The Stock Market and Investing

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  • gagricegagrice Member Posts: 31,450
    Now that you are going to be a landlord, would you like to come fix my toilet? :shades:

    Good luck with your property. I think we are near the bottom. Can't build new for what you can buy them for. Just talking to my realtor in Hilo, HI. He said fixers are selling well. No land selling or new homes being built. He just sold a decent home for $110k that he had sold 3 years ago for $360k. People kind of trashed it when they bailed out. Needs carpet and paint. I get the urge. I just cannot find anything with a decent ROI around here. Not going to pay $400k and rent for $2000 per month. I need at least 12% ROI to consider property for rental. Too old for the hassles.
  • tagmantagman Member Posts: 8,441
    Gary, almost everything is new, and my "net" income even considers the cost of total property management & insureance This property will have a very large security deposit as well.

    The bottom line is that I won't have to lift a finger... well, except to deposit the money every month. :shades:

    TM
  • cyclone4cyclone4 Member Posts: 2,302
    Houdini and Tony,

    I could not resist and I bought the 20 shares back this morning at around $448. I don't see how AAPL will be stopped from reaching into the $600 level in the next 6-12 months.
  • cyclone4cyclone4 Member Posts: 2,302
    The seller has accepted my terms. I'll have a positive cash flow of at least a couple grand every month (net, net... after ALL costs), (all tax-deferred, because I'm purchasing it with my retirement account), and the property is very likely to appreciate over the long haul. I'll be happy when it closes escrow.

    That sounds absolutely awesome TM. In my opinion, you cannot lose on this deal but instead you will be greatly rewarded.
  • gagricegagrice Member Posts: 31,450
    Apple seems to be the major push keeping the Nasdaq in the black. I don't think the market overall was moved by the State of the Union address.
  • cyclone4cyclone4 Member Posts: 2,302
    edited January 2012
    My son-in-law and I visited the Detroit Auto Show this past Saturday while the ladies went shopping. Let me tell you this much. If the crowd is any indication of how the economy is doing, then our economy is definitely on the rebound. The place was absolutely mobbed.

    I enjoyed looking at the various displays. However, let me tell you what auto companies really impressed me the most: Ford and Hyundai. Yes you heard it right. I loved the high tech features, the nice looks, and the prices for the vehicles from these two companies. After viewing their products, I am at the point of actually considering buying a Hyundai Genesis as my next car. I am not sure about the riding comfort on the Genesis, but I should take it for a test drive in the near future. The BMW and MB's looked stale to me. Also, the cost of these cars are off the roof as well. I thought the Infinitis sucked in terms of gas mileage and instrument panels. The Audi interior did not do much for me either, but the exterior looked pretty sharp. I think the worst of all the auto makers at the show was the VW. They are VERY much over priced and the looks and technology with these vehicles stink in my opinion.

    The new LF Lexus concept sports car looked very impressive as did a Toyota concept vehicle that is suppose to be available around 2015. The new 2013 Lexus GS450 looks very nice. I believe that the next generation LS will have similar looks when it comes out in 2013 as a 2014 model. For me, I will either buy the next generation LS or something the like the Genesis. The cost difference is obviously astronomical.

    I did take quite a few photos with my iPhone4S and I will try to post some here as soon as I figure out how to do so.
  • dieselonedieselone Member Posts: 5,729
    That's good to hear. My BIL and I were going to try to make it to the Detroit show, but our schedules didn't line up. We are going to the Chicago Auto Show in mid February instead. I haven't been since 09, and it was depressing. I'm hoping this year's show is worth visiting.
  • ljflxljflx Member Posts: 4,690
    edited January 2012
    Tag,

    Nice to see you back posting. All my prayers for the health of your wife.

    I should get the IMAC in a day or two. I wanted it badly for my study which is darker so I need all the screen real estate I can get. It's gotten delayed a bit because I ordered it with Windows parralel so that and windows 7 had to be installed.

