Stories from the Sales Frontlines

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Comments

  • snakeweaselsnakeweasel Member Posts: 19,592
    No, he won't.

    Oh really? Vito is on his way.

    2011 Hyundai Sonata, 2014 BMW 428i convertible, 2015 Honda CTX700D

  • joel0622joel0622 Member Posts: 3,299
    Funny man..especially when I am at Dunkin Donuts! What used car is better than new ????????

    I have no idea, that claim has always made me wonder to.
  • laurasdadalaurasdada Member Posts: 5,217
    "What used car is better than new ????????"

    The used car that you can afford vs. the new car you cannot?

    '21 Dark Blue/Black Audi A7 PHEV (mine); '22 White/Beige BMW X3 (hers); '20 Estoril Blue/Oyster BMW M240xi 'Vert (Ours, read: hers in 'vert weather; mine during Nor'easters...)

  • sterlingdogsterlingdog Member Posts: 6,984
    "Or maybe I'm overly sensitive..."

    Though you are at times, I have good news. A study last year indicated that overly sensitive people have above normal IQ's. :shades:

    To stay on topic: My Ford Explorer has a higher IQ than my Chrysler convertible. :D

    Richard
  • sterlingdogsterlingdog Member Posts: 6,984
    "No he won't"

    Oh, yes he will. See post 27628.

    "...there is more to jmonroe than meets the eye. He may pretend to be relatively normal,....

    If he ever pretended to be relatively normal, it wasn't on this site.

    "Why haven't we heard from jipster..."

    Our team leader is preparing his plan.

    To stay on topic: Cars pretend to be relatively normal. :D

    Richard
  • sterlingdogsterlingdog Member Posts: 6,984
    "Sorry m8, I learned that from richard."

    Then the rumors are true. You ARE teachable. :P

    To stay on topic: Can you really teach old cars new tricks? :D

    Richard
  • jmonroejmonroe Member Posts: 8,989
    A study last year indicated that overly sensitive people have above normal IQ's.

    As an OLD educator you more than most should know there are always exceptions. :P

    (lest there be confusion as to who Richard was replying to in post 27628 it was ISELL)

    jmonroe

    '15 Genesis V8 with Ultimate Package and '18 Legacy Limited 6 cyl

  • sterlingdogsterlingdog Member Posts: 6,984
    "I was trying really really hard not to make a Polish joke."

    Many, many years ago I had a wonderful Polish student in my class. He was brilliant, creative, popular, and very dependable. Near graduation date, he was assisting me with an assembly program for the student body. He was to open and close the curtain for each speaker or musical performance. One of the motivational speakers was the regional vice president of a major soda pop company. This speaker thought that it would be funny to start off with a Polish joke. As he finished the joke, my Polish student pulled the curtain on him. The curtain actually hit the speaker and he nearly fell over. In an instant I knew what had happened and why. I loved every minute of that! Yes, the speaker apologized to the entire student body for his lack of taste. Was my student punished? Hell no. I congratulated him on his quick thinking. Even the school principal agreed with me.

    To stay on topic: Cars can play funny jokes on you, which are not really funny.

    Richard
  • sterlingdogsterlingdog Member Posts: 6,984
    "...you more than most should know there are always exceptions."

    I have to agree with an OLD miser like you. ;)

    To stay on topic: For every reputable car, there is at least one exception.

    Richard
  • jmonroejmonroe Member Posts: 8,989
    You ARE teachable.

    I thought it was "learnable". I must have an old grammar book.

    Now cars... they can teach (or at least tell) todays mechanics what the problem is. Mechanics today don't need trouble shooting books like in the OLD days. How's that for staying on topic? :surprise:

    jmonroe

    '15 Genesis V8 with Ultimate Package and '18 Legacy Limited 6 cyl

  • obyoneobyone Member Posts: 7,841
    above normal IQ's

    Is that the long version of abnormal IQ's?
  • obyoneobyone Member Posts: 7,841
    Somehow or other whenever someone says that was a good Polish joke a picture of Bobby Vinton comes to mind. I have no clue as to why.

    I'm just curious on a sales frontline story on how often will the deskman walk out to your negotiating desk and say, "Man this guy is bustin my b--ls. Name a number cause we need to get you out of this office so we can make some real money."

