Stories from the Sales Frontlines

isellhondas

Bobst probably lost his car keys and Mack may not be feeling well.

bolivar

Bobst.

I think he is the last living Fortran programmer.

With Homeland Security taking over a huge amount of our government (don't they have control over the Coast Guard?), I think they also gobbled up a mass of old Fortran programs in many of the institutions that were moved under their control.

When the last government Fortran programmer died a year or so ago (a GS-9 with 47 years of service), HS found Bobst. In the early morning hours he was visited by several men in black, with a black helicoptor idling in the vacant lot behind his house.

Bobst is spending long days and nights buried in maintenance of ancient Federal systems. He is in an underground bunker with all his basic needs being met, but internet access is surely not needed, or allowed, as Bob attempts to decipher the GO TO's of a mass of spagetti code, most written during the 1960's.

So, Bobst no longer uses, or needs, those 4 programmed keys he got with his last Honda.

Remember him in your prayers.

P.S. I've heard our government is also running very low on Cobol programmers. With even more ancient systems still running on this code. They are not going to get me. I've taken to wandering the neighborhood with an umbrella, in my undies and an open robe, unshaven and mumbling. What worked for years for a mafia godfather should work for me. And I'll never again tell anyone what I did for 33 years. Just to give an automotive slant to this, I still slide the Corvette out of the garage around 3am for short drives.

snakeweasel

I've taken to wandering the neighborhood with an umbrella, in my undies and an open robe, unshaven and mumbling.

And how is this different from your normal activities?

Ducking and running

:P

wesleyg

thanks, what you just said about overpriced residuals is exactly what happened to me yesterday when I turned in my 05 Equinox for the new Impala. I called GMAC last week and the buyout was something like 15.1K for the Equinox, now thats an almost 4 year old car, why would I want to buy it for that when I got the new Impala for about 15.6K with zero miles, no matter how much you liked the old car you just could not justify buying it.

And yeah, they stressed the equity of buying versus leasing, but I stopped him telling him after 37 new cars, if I hadn't figured out that yet then he couldn't help me, he laughed, said I forgot who I was talking to etc.

So, at this late date I've become a buyer, I'll sell them after 24 months private sale and continue on. I can take my time with the private selling since I'm retired mow and can play around with it. The important part for people in general seems to me that many on the fringe of not being able to buy a fairly expensive new car they really want, before they could handle the lease payments but not afford the monthly buy payments. I'm guessing here, not being in the business, but wouldn't it greatly impact some manufacters that rely on leases? Seems I read companies like BMW etc. relied on 35% or more of their customers as leases, surely many of these are now off the list if they have to try to borrow all that cash.

wesleyg

thanks Graphic, as you can see I cant take any credit for this cause it seems I caught them with their pants down. I told a buddy about this deal and he is going to see them this week about snagging an Impala for that kind of money.

I told him for heavens sake, start off the conversation that you want to LEASE it, then go from there. That seems to be the magic word, we'll see.

oldfarmer50

I was just flipping through the channels and stopped at a Toyota commercial. They were promoting a 0% interest deal. I was shocked at all the big boats they were trying to sell. It seemed like everything in the Toyota barn was a big beast.

When did Toyota fall into the GM trap and start producing so many large SUVs and trucks?

verdugo

Any thoughts on the VW take over? Most of the VW stores I'm aware of are standalone....just like Porsche stores. Pure speculation, but with Porsche upping their ownership of VW, I could see some consolidation happening. Maybe far fetched, but I could see a business model whereas the person coming into the showroom looking for a Jetta, aspires to a Cayman sitting right next to it. At 25, he/she buys the Jetta.


I doubt it. They split up the VW and Audi dealerships, so I doubt they would put VW and Porsche together. Maybe Audi and Porsche, but def. not with VW.

Mr_Shiftright

Here's a weird factoid.

In 1961, when the new "hot" Thunderbird was announced, Ford announced that approximately 2% of the entire US population visited Ford showrooms to see the car during it's initial introduction to the public.

Do you think THAT will ever happen again? That would be what.....6 million people? And Ford has 4,300 Ford and L-M dealerships in the US.

