Stories from the Sales Frontlines

jmonroe

You are truly amazing.

And I am finished with you!

I get that all the time when I drive home a point.

jmonroe

madmanmoo

I wonder if Rlatham or GraphicGuy are around anymore. Both of them had some great stories and I haven't heard from them in a long time. I read back over some older posts and realized that some fresh blood really kicks this forum into high gear.

If ANY of the lurkers care to share, please feel free. I would love to read some new perspectives.

On another note, there is quite a downpour right now in Atlanta. It's supposed to rain all day and we sure need it. This drought needs to go.

-moo

joel0622

It is standard with a l/s rear end. If it didn't have it the car would have been side ways to say the least when he dumped the clutch. I think it is a 3:31.1 but don't quote me, my product knowledge fu is weak.

wesleyg

Isell: with all due respect, I very much disagree with your philosophy that all cars that are the same model etc. are the same and no need to test drive the one you are buying. As I posted several days ago relating my experience, there are literally thousands of parts on each car and that many opportunities for something to be amiss in your car.

I am sure this applies regardless of the make and even the cost of a vehicle, two new cars parked next to each other in the dealers lot, even though identical Mfg. stickers, could display significant differences in many operating areas merely due to the multitude of parts.

lrguy44

And people here say 2 used cars same color and miles are worth the same trade value. Give me a break.

nthe

yeah, its pouring here in birmingham too.

oldfarmer50

I just assumed that two identical NEW cars would drive pretty much alike. The only reason for any difference would be some sort of abuse or accident between the factory and the dealer.

I have heard stories of transport workers beating up on new cars as they move them about. I supose even a salesman or two has taken a new car out for a joy ride and treated it like a rental.

jmonroe

You are a master of twisting things and, I'm getting tired of it.

Boy…if this isn’t like the pot calling the kettle black I don’t know what is.

I’ve heard of editing a post but you completely changed post 23526 from the way it was originally written. It doesn’t resemble it one bit.

You said in the original edition of post 23526 and I quote it exactly as originally written:

You are truly amazing.

And I am finished with you!

And that’s all you said. No one would ever know that now, if I weren’t writing this.

Now, if someone were to read my post 23528, (which was a complete copy of your original post 23526) they wouldn’t have a clue what I was talking about. I’m sure glad Edmunds had the wisdom to prevent posters from changing other posters posts or you might try to change my post too. I hope you don’t do this with the paperwork when you sell a car. Talk about a loss of credibility.

Since your complete re-write of post 23526 does not even contain any part of the original version, as shown above, does this mean you will still talk to me?

jmonroe

wesleyg

lr: perfect example, every car, even new, is a different creature, let alone a used car. When we sold off our police cars each year to high bidder at a public sale, we made sure at the beginning that all of the cars for sale came with the warning that each one is different from each other.

The vehicles were all Crown Vics, approx. 18 months old, equipped the same way, mileage on each between 75 and 85K, but we stipulated that since they were seldom shut off, the engines run times were equivalent to an ordinary car having 350 to 400K on the odometer. An informed buyer would have known this, but we had to make sure every bidder was aware of this.

When we accepted delivery of perhaps 12 new cruisers, although identically equipped, some new ones felt quite different in driving experience. I'm not referring to a car having a broken or malfunctioning part, but just a general feeling in its operation. This was especially the case during the late 60's when we ran the big block 427 Chevy single four barrel Biscaynes and 421 high output Pontiac Catalinas, each animal is different.

madmanmoo

Ok,

I hope you don’t do this with the paperwork when you sell a car. Talk about a loss of credibility.

Timeout. Please. Jmonroe, you throw around people's credibility like used dishtowels. Show a little more respect. He had a change of mind about his post, which is completely reasonable.

This is starting to pass the lines of friendly banter. If I'm wrong, tell me to shutup. Peace and joy for the holidays! :P

-moo

kyfdx

On my current lot, we have several vehicles that Porsche execs drive and then return to us. (Porsche Cars North America is just down the road from us.) They are never titled and we sell them as demos. They will have anywhere from 1,000 to 6,000 miles on them when we sell them. The customer who purchases them will be the first owner.

