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Comments
None of the dealers have any idea what they will get on the next allocation ( every 15 days ). They can take an order and put in a preference for what the customer wants but there is no guarantee. It's been like this for 3+ years on the Prius.
Go to the beginning of the Hybrid Camry Ordering Process board to see what others are doing.
If it's like most places then they offer the first vehicle to the first person on the list and that buyer has the option to take it or decline it and stay on top. If he declines then they move down the list. It's the only fair way to do it.
Two a month is typical for many average-sized stores.
Back in 2000 we did partially 'injure' a battery on our first demo Gen1 - by not driving it for 3 months. Some of the segments went bad so Toyota chastized us for being dumb and replaced it at their cost. Dealer abuse of the Prius.
If it's driven regularly then the battery should last the life of the vehicle ( Toyota's words ).
Not exactly correct. In my 75 mi commute each day ( 85% Hwy and 15% city )I do get precisely the EPA numbers. Knowing what I know now about driving the HSD vehicles, if drove my old commute into NYC from No. Jersey I am sure that I'd be well in excess of the EPA 'City'. The EPA values are very specific based on relatively unrealistic criteria for the general population. They know this and everyone else knows this. However if you do have the opportunity to drive according to the EPA testing criteria then you will get the same values. They are not made up they are real results from real physical tests.
A lot of the control though is in the hands ( brain/feet? ) of the driver. If you like this vehicle so much that you ride the accelerator all the time then there is no way to get the EPA numbers. But you will still do better than you will driving any similar vehicle in similar fashion.
Sure... maybe with a fully charged battery on a Dyno meter gets it gets 40 mpg, but in real world drive city - country - rural driving ( 0 to 40 mph), with no highway... if all it gets is 26 - 28 mpg then one might be better off with the basic Ce/Le 4 cyl... or maybe the Corolla.
... or maybe they should change the way they achieve estimates.
Don't get me wrong... I still think the Camry is a great car for those who need one now, the ride is great and it has that "look" but...
Has anyone been able to achieve the 40 mpg with city driving before I throw down $30,000 for something that does not get better gas mileage the my nine year old Corolla?
I will wager that I can take any undamaged TCH and obtain 40+ mpg under the right conditions. Whether they meet your criteria for city driving is definitely a point to consider. It may very well be that a CE/LE ICE or another Corolla is better and less costly choice overall. As in all vehicle purchases it's the vehicle itself which should make you choose it, not some artificial idea of saving money to justify the higher cost.
If you like the style, power, amenities, feel, comfort, reduced environmental imprint and safety features then go for it. BTW it might save you some money on fuel but that should be item eight or lower on your list of reasons to buy.
I have to go by what the EPA rates the GS450h at. They say it has an 8 cu foot trunk. Edmunds claims 7.5 cu feet. Lexus exaggerates and probably forgot they put batteries in the trunk. Unless you have some documentation that says the government screwed up.
PS
EPA claims the trunk on the TCH is 11 cu ft and the non-hybrid Camry is 15 cu ft.
Ditto
I see several good posts on this comment. Unfortunately, I believe every city is a little bit different. Although I live in hilly WV, the town where I live is flat. I can circle the town, sit at stop lights and do stop and go all I want without the engine even kicking on. My reading was 99.9mpg after my fill up in town. However when I drive home and go up my steep hill the "average" drops significantly, depending upon how many miles I already have on the tank that affects the overall average. If I lived in Pittsburgh on one of the hilly streets, I'd say I would indeed have a hard time maintaining a 40mpg city average. Then again I'd imaging I'd have a hard time maintaining a 22 mpg average (EPA City?) in the V6 as well. It's all relative.
If you do a majority of city driving in a hilly area, or if you know yourself well enough to know that you want to be in the left lane at redlights and jump out in front of everyone else to beat the next light, then you may be better off with a Corolla. If you can get 32 with a Corolla, then realistically going to a 35 mpg average on a Camry won't save you a significant amount of gas. Certainly you can save $10,000 by buying the Corolla and that will buy you all the gas you need for quite a while, certainly it will pay the "difference" for a lifetime.
For me though the Corolla was not an option as I don't use this TCH as a commuter, it's my "family car" and we wanted something bigger and a little more comfortable.
