Stories from the Sales Frontlines

bolivar

About 1 year ago. Almost all HP ratings dropped with the new ratings.

mako1a

Here we go with the letter/number car designations again.
330Ci : not a clue. Is it a Bugatti, Yugo or something in between?

tidester

Is it a Bugatti, Yugo or something in between?

You could say that. BMW does fall somewhere between Bugatti and Yugo. :P

tidester, host
SUVs and Smart Shopper

houdini1

Many Canadians are buying in Arizona, Florida, California and more, counting on the prices going up.

I think that is a very smart move. At some point inflation will have to kick in. I think the low prices in these states are just temporary and are a great opportunity for those fortunate enough to take advantage.

Very interesting about the real estate market in Canada.

driver100

But, it's not really about the 0-60.. After all, either of them would smoke my 330Ci..

I shouldn't even be writing here because I don't know what I am talking about when it comes to "technical" (I am just the styling and overall ambience guru) but, the 330Ci (Note to Mako...that is a BMW see pix below) might have a chance going around corners if it is a long and twisty road.

kyfdx

Now... that's a really nice example..

sterlingdog

Thank you! Thank you! I do wish that posters would put the names of their cars in front of those letters and numbers. Just because I drive an XYZ123, it doesn't mean that the rest of the world knows what car I drive.

Richard

imidazol97

> names of their cars in front of those letters and numbers.

On my part sometimes with the name of the car and the model I still don't know the difference from other vehicles in the same brand. A BMW is a BMW, isn't it? Or is an M3 a different animal?

graphicguy

Personally, the 0-60 time isn't what would drive me to purchase it. As my late Father used to say...."there's always going to be another woman that's prettier than the one you're with, there's always going to be someone richer than you'll ever be, and there's always going to be someone better looking than you are. Deal with it."

Taking that lesson into cardom....there's always going to be faster car out there (short of owning an Enzo, I suppose, which is never going to happen for me).

Bottom line is, it's a Cobra. It's one owner (and I know him well). I know how well the car's been taken care of. No runs, no drips, no errors on the car. It's a convertible. It looks and drives nearly new. It's way fast and makes great sounds.

I dunno, where can you get all of that for $8K-$10K? Sounds like I'm talking myself into this car.

graphicguy

imidazol97....was just thinking about you. Told you I'd let you know when there's another car show locally. Here 'ya go.....

http://lebanonbluesfestival.org/

This combines a really good classic car show with blues and ribs. Can't go wrong with this one.

tjc78

Sounds like I'm talking myself into this car.

From a value perspective you really can't go wrong. I don't believe the purchase would be all about speed. Heck your TL would give it a nice run. A droptop Cobra is one nice weekend car (or in Jersey a great car to take to the "shore"). If he wants to let it go, grab it. You could probably keep it two years and get most of what you paid out of it.

The only downfall (at least in Jersey) is insurance on a Mustang Vert would be pretty steep.

driver100

Just because I drive an XYZ123, it doesn't mean that the rest of the world knows what car I drive.

I thought you had an Explorer and a Sebring? :P

driver100

dunno, where can you get all of that for $8K-$10K? Sounds like I'm talking myself into this car.

Sounds like a wise decision. :shades:

jimbres

A BMW is a BMW, isn't it? Or is an M3 a different animal?

The M3 is a 3-series coupe or sedan into which a 414 hp V-8 has been stuffed. It's my personal dream car - I've configured it a dozen times on BMW's web site - but given its base price of $58K ($65K optioned the way I want it), I won't own one in this lifetime.

imidazol97

Thanks. That one's close enough and I'll try to get there tomorrow.

fezo

Oh, I know what an XYZ123 is!

Good choice, Richard!

imidazol97

>XYZ123

I think that was the license plate I had in the 80s.

sterlingdog

Here's a little sales story. I had to go by our church this morning to do some work. On the way home, I stopped by my favorite dealership to see my favorite salesman and to look again at the new 2011 Jeep Grand Cherokee---really nice. While there, the salesman mentioned that the owner is selling his 2010 demo---Jeep Grand Cherokee Laredo. It has 5,600 miles on it. It's a V6 with every option that you can get: Nav, Bluetooth, two tone leather seats, heated seats, rear sensors, back up camera, satellite radio, rear air, logo floor mats, heated rear view mirrors, towing package, fog lamps, all power accessories, full size spare, front/side airbags, front and rear power seats, DVD player, tire pressure monitor, remote start, etc.

