Chronic Car Buyers Anonymous

stickguy

sucks about the Subaru. But like they show in some of their ads, it gave it's live to protect the family. Cars can get replaced, not them.

and I did not expect to learn today where Col. Sanders is buried.

explorerx4

It's probably better the back of the Toyota hit the car since it is lighter than the front.

sda

Glad everyone is ok and not worse.

fintail

benjaminh said:

Well, heck. No one hurt, thank goodness. Other driver at fault. They went around a corner in their 2007 4Runner too fast on a two lane road, spun around and went out of control into our car's lane. The back of their 4100 pound truck-based Toyota SUV collided with the front of our Outback at around 25-30 mph or so (just a guess). Speed was the main factor, but I wonder about their tires.

Chalk one up for modern car safety, glad you're ok.

corvette

@benjaminh - I've driven though there pretty frequently, pretty sure the PSL is 35 MPH. The average speed people drive through those curves is probably slightly lower.

xwesx

Yesterday, while on my return-the-truck trip to North Carolina, I was in the right lane on 15 south, I believe at the location in the Google Map image below, transitioning on the "circle" toward 17 east. It is an up-sloping ramp that I think is posted (cautionary) at 25. There is another pickup ahead of me, maybe ten car-lengths, and a red WRX behind me.




As I am just about to enter the ramp, the WRX decides to dart around me, coming back into the lane close enough that I was looking down through the back window of the car (I couldn't see the trunk at all from my position!). I was probably going about 40, anticipating that I could likely hold that speed on the ramp.

Well, the truck ahead was not so confident, and he slowed to about 20 mph in short order, with that WRX about three feet off his trailer hitch, and I was about 18 inches behind the WRX until I was able to slow enough to start adding distance again. That little car came about a half-second from becoming jam.

But, no lesson learned... as soon as we reach the highway, he flies around the pickup, literally weaves through about eight other vehicles on this two-lane road (same direction). And, ten minutes later, I pass him pulled over by patrol. Ten minutes after that? He screams by me again on I95 south as he continues to weave through the reasonably heavy traffic. That dude was so dense that I'm not sure how the car's suspension was able to support him!

oldfarmer50

benjaminh said:

Well, heck. No one hurt, thank goodness. Other driver at fault. They went around a corner in their 2007 4Runner too fast on a two lane road, spun around and went out of control into our car's lane. The back of their 4100 pound truck-based Toyota SUV collided with the front of our Outback at around 25-30 mph or so (just a guess). Speed was the main factor, but I wonder about their tires.

My wife and I weren't actually in the car. For those who have understandably lost track of our story, we recently helped our next generation, who really liked our red Outback and sometimes borrowed it, to get a blue Outback. But our grown child gets migraines that were triggered by the new car smell, and so we had switched cars (telling insurance) for the next month or so.

Anyway, the other people were insured by Nationwide, which seems pretty good, but we've still taken a hit. Damage was about 19k, but to my surprise the car was totaled out today with a payout of $31,100. We paid $34k + TTL in June of 2024, and so that's more than we could have expected. But with tax and so on it was more like 37.5k out the door, and so we paid about $6500 to use the car for 1 year and 3 months.

Thought it was a car we might keep for ten years, but now it's already gone.

Currently we have a Jeep Cherokee rental provided by the insurance company.

Paperwork is detailed and is in process. We go get things notarized tomorrow, and then supposedly our bank loan gets paid off, and then we get a check for the remainder.

Sigh. So, I'm back in the chronic car buying line. But since my wife loved that Outback we'll almost certainly get another one, esp. considering the 0.9% financing.

Wow, that’s terrible. I’m glad no one got hurt. I’m surprised that they totaled your car. While substantial that looks fixable but I guess there are all sorts of hidden things that would need replacing.

oldfarmer50

“ and I did not expect to learn today where Col. Sanders is buried.”