So that would be about 1,400 people per dealership.

What's good floor traffic for say a month?

isellhondas

And the 1961 Thunderbird was one of the worst cars Ford ever built!

tedebear

It's all about marketing. Look at Windows, Bose and a few other popular household names.

graphicguy

Taking a trip down memory lane, I remember my late Father taking me for a ride by the dealerships when the new models were rolling out. This is probably somewhere around the mid-late '60s (when I was a little gg.....and not a big GG).

Dealerships would either have their windows covered in black paint. Or, they'd have newspaper covering the windows, so people couldn't see the new models until a specified date.

The dealerships would rip down the newspaper from the windows, or clean the black paint off, sometime during the night, to reveal the new/improved models. I really don't remember the year, but we went past a Pontiac dealership. People were actually lined up to get in, after the "big reveal" happened the day of the rollouts. I specifically remember my Father touching the new iron. Don't see much of that anymore.

One of my first memories, still in my Father's arms, he said I pointed towards a Firebird. Guess that was a harbinger of things to come for me. Consequently, never had a Firebird, nor a Camaro in the GG stable.

That could very well change next year, however.

driver100

Taking a trip down memory lane, I remember my late Father taking me for a ride by the dealerships when the new models were rolling out. This is probably somewhere around the mid-late '60s

That brings back fond memories too. The first new cars I remember going to see were the 1957 Fords. My father always bought Fords or Mercurys. My friend's father bought Chevys. I had to argue that Fords were better even though the GM cars always seemed nicer...interiors and exteriors.

In those days the new models were really a big thing and of course the styling was completely different every year. Now, you can hardly tell the difference when a new model comes out, and the only traffic is from people trying to get a price break on one year model.

graphicguy

This was 4 years ago. I relayed my best friend is trying to buy a Mustang Cobra. He's a Mustang fanatic. He's got a '98 Cobra 'vert sitting in his garage right now. He bought one of the first new (current gen) Mustang GTs to hit the streets back in '05. He paid $5K over MSRP for the privilege.

When I first saw and drove his '05, he still had the sticker in the window. As he let me test drive it, I thought...."now, this is a good interpretation of an honest muscle car. Nothing fancy. Just a 300 HP V8, stuck in a coupe. No fancy suspension tricks. No fancy interior. Just power in a slick body."

I was just off a buyback of an '04 Mazda RX8 (a whole other story).

I was not really interested in buying a then new Mustang for $5K over MSRP. Not really interested in buying one at MSRP. But, I was interested enough to see if I could score a good deal on what, at the time, was a very hot car.

Over the course of about 3 weeks, I stopped at every Ford dealership in a 3 state area (OH, IN, KY). They were all the same. They were holding over MSRP. Even asking them..."I'm a buyer, right now, willing to buy one out of stock (which there was very little of) for $1,000 less than MSRP." None of them would even counter my offer. Heard all the stories....."Ford can't keep up with demand (true). Why should I sell to you for a discount, when we've got plenty of people willing to buy above MSRP (also true)." Etc.

Although, I never got real serious with the Ford dealer closest to me (family run store...no affiliation with a big conglomerate). I had talked to another friend who was an engineer at the local Ford transmission plant. He had bought several vehicles at this store using his employee discount. He said he'd get me a "friend of Ford" X plan pin number if I wanted to buy a Mustang. Problem there, the dealerships weren't required to honor those discounts, if they didn't want to.

So, I go to this local, family run Ford store, drop my friend's name. The SM knew him well. I told him I was interested in a new Mustang GT. He proceeded to tell me the same things I had already heard from every other dealership. "Hot car...can't keep them in stock....getting above MSRP....Ford can't make them fast enough"...on and on.

GG-"Well, my friend gave me a Ford X-pan pin number. I was hoping to use that to buy a Mustang".

SM-"There's no way I can sell you a Mustang in stock using X-plan".

He wasn't a jerk about it. He just stated the obvious.

GG-"How about if you order one for me from the factory for X plan pricing (IIRC, a hundred or two under invoice, with a kickback from Ford for selling at X-Plan)? It's a quick easy deal. I'm willing to wait for it to be built. You move a unit. No muss. No fuss."

