Saturn Outlook, GMC Acadia and Buick Enclave

kcorey

Try www.buick.com/enclave. Then go to vehicle colors.

allmet33

LOL Good one!

nvbanker

My my, how tolerant of you!

murphydog

NV - nice post. I too am a bit tired of the cell phone screamers around here. Enough all ready!

Thanks for putting a smile on my face. :shades:

celica8

enclaveforum.net has great pictures of Enclaves in all colors

driver166

Thank you for the information.

jjnnjohns

Has anyone installed the mud guards available at the dealer?
Do you have pictures?

aggie10

My wife and I have three boys, so we need some extra room, but the Suburban kills us with gas (and just being a more expensive car...payment, etc...). We need enough space to where we can travel comfortably with suitcases. Occasionally, the kids might have friends in the 3rd row, so we want to make sure it's not real cramped. Sorry about the life story, but does anyone have any suggestions? Thanks a lot.

hardhawk

You need a van if you want the best combination of space and mileage.

62vetteefp

We have the Acadia and really like it. Do you keep the 3 boys in the 2nd row? If so lots of room in back for suitcases.

If not, the 3rd row splits and there still would be probably enough room for luggage. The minivan comment kinda makes me wonder though. The last minivan I had did not have a whole lotta room behind the 3rd row. Maybe a bit more than the Acadia but not enough to make a difference. Suggest you go compare your favorite minivan and see.

As far as crampness it is pretty good. I think though that 3 in the 3rd row is a bit tight for anyone excelt the smallest kids.

bobw3

I would put those two cars up against ANYTHING from Japan, Korea or Germany with similar miles and will bet that the GMs will win out in reliability every time!

If more folks had experiences like yours, then GM wouldn't be in the shape it's in.

bobw3

The last minivan I had did not have a whole lotta room behind the 3rd row

I'm assuming you didn't have an Odyssey or Sienna?

chuckhoy

My guess would be a short wheelbase caravan. Almost no room at all behind the 3rd row. But, it is smaller and smaller appeals to some people.

stever

Yep, my '89 SWB Voyager was a 5 seater. Liked the big empty so much I threw away one bench in my '99 Quest and made it a 5 seater.

62vetteefp

Correct, I had the Montana which had about 30 cu ft. The Ody has about 38. The lamdas have 20. But like I said not a lot of difference when you really have a family trip load. Behind the 3rtd row does not make it in any of them. So if she does travel with 3 kids and wants to use the 3rd row she may be able to make it in any of them if they split the 3rd row. All I know in my family of 2 kids I have to have the 3rd row folded to fit all our stuff. that is why the Suburban may be there only choice.

jay_24

Keep in mind most vans won't seat 3 in the second row. The Sienna has one that does and one that doesn't. The Odyssey has a silly little jump seat to make 3 across. I think all others are only 2 seats in the second row, so the third row MUST be partially used all the time. In our 98 Voyager, 3 in the third row was impossible. 2 was the max.

Want AWD and seat 8? Acadia or Outlook become your only choices. The Sienna is the only AWD van and its only available in the 7 seater version.

saturn_comm

In an 8-passenger Outlook, you can get 5 people in the first two rows and fold the third row flat -- not tumbled forward like the Suburban's third row. I suspect the usable storage space is quite similar between the Outlook and Suburban in this situation. It's worth a trip to a Saturn retailer.

allmet33

If you want to increase the cubic footage a tad bit, you can remove the covered storage unit (which is deeper than you think). But from the sounds of things...still wouldn't provide you with the kind of space you're looking for.

dtroiter

my 2nd row split bench reclines independently (pull the recline on the side and push it back)... unsure about the captain chairs.

allmet33

How far back does it recline? The captain's chairs have a slight recline to them, but I'm talkin about being able to lay back in them like you can in the front seats.

canuck17

Hopefully GM has finally produced a decent reliable set of vehicles in the Outlook, Enclave and Acadia to replace the disastrous minivans (Montana, Venture etc.) and the Envoy, Rainer and GMC Jimmy etc. Needless to say the Equinox, Torrent and Rendevoux certainly are nothing to write home about also for quality, reliability and features. GM and other domestic car makers need to build good reliable vehicles and not rely on employee pricing and 0% financing to move their junk. Everyone benefits from a wide selection (domestic and imports) of ggod vehicles.

