Stories from the Sales Frontlines

graphicguy

nyc...congratz to you and your family. Although I didn't take over my late Father's business, I certainly grew up logging plenty of hours working for him. So, it's not easy..especially for you over the last few years.

It's hard work. And, the buck truly starts and stops with you. Every decision has the potential to make, or break a small business...the margin for error is so small. That said, there's nothing more satisfying than running your own business.

nyccarguy

I agree. I get excited when we have "a good day" or if I make a "great buy" that pays off. On the flip side, it drives me nuts when we have a "slow day." It definitely isn't easy. I leave my house between 6:15 & 6:30 every AM then don't get home until at least after 6:30 at night.

Sandman6472

Did that for years when the kids were small, 6 days a week. Though I worked for Uncle Sam, those long hours really do a number on ya. I worked all the ot I could get as I was the sole breadwinner with 3 young rugrats. It was hard and those were difficult years as I missed so much but that's the price we pay when we have a family and want to live a nice middle class lifestyle. luckily when the boy was in elementary school, the wife decided to go back part time since she is a professional and could make so much more than I could if she went to work full time. But the choice we made were similar to yours where she worked part time and was there to pick them up and it worked really well.
Now I am finally at that age where I can enjoy the fruits of our labor. And this is why I am doing all this stuff now. Having that gift from my dad just makes it so much easier. But you will see at a certain point, you become more important and it's time to make oneself happy and us being guys, our vehicles make us happy. And especially us Edmund guys who live and breathe this stuff. I want a new car!!!

The Sandman

driver100

between 6:15 & 6:30 every AM then don't get home until at least after 6:30 at night.

Just a quick comment. Entrepeneurs usually work a minimum of 50 hours a week, and they are the first ones into work and the last to leave....in most cases.

I always worked for someone else, but after getting canned due to downsizing 3 times in 4 years, my only option was to work for myself.

The very beginning was the hardest, but once I got rolling, I found out I would rather make half the amount, and be my own boss.

Fortunately, I made over 10X the amount....getting fired was the second best thing that happened to me, the first was meeting my wife (I can't count kids in this equation) who was a major help in encouraging me. I had no idea what I was doing or how we would survive financially, but every day as I drove off she would say, "Have Fun".

Having your own business means constantly working and changing, and finding new markets and new products or new ways to do things....you can't just coast.......but, it is a wonderful feeling to be part of it when it is working.

houdini1

You need to have a plan in advance in case something goes wrong with your car buying plan. For instance, let's say you buy the Verano and your wife takes a shine to it and decides that it is her Verano.

Remember the old saying, "If mama ain't happy, ain't nobody happy".

stickguy

I thought of that scenario for him (the wife wanting to take it away from him). That is probably the best case for Sandy though. Gets the wife squared away with something nice (and no need to deal with more issues on the Mazda). And he gets to go out to shop for himself all over again!

oldfarmer50

"...I would rather make half the amount..."

I'm happy to say that I accomplished that my first year in business.:)

houdini1

I also thought that scenario might work for sandy if he can have the patience to wait.

The other thing he could do if he wants to be sure he gets the first car, is to be sure he finds something that he likes but that his wife just can't stand. Maybe something with a manual trans.

Sandman6472

Luckily I have the patience of a saint and can wait, hell, she could have the Verano and let me take the Mazda for a bit! And we talked earlier about the possibility of having 2 Verano's in the fleet as I said I just know if I buy it, you're gonna like it so much that you will just take it over. But I can wait and if nothing happens and I just replace the head unit and wait a couple years, that could work also. I am not totally stuck on getting a new vehicle though I really do want to, a new sound system would give me something I could enjoy...and so much cheaper to boot. I will do something I know that...I will do something here!

The Sandman

driver100

we talked earlier about the possibility of having 2 Verano's in the fleet

Just tossing this one one there......aren't the Verano and the Cruze basically the same car? Would you consider one Verano and one Cruze or two Cruzes (or is it Cruzers?)

I parked next to a new Impala yesterday. Beautiful inside....if you like curved lines and swoopy - I don't. It did look more like a Cadillac or upscale Buick than a Chevy.

My BIL was with me and he has a 2008 Impala and before that he used to buy only GM trucks. Now he buys Toyotas and he said he will never buy another Impala or GM product again.

