Yeah, if he trades it. If the residual is higher than the trade value then it would be to his advantage to make the last two payments or have them worked into the Highlander :shades: deal.
"Like you say Mack, there is no bad month." You got it. It's all between the ears. Stay away from negative people, stay positive, smile, compliment the customer on anything, shoes,dress, tie, etc. Make them feel special. Like I said some sales people spend too much energy on finding reasons not to sell a car.
Unfortunately the average consumer does have the math skills of a fifth grader.
I think Jeff Foxworthy would disagree with that!
I've lowered my speed to 60mph and most cars pass me doing 70+ mph and have their windows rolled down which actually creates drag and uses more fuel. Go figure.
Mythbusters did an episode on that and confirmed your assertion!
[Edit: It looks like OldFarmer beat me to the Mythbusters comment!]
Don't fall for it oldfarmer! It's a trick! Remember the doc fee; $1234.56 and you still have to pay for taxes, title, and registration.
I got a better deal for you!
2005 Dodge Neon SXT, one owner, 42345 gently driven miles. Coldest a/c in Virginia Beach, picture yourself driving this economical sporty sedan. MPG: a lot!, keyless remote entry, power windows, power mirrors, power locks, 6 cd changer, cruise/speed control, aluminum alloy wheels. Midnight Black exterior. Carpet shampooed and freshly waxed and ready to go! Looks showroom new! Only $8495.00 plus ttl and processing fee. Call Mack M at 757-491-0234
Hot dang I should write the classified ads for these dealers!
GP I told you to stay off the sauce! You know those nba games are fixed! Look out for a big expose coming in the next couple of weeks. What's up with these New England teams? Mackabee
Two weeks ago Monday I was at my work station making phone calls to previous customers and recent prospects. My GM comes over and asks me if I want to help one of our other sales persons as he had an emergency and had to leave. I said "Sure I'll help him" I replied. He gives me a folder and tells me all the figures have been worked out on their trade and the new truck and I just have to put them on a test drive and get them into F$I. You would think it was an easy task, but nooooooo! "Come on, I'll introduce you to them." We walk to the "porch" in front of the showroom and they are walking around the truck like it's something from outer space. "Guys, this is Mack. He's one of my top people. He'll answer any questions you have." I shake the guys hand and the wife is a bit standoffish. I put the tag on the truck and they go on a test drive. About 15 minutes later they get back and she parks the truck back on the porch. "Where's the cruise control button? I couldn't find it anywhere." she says to me. "This truck doesn't have cruise control." I tell her. "It doesn't??I got to have cruise." she responds. "What about keyless entry?" the husband asks. "Nope, not that either. Didn't Frankie go over the features with you?" I ask them. They ignore the question.
They are looking at the least expensive Tacoma double cab that we have in stock. These are what we call "strippies" in the car biz as the only thing they come with is floor mats besides the standard equipment. This particular truck's MSRP was $23,196.00. We advertise them online for something like $20,990.00, these are the "teaser" ads to get people in the door or out the door whichever the case may be. So anyway, I tell them in order to get cruise and keyless they have to get one with SR5 package#2 which has a host of other neat options like, rear sliding window, privacy glass, and other goodies plus it also has the limited slip differential option. MSRP $25,567.00 They ask me to show them one and I tell them we will have to go to our overflow lot as that's where they are located.
We get in the Tacoma they test drove and head out to the overflow lot. (we are having a hail storm as I write this!) As soon as we leave the dealership's parking lot the husband starts bitching and moaning about how we are "killing him on the trade". I tell them I had nothing to do with the trade or the deal. I'm just the relief pitcher. but nevertheless he continues his song until we get to the other lot.
We get there and it's over 100% with a heat index of about 105-110. It is hot! So these two go their own merry way going from one truck to other.. "Honey, this one has cruise control, it's $29,589.00" he shouts from across the lot to her. "This one too and it's $27,897.00" she responds. "I have the stock numbers for the only two Pre-runner d-cabs in stock with pack 2 and I pull both of them off the line. One is Impulse red and the other is Radiant red. They are both identical and have the same sticker price. "This one is about three thousand dollars more. If you give me this one for the price of the blue one we drove we'll make a deal." he says to me and then throws a jab "besides you guys are stealing my trade." The trade in question is a 2007 Chevy Tahoe 2wd plain Jane. No moonroof, no leather, etc.. which they paid $31,000.00 for it a year ago and they owe $25,500.00 on and trade value is $17,000 OUCH! can you say "Buried?"
So after an hour of wandering in the lot I'm sweating my buns off and am getting really thirsty and begin to feel dizzy. "Ok guys, what's it going to be? I'm getting sick out here." I tell them. She looks at me and says nothing, her husband looks at me also and smiles. "Come on honey, it's hot out here." he tells her. "I don't like either of the red trucks. I want a blue one." So the next closest truck is one with the TRD off-road package and alloy wheels which puts the truck over the $26k range. I pull the truck off the line and open it up. "How much more are my payments going to be?" she asks. "I don't know, what were the payments on the first blue truck?" I ask. "They told us $339.00." she responds. I figure since it's about a three grand difference in price their payments will go up by 60 bucks or so. "This truck will be about 60 dollars more a month." I tell them. "We can't go that high. We are paying $519.00 on the Tahoe. Why can't you give us this truck for the same price as the cheaper truck." she says. "We don't have that kind of mark up as the domestics do." I tell her. "Ok, let's go back and see what you can do." she tells me.
