GM, Ford, Toyota, Honda...Who will sell you your next car?

bumpy

1700 pounds and a 1-liter turbo from what I've read. We'll see.

explorerx4

i'll have to admit, although the stang is a '91, it just went over 31k on the odo. it is still a treat to drive, not a daily driver.
i enjoy driving my focus, but i think i need something more mid-size for the 4 of us.

baggs32

but i think i need something more mid-size for the 4 of us.

What are you talking about?!!! I just bought an '06 Mustang GT and all four of us fit in there just fine.

snakeweasel

What are you talking about?!!! I just bought an '06 Mustang GT and all four of us fit in there just fine.

Yeah if the two in the back are circus midgets.

rockylee

Yeah if the two in the back are circus midgets.

Now that's funny snake :P

Rocky

louiswei

This could be fun...

Cars that I would buy as my daily driver (not in any order):

Honda Accord V6
Toyota Camry V6
Mazda 6
Toyota 4runner (has to be Limited)
BMW 335i
Lexus IS350
Lexus GS350/GS450h
Infiniti G35
Infiniti M45
Acura TL
Acura TSX
Acura RDX
Maserati Quattroporte (When I win the Lottery)
BMW M3
BMW M5 (When I win the Lottery)
MB SL600 (When I win the Lottery)

Cars that I would buy as my weekend fun car or a secondary car (That's if I could afford it. Again not in any order):

Chevy Corvette Z06
BMW M6
Porsche Cayman S
Porsche 911 S or Turbo
Honda/Acura NSX
Jeep Wrangler
MB SL AMG
MB SLR McLaren
Subaru Impreza WRX
Mitsubishi Lancer Evo

Cars that I like a lot but wouldn't buy it

Any Austin Martin
Any Ferrari
Any Lambo
Ford GT
Jaguar XKR

baggs32

Yeah if the two in the back are circus midgets.

One is 8-months old and the other is just about 3 years old. Both fit perfectly fine in their car seats with the two of us in front. I'm 6 feet tall and my wife is 5'8".

Of course we do use the Explorer for most family outings.

lemko

...yesterday afternoon. I took my Cadillac Seville STS in for scheduled maintenance and the dealer gave me a loaner car. Usually, I get a Cadillac, but they were fresh out of Cadillacs. The dealer has a Toyota/Scion franchise next door, so they gave me a 2006 Corolla to use that afternoon.

It was odd for me driving such a small car but it did seem to have good fit and finish with a decent, if somewhat austere, interior. The car drove rather quietly and smoothly until I'd put the hammer down and then there would be a bit of hesitation and a loud high-revving buzz from the engine. When driven gently, the power seemed adequate.

The radio delivered decent sound and had seperate seek and scan buttons. Cool! This is something I like about my Seville and a nice touch for Toyota. My girlfriend's LaCrosse only has a seek button, but will go into scan mode if you hold it down and listen for the "beep." I didn't know this until somebody on Edmunds told me.

The seat was comfortable, but I felt the lower cushion was a little low. There were a few splashes of "plood" on the instrument panel and doors. What was odd was the car had a cigarette lighter, but no ashtray. Weird. Another strange touch was the passenger's vanity mirror had no cover, but the driver's side did. A very un-Toyota like touch was the sloppy finish of the visors. They were thin, spongy and the edges had very visible "flash" around the edges. I'm surprised this passed the QC people.

To release the key from the ignition switch, one has to push the key in then turn it. I wonder what was the reason for this design? At first, I thought the key was stuck.

All in all, the Corolla wasn't a bad car, but I don't know if I could drive it all the time as I'm used to Cadillacs, Buicks, and other larger cars.

anythngbutgm

Ya, I think you would hate it after a few days. If you are used to bigger cars, the Corolla is gonna feel like a penalty box.

I have the opposite effect when I go from my little 2 seat convertible to my wifes 7 passenger Acura. While I have gotten used to the size and where the four corners lie on the vehicle, it is still intimidating to drive in tight parking lots and especially backing into parking spaces.

bumpy

To release the key from the ignition switch, one has to push the key in then turn it. I wonder what was the reason for this design? At first, I thought the key was stuck.