Don’t tell me you found him amongst the old tires and wheelbarrows in your back yard? 😳

tjc78

@benjaminh
Looks like the car did exactly what it was supposed to do and protected everyone. Sucks for sure to have to deal with it all. Glad everyone is OK!

graphicguy

@benjaminh ...whoa! Happy to hear no one was hurt.

Looks like both airbags went off. Front end needs to be replaced. Right front ¼, hood, bumper, suspension bits, maybe frame damage, radiator, engine sits low in those, so damage of some kind there, at least.

Yeah...that's a total.

stickguy

@oldfarmer50 said:
“ and I did not expect to learn today where Col. Sanders is buried.”

Don’t tell me you found him amongst the old tires and wheelbarrows in your back yard? 😳

He’s on the map!

stickguy

All that damage and airbags. Probably hard to get all the parts and find a shop with time and ability to do it. and lots of hidden surprises. Not worth the risk. Instead of paying say $22k to maybe fix (but could be more) easier to cut a check for $31k and ship it to copart and sell it for $9k.

benjaminh

More images of the wreck. Apologies in advance if this is too much...Off to the bank now to transfer ownership of what's left to the insurance company.

au1994

A lot of the EyeSight wizardry was likely taken out leading to the high cost to repair.

tjc78

I'm gonna wager that would have been more than 22K to fix

Windshield, airbags, headliner, interior trim, all that body work and as mentioned above the sensors/wiring for all the safety systems.

If this was me I'd be happy it is totaled out. I don't think I would want it back.

nyccarguy

Check out this 2020 Toyota Camry SE FWD.

au1994

nyccarguy said:

Check out this 2020 Toyota Camry SE FWD.

Still pricy but in nice shape. If it was cheaper, a perfect new driver car.

ab348

Yoicks, @benjaminh ! Scary stuff. As others said, the car did its job. I too would question the insurance offer. They ignored the sales tax which seems to be the biggest shortfall. You shouldn’t have to eat all of that. Glad everyone is OK. Not sure I would have been clear-minded enough to take a pic in the aftermath while the smoke was still clearing.

ab348

I’m not in the car market, but with the ATS now 8 years old I have to admit I’ve been giving some thought to what I might consider replacing it with eventually. Yesterday I watched a review of something that wasn’t on my radar but might be worth considering someday, the Toyota Corolla Cross hybrid. The main benefit of the hybrid version is that it bumps up the HP by 40HP, giving it a sub-8 second 0-60 time. It seemed decent, aside from the interior only being available in black and likely not being all that great in materials quality, but that is TBD. The biggest problem is getting one as they are in short supply. I would guess a Kia or Hyundai hybrid would be in around the same price bracket at around $40K in worthless Canadian dollars.

jmonroe1

andres3 said:

benjaminh said:

Well, heck. No one hurt, thank goodness. Other driver at fault. They went around a corner in their 2007 4Runner too fast on a two lane road, spun around and went out of control into our cars's lane. The back of their 4100 pound truck-based Toyota SUV collided with the front of our Outback at around 25-30 mph or so (just a guess). Speed was the main factor, but I wonder about their tires.

My wife and I weren't actually in the car. For those who have understandably lost track of our story, we recently helped our next generation, who really liked our red Outback and sometimes borrowed it, to get a blue Outback. But our grown child has migraines that were triggered by the new car smell, and so we had switched cars (telling insurance) for the next month or so.

Anyway, the other people were insured by Nationwide, which seems pretty good, but we've still taken a hit. Damage was about 19k, but to my surprise the car was totaled out today with a payout of $31,100. We paid $34k + TTL in June of 2024, and so that's more than we could have expected. But with tax and so on it was more like 37.5k out the door, and so we paid about $6500 to use the car for 1 year and 3 months.

Thought it was a car we might keep for ten years, but now it's already gone.

Currently we have a Jeep Cherokee rental provided by the insurance company.

Paperwork is detailed and is in process. We go get things notarized tomorrow, and then supposedly our bank loan gets paid off, and then we get a check for the remainder.

Sigh. So, I'm back in the chronic car buying line. But since my wife loved that Outback we'll almost certainly get another one, esp. considering the 0.9% financing.

