Rarity. The new Vette design was supposed to be a 1983 release but development problems delayed introduction until 84. They only built something like 43 1983 cars and that one is the only one left. It's identical to my 84 as far as I can tell although being in a museum for 29 years it's in better shape.
2019 Kia Soul+, 2015 Mustang GT, 2013 Ford F-150, 2000 Chrysler Sebring convertible
XG350.- Snotta, what's the difference? It was still a good story.
Again easy for you to say.
Look at my $200 speeding ticket I got in Tennessee, do you know how much mileage I have gotten from that story?
I’d say a blown engine is way more than $200. While you may have gotten some mileage from your story and me with mine, I paid a whole lot more at the pump to tell mine. :mad:
jmonroe
'15 Genesis V8 with Ultimate Package and '18 Legacy Limited 6 cyl
Have to say, from all my recent lookings, smaller (stand alone/"mom and pop") dealers are much more pleasant. Tend to be smaller and less crowded, lower pressure, much friendlier, etc.
The local volvo dealer is great. Been going there for years to check things out, to the extent that the owner (a women) is like an old friend, and loves to see us. And been to a couple of subaru dealers lately that were a very comfortable experience, with very friendly, low key, and helpful salesmen (both older gentlemen). Would have no qualms about buying from either one.
also tonight, pretty empty at 8:00. There was one couple at the Subaru dealer (buying I think) besides us, but it really is a small store. Even the automall Acura dealer did not have too many people in it. Probably explains why the local highway (usually jammed) was empty. Everyone was already at the shore!
I agree with snake that leasing IS more expensive. The biggest problem with leasing for me is: WHAT'S NEXT? I've got about 2 years to decide (lease is up on the BMW in 2 years/2 months). I'm going to try and keep the budget below $30,000. The car has got to have an automatic, xenon headlights, & a backup camera. I'd like AWD, but I have no qualms about purchasing a set of dedicated winter tires. "Feel for the road" is important to me, so nothing with numb, lifeless steering & a mushy suspension. The car will be a commuter car, so it doesnt need to corner like its on rails either. I'm a sucker for STRONG brakes. I love having the factory nav unit in my car, but the amount of times I use it, I'd be better off with a portable. Maybe since I'll be buying in September, I'll get a deal on a nice leftover or a demo. The "right" CPO car (1 yr) might tickle my fancy.
Jeep Wrangler Unlimited Volkswagen Passat TDI SE MINI Cooper S or MINI Clubman S Toyota Camry SE CPO BMW 328i CPO Audi A4 2.0T
I know some of these cars don't meet all my wants, yet. Maybe in 2 years they will.
2001 Prelude Type SH, 2022 Highlander XLE AWD, 2025 Camry SE AWD
I had a great time; the only mishap was in the track garage, when I dinged the passenger door while backing into my bay. Luckily the scratches will buff out and a little PDR will make the dent virtually invisible. I still felt like an idiot... Anyway, here is the new garage that the track just built. One bay is just $75 for three days- best money I ever spent(once I improved my "reversing skills" as the Brits put it):
Here's a friend's GT3; very fast- and it virtually repeals the laws of physics:
And you just have to love a race car campaigned by "Team Fiery Death":
Things I learned:
The 2013 Taurus SHO is no track car- even when equipped with the $1995 "Performance Package"- after just five laps the brakes were smoking so bad onlookers thought the pads were on fire. Shades of my 1984 Thunderbird Turbo Coupe, which had brakes that faded after just one hard stop from 80 mph. The SHO cost over $42,000...
The hot weather also affected a couple of the E46(2002-2006) M3s which ran very hot late in the afternoon sessions.
Ditto for an instructor's 2012 Boss 302, which also tended to run hot after a few laps.
I guess old age and treachery still trumps youth and enthusiasm. My 133,000 mile 1995 318ti ran flawlessly all weekend- and it still runs the original suspension(save two lower control arm bushings I just replaced) and stock brakes.
Finally, I bounced over a rumble strip and somehow managed to knock a hole in one of the plastic undertray panels. Fortunately it takes all of five minutes to replace it. As usual for a BMW, the part was hellishly expensive $7.11 plus tax... :P
Mine: 1995 318ti Club Sport-2020 C43-1996 Speed Triple Challenge Cup Replica
Wife's: 2021 Sahara 4xe
Son's: 2018 330i xDrive
Wow, talk about being all over the map. I bet you'll have fun shopping but the salesmen will be jumping out the back window when they see you coming. :P
Could you really go from a BMW to a Camry?
2019 Kia Soul+, 2015 Mustang GT, 2013 Ford F-150, 2000 Chrysler Sebring convertible
Do you need any special instruction before they let you track your car? I imagine they don't want just any yayhoo flipping his new car into the grass. And do they require a pre-run inspection so they know your wheels will stay on?
2019 Kia Soul+, 2015 Mustang GT, 2013 Ford F-150, 2000 Chrysler Sebring convertible
I love having the factory nav unit in my car, but the amount of times I use it, I'd be better off with a portable.
One thing to think about. When we looked at the 2013 BMW 328 and 335 we weren't interested in paying $3500 for navi and rear camera. The salesman made a good point. When you go to trade in it will be hard to sell a car without these things, and, when you go to trade you will get most of the money back.
I kind of wonder about that a bit, because, most electronics get cheaper over time. Still, I think what he said does make some sense.