He has a neighbor in his community who used to work at GM....now retired. The guys daughter came over to show the family her new Camry.
She isn't allowed to park it in the driveway, only on the street.

We have a neighbor who has had a good friend for over 20 years. Her friend's husband worked at GM and was retired. When our neighbors bought a new Hyundai her friend wouldn't talk to her.

Strange world..................

driver100

we talked earlier about the possibility of having 2 Verano's in the fleet

Just tossing this one one there......aren't the Verano and the Cruze basically the same car? Would you consider one Verano and one Cruze or two Cruzes (or is it Cruzers?)

I parked next to a new Impala yesterday. Beautiful inside....if you like curved lines and swoopy - I don't. It did look more like a Cadillac or upscale Buick than a Chevy.

My BIL was with me and he has a 2008 Impala and before that he used to buy only GM trucks. Now he buys Toyotas and he said he will never buy another Impala or GM product again.

He has a neighbor in his community who used to work at GM....now retired. The guys daughter came over to show the family her new Camry.
She isn't allowed to park it in the driveway, only on the street.

We have a neighbor who has had a good friend for over 20 years. Her friend's husband worked at GM and was retired. When our neighbors bought a new Hyundai her friend wouldn't talk to her.

Strange world..................

Michaell

driver, the Cruze and the Verano are more "cousins" - same platform, different powertrains.

The Cruze comes with either the 1.8L 4-cyl (LS) or 1.4L turbo (LT, LTZ). The Verano has either the 2.4L 4-cyl or 2.0L turbo. The max HP on the Cruze is 138, while the minimum HP on the Verano is, I think, 182.

driver100

Cruze and the Verano are more "cousins" - same platform, different powertrains.

Thanks for explaining Michaell. When I read early reviews for the Verano I believe they said it was the luxury version of a Cruze.....but, that probably meant built on same platform in car jargon.

I have seen a few Veranos, not many, but they look like a substantial expensive car......should be good value. Considering the price I thought I would have seen more by now.......any ideas about that?

Sandman6472

The difference is really like night or day...the Verano is a more upscale vehicle and it feels it the moment you sit down...GM did a great job here and if I am ready to buy domestic, you know it must be great because I am a foreign car buyer...always! This Buick is that good that I am willing to come back to a domestic and really only one of a handful of vehicles I want to purchase. Still plan on driving the Mini again just to see once and for all because that vehicle screams FUN! And if we both had the same kind of vehicle that would be o k to, I couldn't care less since I will be driving both at times and maintaining them.
I am enjoying the search though and since my hours have been cut back, what else have I to do? Figure by December 31st if I have no serious offers on the Civic, it'll stay and I'll swap out the radio...need to give it some time to sell.

The Sandman

imidazol97

I would expect this week to be slow for many people looking for a used car. With all the sales on Black Friday being pushed in the media and people traveling for Thanksgiving, I'd expect next week to pick up when people have time to sit down online and search.

I'd hold the price and see if someone who cares enough to actually come and see the car will bite or offer a handful of cash close to that.

Sandman6472

"Show me the cash" as they say and I'll cut her from the herd at this point. And yes, this week is probably a wash but hopefully next week will have a cash buyer who sees the value I do...and it is there. But again, if it doesn't sell than I'll just go with plan B and that'll be that. But once the new car bug hits ya, it's real hard to make it go away...purchasing something different usually is the only sure fire way to make it go away. And I agree, I don't want to lower the price quite yet as I did put negotiable in the ad...and I did mean it! I just want it to go to a good home cause it is a great reliable vehicle.

The Sandman

Michaell

Sandy, my daughter drives a MINI and while I agree with you that they are quite a blast to drive, I'm not so certain it would be a good car given your back issues. They ride very stiff and you can feel every bump in the road.

driver, I've not driven the Verano but did rent a Cruze for several days on my last visit to California. You are right in that they are built off the same platform, but there are enough differences between them (engines, as I mentioned earlier) to make them very different offerings to the public.

I like them both but I went with the Hyundai because I was looking for a hatchback. Chevrolet does offer both a Cruze hatch and wagon in Europe, but for some reason they don't offer it in the US.