    I always believed that when working the 4 square from a customer's standpoint you should be prepared and walk in with an extra wide RED El Marko. That way you can cross off the deskman's offer and counter offer in your own ink.
  • greanpea68greanpea68 Member Posts: 1,996
    For the record... Last week I asked about how to update truw market value on edmunds.... Because of the wrong numbers.

    Well the info was updated correctly... thank you...

    My customer who called me a liar came in yesterday after many phone calls and emails. :shades:

    He got a great deal and I got another unit. "To stay on topic..." I wouldn't be able to afford Snake as my accountant for one hour with the commision I made mini.... ;) but it was another unit and hopefully it will make me hit bonus. There is nothing worse being one or 1/2 a car away from bonus..

    GP
  • obyoneobyone Member Posts: 7,841
    Did he apologize for calling you a liar?

    Inquiring minds want to know.

    It's too bad we can't resurrect "Inconsiderate Buyers".
  • oldfarmer50oldfarmer50 Member Posts: 24,293
    "...My customer who called me a liar came in yesterday..."

    Why should we believe you? :P

    Being call a liar is the one thing that is sure to bring my blood to a boil. It's usually the guy who doesn't know you and has never done business with you who says it too.

    2019 Kia Soul+, 2015 Mustang GT, 2013 Ford F-150, 2000 Chrysler Sebring convertible

  • greanpea68greanpea68 Member Posts: 1,996
    Did he apologize for calling you a liar?

    Yes because I had explained the whole situation to him.

    GP
  • qbrozenqbrozen Member Posts: 33,769
    Alright. I got a question for you guys. I visited a dealer today that is quite unlike any I've ever been to. They are a private independent store, yet they exclusively deal in Volvos. Oh, and they are connected to a rent-a-wreck joint (which may or may not be relevant). I was handed an inventory sheet with all of their cars (about 60) and prices. I've looked over several of the models listed and they seem to be consistently between $2k-$2500 over wholesale. So, some profit built in, but nowhere near what the volvo dealers markup their used units.

    SO, what do you think? Is this some sort of organization I should avoid? Or does this seem normal? It just strikes me as out of the ordinary. I asked where they get their cars and I was told they mostly come from non-volvo dealers in the area when folks trade them in and those dealers just don't want them around.

    OH, and (I'll research this through google at my earliest opportunity) they offer a warranty through Eagle(?). $1399 for 4 years and unlimited mileage ... which seems cheap. Say they been using them for 7 years and everyone has always been happy with them.

    We would probably prefer CPO, but this independent dealer seems to have a monopoly in Jersey. He's got more used volvos than all 5 volvo dealers put together who are in reasonable driving distance of us. And none of those dealers have what we are looking for.

    '11 GMC Sierra 1500; '98 Alfa 156 2.0TS; '08 Maser QP; '67 Coronet R/T; '13 Fiat 500c; '20 S90 T6; '22 MB Sprinter 2500 4x4 diesel; '97 Suzuki R Wagon; '96 Opel Astra; '11 Mini Cooper S

  • sterlingdogsterlingdog Member Posts: 6,984
    "I must have an old grammar book."

    We no longer recognize the 1920 Manual to English Grammar. ;)

    To stay on topic: An owner's manual for a 2007 Chrysler cost $25.00 plus tax.

    Richard
  • sterlingdogsterlingdog Member Posts: 6,984
    "Is that the long version of abnormal IQ's?"

    You are VERY perceptive. ;)

    Richard
  • stickguystickguy Member Posts: 53,555
    Well, I like the idea of that Volvo place. If you are going to put all your eggs in one basket, and expect to do a volume business on a niche (relatively) car, you better be good at it!

    Besides, they probably know Volvos really well, unlike most used car places that get an occasional stray Swede on the lot.

    Is this the place down on 9 (near Brick?) Can't remember the name (Target? Dial? I would know it if I heard it!)

    2020 Acura RDX tech SH-AWD, 2023 Maverick hybrid Lariat luxury package.

  • qbrozenqbrozen Member Posts: 33,769
    Its farther north. on 9 near the parkway entrance. torchlight motors. I've posted links for you from them in the past. :)

    They have 3 S60Rs, by the way, and all are sticks.