    Real estate, or at least new construction, picking up in this area. I've seen a few large home developments under construction and as well several large condominium complexes under construction. Best of luck with your real estate decisions. I'm just not big on buying real estate (that's me personally and it doesn't mean I think it's a bad market) and this year I love stocks.
  • circlewcirclew Member Posts: 8,666
    I don't think the market overall was moved by the State of the Union address.

    Didn't bother watching. Waiting to vote for ANYBODY other than the incumbent!

    Regards,
    OW
  • circlewcirclew Member Posts: 8,666
    Seems your analysis of AAPL was dead on. It's making it's move and the current product-line up is moving off the shelves quite nicely!

    Go Giants! (Sorry Laurasdada!) ;)

    Regards,
    OW
  • ljflxljflx Member Posts: 4,690
    edited January 2012
    Am I being greedy/stupid to continue to keep all my shares going into this report after the market closes today?

    I've been in since the stock was at 84 if I discount the period that I triggered a sale while on vacation when the stock briefly fell to 128 from 140 or so and then bought it back at 161. it's not greed it's recognizing when a high growth company is badly undervalued. And today as the highest market cap company in the land Apple, IMO remains badly undervalued. I have never in my life seen such expensive products so much in demand across the board and Apple will penetrate new markets, China, education, business etc faster than anyone. The company now has 98bln in cash. A year ago, I thought Apple would get to $100 bln by late year but it's gotten there 6+ months sooner. What makes this story incredible is that they are doing it with products that are highly competed with but that the public will buy at premium prices. The earnings report was nothing short of amazing. But then we said that about growth in earnings a year ago that we thought at that time couldn't be duplicated.

    Couple of stories:

    http://www.nytimes.com/2012/01/25/technology/apples-profit-doubles-as-holiday-cu- - stomers-snapped-up-iphones.html?ref=business

    http://www.forbes.com/sites/briancaulfield/2012/01/25/five-crazy-things-about-ap- - ples-earnings/?partner=yahootix

    Super Bowl - Charlie my friend, I am a big Giant fan. I just re-watched and dvr'd Super Bowl 42 on the NFL network and this Giant team, finally healthy, is better than that team IMO. Key to the game is can the Pats run a little bit and keep the pass rush at bay or will the Giant pass rush overwhem the Pats offensive line and put a lot of pressure on Brady. Naturally I think the latter and a 27-17 Giants win. Getting the Giants and 3 points is a gift. I expected the Giants to be 3 point favorites. They are now 81-39 in points for/against in 3 playoff games. Pretty remarkable to give up only 39 points when one of the opponents is Green Bay on the road in good weather conditions.

    BTW a good story on the two Manning brothers in todays Tiimes:

    http://www.nytimes.com/2012/01/25/sports/football/peyton-manning-fan-analyst-and- - -his-brothers-defender.html?_r=1&ref=sports
  • ljflxljflx Member Posts: 4,690
    edited January 2012
    Gary and OW,

    Agree. Same old, same old. If you've seen one Obama speech, you've seen them all. My wife and I watched a Blue Bloods episode we dvr'd.
  • circlewcirclew Member Posts: 8,666
    edited January 2012
    Her's some data on AAPL. The Giants have a lot in common with Apple!

    Net income of $13.1 billion in the period that ended Dec. 31 ranked among the highest quarterly profits on record, putting Apple in the same league as energy companies such as Exxon Mobil Corp. (XOM) and Russia’s Gazprom OAO (OGZPY), data compiled by Bloomberg show. Per-share profit of $13.87 for the period was more than Apple earned in any full year before 2010, as the success of the new iPhone ramped up pressure on rivals Google Inc. and Samsung Electronics Co.

    ‘Stunning’ Numbers

    The gain gives Apple a market value of about $419 billion, higher than Exxon’s $414 billion. The two companies have been trading places atop the Standard & Poor’s 500 Index since August.