It's an interlock designed to prevent you from accidentally pulling out the key. Asian cars have had that since at least the late '80s, though some older ones have a little button next to the ignition to release the key.

anythngbutgm

My little Nissan pickup has the button. Now THAT is a pain in the neck!

dino001

My Subaru does not have it.

snakeweasel

I had that in one of my cars once, got into the habit of hitting the button at the same time I turned the key off. It worked real well and become second nature to me so that I never even thought of that lock system. That is until the day my mom borrowed the car and called me in a panic saying she couldn't get the key out of the ignition.

jeffyscott

It's an interlock designed to prevent you from accidentally pulling out the key.

And why exactly would you turn the car off, yet not want to pull the key out :confuse: ? Furthermore, what would be the dire consequences of accidentally pulling the key out, if for some reason you did not want to :confuse:.

I had one of these dumb, annoying buttons on an '86 Horizon and also have it on a '91 Sentra.

nippononly

the on-again, off-again rumors about a future Toyota Supra appear to be on again: R&T this month is speculating that we will have a new Supra in '08. If so, that will be my next car, without a doubt. I have had a few Supras in my time, but never a new one. Their illustrations of the car make it look very good, and they are saying it will basically be a two-door IS350 (with a low-slung coupe shape like previous Supras). It just better have a manual shift option (like the IS350 currently DOESN'T), or I will have to give it a pass. But they would be VERY stupid to introduce a new automatic-only Supra.

Oh please, let these rumors finally be true! :shades:

snakeweasel

R&T this month is speculating that we will have a new Supra in '08. If so, that will be my next car, without a doubt.

You mean you would make your decision on buying a car based only on a illustration? You mean that its final looks, what engine it has, the options, price and how it drives won't have any influence whatever on your decision?

louiswei

Well, as for many other cars, maybe. But for the next Supra, I am pretty sure the enthusiasts will be lining up to pre-order their Supra even WITHOUT any official information given.

As for the manual tranny on the Supra, I am pretty sure it'll come with it. I seriously don't think Toyota is dumb enough to mess with the reputation of its best performance sports car. There are a lot so-called "poseurs" buying IS350 out there so Toyota don't think by not offering manual tranny is going to hurt the sales. However, I am pretty sure there will be way less "poseurs" buying the Supra than the enthusiasts. Hopefully Toyota will offer the SMG/DSG that they use on the F1 instead of the regular auto tranny.

nippononly

Now snake, are you jumping down my throat here? :-)

Toyota is a HIGHLY predictable company. The illustration looks about how I would expect the Supra to look, and while I'm sure the actual car, if it materializes, will not look exactly the same, Toyota won't provide too much of a shocker on the styling front.

I am POSITIVE, knowing Toyota, that the car will share engines with the rest of the line, probably offering either two V-6s, one NA and one forced induction, or a V-6 and a V-8. So there will be no big surprises there.

Price of course will be predictably high, again knowing Toyota. I don't think it will start above $35K, as its most obvious competitor will be the 350Z and G35 coupes. In fact, that gives me hope that base price will be more like $32K, but I won't count on that.

And what car enthusiast have you ever met or chatted with that would buy a car without regard for price, content, or how it drives? Come ON. But having owned several Supras in the past and never having had a brand new one, it has always been a bit of a dream of mine, hence my empassioned statement above that you were so quick to call me on. :-P

snakeweasel

But for the next Supra, I am pretty sure the enthusiasts will be lining up to pre-order their Supra even WITHOUT any official information given.

I am sure but I still cannot understand buying a car sight unseen. I have to see it in the flesh, touch it, sit in it, drive it around before I will say that I will buy one for certain.

snakeweasel

Now snake, are you jumping down my throat here?

No, I just don't understand the concept of buying a car sight unseen.

And what car enthusiast have you ever met or chatted with that would buy a car without regard for price, content, or how it drives?

Well since you gave the unqualified statement that you will buy one even though it is still just rumored to be coming out I would say yes, yes I have.

I can understand being excited about it, saying that it is on your short list or that you are very interested in it. But out right saying that you will buy it?

anythngbutgm

If I had the money, I'd be plopping it on the table sight unseen on a new Challenger. Just like Toyota with the Supra, Chrysler has a hit on their hands and if people wait until it arrives before putting money on it, they'll be on the dreaded waiting list for months, even years.