If I commuted mostly in traffic and wanted a car that eventually would be a "beater" then I would indeed consider the Corolla (my daughter has one) or even the Yaris.
Actually you should do better than the EPA figures because they take their measured figure and then reduce it by, I think, 10%.
Assuming 15,000 miles per year and $3.00 gas, each of the improvements below in average fuel consumption yields a savings of 96 gallons per year ($288/yr or $24/mo).
12 to 13
14 to 15.37
16 to 17.82
18 to 20.35
22 to 25.6
25 to 29.75
28 to 34.1
30 to 37.1
32 to 40.2
35 to 45.1
Going from 36 mpg to 38 mpg yields a savings of only 22 gallons per year. That same 2 mpg increase on a vehicle getting 12 mpg would save you 192 gallons
This shows that the overall effect of trying to get an extra 2 mpg from an already high milage vehicle is not an economical need,but rather a personal satisfaction.
My wife recently was getting 36mpg on the Interstate driving 80 mph and I could have probably gotten it up to at least 37.5 by slowing down(we live in the hills). That would have saved about a quart of gasoline. It's satisfying to achieve the numbers,but statistically not really that important UNLESS you're driving the F150 that gets 12 mpg. I know that when I go to the beach this summer and have a 10 hour drive, I will totally ignore trying to save the extra gallon that driving 70 would get me. I can probably knock off 2 hours driving time by not worrying about coasting down hills, not passing on a grade, not pulling out at the red light to get in front of the truck I've been following, etc...
I don't commute with my TCH but if I drove it every day I would indeed attempt to keep it in the mid to upper 30's but I would not try to squeek out that extra 1 mpg if it meant I had to add 10 minutes to my commute.
I've filled up twice so far and am averaging 38+ (actual). My current tank shows 37+(trip computer)with the interstate driving on this tank.
i'll probably lurk around the non-hybrid-camry forums to get an idea for the best empirical 80mph mpg for the manual-trans/small-engine camry model. of course, that is comparing 2006 with 2007 so it's not as apples-to-apples as i'd like. but there aren't any 2007 camry nonhybrids on the road yet, are there?
On my previous two 4c AT Camry's I was averaging about 32 mpg over 35000-40000 miles annually at an average speed of about 60 mph. At 80 mph that value would likely be 26-28 mpg due to drag and extra fuel usage.
I would think the 07 4c manual would be able to hit the 33+ mark on pure interstate driving; but not at 80 mph and any hills. I've never gotten close to EPA on any of my past vehicles. Knowing how I usually hit the EPA marks I would guess I would average overall 24.5 with the V6 and 26 with the 4c with both in automatic. That compares with a 38 overall I'm getting with the TCH
Some cities have a lot of traffic that actually moves well, it's just that you have to stop every block and pull out. Some others like leaving and entering Pittsburgh, have a lot of congestion that moves along very slowly at 5 to 10 mph but doesn't have that many stop lights and some like NYC you just sit.
If you have a lot of flat ground with slow speeds, or if your commute, during the busy part, is mostly down hill (like Pittsburg in the morning), or if you sit in traffic a lot, then having that engine shut off has to go a long ways towards good consumption values
Hopefully since I was #3 or 4 on the list, I will be able to purchase that one. It was a magnetic gray TCH with leather, Nav, Moonroof etc. and the listed MSRP on the inventory was $30,500.. I'm keeping my fingers crossed that it may become mine!..
Just to highlight the above comment, I'd wager that I could get almost double the "city mileage" driving in a place like Phoenix over driving in San Francisco. Phoenix is like a hybrid owner's dream. Flat, wide, smooth streets and a mile between stop lights. Steady 35-45 mph is the sweet spot for hybrid mileage. Also, hybrids will do best in warm weather since the engine will warm up faster (using less gas in the process), and the battery capacity is lower when cold.
Thanks
:shades:
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Anyone try the new LG LX350 with the Prius?
I have an LG LX350 and it works well for the headset/handsfree, but you can't transfer the phone book.
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Now, assuming the Prius bluetooth is the same as the TCH, I'm golden.. I really don't care about the phone book. Sounds like it will work however..
This wait is going to drive me insane, as I have zero patience when it comes to buying stuff.