    Regards,
    OW
  • cyclone4cyclone4 Member Posts: 2,302
    edited January 2012
    This should be very simple but I cannot make it work. I have lots of photos from the Auto Show and I am trying to post a few here. It should be a simple case of copy and paste, right? Photos are on the iPhone4S and I can obviously go to this site on the phone. I can copy the photo but when I go to paste it, there is no such option when I touch the message area on the screen for this site.
  • houdini1houdini1 Member Posts: 8,356
    This morning, a local radio host was playing excerpts from his SOTU speech from last year and comparing them to excerpts from this year. They were practically identical except for the bragging about getting Bin Laden.

    Obama is a very good speaker, but he says one thing and then does just the opposite...and actions speak a lot louder than words. With the MSM on his team along with the black vote and the unions, he will be hard to beat in spite of his terrible record.

    2013 LX 570 2016 LS 460

  • houdini1houdini1 Member Posts: 8,356
    edited January 2012
    I really like the Genesis also...and I am seriously considering it for my next ride. At this point I don't have anyone I am trying to impress and being a little low key does not bother me at all.

    It will all depend on how well the car actually drives and handles.

    2013 LX 570 2016 LS 460

  • houdini1houdini1 Member Posts: 8,356
    Good luck on the real estate deal. I have one property already rehabbed and on the market and I am actively looking for another good candidate. If things go half way right on the first property I will do a lot better there than in the market.

    Speaking of the market, my stocks have been on fire for a couple of months now. I have done better this month so far than all of last year. I like my mix right now and I'm just being patient.

    I hope your wife is feeling better.

    2013 LX 570 2016 LS 460

  • gagricegagrice Member Posts: 31,450
    How the U.S. Lost Out on iPhone Work

    http://www.nytimes.com/2012/01/22/business/apple-america-and-a-squeezed-middle-c- lass.html?pagewanted=1&_r=2
  • slorenzenslorenzen Member Posts: 694
    So what do we do?

    Tariffs?

    :confuse:
  • gagricegagrice Member Posts: 31,450
    edited January 2012
    Better get our kids educated or they will end up slaves to the welfare system in this country. Can you imagine trying to find 200,000 Americans willing to work in a complex where they eat, sleep and work 12 hours per day? No matter how good the pay. I agree with Apple, Americans are not up to the challenge.

    Tariffs may be in order. I have mixed emotions about them.
  • fintailfintail Member Posts: 58,525
    edited January 2012
    The comments in that article are better than the article itself. Shameful propaganda and more or less lies told by Apple suits.

    Play by our rules or don't get access to our playground, simple.
  • slorenzenslorenzen Member Posts: 694
    well,

    i've lived this long without Apple products...

    Of course, ALL our choices seem to be built under the same circumstances.

    :sick:
  • cyclone4cyclone4 Member Posts: 2,302
    edited January 2012
    Super Bowl - Charlie my friend, I am a big Giant fan. I just re-watched and dvr'd Super Bowl 42 on the NFL network and this Giant team, finally healthy, is better than that team IMO. Key to the game is can the Pats run a little bit and keep the pass rush at bay or will the Giant pass rush overwhem the Pats offensive line and put a lot of pressure on Brady. Naturally I think the latter and a 27-17 Giants win.

    I agree with you that this Giants team now (healthy) is better than the team from the 2008 Super Bowl...I say 2008 because it was played in Feb., 2008). I can also say that this Patriots offense is better than the 2008 Super Bowl team. Additionally, the Pats defense is better than a lot of people give them credit (especially in recent games). I think it will be a great Super Bowl match up. I can't see Brady having another tough outing. So, I think the Pats will win this time around.

    Btw, I almost had a heart attack while my wife and I were driving back home during the Pats/Ravens game Saturday afternoon. I was listening on the Ravens broadcast on satellite and with something like 25 seconds left in the game those announcers were going nuts as the Ravens scored the go ahead touchdown. But within a few seconds, they retracted their enthusiasm and said something like, "oh wait a second, they are calling the pass incomplete since Moore stripped it away from Evans just before he took another step. The incredible change in emotions for me was unbelievable. But then I figured they were going to score on 3rd down. The same guy (Moore) defended the pass and then of course we all know what happened on 4th down.

