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Comments
1. You save between C$3,000-$4,000, even with the duty, PST, GST, you pay when you import into Canada
2. You can get the awesome Nav system. Paid just under CAD$40,000 after everything, including the $2000 Ontario tax credit for hybrids, for a loaded car with nav, leather, moonroof, heated seats. You basically get the Nav at the same price as a car bought in Canada with no Nav.
3. More flexible interior colour choices: i.e., you can get Blue Ribbon with Bisque inside, which is not avail in Canada.
4. Don't have to wait as long. If you call around, you can get a car within 1 week. In Canada, they haven't even arrived yet. You're looking at a 1-3 month wait in Canada.
5. More useable gas consumption gauge: in Canada, the instant fuel econ gauge ranges from 10 L/100 to 30, which translates into 25 mpg to 8 mpg. In the US model, it ranges from 20 mpg to 60 mpg. Obviously, the Canadian gauge is not very useful, because most of your driving will be at most 25 mpg. This means that the needle will be between 0 and 10 L/100, the first gradation on the scale on the Canadian model. This is stupid!! On the US version, you will use most of the scale. It's useless the way they did it for Canada.
6. You get the tire pressure monitoring system as standard in the US. It's not even avail in Canada.
7. The cabin air filter lasts twice as long for some reason. Read this in the owner's manual.
If you call around, there are dealers that will sell to you if you are Canadian. You just need to call a few.
Good luck!
Further, if they continue to develop flex-fuel/hybrid or fuel-cell/hybrid then we will be on the right track.
More states need to adopt legislation that creates tax advantages for purchasing this new technology, which in-turn will eventually lessen our dependence on foreign oil.
Wouldn't it be cool to have a TCH that could also function on flex-fuel 85% ethanol?
"Check the manual - the car must be started at least every 2 weeks for at least 30 minutes"
anybody know if this is the same for the Camry Hybrid?
"
Here is a snippet from Toyota.
By the way...anyone know of a way to view these forums by message subject thread instead of in the one big cluster-f it works now? It would be nice to view a thread by subject without seeing all of the "noise" around it.
Actually, it seems that is the way these forums are supposed to work...by creating clear topics from the top level. Instead, the moderators only have like 5 or 6 top level threads, and within each thread there are subheadings...this is pretty messy and annoying...anyone know a better way?
Anyway...complained more than I meant to...here's the info I promised:
Technical Service BULLETIN
March 31, 2006
Before Delivery (to customer) ONLY fully charge auxiliary battery in slow charge (5 amperes max.).Quick charge is prohibited. (Deliver the vehicle to the customer after it is fully charged.)
To Store for 30 Days or More
Disconnect the negative (–) terminal of the 12–volt auxiliary battery in the luggage compartment to prevent the SOC of the auxiliary battery from decreasing during storage due to parasitic current.
Just After Unloading & Every 2 Months
Keep the Hybrid System ON for 30 minutes (in order to charge the HV battery and the auxiliary battery).
When the CA legislature came up with this HOV nonsense they set a minimum combined 45 MPG. That has eliminated all buy the Prius, HCH and Insight. Each state has their own way of doing things. I would imagine CA has come close to their cap of 75,000 HOV hybrid exemptions. Why would anyone want in the HOV lanes anyway. They were over crowded before the Hybrid exemption came along. At least the one I used up the coast, about 4 years ago.
I guess if you want to get 25 MPG instead of 36 MPG. The across the board loss in FE is between 25-30% with E85. Toyota is balking at E85. It is not conducive to long life engines. Ethanol is very corrosive. So far Toyota has only given lip service to the E85 gang in Washington DC.
Please explain your usage of the word nonsense. As a rule, in the Bay Area and Silicon Valley, the HOV lanes move much faster than the others. And why shouldn't carpooling be encouraged? Furthermore, if I'm driving alone in my Insight and getting 60+ mpg, I'm being more fuel efficient than 2 people in a car which gets less than 30 mpg. So it makes a lot of sense to allow extrememly fuel-efficient vehicles in the HOV lanes, as well.