Unfortunately, it seems a lot of other people have had very bad experiences with these type of GM products as I have had with my 2000 Montana van. No wonder GM has dropped to Number 2 in vehicle sales and its bonds are junk bond status. J.D Power has given Buick high marks for overall quality of its products for the past three years and maybe this will extend to the Enclave.

As for the engines's of these Lambda vehicles (Acadia, Outlook and Enclave)IMO due to their size and weight they need a good V8. A 275 HP engine for a vehicle 202 inches wide, over 79 inches wide and over 5,000lbs. definitely needs a V8. A right sized V8 might even improve on the 16 MPG average the 275 V6 provides. Gasoline prices at close to $3 gallon in the U.S. and higher in Canada (with taxes)makes this a big issue IMO.

ET

allmet33

Honestly, I find my Outlook to be quite capable. What I find confusing is that there were a lot of V-8's that were producing the same type of power for the full sized trucks. It wasn't until you hit the Northstar (GM) that you got up to 300 hp and nobody was complaining about the Vortec when it was only producing 270-ish hp.

I truly don't think a V-8 will produce any better numbers in the FE department to be honest. This, of course is just IMO.

dmathews3

Some people won't be happy unless they have the biggest and baddest V8 they can get. I have a brother who had a V8 04 Trailblazer that wouldn't have bought the V6 for anything and tried his darndest to talk me out of buying mine. After we lined them up and I beat him in a 1/4 mile by not quite a half car length did he start to think different.

donl1

I just think the extra torque of a V-8 would keep the tramsmission in high gear where it belongs. The slightest incline or headwind will have the Acadia drop down to 5th and God knows how long it'll stay there. This thing burns more gas than my last car with a hemi in it. It's been a long time since I got 20 mpg out of a tank of gas. And after 10K I don't expect it'll get any better.

lwolf99

Hello. Looking for a little help...

I have an Exclave CXL AWD that I purchased in late June. It has the Towing package, with the trailer hitch and the heavy-duty trailer towing provision (I got this option for my bike rack, not because I do any heavy towing).

Here's my issue.... we live towards the top of a fairly steep hill - about 1/2 mile long. As I climb the hill, my RPMs get up to slightly over 5,000 before the transmission finally downshifts, and then RPMs then go down to about 3,000 or 3,500.

I have taken this road home every day for the past several years. My old 2001 Chrysler Town & Country Limited minivan did not do this. I do not know very much about cars or transmissions, but it just "feels" wrong. The engine really seems to be working hard at 5,000 RPM.

Any ideas/comments if 5,000 RPM is okay, or if it is a problem? Any ideas/comments on how to corret this issue? I heard something abotu an upcoming flash update for the transmission for Acadia.

Last note... Otherwise, I really love my Enclave.

nvbanker

That's usually the sign of an underpowered car, I'm afraid... Sorry to hear this. Does the transmission have a positive lock for the interim gears? IOW, if you put it in 3rd, will it stay in third, or downshift to 2nd anyway?

nxs138

If you take a look at other Acadia forums, you will find that there is a reflash that just came out, so your Enclave is likely not updated (since you bought it in June). The reflash addresses the "unwillingness" of the car to downshift easily.

So the reflash might help you out, although if your car is already at 5000 rpm, downshifting wouldn't really make rpm go down (it would make them go up, since it would go into a lower gear, right?)

As another poster noted, the car might be right on the edge of enough power for its weight...heck, the car will shift from 6th to 5th when there are gusts of wind!

allmet33

Actually...you could be wrong in your thinking. The 6th gear in the Lambdas is merely an "overdrive" gear. You don't have to have a V-8 to get more torque, more torque can be generated in a V-6. In order to apply that torque to the wheels, the gearing has to be there.

Same concept in all those cars that had 4 spd auto trannies with O/D. Of course, there was almost always a little button on the shifter that would allow you to lock the O/D out so you could avoid the constant downshift when the car needed more pull on inclines and such.