Glad everyone is OK. Speed isn't really the factor, it's going too fast for conditions, or unsafe excessive speed, which has zero to do with speed/speeding as normally defined by most people and institutions. This is called a driver error (mental/physical) shortcomings.

————————————————
Hint: Too fast for conditions IS speeding which of course is a mental error.

jmonroe

jmonroe1

@benjaminh, good to hear everyone is safe. I think the insurance company could have done better. I would have said NO to the first offer just as a matter of course. When money is involved in situations like this there is always room for negotiations. However, everyone being safe, is by far the most important thing.

jmonroe

suydam

Yay for all the safety stuff.

ab348 said:

I’m not in the car market, but with the ATS now 8 years old I have to admit I’ve been giving some thought to what I might consider replacing it with eventually. Yesterday I watched a review of something that wasn’t on my radar but might be worth considering someday, the Toyota Corolla Cross hybrid. The main benefit of the hybrid version is that it bumps up the HP by 40HP, giving it a sub-8 second 0-60 time. It seemed decent, aside from the interior only being available in black and likely not being all that great in materials quality, but that is TBD. The biggest problem is getting one as they are in short supply. I would guess a Kia or Hyundai hybrid would be in around the same price bracket at around $40K in worthless Canadian dollars.

I always want to like Toyotas but the interiors are always too plain for me. And Kia/Hyundai counterparts are nicer and cheaper.

tjc78

jmonroe1 said:

andres3 said:

benjaminh said:

Well, heck. No one hurt, thank goodness. Other driver at fault. They went around a corner in their 2007 4Runner too fast on a two lane road, spun around and went out of control into our cars's lane. The back of their 4100 pound truck-based Toyota SUV collided with the front of our Outback at around 25-30 mph or so (just a guess). Speed was the main factor, but I wonder about their tires.

My wife and I weren't actually in the car. For those who have understandably lost track of our story, we recently helped our next generation, who really liked our red Outback and sometimes borrowed it, to get a blue Outback. But our grown child has migraines that were triggered by the new car smell, and so we had switched cars (telling insurance) for the next month or so.

Anyway, the other people were insured by Nationwide, which seems pretty good, but we've still taken a hit. Damage was about 19k, but to my surprise the car was totaled out today with a payout of $31,100. We paid $34k + TTL in June of 2024, and so that's more than we could have expected. But with tax and so on it was more like 37.5k out the door, and so we paid about $6500 to use the car for 1 year and 3 months.

Thought it was a car we might keep for ten years, but now it's already gone.

Currently we have a Jeep Cherokee rental provided by the insurance company.

Paperwork is detailed and is in process. We go get things notarized tomorrow, and then supposedly our bank loan gets paid off, and then we get a check for the remainder.

Sigh. So, I'm back in the chronic car buying line. But since my wife loved that Outback we'll almost certainly get another one, esp. considering the 0.9% financing.

Glad everyone is OK. Speed isn't really the factor, it's going too fast for conditions, or unsafe excessive speed, which has zero to do with speed/speeding as normally defined by most people and institutions. This is called a driver error (mental/physical) shortcomings.

————————————————
Hint: Too fast for conditions IS speeding which of course is a mental error.

jmonroe

Don't feed the trolls.

jmonroe1

benjaminh said:

More images of the wreck. Apologies in advance if this is too much...Off to the bank now to transfer ownership of what's left to the insurance company.

————————————————
That red color looks like Mrs. j’s 2018 Legacy Limited 6 cylinder bought in 2019 with 7K miles on it except her interior is beige. I like that color combo and was about to buy a new 2019 just like the 2018 until my son found the used one at a local used car dealer who specializes in upscale used cars. There is a story how he ended up with it on his lot but I’m not going to get into that. Just glad he did because it saved me plenty. I still like that color combo.

jmonroe

stickguy

I wouldn’t want that back either.

stickguy

nyccarguy said:

Check out this 2020 Toyota Camry SE FWD.