Interesting choices, quite a variety, how did the Camry get in there? Was it the ad on the side of the page that said lease one for $0 down $199 a month?
>we weren't interested in paying $3500 for navi and rear camera. The salesman made a good point. When you go to trade in it will be hard to sell a car without these things, and, when you go to trade you will get most of the money back.
As you said, that's not true. It's a sales gimmick. Probably by the time you trade it the NAV and other options will be setup in a much better way and will have been replaced by items a generation of two better developed. Yours will get you $0 in extra money over the car without same.
Do you need any special instruction before they let you track your car? I imagine they don't want just any yayhoo flipping his new car into the grass. And do they require a pre-run inspection so they know your wheels will stay on?
I’m sure they do. I can’t imagine any track worth their brake pads will let you on their track without some instruction. When Son #1 got into this he had to do something like 4 hours class time before he was allowed to get on the track and even then he had to do runs with an instructor. I can’t remember how many track runs with an instructor you had to do at his track before you could go un-chaperoned but he was able to do it in the minimum number of runs. Because of that he felt he was cut out for that work. Sometimes I wondered how he managed to get his helmet on to his swelled head. And yes, you have to have a car that is track ready and they are constantly going around cars with torque wrenches checking lug nuts.
I’m sure the ‘judge’ can get in to this way more than what I said above. It’s a lot more than just WANTING to go FAST.
jmonroe
'15 Genesis V8 with Ultimate Package and '18 Legacy Limited 6 cyl
When we looked at the 2013 BMW 328 and 335 we weren't interested in paying $3500 for navi and rear camera. The salesman made a good point. When you go to trade in it will be hard to sell a car without these things, and, when you go to trade you will get most of the money back.
I would think that there is a large enough segment of the population that really doesn't care for those things that makes selling it down the line rather easy. I don't think not having these things would make it that much harder to sell. My guess is that 3 years down the line the same vehicle without those items prices say $3K less wouldn't take that much longer to sell.
2011 Hyundai Sonata, 2014 BMW 428i convertible, 2015 Honda CTX700D
Yes- it happened soon after I got to the track on Saturday morning. I decided to be philosophical about the incident and not let it ruin the whole weekend.
Do you need any special instruction before they let you track your car? I imagine they don't want just any yayhoo flipping his new car into the grass.
The schools that I attend require an instructor in the car until the instructor is convinced that the driver really does know his/her stuff. First-timers virtually NEVER get signed off at their first few events. Plus, it reflects poorly on the instructor if they sign someone off and then the student has a big sspin or an "agricultural excursion". In addition, students are divided into three or four "run groups" based on ability so that you don't have an extreme difference of ability on the track at the same time. Instructors get their own group as well- usually with relaxed rules regarding when and where you can pass. There is also a "Three Strike" rule for all students and instructors- a strike is putting more than two wheels off the pavement or spinning over 90 degrees to the direction of travel- accumulate three in one day and your day is over; I once picked up two strikes before the fifth turn...
And do they require a pre-run inspection so they know your wheels will stay on?
Students have to have their car inspected by a mechanic/shop and the shop must complete an inspection checklist on a provided tech form. The cars also receive a once-over on site before they can go out on the track.Instructors may self-tech their cars. Major equipment failures are rare. Most minor problems involve brakes or cooling systems.
In general, the schools that my club(the BMW Car Club of America) conducts are very safe. Cars do get bent every now and then, but it is a very infrequent occurrence(the driver is almost always an advanced student or an instructor). Finally, all makes and models are welcome; I usually see several Corvettes, Mustangs, G37s, etc. at every school.
Mine: 1995 318ti Club Sport-2020 C43-1996 Speed Triple Challenge Cup Replica
Wife's: 2021 Sahara 4xe
Son's: 2018 330i xDrive
The salesperson at BMW was correct. When I used to appraise cars, *driver, black book would provide pricing for poor, fair, good, excellent/clean. Then, there were only a few options that would add several thousand to those prices - Hardrive Navigation Systems, upgraded stereo/surround sound systems, leather or AWD. After that, no other options were given a "bump" in used car values.
Options such as back-up cameras, park assist, etc., did not up the pricing.
Remember, today's Navigations Systems do much more than route guidance - they include *bluetooth, app's (now available with NAV systems in many makes), voice recognition, uploads of pre-determined destinations from your home computer, etc.
So, if you are into technology, and use Navigation several time a year, then it is well worth the added expense since you will get that investment back when trading the car in.
As for the cost of Navigation and back up camera in the BMW, I think $3500 is way over priced. Lexus NAV system which includes *ENFORM (similar to On-Star) and blue tooth, etc., is only $1500, give or take $200. Why so much for BMW NAV and Back up camera? The option must include other equipment or technology for that price, no?
I remember Fezo's car dealer friend (can't remember his user name) saying that certain used vehicles without NAV were very hard to sell. Lexus RX350 comes to mnd.
I have NAV and all the other bundled items. I just like the big screen and how everything is integrated. The actual navigation is bettered by the Google maps app on my Android phone. At least now many of the factory systems say the street names.
Yes, the larger screen is a nice feature. In my new GS350, if you get the NAV, it comes with a 13" screen which can be split in order to monitor other systems along with NAV.
Older cars with NAV systems need to be updated with new routes and roads. I believe the manufacturers charge several hundred dollars to update your NAV system using their computer connections at their dealerships. But with mich older cars, they cannot be updated. Not always essential, but nice to get current info.