I'm not saying the gearing on the Lambdas is the most efficient, but that is where I think the problem lies.

lwolf99

Any idea of the reflash for the GMC Acadia directly applies to the Buick Enclave? Or do I have to wait for an Enclave version for the reflash ?

nxs138

I think the reflash applies across all the Lambdas. The latest is Bulletin No 07217 Transmission Software and Calibration update, dated Aug. 24.

I'd check out enclaveforum.net for more info, esp. the tech section.

zman3

Hey, where did you get that bulletin number?? Do you know if that is indeed the latest and greatest reflash? The timing would be about right. Many of us have been waiting for it but the rumor was that it was not going to be available until later this week. I have not seen any mention of that specific bulletin yet on the acadia or enclave forum.

Thanks.

nxs138

Got it from the enclave forum. And since the internet is always right, then the bulletin number must be correct

Got it from here. Look for Reply #24.

bcb1

We were set to order a 2008 Acadia for my wife, since her family has quite a few retired GM employees, we'd get the GMS pricing also.

That is....until we drove one last night. I'd have to say, after reading all of the great articles about it, I was excited. Driving it was a bit of a letdown. It drove very, very smoothly. But the inside reminded us both of a minivan, as did the step-in height. We're used to driving SUV's - a Yukon for me, Toyota FJ for my wife, so the ride height was a disappointment.

The passenger side front seat also had the headrest that seemed to push your head forward a bit - very uncomfortable. We didn't notice it at all on the driver side, just the passenger side. Perhaps it was adjustable and we didn't know how to fix it...but I'll be darned if I could figure it out.

And the transmission was strange. It was very smooth and powerful at low speeds around town. But in the 30-40 mph range, it hesitated like it didn't know whether to downshift or not.

Before we drove an Acadia, we were agonizing between the Acadia, the 4Runner, and Sequoia. After driving one, I think we're definitely going with the 4Runner or Sequoia now.

allmet33

But why would you expect a similar ride height compared to a Yukon or an FJ, when the Acadia is clearly neither?

From the sounds of it, you wanted an SUV all along. Why fool yourself into thinking crossover???

Good luck with your 4Runner or Sequoia, you certainly won't get the room you would with the Acadia/Outlook/Enclave.

bcb1

Here's the situation.....

My wife likes her FJ, but hates the back seat access. To put it mildly, it sucks. Even with a small bag of groceries, you have to open the rear door to get it in the back seat. And getting teenagers in & out of the back? Terrible. The FJ is cool looking and we're impressed with Toyota overall, but it's not the vehicle for us.

So after reading the reviews and looking at the Acadia on the website, I had convinced myself that it would be a good replacement for her FJ...not so. She kept saying the whole time we were driving it that it reminded her of a minivan, and she's just not a minivan person.

Different strokes for different folks, as they say. I think the Sequoia is way too big for her, so that pretty much leaves the 4Runner as the default choice now.

allmet33

Yeah...that back seat access is terrible. We test drove one too. It's a cool truck for someone that's single or maybe a childless couple that's active.

Has your wife sat in a minivan lately? I had the displeasure of driving a Town & Country for 23 hours from DC to Dallas a few months ago. I can tell you that the interior of my Outlook doesn't bring back memories of that minivan at all. I mean...captains chairs or a bench seat in the back can only be done so many ways.

The Lambdas are designed to give you the best of a minivan and the best of an SUV. Personally, I think they hit the nail on the head.

If you're not looking for a lot of room, then yeah...the 4Runner could be it, why not a Grand Cherokee?

nastacio

I saw one in carbon-black on the lot, it looked the best of all colors I have seen so far. It is a $95 dollar option.

driver166

I agree ordered one last saturday.

nastacio

The initial JD Power numbers for the Saturn Outlook were not very good and the Enclave is not only built in the same assembly line but also shares most of the switchgear and all of the powertrain/suspension bits. The Enclave will fare better though, given its better sound insulation and a few more upscale furnishings.

I would agree that a V8 with more torque would improve numbers but GM pushrods cannot produce the refined sounds people learned to expect in this segment. The Northstars would be too expensive, I think.

zman3

I don't know what the JD Powers numbers say but we have had our Enclave for 4 months and have not had it into the dealership once yet. We are quite happy with it.

allmet33

We've had our Outlook going on 3 months and have had no problems with it either. Don't have any issues with engine noise or any other noises for that matter.

jay_24

I would agree that a V8 with more torque would improve numbers but GM pushrods cannot produce the refined sounds people learned to expect in this segment.