    I was SO happy to watch (I recorded it) the game that evening when I got home that evening. I was going back and forth between the recording and the Giants game. However, during the 4th quarter of the Giants game, I stayed with that game totally.
  • kyfdxkyfdx Moderator Posts: 267,549
    I have lots of photos from the Auto Show and I am trying to post a few here. It should be a simple case of copy and paste, right?

    Your pictures have to be hosted on a public site, like Photobucket... You can't post a .jpg file directly from your phone or computer...

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  • dieselonedieselone Member Posts: 5,729
    Play by our rules or don't get access to our playground, simple.

    Considering 80% of Iphone sales are are overseas, would it really change anything?
  • kyfdxkyfdx Moderator Posts: 267,549
    (all tax-deferred, because I'm purchasing it with my retirement account)

    Not that I'm an expert on investment property, but have you consulted your tax advisor?

    Profit on rental property is pretty much tax-deferred, anyway, as long as you can depreciate it (25 years).. Cash flow really doesn't mean profit.. you can have positive cash flow property, and never pay a dime in tax, until it's fully depreciated or you sell it. Plus, at that point, once the depreciation is re-captured, the rest of it is taxed as capital gains, which may be a lower rate vs. a retirement account, which may be taxed at ordinary earned income rates..

    Also, buying individual properties may not be allowed for certain (many) types of retirement accounts..

    Not an expert, but I'm just saying... ;)

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  • cyclone4cyclone4 Member Posts: 2,302
    Your pictures have to be hosted on a public site, like Photobucket... You can't post a .jpg file directly from your phone or computer...

    Oh ya! I now remember that I did something like this a few years ago when I posted photos of the new car. At least I think it was on this site, but it could have been in Club Lexus. That process seems like a pain in the butt. So, I now need to open a Photobucket account on my iPhone and go through this process, right?
  • fintailfintail Member Posts: 58,525
    edited January 2012
    I'm not speaking of Apple exclusively, but of China as a whole. We basically have to sacrifice IP to gain access to their market via insanely written joint ventures and slave labor branch plants, they need to answer to us if they want in our market. And/or we can be like the EU and hold someone accountable for crimes in another state. No doubt in my mind we still consume more of their stuff than anyone else, especially on a per capita level. Wally World alone buys more than many entire nations.

    The 1%er executive class has really created a socio-economic disaster for the first world, buying their way into suicidal trade policies.
  • fintailfintail Member Posts: 58,525
    Yeah, it matters not what's on the label, it's all from the same place.

    Free trade without oversight isn't fair trade, but it very well may be the undoing of what was good about the USA.
  • robr2robr2 Member Posts: 8,805
    Can you imagine trying to find 200,000 Americans willing to work in a complex where they eat, sleep and work 12 hours per day? No matter how good the pay. I agree with Apple, Americans are not up to the challenge.

    But wasn't that America 100 years ago??

    It's going to take China a lot longer to get to the "service economy" simply because of their population. It's going to take them longer to get a middle class that won't stand for those working conditions.
  • kyfdxkyfdx Moderator Posts: 267,549
    I think so.. that's how I do it (not from my phone, but my computer). When we had CarSpace, you could upload to your CarSpace, and then post from there, but that's gone now..

    Photobucket is easy... I don't have an iPhone, but I bet there is an app for PB or maybe Apple as their own cloud-based app?

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  • gagricegagrice Member Posts: 31,450
    I agree with that. In the mean time we have to accept or reject buying from those countries. My bet is the American people will continue to buy products made with slave labor.
  • robr2robr2 Member Posts: 8,805
    My bet is the American people will continue to buy products made with slave labor.

    You are absolutely correct. For as much as our population screams buy American, we aren't willing to pay for it for the most part. The Wal-Martization of America is too strong.
  • fintailfintail Member Posts: 58,525
    edited January 2012
    You're right on that of course - for two reasons. Primarily, IMO, lack of choice in many markets - sometimes the only offerings are from our "most favored partner", and real incomes that have been declining for ages also make cheaper products attractive, especially if the origin is monopolized.

