Stories from the Sales Frontlines

mako1a

I agree completely with that statement.

Your car is worth what someone will give you for it. Nothing more, nothing less. Exactly like every other market.

When I'm on any lot, this is so true.

mackabee

It will be a rematch of the regular season finale but this time the other team will come out on top.
You heard it here first!
Mack



"Nissan is the superior import"

dino001

Greanpea68 Supervalue Package. Includes two sodas from the vending machine, three pads in the back, a choice of two preselected compliments about customer's wife, attire, or shoes, one hearing on customer's needs and last but not least - framed Greanpea68 Package certificate.

Upgradable to Special Dealer's package with all mop&glo, rust&dust and Greanpea-Joel Hypervalue Package with added extended warranty, Gap and service plan.

Retail value: GP68 SVP: $3999, on sale $2399 (40% off!). GP/J HVP: $8999, on sale: $3199 (60% off!). Additional pads in the back and compliments may be purchased separately for nominal price of $49/each.

jlawrence01

Oh let me guess, is this distant suburb have the same name as a large New Jersey city and does the dealership have a statue of Elvis out front?

Nope. The one that sounds like a 60s rock concert.

snakeweasel

Oh well, it sounded like a dealership along Rt 71 a bit past Yorkville.

chikoo

The average Joe is getting killed every time he buys a new futon or gold necklace and those guys get a free pass.

Agreed!!!

Same goes when you buy a house from a builder. We cannot ask him his "invoice" cost. We have to pay market

chikoo

For what it's worth, where I sell it is true that Asian and Indian customers are more likely to try to haggle with you. For many of them this IS a cultural thing just as most Americans like to argue over football teams. Russians are also likely to get you to lower the price. So skin color has nothing to do with it.

You Forgot Egyptians and Jews.......they are some of the biggest grinders.

benzserviceguy

GP:

Yeah, a busy day at work but I can only 'lurk' at work ... can't post, so I have to wait until I get home.

Yeah, I'll take that bet & I'll take the 7 points.

I will also agree to post "New England sports teams are far superior to NY sports teams" (or something to that effect) IF I lose the wager.

Now, what if the Patsies lose to Big Blue, what will YOU post?

Looking forward top our friendly North (Bawston area) to South (NYC) to West (Cali - my current present locale) rivalry.

-Skip-

chikoo

SOunds like we are hitting close to home

Not yet....

I am not in the apparel biz, but know few folks who are.

chikoo

The Scion will be worth more in in resale

Pay more and get more.

Not so unique.

gmanzx3

The problem is, Saturn has the same MSRP mark up as Honda, Toyota, Chevy, etc. They also sell nearly identical vehicles as other GM dealerships (Aura-Malibu... Outlook-Acadia-Enclave) that do "haggle." Scion's mark-up is a lot closer to invoice, so it's not a direct comparison.

Is Saturn doing it right or wrong? Since we mentioned it earlier, what if car dealers were the same as jewelers, grocery, etc.? What if all pricing was set by the manufacturer, like Saturn? Let's say the dealers got a fixed $750 (or whatever reasonable, but less than the current mark-up) per car, and sales people were paid $12/hour. Would that be a better system for the industry or consumer?

Not trying to upset some of the excellent sales professionals on this forum, just wondering what's the best policy. I'm not sure I agree with the "no-haggle" pricing. Just wondering if they are doing it right?

otto8

3 Ford dealers in the Syracuse NY area have closed in the last year.
1 went broke, 2 were bought out by Ford and closed.
Another is hurting badly and traded its 3 yo. state of the art dealership
and mega lot to a toyota dealer and moved into their tiny 1960s lot. :sick:

sterlingdog

Oh Dave, I really could have a field day with that one. I have read some trash on this forum, but this takes the cake! :mad: :surprise: There are 15 errors in those three lines! I won't even attempt a correction. I would have to place him in first grade and proceed from there. :sick:

Richard

sterlingdog

Moo, I do understand your view on this, but let me ask you another question. Based on what you, and some other posters, have said, am I correct in assuming that perhaps a consumer shouldn't depend on KBB or Edmunds for a clear value picture? When you try to assign a value for your trade, they ask you to put in things like mileage, options, physical and mechanical condition, etc. If I do that, then I assume that the trade value that pops up is what I should expect from a dealer. Am I reading this incorrectly?

I understand that what you get is what the market will allow. I am concerned, however, that these web sites may be misleading consumers. Of course you are in the business to make money, and I am in the business to save money. That being understood, what value are these web sites if they don't guide us in the right direction? Thanks.

Richard

jmonroe

I have read some trash on this forum, but this takes the cake!

What am I, chopped liver? Ain’t I at least a cupcake? :mad:

I would have to place him in first grade and proceed from there.