Nippon, where are you getting the info on the new Supra?

nippononly

You need to take things a little less literally - this is an enthusiast website, I believe. People will often make statements with passion that are not meant to be taken stone-cold word for word. :-)

anythingbut: it's mostly speculation at this point, I'm sure, and it's in print in the November R&T. I hope it comes to fruition.

autoed

My 25 car picks for 2007 were published today. Find it at http://www.mercurynews.com/mld/mercurynews/business/industries/automotive/156936- 32.htm

jimlockey

Whoever has the best diesel car, mini van or station wagon, but it has to be diesel. I've had four diesels and want nothing else.

explorerx4

i think the challenger is a pretty big car. it is larger than the current mustang.

kdhspyder

Dumb but true story.

In the 70's driving in my friend's Charger we were joking around and someone ( unmentioned ) took the key out of the ignition while driving down the road and threw it out the window.

lilengineerboy

My folks old K-car didn't need a key one way or the other. You would just turn the place where the key goes in and it would start right up and the steering column would unlock and everything.
There were various ways to short the power door locks from the outside of the car so it lacked security (which was sub optimal when I would drive it to high school and my friends would take it to lunch).

andres3

to be refined to near perfection, an automotive equivalent to a fine wine thats aged 20 years.

If I wanted to have a contest to see who could drive the most miles w/o any maintenance or repair, I'd choose the corolla as my contender!

snakeweasel

I had a '70 Cornet that you could take the key out of the ignition while it was in any position. So you can keep the car on and running and take out the key.

snakeweasel

to be refined to near perfection, an automotive equivalent to a fine wine thats aged 20 years.

You mean in the cellar all covered with dust?

andres3

I knew that fine wine would draw comments.

I believe the Corolla to be one of the most refined and continually improved vehicles on the road. Is it perfect, no. But its not 59,000 dollars, or even $25,000, which is the average price of a new car these days.

Still... you haven't said what car you'd choose for that contest to see who can drive the most miles with no maintenance or repair... only gas and air for the tires.

explorerx4

i have never bought a vehicle with only that criteria and i hope never will.
even toyota must feel it needs some improvement, since they are delaying the next gen.

gagrice

I think I would pick a Jetta TDI. They are supposed to have 10k mile oil changes. Many folks push that out to 25k miles. I don't know if a Corolla would handle 25k miles between oil changes. They are a pretty good little car for the most part.

snakeweasel

Still... you haven't said what car you'd choose for that contest to see who can drive the most miles with no maintenance or repair... only gas and air for the tires.

Well you wouldn't go to far, I mean any car will drop dead real quick if you don't do oil changes.

Now if you look at who can drive the most with just normal routine maintence my sisters Corolla only went maybe 25-30K miles before something went wrong. And then another 25-30K before something else went wrong, the another 25-30K before the next. It was just like clock work.

My Elantra went almost 125K before needing anything other than normal routine maintenance. My daughters has gone 90K with nothing other than normal routine maintenance. My niece has 35K with no troubles on hers.

gagrice

It's the warranty. They are designed to last just past the warranty. :shades:

I have a friend with a 4 year old Sonata. He bought the bumper to bumper 100k mile warranty. The only thing he has had go bad was the battery. I think Toyota was living on their reputation from the 1990s. Toyota has had their share of problems the last couple years. Staying on top is not easy.

snakeweasel

Just for the sake of clarity what are designed to last just past the warranty?

I think Toyota was living on their reputation from the 1990s.

yes some cars have a reputation that does not reflect reality.

kdhspyder

They are pretty closed mouth about the new Corolla. However it's already been shown to dealer/principals last month fully 18 months in advance of it's launch which is very strange. The impression is that it's ready to go.... now.

I think it's in the way of the Tundra launch early next year thus it gets pushed back a year.

kdhspyder

yes some cars have a reputation that does not reflect reality.

But the Corolla isn't one of them. Despite your anecdotal references there is something very very right with this 5 y.o. vehicle when they remove all incentives and it's sales go up. Only the Camry has more units sold this year and the Corolla is breathing down it's neck. The truly wonderful new Civic is way behind the Corolla.