The new NAV systems are much more utilitarian than ever with lots of other connected features available. And yes, some cars are more difficult to sell as used without some of the updated systems now available.
About 4 days ago I got a bill in the mail to renew my subscription for XM Satellite Radio for the Genny. The bill was $164.45. Today I got another bill for the same amount. As you guys know, last year and for the year before that I had a promotional one time only rate of something like $77 plus an XM music royalty fee plus tax. The total was $92 ish, I think. I called today and went right to the “cancel my order” account line. It seems like this one time promotional rate goes on and on and … :confuse: because I got the same rate for the Genny that I got for Mrs. j’s Subie a few months ago which is now $94.43 all in due to an XM subscription rate increase that took effect at the beginning of 2012.
The most amusing thing about the call I made today was when the guy said to avoid having a bill sent next year and having to call to get it corrected like I have been doing, I should just call next year BEFORE the present subscription lapses and tell them I don’t want to pay MSRP and they will correct the bill to the promo rate before they send out the bill. The guy actually said, “I see you have been doing this for a few years now and calling next year will save both of us the work of going through this type of change again”. :surprise:
The reason I have them send a bill is because if I gave them my CC number they would have hit my card for the then prevailing rate and getting a change then would not have been so easy.
I don’t know how many of you guys do this but it definitely works.
jmonroe
'15 Genesis V8 with Ultimate Package and '18 Legacy Limited 6 cyl
Interesting point by the sales guy. I suppose it depends on the buyer when it comes to demand. For me, I don't want nav, and would only want a camera in a vehicle with poor visibility. I don't want the potential repair problems and certainly won't pay extra for them, so a vehicle equipped with them would be less desirable. That's just me. Society in general seems tech hungry, so I could see where not having those in a higher end vehicle would be a problem.
That said, with most cars, they'll essentially depreciate to near zero in time, so the more paid the more lost. As technology progresses, the old tech becomes useless, so today's nav may not be worth much or anything at all in ten years. Eight track, tape deck, and CD players, anyone?
RE:XM we are always on some sort of promo. I refuse to give that poor excuse of a company anymore than I have to. My fiancé loves it, so that is why we have it.
Yes, *tjc, barely on life support. My new car has a single disc player, and when I complained, the manager said, "...give me your iPhone!" He connected it to the applications sub-system run by *Enform, and low and behold I had an iPod, iHeart Radio, and Pandora radio. I was able to listen to KOST in Los Angeles, the station I used to listen to 24/7 when I lived in southern California and my favorite Chicago station. And I was able to customize the stations and the artists.
I totally agree with you, *tyguy. Cars are meant for getting you from one place to another and then home again. All this hi-tech stuff does is make it more difficult for you to get their safely due to all the distractions. Most os my apps are accessible even when the car is moving, which is outrageous. I have voice recognition for telephone and NAV, which works all the time, but the apps should be frozen (access to the apps, that is) when driving the car.
We are all disgusted with those drivers who talk on their cell phones (they don't have blue tooth) and hold up traffic at a light because they are not paying attention to their external environment. Texting causes the same reaction - they become oblivious to what is happening outside their car.
The sooner they outlaw texting and hand held use of cell phones in cars while engaged in moving vehicular traffic, the better. Sure it's nice to have all these technologies available in your car, but the safety of YHE driving public and pedestrians must be a priority.
Every time I sit behind a car at a light that just turned green and thaw driver of that car is texting or on his/her cell phone (no Bluetooth) I want to scream and possibly take out the SOB. But until laws are passed prohibiting these activities and drivers receive very stiff fines braking those laws, this will continue to cause accidents, etc!
Yes, *tjc, I am in that same situation. My XM trial subscription for music and news expires in August. But my NAV weather and traffic and fuel prices goes through next May. The wanted about $15 a month including fees and taxes for my music/news programming. I figured I'd wait until the beginning of August and then threaten them to cancel that portion of my subscription and see if the offer me a special deal. I don't need news, just music, so they have music only plans as well. I'm hoping for 3 months free per year or better for 2 year plan.
Let me know if you are aware of something like that. I was able to get it on Sirius, so maybe XM will offer it as well.
Amen about all the distractions. I'm looking at a 2013 Outback and noticed a wireless Internet hotspot is an option Serious?? There was a time when I thought the erratic drivers were drunk or high, but now 90% of the time the person is texting or otherwise distracted by something in the car as they weave, dramatically change cruising speeds, change lanes without looking, drive 10 mph under the limit, etc... The safer our cars become they more we need those safety enhancements to protect ourselves from all the other technology advancements that distract. It's dangerous out there. Thank goodness I'm not driving 50,000 miles a year for work anymore.
I believe it will work with most smart phones. The apps work through a blue tooth streaming connection along with *Enform app on most cell phones (smart phones only). And yes, it will accept a flash as well. I should have been more complete in my last post - my apologies.
The point I am trying to make is that due to all this advanced tech in the new cars, CD's will soon be a thing of the past. I am going to copy all my favorite CD's onto my computer and then create a flash of them to play in my car. I don't download music via iTunes because of the cost involved. Why pay for music you already have on CD?
Do you have access to iHeart radio in your car or Pandora? Great sources for music, especially if you don't have satellite radio or are away from big cities where there are lots of FM HD broadcasts.
I have found FM HD stations have the best quality sound reproduction in my car. The sound is as good, if not better than CD's.