So... Are these usually really loaded up? I'm thinking a 2007 Cayman at about $12K off MSRP?

Not that I'm interested, just curious.. :surprise:

regards,
kyfdx
visiting host

madmanmoo

Loaded up? I wouldn't say that. They have a decent amount of equipment. You'll find a Bose sound system, Sport/Chrono package, heated seats, Auto Climate control, things like that. But they are not normally too crazy in the way of "loaded".

As far as your offer? That's sounds reasonable. I have a couple of beatiful "S" Caymans on the lot, both are exec cars. Interested?

-moo

kyfdx

Un-loaded is good.... the cheaper the better.. Can't afford an "S"...

Just like a salesperson... trying to bump me to a more expensive model, before we even get started..

Just wondering.... thanks!

madmanmoo

One other thing I forgot to mention. These vehicles are priced aggressively when we put them on our lot. They are not viewed as a profit center, but rather a way to get a few more punches for the year. It's like a service provided for the execs and the customers who purchase after them.

We get a slight break on pricing, but nothing crazy.

-moo

madmanmoo

Just wondering.... thanks!

This is a "No wondering" zone. You either want one or you don't.

Seriously though, we've had a couple of very nice models come through. I've sold 2 of these PCNA Caymans since I've been here. One example was a Cayman manual with Bose, heated seats and automatic climate control. That's it! Very nice vehicle with a nice price point as well.

I thought your comment about our leases was pretty funny. You obviously know what you're talking about.

-moo

P.S. One other bonus you get with the PCNA cars. They all have speedfilm on them.

kyfdx

Uh.. is that code? "If it's priced $12K off, don't ask for $14K."

Quit working me....lol..

isellhondas

Well jmonroe,

You must have been literally sitting in front of your computer when I made that first post because after reading it, I immediatly dumped it.

madmanmoo

I guess I'm too obvious. Ya, don't grind me. That's what I'm saying. :shades:

We'll sell you a vehicle AND I'll ship it to your door.

-moo

kyfdx

Stop it!! No soliciting in the forums!!

Some guys! Shewwww....

isellhondas

My point which somehow got knocked around was this.

If I were to line up ten 2008 LX Accords, they would all drive exactly the same.

Other makes may vary I suppose.

jescue

Quit hogging all the Porsche ups. :P

madmanmoo

Always prospecting, especially on a day like today. Wow, we're dead. Between weather and the holidays.... I think tomorrow will be very good though.

-moo

madmanmoo

Always prospecting, especially on a day like today. Wow, we're dead. Between weather and the holidays.... I think tomorrow will be very good though.

-moo

isellhondas

Hogging? I would RUN from them!

I'll take my stodgy Hondas.

madmanmoo

You would RUN from the opportunity to own/drive a Porsche?

What exactly would you base that decision on? Since you've been selling Hondas for so long now, I know you don't have much/if any exposure to these vehicles.

Unless you just don't like sports cars, I would love to hear what that's all about!

-moo

jescue

I will someday have a Boxster. Speed yellow with black, manual of course. It is a perfect vehicle to me.

madmanmoo

One of the other guys is putting together a 993 C2S trade-in right now. Looks great and low miles.

That's my favorite bodystyle. I may pull the trigger.

-moo

jmonroe

Well jmonroe,

You must have been literally sitting in front of your computer when I made that first post because after reading it, I immediatly dumped it.

I’m at my desk so the computer is always on. There was a break in the action here so I turned around, hit “refresh” and I couldn’t believe my eyes.

No problem, at least we’re talking again. It must be that holiday thing, like ‘moo’ was talking about.

jmonroe

oldfarmer50

"...You either want one or you don't..."

If you aren't buying TODAY you're a stroke, right?

madmanmoo

:P

I know he wants one. I know it.

-moo

jmonroe

If I'm wrong, tell me to shutup.

I’d never do that; especially now that I want to get some info from ya.

You might like this since it’s a tale about a Porsche.