The one version of the Verano I really like is the 2.0L turbo model. 250 HP and an available 6-speed manual transmission - for about $30K.

Kirstie_H

Yes, it seems like you can check in any time you like, but you can never leave. All part of our grand master plan.

Convoluted instructions: When you're signed in, go to the Edmunds.com home page. Click on the little icon at the top that looks like a person's head and shoulders. On the next page, which is the "sign in" page, click "sign out" at the top. Why does it work there and not in forums? No clue.

driver100

GM did a great job here and if I am ready to buy domestic, you know it must be great because I am a foreign car buyer.

I thought the Verano and Cruze were built in Korea. Or do you just mean American nameplate?

driver100

I've not driven the Verano but did rent a Cruze for several days

On our drive to Florida down I-75 which has a speed limit of 70mph most of the way, I was doing 75 to 80...like 80% of the other drivers. I was surprised at how many Cruzes went by me....I think more of those passed me than any other single make.

Do Cruze drivers drive faster, do they not care about their lives, are they just more reckless, does the car lend itself to being driven fast?

robr2

Most of them were probably rentals so it's not the car....IMHO.

jmonroe

*** That's a good list. To get a car that has some feeling to it you give up some reliability. I would only consider an Audi, VW, BMW, Rover, Volvo if I knew it had a warranty and if I knew I could afford to dump it if it became too much trouble.

Otherwise, I would have to settle for a Toyota, Honda, Hyundai, Lexus, Acura. ***

I have heard you say this before and I never understood why, if you are willing to spend more money, you have to be willing to expect less. Be it performance or quality or most importantly reliability.

If a grocery getter can be reliable, and a lot of them have a lot of widgets today, why should you have to hold your breath when you buy an upscale car and it is out of warranty?

If this kind of reasoning was equated to starting a new car company (pay less so you get less), Honda and Toyota never would have survived or even made it to the second decade. They stayed with it, showed signs of improvement and have thrived over the years. So much so that they are the benchmark for well made reliable cars, with whatever options they put on them. Yes, they had a slow start but they are finishing fast.

jmonroe

Sandman6472

Car hasn't sold yet but did add some new pics...keeping it at $9995 for the time being...again, why should I give the thing away? Bat [non-permissible content removed] crazy to do that right now since it is working perfectly!!!
Got a new job today, that gig in West Palm Beach so am happy and still waiting on Hertz to come through here. I am a happy camper though!

The Sandman :sick: :shades:

[Deleted User]

I thought the Verano and Cruze were built in Korea. Or do you just mean American nameplate?

They're US built, mostly. The manual transmission was from Europe, but could be US today. The design was world sourced with GM design centers from Asia involved along with others, but the actual build for US deliveries is in the USA. Even the Diesel engine is being manufactured in Michigan.

Ty

oldfarmer50

"...strange world..."

Wow, that is strange. Everyone knows you don't get angry with someone who buys a car of which you disapprove.

.......you wait until they leave and then laugh at them behind their back!

oldfarmer50

"...Different power trains..."

Guy at work has a Cruze with the 1.4LT. I swear there's enough room in that engine compartment for a 6 cyl.

I'm smelling an SS version with the GM 3.6L sometime down the road.

oldfarmer50

Will this ever end? Now I find that the cigarette lighter is broken. Oh the humanity! Not that I ever smoked, or know anyone that smokes, or would allow anyone to smoke in the car but what if I did?

On a positive note I must have blown out 15 years of old lady carbon because the car is noticeably faster now than when I bought it. A former Porche mechanic at work says it has an adaptive transmission which is "learning" what I like but I doubt an old 95 had such technology.

What say the experts?

stickguy

when I bought my Volvo 2 years back, the only problem I discovered when I got home was a dead power port (modern speak for a "cigarette lighter"). Pulled out the manual, found the fuse that controlled that, replaced it (conveniently, Volvo included some spares in the fuse box). Problem solved!

my guess, someone spilled liquid into the hole at some point. Or being a volvo, it just decided to blow a fuse. hasn't been a problem since though.

explorerx4

I'm with you, it's the regular driving that is helping old 'Abe' run better.