    We drove an XC90 yesterday and the wife is in love. So now we are on the hunt. Torchlight has 5 or 6 at the moment, but only 1 is equipped the way we want (2.5T 7-passenger with slider and bun toasters). Only thing is its got 45k miles and black interior. We'd prefer 35k and tan interior. BUT, its priced at $16,995 ('03 model), which is mighty appealing. I have yet to find anything comparable within 100 miles of us.

    '11 GMC Sierra 1500; '98 Alfa 156 2.0TS; '08 Maser QP; '67 Coronet R/T; '13 Fiat 500c; '20 S90 T6; '22 MB Sprinter 2500 4x4 diesel; '97 Suzuki R Wagon; '96 Opel Astra; '11 Mini Cooper S

  • kyfdxkyfdx Moderator Posts: 267,571
    We have a guy like that in Cincinnati..

    Not exclusively Volvo... he might have almost any import... But, he really knows Volvo, Saab and Subaru... And, he likes to get almost new Mazdas from the factory official auctions... Usually has 40-50 cars on his lot.

    He knows which configurations are popular, and what to look for.. He consistently has the best used cars for those brands, at reasonable prices. He has a great reputation (40 years).. If I was looking for that kind of car, I'd go to him first..

    You can bet that your exclusive Volvo independent gets most of his cars from the auction... I'm sure the local non-Volvo dealers know to call him for a bid, when they are trying to price a Volvo trade, but I doubt you could keep enough stock, just from that avenue.. But, most used cars come through the auction.. just for efficiency's sake..

    If they have a good reputation, that's where I would be looking.. Not sure about that warranty company, though..

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  • qbrozenqbrozen Member Posts: 33,769
    hmmmm... found a couple of complaints and a couple of positive experiences on the net so far. Methinks you can find the same of any dealer, though. At the very least, it makes me think I should get it checked out first. Problem is, nearest volvo dealer is probably about a half hour drive from them, at least.

    '11 GMC Sierra 1500; '98 Alfa 156 2.0TS; '08 Maser QP; '67 Coronet R/T; '13 Fiat 500c; '20 S90 T6; '22 MB Sprinter 2500 4x4 diesel; '97 Suzuki R Wagon; '96 Opel Astra; '11 Mini Cooper S

  • qbrozenqbrozen Member Posts: 33,769
    yeah, so far I have yet to find a GOOD writeup on the warranty company they work with. So I guess I'd have to "self warranty."

    In all honestly, I am not fond of who volvo works with for CPO, either (called VIP). I didn't suffer major problems with my S70 during the warranty period, but of the small problems I had, they covered 1.

    '11 GMC Sierra 1500; '98 Alfa 156 2.0TS; '08 Maser QP; '67 Coronet R/T; '13 Fiat 500c; '20 S90 T6; '22 MB Sprinter 2500 4x4 diesel; '97 Suzuki R Wagon; '96 Opel Astra; '11 Mini Cooper S

  • isellhondasisellhondas Member Posts: 20,342
    These are probably auction cars that were traded in at other stores. You mentioned that several were 5 speeds? There are almost impossible to sell but if you happen to like them you could probably get a great buy on one. Just know that later, it will be a very difficult sale when you decide to move on.

    As used cars, Volvos can be nothing but continual trouble. They are no longer the rugged 240's of the past. I would proceed with extreme caution if a Volvo is a must for you.
  • isellhondasisellhondas Member Posts: 20,342
    Again, be careful.

    These "Johnny Come Lately" warranty companies can go out of business quickly!
  • greanpea68greanpea68 Member Posts: 1,996
    SO, what do you think? Is this some sort of organization I should avoid? Or does this seem normal? It just strikes me as out of the ordinary. I asked where they get their cars and I was told they mostly come from non-volvo dealers in the area when folks trade them in and those dealers just don't want them around.

    Makes sense to me. It sounds like they have one set pricing. THe Volvo dealer in the area sound like they are ready to negotiate if their prices are high. This place you vissted sounds like the price is the price. Nothing wrong with that. I believe the fact that they buy these trades at local places. The warranty thru Eagle...???>> Who knows? Maybe you have to do all your warranty work there?!

    Anyway sounds like a OK place

    GP
  • qbrozenqbrozen Member Posts: 33,769
    you forget, Isell, I'm a volvo supporter and was a happy owner not all too long ago. I am familiar with your opinion of them. But thanks for looking out for me. I appreciate your position. I just don't agree with it (yet).