SM-"We'd rather sell you the ONE unit we have in stock."

GG-"I'd rather not pay MSRP, let alone over MSRP to get one. Again, I'm not in any hurry. I can wait until Ford catches up."

SM-"Well, I can't sell you the one we have in stock for that price. I can't sell you any of the ones that are incoming, because I already have deposits on them. But, if any of those deals fall through, I'll give you a call."

GG-"Can I use X-plan on any that fall through?"

SM-"No, but depending on the color, I might sell one for MSRP."

GG-"Still not interested".

We shook hands. He thanked me for stopping in. I was headed out to my car to leave. Before I even opened the door to my car, the SM came back out.

SM-"You willing to put a deposit down on a Mustang to have it built for you?"

GG-"Sure, if you honor X-plan".

I gave him a $1,000 deposit. I signed the special order at X plan. We had a deal. 6 weeks later, my car shows up. SM reminds me how good of a deal I got.

It took the entire '05 MY and well into the '06 MY for Ford to catch up with demand. I drove it for about 4-5 months. Ended up selling it privately for a few hundred less than the original MSRP.......used. At the time, they were that "HOT" of a car.

madmanmoo

Bizarre. I wonder why he did that when the market was so strong on it. . .

british_rover

ah fortran we remember the well. At Virginia tech all mining engineeing students had to take at least one class in fortran. I think the class that graduated with me in 2003 was the last class forced to endure that particular horror. Still there ate probably hundred of VA tech mining grads who have at least a basic knowledge of fortran.

fandiguy

DUKE23-You seem to think very highly of yourself due to the "25 years you've been in sales." Can you tell me exactly what you sell? I know plenty of old-timers who've been sellng forever, but don't know much and just do enough to survive. So please elder-statesman of the sales front, enlighten the rest of us "children."

Mr_Shiftright

Ah but the trick is to build an ugly car for 3 years and then build a new one that is a conspicuous improvement. Thus beauty becomes relative. You're right though, '63 Birds were much better cars. Those were the days when the CUSTOMER did the R&D for the factory! "Ah, you have brutal waves of heat coming up through your floorboards, and it takes 35 turns of the wheel to make a U-turn? We can fix that! Thanks for mentioning it!"

madmanmoo

Ok, tone it down, Fandi. You come in here with guns blazing and we've known you for 3 days.

Please show some measure of respect for the folks who have been here. Duke23 is a good guy.

Thanks.

graphicguy

moo....I think it was a combination of things.

Dealership had an opportunity to sell a unit. I wasn't in the market at over MSRP (or even at MSRP). I was a buyer at under MSRP.

It wasn't a unit in stock, or in transit, that they could get MSRP+ for.

It was a quick and easy sale.

They still made money on the deal (Ford's compensation for selling a unit at X-Plan).

Oh yeah....I used some of that GG charisma on them, too.

isellhondas

'63 T Birds looksd better bet they were still pigs.

Inadequate drum brakes and nose heavy handling that was horrible.

You just had to drive them gently.

graphicguy

BR.....Let's be careful....Fortran (and Cobol) was the cornerstones of my Computer Science degree.....lo, those many years ago

fandiguy

Read the posts leading up to my last one. Just because you've known me for 3 days, doesn't mean i was born 3 days ago. I don't measure anyones knowledge or how much respect they deserve by how long they've been posting on edmunds! You claim to be in the business as well, so you should understand where i'm coming from.

Thanks

british_rover

funny story a guy I worked with at UPS did basicly the same thing twice. The first mustang he sold for a small profit and the second he sold for a small loss. Oh and still posting from my phone so forgive any errors. To answer some questions posted earlier I am selling new Volvos, I can feel Craig shuddering, and new Saabs. I will still be selling new rovers to my old customers from time to time.

madmanmoo

I'm not claiming that you were born 3 days ago. I'm simply asking you to show a little respect. Banter and disagreement is understandable on the forum. The need to belittle him is unnecessary when he is pointing out very pertinent information regarding your claims. I would think a $60 drop in stock was a very good point.