Carpooling is good. Solo drivers in any vehicle is corrupting the original intent of the High Occupancy Vehicle lanes. Hybrids in the HOV lane encourages solo drivers rather than carpooling. I would be willing to bet that at least half the hybrid sales in CA are to get the HOV exemption. You may consider it a good thing as you are a user. Many do not share your enthusiasm.
I will unload my current Prius for such a Prius/Camry like this in 5 yrs or so.
Does the "HOV" name misstate the intended purpose?
Is the purpose of the lane to move the most people at one time 'High Occupancy...' or to reduce the numbers of less efficient vehicles on the road by promoting the sharing of old tech gassers in order to reduce smog and emissions or simply to reduce smog/emissions and to improve the quality of air by promoting the development of cleaner more efficient vehicles?
Pick an option an argue.
Yes we have another thread that covers this subject in depth. I will not clutter this fine TCH discussion any further. I am happy to see that the TCH is getting such good mileage.
stevedebi, "Hybrids and HOV Lanes" #353, 11 May 2006 12:07 pm
I don't think so, if the 12v is dead I think the vehicle is also dead. The HSD is not "just like any other car". The engine computer is programmed to protect the electrical system. It also won't run without the traction battery above 20%.
I suspect the owners manual says to tow it.
Anyone out there that can check the manual?
"If the vehicle is parked for a long time, the hybrid battery will discharge gradually. To keep the hybrid battery in good condition, drive the vehicle at least once every several months for at least 30 minutes or 10 miles. If the hybrid battery becomes fully discharged and the vehicle will not start even with a jump start to the 12 volt battery, contact your Toyota dealership."
Pages 306-307 have jump starting procedures that look fairly typical to me, but they are way too long to post here.
Jump starting the 12v is no different from any other vehicle except that the battery is located in the right rear of the trunk.
It's exciting to think that hybrid technology is still in its infant stages.
With today's pace of technological innovation, I can easily imagine that the 2017 Camry Hybrid will have 220 hp combined horsepower and get 80 mpg. Smaller, more powerful batteries is key.
Overall, I was favorably impressed with the look, etc. The trunk is smallish, but doesn't seem that bad.
As for the price, I paid $27,500 for the base model with leather, heated mirrors and the spoiler. This sure beats my Ford Expedition which gets 12 MPG city.
I would bet against this. Hybrid technology has been around for around 10 years already and, though the technology itself has improved, not much has improved with regard to their overall mpg....I just don't see the MPG of the Camry doubling in the next 10 years. IMO - Some other technology will have to come along to achieve a real world 80 mpg in a car the size of the Camry.
Cell phone batteries certainly improved a lot over the last 10 years.
But, without plugging in, it's hard to imagine the Camry hybrid getting 80 mpg and 220 HP in ten years. Your bet isn't a bad one.
Scroll down to the bottom..
http://www.arb.ca.gov/msprog/carpool/carpool.htm
Now there is a gross... misstatement.
All other hyrbid drivers? Prius and HCH also?
All TCH drivers? This is certainly not the case from reports here.
Road & Track got 32 mpg in rush hour, 46 mpg on the highway, and 37 mpg combined.
Nowhere near the 20s !
Ideally, if a person had a 50 mile commute each day they would like to test drive that exact route. Only then can they compare the car with what the EPA says and how that compares with their current car's ability to match the EPA ratings for their current car.
I typically have never averaged much higher on overall driving than the low (city) number, even though I drive mostly interstate miles and longer trips (I drive too fast, heavy foot). However I am never getting less than 36 mpg (on 4 fillups)and that is with my wife driving half the mies and refusing to "play the milage game" like a lot of us are doing to see just what this thing will do.
Your ID would indicate you have a TCH? What is your experience so far?
Gampa
1) Your mileage is linked to the time the engine is running, not just the miles covered with the gas engine. This is why the engine shuts off whenever possible. Therefore, minimize the running of the engine.
a) When approaching a red light or slowing traffic release the gas pedal ASAP and allow the engine to shut-off. Coast to a stop by pressing the brake gently allowing the generator to do most of the braking. This maximizes the battery charge and reduces brake pad wear. If you need to accelerate, do so by pressing the gas pedal very gently allowing the electric motor to power the car.