Just this past Saturday, son #2 and I were heading out of the Burgh going to my house after visiting someone at the hospital. As I approach an on ramp I see a Porsche just itching to pull into traffic. I’m aware of this on ramp so I always stay in the left lane of this two lane interstate but there is a car in the right lane so the Porsche can’t pull out just yet. My son says, “it looks like junior is out driving daddy’s car today” and he adds that the kid looked pretty young so he couldn’t have had his license very long.

A few seconds go buy and I can hear the roar of this Porsche passing me on the right. Keep in mind its winter so the windows are up, the radio is on and we’re talking to each other and I still heard it. I said to my son that has to be a 911 Turbo to sound like that and to move like it did. I mean I have never ever had a car go by me like that and as you know I didn’t start driving 5 years ago.

This kid starts weaving in out, passing everything. The traffic is kind of heavy so this is the only thing that kept him in sight or he would have been waaaay out of sight in just a few seconds if he had maintained the speed at which he passed me.

We now come to the point where there is a grade and there is now three lanes to accommodate slow moving trucks and people who will be getting off at a couple of exits just ahead on the right. This kid now decides this lane is his lane and he’s moving back and forth between the far right lane and the middle lane. One time, just as he decides to pull into the middle lane, a tandem pick-up starts to get into the far right lane (probably wanted to exit). I’m now off the gas peddle and I said to my son, “this ain’t gonna be good”. The kid ducks back into the right lane so fast that he turned the car around completely, (180 degrees, yep, he’s headed toward the Burgh again). As I go passed this scene, I look in my rear view mirror, there is traffic starting to back up. My son said he didn’t hit the wall on the right and as best as he could tell nobody ran into him or anybody else. It never hurts to be lucky. It would have been interesting to watch as he put the car back into the direction he was originally heading.

Now my question; how much does a 911 Turbo, typically equipped, cost? And, if you don't mind me asking, how much does it cost to clean the drivers seat in a Porsche !!!!

I wouldn’t entrust that car to a new driver, no way.

jmonroe

isellhondas

No, I would RUN from a Porsche "up".

I have had the bejessus scared out of me by idiots in Preludes and S-2000's to the point I avoid people looking at these. Of course, as the Internet Manager, I don't take ups except in very rare occassions.

I once owned a Porsche but the Porsche guys don't consider a 912 to be a "real" Porsche and the snooty shops felt the same way and wouldn't work on it.

I liked it. It was a good little car that didn't cause the expensive problems the 911's did.

Now the 914's were a different story. To me they were glorified Volkswagens.

Still, even they had their fans.

madmanmoo

Yikes,

Sometimes Daddy just entrusts everything to little Junior. I think I told you guys that one of my first ups at the Porsche store was 18 yr old Junior in his Daddy's Lambo.

As far as 911 Turbos, a nicely equipped model would run around $140k or so.

Cleaning the driver's seat? I shudder to think about the mess in that seat.

What year did this happen? The model must have been prior to 997.

-moo

jmonroe

As far as 911 Turbos, a nicely equipped model would run around $140k or so.

Well, that's one more thing that I'll have to put on hold. Darn, I'm gonna run outta time with all the things I've put on hold over the years.

What year did this happen?

Like I said, this just happened this past Saturday, 12-22-07. :surprise:

jmonroe

chikoo

The shaky steering I saw was on a new honda. The owner has balanced, forced balanced, changed tires....to no avail....

oldfarmer50

"...The shaky steering..."

Check the wheels. I couldn't get rid of a vibration until I noticed my front wheel had a dent in it. Seems Mrs. Farmer was up to no good. :mad:

isellhondas

I agree, that's probably the culprit.

Still, if the car had received a proper PDI, that would have been caught.

It's also entirely possible the new owner (or his wife or 16 year old kid) could have rammed it into a curb right after it was delivered.

Who knows? I've never seen this on one I've delivered.

isellhondas

Ah, a 421 Pontiac High Output!

Oh what a SWEET engine that was!

My dream car would be a 1965 Catalina 421 with a 4 speed and tri-power.

I never knew the police used Pontiacs?

roadburner

I never knew the police used Pontiacs?

Don't tell me you never saw Smokey and the Bandit...

chikoo

I wish it were like that...but is not.