We get back to the dealership and sit down at a workstation. I open the folder up and see the payment they were quoted was actually $349.00 not $339.00 and this is for 84 months!! I take the deal folder to the new car manager and tell him what has transpired so far. We are on a more expensive truck and they want to pay the same as the least expensive truck. He laughs and gives me the new numbers. We are at $506.00 per month at 84 months. I go back to the table and present the figures to them. I put the worksheet in front of them and they both stare at it for what seems like eons hoping the payment will go lower if they stare at it long enough. "We can't do that. It's too high. It's almost as much as we are paying for the Tahoe." she says. I look at her and tell her I sympathize with their situation but there is nothing I can do about the trade. "You are getting the truck for $1000.00 under invoice after the rebate." I tell them. "You could give us more for our Tahoe," she says. I flip the paper over and show her that we could sell our truck for MSRP and give her 3k more for her trade. "The bottom line is still the same. Total financed will be $32,789.00" I tell her. She is the dominant party as the husband has been real quiet. She looks over at him and says in a low voice.: "We should come back tomorrow when Frankie is here, he can get us a better deal." she didn't think I heard her and I say: "Frankie won't get you a better deal, these numbers are coming from the big dog, our general manager." I tell her.
They look at each other and stand up. "The payment is too high. Give us the keys to our Tahoe." she tells me. Right at that moment my phone rings and it's the GM. He has a question about some floor mats that were missing from a new car and I gave the customer a "we owe" and ordered the mats for her. I then tell him the prospects are about to leave as they are not happy with the payment. "Bring me the deal." he tells me. "Guys hold on a few minutes, my GM wants to look the deal over one more time to see if we can get it lower."
I go to the GM's office and he takes a look and punches some numbers here others there and tells me.; "Tell them this is the best we can do; $469.00 per month for 84 months. If they don't want it then send them home."
I go back to the table and give them the good news! "OK, here's where
For the second or third time I complete a story and this dumb software cuts the post off!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Anyway, here's the rest of the story.
"OK, here's where we are. $469.00 a month." and I wait for their response. "Can you give us a few minutes while we talk about it and smoke a cigarrete?" he asks. "Sure, I'll be right here." I reply.
They come back into the showroom and she has a big smile and says "$450.00 and I'll sign up right now!" she says. "Nope can't do it. Sorry." I tell her. "Can't you give us more for the Tahoe? another dealer was giving us $18,500 for it." she tells me. "You should have taken it. What dealer was this?" I ask. "The Chevy dealer where we bought it." she replies. "And what vehicle were you looking at over there?" I ask. "A Colorado." she replies. "Well, they probably have big rebates on them so they over allowed on your trade." I tell them. They remain quiet and I say "Look, I'm sorry about the position you are in. You probably read about how the used SUV market is taking a beating on trade-ins. We already have too many used SUV's that we are going to have a hard time selling. If you look in our trade lot you'll see lots of Expeditions, Tahoes, Suburbans, and even the smaller SUV's are being traded in for more economical cars"
They thank me for my time and we part company. The next morning Frankie calls me and asks me where the deal folder is. I tell him is on my top drawer and it's unlocked. "Are they coming to buy the truck?" I ask. "I talked to the husband this morning and they'll be here in a few hours. He also told me his wife said you were an as*****. I told him you were one of the nicest guys at the store. He probably was tired of standing out in 100 degree plus weather."
Later that afternoon I'm walking back to the service department with one of my favorite customers. She's a sweet 74 year old lady and she has her arm around me and I have mine over her shoulder. We are just talking having a good time. "You are such a sweetheart!" she says after I told her that I would personally take her license plates to her home and put them on. Right when she said that, the couple comes out of F$I. The husband looks at me and smiles while the wife just looks at me and turns beet red. I was going to go up to her and tell her: "So I'm an As***** huh?" but my better judgement got the best of me so I just said "Enjoy your truck." And my friend looks at them and says.: " Boy, if you didn't buy your car from Mack you missed out."
What the heck were those people doing in there, anyway? And PLEASE don't tell me they were buying a new truck "to save money on gas"! Sure, a Tacoma gets better mileage than a Tahoe, but what are we talking about here, 8 or 9 miles per gallon on average. It's going to take them a great number of miles before they cancel their 7,500 debt (and that's just from the Tahoe!)
Oh, why do people insist on buying cars when they are already upside down on their current one (which usually has nothing wrong with it!) Okay, I'm done ranting about it.
So, here's my question to all the sales folks here - you're all smart from what I have read. The couple in Mack's story were quoted a payment of $509, BUT they ended up with a $469 payment in the end. How does John Q. Customer start there? What are the magic words for me to say to get the best deal right away?
Just for some background on how I have done it, I research like crazy before entering a dealer, and I show up with a spreadsheet which has calculations of the dealer's cost of the car plus a 4% profit. Usually, my offer is accepted, but I hate to waste time, so I assert that I will leave if my offer is rejected. Is this a good way (from a sales person's perspective) for me to deal?