    And you may be right about them having those vehicles that are tough to sell. In more ways than just a manual trans. My wife reminded me that the independent volvo shop we used to use is not all that far from the dealer. So it would probably be wise to pay them to inspect it for us prior to purchase. That is, if we decide to go this route.

    Thanks for the thoughts, everyone.

    Greenpea, if they are set pricing, we won't be buying from them. Their asking prices are reasonable, but I still see wiggle room there. I'd be looking to knock them down $500-$1k to get the type of deal I'm typically looking for on a used vehicle.

    '11 GMC Sierra 1500; '98 Alfa 156 2.0TS; '08 Maser QP; '67 Coronet R/T; '13 Fiat 500c; '20 S90 T6; '22 MB Sprinter 2500 4x4 diesel; '97 Suzuki R Wagon; '96 Opel Astra; '11 Mini Cooper S

  • isellhondasisellhondas Member Posts: 20,342
    I'm sorry I have such strong feelings against Volvos but as a former Volvo fan, my experiences have taken an about face big time.

    I'm sure there are good ones out there.

    I wouldn't worry so much about the kind of a store that is selling them. It is either a good car or it is not. It would be VERY wise to have a trusted Volvo mechanic inspect it.

    As far ias the price, if you think it is, indeed "reasonable" why would you not buy from them. Sometimes, there really isn't any "wiggle room" and even if there is, they may feel that the next person will consider the car to be a good value and just buy it.

    Good Luck!
  • stickguystickguy Member Posts: 53,555
    Yup, Torchlight was what I was thinking of. I work with a guy that is big on Volvos, and he knows of the place (he lives in IIRC Howell, about 20-30 minutes away).

    I would be more comfortable with a V70 or XC70 myself, instead of an early XC90. Didn't they have some initial issues?

    But, I like them. Really wanted to lease one in 2004 (had a fantastic deal on the table), but the wife wanted a new Odyssey. She also had an issue with the headrest pushing on her head. Felt great to me though!

    The new 3.2 model is nice. Much smoother engine than the 2.5T.

    2020 Acura RDX tech SH-AWD, 2023 Maverick hybrid Lariat luxury package.

  • obyoneobyone Member Posts: 7,841
    I'm sure there are good ones out there.

    Question is WHERE? and what are the ODDS of finding one? :shades:
  • greanpea68greanpea68 Member Posts: 1,996
    I'd be looking to knock them down $500-$1k to get the type of deal I'm typically looking for on a used vehicle.

    Anything is possible :shades:

    Good Luck

    GP
  • thenebeanthenebean Member Posts: 1,124
    jmonroe,

    i thought about all the 2 cents i kept giving you guys, and it occured to me that if i just keep them for myself, in about 28 years, i should have enough cents to buy a 2004 Nissan 350Z! ;-)

    -thene
    "insert your favorite theneism here!"
  • greanpea68greanpea68 Member Posts: 1,996
    She also had an issue with the headrest pushing on her head.

    "Active Head Restaints" Great safety feature. Only time if they will ever work for your advantage is if you are rear ended. They prevent whiplash. You probably already knew that. :surprise:

    I think it is funny ( Nissan has the same safety feature on all its vehicles) when people complain about them. I have had plenty of customers complain about the design of them. About 4 years ago one lady ( she was a Nun ) came in and told me she had to correct the head rest that was put on backwards. She simply turned turned the head rest around and found it comfortable. So when anyone complains about it I simply explain the reason for the head rest but than switch it around and they will find it comfortable....

    GP
  • peetertpeetert Member Posts: 124
    I pass by that place when going to visit my mother and have always wanted to stop in. Their prices are good compared to the dealers. The warranty would be a concern of mine too. But, with our last 2 CPO volvos' I've probably broken even on the cost of the warranty vs items I've needed covered. Let me know if you buy from them and how your experience is. An XC90 is also on our short list as a replacement for the family minivan.

    Btw, have you also looked at AutoLenders.com for XC90's? they seem to have a bunch. My brother recently bought a Lexus RX330 from them and is happy with his purchase.

    Peeter
  • jmonroejmonroe Member Posts: 8,989
    About 4 years ago one lady ( she was a Nun ) came in and told me she had to correct the head rest that was put on backwards. She simply turned turned the head rest around and found it comfortable.