Standard driving practice in a gas powered car is to approach a stop rather quickly and then brake fairly hard to come to a stop. This rarely gets you to your destination any faster than coasting and braking sooner.
b) Use the Air Conditioning only when necessary (duh!).
c) Completely remove your foot from the gas pedal and coast whenever possible allowing the engine to shut off. Use this whenever going down a grade or decelerating to a slower speed limit.
2) Use the electric motor whenever possible.
a) Start slowly and run the electric motor as long as possible before the engine kicks in. When the engine is cold, the battery is low, or your using a lot of power (A/C) the motor may run when you think it's not needed. This is normal.
b) When driving under 40 MPH on a flat or declining surface, release the gas pedal and allow the engine to shut off. Gently depress the gas to maintain your speed.
c) Based on my limited TCH use of the cruise control, it appears to be very smart and will shut down the engine whenever possible. You just need to provide additional intelligence and cancel the cruise control when approaching a red light or slowing traffic so you're not forced to brake hard, run your engine longer than necessary and wear down your brake pads.
Using these simple techniques I'm averaging over 41 MPG and I'm not driving like an old lady!
Other hybrid drivers, are there any other tips that I may have forgotten?
Also, just checked inventory for Southeast region. They have added more hybrids as of today. The loaded ones missing from the first alotment are now there but Southeast Toyota has added a plethura of options to the fully loaded car giving some of them MSRP above $35,500. Many have the 18" wheel/Michelen tire option ($1991), spoiler, splash guards, tinted windows, mats, alarm with remote start, Xm tuner, and the overpriced Toyoguard!!
Guess that is why they were not in the system yet
Not available on the Hybrid though.
Excellent synopsis! I just got my first chance to take my new Titanium TCH out for "a spin", and so headed up to the Berkeley Hills for some winding road fun. The TCH exceeded my expectations both for handling and power! Anyway, what I wanted to add to your post was that during descent, I used the "B" setting on the transmission to very good effect. This introduces quite a bit more electric motor drag and required just the occasional extra light touch on the brakes to regulate my speed as I took the downhill curves. I'd kick it back to "D" when I wanted to accelerate, and the hill did the rest. Really kind of fun.....
A quibble
a) Start slowly and run the electric motor as long as possible before the engine kicks in. When the engine is cold, the battery is low, or your using a lot of power (A/C) the motor may run when you think it's not needed. This is normal.
Most in the Prius boards, and I find it so myself, would suggest just accelerating up to 'cruising' speed at the normal pace of traffic and not worry about staying on the e-motor as long as possible at startup. Once cruising do everything you stated.
Other small points:
As you state correctly time in the vehicle is critical. Try to link, plan short trips so as not to allow the engine to cool down completely. Short trips kill FE.
Winter driving will eat into your FE by about 10%
Driving over 70 mph will eat up another 20+% of your FE.
Unless you need to do so it might be more relaxing and better for FE to use quiet back roads for a trip rather than fight the racetracks on the highways.
If you expect these variances you won't be disappointed when they occur.
You do not automatically get to drive in the carpool lane with a hybrid. You have to apply for and purchase special stickers. I think California has already nearly issued all available HOV passes.
The CA Hybrid carpool passes will run out once 70k are issued. They are processing 700 per month. (This is what I thought I heard from the same reps.) The vehicle average MPG must be 55 or greater though. They did mention someone selling his 2004 Prius on Craigs list for a certain figure plus $5,000 for the carpool pass. They did not know whether the seller got his/her price.
The engine shut down is the key and it's incredible just how many opportunities (as described by kevintlutz) you have to shut the engine down.
I can coast through town (driving like a granny) but if needed I can accelerate somewhat to keep up with the traffic and once my momentum is going with the flow I can then lift off the gas and run with electric boost, or at least in the gas mode of about 60 mpg for that short duration. It adds up.
The real trick is to understand how you used to drive and think about what you can do differently. I never take my foot off the gas in a gas vehicle. You have to think about this some and retrain yourself. Once you see the results you're hooked and it becomes second nature.
I can see the 18" wheels looking good on a Camry, but on a FE vehicle like the TCH I can't see why you'd want to add that much rolling mass (and probably a little wider tire). I'd consider aftermarket wheels but not at $2000