Thanks all for your time - I have 193K miles on my 96 Corolla, so I estimate that I'll need one of your services in about 10 years or so.
If my math is right they are paying almost 40K for a 26K Tacoma. Absolutely, crazy! Does this type of thing happen often? Why would anyone try and trade a one year old domestic (or any) full size SUV... let alone one you financed for 7 years.
Just for some background on how I have done it, I research like crazy before entering a dealer, and I show up with a spreadsheet which has calculations of the dealer's cost of the car plus a 4% profit. Usually, my offer is accepted, but I hate to waste time, so I assert that I will leave if my offer is rejected. Is this a good way (from a sales person's perspective) for me to deal?
Do a search here on the Bobst Method thats how he does it and its been discussed here at length.
2011 Hyundai Sonata, 2014 BMW 428i convertible, 2015 Honda CTX700D
I show up with a spreadsheet which has calculations of the dealer's cost of the car plus a 4% profit. What are the magic words for me to say to get the best deal right away?
Show up at my dealership and say carhag I am looking for any car but a civic! Heck I'll even buy you a pop while we get your new car cleaned up!
Y'all were ready to torch the customer at $509 but got lucky the big dog was on the phone. Why not roll the sale and get it done instead of blowing them out?
What price did the customer end up getting? Sounds like he got what he wanted on his trade and got the truck for back of invoice.
I can see that there is no accounting for taste. At least I didn't put "To Be Continued". You have now forfeited your opportunity to market the book. I am also reporting you to Team Jipster. I wonder where he has been lately?
Hi Richard. The family just got back, from a weeks vacation in Panama City Beach, a few days ago. Very nice. They let me go with them this time.
I've been catching up skimming over the last couple hundred posts. Some of you guys have been pretty naughty while I was away. I noticed Krisite had to break out her Delete-O-Matic 5000 a couple times... with Tidester providing air support. Moo seems to be posting more lately... I knew he couldn't resist.
As for jmonroe, I'm sorry to say he's just too much trouble for Team Jipster. He's had 7 reprogramming sessions, a full frontal lobotomy and he's been neutered. STILL he remains quite belligerent to authority. Perhaps I can trade him to Team Tidester for a t-shirt or something?
I think what your doing is pretty good. Having a strong idea of what the market is doing before going in helps a lot.
Whatever you do, don't do what most people do, which is, come in having done 0 research, ask for the best price, and then leave. They wouldn't know what the best price is if it bit them in the butt.
For the second or third time I complete a story and this dumb software cuts the post off!!!!!!!!!!!!!
There is a limit on the size of postings (I don't remember exactly what it is though). If you want to know more about it you can ask in Forums Software! Your Questions Answered...
Just for some background on how I have done it, I research like crazy before entering a dealer, and I show up with a spreadsheet which has calculations of the dealer's cost of the car plus a 4% profit. Usually, my offer is accepted, but I hate to waste time, so I assert that I will leave if my offer is rejected. Is this a good way (from a sales person's perspective) for me to deal?
FWIW, I don’t know why you feel you have to justify your price by showing your research paperwork to the dealer. Sorta like Wall-Mart not having to tell K-Mart how they do business. The dealer knows what they can sell at so let them meet your verbal price or you can leave.
Is this a good way (from a sales person's perspective) for me to deal?
If it works for you and you’re satisfied that’s all that should matter. There is more than one way to skin a cat and buying a car is no different. BTW, I start with the Internet followed up with a phone call, go to the dealer to sign the papers then drive that beauty home and start waxing it. That’s because I don’t fall for the “paint sealant option” spiel in the F&I office.
jmonroe
'15 Genesis V8 with Ultimate Package and '18 Legacy Limited 6 cyl
What are the magic words for me to say to get the best deal right away?
Actions always speak louder than words. Everytime the "mental midgets" got up to leave... the price went down. Maybe, they weren't such mental midgets after all?
The family just got back, from a weeks vacation in Panama City Beach, a few days ago. Very nice. They let me go with them this time.
How did you talk them into that?
As for jmonroe, I'm sorry to say he's just too much trouble for Team Jipster. He's had 7 reprogramming sessions, a full frontal lobotomy and he's been neutered. STILL he remains quite belligerent to authority. Perhaps I can trade him to Team Tidester for a t-shirt or something?
I’ll go for the trade if you can reverse the neutering process. I think I just found a need for those things. :P To keep this on topic I’ll drive over and get them.
Everything else we’ll leave as is so Tidester doesn’t feel cheated.
jmonroe
'15 Genesis V8 with Ultimate Package and '18 Legacy Limited 6 cyl
I figure since it's about a three grand difference in price their payments will go up by 60 bucks or so. "This truck will be about 60 dollars more a month."
OK. Wait. I think I missed a step. The truck was $3k more? And you figured $60, which would be about right on a 5-year note. They are on a 7-year note. So how in the world did the payment jump from $349 to $509???
Hell, I don't even know how they were at $349 to begin with. Are we talking $349 before the negative equity? And $509 was with negative and the more expensive Tacoma?
