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Tundra vs the Big 3 - Continued

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Comments

  • mgdvhmanmgdvhman Member Posts: 4,157
    ..Hello McFly!.....is this thing on??

    If you could read....which I don't know how well...I am not comparing a 3/4 to a Tundra...you idiot..

    I will compare any 1/2 to a Tundra...(didn't I already say this?)

    If the Toyota is such a bad [non-permissible content removed]...how come no 3/4 or 1 tons are made?...and what about commercial applications?.....real tough truck

    TP,
    See....there is power in prayer...
    You...I have hope for that someday we can get you to cross back over to America.....bamat?....I don't know what we will do with him?

    - Tim
  • rooster9rooster9 Member Posts: 239
    Actually, a transmission oil cooler comes standard with V-8s on the Tundra.

    Dbhull, what are all the options you're getting on the Ford? 5.4?
  • bamatundrabamatundra Member Posts: 1,583
    I hear that you can get that Hyundai of yours with a huge rear seat. I hear that they are cheap too. I wonder why?
  • bamatundrabamatundra Member Posts: 1,583
    You need to calm down a little. You are going to bust a vessel! I'm glad that we are finally talking 1/2 ton trucks.

    You Chevy guys need to face reality. The Tundra is full size. You are just in denial. You have Tundra envy.

    The Tundra hauls more than the Chevy and has more front seat leg room. It also has far better quality.

    I will attempt to end the "full size" argument.

    The Tundra is full size. Is not. Is too. Is not. Is too. Is not. Is too. Is not. Is not. Is too. Is not. Is too. Is not. Is too. Is not. ...... ad nauseum