    Funny thing though...I bought a pizza peel last weekend, made in USA, no pricier than the competition. I've bought some other made in USA kitchenware that also cost no more than other products. The cheap labor just buys insane profits for the disguised oligarchs, little benefit to the citizen.
  • cyclone4cyclone4 Member Posts: 2,302
    edited January 2012
    http://i567.photobucket.com/albums/ss120/PatsSoxFan/564ce823.jpg

    http://i567.photobucket.com/albums/ss120/PatsSoxFan/116fbda5.jpg

    Here is the Toyota concept car.
    http://i567.photobucket.com/albums/ss120/PatsSoxFan/cb39e90c.jpg

    A Mercedes that I actually liked:

    http://i567.photobucket.com/albums/ss120/PatsSoxFan/d029674c.jpg

    The Genesis:
    http://i567.photobucket.com/albums/ss120/PatsSoxFan/fcf74443.jpg
    http://i567.photobucket.com/albums/ss120/PatsSoxFan/ff34cbb6.jpg

    The Ford Focus:
    http://i567.photobucket.com/albums/ss120/PatsSoxFan/024a0e16.jpg
  • ljflxljflx Member Posts: 4,690
    Charlie,

    Any news on the next S-class and/or the next LS?
  • cyclone4cyclone4 Member Posts: 2,302
    edited January 2012
    Len,

    I do not know about the next generation S Class. However, from everything I have heard the next generation LS will be coming out early in 2013 as a 2014 model. The new 2013 GS is a hint of its style I believe.
  • ljflxljflx Member Posts: 4,690
    The problenm with that heart attack play in the end zone is that on slo mo it looks like a catch. I think they should have reviewed it and while I don't think it was a catch I am not absolutely certain it wasn't. They allow a guy to fumble a split second after he crosses the goal line and still rule it a TD. The NFL rules are sometimes confusing.

    I go into every NFL game hoping there's no tuck play called also. That rule is the dumbest rule in the history of sports IMO. I will never understand its purpose. You are bringing the ball back to your body because you don't want to throw but the rules say it is still a forward pass. Even though your arm is travelling in reverse. They can sit me down for 24 hours and explain the logic and I'll never get to first base on it. I hope someone in the rules committee comes to their senses on that rule and tosses it ASAP.
  • cyclone4cyclone4 Member Posts: 2,302
    edited January 2012
    I totally agree on the tuck rule even though if it were not for that rule, the Patriots would not have advanced on to their first Super Bowl victory several weeks later in 2002. But that was the rule and they got lucky it was the rule.
  • ljflxljflx Member Posts: 4,690
    edited January 2012
    My lease runs to September 2013 so both the next S and LS are out by then. But I'm very up in the air on what I'll do next. My wife and I want a lux sports car and if we go that route we'll get a cheaper truck as an extra vehicle and a luxury midsize like an E-class, GS or maybe a SWB LS. Not sure but the decision is years away. I also love my GL450 and the ML and even the Lexus GX. But long-term I don't need a large lux truck. The problem is the GL is so comforting, handles great for a truck that big and rides just short of the smoothness of the LS and S-class. Pure lux vehicle that is so satisfying for a large truck.
  • cyclone4cyclone4 Member Posts: 2,302
    I am going to wait and see what the next generation LS has to offer. I imagine it will be awesome. But having said this, I am impressed with the much cheaper (cost-wise anyway) Hyundai Genesis. What do you think about the Genesis? I imagine it does not have all the bells and whistles of the LS, but I don't know this for sure. I also don't know how comfortable and pleasing it is to drive.
  • tagmantagman Member Posts: 8,441
    edited January 2012
    Wow, lots of posts.

    Some items...

    Kyfdx... Yes, I have checked, and my plan allows for this property investment provided it's not for my personal use.