The market speaks.

snakeweasel

But the Corolla isn't one of them.

The Corolla is one of them. I have know enough people that have had issues with their corollas prior to their hitting 100K miles to know that their bullet proof reliability is not as great as people make it to be.

kdhspyder

..would you rather have a dealership that sells Corolla's ( Civics ) exclusively or Sequoia's ( Tahoe's ) exclusively?

Assumptions:
.. both vehicles generate a 'normal' 5% Gross Profit
.. Corolla's sell for $16000
.. Sequoia's sell for $45000

gagrice

I can tell you for sure if the only two vehicles for sale were the Sequoia and Corolla, I would drive off the lot in the Sequoia. There will always be a market for both. You have all the politicians that insist on having a limo or Suburban. I can't let them ride in more comfort than me. After all I am paying for mine and theirs.

Your point is well taken. It is the very reason GM is fighting for their life. They concentrated on the big stuff and said give the nickel and dime cars to the Japanese. That just was not smart.

kdhspyder

Inventory turns.

If you had only $45,000 to invest in a store would you buy 3 Corollas ( Civics ? ) or one Sequoia ( Tahoe )?

Each of the smaller vehicles turns about 3 times a month - 9 times in a quarter. While the larger vehicle currently turns about once every 60-120 days ( longer ). With the smaller vehicles one can generate 9 sales in 90 days vs one sale of the larger vehicle. The smaller vehicles have almost no carrying cost while the larger ones eat up money like mad.
( 90 days @ 8% annually is ~ 2% of $45000 or $900 just in interest expense on one single vehicle. )

9 sales x $750 less zero interest is about $6750 GP
1 sale x $2250 less $900 interest is about $1350 GP

Invest in the small vehicle store.

dhanley

Corolla.

We do have a corolla in the family, and even an ooolld tercel.

I have mixed feelings on the car. It is in the same household as a saturn sl2 and the saturn is more comfortable, feels relatively punchier, and gets slightly better fuel economy. The old out of tune tercel got better mpg than the new corolla. However, the corolla is more refined than the saturn, quite a bit quieter, in fact.

I took the corolla on a road trip and got 32mpg cruising at about 70 with the A/C cranked all the way up. Exactly what my bmw with about twice the horsepower gets. And i needed a couple of doses of ibrprofen to unwind my back after sitting in the corolla seats for six hours.

'course, i think the corolla was 13K and i haven't comparison shopped in that price range recently...

gagrice

I guess that is why when I went to the local Toyota store to look at the TCH, the salesman said I would like the Highlander Hybrid better. Truth was he had 3 HHs sitting burning up flooring. I told him no thank you. He followed me all the way to my PU. Trying to peddle those HHs. He was unaware that GMC made a hybrid so had questions about mine.

lemko

Heck, I'd choose a Buick. My 1968 Buick Special Deluxe was still running in 1992 and would've gone further if my brother wasn't too cheap to buy a new battery. The only reason he got rid of the car is because my Dad gave him his old ride - a 1981 Ford Thunderbird that was a total POS. My brother soon regretted his decision and told me that he should've kept my old car because it was so much better.

Fast forward to today, my 1988 Buick Park Avenue is still going strong so it's already an excellent contender. My 1989 Cadillac Brougham has 157K on it and has required no significant repairs and still looks beautiful.

Now, when you say "no maintenance" doe you mean forgoing oil changes and coolant flushes as well? If you're saying you can totally abuse and neglect your Corolla, go for it. I can't abuse or neglect my vehicles. It's not my nature.

I got to drive a Corolla for an afternoon. It's an OK vehicle if this is all you want. I will say it seemed to be put together well, but it wasn't without its shortcomings.

lemko

My Uncle Johhny has some homemade wine that's been in the basement since 1969. I still haven't had the guts to try it though he's been gone almost 10 years.

lemko

Rolls-Royce would proclaim that they built "The Best Car in the World" but it's reliability was abominable.

rockylee

That new coupe they have out now is very sexy. It should be for $400,000 :surprise:

Rocky

snakeweasel

yeah but its a Rolls, thats all their owners care about.

rockylee

I wish I was rich enough to only have to worry about the badge.

Rocky