Sandman6472

Still like that generation Volvo but decided against it back in '09 when I was looking. Probably should've bitten the bullet then and picked one up and then I'd be in a different place now. But she was as unhappy then as now so that part of the equation remains the same! Starting to like the idea of replacing the head unit more and more if it can be done while giving me the desired results I require...better sound plus XM radio. But how would the XM come through the radio? Would there be a special antennae or since the unit would be XM ready, does that mean that it's already in the guts of the unit and would pick up the signal similar to how wifi works in our house? Just not to sure how this stuff all works really? It's very seamless in the house once the device recognizes the wifi signal or the password is put into it.
Very tech challenged here...and not ashamed to admit it and ask for help from experts.

The Sandman

stickguy

the radio will have the XM receiver integrated, but you are going to have to run an antennae someplace, but that is easy enough. Ideally it will be run outside, but does not have to be.

I used non-OEM units in my TL (my sister had that installed when she owned it) and my Odyssey. In the TL, the wire was run through to the trunk, and under the top weather seal on the trunk lid. the antennae itself is magnetic, and just sits on the top of the trunk.

in the van, I never felt like pulling off the rubber strip, so I just stuck it on the top of the dash, up near the windshield. Work perfectly fine, and I never felt the need to run it outside.

quite likely that new designs have a different style of antennae (maybe stuck on the back window inside?), but one way or another, you will need one.

jmonroe

*** when I bought my Volvo 2 years back, the only problem I discovered when I got home was a dead power port (modern speak for a "cigarette lighter").

my guess, someone spilled liquid into the hole at some point. Or being a volvo, it just decided to blow a fuse. hasn't been a problem since though. ***

You could be right but my money is on a bad battery charger. That was the culprit for son #2’s GPS charger when we went on vacation this past summer to Myrtle Beach.

While on the road he noticed that his GPS went dead and he was a little surprised because he had it plugged in to make sure that didn’t happen. When he mentioned it to his wife she said, “OH, I meant to tell you about that. I replaced the fuse a couple of times and it kept happening. I think it only happens when the GPS charger is plugged in. The port in the back where the kid’s plug in their games is fine”. (where is the confused emotorcon when you need it?). Son #2 says, “gee, thanks for telling me.” (where is the pissed off emotorcon when you need it?).

While in Myrtle Beach he went to Rip-Off Radio Shack and got a new charger. Since I’m posting you can tell that we didn’t get lost on the way home. (probably a good spot for another emotorcon here but I don’t know which one).

jmonroe

graphicguy

OK....so, just returned from an early a.m. meeting with the Audi district rep at the dealership regarding my broken S4.

I think I've been fairly amenable so far, given the amount of time the car has been in the shop (now going on 3 weeks, just this last visit).

He asked me what kind of gas I was using. Huh? What does that have to do with the MMI not working correctly, and the binding of the Quattro system? So, I told him eithter Shell premium or Costco premium. There you have it. He diagnosed the problem right there. Costco gas. That's the cause of all the problems.

He said he'd authorize the dealership to clean my injectors gratis, but that's usually the responsibility of the customer. And, that both Shell and Costco use too many additives and it's not "pure gas". Even the dealership service manager shook his head.

I'm supposed to pick it up tomorrow. So, I asked him what gas I should use (he said Exxon-Mobil exclusively) and what would happen if the problems persisted? He said he looks at all issues on a per incident basis. So, if I have another "incident", he'd consider it a new issue, not the same issue as before.

I have seen incompetence in the past, but this goes above and beyond incompetence to stupidity.

I told him I would take a ride with the service manager tomorrow when I come to pick up my "fixed" car. And, if the MMI was still not working properly, and the Quatrro system was still binding going around corners, I would begin lemon procedures. He was incredulous that I would do such a thing given all he authorized the dealer to do for me for free (understand, there's still about 2 more years of bumper-to-bumper warranty left).

ray80

'So, I asked him what gas I should use (he said Exxon-Mobil exclusively) '

That would seem to be an interesting thought, he says not to use costco or shell (top-tier fuel with additives), and suggests mobil-exxon (also top tier with additives) .

jmonroe

**** I have seen incompetence in the past, but this goes above and beyond incompetence to stupidity. ***

I can’t say I’m all that surprised. When I had the engine problem with Mrs. j’s XG 350 I got no help from the Hyundai rep and I never even got to talk to him first hand. You at least got a face to face meeting with the guy who was going to screw you. I could never get that far. The dealer said he doesn’t talk to the customers.