'11 GMC Sierra 1500; '98 Alfa 156 2.0TS; '08 Maser QP; '67 Coronet R/T; '13 Fiat 500c; '20 S90 T6; '22 MB Sprinter 2500 4x4 diesel; '97 Suzuki R Wagon; '96 Opel Astra; '11 Mini Cooper S
I took a bath and told them they could all sleep while I made the 12 hour drive.
Seriously, I almost got into a very bad accident on the way down. Some guy stopped at a light on 4 lane highway (65mph speed limit). I assumed he would accelerate as the light had turned green and I was still quite a ways from the intersection. He didn't, instead sitting there waiting for the left turning lane to funnel out so he could turn. I hesitated for a second. Luckily my wife was paying attention, and smacked me in the head with a frying pan that she always carries with her, and told me to get in the other (slow) lane. I knew there was another car close behind in the other lane, but I had no choice. I accelerated and moved over into the other lane, narrowly missing the car that had stopped and the car in the other lane... the man/woman (couldn't tell) was flipping me off. Can't say I blame him/her.
I’ll go for the trade if you can reverse the neutering process. I think I just found a need for those things. To keep this on topic I’ll drive over and get them.
Well, I was playing ping-pong a couple days ago... I'll look around. :sick:
The sad part is they ended paying more for the truck when the negative was added to the amount financed. It came out to $31,797.00 over 84 months. I don't recall what interest rate they were given but they will be paying for it for a long long time.
The mileage difference is not that great. The Taco they bought gets 16 city 20 hwy and according to EPA estimates the 07 Tahoe 2wd gets a combined mpg of 20.5 miles. So with the old EPA ratings that number is probably a lot less.
To answer your question: There's nothing you can say that will get you a better deal right away. Our job is to maximize profit for the dealership and getting a bigger commission for ourselves. We end up doing deals like this where we lost $1500 on the front end gross of the deal, or $2500.00 including the rebate due to time spent negotiating, and hopefully we can recoup some of that in aftermarket and finance which in this case we did. 84 month loans carry a lot of interest. Mack
p.s. What type of percussionist are you? I'm a drummer and now learning guitar.
Unfortunately it happens a lot. Once they realize the gas mileage difference is pretty much inexistent they will be back to get out of the Tacoma. Mack
We weren't "torching" anyone. Frankly, I lost all interest in the deal once they started complaining and moaning on how bad we took them on the trade. Believe me, a split mini deal is not worth the aggravation. I just hope they didn't RDR the truck in my name as I know these people are going to burn us on the survey.
The truck they ended up with was $3000.00 more than the first truck. I don't know how the GM manipulated the numbers but we still lost money on the deal to move a truck which lately having been moving much. Toyota has cut production on Tacomas, Tundras, and Sequoias. Mack
"Whatever you do, don't do what most people do, which is, come in having done 0 research, ask for the best price, and then leave. They wouldn't know what the best price is if it bit them in the butt. "
d you took the words right out of my mouth.! :shades:
$469.00 a month for 84 months. That's what they went into F$I. They probably ended up higher than that. I'll check the billed sheet and see what the final was. Mack
Wow, that is a very long time. And for what? They will spend the same on gas I am guessing and if you say the gas mileage is not that different, then what was the point? I would laugh if they come back to your dealership to try to trade that Tacoma in. :P
Just for some background on how I have done it, I research like crazy before entering a dealer, and I show up with a spreadsheet which has calculations of the dealer's cost of the car plus a 4% profit. Usually, my offer is accepted, but I hate to waste time, so I assert that I will leave if my offer is rejected. Is this a good way (from a sales person's perspective) for me to deal?
Not one that I would recommend. It is like having an audience coming up to you an telling you how to play your percussion instrument. All they need to tell is what they want to hear and you handle your stuff. No?
Didn't you see what they ended up financing? $31,797.00, and $8500 of that was negative equity (what an oxymoron heh?) So the price of the Taco was $23,297.00 after rebate which is $1000.00 and like I said those were the numbers going in to F$I. I can guarantee you they probably bought an extended warranty. Most people who own domestics and buy a Toyota always do. They think the truck is going to fall apart after the warranty expires like on the Chevys and Fords. No offense to owners of Chevys and Fords. Just telling it like it is. Mack
When she told me the payment she heard was $439.00 she didn't tell me for how long so I assumed it was for 60 months so I used the rule of 20-30 dollars per $1000.00 financed. All the payments were quoted with the negative equity. I did not know the actual payment quoted initially was $449.00 for 84 months until we got back to the dealership and I opened up the deal folder to change the stock numbers so we would have the right truck in the computer. Mack
My bad. I went back and looked at my story and I put $339.00 instead of $439.00 I apologize.
Good story mack. I'm guessing similar are playing out all over.
So they bought a Taco for the same money as the Tahoe they got last year since the negative was rolled into the new deal. They cut their payment by about $60, I'm guessing by stretching the term out longer. They will end up paying more in interest. They might get 4 more MPG combined. Well, I hope they enjoy their truck.
and you're an a$*****. hmmm
I'm still unclear on where the $349 came from. Was that on the first Taco at 60 months without the negative rolled in? Edit: I see you already cleared this up.