    Charlie... I went to LA Auto Show when it was here end of 2011, & Hyundai was indeed remarkable. As you recall from the old days on the other forum, I was the guy that praised Hyundai & predicted their success, when some thought I was out of my mind. The Genesis is an amazing value. Check out the EQUUS!!!

    Len... Good luck with the iMac. Let me know about the Windows performance.

    Houdini... You and your son should buy & fix-up, and flip another property. These opportunities won't last forever. I am not buying to sell, however, unless appreciation is huge. I like the significant positive cash flow.

    BTW, wife got out of bed several times this week for the first time in almost a month, & got an MRI today. Doubt it shows anything, but I hope she's not getting hooked on all the pain meds. Her personality has changed for the worse. Hostile & distorted. It's challenging (& damaging)... could have longer-term negative consequences. Very sad.

    Landscape project going well... My contractor & I have custom-designed a 17-foot barbeque structure & have bought the grill, power burner, sink, frig, & access doors and drawers. I can't wait until it's built. All Fire Magic equipment, for those of you that know about grills.

    Thursday is supposed to be near 80 degrees here in Malibu. Wow!

    I'll probably be cheering for the Giants while my son hopes Brady & Company wins it. That will be fun.

    Obama's SOTU speech was some of the best campaign rhetoric I've ever heard. King of lip service.

    Also, Pelossi's remarks about Newt made her look like a total disaster.

    TM
  • kyfdxkyfdx Moderator Posts: 267,549
    image

    See what I did there?

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  • kyfdxkyfdx Moderator Posts: 267,549
    If you hit the IMG button down below, then paste in your URL, then close the IMG button, it will post the actual picture...

    But, it won't re-size them.... I think the photos have to be 600 X 480 maximum to fit..

    regards,
    kyfdx

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  • ljflxljflx Member Posts: 4,690
    Re Genesis: Like the styling. Consumers says it falls hort of the higher end with a lesser ride and lesser handling. But they still say its a very good car for the money.
  • ljflxljflx Member Posts: 4,690
    edited January 2012
    BTW, wife got out of bed several times this week for the first time in almost a month, & got an MRI today. Doubt it shows anything, but I hope she's not getting hooked on all the pain meds. Her personality has changed for the worse. Hostile & distorted. It's challenging (& damaging)... could have longer-term negative consequences. Very sad.

    Tag, hang in there. It's the meds usually. My partners wife broke her hip and for a day or two she didn't recognize him and they've been married for nearly 40 years. He was really bothered by it but they stopped giving her ceratin medicines and she returned to normal. Not only was her mood altered (she also had anger, depression etc during this time) but her memory and judgment were way off. One of the doctors said it may have been a combo of certain meds and anesthesia. Bottom line is they know its the meds and/or anesthesia that caused the problem but they don't know for sure which so they stopped a bunch of meds. It took several days for her to get better and a few times as she was improving she slipped back. It's scary.

    I'll keep you posted on the IMAC once I get it and get some experience on it.
  • fintailfintail Member Posts: 58,525
    Genesis is one of the better bargains on the market right now. Think of it as an 8/10ths 5er for 1/2 the price. Suspension isn't sorted to match the big boys and the styling is kind of copycat, but it's a lot of bang for the buck. I have to wonder if Hyundai is even turning a profit on them, or maybe dumping them just to gain exposure (which I am pretty sure Lexus did back in the day, too).

    New S will be in the states for model year 2014, it will be on the road a full year earlier in Europe, as usual.
  • cyclone4cyclone4 Member Posts: 2,302
    Thanks for the suggestion, but I think I will leave them as is. Folks can view the photos just fine if they click on the link. No sense taking up a whole page with photos.
  • gagricegagrice Member Posts: 31,450
    Actually 640 is the perfect width. Any length is fine. If you go over 640 you will not be able to access some features.
  • ljflxljflx Member Posts: 4,690
    Usually the S is one year earlier than the LS. If the LS is a 2014 car released in 2013 than the two will both be relased in the US at the same time.
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