    Now - do you have anything else to add? I even let you have the last word.
  • quark99quark99 Member Posts: 136
    Facts:
    The Tundra is classified as full-size. Remember, the full-size Asian weenie is about 1 1/2" smaller than the ole American weenie, so I guess it makes sense.....
    The Tundra will outlast the Chevy. No doubt about it.
    The Chevy's new makover is a vast improvement over the old models, but hey, it's still a GM product. GM is the worst automaker in the world. They have the worst management, the worst unions, the most valueless stock, and continue to bring up the rear in safety and quality. They manufacture wonderful looking vehicles, but the beauty ends at the sheetmetal. Much like Jerry Springer, WWF, and NASCAR, GM products are aimed at the bottom half of the gene pool. Nothing is funnier than a Chevy/GM truck on the freeway at about 65-75 mph. The truck bed vibrates and shimmies from side to side, illustrating just how solidly-built they are. Even funnier is your basic Suburban or Yukon gasping for air at high altitude, barely able to maintain the speed limit.
    The Chevy is better suited to towing than the Tundra, regardless of ratings. Better frame.
    Personally, I'd never purchase a GM or Toyota product. I don't buy junk, and I don't spend thousands of dollars more than a vehicle is worth.
    You boys go right back to playing now, 'fore your mommas call you for supper.....
    The Tundra's V8 is a technological marvel, but is edged out slightly in terms of performance by the new DC 4.7l V8. I'll keep an eye out for all the Tundras and Silverados in my rear view mirror, where they all end up. Funny, my truck's load rating is 2000 lbs, my 0-60 is 7.4 seconds, and my skidpad of .77 is higher than the Toy or the Chevy..what's up with that? Oh, and I have a real back seat that won't torture my family on a trip.
    Guess I should have spent another $8-10k like you guys so I could be trendy (Toyota) or a brainless lemming (GM/Chevy). Jeez, we clean you guys up, give you books, and send you to school....and what do you do? You eat the teacher.
    Dodge Dakota Quad Cab-the ONLY true sport-utility vehicle on the market-cause there ain't nothin' it can't do.
  • swobigswobig Member Posts: 634
    The Dakota Quad Cab is a good truck, don't get me wrong (with the 4.7L), but to say GM is the worst automaker is just assinine. You don't get to be the biggest without doing something right. They have room for improvement just like Toyota or Dodge, but there good trucks. Spouting off that a automaker sucks just shows your ignorance. Toyota last longer than Silverado - good luck on that one now. I can tell you of many blown head gaskets and bad transmissions with Dodge so any quality arguments you have are worthless. Bamatundra and Quark99 I hope your trucks last forever, but you need to wake up and realize that everyone makes good trucks...
  • quark99quark99 Member Posts: 136
    Asinine, not assinine-or was it a pun? Unquestionably, I'd agree about Dodge's quality problems...but if you re-read my post, I never claimed DC was the best automaker. Whether or not my Quad is a good truck...won't know until the miles rack up. Just last week at my local dealership there were 6 Ram trucks, all in a row, up in the lifts in the service department. All had the rear splines removed, rear end cases opened...not a good thing. Neon/Stratus head gaskets, Avenger brake rotors/electronics...the list of faulty Chrysler stuff is long.
    I spouted off because you GM vs Toyota guys seem to have reverted to name-calling. I guess I've seen too many 1990-1998 Chevy trucks with peeling paint, stuffing hanging out of the seats, or dead on the roadside with flashers going to think much of GM's stuff. I drive 40k a year, so that's a lot of asphalt and cement going by. From a business standpoint, GM IS a poorly-managed company. Look at what nearly held up the new truck rollout, another horrendous strike that cost GM millions in 1999. Just one example in a string of bungled management/union debacles that have spanned the last 30 years. It's too soon to pass judgement on the new Silverado-it looks great, the new motor lineup is impressive (but it shouldn't take 35 years to dump the old 350 and 454..). You can hardly argue that GM's cars have been good performers..with the exception of the 'vette and the Cadillac line, there's little to be excited about. As far as longevity goes, Toyota's vehicles are at the top, and have been for many years. What is horrible with Toyota is their ridiculous repair and parts costs. The only GM product I've ever liked (and could rely on) is/was their 4.3l six. It has proven itself time and time again (it's the powerplant in my 19' SeaRay) and I've got some friends who swear by their motors in their Astros and S-10's. That motor is a 250,000 mile motor. I don't just slam stuff without a reason. If the new line of GM trucks show that the company's got it's sh- together as far as performance, longevity, and value, I'll eat my words and be the first one to sing GM's praises.
    Until then, I'll cross my fingers with the new Quad and hope that Dodge's bad rap on quality and service is a thing of the past.
  • jcmdiejcmdie Member Posts: 594
    The dakota quadcab is a fine truck and a good example of making a new product from an old one. It will be very popular. It's sales won't be coming from full size truck owners though. The buyers for that truck are coming from the compact pickup market and the SUV market. They want the do-everything vehicle. I have a full size truck and wouldn't consider the dakota quad cab. If anything I would go to a 3/4 ton. Different needs......
  • dbhulldbhull Member Posts: 150
    Hey...what happened to my post? Post 158 and 159 are gone. Did I miss something?

    Rooster....

    I feel I got a lot more truck all the way around. For starters, the 5.4l has way more pull, even seat of the pants tells me that, not just stats. I got a limited slip diff that can't be had on Tundra. I got a deeper, more useful bed box. I got 17" aluminum wheels that can't be purchased on a Tundra. I got more payload and tow capacity than a Tundra. I got a bigger rear seat. I got "comfortable" leather captains chairs (I found the Tundra seats to be pretty uncomfortable). I could go on. I don't mean to slam the Tundra. I think it is an ok truck. It is just not a true full size (by my expectations anyway), and it has a lot less options/amount of truck for the money. I got my new F150 with practically everything on it, and definitely way more than a completely loaded Tundra, for about 2500 less than the best deal I was given on a Tundra.

    Bottom line is.....The Toyota is a good mid size truck, but comes with a very high end full size truck price and STILL does not offer all the options that can be found on a domestic truck.

    This is just my opinion. I only offered it because it was asked for.
  • mgdvhmanmgdvhman Member Posts: 4,157
    Last word?....so you admit defeat?

    The only vessel I burst is one from laughing....I do print these out...and show others just how dumb the import crowd is..