Thanks! Now if I could just find out at what point this software cuts your posts off I would be very happy and so would you guys and gals that like my stories. I would end them in one sitting. However, last night's story cut my post off at "Ok, folks here..." but while I was writing the story I wrote it till the end. When I clicked post it was cut off. The first ending was actually better than the final ending. However, it was lost on the first post when I hit post. Confused? So am I. :confuse: Mack
"When I clicked post it was cut off. The first ending was actually better than the final ending. However, it was lost on the first post when I hit post."
Bummer. Did you try hitting the "Back" browser button to see if you could get your original story back on your screen? I'm guessing this wouldn't work, but if it does, you could highlight, copy, and paste the original ending into a new message.
An advertisement from a Chevy dealer within our local newspaper provides all us readers with this highly profound observation:
"Due to the softening market for the larger trucks and SUVs, now may not be the most advantageous time to trade [one] in."
Gee..., ya think?
However, their main point is this:
"Wouldn't it be nice to keep that vehicle (ie, full-sized SUV or truck) for your active lifestyle and have a fuel-efficient vehicle for commuting and running errands around town? Better yet, what if you could have both vehicles for less than you're paying now?"
"Yes! You can have your cake and eat it, too".
No, I'm not making this up. Except for the words I bracketed, this is all a direct quote. Can a ploy such as this gain any steam?
I suggest that you compose your message in Notepad, which is built into Windows, or a similar text editor. Then, when you're ready to post, copy (don't cut) your text into the "Post a Message" window on the web page. That way, you won't lose your post if the forum software burps, as it sometimes does.
Doesn't surprise me. I have sort of been waiting for a pitch in this vein.
"See, you're paying $649 a month for that MondoTruck 450 and you're fuel costs are $700 a month. We can get you into the IttyBitty Max for just $249 a month and it will save you $400 a month in gas. You're ahead by over $200 a month or so and you have 2 vehicles. Plus your truck will hold its value better since you won't be running up the miles on it. Doesn't that sound great?"
That's actually not a bad idea. You could potentially refinance old vehicle, save fuel, not take a bath on your SUV that is worth nothing, get multiline discount at the insurance company....
It does sound outrageous at first blush, but it really is not that far fetched. It is highly dependent on the real numbers for it to make any sense at all though. It is an oddball pitch, but in the hands of a good salesperson, who knows.
Comments
You got it. It's all between the ears. Stay away from negative people, stay positive, smile, compliment the customer on anything, shoes,dress, tie, etc. Make them feel special. Like I said some sales people spend too much energy on finding reasons not to sell a car.
Mack
I think Jeff Foxworthy would disagree with that!
I've lowered my speed to 60mph and most cars pass me doing 70+ mph and have their windows rolled down which actually creates drag and uses more fuel. Go figure.
Mythbusters did an episode on that and confirmed your assertion!
[Edit: It looks like OldFarmer beat me to the Mythbusters comment!]
tidester, host
SUVs and Smart Shopper
I got a better deal for you!
2005 Dodge Neon SXT, one owner, 42345 gently driven miles. Coldest a/c in Virginia Beach, picture yourself driving this economical sporty sedan. MPG: a lot!, keyless remote entry, power windows, power mirrors, power locks, 6 cd changer, cruise/speed control, aluminum alloy wheels. Midnight Black exterior. Carpet shampooed and freshly waxed and ready to go! Looks showroom new! Only $8495.00 plus ttl and processing fee. Call Mack M at 757-491-0234
Hot dang I should write the classified ads for these dealers!
:P
Mackabee
Yeah but he was wrong and you are correct!
Time for a short story dealing with mental midgets. Next post.
:shades:
Two weeks ago Monday I was at my work station making phone calls to previous customers and recent prospects. My GM comes over and asks me if I want to help one of our other sales persons as he had an emergency and had to leave. I said "Sure I'll help him" I replied. He gives me a folder and tells me all the figures have been worked out on their trade and the new truck and I just have to put them on a test drive and get them into F$I. You would think it was an easy task, but nooooooo!
"Come on, I'll introduce you to them." We walk to the "porch" in front of the showroom and they are walking around the truck like it's something from outer space.
"Guys, this is Mack. He's one of my top people. He'll answer any questions you have." I shake the guys hand and the wife is a bit standoffish. I put the tag on the truck and they go on a test drive. About 15 minutes later they get back and she parks the truck back on the porch. "Where's the cruise control button? I couldn't find it anywhere." she says to me. "This truck doesn't have cruise control." I tell her. "It doesn't??I got to have cruise." she responds. "What about keyless entry?" the husband asks. "Nope, not that either. Didn't Frankie go over the features with you?" I ask them. They ignore the question.
They are looking at the least expensive Tacoma double cab that we have in stock. These are what we call "strippies" in the car biz as the only thing they come with is floor mats besides the standard equipment. This particular truck's MSRP was $23,196.00. We advertise them online for something like $20,990.00, these are the "teaser" ads to get people in the door or out the door whichever the case may be. So anyway, I tell them in order to get cruise and keyless they have to get one with SR5 package#2 which has a host of other neat options like, rear sliding window, privacy glass, and other goodies plus it also has the limited slip differential option. MSRP $25,567.00 They ask me to show them one and I tell them we will have to go to our overflow lot as that's where they are located.