Here's the deal: List price is $36,850. There is a factory rebate of $5K, demo discount of $3K, and $4k for my '03 Explorer XLT with 110K miles. That brings the price down to $24,850. It's a tempting offer. The only draw back is color---exterior is light gray stone pearl coat (silver). Interior is black with two tone gray and black leather seats. These colors give the vehicle a rather plain look. My wife agreed with me. It's not bad, but wouldn't be our color choice. The wife thinks that we should probably not pass up this deal. I'm not so sure.

All of you go ahead and put in your two cents. You know that I value the opinions here.

Richard

qbrozen

I dunno. I guess my thinking is.... and not to say its not a nice car.... but, to me, "Cobra" should be the end-all-be-all. On that particular car, it just doesn't strike me as such. Its just a used car. In other words, I wouldn't pay extra for the plate attached to it. Is it the best '98? Sure. Probably. But its not like '98 was a great year for Mustangs.

It is almost Ford's fault, in a way. I mean, even the 2011 GT looks to be faster than even the 2010 Cobra. So, again this is just my way of thinking, the '11 GT is worth more than the '10 Cobra. In summary... if a Cobra isn't the fastest example, why buy it?

(mind you, we're not talking classics here... as that's a different ballgame for purposes of style and collectibility, which these newer ones can't claim.)

fezo

That IS tempting. I'll throw the advice that I give a lot of people and USUALLY follow myself - if there's something you really don't like on the car - especially the color - don't buy it. Long after you've forgotten about the money you've saved (not that you'd forget that you saved that money...) you'll be looking at that Jeep and saying "Dang! It looked so much better in (your color here)."

mako1a

Richard, if the plain jane exterior color is the only thing holding you back, then go for it. Because there are striping kits available in any size and shape you can think of.

Flames are probably not your cup of tea, but how about a multi color variable width full length stripe that hits at the belt line. Or a cross stripe over the front or rear for example? It will change the perceived look in impressive ways. Also, since you probably park it indoors color fade won't be much of a problem. Just take a hair dryer and peel it off in a couple of years and go with another color scheme when you tire of that one. Local body shops will be quite willing to apply anything that suits your design taste.

jipster

He's not in a hurry to sell. Maybe I'll wait until there's snow on the ground and broach the subject with him, again.

Good idea. A nice blizzard or ice storm should yield optimal results.

Any gamblers in the house? Yesterday I was reminded why I only go to the casino once a year. Those gaming machines are programmed to cheat! :mad: My game of choice is video blackjack. I couldn't begin to count the number of times I'd be sitting pretty with a 20, the computer would have a 14, 15 or 16 and then take a hit for 21. It was quite maddening actually. Still probably came about even.

I did win a little bit this morning playing a slot machine called "Used Cars"... complete with the stereotypical car salesmen with slicked back hair, cheesy mustache and up to no good grin on his face. Made me think what isell, or some of the other guys in/out of the biz, would have to say to management over such a game. :P .

jipster

All of you go ahead and put in your two cents. You know that I value the opinions here.

First I'd be taking the rebate and demo money off invoice not list price.

Second, I'm with you on the color choice. Money saved would have to be a lot more significant for me to take a color I didn't care much for.

And third, I'm having to raise the monthly dues to "Team Jipster", as I lost my shirt at the casino the other day.

graphicguy

qbrozen...I hear what you're saying. I think aside from the '80s and part of the early '90s, each model generation outperformed the previous model generation.

Perception is reality. My perception of Cobra Mustangs is overwhelmingly positive. Aside from the Mustang II gen (did they actually make a Cobra version of those), I can't think of one Cobra version that I wouldn't consider desirable.


As I said, I've driven it. Is it a fast car? Without a doubt. Is it the fastest Mustang out there? Nope!

For $8K-$10K I doubt very seriously I could do better...for performance....for condition.....for what this car really is.

I'm not going to track it, though. As "tjc" made a point, I'd probably use it as a weekend cruiser.

Then again, I need this car like I need a live skunk hat.

fezo

And third, I'm having to raise the monthly dues to "Team Jipster", as I lost my shirt at the casino the other day.

Hey, wait a minute. 13 minutes ago you said you broke even....

nortsr1

I totally agree with you jipster. Take those rebates OFF OF INVOICE NOT MSRP.

houdini1

So, he is charging you full retail less the rebate and demo discount? I would try for another $4,000. end of MY discount and make it an even $20,000. difference. I love that color !!