    Please keep it up..

    Here is the Tundra crowd summed up..

    http://www.teleweb.net/mgdvhman/TindraOwners.wav

    I got some partys to enjoy....

    I'll bring your comments with me..

    Keep up the good work...

    - Tim
  • trucksrmetrucksrme Member Posts: 381
    Ya said:

    The only GM product I've ever
    liked (and could rely on) is/was their 4.3l six. It has proven itself time and time again (it's the
    powerplant in my 19' SeaRay)

    Then ya cut down that SB V8. Reckin ya aint knowin that 4.3 be that SB V8 with the 2 front ones lopped off now!

    Then ya said:
    As far as longevity goes, Toyota's vehicles
    are at the top, and have been for many years.

    Reckon ya aint heard of them head-gaskets popin after 60k now! Ya best learn the truth on them facts, not just what folks be sayin now. Good luck on this one now!
  • bamatundrabamatundra Member Posts: 1,583
    Hmm. You just couldn't keep your mouth shut. You must be lonely.

    Seems your Tundra envy is flaring up. In my experience people resort to name calling when they realize that they have lost an argument.

    You keep whining and crying "It ain't full size". You need to face reality.

    Maybe in a few years GM can get their act together and address their serious quality problems. You need to pull your head out of the sand.

    Here are some facts:

    4/10/00 Toyota Tundra is Consumer Reports Top Pick
    for Full Sized Pickup in 2000!
    http://www.consumerreports.org/news/autos/Reports/toppick.htm

    3/3/00 Toyota's New Millennium Truck
    http://truckworld.com/Truck-Tests/Toyota-Tundra/tundra.html

    1/9/00 4-Wheel & Off-Road Magazine 4x4 Truck of
    the Year!

    12/22/99 Motor Trend Magazine announces the 2000
    Toyota Tundra as the Truck of the Year!
    http://www.motortrend.com/

    5/4/00 Toyota vehicles dominate this year's
    quality survey rankings by J.D. Power

    http://cnnfn.com/2000/05/04/companies/wires/carsurvey_wg/
  • RoclesRocles Member Posts: 982
    Ahhh...nothing like paper to defend a truck that should be actually worked instead......
  • jcmdiejcmdie Member Posts: 594
    Awards are great, but I bet Toyota would rather see sales. I won't quote the current rankings, but I'm not sure if there is ANY truck that it has beat out in sales let alone make a dent in the domestic full size market. It seems that the average "Joe" don't accept the Tundra as the leader of ANY pack.
  • superjim2000superjim2000 Member Posts: 314
    LMFAO!!!!!!! Good one.
  • arkie6arkie6 Member Posts: 198
    Sales rankings prove little to nothing. The Tundra plant in Indiana was only intended to produce about 100,000 trucks and 50,000 SUVs per year. I've seen serial numbers in the 90,000 range posted on other web sites, so it appears that they are selling about as many as they can make since the truck was first introduced in May of '99. And as far as I know there have been no incentives or rebates to help move them. The Tundra will never have sales figures anywhere near Ford or Chevy unless they plan on expansion of their manufacturing facilities.
  • bamatundrabamatundra Member Posts: 1,583
    Toyota Expands Indiana Plant to Increase Capacity

    http://www.trucktrend.com/daily/daily_f.html

    They are increasing capacity from 100,000 vehicles a year to 250,000.
  • dbhulldbhull Member Posts: 150
    Why would they do that when they can't sell the 100k they initially targeted for???? If anything, they should be dumping money into the blueprints and design rooms to make a full size truck.
  • mgdvhmanmgdvhman Member Posts: 4,157
    Yeah....I bet Toiletta would like to see sales..eh?

    Too bad all the men buy American..

    But on paper it's so much better!

    .."You READ IT!...Must be true!"

    - Tim
  • mgdvhmanmgdvhman Member Posts: 4,157
    ..Keep talking little man...

    Maybe even some day YOU will believe what you are saying?....Cuz I sure don't..