Hey teach, can I sit next to him? I’ll be good. OK, OK?

BTW, I couldn't help but notice the times of some of your recent posts. Do you stay up all night grading papers? Don't you ever go to bed? :confuse:

jmonroe

kiawah

ooppss is right...thats funny

cdnpinhead

There's a forum called "real-world trade in values" that has about 35K posts and hasn't been around for more than a few years. Edmunds, KBB & the others appear to provide severely inflated values -- to a dealer, any car is worth what it will bring at an auction, and we mere mortals don't have access to that data. The guy who started the real-world board did (& does), as do the pros who've posted there over the years.

By the time a dealership pays wholesale (auction value) for a used car, cleans it up & adds markup, his asking price might approach what's in KBB, but unless he's working with a total laydown, the selling price will be (possibly quite a bit) lower.

As guys on here have said, apparently the real money in car sales is in the used market -- buy low & sell high. Imagine that.

joel0622

You heard it here first

Are you not the guy who said the Cowboys were going to win it all?

carhag2000

This person said I wanted to shop around.

I hope you didnt let her know where she was approved at. You went to all the trouble and found the only banker in 6 counties that had came to work drunk that day and approved her and she wants to "shop". Wow. And I bet that you spent quite a bit of time and effort on her. I hope you get her back and I hope you sell her the cobalt and I hope you are hugely compensated for your time!

It always amazes me how GMD's all of a sudden become " consumers" when they find out that they can get bought at a bank. They go from " Uh, can I take it home today?" to " I need to shop around a little." I hope she isnt able to get done at any other dealer.

jescue

Well, they want to get the nicest car they can get approved for. Since it will end up going back anyway at least they can ride in style for a few months.

carhag2000

Since it will end up going back anyway

I have heard from customers more than once, " What will my payment be? I mean including the late charges." What an auspicious way to approach a large installment loan.

oldfarmer50

"...and sales people were paid $12/hour..."

If that were the case there would be some guy in there trying to haggle them down to $9/hour.

madmanmoo

Great question. With all due respect to Edmunds and KBB, they don't always present a clear picture. Too many times the number they present is way high.

I'll give you a real world example from yesterday. KBB appraised a customer's car at $77k trade-in value for average condition. When we appraised the vehicle, we found it had paintwork and needed 4 tires. Other than that, it was a beautiful vehicle. The paintwork was only one quarterpanel and wasn't anything major, but it does detract from the value. Our offer? $62k.

Granted, the numbers on highline cars become a little larger apart, but this at least gives you an indication of what happens when people do their own homework.

what value are these web sites if they don't guide us in the right direction?

Ugh. Ever noticed how unhappy a lot of the salesguys get on forums when talking about KBB or Edmund's pricing? Unfortunately, it just isn't a good enough gauge for the customer to use. I keep championing the cause of hitting up CarMax for a free trade appraisal and to check SOLD numbers on Ebay.

Here in GA, we use BlackBook. More often than not, you'll be at rough book or a couple grand under rough. Very nice cars bring average. I can't remember when I saw a vehicle bring more than that. So, when using our own barometer, the low end of things always seems to be the buying price.

Frustrating for both parties, no question. What do you do? Check for real world applications where people have actually purchased the vehicles in question. That's truly the only way to get an idea of what your vehicle is worth.

Now, in all fairness, when I was selling Nissans/Hondas, sometimes the websites WOULD be accurate on what the trade was worth. They are not always incorrect. I just don't believe that you can rely on them all of the time for a realistic idea of what your vehicle is worth to a dealer.

I hope this helped and didn't muddy the waters anymore.

-moo

madmanmoo

The salesman wouldn't be salesman anymore. They would be order takers. What incentive to sell more would they have if they were hourly? They get paid the same either way.

-moo

greanpea68

Retail value: GP68 SVP: $3999, on sale $2399 (40% off!). GP/J HVP: $8999, on sale: $3199 (60% off!). Additional pads in the back and compliments may be purchased separately for nominal price of $49/each.

LOL....LOL.... :shades:

GP

greanpea68

I will also agree to post "New England sports teams are far superior to NY sports teams" (or something to that effect) IF I lose the wager.


Deal....

Now, what if the Patsies lose to Big Blue, what will YOU post?


What do you want me to post???

GP

greanpea68

Is Saturn doing it right or wrong?

Ask yourself this... If Saturn was doing it right don't you think they would be number 1....?

GP

chikoo

shirley, were you educated in India?

Reason I ask is the mistakes you have made are not at all the ones who studied English in India would make. They are very American.

rockylee

Lemko,

You got the DTS, for a winter beater. How bout a 2009 ZR-1 sold to you by your pal, Rocky ?