"...don't want the potential repair problems and certainly won't pay extra for them..."
Bravo! A man after my own heart. The only accident I ever had 40+ years ago was because I was fiddling with the radio. I get nervous taking my eyes off the road. I require none of the modern tech that costs so much in today's cars. I don't even bring my antique cell phone with me unless I'm going out of town.
Just more stuff to break.
2019 Kia Soul+, 2015 Mustang GT, 2013 Ford F-150, 2000 Chrysler Sebring convertible
OK I should rephrase the question. What if you don't have a smart phone?
Truth be told I don't have a smart phone and I don't see a need for one (for me, I know others may need and/or want one) in the near future.
The point I am trying to make is that due to all this advanced tech in the new cars, CD's will soon be a thing of the past.
While CD's may become a thing of the past it will be because something else will replace it. Pretty much how CD's replaced cassettes and cassettes replaced 8-tracks. There will always be some need for a compact way to store, carry and/or transport music.
Yeah I know you can disgitally download music but I cannot foresee that being the only way music is sold. Now I just bought the score for the entire Rings cycle and that would have been good to have avaliable on a flash drive since it is something like 16 hours of music.
2011 Hyundai Sonata, 2014 BMW 428i convertible, 2015 Honda CTX700D
Wow I would run out and get this car that has only been driven a little over a thousand miles a year for 33 years if I didn't get rid of all those 8-tracks I used to have.
2011 Hyundai Sonata, 2014 BMW 428i convertible, 2015 Honda CTX700D
Why so much for BMW NAV and Back up camera? The option must include other equipment or technology for that price, no?
The short answer is BMW has become ridiculous with accessories...you have to but a package of goods to get one item. My wife really wanted a button on the mirror that will open the garage door. Is that called Home Link. To get that you need ZWP Premium Package. It includes, Navi, Harmon/Kardon Sound, dimming exterior mirrors, lumbar support, park distance control-rear, alarm,universal remote, comfort access, rear camera, and CIC contribution - whatever in the heck that is!
All these items at a cost of $4500, just to get a $200 garage door opener.
About the rear camera. I wouldn't normally buy one but it came with a package I needed with my 535. Once you get used to it you wouldn't want to be without it.
Backing up has caused lots of injuries, accidents, and deaths. Those cameras are ppretty cheap...I think $50 to $200 to make. I think they will become mandatory soon, and they are very good. There is even some peripheral vision so you can see to the sides when backing out of a parking spot.
my wife really likes the back-up camera that all of the CUVs she has been looking at have. Very handy feature, especially considering how poor the rear visibility is these days (tiny glass and big pillars.)
Not sure. I'm going to have to drive the cars 1st. I'm not sure how much better a 4 cyl 328i w/ electric power steering is going to drive compared to my inline 6 powered wonderfully weighted hydraulic power steering on my BMW. I don't know if I'm going to want to spend BMW money on my next ride.
2001 Prelude Type SH, 2022 Highlander XLE AWD, 2025 Camry SE AWD
interesting thing from my test drive. I told my wife that something I was really impressed with was the steering. nicely weighted, good feel, etc. And that it reminded me of a BMW.
yeah, it was a short drive in the Legacy, but still made an impression.
Here's a thought. Keep two bicycles in the Florida garage. Use them for short runs around your neighborhood---grocery store, drug store, etc. If you have to travel further than 3 or 4 miles, call a taxi. You have no deppreciation, no insurance, and no maintenance. You also would benefit from healthy exercise. Just thinking outside of the box.
Thanks for the kind words Dave. We moved back to where we lived for 35 years---Lumberton, NC. It is on I-95 and is the half way point between New York and Miami.
I'm so glad to hear that. Your plans sound really nice. You'll have a wonderful affair and many memories to share with one another. Those 100 days will be fleeting little droplets of time. Keep us posted on developments.
Yes, this house is truly the dream of our lives. We're so blessed to have the antiques, paintings, silver, etc. to lend it justice. Since this will be our last one, we are pouring our hearts into each and every room. The grounds are so pretty and we were fortunate to retain the man who has cared for them the last 30 years. He is teaching me so much that I need to know about the plants. As Dave said, it helps to be retired. We can devote each day to this project.
Nice town right along I-95. When I used to live in PA, I always made it a point to spend the night in Lumberton. NC, on my way down to FL to visit my folks. Great restaurants and great people.
I have a nephew who is a cardiologist in Raleigh and when I go to visit him and his family, I always try to get back to Lumberton to spend a day or two there. Reminds me of my youth when I lived way out on the eastern end of Long Island and the nice, quiet and "homey" feel and personality of areas like that.
*richard. You and the Mrs. Sure picked a great place yo live!
In my daily perusal of car ads I have been noticing that an awful lot of them list the milage at 140,000. Since I'm always suspicious of car sellers this has gotten me thinking about milage tampering. From what I've seen on Craigslist I can believe some people will try anything to make a buck.
So my question, how hard is it to tamper with modern digital odometers and is there something about that process that would land the reading at 140,000?
The voices in my head await your answer. :surprise:
2019 Kia Soul+, 2015 Mustang GT, 2013 Ford F-150, 2000 Chrysler Sebring convertible
As for the possibility that you are possibly plagued with paranoia, I leave that up to you and your psychiatrist to diagnose! But as to the possible cause of such paranoia, it is extremely difficult to turn odometers back, but not impossible. The old story about giving humanity a tremendous incentive to do something - like make more money than you are entitled to make - and presto, a way to accomplish that immediately comes to fruition.