We get in the Tacoma they test drove and head out to the overflow lot.
(we are having a hail storm as I write this!)
As soon as we leave the dealership's parking lot the husband starts bitching and moaning about how we are "killing him on the trade". I tell them I had nothing to do with the trade or the deal. I'm just the relief pitcher.
We get there and it's over 100% with a heat index of about 105-110. It is hot! So these two go their own merry way going from one truck to other.. "Honey, this one has cruise control, it's $29,589.00" he shouts from across the lot to her. "This one too and it's $27,897.00" she responds. "I have the stock numbers for the only two Pre-runner d-cabs in stock with pack 2 and I pull both of them off the line. One is Impulse red and the other is Radiant red. They are both identical and have the same sticker price. "This one is about three thousand dollars more. If you give me this one for the price of the blue one we drove we'll make a deal." he says to me and then throws a jab "besides you guys are stealing my trade." The trade in question is a 2007 Chevy Tahoe 2wd plain Jane. No moonroof, no leather, etc.. which they paid $31,000.00 for it a year ago and they owe $25,500.00 on and trade value is $17,000 OUCH! can you say "Buried?"
So after an hour of wandering in the lot I'm sweating my buns off and am getting really thirsty and begin to feel dizzy. "Ok guys, what's it going to be? I'm getting sick out here." I tell them. She looks at me and says nothing, her husband looks at me also and smiles. "Come on honey, it's hot out here." he tells her. "I don't like either of the red trucks. I want a blue one." So the next closest truck is one with the TRD off-road package and alloy wheels which puts the truck over the $26k range. I pull the truck off the line and open it up. "How much more are my payments going to be?" she asks. "I don't know, what were the payments on the first blue truck?" I ask. "They told us $339.00." she responds. I figure since it's about a three grand difference in price their payments will go up by 60 bucks or so. "This truck will be about 60 dollars more a month." I tell them. "We can't go that high. We are paying $519.00 on the Tahoe. Why can't you give us this truck for the same price as the cheaper truck." she says. "We don't have that kind of mark up as the domestics do." I tell her. "Ok, let's go back and see what you can do." she tells me.
We get back to the dealership and sit down at a workstation. I open the folder up and see the payment they were quoted was actually $349.00 not $339.00 and this is for 84 months!! I take the deal folder to the new car manager and tell him what has transpired so far. We are on a more expensive truck and they want to pay the same as the least expensive truck. He laughs and gives me the new numbers. We are at $506.00 per month at 84 months. I go back to the table and present the figures to them. I put the worksheet in front of them and they both stare at it for what seems like eons hoping the payment will go lower if they stare at it long enough. "We can't do that. It's too high. It's almost as much as we are paying for the Tahoe." she says. I look at her and tell her I sympathize with their situation but there is nothing I can do about the trade. "You are getting the truck for $1000.00 under invoice after the rebate." I tell them. "You could give us more for our Tahoe," she says. I flip the paper over and show her that we could sell our truck for MSRP and give her 3k more for her trade. "The bottom line is still the same. Total financed will be $32,789.00" I tell her. She is the dominant party as the husband has been real quiet. She looks over at him and says in a low voice.: "We should come back tomorrow when Frankie is here, he can get us a better deal." she didn't think I heard her and I say: "Frankie won't get you a better deal, these numbers are coming from the big dog, our general manager." I tell her.
They look at each other and stand up. "The payment is too high. Give us the keys to our Tahoe." she tells me. Right at that moment my phone rings and it's the GM. He has a question about some floor mats that were missing from a new car and I gave the customer a "we owe" and ordered the mats for her. I then tell him the prospects are about to leave as they are not happy with the payment. "Bring me the deal." he tells me. "Guys hold on a few minutes, my GM wants to look the deal over one more time to see if we can get it lower."
I go to the GM's office and he takes a look and punches some numbers here others there and tells me.; "Tell them this is the best we can do; $469.00 per month for 84 months. If they don't want it then send them home."
I go back to the table and give them the good news! "OK, here's where
Anyway, here's the rest of the story.
"OK, here's where we are. $469.00 a month." and I wait for their response. "Can you give us a few minutes while we talk about it and smoke a cigarrete?" he asks. "Sure, I'll be right here." I reply.
They come back into the showroom and she has a big smile and says "$450.00 and I'll sign up right now!" she says. "Nope can't do it. Sorry." I tell her. "Can't you give us more for the Tahoe? another dealer was giving us $18,500 for it." she tells me. "You should have taken it. What dealer was this?" I ask. "The Chevy dealer where we bought it." she replies. "And what vehicle were you looking at over there?" I ask. "A Colorado." she replies. "Well, they probably have big rebates on them so they over allowed on your trade." I tell them. They remain quiet and I say "Look, I'm sorry about the position you are in. You probably read about how the used SUV market is taking a beating on trade-ins. We already have too many used SUV's that we are going to have a hard time selling. If you look in our trade lot you'll see lots of Expeditions, Tahoes, Suburbans, and even the smaller SUV's are being traded in for more economical cars"
They thank me for my time and we part company.