The most important thing is for you and your wife to each drive the vehicle, not just around the block, but a pretty good test drive, maybe even keep it overnight, and then see what you think. Good luck!

sterlingdog

You must have read my mind. I was thinking on the way home how much nicer the car would look with a double black stripe at the belt line. I did that to a Chevy Blazer once and it made all the difference in the world. It was white and I used a double red stripe to match the interior. With the double black stripe, I might just be a happy camper.

Richard

sterlingdog

You ,nortsr1, and houdini have an excellent point. I just may try that one. I may play gg's game---$20K out the door including my trade---one time offer, take it or leave it.

You can't go up on the dues. There is a clause in your contract that reads, "Executive officers may gamble on automobile negotiations, but may not recoup gambling losses suffered at casinos."

Richard

jipster

Hey, wait a minute. 13 minutes ago you said you broke even...

I did... this was just a ploy/joke to raise my monthly dues. So, yeah richard, you're safe.... for now.

crkeehn

Just one moment. Didn't you use the Jipst Method to get a cut rate hotel room? And didn't you afterwards say, that they would recoup the difference in rate and more with your gambling losses?

It seems to me that your loyal followers owe you nothing more than a vote of thanks for showing that the Jipst Method works for other than car buying AND that gambling doesn't pay (if you're not a casino).

jipster

Just one moment. Didn't you use the Jipst Method to get a cut rate hotel room? And didn't you afterwards say, that they would recoup the difference in rate and more with your gambling losses?

First off, thanks for using the proper terminology in saying the "Jipst Method" instead of the "Jipster Method".

But, no, as you recall there was no need to use the Jipst Method as the hotel clerk pretty much laid down after just a little resistance from me in paying full price. There was no need to break out the Jipst Method. I keep the Jipst Method stored away, locked in a vault... a secret weapon to only use as needed.

Yes, I did say the casino would recoup their loss. But I didn't say from who (or is it whom?). My wife paid the casino back, plus, in her losses. I tried to get her away from that Wheel of Fortune slot machine when she was way up. But, she just didn't listen.

But, yes... gambling doesn't pay. We pretty much look at it as a form of entertainment. I came out about even, wife lost about $100 (really only about $50 if you factor in the discount on the room) . Not bad for a full days worth of excitement and all the complimentary soft drinks you can handle.

jmonroe

I've configured it a dozen times on BMW's web site - but given its base price of $58K ($65K optioned the way I want it), I won't own one in this lifetime.

Why not a 2/3 year old used one? Excuse me...previously owned. :surprise:

That's what Son #1 would like to do in 2/3 years for a track car.

jmonroe

jimbres

Why not a 2/3 year old used one? Excuse me...previously owned.

That's an excellent idea. Unfortunately, recent surgery has made it difficult to get into & out of my current (& much loved) BMW 330i. I'd have the same problem with an M3, so my next vehicle will likely be a compact, upscale SUV. My favorite at the moment is the Audi Q5.

verdugo

Here's the deal: List price is $36,850. There is a factory rebate of $5K, demo discount of $3K, and $4k for my '03 Explorer XLT with 110K miles. That brings the price down to $24,850

That's the wrong way to see it. The price is $28,850. That is high for a 2010 Laredo with 5,600 miles on it. Pass!

jmonroe

My wife agreed with me. It's not bad, but wouldn't be our color choice. The wife thinks that we should probably not pass up this deal. I'm not so sure.

All of you go ahead and put in your two cents. You know that I value the opinions here.

OK, here's my input.

You never said how you left this quasi negotiation after talking with the salesman. If he thinks you're interested you can expect a call with a lower price. I agree with taking this car for a long test drive and possibly and over night stay so you can really check it out. The owner wants to get rid of it and you guys sound interested if the price is right. If it were me I wouldn't go any higher than 21K.

So, when can we expect a sales tale?

jmonroe

explorerx4

i only keep full insurance on my convertible during 'driving' season, so it could be pretty cheap for 6 to 8 months a year.
gg should think about replacing the tires since they are 12 years old.
of course, i didn't take my own advice and waited 18 years.

explorerx4

what dealer is it? maybe they have a picture on their website.

driver100

All of you go ahead and put in your two cents. You know that I value the opinions here.

Well, you asked for it and I know you have been waiting all day to hear from me.

First, I would go and test drive a GLK just for the fun of it, and to have a comparison.

Then I would try the Jeep along with your wife, she has to be happy with it too. (you might want to let her get it stuck in mud to see if it comes out easily, and a few other road tests)

I think the guys have given some excellent points. It should be $4000 off invoice, not MSRP.