:confuse:
Honda Pilots, Toyota Highlanders, Mazda CX9, Hyundai Veracruz... the list goes on. None offer a V8. How can you compare the "refined sound of this segment"? :confuse:

allmet33

The comparison is coming from the larger offerings such as the Yukon, Envoy, Tahoe, Suburban...

jay_24

The 4 you just listed have the same engine. And happen to be the top sellers for large v8 SUVs by a fairly large margin.

allmet33

Yes, I know...however, not everyone owns just one of them. So you have various folks posting and when they make the comparison...that is what it is based on.

They should be the top sellers, considering how many are offered with that powerplant compared to others out there.

Everyone keeps saying that the Lambdas need a V-8 and I totally disagree. I think a V-6 can be a perfect match, they just need to do some tweaking.

nastacio

None offer a V8. How can you compare the "refined sound of this segment"?

It is a simple point really, Acadia/Enclave/Outlook could benefit from a V8, but GM doesn't have one that at the same time makes the "refined sounds" taken as a norm in this segment and is cheap enough to keep the lambdas competitive in price.

I don't think all lambdas are underpowered (Enclave CXL AWD may be,) but even with torque peaking low at 3200 rpm, the GM V6 cannot move 4700 lbs at the same pace as a Honda/Toyota/Ford V6 can propel a Pilot/Highlander/CX-9.

I would disagree that all that they need is some tweaking. If GM gets more aggressive on the gear shifting algorithm, mpg and sales will suffer. In this segment, people may be forgiving of an extra second from 0 to 60, but not of a 14/20 mpg rating.

chuckhoy

Call me crazy, but I don't see a whole lot of people drag-racing their Outlooks/Enclaves/Acadias/CX9s/Pilots. Well maybe against that hoser in the Odyssey ads who enjoys racing his minivan around. People buy this vehicle to haul the family around and pick up things from Home Depot. The people who are insecure enough to only want a V-8 will get a Suburban anyway.

nastacio

Call me crazy, but I don't see a whole lot of people drag-racing their Outlooks/Enclaves/Acadias/CX9s/Pilots. Well maybe against that hoser in the Odyssey ads who enjoys racing his minivan around.

Well there was a poster who wanted to drag-race an FS against an Enclave a few weeks ago, but that is not the point :-)

A good 0-to-60 at full throttle means you will not have to red-line the engine from 0-to-30 when fully loaded or feel like you are going bankrupt on fuel bills if you need to floor the vehicle for whatever reason (during passing or clearing a yellow light after you are past the point of safe braking.)

When I pull out of idle in our Murano (240hp mated to a CVT,) it will reach 60mph in under 10 seconds without ever exceeding 3000 rpm. It feels relaxed, not V8 manly.

Maybe it is just me, but whenever the tach needle crosses 4500 rpm I feel uncomfortable, thinking of all the gas swirling down the tank, all the while with the passengers' heads bobbing back and forth during the inevitable weight-transfers caused by full-throttle gear shifts.

As for insecure people only wanting a V8, they can also get the Highlander V6, which will beat most of the GM-V8 powered SUV (Escalade 400hp excluded) in the performance and gas mileage department.

allmet33

Personally, I don't have an issue with the gearing of my Outlook. I mean...it's not a dragster, so it's not going to launch off the line as such, nor do I expect it to. However, when there is a need to get on down the road, trust me when I say...the Outlook XR AWD is VERY capable.

allmet33

A good 0-to-60 at full throttle means you will not have to red-line the engine from 0-to-30 when fully loaded or feel like you are going bankrupt on fuel bills if you need to floor the vehicle for whatever reason (during passing or clearing a yellow light after you are past the point of safe braking.)

There isn't a V-8 on the market that won't make you feel it in the pockets when you floor it for any reason!!! You can almost WATCH the fuel gauge go down when you do that!!!

You can get a Highlander for it's performance, but I'll stick with the rock solid feel of my Outlook...especially on a windy day on the highway!!!