From what I have heard and seen firsthand, factory reps are just a useless position on the payroll of car companies. Seems like they are all alike. Whether it is a Hyundai or an upscale badged machine.

jmonroe

houdini1

Useless to the car owner, but an important tool to some car companies. Their job is to grasp at any straw in order to blame any and all problems on the owner and not the car company.

GG-It might be interesting to let Shell and Costco know what you were told.

Sandman6472

Not sure if this is really the smart thing to do but if I did it, I'd happily keep the car till it's 10 year mark if it behaves as it has been up to now. Figure I could be otd for around $500 with a decent unit since that was about the price I was given back in March when I tossed this idea around. Having XM would be wickedly fun for me actually while the other features would just add to it...I like XM a whole lot and having it would make that new car itch go away temporarily here. And like I said in an earlier post, a whole lot less expensive also!
Decisions, decisions! Have already printed out a copy of the Florida Bill Of Sale just in case the Civic does sell in the meantime...which would be pretty cool. just go rent a cheapie vehicle for a couple of weeks until I make a final purchase decision. Time will tell here.

The Sandman

Michaell

GG, I read with interest the issues you had with Cadillac a few years ago, and this latest saga with Audi is also intriguing.

Would love for you to get the rep's recommendation to use Exxon-Mobil gas in writing, then, as suggested, take it to Costco and Shell for their reaction.

However, with that said, I really think Audi will be buying your S4 back - multiple attempts to solve the same problem without success falls squarely in the definition of 'lemon'.

The good news is that you'll get to go shopping again! Do you still have the Fiesta, or did the son get that? I know you usually have something to get you to/from the airport.

murphydog

I am certain this is the exception - my 08 C350 had a leak in the air conditioning. My neighbor noticed the leak when I had the hood open to check the oil. Car is one year out of warranty, but has 34,000 miles. Took it to the dealer for annual service and asked them to check the AC - sure enough confirmed leak. I asked the service manager to reach out to MBUSA as the car only had such low miles, though I was not hopeful. Surprise surprise - a week later I get an email that the repair is approved and the parts are in!

I don't know what I did, or how he asked to get it approved, but I was shocked and very pleased.

GG - good luck with your Audi - love the look of those cars, too bad you are having such issues.

Oh and FWIW, I fill my MB exclusively at Costco - premium all the way.

robr2

gg - didn't you buy it out of state? If so, you'll probably have to deal with that state's AG for resolution.

robr2

Surprise surprise - a week later I get an email that the repair is approved and the parts are in!

Do you use this dealer regularly for service? If so, you've just experienced the value of a customer phenomenon. Make money for the service department and treat the service adviser with all "Excellents" and this will continue to happen.

jayrider

I would like to see the gas recommendation in writing and send it to Audi USA headquarters. Also would like to see where Mobile is the gas to use if you don't want problems with the drivetrain. Maybe it is in the owners manual in fine print. I hope you post this in the Audi discussions.

roadburner

Do you use this dealer regularly for service? If so, you've just experienced the value of a customer phenomenon. Make money for the service department and treat the service adviser with all "Excellents" and this will continue to happen.

That has been my experience with both my BMW and Mazda dealers. that said, I rate them as "Excellent" because they actually DO provide first-rate service.
So I'm really reluctant to tempt fate by switching brands. The Fiat dealer is in the same dealer group as my BMW dealer, so I think I'd likely be OK with an Abarth. OTOH, I'm a bit tempted by the Fiesta ST- but my experiences with Ford dealer service and parts departments have been uneven at best.

robr2

That has been my experience with both my BMW and Mazda dealers. that said, I rate them as "Excellent" because they actually DO provide first-rate service.

I'm lucky in that is the case with my Honda, VW and Ford dealer. If there is an issue, I speak directly with the service adviser or manager rather than through the survey. Recently, I had to change the timing belt on my Passat 20K miles early because the water pump failed - it made sense to do it. 3 weeks later, my tstat went. The labor needed was similar to the timing belt in that the nose had to be dropped. I mentioned it to the service manager who checked my history and noted that the service adviser didn't ask me if I wanted to replace the tstat when the timing belt was done - which they usually do. Hence the manager gave me 3 hours of free labor which I used next time I was in for an exhaust issue.