I think the post mentioning you are really paying $28000 for a used 2010 vehicle doesn't make the deal as good as it sounds. It might be better to get the 2011 with a few less options, and the color you like....what is that worth to you?

Also consider, you plan on keeping this car for a long time, and every day you drive it you will say I wish I chose black or some other color. I don't think the savings are worth ruining your fun. You might even get a new 2010 in the color you want from another dealer, and your dealer could trade for it...or buyit for you.

And all this started from an innocent drive to church. On the other hand maybe it was a sign from above that you are supposed to buy this car :confuse:

Don't do anything until you try a GLK. If you buy the Jeep you can tell the neighbors, "I even tried an MB GLK, but I liked this Jeep better". :shades:

snakeweasel

But, yes... gambling doesn't pay.

It doesn't? I must be doing something wrong then.

jipster

It doesn't? I must be doing something wrong then.

Sounds like you have a story to tell snakie. Let's hear it.

Being a gambler and an accountant, I would guess you play quite a bit of blackjack. A card counter? I think you would play somewhat conservatively... mostly hang around the $15 minimum table. If one is to gamble, blackjack is the one game where you have halfway decent odds to win. And unlike the slot machines where it's all luck, you have to have some skill in order to win.

sterlingdog

You give good advice. After all, most of us live with our car purchases for a number of years.

Richard

sterlingdog

That's why I'm glad that you are here---always logical reasoning from all angles. Final price BEFORE the trade value. I should remember that lesson from previous discussions on this site. Thanks.

Richard

sterlingdog

We're doing the test drive tomorrow. I agree---going for $20K but would give $21K tops. After dinner with friends tonight, the four of us stopped by the dealership on the way home. The girls decided where the double black stripe should be placed to give it some personality. Sam, my friend, wanted me to consider the 2011---new styling, better materials, etc. We'll see.

"So, when can we expect a sales tale?"

Not until I get that "good" feeling.

Richard

sterlingdog

Oh yes, I knew that you of all people would give me your two cents plus the plug on the GLK. I did mention to my wife that this vehicle has 4WD AND a towing package for the mud. I also mentioned the back up camera and rear sensors for her utility poles. I also showed her the large cup holders for her iced tea. I wonder why she didn't laugh?

Like the other nice posters, you gave me much to consider. I'll have a better feeling for the situation after tomorrow.

Richard

bolivar

I think most of the others have hit the high points here. The price you got is not much of a deal.

And I look at it not as a 'demo', but a 'used' car with 5,600 miles. A one (model) year old used car.

The rebate money doesn't come from the dealers pocket. Does the $3,000 off even get this down to the invoice price?

jimbres

Don't do anything until you try a GLK.

FYI: I checked out the GLK on the same day that I also looked at the Audi Q5, & I'm here to tell you that the Q5's interior is vastly superior - higher quality materials, more attractive & ergonomically superior control layout, more comfortable seats & more rear seat legroom. By comparison, the GLK's interior looked & felt cheap.

The Audi also beats the MB on the styling front. I'd rather be seen in the Q5 than in the GLK. That's my humble opinion, of course.

Given that the 2 vehicles are approximately the same size & cost, the Audi comes off as the clear winner. I've dropped the GLK from further consideration.

cdnpinhead

All of you go ahead and put in your two cents.

I haven't read all the other responses yet to your post (should be interesting), but my put is to get the color combination you want and don't worry so much about the screaming deal. You'll forget the cost delta long before you stop enjoying having the vehicle look just the way you want it to, plus which you can get a brand new one that hasn't been (possibly) abused.

houdini1

Then I would try the Jeep along with your wife

LOL, just exactly what are you suggesting here? :surprise:

driver100

Audi Q5, & I'm here to tell you that the Q5's interior is vastly superior - higher quality materials, more attractive & ergonomically superior control

Jimbres, I checked it out and I have to agree with you. All the reviews give more points to the Audi Q5 than the GLK. Personally, I like the looks of the GLK a bit more, but I would certainly want to compare them.
It took a long time to get Richard to even say he would look at a GLK (I don't know if he really will.....I think he just wants me to stop mentioning it and it is an hour drive to the MB dealership, maybe this is closer), so I didn't want to start on another car. By the way list price is around $35k, and that seems pretty amazing for an MB or an Audi.

I don't think the Q5 was available in Canada for 2010, but it is for 2011, and that is one reason I missed it.