On another note, I drove a Turbo Cab for an hour on Saturday and loved every minute of it. That was a real treat!

graphicguy

I drove a Turbo Cab for an hour on Saturday and loved every minute of it. That was a real treat!

Now, I'm jealous, moo. Short of a Ferrari or a Lambo, a Turbo Cab would be next on my list of cars I lust for. You get to sell (and drive) some mighty fine iron. Someday, maybe. Just not today. I'd like to have one of those grace my palatial estate

fandi....the last (and only) person I ever called "sir" was my Father. Don't think that will change in my lifetime, either.

fandiguy

Welcome to the convo graphicguy...i don't think i was talking to you.

isellhondas

As a newcomer to these forums you really need to know that you have rubbed some very good people the wrong way.

You might want to temper the tone of your posts a bit.

Some of us have been around these forums since they started in (I think) 1998 and we usually get along pretty well.

oldfarmer50

"...i don't think i was talking to you..."

My, my, so crabby. You must be watching the stock ticker to be in such a bad mood.

I was reading a review of the Chrysler Sebring by some commie who writes for the Sunday Times. Not only did he say the Sebring was the worst car in the world but he went on to call Americans stupid and to trash America in general.

Now that's crabby. :mad:

madmanmoo

Yup, weather was 80 degrees and had the top down. Drove back and forth from my customer's house and realized that someone has done something special with their life to own one of those. So much fun!

madmanmoo

Hehe, well, since you're relatively young in this business, then I suggest getting a thicker skin if you are offended by Duke. He's always been really easygoing and uses kid gloves whenever he talks to someone.

Did I ever tell you guys about a fellow salesman who was duct taped and thrown into the woods?

dino001

You did - in fact it was your first story that almost got you "kicked out". Something about difference in sense of humor ...

percussionist

Let's not get into personal arguments - it's too much drama for people who are so caring about cars. It reminds me of that old saying "never argue with an idiot - he'll drag you down to his level and beat you with his experience". :P There's another saying that comes to mind as well. "You'll catch more flies with honey than with vinegar."

So, let's talk about cars!

Speaking of cars and idiots, this is what happened to me when I bought my last car. I was speaking with the service advisor at the dealership (SA) about window tints for my new, black leather appointed vehicle.

P - Do you install or recommend a certain type of window tint
SA - No, we don't
P - Will it void my warranty to have it installed elsewhere
SA - No, but why do you want it
P - To cut down on the heat in the summer and enhance the apperance of the car
SA - It won't cut down the heat that much
P - Well, it has black leather, so any amount would be worth something
SA - You can't tint the front windshield
P - I realize that, but it will cut down the heat from the other windows
SA - No, more sun will just come in the front :sick:

:confuse: I never knew that!!! Apparently, our sun looks for ways to enter the car. Needless to say, this guy is in no way involved with my car's maintenance - I drive 25 miles to another dealer instead!

...and the tints are awesome - totally worth the money.

madmanmoo

That's right! Lol, that whole situation was hysterical.

That salesman is currently have a minor meltdown trying to fit into another store. His unbearable arrogance and cockiness doesn't seem to sit well with everyone. He's kind of short and wears lifts on his shoes to appear taller. I believe he has "Napoleon complex".

madmanmoo

ROFL!!

"more sun will just come in the front"

He beat you with experience on that one.

Speaking of tints, why is it always the cops who have the illegal tint on their cars when they trade in? I remember this happening on a number of occasions. Tint so dark on their personal cars that you could barely see out of them.

gogiboy

"They split up the VW and Audi dealerships, so I doubt they would put VW and Porsche together."

V--

Can't speak about the teaming of VW/Porsche, but I was looking at some VWs a couple of years back and the dealership had both new VW and Audi vehicles on the same lot with one shared building. This was in Tulsa, OK. One benefit was it made it much easier to cross-shop the GTI and A3.

Gogiboy

fandiguy

Hehe, well, since you're relatively young in this business, then I suggest getting a thicker skin if you are offended by Duke. He's always been really easygoing and uses kid gloves whenever he talks to someone.