Seems pricey to me, but what do I know? Should last a long time though so good for the use case. Wonder how much more a new Corolla is?

tjc78

That's a nice example of that generation of Camry. I thought the price was high too until I looked at comps on Carmax. It is priced well! If you could grind another $1000 off even better.

corvette

That is the same generation Camry my ex had. It rode closer to the ground than I would like, but was otherwise a good car.

nyccarguy

tjc78 said:

That's a nice example of that generation of Camry. I thought the price was high too until I looked at comps on Carmax. It is priced well! If you could grind another $1000 off even better.

I'll have to take a look at the comps.

explorerx4

That generation of Camry was "grounded to the ground".

kyfdx

corvette said:

That is the same generation Camry my ex had. It rode closer to the ground than I would like, but was otherwise a good car.

Well, now we know why that didn't work out

andres3

benjaminh said:

Since there are at least a couple of people from Louisville here, just in case you're curious here's where the accident happened, at this curve on Lexington Rd. So that red brick wall in the photo of the wrecked Outback is for Cave Hill.

They saw it happening. 4Runner started skidding, then driver seemed to overcorrect, and suddenly the car was spinning 360s right toward them. I think posted speed there is maybe 35? It's not that sharp a curve, and so to start skidding a car might need to be going 50+? Idk. Road was a little bit damp.

I wonder if stomping the brakes and jerking the steering wheel like an idiot in both directions back to back at the same time with terrible tires would do the trick. Toyota suspensions don't like more than 1 command per 10 seconds...... (from experience with the soft '95 Camry). To be fair, that Camry had skinny little tires.

xwesx

oldfarmer50 said:

Wow, that’s terrible. I’m glad no one got hurt. I’m surprised that they totaled your car. While substantial that looks fixable but I guess there are all sorts of hidden things that would need replacing.

Not so surprising with all the airbag deployments. They usually do total vehicles when that happens. I mean, it looks like both frontal bags along with side curtain bags at least on the left side of the car. That's not only the bags/igniters, but also interior trim, steering wheel insert, dash, seat belts, possibly the seats themselves... all sorts of $$$$, and you haven't even started on the exterior work yet!

andres3

jmonroe1 said:

andres3 said:

benjaminh said:

Well, heck. No one hurt, thank goodness. Other driver at fault. They went around a corner in their 2007 4Runner too fast on a two lane road, spun around and went out of control into our cars's lane. The back of their 4100 pound truck-based Toyota SUV collided with the front of our Outback at around 25-30 mph or so (just a guess). Speed was the main factor, but I wonder about their tires.

My wife and I weren't actually in the car. For those who have understandably lost track of our story, we recently helped our next generation, who really liked our red Outback and sometimes borrowed it, to get a blue Outback. But our grown child has migraines that were triggered by the new car smell, and so we had switched cars (telling insurance) for the next month or so.

Anyway, the other people were insured by Nationwide, which seems pretty good, but we've still taken a hit. Damage was about 19k, but to my surprise the car was totaled out today with a payout of $31,100. We paid $34k + TTL in June of 2024, and so that's more than we could have expected. But with tax and so on it was more like 37.5k out the door, and so we paid about $6500 to use the car for 1 year and 3 months.

Thought it was a car we might keep for ten years, but now it's already gone.

Currently we have a Jeep Cherokee rental provided by the insurance company.

Paperwork is detailed and is in process. We go get things notarized tomorrow, and then supposedly our bank loan gets paid off, and then we get a check for the remainder.

Sigh. So, I'm back in the chronic car buying line. But since my wife loved that Outback we'll almost certainly get another one, esp. considering the 0.9% financing.

Glad everyone is OK. Speed isn't really the factor, it's going too fast for conditions, or unsafe excessive speed, which has zero to do with speed/speeding as normally defined by most people and institutions. This is called a driver error (mental/physical) shortcomings.

————————————————
Hint: Too fast for conditions IS speeding which of course is a mental error.

jmonroe

In most States, by a legal definition you'd be correct, but most people define speeding only as exceeding the two arbitrary black numbers on a white aluminum sign. If conditions are very bad, you could easily be unsafe at under the speed limit.