When a dealership sells a used vehicle, they must provide the buyer with a legal document verifying that the mileage shown on the odometer is, in fact, correct and that the odometer has not been tampered with. The penalties for circumventing this statute are quite severe, both civilly and criminally. But when purchasing a car online or from a private party that is sold "as is" is another story. The old adage "buyer beware" should be the guiding principal one should use as a cautionary principal when buying from private parties.
The fact that the number 140,000 seems to be cropping up more frequently than it should may be more of a numerology phenomena than as a result of falsifying odometer readouts. But, if the 140,000 figure is right on the 140,000 mark, not 141,342 or some other figure similar to that, I think I would become suspicious, but not paranoid!
I was just wondering if you could lease the car in Canada and keep it in Florida.
Just too many problems if we buy or lease the car in Canada. Just a few problems are; Cost will be about 20% more You can't leave a car in Florida for more than 6 months or your insurance stops, You can't get U.S. insurance on a Canadian car, The car will need certain modifications if you licence it for Florida,
No, that is one reason we decided not to bring down the 335. Just too complicated......but, keep thinking, we have until the end of July or maybe August before we order.
Comments
How many miles?
Rarity. The new Vette design was supposed to be a 1983 release but development problems delayed introduction until 84. They only built something like 43 1983 cars and that one is the only one left. It's identical to my 84 as far as I can tell although being in a museum for 29 years it's in better shape.
2019 Kia Soul+, 2015 Mustang GT, 2013 Ford F-150, 2000 Chrysler Sebring convertible
Again easy for you to say.
Look at my $200 speeding ticket I got in Tennessee, do you know how much mileage I have gotten from that story?
I’d say a blown engine is way more than $200. While you may have gotten some mileage from your story and me with mine, I paid a whole lot more at the pump to tell mine. :mad:
jmonroe
'15 Genesis V8 with Ultimate Package and '18 Legacy Limited 6 cyl
The local volvo dealer is great. Been going there for years to check things out, to the extent that the owner (a women) is like an old friend, and loves to see us. And been to a couple of subaru dealers lately that were a very comfortable experience, with very friendly, low key, and helpful salesmen (both older gentlemen). Would have no qualms about buying from either one.
also tonight, pretty empty at 8:00. There was one couple at the Subaru dealer (buying I think) besides us, but it really is a small store. Even the automall Acura dealer did not have too many people in it. Probably explains why the local highway (usually jammed) was empty. Everyone was already at the shore!
2020 Acura RDX tech SH-AWD, 2023 Maverick hybrid Lariat luxury package.
Jeep Wrangler Unlimited
Volkswagen Passat TDI SE
MINI Cooper S or MINI Clubman S
Toyota Camry SE
CPO BMW 328i
CPO Audi A4 2.0T
I know some of these cars don't meet all my wants, yet. Maybe in 2 years they will.
2001 Prelude Type SH, 2022 Highlander XLE AWD, 2025 Camry SE AWD
after today, the Legacy I drove could be a strong contender. maybe not as strong an engine as you like, though the H6 could do the job.
2020 Acura RDX tech SH-AWD, 2023 Maverick hybrid Lariat luxury package.
Anyway, here is the new garage that the track just built. One bay is just $75 for three days- best money I ever spent(once I improved my "reversing skills" as the Brits put it):
Here's a friend's GT3; very fast- and it virtually repeals the laws of physics:
And you just have to love a race car campaigned by "Team Fiery Death":
Things I learned:
The 2013 Taurus SHO is no track car- even when equipped with the $1995 "Performance Package"- after just five laps the brakes were smoking so bad onlookers thought the pads were on fire. Shades of my 1984 Thunderbird Turbo Coupe, which had brakes that faded after just one hard stop from 80 mph. The SHO cost over $42,000...
The hot weather also affected a couple of the E46(2002-2006) M3s which ran very hot late in the afternoon sessions.
Ditto for an instructor's 2012 Boss 302, which also tended to run hot after a few laps.
I guess old age and treachery still trumps youth and enthusiasm. My 133,000 mile 1995 318ti ran flawlessly all weekend- and it still runs the original suspension(save two lower control arm bushings I just replaced) and stock brakes.
Finally, I bounced over a rumble strip and somehow managed to knock a hole in one of the plastic undertray panels. Fortunately it takes all of five minutes to replace it. As usual for a BMW, the part was hellishly expensive $7.11 plus tax... :P
Mine: 1995 318ti Club Sport-2020 C43-1996 Speed Triple Challenge Cup Replica
Wife's: 2021 Sahara 4xe
Son's: 2018 330i xDrive
Wow, talk about being all over the map. I bet you'll have fun shopping but the salesmen will be jumping out the back window when they see you coming. :P
Could you really go from a BMW to a Camry?
2019 Kia Soul+, 2015 Mustang GT, 2013 Ford F-150, 2000 Chrysler Sebring convertible
Don't you hate when that happens?
Do you need any special instruction before they let you track your car? I imagine they don't want just any yayhoo flipping his new car into the grass. And do they require a pre-run inspection so they know your wheels will stay on?