According to your profile, you've got 5 years selling....i've got more years in f&i than that. And i was in sales and was a sales manager prior to that, so carefull. Its funny, i make a few brash comments, and i have everyone wanting me to "be nice," i think some of YOU might need to thicken your skin a bit. If i wanna talk to experts in the field, i'll talk to some of my mentors that helped me along the way, if i wanna have some fun with a bunch of people on the internet....i'll come to this forum. Just because some of you have spent a lot of time over the last couple years talking in circles, doesn't make you an expert. I'll check back in ten years when i have my own store and the rest of you are still salespeople and see if anything has changed. I haven't decided if i'm gonna just gonna leave, play nicer so no one gets their feelings hurt, or create several log-ins and really mess with some of you

I wonder how long it'll take the hosts to jump on this one!!

boomchek

SA - No, more sun will just come in the front

LOL that's the funniest thing I've heard in a while. I can imagine one of those cartoon suns flying around a car trying to get in.

madmanmoo

You're right. Now let's talk about selling cars.

kiawah

:sick: Be sure to let us know, when you get your dealership !

fandiguy

Hey kiawah.....i'll be the 3rd generation in my family to take over, so i'll be sure to let you know soon enough

Oh yeah, did i forget to mention that on my previous posts?

isis867

I never knew that!!! Apparently, our sun looks for ways to enter the car. Needless to say, this guy is in no way involved with my car's maintenance - I drive 25 miles to another dealer instead!

ROFL!!! Thanks for that! I needed the chuckle!

madmanmoo

Is your last name "Heard"? Because I have some bad news for you......

fandiguy

Nah, its not Heard....sorry. I thought you wanted to talk about selling cars. Tell me how sales have been in your area.

mikefm58

It reminds me of that old saying "never argue with an idiot - he'll drag you down to his level and beat you with his experience"

My favorite, never mud wrestle with a pig. You'll just get dirty and the pig enjoys it.

graphicguy

I'm not the host, the proctor. Nor, am I the supervisor, the school m'arm, the principal, I'm not even the school bully.

But, I think after the last "shut down" of SFTSFL, some of us veteran posters here at Edmunds agreed we should do some self-policing.

Maybe time to "chill" a little?

(mike....not directed at you. You just happen to be the last "reply" post)

dreamcellar

I think your going bankrupt and no one will listen to you complain. So you come on here and brag about the "good times". Selling cars isnt easy like it used to be. Nowadays you have to work for it. Old timers like you need to be pushed aside because all your really doing is wasting customers time and your own. The old school ways of selling cars is over pal. Time for new school treatment. Good Luck Old Timer. :P

graphicguy

isell....that's when I think I joined up.....1998. And, I think the first post I actually read was by YOU!

Don't you feel special........

dreamcellar

How many readers currently online are sitting in thier showrooms?

graphicguy

http://news.yahoo.com/s/nm/20081006/bs_nm/us_markets_oil_15

I remember when this happened in the '80s. Oil had a runnup during the end of the '70s (I can still remember my Father cursing about oil companies then).

OPEC, global oil companies, refineries, etc road the crest of the wave in the '70s by restricting supply. Just as precipitously, oil began to fall. OPEC tried to boost prices, but couldn't. A bbl dropped to $8-$10. Demand just didn't recover (until the 90s).

Just two short years ago, OPEC was saying oil at $28/bbl could trigger a world wide recession. At $22-$25/bbl, everyone was still making gobs of money on oil.

Now, they can't make any money at $80/bbl? Some economists are saying $60/bbl is something they could predict.

Demand is dropping all over again. It doesn't look like it will recover any time soon. Depending on who we elect, the U.S. may even become relatively self-sufficient in using their own oil reserves.

This will be good for the car industry. This will be good for the consumer.

jmonroe

You're right. Now let's talk about selling cars.

Nah...I liked the one where he was "gonna just gonna leave" better. Then again the one about, "create several log-ins and really mess with some of you" then wanting to know, "how long it'll take the hosts to jump on this one!!", wasn't bad either. :sick:

Somehow, I think this site will survive.

jmonroe