    Now that’s what I call divine intervention. With all the sales you’ve made I‘m sure that piece of advice came ‘none’ too soon.

    I’m outta here. :shades:

    jmonroe

    '15 Genesis V8 with Ultimate Package and '18 Legacy Limited 6 cyl

  • qbrozenqbrozen Member Posts: 33,769
    my experience with autolenders is not good. They won't be hearing from me unless they take a serious look at their sales policy. Priced higher than dealer CPO and they will not negotiate. Hmmmm... yeah, sounds great! Can't believe they have been in business even this long.

    '11 GMC Sierra 1500; '98 Alfa 156 2.0TS; '08 Maser QP; '67 Coronet R/T; '13 Fiat 500c; '20 S90 T6; '22 MB Sprinter 2500 4x4 diesel; '97 Suzuki R Wagon; '96 Opel Astra; '11 Mini Cooper S

  • qbrozenqbrozen Member Posts: 33,769
    OK. Here's the thing. I just called the guy this morning. He tells me I can't take it to a shop to have it checked over.(???) He has no problem with me bringing a mechanic there but, "our vehicles don't leave the store until purchased." HUH? Does that mean no test drive, either? I know that's not the case.

    He says they go over them very well and they come with a 3-month warranty, etc, etc. I dunno. Just puts another doubt in my mind, ya know?

    He dropped the price $200 this morning. And I just noticed now that his inventory sheet states "Our prices are firm, but fair." So it seems there is no negotiating. I dunno. $1800 over wholesale for a volvo I can't get inspected and I'm buying from a non-volvo dealer. I'm not writing it off yet, but this is becoming more and more of a gamble, don't ya think?

    Stickguy - The T6s had most of the problems, from what I've read on swedespeed. The 2.5T is supposed to be quite reliable. Lots of good reports from happy owners. Some with over 100k. Most common complaint I've seen is rear wheel bearings. Minor maintenance issue. No biggie. Oh, and I should say that the 2.5T is more than powerful enough. I was literally shocked at how quick and agile it is. 208hp and it feels like it could run circles around our 240hp Pilot and 250hp Pacifica. And, according to IPD, their ECU reflash can knock 8 tenths off the 0-60 time. ;)

    '11 GMC Sierra 1500; '98 Alfa 156 2.0TS; '08 Maser QP; '67 Coronet R/T; '13 Fiat 500c; '20 S90 T6; '22 MB Sprinter 2500 4x4 diesel; '97 Suzuki R Wagon; '96 Opel Astra; '11 Mini Cooper S

  • british_roverbritish_rover Member Posts: 8,502
    The T6 is also the engine that toasted the earlier Volvo Transmissions. I suppose it happened on the later transmissions sometimes as well but it was very common on the early ones.
  • greanpea68greanpea68 Member Posts: 1,996
    He tells me I can't take it to a shop to have it checked over.(???) He has no problem with me bringing a mechanic there but, "our vehicles don't leave the store until purchased." HUH? Does that mean no test drive, either? I know that's not the case.

    I am surprised he said no to a third party. Maybe he thought you wanted to do that. I can understand him saying no to you maybe thinking you could steal some parts of the vehicle. But I can't understand why the salesperson won't take 2 hours out of a day for a customer tomake a sale :confuse:

    GP
  • british_roverbritish_rover Member Posts: 8,502
    I have never told someone they can't bring a car to an independent mechanic to have it looked over. If I am particularly suspicious of the person I might want to call the mechanic they say they are bringing it to to confirm things and maybe put a hold on their credit card as well but I would let them take the car to be inspected.
  • isellhondasisellhondas Member Posts: 20,342
    I've told this story before...

    There was a shop in Seattle that was owned by "Swen". Swen was a Volvo fanatic and his customers were loyal to him beyond belief.

    He would quickly condemm any Volvo anyone would bring to him for a pre-purchase inspection. No matter how nice the Volvo was, Swen would write up a long "laundry list" of repairs he thought the car needed. Of course, people believed every word that came out of this guys mouth.

    It got so bad that we would tell people in advance what to expect and we would suggest that they simply pass on the car and save whatever he would charge them to inspect the car.

    I remember once, he told a customer of ours that the Volvo she brought in had oil leaks from several different areas among other things. Of course, she passed on the car. Curious, and thinking we may have missed something, we put the car up on a rack and using a flashlight we determined there were zero oil leaks!