Accepting that your legal definition is the one we'll use, then you must accept by the EXACT SAME RATIONALE that you can legally exceed the two numbers on the white aluminum sign as long as it is safe, prudent, and reasonable to do so given the existing conditions.

Or do you only use logic when it suits your narrative?

andres3

Michaell said:

@benjaminh - glad that everyone is ok, and that the Subaru did exactly what it was engineered to do in an accident.

Good luck with the search for a new one ... had this happened 6 months from now, there may not have been any new stock to choose from, just the ungainly 2026 model.

@andres3 - haven't seen any of the new Tiguans on the road, but that does look sharp. Same engine/transmission combo as before? Drove an Atlas a year or so back and was thoroughly unimpressed with the interior materials.

Was a car show so didn't get to drive anything. I sure hope VW improves the drive train on that thing. Give the 2.0T the guts they took out for the previous generation. Better yet, since I heard they will be using Audi's 2.5 5-cylinder in the Golf R next year it would be nice if they just put that 400 HP powerplant in everything with a VW logo.

nyccarguy

I know the specs of the Acura ADX aren’t impressive, but I saw a Black A-Spec model today. It looked sharp.

nyccarguy

@tjc78 said:
That's a nice example of that generation of Camry. I thought the price was high too until I looked at comps on Carmax. It is priced well! If you could grind another $1000 off even better.

So I took a closer look at the CarFax. Owner #2 had it for a year and put over 52K miles on it. That screams ride share driver. I looked at the comps on carmax. It is so MUCH cheaper than anything they offer. There’s got to be a reason it isn’t Toyota gold or silver certified…. A salesman from that dealer bought some material from me. He gave me his card. It might be worth a phone call.

sda

ab348 said:

I’m not in the car market, but with the ATS now 8 years old I have to admit I’ve been giving some thought to what I might consider replacing it with eventually. Yesterday I watched a review of something that wasn’t on my radar but might be worth considering someday, the Toyota Corolla Cross hybrid. The main benefit of the hybrid version is that it bumps up the HP by 40HP, giving it a sub-8 second 0-60 time. It seemed decent, aside from the interior only being available in black and likely not being all that great in materials quality, but that is TBD. The biggest problem is getting one as they are in short supply. I would guess a Kia or Hyundai hybrid would be in around the same price bracket at around $40K in worthless Canadian dollars.

How many mi/km on the ATS? I like the crisp styling of your car. I followed a similar color ATS that looked well cared for on my drive home today and thought what a nice car.

benjaminh

Got another little bit of info on the accident. It all happened very fast, of course. The person driving our car was about to slam on the brakes, but the eye sight system was just a fraction of a second faster. As its sensors and systems detected an imminent collision it hit the brakes first, and was also pretensioning the seatbelts. Minimized the impact a bit, apparently.

Since my wife loved that red Outback I've put down a deposit to buy another brand new red one. To save about $1400 we're skipping the moonroof on this one, as well as the built-in navigation (which we almost never used). My wife didn't really want a moonroof anyway, and basically never used it. I like a moonroof, and I do use mine in my TLX sometimes. But it's true that it's yet another thing that can go wrong. My older sister's and brother-in-law's 2014 Accord hybrid just had its moonroof fail, and it was almost $2k to fix.

Our new Outback just arrived by truck today to Bachman Subaru from that Indiana factory my wife and I toured a couple of months ago. The msrp is $36,575, and my salesperson is selling it slightly below invoice to us for $34,350, which is about $3200 off. We'll make about a 20% downpayment and then finance the rest with Subaru at 0.9% for 36 months.

We've gone back and forth on the extended warranty, but just for peace of mind we've decided to get it. 10 years/100k with 0 deductible for $2500, which seemingly is the current employee cost. After the regular warranty expires it's about a dollar a day. Most of the cost for that is actually covered by the rebate of c.$2100 on the warranty rebate from the wrecked car.