I see the Honda service dept once a year for the 7500 mile check up. But after 20 years of going there, the service adviser always gives me a discount on the service and on the oil change parts which I do myself.

isellhondas

OK, that cinches it. I can't ever own an Audi.

They don't have Exxon-Mobil gas stations around here!

I use either Shell or Chevron in our Hondas and have never had any kind of a problem.

I will say that Hondas and my former lawn mower did NOT like Arco gas!

I took the mower into the shop and the first thing I was asked was had I put Arco gas in it? Yep! Cleaned the carb and the problem was solved.

Whenever a Honda would come into the shop with a rough idle of other hard to find drivability the Service Advisors would ask if they used Arco.

Seriously, Arco created problems yet I know a lot of people use it.

ohenryx

my experiences with Ford dealer service and parts departments have been uneven at best.

I wouldn't call mine "uneven", I would just go with "bad". (smile)

nyccarguy

That STINKS! (Can't say anything else because we have to keep it PG in here) I'll bet you he would have fed you the same load of garbage if you told him you exclusively use Exxon/Mobil Gas: "You should try Shell or even Costco." I know you have been patient and keeping your cool, but this has got to have you fuming inside!

Do you use the same dealer as markincincinnati?

sterlingdog

"Thanks for trying to help but I don't know how to post a picture."

I had to laugh. Here is a man who knows everything about plumbing, wiring, auto repair, etc. and he can't post a picture on this forum. Neither can I but I have an excuse---I'm technically challenged.

Speaking of finding valves and other parts, there is simply nothing like the old fashioned hardware store, if you can find one in your area. When we purchased this house, the powder bath downstairs had a beautiful hand painted flowered lavatory and very ornate brass handles purchased at Harrods of London. The cold water valve was broken. Our plumber tried all of the big box stores and the plumbing supply stores within 200 miles. We had no luck. We refused to give up the one of a kind sink and faucets. I made an overseas call to Harrods in London. Not since the 1950's had those sinks been produced. They had no idea where I could find any replacement parts. We decided to keep the sink and faucets simply as a conversation piece, though my wife was very disappointed that guests couldn't wash their hands there.

One night I sat straight up in bed. I remembered an old college friend who was running his grandfather's hardware store in another part of the state. I managed to track down his phone number and gave him a call. He said for me to bring the valve to him because if he didn't have it, he would love the challenge of finding it. It would also give us a chance to catch up on old times. The following Friday we took our old valve, and a spark of hope, on the road to visit my old friend. Early Saturday morning, he and I went down to the store. What a store it was; it had everything a person could want---both new and old. In the back were over 20 shelves from floor to ceiling containing old parts. Jim got on his rolling ladder and began to look for the valve serial number. No luck. He then pulled out old catalogues from the 40's and 50's. After about an hour, he found the part in a catalogue. He returned to the ladder and began another search. After about 20 minutes, he suddenly shouted, "Got it!". I couldn't believe it. In a little bin over in one corner, he found two sets for both hot and cold water. He insisted that I accept them as a gift.

Since everyone at home had said that I would never find the replacement valve, I couldn't wait for them to see my success. On Monday morning, I called my plumber to come and install one of the new sets. On the phone, he bet me that I had brought home the wrong valve. Much to his surprise, and my delight, the valve was a perfect fit. Our guests can now use the powder bath with comfort. My wife was thrilled. The bottom line is that old hardware stores are real treasures when you are seeking the difficult to find.

Richard

Michaell

Do you use the same dealer as markincincinnati?

Yeah, I was thinking about ol' Mark as I read GG's story about on the S4 trials and tribulations.

Yes, GG bought his S4 at a dealer in Chicago, but I think all the maintenance has been done in OH.

dino001

This is not incompetence you are experiencing. It is lazyness mixed with bad faith and lack of any kind of conscience. To even suggest that electronic control module and mechanical differential binding can have anything to do with gas is not incompetent - it is shameless and qualifies for investigation by a state attorney.