nice. I bought one of those once from a guy some 25 years ago He sold it cheap because it had one dead cylinder and was making a horrible knocking noise.

Turns out it was a broken stamped valve rocker arm. Bought one for a few bucks and it ran great. Bronze and white. It was a nice car. I flipped it (as usual) and made some money on it.

andys120

Nicer than the '58 Impala isn't saying much IMO, the '58 Chevy was a mess compared to the Tri-Chevies.

I will say that the '58 Poncho was restrained compared to the truly awful
Buick and Olds>

mac24

Right, Lemko, it's a Humber Imperial.

I would have guessed at a Humber Snipe or Super Snipe.
Very posh car in its day, often chauffeur driven and used to shunt government ministers around.

mac24

There is also a system by which you can tell the town where the car was first registered.

This was true until the mid to late sixties I think.
The various county codes would be listed in the back of an AA or RAC member's handbook.

grahampeters

G'day

The UK system reintroduced town specific plates in 2001. The first letter indicate the general area (eg G for Garden of England ie Kent) and second letter specific to a sub area (eg GA= Maidstone, Kent)

Good link here http://www.cvpg.co.uk/REG.pdf

Very sad that I know so much about UK number plates; I should get a life!

Cheers

Graham

mac24

The UK system reintroduced town specific plates in 2001. The first letter indicate the general area (eg G for Garden of England ie Kent) and second letter specific to a sub area (eg GA= Maidstone, Kent)

Shows how long it's been since I was back there.

Good link, looks like system changed several times, meaning you'd have to be pretty good to look at a number plate and immediately determine the origin of the registration.

qbrozen

hmmm... ya know, I can't find a source that states the GTV6 was produced in the mid 70s.

andys120

I can't find a source that states the GTV6 was produced in the mid 70s.

You are correct, the basic Alfetta design goes back to 1974 but the GTV6 didn't come along until 1980 or '81. The GTV (for Veloce) with the 2.0 I-4 came out in '74.

andys120

lemko

1971 or 1972 Oldsmobile Cutlass 442?

andys120

Yep, it's a '71.

lemko

Are there any Olds experts out there that can tell the difference between a 1971 and a 1972 model 442? They look extremely close.

fezo

Nicer than the '58 Impala isn't saying much IMO, the '58 Chevy was a mess compared to the Tri-Chevies.

I was thinking exactly the same thing!

1958 wasn't a great year for cars with a few excpetions.

berri

Yeah, probably the only successful effort in 58 was the squarebird.

explorerx4

I'll bet the Buick parked next to it is pretty loud. Looks like the exhaust pipes are disconnected from the exhaust manifolds.

explorerx4

Is that one of your pictures or did you just find it on the net?

andys120

What a beautifully clear shot, Make and year please on the American-made in the foreground and make-model on the two imports.

berri

Here are my guesses - 62 Olds, 56 Pontiac, 60 T-Bird, 59 DeSoto, 58 Chevy wagon. 56 Chevy, 54 Olds, late 50's or early 60's VW Beetle and Volvo and an early 60's Falcon. Also, maybe a 57 Plymouth parked by the building.

fezo

Nice catch on the Plymouth! I can't tell if it's a 57 or 58 from the picture but would have missed it altogether.

Yeah, a Volvo 544!

texases

How about those cars driving away on the right: '60-ish Dodge, '62 Ford wagon, early Corvair, and a '59 Impala convertible are some guesses...

andys120

The Oldsmobile convertible is a '56, a '54 was narrower and taller and had a big horizontal bar in the grille. The narrow front window on the Beetle indicates that it is pre-1960. The Ford Falcon is a '61, the rounded grille is the giveaway.

Fezo is right about the Volvo, it's my favorite Volvo, the 544, a pretty decent racing sedan in the day.

Your others are correct as far as I know (I'm not real good with plymouths of that vintage).

andys120

mac24

Is that a Skoda badge on the front?

andys120

If you don't know, I'm not sayin' :P