2019 Kia Soul+, 2015 Mustang GT, 2013 Ford F-150, 2000 Chrysler Sebring convertible
One thing to think about. When we looked at the 2013 BMW 328 and 335 we weren't interested in paying $3500 for navi and rear camera. The salesman made a good point. When you go to trade in it will be hard to sell a car without these things, and, when you go to trade you will get most of the money back.
I kind of wonder about that a bit, because, most electronics get cheaper over time. Still, I think what he said does make some sense.
Interesting choices, quite a variety, how did the Camry get in there? Was it the ad on the side of the page that said lease one for $0 down $199 a month?
2017 MB E400 , 2015 MB GLK350, 2014 MB C250
As you said, that's not true. It's a sales gimmick. Probably by the time you trade it the NAV and other options will be setup in a much better way and will have been replaced by items a generation of two better developed. Yours will get you $0 in extra money over the car without same.
2014 Malibu 2LT, 2015 Cruze 2LT,
I’m sure they do. I can’t imagine any track worth their brake pads will let you on their track without some instruction. When Son #1 got into this he had to do something like 4 hours class time before he was allowed to get on the track and even then he had to do runs with an instructor. I can’t remember how many track runs with an instructor you had to do at his track before you could go un-chaperoned but he was able to do it in the minimum number of runs. Because of that he felt he was cut out for that work. Sometimes I wondered how he managed to get his helmet on to his swelled head. And yes, you have to have a car that is track ready and they are constantly going around cars with torque wrenches checking lug nuts.
I’m sure the ‘judge’ can get in to this way more than what I said above. It’s a lot more than just WANTING to go FAST.
jmonroe
'15 Genesis V8 with Ultimate Package and '18 Legacy Limited 6 cyl
I would think that there is a large enough segment of the population that really doesn't care for those things that makes selling it down the line rather easy. I don't think not having these things would make it that much harder to sell. My guess is that 3 years down the line the same vehicle without those items prices say $3K less wouldn't take that much longer to sell.
2011 Hyundai Sonata, 2014 BMW 428i convertible, 2015 Honda CTX700D
Yes- it happened soon after I got to the track on Saturday morning. I decided to be philosophical about the incident and not let it ruin the whole weekend.
Do you need any special instruction before they let you track your car? I imagine they don't want just any yayhoo flipping his new car into the grass.
The schools that I attend require an instructor in the car until the instructor is convinced that the driver really does know his/her stuff. First-timers virtually NEVER get signed off at their first few events. Plus, it reflects poorly on the instructor if they sign someone off and then the student has a big sspin or an "agricultural excursion". In addition, students are divided into three or four "run groups" based on ability so that you don't have an extreme difference of ability on the track at the same time. Instructors get their own group as well- usually with relaxed rules regarding when and where you can pass. There is also a "Three Strike" rule for all students and instructors- a strike is putting more than two wheels off the pavement or spinning over 90 degrees to the direction of travel- accumulate three in one day and your day is over; I once picked up two strikes before the fifth turn...
And do they require a pre-run inspection so they know your wheels will stay on?
Students have to have their car inspected by a mechanic/shop and the shop must complete an inspection checklist on a provided tech form. The cars also receive a once-over on site before they can go out on the track.Instructors may self-tech their cars. Major equipment failures are rare. Most minor problems involve brakes or cooling systems.
In general, the schools that my club(the BMW Car Club of America) conducts are very safe. Cars do get bent every now and then, but it is a very infrequent occurrence(the driver is almost always an advanced student or an instructor). Finally, all makes and models are welcome; I usually see several Corvettes, Mustangs, G37s, etc. at every school.
Mine: 1995 318ti Club Sport-2020 C43-1996 Speed Triple Challenge Cup Replica
Wife's: 2021 Sahara 4xe
Son's: 2018 330i xDrive
The salesperson at BMW was correct. When I used to appraise cars, *driver, black book would provide pricing for poor, fair, good, excellent/clean. Then, there were only a few options that would add several thousand to those prices - Hardrive Navigation Systems, upgraded stereo/surround sound systems, leather or AWD. After that, no other options were given a "bump" in used car values.
Options such as back-up cameras, park assist, etc., did not up the pricing.
Remember, today's Navigations Systems do much more than route guidance - they include *bluetooth, app's (now available with NAV systems in many makes), voice recognition, uploads of pre-determined destinations from your home computer, etc.
So, if you are into technology, and use Navigation several time a year, then it is well worth the added expense since you will get that investment back when trading the car in.
As for the cost of Navigation and back up camera in the BMW, I think $3500 is way over priced. Lexus NAV system which includes *ENFORM (similar to On-Star) and blue tooth, etc., is only $1500, give or take $200. Why so much for BMW NAV and Back up camera? The option must include other equipment or technology for that price, no?
2024 Genesis G90 Super-Charger
I have NAV and all the other bundled items. I just like the big screen and how everything is integrated. The actual navigation is bettered by the Google maps app on my Android phone. At least now many of the factory systems say the street names.
2025 Ram 1500 Laramie 4x4 / 2023 Mercedes EQE 350 4Matic
Yes, the larger screen is a nice feature. In my new GS350, if you get the NAV, it comes with a 13" screen which can be split in order to monitor other systems along with NAV.
Older cars with NAV systems need to be updated with new routes and roads. I believe the manufacturers charge several hundred dollars to update your NAV system using their computer connections at their dealerships. But with mich older cars, they cannot be updated. Not always essential, but nice to get current info.
The new NAV systems are much more utilitarian than ever with lots of other connected features available. And yes, some cars are more difficult to sell as used without some of the updated systems now available.