The next morning Frankie calls me and asks me where the deal folder is. I tell him is on my top drawer and it's unlocked. "Are they coming to buy the truck?" I ask. "I talked to the husband this morning and they'll be here in a few hours. He also told me his wife said you were an as*****. I told him you were one of the nicest guys at the store. He probably was tired of standing out in 100 degree plus weather."
Later that afternoon I'm walking back to the service department with one of my favorite customers. She's a sweet 74 year old lady and she has her arm around me and I have mine over her shoulder. We are just talking having a good time. "You are such a sweetheart!" she says after I told her that I would personally take her license plates to her home and put them on. Right when she said that, the couple comes out of F$I. The husband looks at me and smiles while the wife just looks at me and turns beet red. I was going to go up to her and tell her: "So I'm an As***** huh?" but my better judgement got the best of me so I just said "Enjoy your truck." And my friend looks at them and says.: " Boy, if you didn't buy your car from Mack you missed out."
:shades:
Oh, why do people insist on buying cars when they are already upside down on their current one (which usually has nothing wrong with it!) Okay, I'm done ranting about it.
So, here's my question to all the sales folks here - you're all smart from what I have read. The couple in Mack's story were quoted a payment of $509, BUT they ended up with a $469 payment in the end. How does John Q. Customer start there? What are the magic words for me to say to get the best deal right away?
Just for some background on how I have done it, I research like crazy before entering a dealer, and I show up with a spreadsheet which has calculations of the dealer's cost of the car plus a 4% profit. Usually, my offer is accepted, but I hate to waste time, so I assert that I will leave if my offer is rejected. Is this a good way (from a sales person's perspective) for me to deal?
Thanks all for your time - I have 193K miles on my 96 Corolla, so I estimate that I'll need one of your services in about 10 years or so.
-Percussionist
If my math is right they are paying almost 40K for a 26K Tacoma. Absolutely, crazy! Does this type of thing happen often? Why would anyone try and trade a one year old domestic (or any) full size SUV... let alone one you financed for 7 years.
As always...thanks for the story!
2025 Ram 1500 Laramie 4x4 / 2023 Mercedes EQE 350 4Matic
Do a search here on the Bobst Method thats how he does it and its been discussed here at length.
2011 Hyundai Sonata, 2014 BMW 428i convertible, 2015 Honda CTX700D
Richard
What are the magic words for me to say to get the best deal right away?
Show up at my dealership and say carhag I am looking for any car but a civic! Heck I'll even buy you a pop while we get your new car cleaned up!
If that will include a dining room set, you're on.
jmonroe
'15 Genesis V8 with Ultimate Package and '18 Legacy Limited 6 cyl
Y'all were ready to torch the customer at $509 but got lucky the big dog was on the phone. Why not roll the sale and get it done instead of blowing them out?
What price did the customer end up getting? Sounds like he got what he wanted on his trade and got the truck for back of invoice.
Hi Richard. The family just got back, from a weeks vacation in Panama City Beach, a few days ago. Very nice. They let me go with them this time.
I've been catching up skimming over the last couple hundred posts. Some of you guys have been pretty naughty while I was away. I noticed Krisite had to break out her Delete-O-Matic 5000 a couple times... with Tidester providing air support. Moo seems to be posting more lately... I knew he couldn't resist.
As for jmonroe, I'm sorry to say he's just too much trouble for Team Jipster. He's had 7 reprogramming sessions, a full frontal lobotomy and he's been neutered. STILL he remains quite belligerent to authority. Perhaps I can trade him to Team Tidester for a t-shirt or something?
Whatever you do, don't do what most people do, which is, come in having done 0 research, ask for the best price, and then leave. They wouldn't know what the best price is if it bit them in the butt.
All this for free from a BMW salesman
There is a limit on the size of postings (I don't remember exactly what it is though). If you want to know more about it you can ask in Forums Software! Your Questions Answered...
tidester, host
SUVs and Smart Shopper
FWIW, I don’t know why you feel you have to justify your price by showing your research paperwork to the dealer. Sorta like Wall-Mart not having to tell K-Mart how they do business. The dealer knows what they can sell at so let them meet your verbal price or you can leave.
Is this a good way (from a sales person's perspective) for me to deal?
If it works for you and you’re satisfied that’s all that should matter. There is more than one way to skin a cat and buying a car is no different. BTW, I start with the Internet followed up with a phone call, go to the dealer to sign the papers then drive that beauty home and start waxing it. That’s because I don’t fall for the “paint sealant option” spiel in the F&I office.
jmonroe
'15 Genesis V8 with Ultimate Package and '18 Legacy Limited 6 cyl
Actions always speak louder than words. Everytime the "mental midgets" got up to leave... the price went down. Maybe, they weren't such mental midgets after all?
How did you talk them into that?
As for jmonroe, I'm sorry to say he's just too much trouble for Team Jipster. He's had 7 reprogramming sessions, a full frontal lobotomy and he's been neutered. STILL he remains quite belligerent to authority. Perhaps I can trade him to Team Tidester for a t-shirt or something?