I am curious about how you get the dealer to show you this type of info? Did they offer to show you, or have you been calling/talking to them frequently for status updates?
Also, does anyone know how many TCH's some of the higher volume dealers get per month?
A good sized store will likely get 4-6/month.
They showed me the inventory book which they have right out in the open which shows all cars either in stock or which will be delivered shortly. The book shows each car, the VIN, the options, color and MSRP. I think this dealer is exceptional and time will prove this out, but so far I am impressed with the way they have handled my transaction. Of course, I am going crazy too waiting for this car.. I can't remember ever being this way any other time in my life except for the first time I bought a brand new car and it was ordered. The year...1968 !.. The car a Chevy Impala and the cost (get this) $3,500 OTD
I know I was #3 or 4 on the list and at least one has been sold and there are about three others on the inventory list. The magnetic grey fully loaded model is quite a ways down so hopefully by the time it arrives, I will have advanced to next in line. And no you can't have mine!
that is where you screw in the eye bolt when they are transported over seas. I would get another sales person as he made up his answer rather than finding the true answer to your question
I don't like their super high pressure sales, and I feel that they screwed me on a previous deal (a lease). I am probably partly to blame, but I was young and naive.
As much as I want this vehicle, I would rather wait a bit and not use them...
I would love to publicize the name of this dealer (and see if anyone else has any similar complaints), but I assume that this is discouraged here...
This car can achieve 33mpg easily if I only drive this car at 65 mph on the highway. Of course, I have to change my driving style during the start at traffic lights and stop sign :P .
07 Camry is not rare any more. I live at Southern CA :shades: and I see 3-5 different 07 Camry's every day during my 80 miles commute
At least they are all the same, you just choose the color you want.
I'm starting to lean more toward an XLE 4 cylinder with no options, so I can have a normal sized trunk, rear sunshade, reclining rear seats and the other standard things the Hybrid loses. Other than the Hybrid engine, the keyless push start is the only thing I think I'd miss on the XLE.
I can get an XLE 4 cylinder discounted well below MSRP and that will more than pay for any additional fuel used over the 3 or 4 years I'd likely keep the car.
If the Camry Hybrid qualified for the HOV lane, I would be more tempted and I can't stand the looks of the Prius. The Civic Hybrid is too slow.
Maybe the next generation hybrids that are supposed to get more like 80MPG+ are worth waiting for.
radio, but don't think either would impact your mileage. the brochure states that the requiremnets for the gas version to get sat applies to the Hybrid version and in the footnote it says reuires reciever antenna hookup
Hummm. Leave it to Toyota to be considerate enought to leave a hole in the bumper of 40,000 TCh's in case 1 or 2 people want a block heater.
Some people live in very cold areas and have a habit of using block heaters.
Obviously, they are not that incredibly considerate or they would offer a wide variety of possible option packages in all regions.
personally i think hybrids should be prohibited from the carpool lanes and restricted to stop-and-go traffic where they will get better mpg!
Don't put the Prius and Camry Hybrid's abilities to meet EPA figures in the same category. The Prius is notorious for being far off EPA #s in the real-world (unless you drive ultra-conservatively). The Camry Hybrid does not suffer from that. It's easy to get the EPA #s in the Camry.
weird, nonsensical position.
why should a midsized vehicle that has V6 power and the fuel economy of a Corolla be restricted to stop and go traffic? faster than an accord i4 or it's sibling i4 or sonata i4 and you would restrict it to stop and go traffic?
HUH?
your logic cap is missing today.
True...This maybe just around the corner but... the only problem is that it might be the size of the Yaris coupe.
(I guess this is what the American driving public can look forward to driving within the next five - ten years.)
Gampa
With China and India booming they will absorb all the natural resources ( steel, aluminum, gas, oil, engineering knowhow ) into their redhot economies even at inflated prices. The developed world will just have to tag along and pay whatever the prices determined by the two developing giants.
If China/India bid up the price of oil to $125-150 a barrel then that's what we will pay also. To absorb this doubling in fuel prices the developed world will just have to be twice as efficient or become relatively poorer.
It's our choice.
i'm not in california any more, but i am curious why TCH would not be eligible for carpool lane while HCH/prius are eligible. i still don't get it.