2024 Genesis G90 Super-Charger
The most amusing thing about the call I made today was when the guy said to avoid having a bill sent next year and having to call to get it corrected like I have been doing, I should just call next year BEFORE the present subscription lapses and tell them I don’t want to pay MSRP and they will correct the bill to the promo rate before they send out the bill. The guy actually said, “I see you have been doing this for a few years now and calling next year will save both of us the work of going through this type of change again”. :surprise:
The reason I have them send a bill is because if I gave them my CC number they would have hit my card for the then prevailing rate and getting a change then would not have been so easy.
I don’t know how many of you guys do this but it definitely works.
jmonroe
'15 Genesis V8 with Ultimate Package and '18 Legacy Limited 6 cyl
What's with the funny business when you use apostrophes or quotation marks? Are you trying to be fancy or is that another ghost in Edmunds machine?
2019 Kia Soul+, 2015 Mustang GT, 2013 Ford F-150, 2000 Chrysler Sebring convertible
That said, with most cars, they'll essentially depreciate to near zero in time, so the more paid the more lost. As technology progresses, the old tech becomes useless, so today's nav may not be worth much or anything at all in ten years. Eight track, tape deck, and CD players, anyone?
RE:XM we are always on some sort of promo. I refuse to give that poor excuse of a company anymore than I have to. My fiancé loves it, so that is why we have it.
2025 Ram 1500 Laramie 4x4 / 2023 Mercedes EQE 350 4Matic
Yes, *tjc, barely on life support. My new car has a single disc player, and when I complained, the manager said, "...give me your iPhone!" He connected it to the applications sub-system run by *Enform, and low and behold I had an iPod, iHeart Radio, and Pandora radio. I was able to listen to KOST in Los Angeles, the station I used to listen to 24/7 when I lived in southern California and my favorite Chicago station. And I was able to customize the stations and the artists.
Yes, CD's are on life support BARELY!!!
2024 Genesis G90 Super-Charger
I totally agree with you, *tyguy. Cars are meant for getting you from one place to another and then home again. All this hi-tech stuff does is make it more difficult for you to get their safely due to all the distractions. Most os my apps are accessible even when the car is moving, which is outrageous. I have voice recognition for telephone and NAV, which works all the time, but the apps should be frozen (access to the apps, that is) when driving the car.
We are all disgusted with those drivers who talk on their cell phones (they don't have blue tooth) and hold up traffic at a light because they are not paying attention to their external environment. Texting causes the same reaction - they become oblivious to what is happening outside their car.
The sooner they outlaw texting and hand held use of cell phones in cars while engaged in moving vehicular traffic, the better. Sure it's nice to have all these technologies available in your car, but the safety of YHE driving public and pedestrians must be a priority.
Every time I sit behind a car at a light that just turned green and thaw driver of that car is texting or on his/her cell phone (no Bluetooth) I want to scream and possibly take out the SOB. But until laws are passed prohibiting these activities and drivers receive very stiff fines braking those laws, this will continue to cause accidents, etc!
2024 Genesis G90 Super-Charger
Yes, *tjc, I am in that same situation. My XM trial subscription for music and news expires in August. But my NAV weather and traffic and fuel prices goes through next May. The wanted about $15 a month including fees and taxes for my music/news programming. I figured I'd wait until the beginning of August and then threaten them to cancel that portion of my subscription and see if the offer me a special deal. I don't need news, just music, so they have music only plans as well. I'm hoping for 3 months free per year or better for 2 year plan.
Let me know if you are aware of something like that. I was able to get it on Sirius, so maybe XM will offer it as well.
Thanks for the info!
2024 Genesis G90 Super-Charger
And if you don't have an iPhone?
That being said I took a flash drive and filled it with music that she who must be obeyed likes and plugged it into the Sonata.
2011 Hyundai Sonata, 2014 BMW 428i convertible, 2015 Honda CTX700D
I believe it will work with most smart phones. The apps work through a blue tooth streaming connection along with *Enform app on most cell phones (smart phones only). And yes, it will accept a flash as well. I should have been more complete in my last post - my apologies.
The point I am trying to make is that due to all this advanced tech in the new cars, CD's will soon be a thing of the past. I am going to copy all my favorite CD's onto my computer and then create a flash of them to play in my car. I don't download music via iTunes because of the cost involved. Why pay for music you already have on CD?
Do you have access to iHeart radio in your car or Pandora? Great sources for music, especially if you don't have satellite radio or are away from big cities where there are lots of FM HD broadcasts.
I have found FM HD stations have the best quality sound reproduction in my car. The sound is as good, if not better than CD's.
2024 Genesis G90 Super-Charger
Bravo! A man after my own heart. The only accident I ever had 40+ years ago was because I was fiddling with the radio. I get nervous taking my eyes off the road. I require none of the modern tech that costs so much in today's cars. I don't even bring my antique cell phone with me unless I'm going out of town.
Just more stuff to break.
2019 Kia Soul+, 2015 Mustang GT, 2013 Ford F-150, 2000 Chrysler Sebring convertible
Who needs those fancy new CDs when you can have this:
http://tampa.craigslist.org/hdo/ctd/3071391519.html
I might ask driver100 to put down a deposit for me next time he goes on vacation.
2019 Kia Soul+, 2015 Mustang GT, 2013 Ford F-150, 2000 Chrysler Sebring convertible
OK I should rephrase the question. What if you don't have a smart phone?