I’ll go for the trade if you can reverse the neutering process. I think I just found a need for those things. :P To keep this on topic I’ll drive over and get them.
Everything else we’ll leave as is so Tidester doesn’t feel cheated.
jmonroe
'15 Genesis V8 with Ultimate Package and '18 Legacy Limited 6 cyl
OK. Wait. I think I missed a step. The truck was $3k more? And you figured $60, which would be about right on a 5-year note. They are on a 7-year note. So how in the world did the payment jump from $349 to $509???
Hell, I don't even know how they were at $349 to begin with. Are we talking $349 before the negative equity? And $509 was with negative and the more expensive Tacoma?
'11 GMC Sierra 1500; '98 Alfa 156 2.0TS; '08 Maser QP; '67 Coronet R/T; '13 Fiat 500c; '20 S90 T6; '22 MB Sprinter 2500 4x4 diesel; '97 Suzuki R Wagon; '96 Opel Astra; '11 Mini Cooper S
I took a bath and told them they could all sleep while I made the 12 hour drive.
Seriously, I almost got into a very bad accident on the way down. Some guy stopped at a light on 4 lane highway (65mph speed limit). I assumed he would accelerate as the light had turned green and I was still quite a ways from the intersection. He didn't, instead sitting there waiting for the left turning lane to funnel out so he could turn. I hesitated for a second. Luckily my wife was paying attention, and smacked me in the head with a frying pan that she always carries with her, and told me to get in the other (slow) lane. I knew there was another car close behind in the other lane, but I had no choice. I accelerated and moved over into the other lane, narrowly missing the car that had stopped and the car in the other lane... the man/woman (couldn't tell) was flipping me off. Can't say I blame him/her.
I’ll go for the trade if you can reverse the neutering process. I think I just found a need for those things. To keep this on topic I’ll drive over and get them.
Well, I was playing ping-pong a couple days ago... I'll look around. :sick:
The mileage difference is not that great. The Taco they bought gets 16 city 20 hwy and according to EPA estimates the 07 Tahoe 2wd gets a combined mpg of 20.5 miles. So with the old EPA ratings that number is probably a lot less.
To answer your question: There's nothing you can say that will get you a better deal right away. Our job is to maximize profit for the dealership and getting a bigger commission for ourselves. We end up doing deals like this where we lost $1500 on the front end gross of the deal, or $2500.00 including the rebate due to time spent negotiating, and hopefully we can recoup some of that in aftermarket and finance which in this case we did. 84 month loans carry a lot of interest.
Mack
p.s. What type of percussionist are you?
I'm a drummer and now learning guitar.
Mack
The truck they ended up with was $3000.00 more than the first truck. I don't know how the GM manipulated the numbers but we still lost money on the deal to move a truck which lately having been moving much. Toyota has cut production on Tacomas, Tundras, and Sequoias.
Mack
d you took the words right out of my mouth.!
:shades:
Mack
Not one that I would recommend.
It is like having an audience coming up to you an telling you how to play your percussion instrument. All they need to tell is what they want to hear and you handle your stuff. No?
Mack
Mack
My bad. I went back and looked at my story and I put $339.00 instead of $439.00
I apologize.
So they bought a Taco for the same money as the Tahoe they got last year since the negative was rolled into the new deal. They cut their payment by about $60, I'm guessing by stretching the term out longer. They will end up paying more in interest. They might get 4 more MPG combined. Well, I hope they enjoy their truck.
and you're an a$*****. hmmm
I'm still unclear on where the $349 came from. Was that on the first Taco at 60 months without the negative rolled in? Edit: I see you already cleared this up.
Mack
There just might be a $46,000 Rav4 in their future. :P
O.k... sorry... they is mental midgets! They got a Taco with more options than the original stripper they looked at.
Mack
Not good news for the Team!
Bummer. Did you try hitting the "Back" browser button to see if you could get your original story back on your screen? I'm guessing this wouldn't work, but if it does, you could highlight, copy, and paste the original ending into a new message.
"Due to the softening market for the larger trucks and SUVs, now may not be the most advantageous time to trade [one] in."
Gee..., ya think?
However, their main point is this:
"Wouldn't it be nice to keep that vehicle (ie, full-sized SUV or truck) for your active lifestyle and have a fuel-efficient vehicle for commuting and running errands around town? Better yet, what if you could have both vehicles for less than you're paying now?"
"Yes! You can have your cake and eat it, too".
No, I'm not making this up. Except for the words I bracketed, this is all a direct quote. Can a ploy such as this gain any steam?
"See, you're paying $649 a month for that MondoTruck 450 and you're fuel costs are $700 a month. We can get you into the IttyBitty Max for just $249 a month and it will save you $400 a month in gas. You're ahead by over $200 a month or so and you have 2 vehicles. Plus your truck will hold its value better since you won't be running up the miles on it. Doesn't that sound great?"
It might be worth it! :P
-moo
It does sound outrageous at first blush, but it really is not that far fetched. It is highly dependent on the real numbers for it to make any sense at all though. It is an oddball pitch, but in the hands of a good salesperson, who knows.
the only good neon is the srt 4.
You could do that if you use Firefox browser
http://www.mozilla.com/en-US/firefox/