The wheels are rash free...u can expect at least that from me...a person who is so meticulous on my person PDOI (pre-drive-off inspection) to at least check for that on my friends Honda. It was also I who suggested him to take it back and have it inspected, et al. He was happy as a whale before I pointed out the shaky steering.

isellhondas

I guess I'm confused.

YOUR car does this?

A friend bought a new Honda, was happy with it until you pointed out a similar problem on his new car and now he feels it too?

joel0622

Something that happens that is missed in PDI some times, and it is rare for this to happen. Probably 5 times in the 15 years I have been here is for the car gets chain downed to tight on the car hauler and something gets tweaked.

Another thing that can happen is the car is PDI'ed and is fine then some one comes in and goes on a test drive and hits a pot hole and knocks it out of wack and does not bother to tell you, or the tires are flat spotted, or it was a dealer trade that was brought in aon a trailer and the other dealer missed something, or a laundry list of other things.

If you drive the car you are buying it eliminates the possibility of you being highly disappointed when you are 2 miles from the dealer. It is always fixable but it sure takes the air out of your balloon when you have to bring back your brand new car back the next day to have something fixed that could have been taken care of if you just would have drove it before you bought it.

Like I said earlier, our policy is you drive what you are buying.

Whats is even more ridiculous is the people who say "I never test drive anything till I have bought it and am driving it home" They won't buy a $500 recliner without sitting there butt in it first but they will buy a $40K car with out driving it. first. :confuse: I point out to those folks several times that there is no buyers remorse law in TN when buying a car.

mackabee

How do you treat a rental? I've never understood that statement. I've rented a couple of Toyotas in the last two months and drove them just the way I drive my own cars.

Mack

mackabee

Well, isn't that what a Porsche is? a glorified VW?
What happened to your customer base?
Mack

chikoo

sorry if I got u confused.

I am the meticulous person. So when my friend got his new Honda, and came over to show it to me the very next morning (he sealed the deal at 10:30PM) I went over his vehicle to see if it had any issues. I took it on a test drive and noticed the shaky steering.

wesleyg

yeah, about 3 years in the mid-sixties with Catalina 421's as I recall, then all Chevy Biscaynes til about the mid-seventies, then the bottom dropped off the hi-po crusiers and they were all Ford Crown Vics from then on up to today.

Not to blame Ford for the performance loss, some of our neighboring departments in the sixties ran Ford Galaxies with the 428's and they kept up with us. One next door dept. ran Plymouth Furies, all 440 big blocks. Needed those cars in those days, On our interstates we would always be parked on bridges (no moving radar then), started writing at 80 and above and you were at a dead stop when clocking.

madmanmoo

That hurts. Because it isn't true.

-moo

jmonroe

How do you treat a rental? I've never understood that statement. I've rented a couple of Toyotas in the last two months and drove them just the way I drive my own cars.

First off, I'm sure 'oldfarmer' doesn't beat his rentals since he's a nice car guy here at Edmunds.

I’ll never understand this renter behavior either but I know it exists. When I was a full time working stiff, I couldn’t begin to count all the rentals I had when I was on business trips and I’m with you, I drove them just as if they were my cars. The way I looked at it, that car was the only thing that was going to get me to where I was going so why would I want to beat it. :confuse:

I did know a young guy who thought it was cute to beat his rentals (I’d never want one that he returned) until he broke down on the interstate at night on his way back to LAX for a flight. The guys who pulled over to help him helped themselves to his wallet at gun point.

jmonroe

oldfarmer50

"...How do you treat a rental?..."

I supose I'm on the gentle side of the car renter spectrum. That said I do like to test out a rental car's capabilities ( especially if it is one I might potentially buy some day).

My original statement was based on things salesmen have told me they have done with cars I am looking at. "Fast? I had this one up to 100 in third gear last week!" Statements like that make me wonder what you guys do when customer traffic is slow.

Speaking of traffic. I have a headache from the constant TV ads for great year end car deals. What happens after new year? Do you start charging more to make up for all the bargains? I would think it is a zero sum game here. If everybody buys a car now January must be a dead as a tomb.

oldfarmer50

"..."oldfarmer' doesn't beat his rentals since he's a nice car guy..."

Awww shucks