I sold my first automobile last night a 99' Chevy Tahoe. It was a great experience !!!

-Rocky

P.S. I think imidazol97' needs a ZR-1 also !!! :shades:

jescue

I could use one of those. Can you get me a good price? I need top dollar for my trade too. A good interest rate is a must, and I need my payments close to where they are now. Just sharpen your pencil and lets make a deal.

greanpea68

I sold my first automobile last night a 99' Chevy Tahoe.

Congratulations!!!!

I believe I smell a grosser

Remeber:

Coffee is for closers!!!

GP

lemko

Nah, I'm not THAT extravagant to consider the DTS a "winter beater." I simply consider it my "everyday car." Now, my 1988 Buick Park Avenue is the beater car or the conveyance I use in less than desirable neighborhoods.

Something like a ZR-1 would be more like my best friend's taste as he's a Corvette man through and through. He's even president of his local Corvette club.

I heard Chevrolet was supposed to build a nice RWD V-8 powered Impala SS with styling based on the 1967 model. Now, THAT is definately something I would've gone for. Stupid eco-weenies have to take away everybody's fun!

Anyway, congrats on your first sale!

mackabee

How about: "Friends don't let friends drive Nissans or Fords"?


"Nissan is a superior product"

mackabee

Yeah, that was me. I still haven't recovered from that one. I made my prediction way before they went on the slide. I somehow had a feeling they would blow it. Too many distractions. Who in their right mind lets their offensive coordinator, defensive/assistant coach, and a few others interview for head coaching jobs in the middle of the biggest game + one in their life??
"Nissan is a superior product" :shades:

chikoo

Ask yourself this... If Saturn was doing it right don't you think they would be number 1....?

pricing is the last thing that makes or breaks # 1.

It is quality of the product (perceived or not) first and foremost.

joel0622

How about: "Friends don't let friends drive Nissans or Fords"?

Hey now, I don't have a dog in the hunt this time.

The worst thing about those wagers is having to type that crap every time.

If you plan on posting allot at any given time I recommend (from experience) copy and paste.

greanpea68

How about: "Friends don't let friends drive Nissans or Fords"?

If that is what he wants me to post I'll do it. Do you want to take the advantage of the 7 point spread favoring the big blue?

GP

madmanmoo

Oh man, I just finished up with a phenomenal up. By phenomenal, I mean insane. I'll post it here when I get a chance to type it all out.

Great stuff.

:P

-moo

mackabee

It's not all about price. Saturn caters to the folks that hate to negotiate or find haggling distasteful.

"Nissan is a superior product"

mackabee

Just making sure you were awake. At your age you need more than coffee. LOL.
"Nissan is a superior product" :shades:

rockylee

Well the RWD Impala's future might be in jeapordy because of the 35 mpg law.

-Rocky

P.S. Didn't your G/F recently bought another car or is she still driving the LaCrosse ?

rockylee

Thanks GP

-Rocky

rockylee

Sure, I'll just need a "small" sum of money down for a down payment.

-Rocky

joel0622

Well the RWD Impala's future might be in jeapordy because of the 35 mpg law

Rocky the new CAFE standards does not mean every car has to get 35 MPG, it just means that your name plate as a whole has to average 35 MPG.

Now you may have already known that, is the RWD Impala one theat Chevy is going to scrap to help get the AVG rating where it needs to be?

snakeweasel

Is Saturn doing it right or wrong?

IIRC Saturn didn't make their projected sales for the first several years after their introduction and some analysts were stating that their sales did suffer from the no haggle approach.

snakeweasel

am I correct in assuming that perhaps a consumer shouldn't depend on KBB or Edmunds for a clear value picture?

I think that the big problem with that is that people have a tendency to judge what they own to be better than it is. So they may have a car thats in "fair" condition but they think its in "good" condition and put that into the system.

snakeweasel

Ask yourself this... If Saturn was doing it right don't you think they would be number 1....?

No, doing it right does not equate to being number 1.

snakeweasel

Well the RWD Impala's future might be in jeapordy because of the 35 mpg law.

Naw, just make it a station wagon, put bigger tires on it, call it an SUV and classify it as a truck.

stickguy

If I can make it out of hte house without keeling over from my bad back, I may go shopping on Friday. At least any salespeople I meet won't have any problems keeping up!

The right driver's seat could be a winner. THat, and a kick booty lease offer!

sterlingdog

Your explanation was the clearest, most informative, and understandable post that I have seen on this site in months. I now have a more realistic view of KBB and Edmunds. You have really cleared the air for me, and I appreciate it. From now on, these two sites will not be my only avenues for research. You are a Champ!

Richard