We're returning the rental Jeep Grand Cherokee from the insurance co. tomorrow, and then if all goes well I'll actually buy and pick up the new car Saturday morning.

Thanks to all for your good wishes and thoughts.

suydam

Not the greatest way to get a new car and I’m glad it worked out for you!

explorerx4

@benjaminh,
Life isn't all about money, so getting this unfortunate event behind you is good.
Is your daughter willing to take her car back?

benjaminh

Yes, the cosmic blue Subaru is back with them now. Much of the new car smell has faded at this point...but it's not quite gone.

oldfarmer50

nyccarguy said:

Check out this 2020 Toyota Camry SE FWD.

About the price you’d expect. Quite a divergence from what you’ve been looking at but probably better tech features. I’ve driven a few Camrys of that vintage and they drive well while getting at least 35 mpg highway.

oldfarmer50

nyccarguy said:

@tjc78 said:

That's a nice example of that generation of Camry. I thought the price was high too until I looked at comps on Carmax. It is priced well! If you could grind another $1000 off even better.

So I took a closer look at the CarFax. Owner #2 had it for a year and put over 52K miles on it. That screams ride share driver. I looked at the comps on carmax. It is so MUCH cheaper than anything they offer. There’s got to be a reason it isn’t Toyota gold or silver certified…. A salesman from that dealer bought some material from me. He gave me his card. It might be worth a phone call.

Didn’t some of those Toyotas develop oil consumption issues?

stickguy

being an Uber for a year would not bother me all that much, but only if I could see for sure it had regular oil changes.. otherwise I would assume a driver only planning on keeping it for 1 year would just run it without any changes (maybe top it up occasionally). or a token change every 20k.

ab348

sda said:

ab348 said:

I’m not in the car market, but with the ATS now 8 years old I have to admit I’ve been giving some thought to what I might consider replacing it with eventually. Yesterday I watched a review of something that wasn’t on my radar but might be worth considering someday, the Toyota Corolla Cross hybrid. The main benefit of the hybrid version is that it bumps up the HP by 40HP, giving it a sub-8 second 0-60 time. It seemed decent, aside from the interior only being available in black and likely not being all that great in materials quality, but that is TBD. The biggest problem is getting one as they are in short supply. I would guess a Kia or Hyundai hybrid would be in around the same price bracket at around $40K in worthless Canadian dollars.

How many mi/km on the ATS? I like the crisp styling of your car. I followed a similar color ATS that looked well cared for on my drive home today and thought what a nice car.

I’m embarrassed to admit how few it has. Just about to roll over 30,000km or 20,000 miles. Obviously it needs nothing and is in fine condition. Aside from a wreck, about the only thing that could get expensive is a major systems failure of some sort, especially now when parts might be hard to source.

explorerx4

@ab348,
You might want to look into a coolant change due to time if it hasn't been changed yet.
It gets acidic over time.

nyccarguy

@oldfarmer50 said:
About the price you’d expect. Quite a divergence from what you’ve been looking at but probably better tech features. I’ve driven a few Camrys of that vintage and they drive well while getting at least 35 mpg highway.

I’m curious to see if this car has BSM.

roadburner

I brought the ti to my indie shop yesterday to have it checked over and to have the cooling system replaced. I figured that after 30 years it was time. Everything else checked out fine, although I will probably need brakes next year.

corvette

@nyccarguy - most of the SEs did not have BSM, IIRC. Maybe also consider the 2020-ish Accord Hybrid if it's in the same price range, I rode in one of those as an Uber and really preferred it to the Camry.

@xwesx - in my state, the insurance company "may" (but is not required to) exclude the cost of airbag replacement in the threshold for totaling the car, or at least that used to be the law. It's very anti-consumer... if an airbag deployed, I never want to see that car again, other than to remove my personal items.

@benjaminh - similar thing happened to my cousin, a deer ran out in front of her, and the car slammed on the brakes before she did. Unfortunately, didn't avoid a collision, but it was less severe than it otherwise would have been. Sounds like a good price on the OE extended warranty!