    Maybe that shop is worried that "Swen" has moved to your neck of the woods? :)
  • obyoneobyone Member Posts: 7,841
    How much hold can you place on a credit card with a used vehicle potentially worth $50K?
  • british_roverbritish_rover Member Posts: 8,502
    I just want an additional check that the person is real so a 500-1000 dollar hold on a card gives me some assurances.

    Thinking back I don't know if I personally have ever done that but I know it has been done here before. I haven't had anybody want to take a car to a third party for inspection in well over a year.
  • chikoochikoo Member Posts: 3,008
    There is nothing worse being one or 1/2 a car away from bonus..

    Which makes me wonder.....does the management actively work so that you do not hit bonus in this situation, in order to keep shelling no more money out to you?
  • isellhondasisellhondas Member Posts: 20,342
    I can't remember the last time I had a customer who wanted an independant inspection.

    We are so picky ourselves that by the time I go over our detailed inspection report, they are almost always satisfied.

    Sometimes, we are as bad as "Swen"!
  • cracoviancracovian Member Posts: 337
    I came to the southern states in '91 and I haven't really experienced too many "polish" issues, especially recently. I believe the old and ignorant people who grew up with and spread this unjustified crap are dying off plus it was more prevalent up north.

    I just got my Sienna and had a nice "polish-related" conversation with the Irish sales manager who grew up in Buffalo and that might have actually closed the deal aside from the professionalism and an attractive price offered by this excellent Toyota dealership.

    Anyway, I have an MBA in Finance but I didn't bring my RPN-based HP since I was paying cash for the vehicle ;)

    But... from wikipedia: "Reverse Polish notation (or just RPN) by analogy with the related Polish notation, a prefix notation introduced in 1920 by the Polish mathematician Jan Łukasiewicz, is a mathematical notation wherein every operator follows all of its operands. It is also known as Postfix notation."

    Talk about the issues this dude's first name (which also happens to be my name) causes - it's a whole another story but people visiting Europe and those who watch Tour de France and soccer get it :)
  • jkinzeljkinzel Member Posts: 735
    I purchased a 1994 Ford ranger used in 1996 from a major Ford Dealer in Tacoma, WA. The day the salesman wanted me to come in look at it I was swamped with things to do. I told them I wanted my local mechanic to look at it but I didn’t have the time, so they offered to take it to him. Later that day the mechanic gave it a clean bill of health, I went to the dealer and finished the paper work and later picked it up from the mechanic. Deal done.
    I still have it and it's a great truck.
  • obyoneobyone Member Posts: 7,841
    If I recall correctly the university was divided into the haves and the have nots. Those that had carried HP, those that didn't used TI. Course some of us older folks used to carry slide rules and I understand Snake still has an abacus. The good old days...lol!!

    Back to topic.

    Visited a Toyota dealer last week to look at the new Sequoias. Was walking around the lot when approached by a salesperson. When he asked if he could be of help I had replied that I had made an appointment with another salesperson and was 10 minutes early for that appointment. He gets on his cellphone/walkietalkie trying to get a hold of that salesperson. He walks away as he is doing so and a few minutes later returns to tell me that my contact is tied up in a deal at the moment and he didn't know for how long.

    I told him no problem as I really wanted to take a good look at the Sequoia and didn't know if I could end up buying it as it's looks didn't really sit well with me.
  • oldfarmer50oldfarmer50 Member Posts: 24,293
    "...I haven't had anybody want to take a car to a third party..."

    My last two used cars were purchased at a dealer that sold the same brand new. I didn't get them looked at by my mechanic and I've had no trouble with them, even after 80K miles on one of them.

    The last time I had one checked was in 1987. The salesman had no problem with me taking it 15 miles away for a couple of hours. My mechanic found a couple of oil leaks which were fixed as part of the deal. 30 days later the A/C compressor blew out--$300.

    I would say as a general rule it's a good idea to have a car checked but it doesn't guarantee having no problems.

    BTW, does anyone have an opinion on these companies who will go to where the car is located and inspect it for $100 or so? I wonder how complete a job they can do out in the field with no diagnostic machines laying in the mud on a rainy day. :confuse:

    2019 Kia Soul+, 2015 Mustang GT, 2013 Ford F-150, 2000 Chrysler Sebring convertible

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