    - Tim
  • swobigswobig Member Posts: 634
    Just responding to your "brainless lemming" comment and the fact that GM is the worst automaker with the worst unions, management, etc., give me a break. Your comments are so steriotypical (sp?) of many of the comments here...
  • devil1devil1 Member Posts: 74
    If Toyota came out with some truck that had a double the length/width/height of the current BIG3 then would everyone that says Tundra is not full size buy it???

    Is the size of the truck the only thing that matters??? So I guess Chevy's are the only "Fullsize" BIG3 because they have the longest truck.

    This size issue with the Tundra is rediculous. Yes it's smaller than all the BIG3. The BIG3 all are smaller/larger than eachother, also.
    The people that don't like Tundra are mostly people that ONLY buy American. The backseat is the only thing lacking in the Tundra. Although when I peeked in a Dodge Ram the backseat looked the same.

    Let me know one person who can't fit in the front seat of the Tundra. It's smaller than the BIG3 but god damn, not everyone wants to drive a semi around. Also, not many people haul the maximum payload, and Tundra comes close in all respects to the BIG3.

    Your tradeoff for a smaller backseat and slightly smaller payloads is a truck with a proven reliable brand and motor and a powertrain warranty to prove it. The BIG3 definately do have advantages, but I not buy a Dodge/Chevy if my life depended on it.
  • devil1devil1 Member Posts: 74
    Why would someone buy a truck that gets the worst possible reliability rating of any full size truck or car or compact truck or car?? (Dodge/Chevy)
  • obyoneobyone Member Posts: 7,841
    because the Tundra looks sooo much like the F150...just can't get used to the looks of those damn things ;)
  • andy_jordanandy_jordan Member Posts: 764
    Well that's easy.

    We are all too stupid to put complete faith in reviews from less than independent publications.

    Instead we have to rely on our own judgement - consideration of our needs, weighing up options, building a package that suits our needs and then paying a reasonable amount of money for it.

    Life would be so much easier if we could just buy into the hype and be lucky enough to have a truck that we paid more for, had option groups that were specified to us, and was smaller than a full size but larger than a mid size.

    But no, us poor fools are too stupid to have worked that out.

    Dohh!!!
  • dbhulldbhull Member Posts: 150
    Yes, I try and buy American when I can. If Toyota built an euqivelent sized and optioned truck that could do the same job or more as the domestics, offered it at a better price, AND kept my American brothers and sisters in jobs that helped strengthen the US economy, I would not have a problem buying a Japanese made truck.

    However, the domestic trucks have more capability/options, cost less, keep my American brothers and sisters in jobs that help strengthen the US economy, so....I keep buying American.
    Yeah, I just traded my Silverado off because of some very minute problems. I am very nitpicky. The problems I had were no worse than can be found on any brand new Tundra. I also just have a bad habit of getting new trucks very often. I can afford it, so I do. My choice.

    I also test drove a Tundra while my new F150 was being prepped for delivery. I was way less than remotely impressed at all. I would have kept my Silverado any day before buying a brand new "Flawless" (if there is one) Tundra.

    Not everybody buys on blind loyalty. I do however, believe in keeping money in America. I have bought two imports in my past, and I felt very guilty each time. My wife drove the purchase as they were both for her to primarily drive. I won't buy another one, no matter what she say's.

    Toyota's are not perfect or even marginally more reliable than any other truck. Their parts cost more "WHEN" they break down too.