Truth be told I don't have a smart phone and I don't see a need for one (for me, I know others may need and/or want one) in the near future.
The point I am trying to make is that due to all this advanced tech in the new cars, CD's will soon be a thing of the past.
While CD's may become a thing of the past it will be because something else will replace it. Pretty much how CD's replaced cassettes and cassettes replaced 8-tracks. There will always be some need for a compact way to store, carry and/or transport music.
Yeah I know you can disgitally download music but I cannot foresee that being the only way music is sold. Now I just bought the score for the entire Rings cycle and that would have been good to have avaliable on a flash drive since it is something like 16 hours of music.
2011 Hyundai Sonata, 2014 BMW 428i convertible, 2015 Honda CTX700D
2011 Hyundai Sonata, 2014 BMW 428i convertible, 2015 Honda CTX700D
The short answer is BMW has become ridiculous with accessories...you have to but a package of goods to get one item. My wife really wanted a button on the mirror that will open the garage door. Is that called Home Link. To get that you need ZWP Premium Package. It includes,
Navi, Harmon/Kardon Sound, dimming exterior mirrors, lumbar support, park distance control-rear, alarm,universal remote, comfort access, rear camera, and CIC contribution - whatever in the heck that is!
All these items at a cost of $4500, just to get a $200 garage door opener.
About the rear camera. I wouldn't normally buy one but it came with a package I needed with my 535. Once you get used to it you wouldn't want to be without it.
Backing up has caused lots of injuries, accidents, and deaths. Those cameras are ppretty cheap...I think $50 to $200 to make. I think they will become mandatory soon, and they are very good. There is even some peripheral vision so you can see to the sides when backing out of a parking spot.
2017 MB E400 , 2015 MB GLK350, 2014 MB C250
2020 Acura RDX tech SH-AWD, 2023 Maverick hybrid Lariat luxury package.
2001 Prelude Type SH, 2022 Highlander XLE AWD, 2025 Camry SE AWD
still working on the wife about it. Honestly, her biggest hang up? It look too much like a wagon!
2020 Acura RDX tech SH-AWD, 2023 Maverick hybrid Lariat luxury package.
2001 Prelude Type SH, 2022 Highlander XLE AWD, 2025 Camry SE AWD
yeah, it was a short drive in the Legacy, but still made an impression.
2020 Acura RDX tech SH-AWD, 2023 Maverick hybrid Lariat luxury package.
Richard
Richard
Richard
Richard
Richard
I'm so glad to hear that. Your plans sound really nice. You'll have a wonderful affair and many memories to share with one another. Those 100 days will be fleeting little droplets of time. Keep us posted on developments.
Yes, this house is truly the dream of our lives. We're so blessed to have the antiques, paintings, silver, etc. to lend it justice. Since this will be our last one, we are pouring our hearts into each and every room. The grounds are so pretty and we were fortunate to retain the man who has cared for them the last 30 years. He is teaching me so much that I need to know about the plants. As Dave said, it helps to be retired. We can devote each day to this project.
Richard
Nice town right along I-95. When I used to live in PA, I always made it a point to spend the night in Lumberton. NC, on my way down to FL to visit my folks. Great restaurants and great people.
I have a nephew who is a cardiologist in Raleigh and when I go to visit him and his family, I always try to get back to Lumberton to spend a day or two there. Reminds me of my youth when I lived way out on the eastern end of Long Island and the nice, quiet and "homey" feel and personality of areas like that.
*richard. You and the Mrs. Sure picked a great place yo live!
2024 Genesis G90 Super-Charger
So my question, how hard is it to tamper with modern digital odometers and is there something about that process that would land the reading at 140,000?
The voices in my head await your answer. :surprise:
2019 Kia Soul+, 2015 Mustang GT, 2013 Ford F-150, 2000 Chrysler Sebring convertible
As for the possibility that you are possibly plagued with paranoia, I leave that up to you and your psychiatrist to diagnose! But as to the possible cause of such paranoia, it is extremely difficult to turn odometers back, but not impossible. The old story about giving humanity a tremendous incentive to do something - like make more money than you are entitled to make - and presto, a way to accomplish that immediately comes to fruition.
When a dealership sells a used vehicle, they must provide the buyer with a legal document verifying that the mileage shown on the odometer is, in fact, correct and that the odometer has not been tampered with. The penalties for circumventing this statute are quite severe, both civilly and criminally. But when purchasing a car online or from a private party that is sold "as is" is another story. The old adage "buyer beware" should be the guiding principal one should use as a cautionary principal when buying from private parties.
The fact that the number 140,000 seems to be cropping up more frequently than it should may be more of a numerology phenomena than as a result of falsifying odometer readouts. But, if the 140,000 figure is right on the 140,000 mark, not 141,342 or some other figure similar to that, I think I would become suspicious, but not paranoid!
2024 Genesis G90 Super-Charger
Just too many problems if we buy or lease the car in Canada. Just a few problems are;
Cost will be about 20% more
You can't leave a car in Florida for more than 6 months or your insurance stops,
You can't get U.S. insurance on a Canadian car,
The car will need certain modifications if you licence it for Florida,
No, that is one reason we decided not to bring down the 335. Just too complicated......but, keep thinking, we have until the end of July or maybe August before we order.
2017 MB E400 , 2015 MB GLK350, 2014 MB C250