    I have done the math. Domestics are a much better investment all the way around.
  • quark99quark99 Member Posts: 136
    Swobig- If you have evidence or facts that dispute my comments about GM, please post/share them here...perhaps GM really is the best managed, best organized automaker, and has the best engineering and design teams...but for some reason, they're hiding it from the public. There must be some strategic reason for this, since they go out of their way to keep us all in the dark. Perhaps they're just too modest....and couldn't stand the notoriety and acclaim they'd receive from the millions of new customers that would flock to their showrooms if the "real story" ever got out. Yeah, that's the ticket....
    Trucksrme- what's up with your preoccupation with size? Is there something you'd like to tell us? I've heard stories of horrible "shrinkage" side-effects from prolonged exposure to butter beans. Better see the local sawbones 'fore it's too late...good luck on that one now-
    Tim-How long do these episodes of chest-beating usually last? Do you have some inner need to be "right", or is it just a symptom of some deep and dark "past childhood" thing? Cut the pedantic vitriol, please.....
    Quark-WTF you doin' in this room anyway? You knew that if you stepped in sh- you'd get some on you, right? Go back to your safe little DC boards and leave these poor bastids alone in their misery...
  • obyoneobyone Member Posts: 7,841
    that was one of the better posts that I have seen in awhile...especially the part "that if you stepped in..."
  • obyoneobyone Member Posts: 7,841
    I saw the handle Quark99 I thought of some Ferengis...
  • swobigswobig Member Posts: 634
    I'm not saying GM is the best, but to say there the worst just about everything is a pretty dumb comment. How have they stayed number 1 for so long? I mean really, Toyota is a good company - I just think there a little off the mark with the Tundra. I could spout off and say Toyota J.. Ba...... are the worst this and that also, but what does that prove? Nothing. Get over it man. If the Toy grows a few inches I would probably consider it, but it's too small for the money. BTW, my neighbor just bought a ext. cab Dakota. Nice truck, but he's got a family he toats are with it and I can tell he wants a Quad Cab or full size...
  • ndancendance Member Posts: 323
    This is a great argument to read through.
    I didn't think that Toyota vs. America
    could crack me up like that. A couple
    of questions/observations.
    . Does the towing ability really matter?
    (my apologies to you folks that actually
    move gravel/drywall/whatever). Around
    here (Northern California, in the Sierras,
    _not_ the Bay area) I never see trucks
    with anything in them (occasionally a
    horse trailer). The sole purpose of a
    3/4 ton 4x4 truck seems to be
    movement of 150 pounds worth of middle
    aged man (the sticking out ears are the
    giveaway). Exceptions to this rule seem
    to be limited to fleet truck buyers, construction
    firms and the like. I haven't seen any
    cement company Tundras, but you never know.

    . Does interior room matter? If you're using
    a pickup as a family car, I suggest you go
    look at a Crown Victoria or whatever, they're
    faster and (lots)safer.

    . Does buying American matter? Just look at the
    Japanese economy. They're harvesting the fruits
    of a nationalistic, closed system. Determining
    nation of origin is probably useless anyway.
    (Daimler-Chrysler is pretty ironic given their
    WWII product lines).

    Just stirring the pot..
  • ndancendance Member Posts: 323
    Good luck on this one now!
  • nrd525nrd525 Member Posts: 109
    The main reason they don't do the sideways back seats is fear of lawsuits.Your chance of injury is much higher from the side than front/back(in a front/rear crash),due to the way your neck is made.I think the Subaru Brat was killed for this reason,I don't know if that was the main cause,but it was one of them.
  • swobigswobig Member Posts: 634
    Finally we agree on something. Yeah, I would say Ford has got something on GM and Dodge seems to be a little behind, but you can always get a bad one, or good one from any manufacturer. Maybe the DC thing will help quality. I think GM made great strides with the Silverado. American trucks have always had high resale, but American cars seem to lack. I don't know that there is a major quality difference, but that's just the way it is. Although I do think GM has too many similar models with similar engines, etc., but then so does Ford, DC, etc...
  • mgdvhmanmgdvhman Member Posts: 4,157
    ..Quark...now there is a good one...

    I'd have to say they will last as long as I say they do...got it?

    - Tim
  • tp4unctp4unc Member Posts: 437
    You guys need to watch a game during the Pacers/Knicks series and take a good look at Reggie Miller...this is easily done when he's on the free throw line. Does Quark come to mind?

    Yeah, I know....this is way off topic.
  • swobigswobig Member Posts: 634
    Sounds pretty bad. 3 oil changes in 4800 miles wow! Just did my first with 4950 miles. Didn't really find any shavings as others had reported and oil looked dirty, but not really that bad. With as often as you have changed you oil, I'd stay with the cheap stuff, but if your going to leave it in there longer, heavy towing, it may be worth it...
  • dbhulldbhull Member Posts: 150
    I posed the same question on f150online.com because there has been so much controversy on when to switch to synthetic. Several on that board switched to synthetic at 500 miles and 10-20k miles later, still no problems.

    I have about 300 miles on my truck now. Another 200 miles and I am switching to synthetic.
  • bigsnagbigsnag Member Posts: 394
    Most people feel as though you should do your first oil change at least by 3000. Many people do it at 1500, 1000 or even as soon as 500. Waiting until 4950 might not have been the wisest decision.
  • swobigswobig Member Posts: 634
    as the owners manual says - wait till the oil change light comes on. Like I said, it wasn't really that bad and (I did it myself) I didn't find any shavings on the plug. I think people are a little paranoid over these oil changes - oil today is much better than oil of years ago - the standards keep going up. I remember changing oil every 10,000 miles. But, I guess if it dies tommorrow I'll probably know why...
  • quadrunner500quadrunner500 Member Posts: 2,721
    If your oil is discolored, it's got carbon products breaking down, i.e. sludge. That gunk will accumulate in your oil pan for a long time.
  • barlitzbarlitz Member Posts: 752
    I wasn't in prison I was only kiddin although I wouldn't have minded being handcuffed to Dixie a nice little stripper in St John's canada.I also only put super in my truck because I'm runnin a superchip,I'm not sure what effect that will have on my engine but it does run very smoothly.
  • swobigswobig Member Posts: 634
    with my truck and it seems to run smoother also. It was just a little rough, but no more. I stuck with the 87 octane setting though. Stay away from Dixie - she's trouble...
  • quadrunner500quadrunner500 Member Posts: 2,721
    Okay, I don't know if it was here or someplace else, but someone wanted a post where you could get a Tundra for 4k off msrp. I didn't see that deal. Here's what the Denver Rocky Mtn News had.

    John Elway Toyota (Autonation) 181 in stock
    Tundra X-Cab V8 4x4 $24,999

    Stevinson Toyota discount on Tundra V8 4x4 X-Cab $3400 off msrp.

    That's todays report. My Silverado is a keeper.
  • trucksrmetrucksrme Member Posts: 381
    Heard them tundras backin up at that factory. They be havin the hard time sellin them trucks, as the word be gettin out quick on em: tundra=less truck, more buck. There aint but so many slow learnin yuppies that factory can trick into em now. Good luck on this one now!
  • swobigswobig Member Posts: 634
    that's two years supply!!!
  • barlitzbarlitz Member Posts: 752
    I saw a nice Dakota quad cab today,it was blue with black very nice.If I wanted a midsize truck the Dakota would be it, I think Dodge did a good job with the Dakota.I don't even think you can compare the Tundra with the Dakota maybe it should be Tundra vs Frontier or Tundra vs Tacoma.
  • barlitzbarlitz Member Posts: 752
    I've got the superchip in my truck it helps at all throttle levels and there is a noticable difference,I've always run it on super never tried the 87 octane.I joined www.cucarclub.com and I get a 10% discount on gas at any station.So I figure I'm saving about .17 a gallon.along with other good membership benefits.Check it out sometime if you have the time.
  • tp4unctp4unc Member Posts: 437
    I paid $900 over invoice in July 1999 for mine. That was just over 2600 below MSRP. I have no doubt I could buy it now for around $200 over invoice in my area. I'm not surprised by the "discount". Seems about right to me....depending on equipment.

    Do they really have 181 Tundras(or anything!) in stock? That must be one heckuva big dealership!
  • tp4unctp4unc Member Posts: 437
    Just for arguments sake, let's assume the Tundra is made by an American company(by UAW workers). Would you still think the Dakota is a better truck. Be completely honest...drive them both first and then report your experiences.
This discussion has been closed.